Arcane Sneak

[cbaidchris]

So I want to build a sneak attack arcane character that doesn't apply it's sneak to rays (which is what most builds I find have been) but rather just to his melee so basically I'm asking are there any good prcs that advance CL and sneak attack well? I've looked at unseen seer and arcane trickster. the minus to all other schools for unseen seer seems rather unappealing to me

[Deadline]

Daggerspell Mage from Complete ... Adventurer?

[Piggy Knowles]

Practiced Spellcaster deals with the CL penalty from Unseen Seer handily. It's probably still your best option, unfortunately. There's Magelord, but the pre-reqs are completely ridiculous (as in, impossible to complete the class pre-Epic without some degree of shenanigans).

[Thrice Dead Cat]

I would recomend going Spellthief 1/Wizard 4/ Unseen Seer 10/Arcane Trickster or Abjurant Champion 5, grabbing Craven, Master Spellthief, and extend spell, persistent spell, and echoing spell. Use your advance learnings to grabb Hunter's Eye (PHB 2), Divine Inspiration (SpC) and whatever floats your boat for the third. Use and abuse Heroics to gain the TWFing tree and Wraithstrike to ensure you hit.

[Turion]

Daggerspell Mage from Complete ... Adventurer?

Complete Adventurer is correct. note that the class has a rather annoying feat tax, though. Also, its main feature (aside from the dual SA/casting progression) is the ability to stab people with spells and throw touch spells at people. If you plan on using mostly buffs, this is not terribly useful.


I would recomend going Spellthief 1/Wizard 4/ Unseen Seer 10/Arcane Trickster or Abjurant Champion 5, grabbing Craven, Master Spellthief, and extend spell, persistent spell, and echoing spell. Use your advance learnings to grab Hunter's Eye (PHB 2), Divine Inspiration (SpC) and whatever floats your boat for the third. Use and abuse Heroics to gain the TWFing tree and Wraithstrike to ensure you hit.

I like this. Note that Craven will shut off if you ever use Heroes' Feast or mind blank, though. A third option would be ST1/Wiz4/USS10/DsM5; it would be about on par with Arcane Trickster.
Heroics is very nice for martial study/martial stance, as well.
Picking up Gravestrike/Vinestrike through Unseen Seer wouldn't be the worst thing you could do, either.
I know you didn't ask about feats, but wanted to mention: you may actually find Arcane Strike helpful as well, especially if you're persisting Hunter's Eye/<monster>strike/Wraithstrike. Consistent bonuses to attack+damage are rather nice on a TWF build. If you do plan on TWFing, snag the Gloves of the Balanced Hand from MiC. Saves a few castings of heroics, and if you took TWF (possibly to enter Daggerspell Mage), then it automatically upgrades. (does not go past ITWF, though.)

[Fouredged Sword]

I am going to recomend another route.

Spellthief 1 / Duskblade 4 / Chameleon 10 / Abjurant champion 5, unseen seer 5, or arcane trickster 5.

You get only 6th level spells, but you get ALL 6th level spells, and you can cast them into melee attacks.

You want to go Int > Con > Str > Dex, and decide if you want to save enough wisdom for the divine focus or not (divine power is nice, but not needed. The skill boosting duo is a powerhouse of divine insight and guidance of the avatar)

Take craven and use items to boost your sneak attack. You can get +3d6 from weapon enhancements and another +1d6 or so from other things. Hunter's eye is possible through spellthief. See if your DM will let you snag an arcane version from the spellbook of an unseen seer.

[Thrice Dead Cat]

I'm not really a fan of Daggerspell Mage. It loses a caster level and just doesn't really do mucn of anything. Also, never blow your advanced learnings on grave/vinestrike. True death crystals exist for a reason, while plants are easy enough to deal with sans sneak attack. Good point on arcane strike, though

[Turion]

I'm not really a fan of Daggerspell Mage. It loses a caster level and just doesn't really do mucn of anything. Also, never blow your advanced learnings on grave/vinestrike. True death crystals exist for a reason, while plants are easy enough to deal with sans sneak attack. Good point on arcane strike, though

Yeah, DsM's not the greatest. I'm kinda fond of it, but its abilities don't mesh too well with its prereqs/probable playstyle, and, as you mention, it loses a cl at first level. Not quite sure if Master Spellthief would make up for that; would probably depend on whether DsM itself is considered a spellcasting class as a whole, or just the levels that actually increase casting.

Also, fair enough on the -strike spells. Mostly mentioned them because greater truedeath crystals are kinda pricey, especially at low levels. Wands +chambers+ UMD might actually be a better idea, although persisting them would require Incantatrix levels. (Which would actually help with feat starvation, but... :smalleek: )

[Keld Denar]

I think Divine Insight us one of the best USS pick ups, other than the ubiquitous Hunter's Eye. At most levels it is a nice +15 to just about any skill check you might need. Use it for a really critical Disable Device check or as a mini Glibbness or for Diplomacy or something crazy like Forgery or a Craft check in conjunction with an emergency Fabricate spell. It's just so good. Hours pretty level duration mends it it's nearly always there when you need it, just set it but don't forget it!

[pilvento]

I love this build:

But thats just cause i like death attack and a CL 22 hearth ripper.

Master Spellthief 5 / Assassin 10 / Unseen seer 5

Edit: Cl 22 hearth ripper comes from master spellthief, and spell thesis.

[Fax Celestis]

How about Spellthief 4/Duskblade 5/Enlightened Fist 7/Arcane Trickster 4? Enlightened Fist will let you hold ray spells as touch attacks, and you can sneak attack with them or channel them via Duskblade. Not much in the way of sneak attack here, though.

[Dusk Eclipse]

I am going to recomend another route.

Spellthief 1 / Duskblade 4 / Chameleon 10 / Abjurant champion 5, unseen seer 5, or arcane trickster 5.

You get only 6th level spells, but you get ALL 6th level spells, and you can cast them into melee attacks.

You want to go Int > Con > Str > Dex, and decide if you want to save enough wisdom for the divine focus or not (divine power is nice, but not needed. The skill boosting duo is a powerhouse of divine insight and guidance of the avatar)

Take craven and use items to boost your sneak attack. You can get +3d6 from weapon enhancements and another +1d6 or so from other things. Hunter's eye is possible through spellthief. See if your DM will let you snag an arcane version from the spellbook of an unseen seer.

That seems pretty solid to me, it even gets 16 Bab (with abjurant champion) and you can takt ITW with the chamelon bonus feat while you save up for a pair of gloves of the balanced hand.

Do note you need city slicker to get the pre-requisite skills for chamelon in time. So baring flaws your first feats will be Able Learner+City slicker, leaving TWF for third level.

Knowledge Devotion is also a strong option here, since all your attacks benefit from it and you can get some pretty decent bonus even with little investment.