PDA

View Full Version : Elven Swordmaster PEACH [3.5 ToB PrC]



Keko
2013-08-21, 07:28 AM
Hi, this is my first post here and my first homebrew so I'd like to know your opinion about my work.
Let me know any suggestion about it from wording (i'm not a native english speaker) to rules unclear/unbalanced or open to "OMG game-breaking combo!" :smalltongue:

Thanks, hope you enjoy :smallamused:

Note: to make a swordsage build more viable you can use this acf
Alternative class feature: Thoughtful Discernment
Requisite: Swordsage level 1
Description: you use your Int instead of Wis modifier for the ac and the Discipline Focus (Insightful Strike) class features, also add Int instead of Wis modifier to Sense Motive checks. (the ac bonus would't stack with the one of the elven swordmaster but would let the swordsage benefit of improved armor class until he enters the PrC )

Note on a ranged build
Even if at first it was not intended many of the class features work also with the elven double bow (arms and equipment guide page 7) Double Bow, Elven: This double-stringed longbow
can be used as a normal longbow by anyone proficient
in that weapon. Characters with Exotic Weapon Proficiency
(elven double bow) can use the bow to fire two
arrows at once. Nocking an arrow on the second string
requires a move-equivalent action. Once the wielder
has taken an action to load the second string, his next
attack is a double shot that launches both arrows
simultaneously at the same target. The wielder makes
one attack roll at a –2 penalty to determine whether or
not both arrows strike the target. If the attack is successful,
both arrows deal normal damage. If the attack
is a critical hit, only one arrow deals extra damage, and
extra sneak attack damage is applied only once.I don't know if you can get something from its special rules but even if you don't it's still a longbow. Just change the available disciplines to add homebrew ranged ones, maybe ask you DM if allows it for a custom made swordbow (RotW p. 171) in case you get struck in melee and then enjoy :smalltongue:

I made this PrC with the flavour of the CoCL in my mind so it has many points in common with it and is supposed to have a similar fluff but not be just (I hope) a 2 level class to gain elegant strike feature

ELVEN SWORDMASTER

ENTRY REQUIREMENTS
Race: Elf (also half-elf and Ruathar if supported by a member of the order)
Alignment: Any non-evil
BAB: +5
Skills: Concentration 8 ranks, Knowledge (history) 4 ranks, Knowledge (religion) 4 ranks
Feats: Improved Weapon Familiarity, Weapon Focus (any elven weapon).
Maneuvers: any 3 Devoted Spirit, Diamond Mind or Iron Heart maneuvers, one of which must be at least of 3 level.
Special: i have to think about that.

CLASS FEATURES

Hit Die: d10

ELVEN SWORDMASTER
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special|Known|Readied|Stances
1st|
+0|
+2|
+2|
+0|Elven Swordplay (Specialized), Blade of the Finest|
1|
0|
0|
2nd|
+1|
+3|
+3|
+0|Speed of Thought (AC)|
1|
1|
0|
3rd|
+2|
+3|
+3|
+1|Paragon of Skill|
1|
0|
1|
4th|
+3|
+4|
+4|
+1|Elven Swordplay (Greater Focus)|
1|
1|
0|
5th|
+3|
+4|
+4|
+1|Speed of Thought (Initiative), Blade of the Fastest |
1|
0|
0|
6th|
+4|
+5|
+5|
+2|Paragon of Will, Blessing of the Seldarine|
1|
0|
0|
7th|
+5|
+5|
+5|
+2|Elven Swordplay (Greater Specialized)|
1|
1|
0|
8th|
+6|
+6|
+6|
+2|Speed of Thought (Tactical Lead)|
1|
0|
1|
9th|
+6|
+6|
+6|
+3|Paragon of Avoidance|
1|
1|
0|
10th|
+7|
+7|
+7|
+3|Elven Swordplay (Weapon Supremacy), Blade of the Deadliest, Defender of the Elvenkind |
1|
0|
0| [/table]


Class Skills (6+Int modifier): Balance, Climb, Concentration, Craft, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (Arcane), Knowledge (History), Knowledge (Local), Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty), Knowledge (Religion), Martial Lore, Profession, Ride, Swim, Tumble.

