[PF] Hexes and Undead

[Barstro]

In my last game, my group went up against several wights (undead).

I read in the undead description "many undead, however, are mindless and gain no skill points or feats" very quickly and took it to mean that if an undead had a mind, it could be effected.

Since they have Intelligence and Wisdom scores, I argued that my Witch's Evil Eye Hex should work.

In taking a closer look at descriptions today, I'm not sure that the above argument is correct. Wights have "Undead Traits" and, despite the INT and WIS scores, nothing in their description says that they are not immune to mind effecting traits.

Relevant:
Evil Eye Hex; "This is a mind-affecting effect"
Undead Trait; "Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, morale effects, patterns, and phantasms)."

Question
1) Are Wights immune to Witch Hexes that are "mind effecting effects"

2) Assuming Wights are immune; what is the proper penalty for me? While I know that at least my Hex was the tipping point for at least two rolls, I would have done things differently and used more "Misfortune", that is not mind-effecting. I assume the results would have been the same, but I do not know.

[Dusk Eclipse]

1) Yes, as per the type all undead are immune to [Mind-Affecting] spells/abilities.

2)IMO there shouldn't be any kind of penalty, the mistake of allowing Evil Eye to affect the wights was your DM's fault as much as yours; personally I would keep the result the same, but warn you that next time the immunity will be enforced.

[Frosty]

Next time, use your Healing Hex on the undead instead :smallsmile:

[Barstro]

If only I'd had it. But Healing Hex did not make the cut for this character.

[grarrrg]

Just because:
There are 2 abilities that will allow Spells to "mind-effect" Undead creatures, but only one of them works for "Spell-likes" as well.

1 level of Undead Bloodline (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/bloodlines/bloodlines-from-paizo/undead-bloodline) Sorcerer: "Some undead are susceptible to your mind-affecting spells. Corporeal undead that were once humanoids are treated as humanoids for the purposes of determining which spells affect them."
This works on ALL of your spells (http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9ne8), not just your Sorcerer spells.

The more powerful/useful version is from the Agent of the Grave (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/a-b/agent-of-the-grave) PrC: "At 2nd level, ...Agent of the Grave’s spells and spell-like abilities with mind-affecting effects treat undead creatures as their original type."

Of course Evil Eye Hex is a Supernatural ability, and thus doesn't qualify for either of the above anyway...

[TuggyNE]

1) Are Wights immune to Witch Hexes that are "mind effecting effects"

As correctly noted already, yes they are.


2) Assuming Wights are immune; what is the proper penalty for me? While I know that at least my Hex was the tipping point for at least two rolls, I would have done things differently and used more "Misfortune", that is not mind-effecting. I assume the results would have been the same, but I do not know.

If you've already finished the encounter it's probably impractical to attempt to re-run it; chaos theory suggests all kinds of crazy ramifications of that. Just accept the mistake, remember it in future, and move on for now.