Care and feeding of your new pet vampire..! [Archive]

e1_conquistador

2013-08-10, 04:52 PM

Kish

2013-08-10, 05:03 PM

Sooo yeah, this'll be interesting.
Feeding
-What, or who, do you think Durkon ought to be eating? I nominate Roy;

I nominate Nale. Depending on where they go next, nameless goblinoids are also a possibility.

-Would create food and water work?

Doubt it.

-Hey, is Redcloak going to be able to just dominate him like he did the wights? Yeek.
If Redcloak gains about seventeen more levels before he next meets Durkon while Durkon gains no more than one or two at most, sure.

ScrapperTBP

2013-08-10, 05:30 PM

There will definitely be ethical qualms about the whole feeding issue. I cannot imagine Roy just accepting that it is ok. In terms of raising, they need to go to the Dwarven Lands anyway. They will have clerics capable. What to do until then though?

theNater

2013-08-10, 05:41 PM

-What, or who, do you think Durkon ought to be eating?
Animals, like most of the rest of the party. He'll have them prepared differently(raw and wriggling), of course.

-Would create food and water work?
Unlikely, as the necessary nourishment for the vampire is life energy, and I'm fairly sure that's outside of what Create Food and Water can do.

-That staff probably has limited protection from daylight charges, right? Could be unlimited? Or no?
The charges are probably limited, so Durkon will have to stay indoors during the day once he runs out. Now that he knows such a spell is possible, he could research a version of it for himself.

-Whuh-oh; no coffin. Now what?
Now he'll have nowhere to run to if reduced to 0 hit points, so reducing him to 0 hit points will destroy him(like most undead). As with the last question, though, Malack has indicated that magic may be usable to bind Durkon to a coffin.

-How easy would it be to raise him, anyway? I heard something about a scroll? ...Who could cast that, Elan or Haley after about a hundred tries maybe? I forget the rogues and bards using scrolls rules...
It's a skill check, and like most skill checks would be pretty easy if they've put a lot of points into the skill and would be hard if they haven't put very many. I don't think we have much information on how skilled they are at it, you could check the class and level geekery thread if you wanted. The skill is called Use Magic Device.

-Hey, is Redcloak going to be able to just dominate him like he did the wights?
No.

NerdyKris

2013-08-10, 05:42 PM

I mentioned in another thread that Roy's bag of tricks would be surprisingly helpful at producing animals for Durkon to feed on. Unless the rules don't allow that.

Solse

2013-08-10, 05:48 PM

I mentioned in another thread that Roy's bag of tricks would be surprisingly helpful at producing animals for Durkon to feed on. Unless the rules don't allow that.

I'm not precisely sure as to what the exact mechanics of Bags of Tricks are, but in the strip where Roy died he mentioned that he was out of animals.

Kish

2013-08-10, 05:49 PM

KingFlameHawk

2013-08-10, 05:53 PM

Fun & Exercise
-How easy would it be to raise him, anyway? I heard something about a scroll? ...Who could cast that, Elan or Haley after about a hundred tries maybe? I forget the rogues and bards using scrolls rules...

I am not sure that Durkon would like to be raised remember how Malak reacted when Durkon offered to raise him. I can see him having a similar reaction even if he has only been a vampire for a few days.

Giggling Ghast

2013-08-10, 06:27 PM

How often does Durkon need to feed on blood now? Every couple of days or so?

EmperorSarda

2013-08-11, 01:30 AM

Invent a spell called "Create Blood" to be the vampire equivalent to Create Food and Water.

That, or feed on the local wildlife.

Gift Jeraff

2013-08-11, 01:33 AM

Remember to feed your vampire lots of garlic and leave a mirror in its habitat.

Skarn

2013-08-11, 01:59 AM

Sooo yeah, this'll be interesting.
Feeding
-What, or who, do you think Durkon ought to be eating? I nominate Roy; he's got the HP & was probably Durkon's best buddy of the group. It also seems like something that would squick Haley and Elan out, and Belkar surely won't tolerate it.
If it comes to that. But we're not sure it's strictly necessary at this point. Also as others have said, enemies may be enough of a source that it won't be a problem.

