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Tyndmyr
2013-09-14, 09:58 PM
So, I've started a game shop recently. Now, most of you are probably too far away to drop by...but not too far to give me precious ideas.

Now, obviously, I've already stocked the OOTS comics :smallbiggrin:, but what else makes a game shop great, and gives it that proper feel where you want to sit down and have a game there? What are the things you love about your local shops, and what drives you nuts?

Techsmart
2013-09-14, 10:16 PM
actually having enough room to sit down and play :P This seems like a no brainer, but I've been to a couple shops where the "gaming" area was just crammed in a corner to have more shelf space. Needless to say, those shops didn't last long.

Have events. Events bring in people, and help you get a good, consistent fanbase. When you have them, don't try to make a fortune on the event. An old store I went to twice ran MTG tournaments where there was a $5 entry for a constructed tournament (so there was no other cost), and 1st place got 2 booster packs (a $8 value at the time). People stopped participating in the tournaments, and the place went downhill quickly until they learned. The event brought them in, then the profits were made on the extras sold at the tournament. (similarly, the profits wouldnt be made with the campaign, it would be on the minis and such).

Know about every line you sell, even if it's just a general concept. I've been to a couple dedicated rpg/gaming stores where the staff had no interest in the product and simply had a "either buy it or leave me be" mentality.

talk with your customers. Don't be "that guy behind the counter." If you and your customers can refer to each other by name, then you can be pretty confident they'll be back. This also helps you generate a sense of safety. If your customers are also your friends, they will be more likely to discourage other people from doing the wrong thing.

I recently moved, and the new store in my area seems to do a pretty good job. The gaming area has a big open space for tournaments (in this case mostly card games, but also overflow during Pathfinder Society stuff), then has some separated rooms for private RPGs. The people behind the counter are really interested in what the players do.

Don't know if this helps any, but I'm sure I can get some other ideas going.

JusticeZero
2013-09-14, 10:23 PM
1: Location location location. If I can't get there, I won't go there.
2: Women. Not in the X rated section, either. That means don't put up with sexist crap, keep the place clean, and put a mix of stuff in.
3: Keep honest. Sometimes I would come to a game store and see some of the $25 first printing 3.0 books marked up with tape to match the higher price of the next printing. That's actually illegal. It's also a red flag to me, so I don't go there as much.
4: Lights. If the lights flicker, i'm out of there. If the lights are dim or glare, I don't want to be there.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-14, 10:29 PM
Oh, no, this is good...I'm still trying to find the right mix of gaming space and shelf space. I've got a side room that's all gaming space, but you can only really put two long eight person tables in there and still leave enough room for it to feel comfortable and roomy. Got another two long tables and one small one in the main room(plus outdoor seating), but as I get more shelving, there's gonna be some sort of tradeoff there. Maybe mobile shelves/tables for events.

We've done some small drafts so far, haven't gotten the volume to get them sanctioned yet, but they're otherwise run exactly the same as official events. Been doing three round swiss draft, $15 entry, prizes are a pack a win. Going strictly by the averages, that should come out to be a fairly good deal for players, but I don't know if that *looks* impressive or is what the players actually want.

I've got an pirate weekend event going on this weekend, not really focused on any one game, more of an excuse to wear ridiculous pirate outfits(which, oddly, everyone involved in the store already owns), have a mess of pirate themed demo games, and offer a discount on anything that customers can justify as pirate related. Great idea, terrible idea, not really sure yet, but I suppose I'll find out.



3: Keep honest. Sometimes I would come to a game store and see some of the $25 first printing 3.0 books marked up with tape to match the higher price of the next printing. That's actually illegal. It's also a red flag to me, so I don't go there as much.

Selling above MSRP isn't actually illegal...but yeah, it isn't going to win you any friends. We tried to peg all our prices to an even dollar number wherever possible(instead of the .99 or what not you see everywhere). Sometimes this results in a markdown, sometimes it's a penny up. I figure nobody really cares about the penny compared to clarity in prices, but the only things that *should* be above MSRP are genuine collectors stuff. Not 3.0 books(those are all below MSRP, because...3.0), but stuff like sealed boxes of magic cards from a decade ago or so. Things that the internet wants ridiculous money for.

The lights thing is interesting, I genuinely hadn't considered it at all. We have a very high level of lights in the main room and for the exterior tables, but only a moderate level for the gaming room(just the overhead lights in the ceiling). None of them flicker, though. I suppose that's fortunate.

Hiro Protagonest
2013-09-14, 10:41 PM
Have people who are willing to DM wear hooded cloaks and sit in dark corners. :smalltongue:

JusticeZero
2013-09-14, 10:47 PM
Selling above MSRP isn't actually illegal...but yeah, it isn't going to win you any friends.It wasn't that it was MSRP, its that they kicked the price up substantially to match items next to it that WERE at MSRP.
Is there anywhere that people at events can get food or similar?

Slipperychicken
2013-09-14, 10:48 PM
When I go to a game shop (Not very often, only 1-3 times a year; usually only to buy something specific like dice), I like it when the people working there know about (or better yet, actually play or are passionate about) the game/product I'm looking for. Especially if they seem chill and can give me good advice about what I'm looking for.

EDIT:
Perhaps market research might be in order? I know my Intro to Marketing class talked a lot about various ways to be keep aware of what your target market looks like and wants (which obviously informs which needs you cater to, how, and other things), like sending surveys to customers or even getting a third party to help you out. Same goes for "findability"; making your business come up when someone googles things that you offer, advertising in the right places/ways/amounts, and having a nice-looking, useful, easily-navigable website.

Obviously, I don't know the specifics of your startup, but as a business major, this stuff is really cool to me.


Also, good luck with the game shop!

Techsmart
2013-09-14, 10:55 PM
$15 drafts sounds fine, I would pay that. The annoying ones are when it's clear that they are making a huge profit on something that cost them almost nothing in products (roomspace and electricity notwithstanding).

The pirate day sounds fun. things like that help keep the place interesting. Another good idea is a board game day. Even non-RPGers and MTG players can have fun on days like that. The shop I go to also uses them as days to experiment with some of the newer games they get in stock. Board games tend to sell there :P.

