"And Thus The Dwarves Wrought Their Own Destruction"

[eilandesq]

Hmm. . .so Durkon is now a (probably) Lawful Evil epic level cleric vampire who might well take stock of his situation and decide that a bit of vengeance is in order against those who exiled him and therefore set into motion the course of events that has him in his current situation? Even Lawful Good dwarves are rather prone to being vengeful. . .how much worse will that tendency be for a Lawful Evil one with a condition that will probably push him towards megalomania and homicidal mania?

"And thus was the prophecy fulfilled and the dwarven homeland devastated at the hands of Durkon the Wronged One."

[iyaerP]

I feel like this will end like my latest dwarf fortress. A mighty siege of undead overwhelming everything the dorfs can throw at them.

[Steward]

Why is Durkon epic level?

[Shale]

Being a full vampire gives a +8 level adjustment. When your adjusted level hits 20, you are epic.

[Verditude]

His ECL is epic, since he's at least 14th level and has a +8 level adjustment from the vampire template.

dang ninjas.

[Chronos]

He has an epic Equivalent Character Level (ECL) due to the level adjustment (LA) of being a vampire. But that's a disadvantage, not an advantage: It just means that the rules officially think he's about as powerful as an epic-level character, and so he'd need to defeat epic challenges in order to level up more. In practice, though, being a vampire isn't worth that much power, especially to a spellcaster, who would gain much more power from actual levels.

Twice-ninjaed, but to add: Even though he has an epic ECL, he still isn't epic, in the sense that he can't take epic feats, doesn't follow the epic level advancement rules, etc. That only comes in when your actual HD reach 21.

[Green and Red]

Why is Durkon epic level?

Hes at least 14 normally, vampire template is +8 effective level, so he counts as 22.

[Muenster Man]

Being a full vampire gives a +8 level adjustment. When your adjusted level hits 20, you are epic.

Nice, you ninja'd 3 people with one post. I'd frame this thread on a wall if I were you.

[Kish]

To be sure.

...The only problem I have with it, is that Durkon would be devastated at some point, whether when he got resurrected or when he finally died and went to the afterlife. When you have someone whose sense of duty is so great that he will do anything you tell him to, even walk with his eyes open into something he considers a fate much worse than death, asking him to actually do that is...just something you don't do.

[Phybender]

Durkon's only real, -when it comes to self- purpose was to be buried along with his anchestors. If being a vampire eliminates, one way or another, that possibility, then he would gladly accept any solution that would return him to the honor path. That means resurrection. Prophecy has it that this could only occur after he brings devastation to his homeland as a vampire. And life has it that you don't always get what you want.

All the poor guy wanted is to go home.

[Rogar Demonblud]

One problem with that scenario, eilandesq. Durkon doesn't know any of that. He just knows he was given a job to do, and promised to not return until sent for.

And if High Priest Hurok is dead, then only the blacksmith (Blackore?) knows the whole story.

[Tetsujin-28]

It's an interesting theory, but the problem is that Vampire!Durkon is still Lawful, so I would imagine that he'd still honor his duty and keep himself in exile.

[Dark Matter]

Durkon's epic for the purpose of he, himself, trying to go up levels, but in the context of Durkon trying to kill someone, his CR is only +2.

So he's not an epic challenge.

[Muenster Man]

Durkon's epic for the purpose of he, himself, trying to go up levels, but in the context of Durkon trying to kill someone, his CR is only +2.

So he's not an epic challenge.

Good point. It seems the main reason that a vampire gets a +8 LA is because they effectively get the Leadership feat (but way better) for free so they can build an obedient vampire army relatively easily. But a single character with the vampire template is not too much stronger than without, hence why it's so hard for vampires to level up.

[sockmonkey]

Didn't the note to Durkon that the MITD found and tossed away say that the prophecy about his returning home causing doom was bullcrap?

[Kish]

No. It said that the people who knew about it had died and the priest who had received Durkon's letter had no idea why he'd been sent away and saw no reason he couldn't come back.

[GuySmiley1970]

No, the note basically said that the High Priest of Thor who sent Durkon away had died and his successor couldn't figure out why he had been sent away in the first place.

Ninja'd. :smallmad:

[sockmonkey]

Ah, I thought it was implied that the priest who sent Durkon away did it for some malevolent reason and lied about there being a prophecy.

