Shonen Swordsman, 4e

[TimeWizard]

Hey y'all! I'm looking for some advice in character building. In 4e I want to play a bad*** swordsman, in the vain of a wandering katana master with the requisite amount of special moves. In 3e, I could just pick Swordsage or Warblade and Bam! instant Kenshin/Zoro/whatever. I'm not so sure how to do this in 4e. I'm sure that this role is a Striker (although I heard Samurai is a leader subclass), and was looking for some advice.

Is there a class for this yet?

I.E. Kenshin (Ruroni Kenshin); Zoro (One Piece); Yojimbo[Job] (Final Fantasy Tactics A2) etc...

[Surrealistik]

Avenger seems to be a pretty suitable option.

[Tegu8788]

Oh yes, we have tons. Fighter, Ranger, Rogue, Paladin, Warlord, Bard, Avenger, Barbarian, Swordmage, Bladesinger, Assassin, Blackguard, Executioner, Thief, Slayer, Hexblade, Scout, Skald, Berserker...

What do you want to do in combat, do you want to do it alone or surrounded, do you want a simple or complex class, how many weapons do you want to use? The more you describe how you want to fight, the closer we can direct you.

[Ashdate]

Three suggestions:

1. Ranger (PHB): this one is pretty easy in the line of "bad-ass two-bladed warrior" (a la Zoro). Certainly one of the more powerful strikers in the game.

2. Slayer (HotFL): an Essentials Fighter that leans Striker (rather than the core Fighter which leans defender). Essentially operates on huge swings with a two-handed sword.

3. Barbarian (PHB2): Generally considered more of the "big strong brute" type (a la something like Guts from Berserk), but could be re-fluffed such that the "rage" powers are something more Shonen-y.

I have little experience with Avengers; my only concern with them is that you attack with Wisdom rather than Strength, and the divine aspect isn't very shonen-y and might be a weirder thing to try and fluff, but certainly they're fairly effective at hitting things.

If your DM allows themes, ain't nothing more samurai-y than the Samurai theme (D404), but Sohei is good too.

The standout Paragon path in my eyes is a Kensai (PHB), which if you're not a fighter, would require a multi-class feat, but it's worth it for the +1 untyped bonus to hit, and as long as you qualify for it, there are a lot worse feats than Battle Awareness (a fighter multi-class feat, MP1).

[NecroRebel]

I'd call Kenshin an Assault Swordmage, Battlemind, or Avenger. Assaultmages have lots of ways to teleport to their target and attack them, including their main marking class feature, mimicking Himura's great speed, though they aren't strikers and won't deal as much damage as a striker would. Battleminds can get the Lightning Rush power at level 7, which lets them dash around the battlefield like crazy, and are probably higher-damage than Swordmages. Avengers can be quite mobile as well and tend to carry a big sword.

Zoro would probably have to be a Ranger or Fighter, as otherwise it's difficult or impossible to wield multiple weapons effectively. You don't get to attack with your off-hand weapon unless your power specifically says that you do, so if you want a dual-wielder your options are somewhat limited. Tri-wielding is just impossible AFAIK, though I guess you could hybrid Ranger or Fighter with an implement-using class and fluff your implement as being the third weapon held in your mouth (disclaimer: hybrids are one of the few ways to become truly ineffective in 4e, so do not make one for your first few characters, unless you really know what you're doing, and unless you know exactly what you want from being a hybrid and can't get it any other way).

Final Fantasy-type Samurai (which I'm assuming the Yojimbo are similar to) would probably just be outright Fighters, Paladins, or Swordmages depending on how much you wanted to emphasize their more supernatural abilities.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

My vote's for Assault Swordmage. Flashy, obviously supernatural powers, plus the ability to teleport after an enemy. The only thing that's missing is heavy damage.

Avenger could deliver on that, and there's some nifty shounen-esque flavor, too. (to the tune of "I WILL END YOU TODAY!" <Oath of Enmity>) Especially if you build an Avenger who maximizes critical hit damage. Plus you get some cool divine powers in the mix. (And there's a divine paragon path that gives you a transformation sequence...)

Ranger could fluff to it with Hunter's Quarry, but they're more grounded.

[TimeWizard]

What do you want to do in combat, do you want to do it alone or surrounded, do you want a simple or complex class, how many weapons do you want to use? The more you describe how you want to fight, the closer we can direct you.

I'd like to be Single Target DPT; either in Burst (flashy moves), or Consistent (ruthless efficiency). Highly mobile, lightly armored. Preferably just the one sword, although I've heard a lot about Twin Strike. A real killer, not a defender.


Final Fantasy-type Samurai (which I'm assuming the Yojimbo are similar to) would probably just be outright Fighters, Paladins, or Swordmages depending on how much you wanted to emphasize their more supernatural abilities.
In Tactics A2 Yojimbo are like Toshiro Mifune in Sanjuro- cocky, wandering swordmasters. They can't wear armor but have extremely powerful moves and an amazing Attack Stat. The Samurai from Tactics Original are armored warriors with a few neat tricks.

I'll check out: Avenger, Slayer, Ranger (Melee), Assualt Swordmage.

[neonchameleon]

A real killer, not a defender.

Ah, there you've misunderstood the way several sorts of defender (notably fighters and assault swordmages) work. Fighters are real killers - they are good enough and sharp enough as killers that the enemy can not afford to take their eyes off them even for an instant. If the enemy even momentarily turns their attention off a fighter that's marked them for death, whether to attack someone else or to try to creep away then the fighter gets to slip another attack through in the tiny gap they've just offered.

Likewise the assault swordmage. If the enemy takes their eyes off the assault swordmage to attack someone else, they find the swordmage right behind them thrusting a sword into their kidneys.

People pay attention to the fighter because if they don't they know they will end up dead. That's one way being a defender works. (They pay attention to shielding swordmages and paladins for more supernatural reasons).


In Tactics A2 Yojimbo are like Toshiro Mifune in Sanjuro- cocky, wandering swordmasters. They can't wear armor but have extremely powerful moves and an amazing Attack Stat.

I think you're looking at the Avenger from the description. Avengers are probably the best one-on-one duellists in the game as well as being supernatural with flashy abilities. But they are almost the opposite of fighters in this way - avengers pick their target and win if there aren't any distractions, but allies to the enemy can throw them off their game. Fighters on the other hand exploit the chaos and distraction of the battlefield to take advantage of even the smallest slip in the concentration the enemy gives.

[Tegu8788]

I agree, that I think the Avenger is going to work out best for you, Assault Swordmage could also do very well. The Avenger stays in solo combat, the Swordmage tends to teleport around more often.

And in 4E, refluffing is par for the course, so if you don't like the Divine power source, then say it's his devotion to his leaders, or his innate magical powers, or a ritual was cast on him, whatever. The crunch and fluff are very seperate here, so have fun and go wild.