Maneuvers: At each level, you gain a new maneuver known from the Devoted Spirit, Diamond Mind, Iron Heart, or White Raven discipline. You must meet a maneuver’s prerequisite to learn it. You add your full Elven Swordmaster levels to your initiator level to determine your total initiator level and your highest-level maneuvers known. At 2rd level, 4th level, 7th level and 9th level, you gain an additional maneuver readied per day.
Note: feel free to add some homebrew discipline, for example I like Untamed Essence (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112720%5DUntamed) by Vox Clamantis. If you choose to do so add the associate skill to the list.

Stances Known: At 3rd and 8th level, you learn a new martial stance from the Devoted Spirit, Diamond Mind, Iron Heart, or White Raven disciplines. You must meet a stance’s prerequisite to learn it.

Elven Swordplay: Add Int modifier (if positive) to the check against sunder, disarm and feint attempt against your as long as you hold an elven weapon (as defined by the Improved Weapon Familiarity feat), if you are subjected to conditions that normally would make you drop held object (stunned etc..) you do not let it fall as long as it is an elven weapon. At 1st level you gain the benefit of the Weapon Specialization feat in all elven weapons, Greater Weapon Focus at 4th, Greater Weapon Specialization at 7th and Weapon Supremacy at 10th, even if you do not fulfill the requirements. Furthermore you qualify for feats that usually require a minimum number of fighter level as if you had a Fighter level equal to your Elven Swordmaster level but only regarding elven weapons (this feature stacks with the Warblade weapon aptitude feature).

Speed of Thought: Starting at 2nd level add your Int modifier (if positive) to your armor class as long as you wear light armor or no armor. This bonus applies even against touch attacks or when you are caught flat-footed but not when you are immobilized or helpless; this feature does not stack with the ac feature granted by the monk or swordsage classes . From 5th level add your Int modifier (if positive) to initiative checks. Starting from the 8th level, you can guarantee half of your Int modifier (rounded down) to initiative checks of allies within 30 feet that can see or hear you.

Paragon of Skill: From level 3 add your Int modifier (if positive) to the number of attacks of opportunity you can make each turn (this effect is not cumulative with the Combat Reflexes feat but counts as such for the purposes of satisfying the requirements of other feats, prestige classes or other special abilities.

Paragon of Will: Starting from 6th level add your Int modifier (if positive) to your will save against enchantment / compulsion effects, fear effect and to disbelief illusions.

Paragon of Avoidance: Starting from 9th level you can make a Concentration check against a DC 15+BAB of the threatening creature: if you succed you avoid provoking an attack of opportunity performing an action that normally would (pass through a threatened square, standing up from a prone position etc). If more creatures are threating you you must check separately for every foe adding 5 to the DC for every one after the first.

Blade of the Finest: Add your Int modifier (if positive) to damage rolls when you use elven weapons (as defined by the Improved Weapon Familiarity feat); treat all elven melee weapons and projectile shot by elven ranged weapons as they have the Keen property.

Blade of the Fastest: For a number of rounds per day equal to twice your class level you may be treated as if under the effects of a Haste spell. Those rounds do not have to be consecutive .This effect can be activated as a free action.

Blade of the Deadliest: Add 1 to the critical multiplier of all elven weapons.

Blessing of the Seldarine: At 6th level you gain a limited capacity to nullify death effects an effects that would bestow you negative levels, drain ability score or hexes (as the Hexblade's Course class features). You can, as an immediate action, make a Concentration check against a DC 15+the caster level of the effect: if you suceed you take no harm even if normally would have a reduced effect on a succesful save(as Finger of Death spell). You have a +4 sacred bonus to this check if you possess the True Believer (any elven deity) feat.

Defender of the Elvenkind: Once per encounter you can designate a single enemy on the battlefield to be your chosen foe until he dies or falls unconscious. Whenever you use a martial strike against him it is not considered expended and all variable effects of the maneuver (and the maneuver only) are automatically maximized. For example a maneuver that normally deals +10d6 damage now deals +70 damage. Activating this ability is a free action.

EX-Elven Swordmaster
Few Elven Swordmasters ever turn to evil, but it occasionally happens. If your alignment changes to evil, you are expelled from the order and lose the Blessing of the Seldarine and Defender of the Elvenkind abilities. However, you are not barred from gaining more levels in this class if you so desire. You can continue to refine the combat techniques you have learned, but you cannot make use of these class's abilities.