I don't know what your gaming area is like (I've played in areas with mostly casual and mostly serious). If your players like to play seriously, or at least think they're playing more seriously, it might be worth it trying to get yourself sanctioned sooner, rather than later. It will help set the atmosphere of the gaming area, and will get you self-advertised, since the WOTC website will add you to their store search. Similarly, (this part involves both the RPG and MTG parts), familiarize yourself with the rules. One store I went to had one of the players be the judge, and neither the player nor the judge had any clue as to what the rules actually said, so I tended to get very frustrated doing something that, at PTQs, worked fine but got vetoed.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-14, 10:59 PM
It wasn't that it was MSRP, its that they kicked the price up substantially to match items next to it that WERE at MSRP.
Is there anywhere that people at events can get food or similar?

We've got a pretty good selection of snacks and drinks(both sodas and energy drinks)...maybe twenty types of snacks and a dozen drink types or so, but due to local licensing, we can't do full on food. There's a coupla pizza places that deliver, though. That's a good reminder, I need to make a cheat sheet for hungry gamers to put by the phone with the local delivery places on it.

Still gotta work on learning all the products. I know most of 'em from just having gamed forever, but it turns out there's a *lot* of games out there I somehow missed. I may have to buckle down and finally learn pokemon. :smallsigh:

Tyndmyr
2013-09-14, 11:06 PM
$15 drafts sounds fine, I would pay that. The annoying ones are when it's clear that they are making a huge profit on something that cost them almost nothing in products (roomspace and electricity notwithstanding).

The pirate day sounds fun. things like that help keep the place interesting. Another good idea is a board game day. Even non-RPGers and MTG players can have fun on days like that. The shop I go to also uses them as days to experiment with some of the newer games they get in stock. Board games tend to sell there :P.

I don't know what your gaming area is like (I've played in areas with mostly casual and mostly serious). If your players like to play seriously, or at least think they're playing more seriously, it might be worth it trying to get yourself sanctioned sooner, rather than later. It will help set the atmosphere of the gaming area, and will get you self-advertised, since the WOTC website will add you to their store search. Similarly, (this part involves both the RPG and MTG parts), familiarize yourself with the rules. One store I went to had one of the players be the judge, and neither the player nor the judge had any clue as to what the rules actually said, so I tended to get very frustrated doing something that, at PTQs, worked fine but got vetoed.

This is actually one of my frustrations with one of the local shops(don't get me wrong, they're good people, I'm not trying to put them out of business or the like)....one of 'em, the tournament organizer doesn't even play the game. Players are relied on to do the judging. That seems worrisome. I haven't ever bothered to qualify as a formal judge, but I'm sufficiently good at the game to be able to draft online and build full sets at a (slight) profit. I suspect I'll crush the game rules stuff pretty hard...but I'll need to memorize the things like penalties for formal events and what not.

Crankin' through the paperwork for a direct wizards account this weekend, it's oddly specific, and requires you submit it via snail mail with a certain list of pictures attached and what not. *shrug* It's strange, but I'll do it. It's not really doable until after you've gotten your store open, so there's an unavoidable lag where you have to get magic product in store and conduct events without being official. Odd.

AttilaTheGeek
2013-09-14, 11:24 PM
Make sure everyone who works there is friendly and approachable. If you haven't built up a customer base, nametags help. I want to go to a gaming shop and see people who look like they want to be there.

I also want to second the points about lighting, pricing, and floor space. My local game shop has (eyeballing, I haven't been there in a few weeks) 500 square feet, maybe, on the upper floor. About half of it is taken up by bookshelves for all sorts of sci-fi and fantasy books, and the other half is a main counter with a case for Magic: The Gathering cards. You do have a case, right?

Anyway, down in the basement they have maybe 200, 300 square feet for board games, but they also have tournament seating down there. There are 60-something seats, and prereleases are always full. I realize you won't have anywhere near that customer base (the store I'm talking about is 14 years old) but that should give you an idea of a store space to table space ratio. However, I do wish they had more tables there, especially round tables. All the tables are for pairs because the store makes most of its money off magic, but I wish they ran D&D campaigns there.

Speaking of which, a list of stuff to stock. I see a lot of Warhammer/ Warhammer 40k Pathfinder along the walls of the board game section, so I'd be sure to carry those as well. Best of luck!

tasw
2013-09-14, 11:33 PM
a good facebook page. Lets you keep in touch with a lot of your customers and let them know about whats on sale each week and what activities your sponsoring. And if they like it it will viral out to their contacts too.

OACSNY97
2013-09-15, 08:34 AM
On the board games thing- my best friend talks up a gaming store she's been to when visiting relatives that's half restaurant and half game store (which I know is not your situation) and says that by far the most popular game available for drop in play is Apples to Apples.

Weird and/or collectable dice, especially those low to middling price range, will probably sell well.

For the table top game manuals- try and have at least the first book in a line for several of the moderately popular but not top tier (i.e. DnD, Pathfinder, WoD) systems in stock most of the time. If I'm going to impulse buy a gaming manual it's probably NOT going to be one of the superstars that I know I can get cheaper online using my Barnes and Noble coupons and membership. It's frustrating going to the local game store and looking for the first book to try a new system and only finding some late expansion book, even if the store is willing to order.

Oh, forgot to mention that I do like my local store's loyalty program- for every certain amount of money you spend, you get a point that can be used towards merchandise and periodically they send e-mails that will give bonus points.

Mutazoia
2013-09-15, 09:02 AM
Here's my preferred game store (http://dlair.net/austin/store-info/at-the-lair/) in town for reference....


bookshelves along the wall's except at the very front half of the store. You want people to look in the front window and see games.
Lighting: a little brighter in the game areas so people can read their stuff. Slightly dimmer in the rest of the store (but not dim enough to make the place look gloomy). This will also draw attention to the game area and entice people to play there. Pot lights shining directly on the product and immediate area in front of it will allow you to use slightly dimmer lights elsewhere. This will also highlight your product but keep the room lights at a level that avoids eye strain and allows shy geeks to keep partial concealment while they wander around. Otherwise keep the lighting even.
A gimmick. Dragon's Lair Austin has a pair of cats living in the store. It's not uncommon for me to have a cat perched on my shoulder while I shop.
Diversify your stock. Don't focus exclusively on games...sell comix, rent/sell Anime and Dr. Who paraphernalia. Sell to the entire geek culture.
PARKING! (probably should be #1). My only complaint about DLA's location is not enough parking (especially when the bike shop next door has a tent sale in the parking lot the same day DLA is having a major event).
Don't forget the kids! Remember there are a lot of older gamer's around and they bring their kids when they go shopping. Cthulhu plushies, dragon plushies, a children's book section... kid's impulse shop like crazy. Why do you think all the candy at the supermarket is at knee level? Plus having an area where they can hang out and play and be out of mom/dad's hair is always a bonus to parents.
Events! Besides the normal gaming events. Hold costume contests for the premier's of Marvel or DC movies (or Star Wars and Star Trek). Encourage staff to dress up as well.
Hot Geek Girls on staff. Nothing keeps the lonely game/comic nerd coming back like the opportunity to chat up a hot girl that know's the difference between Captain Marvel and Captain Marvel.
Have copies of popular board games available to play. Put a shelf in the game area and throw a bunch of board games up there for people to just grab and play. If gamer's know they can wander in on any given day and do a pick up game of their favorite board game with out having to shlep their own stuff in will be a good draw.