[Leecros]

Good point. It seems the main reason that a vampire gets a +8 LA is because they effectively get the Leadership feat (but way better) for free so they can build an obedient vampire army relatively easily. But a single character with the vampire template is not too much stronger than without, hence why it's so hard for vampires to level up.

They're also very difficult to kill, unless the people you're fighting actually know you're a vampire. Sure, you can get knocked out fairly easy, but you'll be back a few days later barring shenanigans.

[eilandesq]

One problem with that scenario, eilandesq. Durkon doesn't know any of that. He just knows he was given a job to do, and promised to not return until sent for.

And if High Priest Hurok is dead, then only the blacksmith (Blackore?) knows the whole story.

That really makes it worse from the viewpoint of a possibly vengeance-minded now evil dwarf. Knowing Durkon, if he had been *told* that he was being sent away because a prophecy existed that he would bring destruction to his homeland, he would have swallowed hard and left and never even asked about returning, because of his overwhelming sense of duty. As things stand, he was sent away without explanation and no one from home ever contacted him again (and he doesn't know that the note from his people was lost due to misfortune). Now, take the mindset from that and add the ethical flip from going from lawful good to (probably lawful) evil, and what is the likely result? A serious desire for vengeance, particularly if Durkon still isn't thrilled with the whole being vamped thing and would like to vent on convenient targets over it. Not to mention a whole lot of innocent victims of the now dead High Priest's bad judgment in not just telling Durkon the truth in the first place.

[Taelas]

That really makes it worse from the viewpoint of a possibly vengeance-minded now evil dwarf. Knowing Durkon, if he had been *told* that he was being sent away because a prophecy existed that he would bring destruction to his homeland, he would have swallowed hard and left and never even asked about returning, because of his overwhelming sense of duty. As things stand, he was sent away without explanation and no one from home ever contacted him again (and he doesn't know that the note from his people was lost due to misfortune). Now, take the mindset from that and add the ethical flip from going from lawful good to (probably lawful) evil, and what is the likely result? A serious desire for vengeance, particularly if Durkon still isn't thrilled with the whole being vamped thing and would like to vent on convenient targets over it. Not to mention a whole lot of innocent victims of the now dead High Priest's bad judgment in not just telling Durkon the truth in the first place.

Considering that he spent the rest of his life away from home, the high priest's plan worked perfectly without telling Durkon anything.

The only problem is, the high priest was an idiot and didn't consider the possibility of the prophecy being fulfilled after Durkon's death.

The real joke here is that if the high priest had ignored the prophecy and hadn't sent Durkon away, it could never have been fulfilled. Rather than make him leave and force him to stay away, he should have made Durkon stay put and never leave.

[Starwulf]

Here's a question: Whatever happened to Hilda? She served an evil god, and now Durkon is evil himself due to being a vampire! They could be lovers again!

[Kish]

Hilgya was Chaotic Evil, big-Chaotic-little-Evil. She is unlikely to be impressed should a Lawful Evil Durkon tell her that he has no more tolerance for her lack of respect for tradition than ever, but has found a new appreciation for her efforts to avoid breaking her wedding vows by killing her husband rather than cheating on him.

[DaggerPen]

Hilgya was Chaotic Evil, big-Chaotic-little-Evil. She is unlikely to be impressed should a Lawful Evil Durkon tell her that he has no more tolerance for her lack of respect for tradition than ever, but has found a new appreciation for her efforts to avoid breaking her wedding vows by killing her husband rather than cheating on him.

Are you, uh, quite certain of that (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0083.html)?

[Kish]

Taking an educated guess at what you're taking issue with:

I said efforts. I didn't mean to imply that she'd succeeded in killing him, merely that she said she'd tried. And that a Just-As-Lawful Now-Evil Durkon might put a particular spin on her trying...which would, of course, be totally wrong and the entire suggestion that her vows ever mattered would annoy her.

[Steward]

I agree with Kish. The law was probably what came between Durkon and Hilgya. Hilgya was wiling to give up the LG (they had already lost her anyway), but he couldn't overlook the fact that she ran away from her clan responsibilities. That aspect of his personality probably hasn't changed.

[Bulldog Psion]

I have been assuming (and posting) that he seems likely to return In Great Wrath to fulfill the prophecy in the worst possible way.