Leveling-up during a session?

[Maginomicon]

In my games, want to institute a policy where players can level-up in the middle of a gaming session. In my experience (at least), this is completely untenable under typical circumstances.

What would have to change about a typical GM's process to make this feasible?

For example, would the following practice pull it off?


During out-of-game time (such as between sessions), all players set up what they plan to do for the next level-up (or for the next two level-ups, ideally). They can change these decisions at any time (excluding dedicated level-up rolls like for HP gain, which must be decided when the player and GM can dedicate out-of-game time for it) unless we're having a game session at that moment. Players always are told upon-request how close they are to a level-up, as well as any time the next session could likely cause a level-up.

[Gwendol]

Er, HP is a single roll. Surely there is time for that in session?

Other than that, yes, a player who thinks they are on the cusp of a new level could present his/her plans for the next level to the GM in order to allow for in-game leveling. This includes class (DUH), feats, skills, spells as applicable. Saves, BAB, and HP tend to be incremental so shouldn't take more than a moment to apply.

[Serpentine]

Yeah, I think you'd pretty much have to have two sheet for each character at any one time: one for the character at the current level, and one for the character at the next level up. Wouldn't be so bad to do, though, as long as you didn't get them mixed up.

[Zanos]

I often have a pretty solid progression for every character I personally make thought out already. 20 levels worth of classes, every feat, and most spells I want to pick.

A lot of level ups don't really grant more things, so most of it is easy. You should already know where you're going with feats because of requirements and because they're such a limited resource.

Skill Points and, for Spontaneous Casters, spells are the two biggest jams in leveling up mid-session IMO. What I want personally for skills changes considerably based on the campaign, and spell selection is a pretty big decision in general.

I've played in some more experience groups though, and we've leveled up in the middle of a session in 5-10 minutes.

[ahenobarbi]

I often have a pretty solid progression for every character I personally make thought out already. 20 levels worth of classes, every feat, and most spells I want to pick.

A lot of level ups don't really grant more things, so most of it is easy. You should already know where you're going with feats because of requirements and because they're such a limited resource.

Skill Points and, for Spontaneous Casters, spells are the two biggest jams in leveling up mid-session IMO. What I want personally for skills changes considerably based on the campaign, and spell selection is a pretty big decision in general.

I've played in some more experience groups though, and we've leveled up in the middle of a session in 5-10 minutes.

Leveling for me usually is short too (once I decide on a build), but some players start thinking what to take next only after they gain XP to get a level...

[Raendyn]

It can happen but it needs some work before that.

First of all you should ask your players to have many lvls prepared in advance, idealy all that they would get in the current campaign, and about HP, its a single dice roll.

It is recommended that you either do this during night's sleep, or after some down time that includes some kind of training, bonus points if you manage to do it in a dramatic momment story-wise.

The bad things that may happen is that, the spell selection may and such, may take ages.

Also always do the paperwork during OOG downtime, During food break maybe.

[Gigas Breaker]

I always have my characters planned out. It takes only a couple of minutes for me to level up. Classes, feats, maneuvers, etc. have been decided before I even start the campaign. On level up I just have to update my attack bonuses, saves, and HD and allocate skill points which I'll already pretty much know what I want to keep up with too.

[molten_dragon]

In my games, want to institute a policy where players can level-up in the middle of a gaming session. In my experience (at least), this is completely untenable under typical circumstances.

What would have to change about a typical GM's process to make this feasible?

For example, would the following practice pull it off?


During out-of-game time (such as between sessions), all players set up what they plan to do for the next level-up (or for the next two level-ups, ideally). They can change these decisions at any time (excluding dedicated level-up rolls like for HP gain, which must be decided when the player and GM can dedicate out-of-game time for it) unless we're having a game session at that moment. Players always are told upon-request how close they are to a level-up, as well as any time the next session could likely cause a level-up.

Probably not, because some people just won't do it. Some players don't want to do anything outside of game time.

