Craft Alchemy by the day?

[unseenmage]

I want to add Crafting Mundane Items (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/craft.htm) to this chart but my brain is full of the dumb this morning and I can't quite get it.

Could someone help me fill in the blanks here?


Cost to Craft Construct or Magic Item (gp) = Market Price * 0.375
Cost to Craft Construct or Magic Item (xp) = Market Price * 0.03
Time to Craft Construct or Magic Item (in days) = Market Price / 1,000

Cost to Craft Mundane Item (gp) = Market Price / 3
Time to Craft Mundane Item (in weeks) = (Craft Check * DC)>= (Market Price * 10 sp)
Time to Craft Mundane Item (in days) = (Craft Check * DC)>= (Market Price * 100 cp)
(If the result * the DC doesn’t equal the price, then it represents the progress you’ve made this week/day. Record the result and make a new Craft check for the next week/day. Each week/day, you make more progress until your total reaches the price of the item in silver/copper pieces.)


Edit: The Magic Item crafting costs are off because of the Eberron cost reduction feats by the way.


Acid, 10gp, week DC 15, day DC , hour DC
Alchemist's Fire, 20gp, week DC 20, day DC , hour DC
Tanglefoot Bag, 50gp, week DC 25, day DC , hour DC
Shapesand, 100gp, week DC 25, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 2 lbs./1d6/5' radius, 200gp, week DC 26, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 4 lbs./2d6/5' radius, 400gp, week DC 27, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 6 lbs./3d6/5' radius, 600gp, week DC 28, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 8 lbs./4d6/10' radius, 800gp, week DC 29, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 10 lbs./5d6/10'radius, 1,000gp, week DC 30, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 12 lbs./6d6/10'radius, 1,200gp, week DC 31, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 14 lbs./7d6/15' radius, 1,400gp, week DC 32, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 16 lbs./8d6/15' radius, 1,600gp, week DC 33, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 18 lbs./9d6/15' radius, 1,800gp, week DC 34, day DC , hour DC
Explosive Pack 20 lbs./10d6/20' radius, 2,000gp, week DC 35, day DC , hour DC
Black Lotus Extract, 4,500gp, week DC 24, day DC , hour DC

[unseenmage]

Okay, I think I've got this now.
Assuming my chart is right.

My check result is Craft Alchemy +16 +10 to take 10 = check result 26.
Flask of Acid - Craft Alchemy DC 15 - MP: 10gp

Plugging in the numbers gives us,
30 * 15 >= 10 * 10 * 3 = not only can I make it I make it in 1/3 of a week.

56 hours per flask of Acid is horrible. Just horrible.
Even with both me and my Dedicated Wright Homunculus making them (it can craft of it's own accord so long as it's not a magic item) we still only make 2 flasks of acid every 56 hours.

Ugh.

[Vizzerdrix]

There is a PrC to ease that problem in one of the Eberron books.

[unseenmage]

Marvelous Pigments (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Marvelous_Pigments) solve this problem somewhat.
Just need to figure out how many alchemical items one dose of the pigments can make before it's used up.

Edit: from the Q&A thread:


1000 cubic feet is a cube 10' on a size, which roughly corresponds to size Large (a Large gelatinous cube has exactly those dimensions). Each size category corresponds to a factor of 2 in linear dimension, so if the objects can be stacked three-dimensionally, this would correspond to 8 Medium objects, or 64 Small ones, etc.

Large: 1
Medium/Small: 8
Tiny: 64
Diminutive: 1,000
Fine: 8,000

I suspect that 8 greatswords/statues/corpses/outfits/suits of armor is plenty.
And I'm certain that 8,000 doses of poison/Tanglefoot Bags/arrows/bolts/pebbles is more than enough.

[Lord Vukodlak]

Don't forget you can increase your crafting speed by adding 10 to the DC of the craft check. So 26x25=650, if you can manage to boost your crafting skill by another two points you can make seven acids per week.

I presume your an artificer so you could also use fabricate infusion to instantly create massive amounts of alchemical items.

[unseenmage]

I presume your an artificer so you could also use fabricate infusion to instantly create massive amounts of alchemical items.
Howso? I was under the impression that Fabricate was just a fancy Stone Shape spell.

[forsaken1111]

During downtime crafting I've always allowed my players to work on multiple alchemical items concurrently provided they are devoting all of their attention to it. Sure it takes 50+ hours to make a flask of acid, but who says you can't make that acid in large batches?

[Lord Vukodlak]

Howso? I was under the impression that Fabricate was just a fancy Stone Shape spell. Its not, you transform raw materials into finished items.
During downtime crafting I've always allowed my players to work on multiple alchemical items concurrently provided they are devoting all of their attention to it. Sure it takes 50+ hours to make a flask of acid, but who says you can't make that acid in large batches? Because 100 doses of alchemist acid would cost 100gp and thus increase the crafting time.

[forsaken1111]

If I add ingredient A and B and do C to them to make Acid, why must I work in tiny volumes? Can I not pour 2x A and 2x B and do C to them to make two doses at once?

Anyway, as I said this is something I allow as a DM. If you want to follow a table instead, feel free. I make allowances to common sense sometimes.

