3.0 Fighter barbarian

[stenver1010]

Hello!

Last week i asked help about 3.0 tricks and hooks

This week my friend needs help

We only have the core 3.0 books, Faiths and Pantheons, Magic of the Faerun and Forgotten realms. Nothing else. And we cant get them.

He is going to make a barbarian/fighter

However, i noticed that Power attack is weaker in 3.0 - two handed weapons dont do double damage

This really undermines the entire feat imo

Can you please suggest fighter feats?
Also, what are some of the interesting items for fighter besides boots of speed?

Thanks

[hicegetraenk]

Are we talking about a lvl 1 fighter? Also some stats / race info would be nice.

Sadly, with just these few books, choices are limited.

Assuming you wanted to get Power Attack, he's fighting melee with a two-handed weapon.

Improved Critical in 3.0 is way better than in 3.5, since it stacks with a keen weapon and other effects that increase your critical range (weapon master of Sword and Fist also builds on that, but ye, you don't have that book).

Other good feats for fighters are those that let you trip enemies / destroy their gear. I played a 3.0 fighter once who could basically smash any weapon in 1 round, rendering the enemy usually completely useless. But I think you'd also need more rulebooks to get to that point.

[stenver1010]

We start at level 8.

Thanks for the critical tip

The core tripping and sundering doesnt look that scary.

The books are what they are :/

[Killer Angel]

He is going to make a barbarian/fighter


Can you please suggest fighter feats?
Also, what are some of the interesting items for fighter besides boots of speed?

Thanks

Unless you're really feat-starved, I suggest to pick only the first 2 levels of fighter.
FOr Items, it's better to look at thing that let the character do something different from its abilities.
For example:
Boots of speed? nice for the additional attack, but boots of flying are decisely better, there's not even a comparison.

(a meta reasoning is also needed: in 3.0, haste is so good broken, that you can count that every arcane caster in your group will have it, so they'll spam it also on the barbarian)


The core tripping and sundering doesnt look that scary.


Trip is very useful but you must dedicate some of your build around it. Sundering is better to be left in the manual as a thought exercise: you don't want to sunder your possible loot.

[hicegetraenk]

Tripping is very strong, and there's certain builds that make use of weapons with higher attack range, like a spike chain. There's feats that let you attack after every successful trip and such, combined with combat reflexes to be a baller regarding crowd control.

[Gavinfoxx]

You don't wanna do sundering, you want to minimize disarming...

but trip? Now you're getting somewhere...

[stenver1010]

There is only 1 trip in the core book - Improved trip

Do you guys think this is enough?

Maybe focus on pure damage and go for Critical hit dwarven warhammer?

Also about the critical hit - Does it only multiply the core weapon damage, or also enchantment, str etc?

[hicegetraenk]

I guess if you have to chose now, increase crit is better.

The crit multiplies basedmg, str, enhancement bonus, that of weapon specialization and feats, but not of "flaming" (or other elemental enchantments) and such.

[Big Fau]

The 3.5 SRD is available at d20srd.org, and the 3.0>3.5 updates are also available online, so you do have access to the more recent books. It's a bit of work, but you should have everything you need online.

[ksbsnowowl]

3.0 Power Attack, while not as good for two-handers, it is actually useful for two-weapon fighters.

Straight-up mundane melee has limited options given the sources you have available. Definitely go with Keen + Improved Crit. Probably Greatsword, though there might be an argument for a Falchion.

[Gavinfoxx]

Trip has more than that! Combat Expertise, Combat Reflexes, Exotic Weapon Proficiency Spiked Chain. I think the 3.0 srd might have more feats too.

[ksbsnowowl]

With trip, recall that 3.0 Improved Trip ONLY removed the AoO. It does not provide a bonus to the trip attempt.

[Gavinfoxx]

Does 3.0 have stand still or knock down in the srd?