-Would create food and water work? Seems like a technical cop-out, and Malack didn't seem to use it, but It doesn't specifically say "no non-exotic fare" - it says "simple fare of your choice". It's a 3rd level spell slot, it oughta have at least some punch or flexibility. Hard to say, but I doubt it given that Malack couldn't.

Housing
-That staff probably has limited protection from daylight charges, right? Could be unlimited? Or no? Maximum of 50 charges by raw, and about 5 of them have been used in-strip. If he only uses one a day, it's very possible the story will be over before he runs out. If not, well, unless it's domain locked he should be able to cast it for himself. Clerics generally only need to know of the existence of a spell to be able to prepare it.

-Whuh-oh; no coffin. Now what?
To my knowledge pretty much any enclosed space can be designated for that. They could just find him a box.

Hmm, I wonder if a Bag of Holding would work... :smallbiggrin:

-How easy would it be to raise him, anyway? I heard something about a scroll? ...Who could cast that, Elan or Haley after about a hundred tries maybe? I forget the rogues and bards using scrolls rules...
Theoretically, Haley has some amount of Use Magic Device. She wouldn't have a problem using it.

In practice, I don't think Durkon has the feat for scribing scrolls which means they don't have access to such an item in the first place, unfortunately. I could be wrong about that though.

-Hey, is Redcloak going to be able to just dominate him like he did the wights? Yeek.
Command you mean? The wights didn't get a will save at all, but Durkon would still have a massive one, so it's unlikely to be a problem. Also, it's essentially a charm effect, so there's limits to that as well.

How often does Durkon need to feed on blood now? Every couple of days or so?
There's a source-book (Libris Mortis?) that requires them to, but otherwise not to my knowledge.

As with Malack, he may want to even if it's not a biological need though.

factotum

2013-08-11, 02:19 AM

I'm not precisely sure as to what the exact mechanics of Bags of Tricks are, but in the strip where Roy died he mentioned that he was out of animals.

According to RAW, you can only have one animal from a Bag of Tricks active at a time, and you can withdraw no more than ten animals per week. So, by RAW the bag will have recharged ages ago, but given that we've seen Roy draw multiple animals at once from his bag, it clearly doesn't work according to RAW anyway!

Aharon

2013-08-11, 02:44 AM

Actually, by the Monster Manual, Vampires don't need to drink blood at all. They do so to gain power (draining somebody completely yields a new vampire totally under their control). While the rules are silent on it, presumably they also do so because it tastes well and they don't care about the lives they destroy.

Libris Mortis adds rules that Vampires can't live without draining blood (via biting) and life force (via their energy draining touch), losing mobility if they don't do so for too long. The book also contains a variant rule that says they have to feed on life force every day, unless they make a DC 25 Will Save, and on blood every three days, unless they make a DC 15 Will Save. If they don't make the save, their Wisdom is damaged. Durkon is a 14th level cleric with Wisdom of at least 19, so he only has a 10% chance to fail the "need blood" will save. He will fail this save with a 95% probability within about 43 trials or about 120 days.

I assume that Rich will use Libris Mortis or an even harsher house rule, because Vampires who don't need blood are kind of lame.

Giggling Ghast

2013-08-11, 02:53 AM

.There's a source-book (Libris Mortis?) that requires them to, but otherwise not to my knowledge.

As with Malack, he may want to even if it's not a biological need though.

When Haley imagined Roy as a vampire, he went on about how he was conflicted about his need to eat people.

I think OOTS vampires have to feed on the living. Plus, as Aharon pointed out, vampires who don't drink blood/consume life force are kinda lame.

What would be the downside to being a vampire, then? Durkon's even got the vulnerability to sunlight licked.

Ark_X01

2013-08-11, 03:16 AM

Housing
-That staff probably has limited protection from daylight charges, right? Could be unlimited? Or no?
-Whuh-oh; no coffin. Now what?

