Favorite "Non-dip" Build? (All PRSC's maxed out)

[PangolinPie]

I see so many people around here with these crazy builds meant to optimize every single possibly bonus or perk but ends up with like 2 levels of one class, 3 of another until you have like a laundry list of PRSC's, most of the time being impossible to rationalize in a narrative/plot sense.

So my question is...what are peoples favorite builds that involve you maxing out any PRSC's utilized? (its fine if the levels are divided up) One of my all time favorites was a savage human martial artist named "Kwan" I used a number of years ago:

Barbarian 2/ Fist of the Forest 3 / Bear Warrior 10/ Warshaper 10 (we went into epic levels in that campaign)

[Tokuhara]

Well, my favorite was a Killoren Druid 10/Horizon Walker 10 that was TN and carried a custom item as a walking stick (basically, I was so close to the setting's nature god, she game me a treant that was basically reshaped into a quarterstaff. As long as I held it, it was a quarterstaff but if someone else touched it, it weighed the same as a Treant and gave me 6 spells 1/day)

I'll miss you Ash. Too bad you ascended to Godhood

[Humble Master]

Warblade 10/ Eternal Blade 10 is pretty solid. You get to be a master elven swordsman who has the spirit of an ancient elf heroes guiding him as he leaps into combat, lay hordes of enemies to was with unmatched celerity and grace.

It's also pretty strong to.

[ArqArturo]

Druid 20 dips at nothing, because honestly, all druid levels are great :smallbiggrin:.

But then again, a Druid 10/Lion of Talisid 10 is also great. Sure it adds little to what an ordinary druid can do, but, it does give you scent, pounce, leonal's roar, and fearless, besides wildshape progression.

[eggynack]

Druid 20 dips at nothing, because honestly, all druid levels are great :smallbiggrin:.
Yup. Druid 20 is about as good as it gets. Beyond that level of power, you get druid 5/planar shepherd 10/druid 5, which is also a non-dip build. That one might be TO all on its own, especially if you play it well.

[ArqArturo]

Yup. Druid 20 is about as good as it gets. Beyond that level of power, you get druid 5/planar shepherd 10/druid 5, which is also a non-dip build. That one might be TO all on its own, especially if you play it well.

I've heard Planar Shepherds make DMs cry. Why is that?.

[Tvtyrant]

I've heard Planar Shepherds make DMs cry. Why is that?.

Time bubbles that allow the Druid to take hundreds of actions a turn. It doesn't work by RAW, as a turn is based on initiative and not time, but like the commoner cannon people mix RAW with physics to get broken outcomes.

Even without that it is amazing though, as you get the SLAs of everything on your chose plane of existence. This means free wishes, access to a lot of spells and all psychic powers, etc.

[Vedhin]

I've heard Planar Shepherds make DMs cry. Why is that?.

Well, you can Wildshape into an Efreeti and grant Wishes and you can use Planar Bubble with a slow/fast time plane. And it advances cating, wildshape, and the animal companion, all 10/10.
The Efreeti and time things were just the abuses off the top of my head.

[ArqArturo]

You had me at time bubbles.

I'd allow it, but they would have to face a cabal of high-level Planar Shepherd lich-lords :smallamused:.

[Larkas]

I really like Wildshaping Ranger 5/ Master of Many Forms 10/ Warshaper 5. Fun fun fun, and quite optimal!

I also like Bard 10/ Sublime Chord 10. Simple, and works very well, though you can do better with a little dipping.

[eggynack]

Time bubbles that allow the Druid to take hundreds of actions a turn. It doesn't work by RAW, as a turn is based on initiative and not time, but like the commoner cannon people mix RAW with physics to get broken outcomes.

I don't think you're right on this one. There's a direct conversion that can be made from time to rounds, and if you get one minute for everyone else's six seconds, what could possibly happen outside of you getting multiple turns? This isn't like the commoner cannon, because momentum isn't a part of the game's rules. Time is a part of the game's rules, so it's not mixing RAW with physics. It's just mixing RAW with other RAW.

[underlaud]

To be honest, I like Monk 20. I know its far from "Optimal" but I really enjoy kung fu fighting.

[Blackhawk748]

I once went straight Fighter 10 (thats when the campaign ended) with no ACFs. honestly i had a ton of fun

My favorite character ever probably has to be Aramil Redhawk (i have however had several characters with this name lol) This particular one was a Sorcerer 6/Fighter (Armored Mage) 1/ Eldritch Knight 10/ Abjurant Champion 3 (i woulda took more Adjurant Champion but i discovered it when i was about level 15 so i just figured id wait)

Anyway Aramil actually split from the party as they were driving me nuts (this party was Chaotic (stupid) Evil (stupid) though they adamantly deny this) but my DM let me keep playing online. So by the end of the campaign i wound up killing the party 3 times and owned all of Renaria Bay as well as the eastern section of Drhokker under the banner of the Raven King (ie me) and i wound up becoming a Lich, all while remaining Lawful Neutral.