Xerlith
2013-08-21, 05:00 PM
Okay. So I'm going to have a thorough peach on this, since I smell potential.
Also, I'll correct wrong spelling if I notice such. :smalltongue:


Hi, this is my first post here and my first homebrew so I'd like to know your opinion about my work.
Let me know any suggestion about it from wording (i'm not a native english speaker) to rules unclear/unbalanced or open to "OMG game-breaking combo!" :smalltongue:
Thanks, hope you enjoy :smallamused:

ELVEN SWORDMASTER

ENTRY REQUIREMENTS <-This should be bolded for easier reading.
Race: Elf
BAB: +7
Skills: concentration 13 ranks, knowledge (history) 4 ranks, knowledge (nobility) 4 ranks
Feats: Weapon Focus (shortsword/longsword/greatsword/rapier)
Maneuvers: any 3 Iron Heart, Desert Wind or Diamond Mind manouvers, one of which must be at least of 5 level <- Make it 3rd level. 4th tops.
Special: i have to think about that <- I don't really think this needs any.

Too steep requirements. Let the class be entered at about 7th level if you do not plan on changing the class features. Also - Why Knowledge (nobility)?

CLASS FEATURES

Hit Die: d8

ELVEN SWORDMASTER
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special|Known|Readied|Stances
1st|
+0|
+2|
+2|
+0|Elven Swordplay (specialized) Blade of the finest|
+1|
+0|
+0|
2nd|
+1|
+3|
+3|
+0|Speed of Thought (ac)|
+1|
+1|
+0|
3rd|
+2|
+3|
+3|
+1|Paragon of Skill (opportunity)|
+1|
+0|
+1|
4th|
+3|
+4|
+4|
+1|Elven Swordplay (Greater Focus)|
+1|
+1|
+0|
5th|
+3|
+4|
+4|
+1|Speed of Thought (Initiative) Blade of the fastest |
+1|
+0|
+0|
6th|
+4|
+5|
+5|
+2|Paragon of Skill (Will save)|
+1|
+0|
+0|
7th|
+5|
+5|
+5|
+2|Elven Swordplay (Greater Specialized)|
+1|
+1|
+0|
8th|
+6|
+6|
+6|
+2|Speed of Thought (Tactical lead)|
+1|
+0|
+1|
9th|
+6|
+6|
+6|
+3|Paragon of Skill (Threatened)|
+1|
+1|
+0|
10th|
+7|
+7|
+7|
+3|Elven Swordplay (Weapon supremacy) Blade of the deadliest |
+1|
+0|
+0| [/table]

The "+" seem unnecessary in the table. The chassis is weak-ish for a primary melee fighter. Why not d10/fullBAB? Also, Big Letters should be normalized throughout the table.

Class Skills (6+Int modifier): Balance, Climb, Concentration ,Craft, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (Arcane), Knowledge (History), Knowledge (Local), Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty), Knowledge (Religion), Martial Lore, Profession, Ride, Swim, Tumble.
Solid. Not much to say.

Maneuvers: same fluff text on every PrC of ToB
-Disciplines: Desert Wind, Diamond Mind, Iron Heart White Raven (may add some homebrew discipline, for example I like Untamed Essence by Vox Clamantis found here http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112720%5DUntamed if you choose to do so add the associate skill to the list)

This needs clearing up a bit. Maybe give the typical fluff text anyway. Also, you can hide the URL in the name, by typing this: [URL ="http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112720%5DUntamed"]Untamed Essence[ /URL] without spaces

Elven Swordplay: a weapon to be chosen among those with whom you have met the feat requirement for weapon focus become your favorite weapon: add Int modifier (if positive) to the check against sunder, disarm and feint attempt against your favorite weapon, if you are subjected to conditions that normally would make you drop held object (stunned etc..) you do not let it fall as long as it is your favorite weapon. Furthermore at 1st level you get the Weapon Specialization feat in your favorite weapon, Greater Weapon Focus at 4th, Greater Weapon Specialization at 7th and Weapon Supremacy at 10th, even if you do not fulfil the requirements.
Special: Warblades can not use the weapon aptitude class feature to change the weapon designated by these feats.

The "special" disclaimer seems unnecesary. That's the little boon warblades have. Why take it away? Also, maybe consider giving something other than the fighter feats. They should never be half of your class features. That's what makes the Fighter so weak.
Maybe give it Int modifier to damage or something like that.