I'm pretty sure he can replenish the staff with a spell slot or something without having to research the spell specifically (not sure, I don't know much anything about D&D rules).

Also, a coffin IS nearby in the desert...Girard Draketooth's. Thats a temporary option if he needs one.

Kareasint

2013-08-11, 05:55 AM

I'm pretty sure he can replenish the staff with a spell slot or something without having to research the spell specifically (not sure, I don't know much anything about D&D rules).

A staff can be recharged via casting a spell into it where it is stored. Once V identifies it, Durkon will know what he can use to recharge the staff. I am going to presume that Malack has multiple spells set up for the staff to cast.

As for learning the spell "Protection from Daylight," Durkon could research it but this will take time. Access to Malack's library would definitely help. It may already have the complete spell written down.

Kish

2013-08-11, 06:19 AM

A staff can be recharged via casting a spell into it where it is stored.
This isn't Pathfinder.

pendell

2013-08-11, 07:03 AM

Invent a spell called "Create Blood" to be the vampire equivalent to Create Food and Water.

This. If I was RPing a vampire cleric and could not , for one reason or another, return to my living state ( for instance, the DM tells me that as part of my new condition my character cannot *want* to return to mortality, so I can't raise it as an option), researching "create blood" will be among the first things I do as soon as I can.

If that won't work, feed on live animals.

If it must be a sentient, try to find sentients who are not innocents. The ogres who are harassing the local town. Or criminals already condemned to death. We've already established that you don't need to "drain the last drop" to gain nourishment, so indulge in a quick snack before killing them the conventional way.

Or, if I've got tons of money or something else to trade, offer it in exchange for blood. If 18 men with 16 constitution agree to donate 1 point of constitution each, that's the same as draining 1 person of 18 constitution points. For a commoner, a thousand GP (say) may be more money than they'll see in their lifetimes, well worth losing 1 point of constitution for , especially if he/she is a big, strong ox who won't miss it. No feeding on kids or the very weak, for that reason.

Or ... some clerical services are provided in exchange for a donation, right? So Durkula takes his donation for a Heal or a Restore or a Cure Sickness in the form of a pint of blood instead of in gold. It might even be more fair, a boon to the poor, as not everyone has gold but everyone has blood.

Or take over Malack's old job in a different kingdom with a better system of justice. Malack takes flack, but even in the EOB system I'll bet more than enough serious crimes are committed in which those convicted really are guilty that Durkula could "live" . Say, "you're convicted of armed robbery. Your sentence is <> gold pieces OR <> days in jail OR 1 pint of blood". Fines can be paid in blood as well as in gold or in magic items. Or maybe people who get executed donate a pint first.

In such a situation it would be very, very important for Durkula to be executioner but not judge. This is because it is a very, very bad idea for a judge to benefit in any way from the sentences s/he pronounces.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Pyron

2013-08-11, 07:12 AM

Invent a spell called "Create Blood" to be the vampire equivalent to Create Food and Water..

One already exists. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/summonMonsterI.htm)

hamishspence

2013-08-11, 07:21 AM

If summoned monsters aren't "real" - then their blood/energy might not be, either.

Ruleswise though, while they don't grant XP (unless there's no Summoner in the encounter) - there's nothing preventing them being drained successfully.

Jay R

2013-08-11, 08:37 AM

Well, Durkon carefully killed Zz'dtri so that there were no cuts in his skin. His blood should still be available.

hamishspence

2013-08-11, 08:40 AM

FlawedParadigm

2013-08-11, 09:18 AM

I don't think you can inflict CON-drain on a dead body though- and it may be the CON-draining that provides nourishment, not the blood itself.

In some vampire fiction "dead blood" doesn't feed a vampire. In Anne Rice's version, it's actually toxic to them.