[Need_A_Life]

Wizard/Dread Witch/Nightmare Spinner.

Causing enemies to be Panicked and take damage is useful. Being a high-level arcane caster too? That's just icing.

Shadowcraft Mage is also fun.

But for "must finish the PrC" requirement, I think Rainbow Warsnake bears mentioning. Sure, Warmages (or Dread Necromancers etc.) might not be all that good, but add all Cleric spells to their spell lists and they become so flexible that Wizards and Artificers start getting envious (well, not really, but it's close).

Or Unholy Abomination (Dragon Magazine). Or Soul Eater (using Warshaper you can get to a truly staggering amount of attacks delivering that energy drain). Heck, combine Unholy Abomination and Soul Eater (I think Elans - no, the race - qualify for both).

[Chronos]

What dips are so hard to justify from a story perspective? The character can justify them the same way the player does: "I want to be more powerful". OK, so the character's motivations are going to be more nuanced than that: Maybe "I want to be more powerful so I stand a chance at defeating the demon lord that's taking over the world", or something like that. It's still a sane and reasonable thing for a character to do.

[Blackhawk748]

What dips are so hard to justify from a story perspective? The character can justify them the same way the player does: "I want to be more powerful". OK, so the character's motivations are going to be more nuanced than that: Maybe "I want to be more powerful so I stand a chance at defeating the demon lord that's taking over the world", or something like that. It's still a sane and reasonable thing for a character to do.

With most things ya, but looking at some builds the only reaction i have is "what in gods name...." probably because some builds that dont have more than 3 levels in a particular class. However these particular builds arent exactly common and exist for pure power gaming.

[almightycoma]

wizard 10/ elemental savant(acid) 10, because earth glide is awesome.

[ArqArturo]

wizard 10/ elemental savant(acid) 10, because earth glide is awesome.

I have a thing against the Elemental Savant, simply because you sacrifice all the plethora of different energies for one. However, with Silver Pyromancer, you seem to offset it when it comes to Fire, but I'm still not convinced.

[angry_bear]

An idea I had, that seems a bit far from optimal, but looks like it'd be a lot of fun is sorcerer 4, cleric 3, mystic theurge 10. Probably use the sorcerer spells for blasting and the cleric spells for buffs/debuffs or something along those lines. And yeah, probably not the best build, but I think it'd be enjoyable. For the heck of it, I might go Lich near end game.

[NeoPhoenix0]

This build is freaking complicated and required all kinds of planning to get done and it is quite feat starved in the first half. It is also very unoptimized, but I found the character to be quite enjoyable to play.

Sorcerer 5/ Wild Mage (CA) 4/ Jaunter (Demonweb pits) 1/ Wayfarer Guide (CA) 3/ Jaunter 3/ Wild Mage 4 (6 if going epic)

The wild mage was completely unnecessary and I added it in last. I chose it over other arcane classes because i really like it and go for it when I don't know what to do for my sorcerer. I am also hoping one of these days to get a chance to use a greater rod of wonder.

For the jaunter from the expedition to the demonweb pits, I used the adaptation to give it full casting. My DM also house ruled that I could use use wayfarer guide as a full casting instead of 2/3 because it doesn't give you anything to warrant the lose of spellcasting. Also, I don't use teleport to break storylines. Partially because he usually doesn't gives us enough information to scry locations that would jump us far ahead.

Edit: Also needs to be human or use flaws to get enough feats to qualify at the levels indicated.

[lsfreak]

With most things ya, but looking at some builds the only reaction i have is "what in gods name...." probably because some builds that dont have more than 3 levels in a particular class. However these particular builds arent exactly common and exist for pure power gaming.

Many of those aren't for powergaming, but to fill a particular concept (I'd argue if you fulfill a concept but end up being bad at it, you've failed to fulfill the concept). And many people on this board are of the view that classes are a metagame concept anyway; the character, in-world, wouldn't see any difference between taking a level in Ruby Knight Vindicator versus finishing Ordained Champion, because to him, he's just training towards the same goal as always.

Speaking of which, a Cleric4/Ordained Champion5/Sacred Exorcist 10. Tank-type using DMM:Persist to buff himself, and using remaining TU attempts for smiting. I like fitting RKV in there in place of sacred exorcist, but that's best not finishing out ordained champion or RKV imo, or at least splitting them up if you're going to, and it requires either being TU-starved or some shenanigans to get more.

Binder/Knight of the Sacred Seal, Wizard3-4/Master Specialist and Scout 4/Ranger16 are straightforward, functional and standard builds. With the latter, I prefer throwing in a level of cloistered cleric for Law/Travel/Knowledge devotions basically ignoring the spellcasting it gains.