jedipotter
2013-09-15, 09:26 AM
1. Parking. Must be free and in a large, well mainatined lot.
2. Good Location. No where 'downtown' or 'urban', must be in a nice suburb at least.
3. Good mix of games, comics, books, posters, collectables and other related items.
4. Have the store seperated from the shop. I hate where your expected to role play with people walking all around and looking and interupting.
5. Sales staff that know the products, at least a bit.
6. Don't forget the Adults! He seperate kids and adult areas. Nothing ruins a shop quicker then when they roll over and worship the kids and try to be all kid freindly. Kids running wild and acting like idiots, jerks and well kids, is not a good attractive thing to have in your shop. You will quickly push all the adults away who can't stand to be around the Coolz Kidzz. But a nice, locked and caged area(to keep the poor innocent kids safe, of course) is a good idea.
7.Food And Drink. First of all, allow outside food. Don't do the Stupid Overlord Crap where you allow no outside food or drink and then charge $3 for a bottle of water. If you could connect a small sub shop or such that would be even better.
8. Samples. You need to have a book that customers can flip through. I hate spending $30 for a book I can't look through. I want to flip through and see how much space the book wastes on crappy art, for example. 60 pages, with 30 crappy art pages equals I don't buy that book. The same way you can't trust the back of the book where it says ''over a dozen spells'', when there are fifteen. Or worse just ''lots of new spells'', where there are six. (one of the worst shops around here...long gone now..shrink wrapped everything.
9.Internet access, WiFi.
10.A service to order books amd items for a handing fee. A LOT of gamers (I was one once) don't live in the best area to have packages shipped too. So having a nice, safe, dry place to ship orders to would be great.

Blackfang108
2013-09-15, 10:25 AM
A gimmick. Dragon's Lair Austin has a pair of cats living in the store. It's not uncommon for me to have a cat perched on my shoulder while I shop.


This gimmick ensures that I will NEVER set foot inside the store.

I hate that this gimmick is becoming more and more common.

I am highly allergic to cats, and I'm not the only person.

Alejandro
2013-09-15, 10:59 AM
We've got a pretty good selection of snacks and drinks(both sodas and energy drinks)...maybe twenty types of snacks and a dozen drink types or so, but due to local licensing, we can't do full on food. There's a coupla pizza places that deliver, though. That's a good reminder, I need to make a cheat sheet for hungry gamers to put by the phone with the local delivery places on it.

This is actually a good business and networking opportunity for you. Find out which of these places has good food (just ask your gamers) and then contact them, tell them you want to place promotional material in your shop for your gamers to order their food with, and see if they can do something similar for you. This doesn't mean they need to put up a poster about your shop in their pizza place, but they could offer a special deal, like 10% off deliveries to X Gaming Store.

Raum
2013-09-15, 11:13 AM
I'd skip gimmicks...unless good games and friendly people are a gimmick. They're what you want to focus on and gimmicks are just distractions.

Things you should consider include:
- Refreshments. There are limitations to what you can serve but be flexible when you can. Sodas & snacks of course but don't forget things like a Kuerig (or equivalent) which can make everything from coffee or tea to just hot water for other drinks. These are also a way to pay for the table space dedicated to playing games. :)
- Library. Have a game library of loaners, probably with some sort of membership or small fee to pay for the games. I've probably purchased half my games after playing them...so make sure you can get your library games in stock also.
- Lighting has been mentioned.
- Sound baffling if you have the space. Contained areas get loud quickly.
- Atmosphere. Target the audience you want - keep it clean and friendly if you want younger gamers or older gamers with youngsters.
- Play your games. This should apply to the whole staff. Not only will it make the staff more knowledgeable about the games but teaching games to potential customers is a good way to sell.

Good luck!

valadil
2013-09-15, 11:37 AM
Cleanliness. The most popular game store in my area is the one that doesn't have gamer funk. I feel more incline to stick around and play for a while if I don't feel like I'll need a shower afterward.

This may sound condescending but when my wife can tell I visited a store because its scent is still on me, somethings wrong with the store. I feel like this will go a long way to making your store more inviting to people who are on the fence about going into a game store.

Also, I recommend listing to Fear the Boot. It's a podcast about RPGs. Some of the hosts run game shops and they've done a few episodes on the matter.

Zahhak
2013-09-15, 12:17 PM
I need to make a cheat sheet for hungry gamers to put by the phone with the local delivery places on it.

Seriously, this.

Some people have mentioned demo games for popular titles, but they're wrong. You need demo games for every title you expect to sell. After that time I spent $60 on a Call of the Cthulhu card game with a lot more rules then fun, I now openly refuse to buy any game I haven't played before. And seriously, what is a better way to make yourself look like a goat then have someone walk in and ask about your new releases, and have your staff not know about it because they've never played it before. Say you get new books on Wednesday. Wednesday evening, have some of your staff stay late and play a round of the new games, and put them up Thursday. Stuff gets released a day late, but the staff have an idea of how to play it, and they can get people to play a game if they aren't sure.

Also, have a good website. People that run bad websites, they go to hell. If your page isn't 100% intuitive with a professional look to it, I'm not going to your store. I have actually looked for a game store and made my selection for what store to go to simply because that one was the only one that seemed to be interested in having a decent website.

Segev
2013-09-15, 01:30 PM
If you're going to do anything gimmicky, and you also want to have people use your web site, you could have a "password of the day" on your site that, if people use it when they check out, you give a 5% discount or something to them. Whatever you think you could afford as a general "throw away" discount for customers who show a little extra dedication.

