Why does Haley use potions?

[littlebum2002]

I'm not a D&D player, but I've read about it extensively to better understand this comic, so I have some feel for the basic rules, character optimization, etc.

From what I understand, potions and wands do the exact same thing. For instance, a Wand of Cure Moderate Wounds is the exact same as 50 Potions of Cure Moderate Wounds. However, the wand is much more cost-efficient as the potion. (In that example, it would be 90GP per cure instead of 300GP per cure)

I can understand why a cleric like Durkon uses potions, since he is only interested in making sure people get cured and not how much it costs. But it seems odd that a money miser like Haley would use something as inefficient as potions, unless there's something beneficial about them I don't realize (which is usually the case when I try to understand D&D rules)

[Morty]

Because it ultimately makes no difference and potions are more readily recognizable, is my guess.

[Kornaki]

Durkon should use a wand of cure light wounds; there's no real reason he should be using potions except that it allows the team to heal him when he goes down. Haley on the other hand would require a use magic device check to use a wand which she may or may not be able to make - potions are a much more reliable source of healing for her.

[Cuaqchi]

Also unless she has a good U(se) M(agic) D(evice) skill; which, is generally unlikely given the style of the characters in the comic she can't actually use a wand because she lacks a spell list.

Ninja'd... :smallmad:

[Emanick]

I can think of two in-universe reasons (in addition to the obvious and dull possibility that "Rich might prefer showing Haley using a potion because XXX"):

1) Haley doesn't want to buy 50 charges' worth of the same spell. So even though a wand is cheaper per use, it could be cheaper overall to use potions if she doesn't need the spell very often.

2) Haley simply isn't able to buy the kind of wands she wants. Magic item stores aren't that common in many D&D universes, and we haven't seen many in OOTSverse. Perhaps she simply hasn't found any stores that sell, say, a wand of cure moderate wounds.

[Leecros]

It probably mostly because potions are more recognizable.


Personally, i'm glad that there's not many wands in the comic. Everytime we would see one there'd be a group having rampant speculation about what all it can do and another shouting "Deus Ex Machina! Deus Ex Machina!" Probably mostly from people who probably don't fully understand what exactly a "DEM" is.

[NerdyKris]

This isn't a fully optimized, play by play retelling of a D&D campaign. Haley doesn't use wands because potions are more easily recognizable to the readers, requires less explanation, and can be shared among the party.

If she was using a wand, a lot of people would be asking "Is Haley a wizard/rogue?" and "What spell is she casting?". It's just ease of narrative with no real impact on the story, since they will always have as much money as they need at that time. There's no tracking of that being done.

[Oko and Qailee]

I think the big thing here is more story telling than actual mechanics.

Potions are much more common and recognizable in literature/fantasy as being items of healing.

Wands have varied uses, but aren't the standard go-to for healing

Edit: Ninja'd twice, my spot might as well be the same as Belkars

[SavageWombat]

Or maybe, like a lot of DMs, Rich doesn't like the Wand of CLW bit.

[Yuki Akuma]

Also unless she has a good U(se) M(agic) D(evice) skill; which, is generally unlikely given the style of the characters in the comic she can't actually use a wand because she lacks a spell list.

Ninja'd... :smallmad:

Haley absolutely has UMD - she's used Sending scrolls before, and Teleport scrolls in one of the books.

[Xelbiuj]

She was able to buy them at less then cost, which throws your math out the window. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0135.html)

She probably overheard V and was the one that decided to buy out their entire stock of healing potions. :smallbiggrin:

[Sephoris]

As others have said, Haley would have to roll UMD to activate a wand. The thing is, even if Haley's UMD is very good (and it probably is), it can still be risky to rely on rolling UMD a lot to heal yourself. The problem is that, if you ever roll a 1 on UMD, you're unable to use that item again for 24 hours. It's going to happen sooner or later if you're healing yourself with a wand all the time, and if it happens at a bad time it could very well kill you.

[The Giant]

Because potions can be used by anyone, anywhere, even if Haley gets knocked out. They can be traded to Elan or Roy or V for them to carry when the party is inevitably split during combat.

That makes them more versatile tactically AND more flexible story-wise. And they're also more recognizable to non-D&D players. And wand are more visually appropriate to offensive spells that you aim at someone. And I don't care at all about what the most cost-efficient option by the rules is anyway.