That's true for a lot of them. I actually can't think of any vampire fiction where they can feed on the dead (although I've by no means read/watched it all.) It would too neatly solve their conflicts if they could just feed on any dead thing they happened across. Roadkill. Dig up graves. Slaughtered pigs. There's pretty much two kinds of vampire fiction; either they're monsters to be killed or conflicted beings, and neither would make a whole lot of sense if vampires could just feed on the dead. The reason for conflict goes out the window, either external or internal conflict.

martianmister

2013-08-11, 09:57 AM

Considering the relationship Roy has shown with the animals from his Bag of Tricks, I doubt if we're going to be shown Durkon treating them as a food source unless it's supposed to be seriously disturbing.

Animals that he uncaringly throw off to their dooms? (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0443.html)

gorocz

2013-08-12, 03:49 AM

Remember to feed your vampire lots of garlic and leave a mirror in its habitat.

I think you'll find that's parrots you're thinking. They are a smaller subspecies of vampires and while Durkula is certainly smaller than your average vampire, he's missing the plumage that parrots usually have...

If summoned monsters aren't "real" - then their blood/energy might not be, either.

Ruleswise though, while they don't grant XP (unless there's no Summoner in the encounter) - there's nothing preventing them being drained successfully.

I'm pretty sure summoned monsters are real, they just can't die and are bound to serve the summoner for the duration of the spell. If they were to die (like the sand elemental, for example) they should "respawn" in their natural plane in 24 hours. Otherwise they are normal inhabitants of that plane.

Bulldog Psion

2013-08-12, 03:55 AM

Yes, there's always a lot of "drinking the blood of the living" stuff. So no sucking the juice out of fresh corpses, I guess.

Dang, now that I write that, it sounds utterly, absolutely revolting. Ugh.:smallyuk:

ranagrande

2013-08-12, 05:29 AM

I think this is one place where a vampire cleric has a major advantage. Find a willing partner, drink their blood, and then cast Restoration.

Mike Havran

2013-08-12, 05:30 AM

Come to think of it, Malack seemed to be okay with drinking bloodwart tea, which implies vampires don't need to suck blood out of living victims to survive. Or maybe Malack drank his daily fare out of living prisoners in the night anyway and had the tea just because he liked the taste, like a midday snack?

I think this is one place where a vampire cleric has a major advantage. Find a willing partner, drink their blood, and then cast Restoration.

I am not sure if common Restoration can fix vampire Con drain. But I can imagine Durkula researching a special, higher level version of it that can fix it.

Kish

2013-08-12, 05:57 AM

I am not sure if common Restoration can fix vampire Con drain. But I can imagine Durkula researching a special, higher level version of it that can fix it.
Curing the long-term effects of being attacked by a creature like a vampire is what "common Restoration (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/restoration.htm)" is for.

gorocz

2013-08-12, 06:02 AM

I am not sure if common Restoration can fix vampire Con drain. But I can imagine Durkula researching a special, higher level version of it that can fix it.

Lesser Restoration (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/restorationLesser.htm) can't (clearly states only temporary ability damage), but Restoration (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/restoration.htm) can cure permanent ability drain. Not to mention its stronger cousin, Greater Restoration (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/restorationGreater.htm), which can also restore all drained levels at once (and which should Durkon be also able to cast).

Any reason why should Vampire Blood Drain ability drain (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/vampire.htm) be any different? The only exception to Restoration is the CON loss and negative level on death, which is explicitly stated in the description...

paddyfool

2013-08-12, 06:05 AM

That's true for a lot of them. I actually can't think of any vampire fiction where they can feed on the dead (although I've by no means read/watched it all.) It would too neatly solve their conflicts if they could just feed on any dead thing they happened across. Roadkill. Dig up graves. Slaughtered pigs. There's pretty much two kinds of vampire fiction; either they're monsters to be killed or conflicted beings, and neither would make a whole lot of sense if vampires could just feed on the dead. The reason for conflict goes out the window, either external or internal conflict.

IIRC, Buffyverse vamps can (Angel lived for a while off pig blood he got from a butcher's shop - it's a product used in preparing various delicacies, e.g. black pudding - and I very much doubt they were regularly bleeding live pigs for donations).

factotum

2013-08-12, 06:37 AM

Or maybe Malack drank his daily fare out of living prisoners in the night anyway and had the tea just because he liked the taste, like a midday snack?

That, I would think. See Malack's comment in strip #871:

"I take my daily nourishment from those the Empire executes in the course of its regular business."

MtlGuy

2013-08-12, 12:16 PM

I had been wondering the same thing.
Easiest thing would be for him to dominate Belkar with his gaze attack, feed on him, cast a restoration spell then make him forget the entire thing, every day.

Alternatively, perhaps Durkon could summon a monster to feed on?

Or he can simply consume his living enemies. Gives OotS a good interogation tactic "Tell us what we want to know or I'll feed you to our vampire cleric!" Though Roy's probably too good a guy to take advantage of same given his reluctance to use a dominated Kobold as a trapspringer.

NerdyKris

2013-08-12, 01:23 PM

Easiest thing would be for him to dominate Belkar with his gaze attack, feed on him, cast a restoration spell then make him forget the entire thing, every day.

I think the rest of the Order would have an extreme problem with him doing that, Varsuvius included. That's not even remotely anywhere near a good action. That's a horrible, despicable action. Especially when any of the party members could have volunteered for blood duty without being dominated. He doesn't have to drink from them directly. There's always the "Bleed into a cup and drink from that" method.

I'd guess that they'll find a non objectionable method to get him blood, such as hunting animals or offering their blood. It simply wouldn't make sense for Durkon, who wants to help the Order, to do something that would make them all turn on him instantly. He's evil, yes. But not stupid.

GSFB

2013-08-12, 03:11 PM

The Masai tribe raise cattle, and bleed (relatively) small amounts of blood from them to use as food in addition to their milk. Because cows are large and have a LOT of blood (compared to, say, a human), their blood can be harvested like this regularly without killing them or even leaving them too weak to survive in the harsh climate. Durkon could obtain a large domesticated animal, one that could be regularly drained of enough blood to sustain him without suffering TOO much, and keep it with him. Meanwhile, look at all those DINOSAURS headed his way...

Skarn

2013-08-12, 07:57 PM

When Haley imagined Roy as a vampire, he went on about how he was conflicted about his need to eat people.

I think OOTS vampires have to feed on the living. Plus, as Aharon pointed out, vampires who don't drink blood/consume life force are kinda lame.I had actually forgotten about that.

Lame isn't the word I'd use though. Clichè maybe.

What would be the downside to being a vampire, then? Durkon's even got the vulnerability to sunlight licked. Besides the forced-evil thing, there's the undead traits, which can be used against them(doubly so when your main antagonists use necromancy). There's still the vulnerability to running water, holy symbols, mirrors and staking as well.

Also, the Vampire traits are great and work well together, but in exchange the character tends to be weak in terms of class levels. You can't have everything after all.

Besides, he's still weak to sunlight: an anti-magic field could result in instant death for him if someone knows his weakness. Same goes for if he loses his staff somehow.

factotum

2013-08-13, 01:41 AM

Also, the Vampire traits are great and work well together, but in exchange the character tends to be weak in terms of class levels.

That only really applies if he spent his entire "life" as a vampire. Since he levelled up in his class before becoming one, he's still a pretty high level cleric regardless of being a vampire--it's just he isn't likely to gain any more cleric levels for a while due to the LA!

Vovix

2013-08-13, 02:08 AM

-That staff probably has limited protection from daylight charges, right?
Staves can be recharged, so Durkon should be fine until he researches the spell for himself.

Needle

2013-08-13, 05:45 AM

Silverionmox

2013-08-13, 07:07 AM

I had actually forgotten about that.