Alternatively, you could give away a free roll on a prize table or something.

I'm actually amused by one person's suggestion of having willing DMs wear cloaked robes in hooded corners. This would probably work better in an actual food-serving establishment, but I could see a "gamer's pub" who employed professional DMs who served as "mysterious figures." The players bypass the whole "how does the party get together?" by actually sitting down at the table and letting this mysterious individual tell them the quest he offers. And then he'll run it for them. Waiters/"bar maids" or what-have-you will take food and drink orders and treat it like a restaurant or pub for the business side.

Could be fun if it could be done profitably without being overbearing.

Mando Knight
2013-09-15, 01:47 PM
- Library. Have a game library of loaners, probably with some sort of membership or small fee to pay for the games. I've probably purchased half my games after playing them...so make sure you can get your library games in stock also.
Not just the game books, either, but also a decent collection of peripheral materials (so long as they're clearly marked as loaner materials) as well.

mrzomby
2013-09-15, 02:14 PM
The place I visit is right next door to a pizza joint that is pretty good, and an okay chinese restaurant. When there is an event going on all day, with like 40-60 of us, some won't remember to pack a lunch, and it is just much better for us if we don't need to go out for like 45 minutes just to get a sammich and soda.

There are events twice a week for just about each game there, and at least 4 people on staff who know any game, including many LAN games(there are a decent amount of computers there hooked up that can have CS 10 v 10 with some left over for moba/rts games)

Waxillium Lande
2013-09-15, 02:53 PM
Get good chairs. Make sure that the tables aren't uncomfortable to sit at. Don't have the room too cold or too hot. All of the little things that don't matter on their own really really add up.
Also, expand into Cleveland. We could really use a good game shop here.

tasw
2013-09-15, 05:26 PM
If you're going to do anything gimmicky, and you also want to have people use your web site, you could have a "password of the day" on your site that, if people use it when they check out, you give a 5% discount or something to them. Whatever you think you could afford as a general "throw away" discount for customers who show a little extra dedication.

Alternatively, you could give away a free roll on a prize table or something.

I'm actually amused by one person's suggestion of having willing DMs wear cloaked robes in hooded corners. This would probably work better in an actual food-serving establishment, but I could see a "gamer's pub" who employed professional DMs who served as "mysterious figures." The players bypass the whole "how does the party get together?" by actually sitting down at the table and letting this mysterious individual tell them the quest he offers. And then he'll run it for them. Waiters/"bar maids" or what-have-you will take food and drink orders and treat it like a restaurant or pub for the business side.

Could be fun if it could be done profitably without being overbearing.

its a niche idea so the pub would have to be really small, more a cafe but if you did it right i can see it becoming THE place that gamers hang out.

Honest Tiefling
2013-09-15, 05:33 PM
Cleanliness. The most popular game store in my area is the one that doesn't have gamer funk. I feel more incline to stick around and play for a while if I don't feel like I'll need a shower afterward.

This. I do the same thing in a different area. The one without gamer funk is open, airy, bright, and pleasant to be in rather then being stuck in a funky basement room.

The 'better' game store also has a lot of specialty and different snacks, through that might be more of a case of the area it is in.

However, I think you also need to make sure your events are friendly. When you buy a game (MTG, DnD, CoC, whatever) most of the time, you need people to play it with. If I feel like I can drop on in whenever, I'm more likely to try things and invest money in things that require others. Helpful and friendly staff is also a plus.

And really...Please do not be afraid to boot out creepy folks if they really start to do inappropriate things. People with too much BO that I can smell them across the room or hit on teenagers (When they are NOT teenagers) should likely get the boot.

RochtheCrusher
2013-09-15, 05:48 PM
My perfect gaming store would buy and sell the prepainted plastic minis that you have to buy in packs of 5 or more (Piazo, WotC, what have you). In addition to carrying the packs, it would give me half value on my extras and sell me the ones I actually want, loose, for a slight markup... like is done with Magic cards, I understand.

I currently have duplicates of several minis I will NEVER need duplicates of, and having a place to trade them in would be great. I doubt I'm alone in that.

Hamste
2013-09-15, 05:48 PM
Be careful with new card games. You can make a fortune off of them if they become a fad but they also have a tendency to die off soon. You do not want to have a ton of them on stock when they collapse. For example, Chaotic's packs have become very cheap lately as people seem to have lost interest.

As others have mentioned, do your research. If you are able to actually describe a game's general idea then you will be able to sell more.

Also certain Nerdy items will also give it a better mood and will make the place seem so much cooler. For example if you think D&D/fantasy games will be a big seller then you might want to get a few replica swords from a well known movie to hang on the wall behind the counter.

Remmirath
2013-09-15, 07:33 PM
The atmosphere of it is quite important if I'm intending on gaming there, but much less important if I'm only purchasing supplies. I had two gaming shops that were rather near to me -- one is still left and the other closed only quite recently.

The first one, which is still open, used to be a fairly cool place to go. It had a decent array of stuff that I want (to be detailed later on), it had helpful people, it has a nice big basement area with plenty of tables (albeit with some of the more uncomfortable chairs known to man), and they often hosted local roleplaying events as well as Magic events and such. Some years back, however, it changed quite a bit. The selection of stuff, particularly stuff that I want, has gone down. The atmosphere is somewhat hostile to actually gaming there, as the people who work there are always to be seen standing around and staring at a TV they have on the ceiling (this part is very odd to me). They still let you go down in the basement, but one gets the impression they'd rather you didn't. I believe they still host Magic events, but have seen no evidence of them still hosting roleplaying events. They were an example of a good store; now they are an example of what not to do.

The one that closed, on the other hand, had a somewhat worse supply of stuff than the other one used to have -- although better than it has now. Gaming there was great, because they were always quite welcoming, didn't mind if you stayed there a long time, and they were clearly interested in gaming and so forth. They were a bit lacking in tables (although the tables they had were well set up and had comfortable furniture), but that was the only problem there. I'd say they were a pretty good example.

What I most want to see in a gaming shop is a good selection of the sorts of things I'm going to want to buy every now and again: dice, figures/miniatures, paints and such for said figures, and that sort of thing. Gaming manuals are also pretty obvious. For me, it's a big plus if there's a substantial used section, because most of the games I'm most interested in can only be found in those sections these days. A small selection of board games is a nice plus. If they happened to stock computer games that would be awesome (though very unlikely), because almost nowhere where I live stocks them.

