Critical Hits, Displacement, and Precision Damage oh my!

[Eonir]

SOOOOOO...

A fight is going on right now where the BBEG is displaced. The rules compendium states that any creature that has concealment is immune to precision based damage. My DM is under the conclusion that this makes him immune to crits, because a critical hit is precision damage. However, I can't find this ANYWHERE, nor can I find any ruling that gives a precise definition of what "precision damage" is.

HELP ME. This wizard is ruining my night.

[Qc Storm]

While monsters immune to precision damage are typically immune to critical hits (due to lack of internal organs and such), concealment does not prevent critical hits.

Think of it as :

Precision = Carefully aiming strikes where it hurts

Critical = Mostly luck.

[Eonir]

While monsters immune to precision damage are typically immune to critical hits (due to lack of internal organs and such), concealment does not prevent critical hits.

Think of it as :

Precision = Carefully aiming strikes where it hurts

Critical = Mostly luck.

Can you list your source for this?

[Fax Celestis]

Critical Hits
When you make an attack roll and get a natural 20 (the d20 shows 20), you hit regardless of your target’s Armor Class, and you have scored a threat. The hit might be a critical hit (or "crit"). To find out if it’s a critical hit, you immediately make a critical roll—another attack roll with all the same modifiers as the attack roll you just made. If the critical roll also results in a hit against the target’s AC, your original hit is a critical hit. (The critical roll just needs to hit to give you a crit. It doesn’t need to come up 20 again.) If the critical roll is a miss, then your hit is just a regular hit.

A critical hit means that you roll your damage more than once, with all your usual bonuses, and add the rolls together. Unless otherwise specified, the threat range for a critical hit on an attack roll is 20, and the multiplier is ×2.

Exception: Extra damage dice over and above a weapon’s normal damage is not multiplied when you score a critical hit.

Increased Threat Range
Sometimes your threat range is greater than 20. That is, you can score a threat on a lower number. In such cases, a roll of lower than 20 is not an automatic hit. Any attack roll that doesn’t result in a hit is not a threat.

Increased Critical Multiplier
Some weapons deal better than double damage on a critical hit.

Spells and Critical Hits
A spell that requires an attack roll can score a critical hit. A spell attack that requires no attack roll cannot score a critical hit.

Crits only care about the dice, they don't care about concealment.


A rogue can sneak attack only living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack. Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks. The rogue must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. A rogue cannot sneak attack while striking a creature with concealment or striking the limbs of a creature whose vitals are beyond reach.
Concealment prevents precision damage, not crits.

[Thiyr]

Rules compendium page 42: "A number of abilities in the game allow a creature to deal extra damage by striking a vital area. This category of abilities includes sneak attack and other abilities that work like it, such as a ninja’s sudden strike (Complete Adventurer 8) and scout’s skirmish (Complete Adventurer 12).[yadda yadda blah blah blah yakkity smackity let's make it easy and call lump this all under the term precision damage]"

Crits are not precision damage, as a) a crit is not an ability, it is an event, and b) it bears no resemblance to sneak attack mechanically. The only connection is that precision damage is hampered by crit immunity, but that doesn't work in reverse (the age old all circles are ovals but not all ovals are circles bit). Hope that helped (And wasn't too late for you)

[Eonir]

Rules compendium page 42: "A number of abilities in the game allow a creature to deal extra damage by striking a vital area. This category of abilities includes sneak attack and other abilities that work like it, such as a ninja’s sudden strike (Complete Adventurer 8) and scout’s skirmish (Complete Adventurer 12).[yadda yadda blah blah blah yakkity smackity let's make it easy and call lump this all under the term precision damage]"

Exactly what I was looking for. Thank you.

[prufock]

SOOOOOO...

A fight is going on right now where the BBEG is displaced. The rules compendium states that any creature that has concealment is immune to precision based damage. My DM is under the conclusion that this makes him immune to crits, because a critical hit is precision damage. However, I can't find this ANYWHERE, nor can I find any ruling that gives a precise definition of what "precision damage" is.

HELP ME. This wizard is ruining my night.

Just pointing out that displacement doesn't actually grant concealment, it only grants miss chance as if you had concealment. They don't get the ability to hide in it, nor does it mean that there's a square between the attacker and defender that grants concealment. It doesn't prevent enemies from targeting the creature normally. Sneak attack should still apply*

*Unless this was cleared up in the Rules Compendium.