[3.5] Non-magical hypnosis, post-hypnotic suggestion, and nice things for mundanes

[Phelix-Mu]

Aside from making it an Ex charm person (rather obvious, if simple, way to do it), how would you implement this? I'd like some kind of skill check mechanic, but I'm perilously aware of how mucked up the rules for Diplomacy are, and I'd like a less abusable, more versatile tool than "Hi Friend!"

Finally, do you think this would be a sensible tool to use to make skillmonkeys and the like more effective (if only in the most marginal and low-level sense)? Another mundane tool of limited scope, but potentially very useful for a creative player (which tend to be the tools that I like best).

[Segev]

I'd look at the sor/wiz 1st level spell "Hypnotism." It's SRD material.

The effects it spells out should work for post-hypnotic suggestion.

The trick is figuring out how to do it "non-magically." How realistic you want it to be (where "realistic" is an awfully flexible term on hypnosis anyway) is a good question to start with. Should it be combat or near-combat usable? i.e., should the user be able to set up a hypnotic patter that entrances even hostile people?

For some rough ideas, I suggest making it a Feat or a Skill Trick that enables new uses of Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate. And any other skills that are useful for compelling action in the short- or long-term.

The mechanics should be something along the lines of using those skills to compel a behavior that gets them to focus on whatever it is you're doing to hypnotize them. Compel them in consecutive rounds to spend first a Swift, then a Move, then a Standard, then a Full Round action just on paying attention to it. Once you have them at Full Round, they count as Fascinated and are automatically subject to a skill check to improve their attitude or compel a behavior.

Obviously, just guidelines, above; you'll have to do some thinking on how exactly you want this to work. It can easily be grossly powerful, particularly if you're going for something useful in combat or other tense situations against wary foes.

Also take a look at epic uses of Bluff; I believe an (Ex) Suggestion effect is one possibility.

[Phelix-Mu]

I was mainly looking for an out-of-combat use. Near-combat might be possible with a good check, while in-combat would be some kind of +100 to DC or something, since adrenaline, noise, and movement are all complicating factors in focusing someone enough (and as you say, in-combat hypnosis would be grossly exploitable, much more so than Intimidate exploits).

But your suggestions are quite useful. Having it be a feat that adds new skill uses makes it easy for a DM to rule in or out. I'd consider allowing one or two skill tricks to expand the usefulness, perhaps, or making it more efficient, with high enough skill ranks to gauge the level when this would be useful, but not gamebreaking.

I was thinking a normal hypnosis might be language-dependent, but maybe a skill trick to substitute a physical contact component or a strictly visual component.

The whole issue comes up because psionics introduces Autohypnosis, which kind of implies that hypnosis might also be a thing.

[Segev]

I'd go with hypnosis being language-dependent for everything except "entrancing" things. Of course, if you can use a Handle Animal check with your hypnotism, you can probably use that to help manipulate the animal. Then again, animal training is at least 50% conditioning anyway, so the line there gets even fuzzier and...well.

Long story short: "real" hypnosis is something that is so conflated with fiction and urban legend and entertainment (fiction again, as well as "hypnosis shows" which I understand are a sort of Vegas stage act) that it's nearly impossible to determine how to represent it. Ultimately, decide what you want it to do when used in your setting, and then use the skill rules to build a sequence of checks to make it happen, is my advice.

[Piggy Knowles]

It already sort of exists? Per the epic rules on the bluff skill (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/skills.htm#instillSuggestioninTarget), if you give your opponent a +50 on their sense motive modifier, you can instill a suggestion that is nonmagical and lasts for 10 minutes, no save.