For gaming in the shop I just want an accessible, reasonably comfortable table. I don't mind if the staff come up and talk to us every now and then about the game we're playing, but if they just keep staring at us as though they would rather we weren't there it's off-putting. Having access to things such as drinking water and bathrooms is nice. The better, closed shop did have as a downside that the only snacks they sold were candy bars and the only drinks they sold were soda. I don't really want to eat or drink those things. Water, tea, or coffee being available would be swell, and being allowed to carry food in is I think the best for that problem.

A good website is a good thing to have. It's useful for advertising, it lets people know what's going on, and people may well find you through it.

I'd strongly advise not having animals. There's not an animal around that some people are not allergic to or afraid of. One gaming store I saw once had a dog. I turned around and walked away the moment it came up to the door, and that will happen with some people no matter what the animal is.

Savannah
2013-09-15, 08:19 PM
* Some kind of bulletin board for players looking for a group and groups looking for players to post flyers. (Of course, you'd probably want some sort of legal disclaimer that you haven't personally vetted these people and use caution when meeting strangers, etc.)

* I don't want to be surrounded by scantly clad boobs and butts. I accept that sexist eye candy isn't going to disappear from gaming artwork anytime soon, but you don't have to make it worse by plastering the walls with posters.

* I don't want to be treated differently by staff because I happen to be a woman who games.

* A large collection of decent quality loose dice in all different sizes and patterns. Some characters need 10+ color-coded d6s.

* My perfect shop would have 3.5 splats at a decent price. This one may not be doable :smalltongue:

valadil
2013-09-15, 08:31 PM
Here's a thought. Some sort of online presence. I don't think it would be realistic for a game store to have its own forum, but a Facebook page is low hanging fruit and would go a long way for community building.

Savannah
2013-09-15, 08:45 PM
Oh, also a non-Facebook webpage. Some of us avoid social media but still want to check your hours and location :smalltongue:

Matre
2013-09-16, 03:22 AM
Sorry if this includes repeats of things that other people said.

-Have a proper, updated website. I need to be able to tell when you're open, how to get there, and how to contact you. The way that I even find gaming establishments is online searches that include the name of the city and some combination of "tabletop gaming store", and I don't know why, but way too many establishments don't have a decent webfront.

-On the aforementioned website, have a calendar. If I don't know what you're doing when, I'm not going to show up. Keep it updated with events, both consistent (FNM) and inconsistent (launches of products, special deal days, etc)

-Have deals and sales, but market them. The store closest to my house has, no jokes, an un-advertised "10% off" sale that goes on all the time. That is to say, everything is listed at a price, and then you get to the register, and you are told that that item is actually 10% off. Some things (namely magic cards) when brought to the register, are claimed to already have the discount, and for these items the listed price is apparently correct. There are about a dozen reasons that this is terrible, and as I numerically categorize them in my head, I start to get a headache, so I'll just say that if you have deals, make them known through your website or a bulletin board (ideally both).

-Store credit is AWESOME for the store. It's like you had to give someone something, and now you don't, and you retain the value of whatever you could have given them, and they may never even claim it. The 10% store I mentioned apparently disallowed store credit because people were "taking advantage of it", and they were owing people in the range of $200. That is crazy talk. Try getting zero percent loans from a bank: they won't do it because lending money like that loses them money because of inflation.

valadil
2013-09-16, 08:14 AM
-On the aforementioned website, have a calendar. If I don't know what you're doing when, I'm not going to show up. Keep it updated with events, both consistent (FNM) and inconsistent (launches of products, special deal days, etc)


Not just a plain text calendar, but something I can import into my calendar. An embedded Google calendar would be perfect.

Alejandro
2013-09-16, 09:16 AM
Have a small, special chart at the register. Every time someone makes a purchase, let them roll percentile dice to see if they have a 'random encounter.' If they do (you can set the chance at whatever you like, just be consistent) then have a small table they can roll on to see what small 'treasure' they've obtained, like a free d6 or a candy bar, etc. :)

Krazzman
2013-09-16, 09:21 AM
Ok what I disliked about the gamestore we had and what I liked was the people in both terms.

I totally hated it that you could play there but also be interrupted by other gamers.
The Light was for me ok, it was a clean and bright light similar to office light, be eyefriendly in this point.
Broaden your stuff up so that you can deliver a wide margin of people. The Game shop had Mangas and stuff in the entry shop and the cards, miniatures and roleplay stuff down below. They had painting events, had paints, glue and miniatures and all the stuff needed there so if you missed a color you could resupply. They were friendly and would often joke with you and had some refreshments as well as a subway right next to them and a pizza delivery they used for when they had events.

The things I absolutely hated were the other guys and in retrospec their minimalistic take on refreshments (ie they mostly had the usual softdrinks). In a certain way I would definitly now say you have to broaden up in this regard and have vegan, vegetarian and normal softdrinks (coke for example wasn't vegetarian until recently afaik). So that even guys with allergies or a certain believe aren't left out of your "refreshment" consumer base.

Testreading only helps this much. What I hated was that the Gamestore ditched every 3.5 book in favor of the 4th edition books. And seriously they had a minimal collection of them even before 4th edition launched. I never saw a Comp Champion, Phb 2, or Comp Mage in their store. Not even ToB or MoI or similar books. I think their latest book was the four Comp War, Arc, Div and Adv. Albeit having nearly half a shelf full of DSA crap.

Have the starterkits for editions there to read, like PF Bestiary 1 and CRB and the 4th Edition Starter kit (and the DnD Next starterkit or similar) so people can go in but have advertisement for upcoming rulebooks and such there too.

Hope this helps as a starting point. Also separate rooms for DnD groups are awesome but don't go on their nerves and don't doublebook them. But also have some tables be in the "open" for Testplays that should be open so others can see them too and so on.

Alejandro
2013-09-16, 09:31 AM
The things I absolutely hated were the other guys and in retrospec their minimalistic take on refreshments (ie they mostly had the usual softdrinks). In a certain way I would definitly now say you have to broaden up in this regard and have vegan, vegetarian and normal softdrinks (coke for example wasn't vegetarian until recently afaik). So that even guys with allergies or a certain believe aren't left out of your "refreshment" consumer base.