I try to avoid leveling up in-session as much as possible, but sometimes I find that I need to because they're coming up on a tough fight, and have gotten enough XP to level, and that extra level will probably make the difference between winning and losing the fight. I ask players to handle all of their leveling and treasure buying outside of the sessions, but I have a couple who refuse to do it.

[rexreg]

the party hears -
"Be prepared to level next session."
& things move along pretty smoothly

[AKA_Bait]

If you warn the players that it will be happening next time at the end of the prior session and give a short break for it to happen (perhaps overlapping with the pizza delivery?) then it shouldn't be too big a deal.

This assumes, of course, that you trust your players to level without much supervision.

[rexreg]

Skills, Feats, Spells, etc. are readied between sessions...
hp's for the new level are rolled when the levelling actually occurs...

my group has been meeting for over 15 years, so the trust level is solid

[Psyren]

I find leveling slows the game to a crawl even with an experienced group, and when there's a couple of folks that need to be walked through it it gets even worse. With PF it's never necessary since XP is only used for leveling, so we don't track it, but in other systems I play (e.g. Dragon Age) we end up postponing it until the end of the current session or the beginning of the next one.

[rexreg]

I find leveling slows the game to a crawl even with an experienced group, and when there's a couple of folks that need to be walked through it it gets even worse.

my experience says 5-10 minutes (a cigarette break, for some) is sufficient for levelling, if all involved are prepared & know what they're doing...
this is w/in the 3.X/Pathfinder system

[Feilith]

In my current game, we're leveling up about every session or every other session. and it works out pretty well to level up during a pizza break for us. All the DM needs to be there for is the HP roll (and confirming feats and PrCs that are really powerful, but those are usually taken care of pre-session) and everyone can work it out at their own pace.

[Maginomicon]

I manage XP for each person separately, as not everyone makes it to every session or chooses (or is able) to participate in every encounter. Thus, it's impractical to make everyone use the same value for XP or have everyone level up at exactly the same time.

Given that context, are there any suggestions other than "don't do that"?

[Psyren]

It would help if you elaborated a little more on why it is untenable to just have them level-up mid-game without any prior preparation. Is it taking too long/breaking the flow of the session? Are people making errors or cheating when leveling under pressure? Are requests to "take back" a previously made choice common? What exactly is the problem?

Also, how many players do you typically have? Any leveling/advancement system would likely be related to that.

[Maginomicon]

It would help if you elaborated a little more on why it is untenable to just have them level-up mid-game without any prior preparation. Is it taking too long/breaking the flow of the session? Are people making errors or cheating when leveling under pressure? Are requests to "take back" a previously made choice common? What exactly is the problem?

Also, how many players do you typically have? Any leveling/advancement system would likely be related to that.
All of the above in varying amounts at various times. The most significant problem is it taking too much in-game time to level-up. Several players frequently forget the options they took and one or two of the players don't have a clue what they want to do in the coming levels (which means that ALL contemplations about level-up choices happen at the time of the level-up).

I've had enough of that. I personally want most to be able to audit level-up choices before they have to be implemented. Some of the players are veterans but have on-occasion demonstrated a disturbing lack of understanding of how to interpret various character options. Additionally, I'm very permissive of all but a few specific options themselves so long as I can house rule some ambiguous bits in them (such as the text of Linked Power or Synchronicity).

As for leveling/advancement, I use PF's encounter generation method except that I use the CR-XP ratios from the "Level-Independent XP Awards" variant from UA. People gain feats at every odd-numbered level (like in Pathfinder), and I want to use a "Slow Burn" method (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=296752) for giving out XP (see also this post in that thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15875764&postcount=31)).

[nedz]

Personally I always have the character sheet for the next level ready, but not everyone likes doing their homework. We have one player who doesn't believe in planning ahead and can be very indecisive. I guess it depends upon your group of players, whom you know far better than we ever will.