O-Assassin: Can It Be Saved?

[Rhaegar14]

First, a little context for what I mean by "saved." I'm well aware an O-Assassin is not going to be anywhere near as effective as another class played competently.

A friend of mine is starting up a new 4e campaign soon. He is new to DMing, and most of his players are new to playing. Now, my instinct when building a character is to optimize to holy hell after a few fluff considerations. I don't want to tell the other players how to play the game or build their characters (I might point out the universal feat taxes, but that's about it), but I don't want to bring something like a Ranger to the table and make them all look bad, especially since it's a party of five and we're likely to have another Striker.

The O-Assassin has awesome fluff and I really like the feel and tactics of the class. So my question to you, Playground, is this: in a party of low-op, new players, can a well-optimized Assassin keep up?

[Firebug]

The answer you obviously are fishing for is "yes". A well optimized -anything- will hold its own in a low-op or new player group. In fact, you might as well play a leader and spec for damage. More of a safety net type of thing.

But I digress. The real issue here is how your DM is going to play Assassin's Shroud. Are you playing RAW or RAI? RAW: you can invoke the shrouds whenever there are shrouds on the target and you make an attack roll. After the damage roll the shrouds are removed. This is an important distinction. RAW if you have a power that has multiple attack rolls but a single damage roll against a single target you get multiple instances of the shroud damage. This is especially interesting because the Assassin innately does have a few powers that fit this criteria. Shadow Darts at level 1 for example.

However, most DMs will pull RAI and slap you down, so don't rely on it.

[Mando Knight]

I think an optimized Vampire could keep up with a bunch of low-op players. Insofar as a Vampire can be optimized while playing that class.

The Original Assassin isn't bad, it's just not as good as the Rogue at most levels of optimization. The Shroud mechanic is very strong if the Assassin is allowed to sit in the shadows for several seconds before anyone else even starts fighting (so it can invoke all of them at once), the problem is that it's a touch weaker than Hunter's Quarry otherwise and has no synergy with off-turn attacks. The Assassin trades the higher per-round potential of Quarry or Curse for a more reliable spread and the one-hit wonder that is Hunter's Insight after three or four rounds of pre-combat prep.

[Yakk]

Yes. Charge optimization alone is enough to make any character a stronger than average striker, using nothing but melee training for your basic melee attack.

While you don't have to charge optimize, the existence of that option means that there is a solution.

Will you allow other features to vary?

Fighter/Rogue MC, Cruel Shroud and Surprising Charge gives you +[W] damage on basically all charges, and Battle Awareness is a top-tier feat (costs you 13 str 13 wis) -- a free MBA/encounter is nothing to sneeze at, and +2 to almost all attacks (perma-CA) is also worth a feat.

Ki Focus expertise isn't bad.

For a weapon, a Greatspear or a Rapier are both fine. (+3/1d10 for a feat, or +3/1d8). At paragon if you go Rapier, pick up the TWF feat that gives you a free off-hand attack on a crit, and crit fish a bit.

To do charge based optimization, you'll need to pick up melee training (there doesn't appear to be a way to make an oassassin at-will a MBA) anyhow.

Black Flame for the possible double-shroud.

If you are doing well optimization wise, pick up the "Hidden Shrouds" feat, because it is fun.

Lethal Shroud is +0.5-1 DPR at Heroic, +1.5-3 at Paragon, and +2.5-5 DPR at Epic (higher values if you hit, or wait to invoke more shrouds, lower values if you have a 50% chance of hitting, and spam-use shrouds).

[Epinephrine]

The O-Assassin in the game I run is fairly strong, not the best striker, but amazingly resilient and mobile, which is certainly an advantage. Since she generally starts fights with full shrouds up (thanks to amazing stealth) and can re-apply shrouds fairly easily (Soul thief; you should finish most fights at 5 soul shards, if you regain 5 shards per fight it lets you apply your shrouds fast.

Generally, opening attack is to trigger 4 shrouds, and she'll apply another shroud that round for free. Next round she adds the second shroud, burns two soul shards (bringing it to 4 shrouds) and triggers. Next round she can add a shroud (free action) and burn the remaining 3 shards to bring it to 4 shrouds again, and trigger. So for the first three rounds she's dealing +4d8+20 damage. If there are minions, she can do it for longer.

[Yakk]

Here is a low end charge-optimized assassin.