Wow, that's the first time I have ever heard of people worrying about whether or not Coke was vegetarian. I always assumed if someone cared enough about their health to try vegetarianism, one of the first things they'd do is stop drinking soda. :)

I'm not sure enough American gaming store customers would care whether or not you had vegan offerings.

Logic
2013-09-16, 09:39 AM
Have a small, special chart at the register. Every time someone makes a purchase, let them roll percentile dice to see if they have a 'random encounter.' If they do (you can set the chance at whatever you like, just be consistent) then have a small table they can roll on to see what small 'treasure' they've obtained, like a free d6 or a candy bar, etc. :)

I actually like this idea. It's a silly gimmick, but I don't know how I would like to pay for it's implementation.

The gaming store I frequented most (before I moved)

PROS:
*TONS of gaming space.
*A nice amount of shelf space
*A friendly and knowledgeable staff

CONS:
*Dice selection was medium-minimal (I have a very specific method of buying dice, bordering on OCD)
*Catered to a younger crowd with Magic TG and Pokemon tournaments (this is a con for me, though I know it would be fine for most.)
*Wargaming focused (this is only a con because I don't wargame.)
*Minimal copies of the products I was interested in buying. I always walked out with what I wanted, but often had to wait because there was usually only 2-3 on the shelf at any one time, and sometimes they were all in the hands of browsers.
*Moderately bad location (difficult parking, somewhat hard to get to, and in a semi-bad neighborhood)

I have been to a new store near my new home, but it has less space, worse dice selection, less knowledgeable staff, free wifi (I have never needed this before, but it seems this is a must for some) a better location all around, and plenty of product.

I hope this helps.

Mando Knight
2013-09-16, 11:59 AM
In a certain way I would definitly now say you have to broaden up in this regard and have vegan, vegetarian and normal softdrinks (coke for example wasn't vegetarian until recently afaik).

Wow, that's the first time I have ever heard of people worrying about whether or not Coke was vegetarian.
That's because it never had animal product or by-product as an ingredient, so far as I know. Caramel is derived from sugar (generally extracted from plants), and there are no animal-derived flavors (all known flavorings to the drink, dating back to a journal attributed to the inventor, John Pemberton, are derived from plants).

Some other products from the Coca-Cola company, mostly those with an orange color, have small amounts of fish gelatin to help stabilize the beta-carotene used for coloring. There may be a minor concern about machinery being used for multiple products getting a trace amount of a trace amount into your drink, but at that point I think I'd be just as concerned about everything else in the fridge.

valadil
2013-09-16, 12:17 PM
I always assumed if someone cared enough about their health to try vegetarianism, one of the first things they'd do is stop drinking soda.

Not everyone goes veggie for health reasons.

I like the inclusive attitude of the vegan food option ideas, but this is a game store, not a restaurant. Keeping people in the store longer is a good thing, but if you have sacrifice the M:tG counter to make way for the sandwich shop people won't have a reason to enter your store in the first place. Unless they want a sandwich.

Anyway, how much food you go with should probably depend on what else is in the area. If your store is is downtown and space is limited, but you're down the block from a Store 24 and three burger joints, how much food you stock will be different than if you're in the middle of nowhere and have all the space in the world.

Mando Knight
2013-09-16, 01:22 PM
Anyway, how much food you go with should probably depend on what else is in the area. If your store is is downtown and space is limited, but you're down the block from a Store 24 and three burger joints, how much food you stock will be different than if you're in the middle of nowhere and have all the space in the world.

Yeah. The typical route I've seen in game shops I've been in is to stock the "basics" (that is, a fridge of various caffeinated soft drinks) and some market-specific snacks (i.e. Pocky). Food purchased at a game store is almost always an impulse buy, but it's tangential to the main product, so don't overstock or it'll just waste your money and counter space.

jedipotter
2013-09-16, 02:48 PM
Also, expand into Cleveland. We could really use a good game shop here.

Where around ''Cleveland''? Is not Warzone still there by the airport?

Honest Tiefling
2013-09-16, 02:53 PM
The store I go to technically doesn't allow outside food, but people in games or who have bought something are usually allowed to bring in food as long as they aren't messy. Might be preferable, since that way people can still get food (And more variety) without sacrificing game space or products.

Thinker
2013-09-16, 03:26 PM
Some ideas for events:
Minis painting night - Paint miniatures as a group. If you have any friends who are talented at this, it would be great if they could help you with showing people good techniques. Maybe make some paint available for free, but they have to buy the minis. If it is a hit you can do it once every two weeks or month.
Board games night - Play board games that are available at the shop. It helps you and your staff learn the games and also lets people demo them with people available to play. Maybe rotate a different game or games every week.
TCG tournaments - You already covered this, but I wanted to mention it for the sake of completeness.
Warhammer night - Encourage people to play Warhammer/WH40K. Have loaner rule books, measuring string, and terrain available.
Fantasy Day - A day devoted to fantasy games.
SciFi Day - A day devoted to SciFi games.


I think that the more events you can come up with the better. If people think of your shop and think, "I wonder what's going on over at Tyndmyr's tonight," they're more likely to stop by.

I also think you should look for sponsors for your various game days. I'm not sure about an appropriate fee, but they can boost your revenue and all it costs you is saying, "Welcome to Fantasy Day brought to you by Papa John's." and then handing out some coupons.

Good luck. I may look up your store sometime if you share its name with us (I live in Northern VA).

Mordar
2013-09-16, 04:31 PM
Other people have talked about the stock/playspace issues, as well as "knowledge of the games you sell" so I'm going to jump on my favorite topic:

Staff and environment.


Make sure everyone who works there is friendly and approachable. If you haven't built up a customer base, nametags help. I want to go to a gaming shop and see people who look like they want to be there.


Cleanliness. The most popular game store in my area is the one that doesn't have gamer funk. I feel more incline to stick around and play for a while if I don't feel like I'll need a shower afterward.

This may sound condescending but when my wife can tell I visited a store because its scent is still on me, somethings wrong with the store. I feel like this will go a long way to making your store more inviting to people who are on the fence about going into a game store.

I want to echo these and push a couple of steps further...

Staff should be clearly and immediately identifiable, friendly (to *everyone*) and just-the-right-amount of engaging. To my mind, and the clear policies of major/profitable retail ventures, this includes:


"Uniforms" - In this case, just shirts. I recommend polo shirts in any color other than black*, and always clean;
Employee habits - Absolutely no smoking or eating in view of patrons or the door;
Hygiene - Staff must be clean and offensive odor-free


I recommend providing staff the "uniform" if at all possible (again, shirts only), and in sufficient number that they don't have to do laundry every night or two. Not always an easy thing to do, I know.