Besides the forced-evil thing, there's the undead traits, which can be used against them(doubly so when your main antagonists use necromancy). There's still the vulnerability to running water, holy symbols, mirrors and staking as well. I think being staked in the heart wouldn't have gone well with Durkon before his new dresscode either, constitution bonus or not http://www.giantitp.com/forums/images/smilies/smallstick/smallbiggrin.gif. And having no reflection is just an oddity.

Kish

2013-08-13, 08:03 AM

Staves can be recharged, so Durkon should be fine until he researches the spell for himself.
Staves cannot be recharged; this isn't Pathfinder.

pendell

2013-08-13, 08:26 AM

Staves cannot be recharged; this isn't Pathfinder.

Just did a quick drive through the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/staffs.htm). The rules don't make mechanical provision for staff recharge but neither do they explicitly forbid it. In the absence of clearly defined RAW, this appears to be at the discretion of the DM. *I* would houserule in a mechanism for recharging a staff, as it makes no sense to me that someone would develop an expensive magical item only to have it revert permanently to a +2 staff when all the charges are expended. Besides, the ability to charge something in the first place implies the ability to recharge it -- the same magic that put those 50 charges in the staff in the first place could conceivably be leveraged to add more charges once some are expended.

Besides, it makes sense to me that any magic-user who would go to the trouble of creating a staff in the first place would not want to have to make another one from scratch when the first one is out of charges. Thus , I believe it reasonable that in any world where D&D staff technology exists research on rechargeable staffs would be a priority. On some worlds they would have succeeded where on others they will not yet have done so. Whether such technology exists in OOTSverse is at Rich's discretion. So I will assume it is *possible* until a definitive ruling to the contrary is issued.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

gorocz

2013-08-13, 08:32 AM

As stated above, Malack could drink bloodwort tea, implying vampires can drink blood for as long as that blood is pure enough or so, then... I guess Gentle Repose on Zz'dtri, who should be attached a drinking straw somewhere :smalleek:

We don't know if the tea wasn't just a sort of a snack. You couldn't live on snacks, maybe vampires can't live on pre-drained blood. Maybe they need to drain the "life force"* of a living being along with its blood as a nourishment. My point is the CON damage. If you bleed a bit, you don't get CON damage. If you bleed a lot (half a litre, litre) you might get some CON damage, but that should be only temporary because human body refills its own blood supply after a time, given enough fluids. Vampire CON drain that happens when he drinks your blood is permanent, only curable by magic, the same magic that can restore your lost levels, i.e. your life force...

*Not an actual D&D term

Psyren

2013-08-13, 09:06 AM

pendell

2013-08-13, 09:32 AM

I'm guessing they will either run into Malack's Bloodwort Tea stash or that draining summons and sending them back home will work. Unless the Giant wants to play it for drama, in which case Durkon's helpful manner might change a little when he sees all those juicy necks sleeping every night...

Knowing Roy, he may volunteer his blood for his friend, who will then Restore him afterward. We don't know what Durkon's minimum daily consumption needs to be after all - that detail is up to the Giant's discretion.

You're right that the DM can control this if they want, but I just wanted to point out that WotC has said they intentionally forbade recharging items (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20041130a) in 3.5. So it's not like it was some oversight in the rules that the DM needs to make a statement on.

Right then. Since OOTSverse runs on D&D 3.5 and not SRD then I think I stand corrected -- magic items in OOTSverse (wands, staffs) cannot be recharged, unless Rich chooses to houserule it in. Until he indicates that he has done so, I will believe that the staff is not rechargeable. If Durkula is going to need protection from daylight after the staff expires, he must either learn it himself, or otherwise acquire a brand new item.

ETA: I note that there is an optional rule provided in the page you mentioned providing for recharging, with the caution it may destroy play balance because something intended to be rare and difficult to acquire suddenly became a lot less rare. I'm going to assume Rich is not using this rule unless he gives some indication in strip that he is.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Psyren

2013-08-13, 09:44 AM

Given that we are close to endgame for the strip it may be moot. Durkula may decide to use the staff for daytime missions as the Order requires it, then when it runs out (after the strip is over), walk willingly into the sun to end his unlife.