[Amphetryon]

Duskblade 13/Iot7v 7 is always good for a laugh under these parameters.

[NeoPhoenix0]

Duskblade 13/Iot7v 7 is always good for a laugh under these parameters.

What do you mean for a good laugh? It is actually a good way to increase the power of a nova duskblade while only sacrificing a few feats. So you trade a little of that massive damage build for a massive boost to defense.

[erikun]

Crusader/Cleric/Ruby Knight Vindicator is lots of fun. I'd like to give Wizard/Bard/Ultimate Magus a try.

Druid/Wizard/Arcane Hierophant/Mystic Theurge is definitely worth taking to full levels, and beyond with epic Mystic Theurge, although you'll hit 20th level before the Mystic Theurge caps out.

[AutumnLotus]

Personal Favorite 'Logical' build? Probably Paladin of Tyranny 6/Blackguard 10/Ordained Champion 4. He was very fun to roleplay, since they were a political advisor and corrupt lawgiver for a large kingdom. Not amazing at combat, but still a fun little stint into what I enjoy before I noticed the crusader class :smallbiggrin:

[Prince Raven]

Bard 20 is always fun to play.

[thethird]

Personal favorite crazy build with all prcs maxed?

Spellthief 10 / War Weaver 5 / Spellguard 5.

So I heard you like to throw spellcasters at the party...

[Vaz]

Wu Jen 5/Incantatrix 10/Archmage 5

[Endarire]

Wizard5/Incantatrix10/Spellguard of Silverymoon5

Wizard5/Incantatrix10/Full Casting5

Wizard5/Red Wizard10/Archmage5 (And it's core!)

Druid20 and Artificer20 are the only base classes I can propose going to 20 if all of 3.5 is available to use.

[Azoth]

While it falls 1 level shy of finishing out both PRCs I do love Wilderness Rogue4/Ranger2/Dread Commando 5/Nightsong Enforcer 9. It is a simple and fun skill monkey/skirmisher perfect for ambush fighting.

[Eldan]

I quite like Binder 2/Sorcerer 8/Anima Mage 10. Stick 5 level casting PrC in to taste. Maybe Archmage.

[Prince Raven]

would 3 levels be considered a dip? Because I'm quite a fan of Rogue 7/Swashbuckler 3/Whisperknife 9 for halflings.

[Amphetryon]

What do you mean for a good laugh? It is actually a good way to increase the power of a nova duskblade while only sacrificing a few feats. So you trade a little of that massive damage build for a massive boost to defense.

"A good laugh" = "having fun." Do you not usually have fun when you're laughing?:smallconfused:

[eggynack]

"A good laugh" = "having fun." Do you not usually have fun when you're laughing?:smallconfused:
I believe that he interpreted your words to mean that your fun was being had at the build's expense.

[Amphetryon]

I believe that he interpreted your words to mean that your fun was being had at the build's expense.

Which is why I answered the query, clarifying the intent. . . .

[eggynack]

Which is why I answered the query, clarifying the intent. . . .
Ah. I thought you were wondering how he derived his interpretation of your statement. This is going to a very meta place.

[Raendyn]

Supposing that "all PrC maxed" means that we max them as much as possible...

Wizard5/Red Wizard of Thay10 (5)/Shadow Adept 5 (10)

Evil, Sharan, Dreams to be his Specialty Zulkir. That says it all.

[Daruwind]

Minotaur 6HD / Barbarian 20 / Epic Barbarian 10 with a few homebrew changes...It took several years and different campaigns but its definitely one of most notable characters in our group. Magic, metamagic, diplomacy..everything was failing from time to time but during all of this there were the certainty of large greataxe as the last save for our butts. :smallbiggrin:

[Blackhawk748]

20 lvls of Dread Necro, because nothing says happiness like an army of completely loyal killing machines being led by a Lich

[Talya]

Druid 20 dips at nothing, because honestly, all druid levels are great :smallbiggrin:.


While 2 tiers lower on the power scale, Bard 20 lacks nothing, either. I know there are several nice bard PrCs, but my favorite bard build -- while making liberal use of ACFs -- is still 100% bard. A well-built single-class bard can out-do the factotum at their own game (the game of being able to do absolutely everything competently) while also being one of the best melee damage dealers ever. (The only reason it's "one of the best" instead of just "the best" is because they'll confer most of their melee bonuses that make them great onto their party members as well - which certainly isn't a negative thing.)

[Dusk Eclipse]

Eh Bard 20 needs a lot of stuff from splatbooks to be good, core Bard is severely lacking due the "Jack of all trades" symptom.