In my opinion you must appeal to casual customers, and (very important!) moms and gift-buyers. They will pay your bills. Many if not most "gamers" will be buying the lion's share of their merchandise from online discounters and PDF services, relying on your store for occasional fill-in and impulse buys, so the hardcore niche might well not be carrying the revenue load you think they will. Having a clean and "professional" staff that is approachable to the soccer mom who wants to spend money for that card game her 12-year-old plays is very important in this regard.

Additionally, that mom must trust the staff and location if they are going to let Johnny and Susie stay there for that event you mentioned...and become cardflopping addicts hobbyists that are the building block of your $3.95 per transaction empire.

Being the place where the stereotypical "bad gamer" comes to hang out for 4 hours before or after their shift at [insert non-traditional business hour location here, far too frequently fast-food] is disadvantageous and keeps out both those of us who hate being around "bad gamer" and the significant number of non-gamers-looking-to-buy-things-for gamers.

This is magnified by those who paint their conversation with foul language at every opportunity, trying to show just how edgy they want to be...and nothing clears a room of disposable mom dollars (and the repeat business) as fast as a bunch of f-bombs from the locals.

This means physical environment controls (temperature, ventilation, air freshening system (automatic if possible, manual if not) and regular attention to tidying up as well as controlling the regulars.

It also means that staff must be able to "manage" the "regulars" so they are not a distraction or barrier to communication with customers.

Recognizing that "mainstream" customers will be easily intimidated by the variety of inventory and reluctant to express their fear, staff has to actively make them welcome and be helpful (within boundaries)...and they really can't do that while having a detailed conversation about the latest feat combo, CCG internet deck template or "let me tell you about my character" story. This might be the toughest thing to do, particularly when we know how so many of us gamers (self included) relish the opportunity to "talk shop" with people who get it. It's darn tough for the mom or dad who just popped in for son/daughter's birthday to interrupt with questions, so staff must be extra-vigilant in this regard.

Going the "extra" mile (that isn't "extra" in places like Walgreens, Target, local non-chain clothing stores or virtually anywhere other than game/video game stores, crappy tattoo and piercing parlors and comic book stores) makes someone like me...and more importantly, my significant other - one of the aforementioned mom's looking to buy for kids - MUCH more likely to stay and buy, and come back again.

Best of luck to you!

- M

* - It is an off-putting color for mainstream shoppers, and far too frequently is thought to hide stains it really doesn't...bright and clean for retail.

Lorsa
2013-09-16, 04:42 PM
I'll give more personal thoughts later on but I just wanted to quickly say that in a local game shop here they sometimes have Magic the Gathering drafts using this formula:

Everybody buys 3 boosters each, then gets divided into tables set up as evenly as possible (I guess about 8-10 people each?). There are usually 3 rounds which will determine the ranking per table. At the end, everybody throws in all the rares drafted and then they get chosen in ranking order but the first one gets to take her/his second pick after the 3rd placer. So the order will be: 1,2,3,1,4,5,etc,2,3,4,5,etc,1,2,3,etc until all the rares are chosen. All other cards (common and uncommon) are kept by the person who drafted them. So you get to keep all your drafted cards minus the rares but instead get to choose rares according to your position.

So in the end you get to go home with cards equal to 3 boosters (just not random) which was what you paid for! It is very popular usually, when I've beeen there it's been some 20-30 people there, which I think is a lot considering the tiny town I live in.

CombatOwl
2013-09-16, 04:54 PM
So, I've started a game shop recently. Now, most of you are probably too far away to drop by...but not too far to give me precious ideas.

Now, obviously, I've already stocked the OOTS comics :smallbiggrin:, but what else makes a game shop great, and gives it that proper feel where you want to sit down and have a game there? What are the things you love about your local shops, and what drives you nuts?

If I might suggest: something that's hard to setup in homes, like a few large (and correctly-textured) tables with ceiling-mounted projectors aimed at the table--if you can get the lighting to work right for it. They don't need to be amazing quality for map projection, and not that hard to setup on drop ceilings.

The local FLGS has such a setup, and it seems to get a fair amount of use.

Perhaps some sort of arrangement for renting a high quality photo-lithographic 3d printer, if enough of your customers had an interest in printing their own minis or game pieces. If you have a significant homebrew gaming community there might well be a lot of interest for that. Or maybe none at all, it would kind of depend. It would have to be one of the ones that can do good detail on the 30mm scale though--a significant investment. OTOH, it might be another source of income anyway, since there's interest beyond gamers for them.

Zahhak
2013-09-16, 05:36 PM
You could do a theme night once a month (someone posted a lot of ideas further up). Horror themed in October, and such.

JusticeZero
2013-09-16, 06:59 PM
Security and friendliness issue: Try to make sure that everyone who comes through the door gets a "hello". Most consider it friendly, but it also keeps staff on top of who is coming and going to reduce shrinkage. Thieves hate to interact with staff as a rule.

Be conscientious about your bookkeeping. I'm a fan of having the numbers transparent to staff as well, because extra eyes and it gets them more involved. But keeping on top of your inventory and figures is very important.

tasw
2013-09-16, 07:18 PM
Another thought, if you have good foot traffic at your location have a backyard style BBQ during high traffic hours and your events.

For the average red blooded american nothing gets people moving towards you like the smell of a good grilled hotdog or hamburger. It will draw people in as they walk by to the front of your store (where they would of course see what your doing in there....advertisement) be a source of good snacks for the gamers and dollars all around.

Even selling at a buck a dog and with decent hotdogs you can turn a fair profit selling dogs, the burgers would have to be 2$ to do the same and you'd have to make sure you weigh the meat right for your profit ratio but its definitely do-able. And some of the shoppers that stop for a hot dog for the kids (target the kids) will ask what your store sells giving you a chance to pitch your store to the SO and soccer moms mentioned upthread as a place to get little Johnny those magic or yugi-oh cards he's always asking for.

Fable Wright
2013-09-16, 07:25 PM
-Have a proper, updated website. I need to be able to tell when you're open, how to get there, and how to contact you. The way that I even find gaming establishments is online searches that include the name of the city and some combination of "tabletop gaming store", and I don't know why, but way too many establishments don't have a decent webfront.