SavageWombat

2013-08-13, 10:27 AM

You know, this is exactly the kind of thing Rich would clear up in the strip if it's an important plot point.

Ashiver

2013-08-13, 10:44 AM

Anyone else think the real Durkon is going to be really mad at Roy for making use of him as a vampire instead of immediately trying to destroy him? He wasn't willing to ignore it about Malack, even for the sake of their friendship. I'm sure Durkula probably feels like it's a sensible thing to do, ignoring it for the sake of friendship. That doesn't mean that Durkon will have changed his views if he gets resurrected though.

FlawedParadigm

2013-08-13, 10:51 AM

Rakoa

2013-08-13, 10:54 AM

"Close to the endgame?" We've got at least two more books. That's probably 400+ strips.

Luckily the staff doesn't lose charges based on the number of strips that pass.

FlawedParadigm

2013-08-13, 11:00 AM

Luckily the staff doesn't lose charges based on the number of strips that pass.

Fair, but we have no idea of the remaining time frame involved with anything in the strip except Belkar's not being long for the world and the final cessation of his breathing. Although if he started being a vampire in RiftWorld, he might even still be part of the strip. I have a sneaking suspicion the strip is not going to end at the next gate, since none of the others have had a 400 strip lifespan after the Order began pursuing them.

...Do we have a wiki with a timeline somewhere? We really ought to.Aside from solving our personal curiosities, Rich could refer to it if need be.

Rakoa

2013-08-13, 11:13 AM

I think someone set up something like that timeline as a project quite awhile ago. Oceanic, perhaps?

gorocz

2013-08-13, 03:26 PM

Right then. Since OOTSverse runs on D&D 3.5 and not SRD then I think I stand corrected -- magic items in OOTSverse (wands, staffs) cannot be recharged, unless Rich chooses to houserule it in. Until he indicates that he has done so, I will believe that the staff is not rechargeable. If Durkula is going to need protection from daylight after the staff expires, he must either learn it himself, or otherwise acquire a brand new item.

ETA: I note that there is an optional rule provided in the page you mentioned providing for recharging, with the caution it may destroy play balance because something intended to be rare and difficult to acquire suddenly became a lot less rare. I'm going to assume Rich is not using this rule unless he gives some indication in strip that he is.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Just a quick note - if I'm not very much mistaken, SRD is the same as 3.5 rules (it's called v3.5 SRD for a reason), specifically the system (i.e. not how to play the game, but how the game works). It's just briefer and with couple of things removed (e.g. character creation). But the important parts are there. That means that if there is a magic staff creation system and there's no recharging system in SRD, there is none in 3.5 PHB/DMG either.

And about the optional rule -
a) Even with it, you need to know the spell yourself. And if Durkon knew the Protection from Daylight spell, he wouldn't need the staff charges so desperately

b) We don't know the exact specifications of the spell, but let's say (and these are just arbitrary numbers) it's lvl 4 spell, cast as caster level 12 (Malack's presumed level, nicely coincides with 2 hours/caster level duration for 24 hours of protection), that's 18000 gp to create, meaning 360gp per charge to recharge. That means either you spen one whole day recharging 2 charges (1 day per 1000gp spent) or 2 days for 5 charges. I don't think the Order has time for that... (note: I'm aware Giant wouldn't bother with exact recharge time numbers, since he probably doesn't have the spell exactly fixed in terms of numbers, even if it was a lvl 1 spell with fixed 1day duration, unaffected by caster level, he'd have to spend at least 1 full day recharging it (though at that point, he'd be able to create a fully 50 charged one), which is something Order can't really afford to lose any time when Xykon is ahead of them.
tl;dr - at least 1 full day, during which you can't do anything else, for even the smallest recharge, Order doesn't have time for that

c) Also, Durkon surely doesn't have Craft Staff feat and I don't think you're gonna find a cleric staff crafter that knows Protection from Daylight anywhere in this world, unless Malack had someone like that working for him back in Bleedingham, which would probably mean that there's a spare staff too...

factotum

2013-08-13, 04:01 PM

Anyone else think the real Durkon is going to be really mad at Roy for making use of him as a vampire instead of immediately trying to destroy him?