[137beth]

Well...
drawing a potion in Haley's hand in a digital file costs nothing, so Haley can get potions for free by having the giant draw them in:smalltongue:

[SavageWombat]

I think we need an accounting of this Kickstarter money to see if Haley's been embezzling it for potions.

[Math_Mage]

I think we need an accounting of this Kickstarter money to see if Haley's been embezzling it for potions.
It's necessary, don't judge! She spent all her allotted money on Aton skin products! :smallwink:

[littlebum2002]

Thanks guys. I didn't realize that you needed a skill to use a wand. See, I knew my lack of knowledge of D&D factored in here somewhere.

Also, it's pretty embarrassing that the first post of mine that the Giant ever responded to is something as silly as this.

EDIT: I also second the "potions are more recognizable" idea. When I first read the story, I did kinda wonder why Nale was the only person using wands. So if everyone was using wands, I probably would have assumed that magic in D&D was like Harry Potter.

[Peelee]

it's pretty embarrassing that the first post of mine that the Giant ever responded to is something as silly as this.

If it makes you feel any better, I think the first time the Giant responded to me was because I ignored the fact that vampires have fast healing, and I do play D&D. In fact, most of the time when he answers some question or comment I have, it's because I'm wrong in some way. I see it as good, though. Question is answered from the best possible source, and who cares if we end up looking a little silly for it?

[Snails]

OotS only shows token healing on panel anyway. This is not an aspect of D&D that the Giant seems interested in modelling in a manner that is easy to follow for obsessive number crunchers. Whether the healing is provided by Spells + Potions or Spells + Potions + Wands, hardly matters, in the larger context. Maybe they are using wands off panel?

[Newwby]

She was able to buy them at less then cost, which throws your math out the window. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0135.html)

She probably overheard V and was the one that decided to buy out their entire stock of healing potions. :smallbiggrin:

Thisssss. I would have posted it if I wasn't beaten to it by a long shot :smallfrown:

[Tragak]

She was able to buy them at less then cost, which throws your math out the window. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0135.html)

She probably overheard V and was the one that decided to buy out their entire stock of healing potions. :smallbiggrin: There is no way that didn't happen. I believe you win the internet.

[ralphmerridew]

There is no way that didn't happen. I believe you win the internet.

But wouldn't those potions have been lost during the inn explosion?

[Connington]

Haley has a cache of wands now. Happy?

[SavageWombat]

There is no way that didn't happen. I believe you win the internet.

People keep winning "the" internet. Are they passing it to each other each time?

[Tragak]

People keep winning "the" internet. Are they passing it to each other each time? Nope, the Internet is a game, not a currency.

[137beth]

People keep winning "the" internet. Are they passing it to each other each time?

I seem to recall on the 3.5 forums flickerdart won "all the internets", so there have to be more than one.

[Porthos]

Haley has a cache of wands now. Happy?

Actually, it looks like he was a slightly embarrassed. :smalltongue:

Just a coincidence though. :smallwink:

[Yendor]

I'm guessing it's more to do with the time Nale used a Wand of Enervation, and some people complained because the Giant didn't show Nale finding a Wand of Enervation, and deciding he should totally buy this Wand of Enervation in case he needs to zap an enemy spellcaster and drain some of his spell slots. (That might be a slight exaggeration, but you can never be sure around here.)

[NerdyKris]

I'm guessing the reason is so they have magic wands for some plot critical sequence in the future. Not to appease internet fan theories.

They're without their main caster for a little longer. They might need those wands.

[EnragedFilia]

On winning internets (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/you-win-the-internet)
It can be used either way. It's still the same basic gag though. (warning: above link involves profanity and annoying banner ads)

[holywhippet]

Wands have varied uses, but aren't the standard go-to for healing



I disagree. A lot of players either buy or manufacture wands of cure light wounds by the dozen. They are a cheap and effective means of enacting healing and many classes can use them. Potions are equally effective, cost more but can be used by anyone at any time. So you'd keep potions as an emergency reserve option and have wands for primary usage.

[EnragedFilia]

In fiction that is not based on D&D rules, potions are used for healing much more commonly than wands.

[hoff]

If im not mistaken uing a wand is a standard action, while drinking a potion is a move action.

[Snails]

If im not mistaken uing a wand is a standard action, while drinking a potion is a move action.

Mistaken.