[Lord Vukodlak]

If I add ingredient A and B and do C to them to make Acid, why must I work in tiny volumes? Can I not pour 2x A and 2x B and do C to them to make two doses at once?
Because your not just adding ingredients A and B it takes days to make alchemical items because its a long complex process often working with volatile or dangerous chemicals. If it was as simple as add A and B it wouldn't take days to make alchemical items. Making 50 vials of alchemist acid would also require fifty sets of alchemical tools. Or a huge unmovable industrial alchemical lab.

And while you might be able to pour out acid from one large container to many smaller ones alchemist fire ignites upon contact with air so that won't work to well but could be possible and other alchemical items aren't liquids. Sunrods, Tanglefoot bags, Thunderstones and Tindertwigs plus dozens of other items found in various books.


Anyway, as I said this is something I allow as a DM. If you want to follow a table instead, feel free. I make allowances to common sense sometimes. If you want to house rule it fine but the "common sense" of it falls apart with most alchemical items.

[unseenmage]

Its not, you transform raw materials into finished items.

Okay, a friend just explained Unseen Crafter to me and how it makes Alchemical items much much easier to get done.

6th level artificer, 19 Int, gives me 7 potential castings of Unseen Crafter.
Each lasts for 6 days. So using 7 each day for 6 days gives me 42 of them.

They can Aid Another and Take 10 on Craft checks too. Their bonus is my ranks plus my ability mod, +13. With taking 10 They can hit DC 23 Craft Alchemy.
With all of them Aid Another-ing my check I can hit DC 102.

So, my question now is, how fast can i really output my important Alchemical Items? Shapesand (Sa102), Explosive Packs (EB: SoS138), and the triumvirate of elemental damagers from core srd being the most important ones I know of.
(Okay maybe that one Con poison too I guess, I'm not statted for poisoning though.)

[Lord Vukodlak]

Okay, a friend just explained Unseen Crafter to me and how it makes Alchemical items much much easier to get done.

6th level artificer, 19 Int, gives me 7 potential castings of Unseen Crafter.
Each lasts for 6 days. So using 7 each day for 6 days gives me 42 of them.

They can Aid Another and Take 10 on Craft checks too. Their bonus is my ranks plus my ability mod, +13. With taking 10 They can hit DC 23 Craft Alchemy.
With all of them Aid Another-ing my check I can hit DC 102.

So, my question now is, how fast can i really output my important Alchemical Items? Shapesand (Sa102), Explosive Packs (EB: SoS138), and the triumvirate of elemental damagers from core srd being the most important ones I know of.
(Okay maybe that one Con poison too I guess, I'm not statted for poisoning though.)
I'm not going to do the math for all kinds of misc alchemical items with different prices and different crafting DC's. It doesn't work as there are to many variables based off the craft dc and result.

Well I don't know how many DM's would allow that many aid another's to stack together but when you have 42 of them(and presuming the aid another was allowed to that level) You could make 28 alchemist acid's in a single day. (presuming you added 10 to the DC for fast crafting). 112x25=2800cp of progress in copper for one day of work. Which is enough for 28 vials of acid.
A whole weeks worth would be 280 vials. The hard part would be figuring out the progress as you build up your army of 42.
And again your DM would have to allow that kind of aid another stacking. Lets say he doesn't and see how well they do on their own.

A simple set of seven unseen crafters could make 345cp progress perday towards alchemist acid's, after six days they'd have made 2070cp in progress. Which is enough for two acids each. They could also do this in some sealed in cave while your off adventuring.

In a couple levels when they have a craft skill of +15 they could take 10 and fast craft acid each producing six vials of acid per week each.

[unseenmage]

I'm not going to do the math for all kinds of misc alchemical items with different prices and different crafting DC's. It doesn't work as there are to many variables based off the craft dc and result.

Well I don't know how many DM's would allow that many aid another's to stack together but when you have 42 of them(and presuming the aid another was allowed to that level) You could make 28 alchemist acid's in a single day. (presuming you added 10 to the DC for fast crafting). 112x25=2800cp of progress in copper for one day of work. Which is enough for 28 vials of acid.
A whole weeks worth would be 280 vials. The hard part would be figuring out the progress as you build up your army of 42.
And again your DM would have to allow that kind of aid another stacking. Lets say he doesn't and see how well they do on their own.

A simple set of seven unseen crafters could make 345cp progress perday towards alchemist acid's, after six days they'd have made 2070cp in progress. Which is enough for two acids each. They could also do this in some sealed in cave while your off adventuring.

In a couple levels when they have a craft skill of +15 they could take 10 and fast craft acid each producing six vials of acid per week each.

Unseen Crafter is based on Unseen Servant which does not even occupy a space. So lacking the usual limiter for Aid Another (that being how many dudes can feasibly stand next to each other Aid-ing) we default to at least one Aid Another action per craft check. That or we assume they all can help since they don't occupy space, but that's abusable, so no dice.

"This spell functions as unseen servant, except that the unseen crafter can be assigned any one task that can be accomplished by the use of the Craft skill." -- EB: RoE

By my reading they can in fact use the Aid Another action for Craft checks. Though the argument could be made that because the Take 10 action is specified as an example and the Aid Another action is not they may not.


I'm working on a chart for the various items I'm most concerned with, though working the misc +10 to the DC to craft faster is frustrating me.