Speed of Thought: Starting at 2nd level add your Int modifier (if positive) to your armor class as long as you wear light armor or no armor. This bonus applies even against touch attacks or when you are caught flat-footed but not when you are immobilized or helpless; this feature does not stack with the ac feature granted by the monk or swordsage classes.
From 5th level add your Int modifier (if positive) to initiative checks.
Starting from the 8th level, you can guarantee half of your Int modifier (rounded down) to initiative checks of allies within 30 feet that can see or hear you.

Solid. State that it doesn't stack with the Monk's ability, though.

Paragon of skill: from level 3 add Int modifier (if positive) to the number of attacks of opportunity you can make each turn (this effect is not cumulative with the Combat Reflexes feat but counts as such for the purposes of satisfying the requirements of other feats, prestige classes or other special abilities.
Starting from 6th level add your Int modifier (if positive) to your will save against enchantment / compulsion effects, fear effect and to disbelief illusions.
Starting from 9th level, a number of times per day equal to your Int modifier, you can avoid provoking an attack of opportunity performing an action that normally would (pass through a threatened square, standing up from a prone position etc.).

Strong, but I'd change the name or split it up into 3 separate abilities. For clarity.


Blade of the finest: you acquire the Improved Weapon Familiarity feat for free.

Another fighter feat. Bland. This should be a prerequisite more than a class feature.

Blade of the fastest: a number of rounds per day equal to twice your Int modifier you can activate a Haste effect on you; this works exactly as the Haste spell. This effect can be activated as a free action.

Except the cheesy name :smalltongue: this seems okay. Maybe change the wording to:
"For a number of rounds equal to twice your Int modifier per day you may be treated as if under the effects of a Haste spell. Those rounds do not have to be consecutive.", because as it is now, it doesn't state your caster level (so for how long each casting lasts) and is too much. You don't really need THAT many rounds/day of that spell.

Blade of the deadliest: a number of times per day equal to your Int modifier you can, as a free action after confirming a critical hit, increase by 1 the critical multiplier of the weapon (only works with your favorite weapon).

Underwhelming, to say the least. This should be either continuous or acquired much, much earlier. Probably both.

TO sum up - This class would be better off being able to be taken at about 6ish level.
As it is now, its strongest points are the maneuvers mostly. And there's not much real reason for an elf to take this over the Eternal Blade. Fleshing out the flavor by setting a solid, distinguishing crunch could work wonders here. To put it bluntly - it needs more real class abilities.

Keko
2013-08-21, 05:58 PM
Thanks for the feedback :smallwink:

I'll correct typos and the table and indeed i can lower the requirements;

I wanted to make a more maneuver oriented class than the eternal blade so i gave new maneuver every level, more prepared, more stances and more discipline availables so I was not sure if high BAB and d10 hit point was "fair" but i can think about it.

For the special requirement i would have liked something just flavourful and bgistic that is not the usual "find someone to teach you" or "enter the organization" so nothing difficult.



The "special" disclaimer seems unnecesary. That's the little boon warblades have. Why take it away? Also, maybe consider giving something other than the fighter feats. They should never be half of your class features. That's what makes the Fighter so weak

I know that negating weapon aptitude is a bit nasty but i didn't want to loose the flavour of the class. I would find annoying someone entering the class to get the feats and the change them for other weapons but again yours is a solid argument, tough decision

Edit: i wanted the class to be focused on elven weapons but now i do it by encouraging using them instead of penalizing not doing it. That's much better



Strong, but I'd change the name or split it up into 3 separate abilities. For clarity.

I wanted to keep a kind of "continuity" in the name of class feature just for fluff reason, but i'll survive



Except the cheesy name this seems okay. Maybe change the wording to:
"For a number of rounds equal to twice your Int modifier per day you may be treated as if under the effects of a Haste spell. Those rounds do not have to be consecutive.", because as it is now, it doesn't state your caster level (so for how long each casting lasts) and is too much. You don't really need THAT many rounds/day of that spell.

I intended it to be as you said and I thought it was clear but actually it wasn't. Your wording is clearer anyway so i'll change it.


Underwhelming, to say the least. This should be either continuous or acquired much, much earlier. Probably both.

I agree with you, the major thing I wanted to work on was this, I felt this was not charismatic nor strong enough

Edit: now the Defender of the Elvenkind feature should be a nice start :smallamused: