[3.5] Duskblade build help

[macdaddy]

I have decided to make a duskblade, I will be starting at Level 6. After doing a lot of poking around, I don't really see much in the way of 2nd classes or prestige classes that would benefit a duskblade, so I will just go straight duskblade unless someone else can point something out that I missed... (Eventually take a 2 level dip into Dragon Disciple, but probably not until after 13th or 15th... if we ever get that far).

Anyway,
Human, LN

[Rolled Stats]
S: 18 + 1 = 19
D: 14
C: 14
I: 14
W: 13
Ch: 10

Feats:
1 - Power Attack, H: Versatile Spell Caster (maybe short haft??)
2 - B: Combat Casting
3 - Knowledge Devotion
6 - Obtain Familiar (Hawk)

planned:
9 - Arcane Strike
12 - Improved Familair (Imp)

Skills (45):
Knowledge (Arcane, Planes, Religion, Nature): 9
[Note: Miss out on Dungeoneering because I don't have a 16 int]
Concentration: 9

Spells: 6/7/4
0: All
1st: Shocking Grasp, True Strike, Resist Energy, Obscuring Mist, (Chill Touch or Swift Expeditious Retreat)
2nd: Dimension Hop, Swift Invis

=============================================

Questions:
1. Would skill trick "Collector of Stories" work in conjunction with Knowledge Devotion for +5 on skill checks?

2. Which spell, Chill Touch or Swift Expeditious Retreat? Chill Touch has a saving throw that will be fairly easy for anything with a decent fortitude save to pass, so it doesn't seem very useful. Then its adding just a D6 cold damage, blade of blood seems better in that case as with some party synergy (Vigor spell) my -5HP will just be -2HP.

3: Greatsword, Glaive or Guissarme? Glaive/Guisarme have reach, but that's not very critical until 13th level. Greatsword does better average damage. But with my terrible AC, reach attacks would let me potentially hide behind the BSF.

4: AC seems weeeeeaaaaak. A 16 AC, 17 with a +1 chain shirt? Yikes. That's fairly easy to hit. A Breastplate adds a little extra to it(1!), but at the cost of reducing movement to base of 20? Ouch. Yes, Mithril breastplate, but its not that easy to get in our campaign and I certainly don't have the room for craft skills. Are there any decent ways to boost up the AC? Or situational ways to pump it up? Having my familiar do aid another would net me +2AC (+9 to hit must hit AC 10) against a single opponent

5: Would energy substitution(acid?) be worthwhile to take in there somewhere?

6. When is it better to full attack instead of using arcane channel??
Since you cannot full attack with Arcane channel, it seems as if most of the time it would be better to channel shocking grasp for the +5D6 (avg 17 dmg) than try for a 2nd attack (~+8 to hit, 7 avg dmg + 9 bonus dmg = 16 dmg). Depends on situational bonuses and opposing AC, but if they have a 20+AC, then the shocking grasp would be better for the sure thing. Right?

[DarkSonic1337]

Well, Chill Touch combos nicely with Bracers of Entangling blast http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=79705. It's actually more useful when you DON'T channel it

But overall swift expeditious retreat is just a better spell for you imo. The low save on Chill Touch just makes it not worth it unless you add some other no save rider effect.

Don't get shorthaft. If you're going to use a feat for fighting effectively at reach and up close, just get exotic weapon proficiency spiked chain.

Nah, you don't want energy sub. Don't forget that as a spontaneous caster, that increases the casting time of your spells,making it ineligible for channeling unless you spend ANOTHER feat on rapid metamagic. And besides, you can't energy sub vampiric touch anyway :P


Talk to your DM about possibly expanding the duskblade spell list. In my experience it really hasn't changed the power level of the class much (as they're still limited by a small list of spells known), but it does allow more versatility in what you want to do with your duskblade (and more importantly HOW you do it. Saying "I power attack with vampiric touch" every round gets kinda boring.) Here's a start http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2030778&postcount=10. In general, try to stick to touch spells, rays, buffs, and movement enhancers, and be mindful of the power level of your campaign (so don't go asking for things like Wraithstrike if you think it'll be too good <_<)

[Daftendirekt]

If you're going to be using Vampiric Touch, don't forget to make your weapon Bloodstone (from Magic Item Compendium) to Empower it for free.

[juicycaboose]

After level 13 you might as well take some levels of Abjurant Champion, despite not having many Abjuration spells I personally would still rather the AC abilities than the few extra things you get as a straight duskblade after level 13.
Oh you also automatically qualify for AC as a duskblade so that's not a worry.

[Raendyn]

I wonder why noone linked this (http://dictummortuum.blogspot.gr/2011/08/duskblade-handbook.html) yet.

And at lvls 6-10 you better channel than have 2 attacks.

[Feint's End]

As I've build and played several duskblades over my career I think I can give you some insight. So here we go:

1. yes it does and it is one good way to increase your damage. It should be your 3rd level feat. Also you should consider Arcane strike at level 6

and don't forget to get a ring of wizardry of 1st level (later higher level) for the spellslots to burn

2. Blade of Blood is terrible. Chill Touch has some nice effects so I'd get it before swift expeditious retreat. The good thing is that you have several rounds of touch attacks from just one casting so for the times you don't want to spend some other spell you can just use Chill Touch once and there you go with touch attacks for several rounds.

3. You can get a Glaive and Armor Spikes or a Spiked Chain. Reach is almost always better .... the damage from a greatsword is neglible

4. It is ok .... Mithralbreastplate +2, Amulet of natural armor +1, Ring of Protection +1 ... all together for 12300 gold -> Ac of 21

5. nope ... put your feats in more gysh like feats. Powerattack at 1st, Attain Familiar at 1st, Knowledge Devotion at 3rd, Arcane Strike at 6th, Improved Familiar or Celestial Familiar at 9th

6. Often from level 13 but it entirely depends on what you are channeling and if you have the space to full attack. Low AC and 3 attacks? Go PA and full attack. High AC and 2 attacks or less? Go channeling. Between those two it really depends on the situation.

Hope I could help

edit: and for multiclassing ... Duskblade works fine in and on itself but I like to dip into Warblade after level 13 and go Jade Phoenix Mage for a few levels for Arcane Wrath (which stacks with Arcane Strike) and Mystic Phoenix Stance (which btw gives you an additional +2 to AC). Also it opens up the awesome Martial Discipline Enchantment for your weapons which is a +1 enchantment and it give you an additional +3 to hit and that makes power attacking stupidly easy at higher levels.

[DR27]

This depends on how far you think the game will go, but unless it's going above 13th (Duskblade 13 gets full attack arcane channel, so is worth going straight duskblade), I would probably go for an early Jade Phoenix Mage (great knowledge synergy) entry. I prefer Duskblade 5/ Crusader 1/ JPM X - Warblade swift action maneuver recovery ends up interfering with your casting, so Crusader's actionless refresh is advantageous. Having maneuver progression plus spells and channeling will give you tons of options in combat. I like options. Battlecaster Offense is also an option for boosting your save DCs if you care about that.

[Fax Celestis]

If you finagle your way into the requirements for Enlightened Fist (Combat Casting, which you get for free, IUS, and Stunning Fist, Concentration 8, Spellcraft 5, Know (Arcane) 5), you can pick up the Hold Ray ability at 7th level, which lets you turn ray spells into touch spells.

Then, if you can pick up some sneak attack (if you're interested in burning feats, you could pick up Martial Study and Martial Stance, or you could bite the bullet and do the Swordsage Dip™ for Assassin's Stance, or do a Spellthief dip and take Master Spellthief to avoid CL loss), you can go into Spellwarp Sniper, which lets you turn AoE spells into rays.

So it's a late-game thing, but the long story short is you turn AoEs into rays and rays into touches. Just off the duskblade list, this means you can start channeling things like polar ray, burning hands, ray of enfeeblement, (weirdly) obscuring mist, ray of exhaustion, channeled pyroburst, disintegrate and enervation. Getting more spells onto your list (like, say, Extra Spell, Arcane Disciple, or asking your DM nicely) makes this even cooler.

[DR27]

So it's a late-game thing, but the long story short is you turn AoEs into rays and rays into touches. Just off the duskblade list, this means you can start channeling things like polar ray, burning hands, ray of enfeeblement, (weirdly) obscuring mist, ray of exhaustion, channeled pyroburst, disintegrate and enervation. Getting more spells onto your list (like, say, Extra Spell, Arcane Disciple, or asking your DM nicely) makes this even cooler.That sounds like a lot of effort just to channel more things. Is it a good thing to put so much investment and planning into having one good trick? (channeling) It's a really good trick though, and that's not to say that I wouldn't play this build in it's final form just to channel obscuring mist for the look on the DM's face, but how does the build-up play?

[A_S]

If you finagle your way into the requirements for Enlightened Fist (Combat Casting, which you get for free, IUS, and Stunning Fist, Concentration 8, Spellcraft 5, Know (Arcane) 5), you can pick up the Hold Ray ability at 7th level, which lets you turn ray spells into touch spells.

Then, if you can pick up some sneak attack (if you're interested in burning feats, you could pick up Martial Study and Martial Stance, or you could bite the bullet and do the Swordsage Dip™ for Assassin's Stance, or do a Spellthief dip and take Master Spellthief to avoid CL loss), you can go into Spellwarp Sniper, which lets you turn AoE spells into rays.

So it's a late-game thing, but the long story short is you turn AoEs into rays and rays into touches. Just off the duskblade list, this means you can start channeling things like polar ray, burning hands, ray of enfeeblement, (weirdly) obscuring mist, ray of exhaustion, channeled pyroburst, disintegrate and enervation. Getting more spells onto your list (like, say, Extra Spell, Arcane Disciple, or asking your DM nicely) makes this even cooler.
This is cool, but I wouldn't put it on a duskblade chassis. Enlightened Fist gets its own channel mechanic (which works with full attacks, though doesn't deliver the spell multiple times), and the best spells to pull this off with aren't duskblade. I would just do this with an ascetic mage sorcerer and channel Wings of Flurry all day long.