[Karnith]

Does 3.0 have stand still or knock down in the srd?
Stand Still is in the 3.0 SRD, though it is a bit different. Per the 3.0 SRD (http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html):
Stand Still [Psionic]
Prerequisite: Str 13+, reserve power points 1+.
Benefit: When a foe’s movement would otherwise grant the character an attack of opportunity, the character may give up that attack and instead attack the foe prior to the foe’s actual movement. This is akin to a readied action, but Stand Still doesn’t affect the character’s initiative count or actual readied actions, if any. The foe must succeed at a Fortitude save against a DC equal to 10 + the damage dealt, or be unable to move into or out of the area the character threatens—essentially, this ends the movement of a foe who is closing, and prevents any movement of a foe who is fleeing (if the character is normally allowed an attack of opportunity against the fleeing foe). Since the character uses the Stand Still feat in place of his or her attack of opportunity, the character may only do so a number of times per round equal to the number of times per round he or she could make an attack of opportunity.
Normal: Attacks of opportunity occur after a foe has already moved within the area a character threatens; thus, a character is unable to affect their movement with an attack.
Knock-Down is to the best of my knowledge not in the 3.0 SRD.

[Gavinfoxx]

Bah...

Get 50 gp potions of enlarge person to improve your tripping capability.

Prone still is a very useful condition to apply to enemies, regardless.

My main question is...

WHY are you using 3.0 when THIS:

http://www.d20srd.org/

exists??? You have access to most of 3.5e! Just use the 3.0 books for the bits you don't have, and use the SRD to override things where they conflict.

Seriously, with the SRD, you can make THIS:

http://www.thetangledweb.net/forums/profiler/view_char.php?cid=55074

[stenver1010]

My DM own words:

"Yes i know that 3.5 was meant to fix 3.0 playability, but in my opinion, it also broke a lot of 3.0 (i admit, often crumbersome) successful mechanics"

[Karnith]

My DM own words:

"Yes i know that 3.5 was meant to fix 3.0 playability, but in my opinion, it also broke a lot of 3.0 (i admit, often crumbersome) successful mechanics"
I don't suppose you know what those "successful mechanics" were? I am quite interested to know.

[Gavinfoxx]

You know what actually fixes 3.5e? And is free too?

Legend.

http://ruleofcool.com/

[stenver1010]

Well i can ask him on friday, when the game takes place.

You can PM me if you are really interested, then im going to ask him.

But currently it is what it is and if the DM wants to use that system, then noone can stop him.

[stenver1010]

You know what actually fixes 3.5e? And is free too?

Legend.

http://ruleofcool.com/


You could also chech out Window. Easiest system of them all

http://www.mimgames.com/window/rules/

[ksbsnowowl]

Bah...

Get 50 gp potions of enlarge person to improve your tripping capability.3.0 Enlarge Person does not actually make you Large (with associated size bonuses/penalties). It just makes you somewhat taller/heavier, and gives you some Strength bonuses.

If I had to take one system whole cloth over the other, I would choose 3.0 over 3.5 any day.

Instead, I am the DM, and for ease of use for a gaming group I use the 3.5 chassis, but house-rule much of 3.0 back into the game.

Mostly I use 3.0 Polymorph Other/Self, and 3.0 Wild Shape as per Masters of the Wild. I do this, because these spells are closer to the mythological roots that the game is based upon.

I also allow Power Attack to apply to light weapons, which hearkens back to 3.0 play. And makes sense (Ever swung a tomahawk? Yes, you can PA with a throwing axe).

I allow 3.0 darkness and deeper darkness as one spell level higher than the nerfed 3.5 versions. I allow a slightly modified 3.0 haste as a 5th level spell (it doesn't take effect until your turn is done, so no second action for you until your next turn).

Keen and Improved Crit stack, because there's no logical reason they shouldn't.

DR/Magic is tiered like it was in 3.0 - DR 5/+1 or DR 10/+3, for example.
Even something like DR 10/+3 and Good.

Now, all that said, there are things "missing" from 3.0, and 3.5 overall is a more complete system, having taken into account many of the small things that were overlooked in the initial 3rd edition attempt. So again, for ease of use, I use the 3.5 chassis, but retrofit 3.0 in for the 3.5 changes that I detest.

Although I don't actually house-rule this back to the 3.0 ways, I actually like the 3.0 handling of magical ammunition and Damage Reduction. A magic bow firing a mundane arrow did nothing for overcoming DR; you HAD to have a magic arrow (Greater Magic Weapon was good for this). However, the enhancement bonuses to a bow and ammunition STACKED for attack and damage. Getting rid of this is one of the reasons archers suck so hard in 3.5.