I'm sure he would see the need when Roy explains it exactly as he just did to Belkar. Quite apart from anything else, if Roy had refused Durkula's help then we'd currently be looking at TPK--elemental + Durkula + Barbed Devil = one dead team!

Coat

2013-08-15, 10:21 AM

Kish

2013-08-15, 10:34 AM

Why's everyone looking at me like that?
Because, alas and alack, Durkon is unable to find knocking over Tarquin's army to be that easy.

Tragak

2013-08-15, 10:36 AM

Because, alas and alack, Durkon is unable to find knocking over Tarquin's army to be that easy. Even if he Dominates the enemy troops the way Xykon threw a Ball of Symbol of Insanity into the Sapphire Guard? :smallwink: Or for that matter, the way he himself took attrition to a Dominated Belkar?

Coat

2013-08-15, 10:42 AM

Because, alas and alack, Durkon is unable to find knocking over Tarquin's army to be that easy.

Well, I was assuming some kind of Tarquin/Order team up thing - after all, Tarquin's got so many little friends. He's not going to mind a few going missing. Surely?

But dudes wandering away from camp at night to answer a call of nature, looking into a pair of glowing eyes, and not coming back works too.

pendell

2013-08-15, 11:14 AM

Is it just me that sees Tarquin arriving in #910 with a thousand or so pre-filled Sippy-cups (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sippy_cup), perfect for a night-time feed for your new baby vampire?

And because they're all soldiers of an evil empire, they're evil, so draining them dry would be perfectly morally justified, right? Right?

Why's everyone looking at me like that?

Realistically, I don't see any reason why the EOB wouldn't maintain a blood bank if they have the magical technology to do so. Modern forces do (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Services_Blood_Program). The need for whole blood and plasma in combat operations is immense.

It's a shame to lose a level 1 warrior who just earned enough XP to level up. And while clerical magic or necromantic magic may obviate some of these problems, it may be a society that has advanced knowledge of chemistry is also intelligent enough to use more conventional medicine to supplement the clerics.

Anyway, if the EOB keeps a blood bank, they can easily feed Durkula for the rest of his life. Their donors, of course, would be the aforementioned condemned criminals.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Kish

2013-08-15, 11:43 AM

Even if he Dominates the enemy troops the way Xykon threw a Ball of Symbol of Insanity into the Sapphire Guard? :smallwink: Or for that matter, the way he himself took attrition to a Dominated Belkar?
First thing I thought of. Unfortunately, the SRD informed me that it would take a number of standard actions equal to the number of troops in the army. :smalltongue:

Valanarch

2013-08-15, 02:35 PM

Housing
-That staff probably has limited protection from daylight charges, right? Could be unlimited? Or no?
-Whuh-oh; no coffin. Now what?

Even though it is against the rules, the charges probably are unlimited or recharge. In this strip (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0858.html) Tarquin says that each of the zombies cost Malack a few charges from his staff each. I don't think that he would use up around 20 charges from his staff in a day if there were only 50 in there.

gorocz

2013-08-17, 11:02 AM

Even though it is against the rules, the charges probably are unlimited or recharge. In this strip (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0858.html) Tarquin says that each of the zombies cost Malack a few charges from his staff each. I don't think that he would use up around 20 charges from his staff in a day if there were only 50 in there.

He would, when he can (relatively) easily create a new staff when they get back home. It's not like he was counting on this whole shindig to last for more than a few days. If he had fully 50 charged staff at the beggining, he can be willing to spend a few. Especially if it would be rude to his god otherwise. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0856.html) The argument about that "it only costs a few charges each" is about the expendability of them.

It's not an artifact that he found somewhere, he created it himself and can do it as many times as needed, in around a week or two (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15815537&postcount=54) each...