====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
level 11
Changeling, Assassin, Soul Thief
Guild Training: Night Stalker
Assassin: Black Flame Form
Background: Occupation - Criminal (+2 to Stealth)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 14, Con 13, Dex 21, Int 9, Wis 14, Cha 19.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 13, Con 12, Dex 16, Int 8, Wis 13, Cha 14.


AC: 26 Fort: 21 Reflex: 25 Will: 24
HP: 63 Surges: 7 Surge Value: 15

TRAINED SKILLS
Stealth +17, Thievery +15, Bluff +16, Acrobatics +15, Streetwise +14, Intimidate +14

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +4, Diplomacy +9, Dungeoneering +7, Endurance +6, Heal +7, History +4, Insight +11, Nature +7, Perception +9, Religion +4, Athletics +7

FEATS
Level 1: Cruel Shroud
Level 2: Melee Training (Dexterity)
Level 4: Battle Awareness
Level 6: Surprising Charge
Level 8: Ki Focus Expertise
Level 10: Lethal Shroud
Level 11: Hidden Insight

POWERS
Assassin at-will 1: Executioner's Noose
Assassin at-will 1: Leaping Shade
Assassin encounter 1: Shadow Darts
Assassin daily 1: Terrifying Visage
Assassin utility 2: Distracting Illusion
Assassin encounter 3: Sohei Advance
Assassin daily 5: Twilight Assassin
Assassin utility 6: Darting Shadow
Assassin encounter 7: Blinding Menace
Assassin daily 9: Wall of Shadows
Assassin utility 10: Walk Through Shadow

ITEMS
Summoned Inix Leather Armor +3, Light Shield, Iron Armbands of Power (heroic tier), Horned Helm (heroic tier), Badge of the Berserker +3, Devastating Ki Focus +2, Rapier
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======


The charge damage: 1d8 [W] +1d8 (Surprise) +1d8+5 (Shroud) +1d6 (helm) +2 (dex) +2 (enhance) +2 (item) (notes: 1s and 2s are 3s) +4 (isolation) = 33.625

+5 (level) +5 (dex) +3 (prof) +2 (enhance) +2 (CA) +1 (charge) +2 (expertise) = +20 to hit.

A level 11 normal monster has 25 AC, so you hit on a 5+.

So your at-will charge makes you a 4-round striker (can kill an even-level opponent in 4 rounds of attacks), which is acceptable low-optimization striker damage output. On top of this, you have some encounter damage boosts.

You also have a bunch of encounter options. The Sohai stuff deals extra damage, while most of the rest of the encounter stuff is just fun stuff to play with (or lets you deal with flying foes). You have fun utility mechanics -- you are a changeling who can mimic anyone else's appearance, fight with any weapon you pick up, summon your own armor, teleport through walls, walk right in front of people without them being able to see you.

You can do the "cover someone in shrouds before a fight" thing, and rapidly replenish the shrouds you have on a target using reaped souls. Your alpha-strike charge is enough to bloody an even level opponent on average.

[Cloud]

I don't actually agree with this reading of Assassin's Shroud, but it does 'save' the assassin without having to buff the class.

http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/29099703/Look_Very_Carefully:_The_Shroud_Assassins_Handbook

[Yomega]

The key to "saving the o-assassin" is to take a very liberal veiw at the timing of the abilitys cout the shrouds as seperate damage rolls grab the lvl 2 ki focus that moves the shrouds largly because

Shrouds are invoked before you make the attack roll but dont leave the target until after the damage is resolved so if there not on the target when damage is done there not lost

Also the revnant has a rediculous amout of feat support for the o-assassin with the trick I just mentioned and the racial feat revnants have you can double tap your shrouds and not end up losing them

Personaly I also find ways to stack the warlocks curse along the shrouds for some pretty acceptible damage if not a bit hard to setup

[Leolo]

The main problem of the O-Assassin is that it both dips into multiple character roles (striker, but also a little bit of a controler) but also has more than one source of damage.

So it can require much system knowledge to add this all together. And his main source of damage is very variable. You can have an assassin that invokes an average of 1 shroud per round next to an assassin that invokes an average of 2 or 3 shrouds per round.

With all the effects on the damage output this includes.

Other classes, like for example the ranger does not need this system knowledge, they are pretty much already well build and played without the player having to really know the class.

So it is not only optimization, it is also much about knowing how to play the O-Assassin and to use it strengths and avoid it's weaknesses. A well played assassin is still not that good as an well played ranger, and an optimized assassin is not as good as an optimized ranger.

But the difference is much smaller than those between an unoptimized Assassin played without much class knowledge and an unoptimized ranger played without much class knowledge.