To activate a Potion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#activateMagicItem) and gain its magical effect is a Standard Action.

Drinking a small amount of liquid might arguably be a Move Equivalent Action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#manipulateanItem). Maybe. But by the RAW, merely drinking the liquid does not provide the useful magical effect contained in the potion. The potion must still be "activated" via the effort included in a Standard Action.

Weird, ain't it? But for game purposes, it works.

[Shred-Bot]

Mistaken.

To activate a Potion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#activateMagicItem) and gain its magical effect is a Standard Action.

Drinking a small amount of liquid might arguably be a Move Equivalent Action (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#manipulateanItem). Maybe. But by the RAW, merely drinking the liquid does not provide the useful magical effect contained in the potion. The potion must still be "activated" via the effort included in a Standard Action.

Weird, ain't it? But for game purposes, it works.

And there goes the market for my potion Camelbak invention. :smallfrown:

[b_jonas]

Maybe I'm coming from the wrong game, but I thought the in-universe reason for potions is the following.

Haley does not (usually) buy potions of healing. They find random potions of healing in the loot of fallen mooks, and manufacture more potent potions of healing (say cure critical wounds) from less useful ones (say cure itchy wounds). Potions of healing are a really common randomly generated item in inventories of many monsters (most of the intelligent non-undead monsters, for they're the ones who can use such a potion to heal themselves), and the Order are high level enough to kill low-level enemies quickly enough that they can't drink their potions before dying. On the other hand, wands of healing are rare, just like more potent potions like the potion of glibness (which Elan specifically claims he has bought) (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0767.html), so the Order are more likely to have to buy those.

Xelbiuj also makes a good point above about the cheap potions in that shop (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0135.html).

The Giant has explained the out of universe reason already.

[Shred-Bot]

Obviously the reason she uses the healing potions is that they taste fantastic, and adventuring is thirsty work so she's got to keep her fluids up.

[Syncrogti]

And there goes the market for my potion Camelbak invention. :smallfrown:

Dude that is a great idea! You could get a CLW with double volume to give you a CMW effect. Would it be a full round action? Kinda trading length of action for additional healing. How does a CLW potion compare to a CMW, is it half the price?

[EnragedFilia]

Dude that is a great idea! You could get a CLW with double volume to give you a CMW effect. Would it be a full round action? Kinda trading length of action for additional healing. How does a CLW potion compare to a CMW, is it half the price?

A CLW potion is 1/6 the price of a CMW potion (both base price and cost to produce in gp and xp). This is part of the reason why lower-level potions/scrolls/wands are more commonly used for noncombat healing than higher-level ones.

[137beth]

Obviously the reason she uses the healing potions is that they taste fantastic, and adventuring is thirsty work so she's got to keep her fluids up.

Does drinking potions prevent dehydration?:smalltongue:

[Tragak]

Does drinking potions prevent dehydration?:smalltongue: That depends: is it a potion of dehydration :smallbiggrin:

[Kid Jake]

That depends: is it a potion of dehydration :smallbiggrin:


You mean a potion of hydration. It's got electrolytes!

[Nevereatcars]

I seem to recall on the 3.5 forums flickerdart won "all the internets", so there have to be more than one.

"Multinet"

[137beth]

"Multinet"

Well the prefix "inter" already implies that it is between multiple Nets. Apparently "intercomputer" didn't sell as well:smalltongue:

[Newwby]

That depends: is it a potion of dehydration :smallbiggrin:

Things then become extremely complicated with potions of identify hydration which provide an ever-fluctuating result based on how many you drink.

[Shred-Bot]

Dude that is a great idea! You could get a CLW with double volume to give you a CMW effect. Would it be a full round action? Kinda trading length of action for additional healing. How does a CLW potion compare to a CMW, is it half the price?

I think the rule and/or prevailing thought is that 1 spell being used to brew a potion produces a set volume of liquid. So in theory, dumping multiple potions into a larger container would have a larger effect, sure. Pricing I think depends partly on caster levels being put into the spell, but 2 CLW potions should be cheaper than one CMW.

Better yet, we can create a Chug feat to allow a character to drink a larger volume/combined potion in one standard action.

[Rogar Demonblud]

I know a lot of frat boys with that feat.

[JSSheridan]

Does drinking potions prevent dehydration?:smalltongue:

Potions are clearly diuretic.