As far as non-dip builds I love Ranger 1/Warblade 4 /Revenanr Blade 5/Eternal Blade 10 (needs flaws to work; but you can substitute one Warblade level with Fighter; but it does cost you 9th level maneuvers)

[NeoPhoenix0]

"A good laugh" = "having fun." Do you not usually have fun when you're laughing?:smallconfused:

Just goes to show not even blue text solves all our communication errors.

It is pretty funny, nuclear swordsman meets barrier maiden.

[Talya]

Eh Bard 20 needs a lot of stuff from splatbooks to be good, core Bard is severely lacking due the "Jack of all trades" symptom.


And which part of "liberal use of ACFs" (or anything else in this thread) suggested "core?" :smallwink:

Of course it ain't core. Nobody plays core 3.5.

So, specific ACFs suggested:
Start with "Savage Bard" (Unearthed Arcana)
Add Bardic Knack, Spellbreaker Song, Hymn of Healing. Trade away Suggestion for Song of the Heart.
Take feats like Melodic Casting, Jack of All Trades, Snowflake Wardance, and Dragonfire Inspiration, and possibly Words of Creation.

Get yourself a Crystal Echoblade.

Never, ever leave bard.

[Auramis]

Recently discovered to be my favorite with our current D&D campaign.

Cleric 4, Knight 3, Prestige Paladin 3, Swift Wing 10

I know Prestige Paladin isn't maxed, but I'm not counting it as a true prestige class, since it's just a re-adaptation of the core paladin.

Since this particular character is a cleric to Bahamut too, I plan on going into and maxing out Vassal of Bahamut too, if we're allowed to advance beyond 20-25.

[Urpriest]

I see so many people around here with these crazy builds meant to optimize every single possibly bonus or perk but ends up with like 2 levels of one class, 3 of another until you have like a laundry list of PRSC's, most of the time being impossible to rationalize in a narrative/plot sense.

So my question is...what are peoples favorite builds that involve you maxing out any PRSC's utilized? (its fine if the levels are divided up) One of my all time favorites was a savage human martial artist named "Kwan" I used a number of years ago:

Barbarian 2/ Fist of the Forest 3 / Bear Warrior 10/ Warshaper 10 (we went into epic levels in that campaign)

You wouldn't have done Epic Warshaper though, as Warshaper is a five-level class.

Anyway, I would like to point out that most of the "lots of dips" builds are arranged that way because the classes used all have the same fluff, so no new fluff justification is necessary. For example, the dippy-looking

Paladin 2/Sorceror 4/Spellsword 1/Abjurant Champion 5/Sacred Exorcist 8

Takes classes that are: Holy Warrior, Spellcaster, Spellcaster Warrior, Spellcaster Warrior, Holy Warrior

When you can describe all of the classes in a build with three words, you know there isn't any fluff difficulty.

Anyway, in terms of finishing all PrCs I like Wizard 3/Master Specialist 10/Archmage 5/Wizard +2, for a nice, as-intended stack of PrCs.

[Dusk Eclipse]

And which part of "liberal use of ACFs" (or anything else in this thread) suggested "core?" :smallwink:

Of course it ain't core. Nobody plays core 3.5.

So, specific ACFs suggested:
Start with "Savage Bard" (Unearthed Arcana)
Add Bardic Knack, Spellbreaker Song, Hymn of Healing. Trade away Suggestion for Song of the Heart.
Take feats like Melodic Casting, Jack of All Trades, Snowflake Wardance, and Dragonfire Inspiration, and possibly Words of Creation.

Get yourself a Crystal Echoblade.

Never, ever leave bard.

I swear you didn't mention ACF before, oh well. In any case since we get semi-regularly threads about core-only advice and I've seen more than one pbp recruitment which specified core only I would say there is a fair amount of people who play like that (a shame really
since 3.5/PF best quality is its versatility) .

[Eldan]

Recently discovered to be my favorite with our current D&D campaign.

Cleric 4, Knight 3, Prestige Paladin 3, Swift Wing 10

I know Prestige Paladin isn't maxed, but I'm not counting it as a true prestige class, since it's just a re-adaptation of the core paladin.

Since this particular character is a cleric to Bahamut too, I plan on going into and maxing out Vassal of Bahamut too, if we're allowed to advance beyond 20-25.

Never heard of Swiftwing. Where's that from?

[Auramis]

Never heard of Swiftwing. Where's that from?

It's a prestige for paladins and clerics (the latter being better, as usual when it comes to those two) that has super natural wings, damage reduction/magic, immunity to one type of energy, a holy breath weapon that harms undead and heals allies (scaling off character level) in exchange for a turn attempt, casting boost 8/10 levels, and a near unhealthy obsession with dragons. More skill points to use than cleric or paladin, too, with just a few more skills than cleric (except lacking knowledge (history)).

It's from Dragon Magics. One of my favorite prestige classes. Despite how dragon loving it sounds, by the way, you don't even have to worship a dragonic god.

http://dndtools.eu/classes/swift-wing/