-On the aforementioned website, have a calendar. If I don't know what you're doing when, I'm not going to show up. Keep it updated with events, both consistent (FNM) and inconsistent (launches of products, special deal days, etc)

-Store credit is AWESOME for the store. It's like you had to give someone something, and now you don't, and you retain the value of whatever you could have given them, and they may never even claim it. The 10% store I mentioned apparently disallowed store credit because people were "taking advantage of it", and they were owing people in the range of $200. That is crazy talk. Try getting zero percent loans from a bank: they won't do it because lending money like that loses them money because of inflation.
This. All of the this. Don't necessarily add in a google calender or other gimmick, but you need some way of knowing what event's going on at what time to get a decent market base.

And to reiterate the point of store credit: It's the best system for tournament payout. If you offer, say, 4 dollars of store credit for an M:tG booster packs, for example, and have a decent selection of singles up front, it will help you keep a strong player base. They want to save up the credit for the big cards, and don't want to use cash. This means people will show up repeatedly to save up for the big cards. And, since the store credit is equivalent to the prize payout anyways, you're not losing profit at all.


Everybody buys 3 boosters each, then gets divided into tables set up as evenly as possible (I guess about 8-10 people each?). There are usually 3 rounds which will determine the ranking per table. At the end, everybody throws in all the rares drafted and then they get chosen in ranking order but the first one gets to take her/his second pick after the 3rd placer. So the order will be: 1,2,3,1,4,5,etc,2,3,4,5,etc,1,2,3,etc until all the rares are chosen. All other cards (common and uncommon) are kept by the person who drafted them. So you get to keep all your drafted cards minus the rares but instead get to choose rares according to your position.

So in the end you get to go home with cards equal to 3 boosters (just not random) which was what you paid for! It is very popular usually, when I've beeen there it's been some 20-30 people there, which I think is a lot considering the tiny town I live in.
Rare redraft. :smallyuk:

It's fine if the store isn't running the event and people are just pitching in, but paying $3 more than the price of 3 packs for a proper prize payout in booster packs or store credit makes it a much more rewarding experience when you win. Plus, if you opened a foil <insert chase mythic here>, you want to play and keep him, not have to fork him over if you're not a competitive enough player. Speaking of prize payout: While I can respect the prize packs equal to your wins method that you're doing, as it gets everyone their money's worth or more, consider paying out 4-3-2-2-1 or 5-4-2-1 for an 8-man pod. Two to three people get one fewer pack, but it adds a bit more of a competitive edge for the top slots, and it lets people feel free to drop if they go 0-2 if they have something better to do.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-16, 07:41 PM
Not everyone goes veggie for health reasons.

I like the inclusive attitude of the vegan food option ideas, but this is a game store, not a restaurant. Keeping people in the store longer is a good thing, but if you have sacrifice the M:tG counter to make way for the sandwich shop people won't have a reason to enter your store in the first place. Unless they want a sandwich.

Anyway, how much food you go with should probably depend on what else is in the area. If your store is is downtown and space is limited, but you're down the block from a Store 24 and three burger joints, how much food you stock will be different than if you're in the middle of nowhere and have all the space in the world.

Had not considered the vegetarian option...I didn't even realize that was a concern for sodas, as it never occurred to me that meat products might be in the sodas. Well, except for the bacon flavored one, obviously.

Lots of good responses here...as for lighting, I've got a single nighttime shot of the store from in front, before most of the banners and stock and what not went in. Many of the exterior lights are timered, so as to not waste power during the day, but keep it looking not-sketchy at night.

http://cardboardgaming.com/images/lighting.jpg

The spotlights don't come on to a bit later, but mostly, they just shine on banner areas anyway, so they don't add significant light to the interior. The door on the left leads to the gaming area, the right, to the retail portion(they're also connected inside, of course). Hopefully that gives a good idea of the light levels.

On pets: Sadly, I'm very allergic to cats. I like 'em, but I like breathing more, so other gimmicks are definitely preferable.

Snacks/glass case:

http://cardboardgaming.com/images/glasscase.jpg

I'm a terrible photographer, so I mostly cut off the bottom stuff. There's like, a dozen types of chip-like products(including fritos and cheetos in here), and some sodas. Canned sodas are a little weak, with only Mt Dew and Diet Dr Pepper down there, but bottled sodas are stronger, with Mexican Coke, all five flavors of Bawls, Big Red, Vampire Blood(strawberry), and Smoked Maple Bacon Chocolate Soda. There is also water and arizona iced tea. Suggestions for improving the selection is good(we've got excellent cabinet and fridge space, so no worries there). I'm informed that the lack of Three Musketeers is dire, so that's already on the list. Maaaybe popcorn packets. We have a microwave, so logistically, it's easy. Just not sure if making the whole place smell like popcorn, or worse, burnt popcorn if someone is careless, is a plus. Allowing outside food isn't a big concern, if people want to bring it in, no problem. There's a large number of food places within a mile or two, but none within a convenient walk.

Cleveland is sadly a long ways away, but I wish you luck! Who knows, perhaps one day you or one of your friends might open a shop and fill the need!

Parking: We've got our own surface parking lot, with 11 dedicated spots anytime of the day or night. In addition, we have dibs on the parking lot next to us whenever they are not open. They're not open after five weekdays or anytime on weekends, so in practice, we have a lot more.

Comics: I actually like comics a lot, but they're strange business wise. Hard to dabble in. A single distributor, Diamond, essentially has a monopoly on the industry(including DC and Marvel), and prices scale with how much you buy. Thus, carrying a few comics is very hard to do well/profitably. Now, gaming-style comics like OOTS that are carried by gaming distributors are an exception, and OOTS is popular here.



I think that the more events you can come up with the better. If people think of your shop and think, "I wonder what's going on over at Tyndmyr's tonight," they're more likely to stop by.

Oh, I fully agree...but I also want them to be kind of awesome events. A lot of stores sort of half ass it. A certain night is declared "board game night", but no further work is done, so if you actually show up that night, there may be nobody else there to play with. I think the dead events like that might actually be worse than no events, because they result in disappointment. So far, I've got my PF group on weds, a PF society game on mondays, friday night magic, and a friday night 3.5 group. All those are real, attended events, but that definitely still leaves some dead nights. Gotta find the pockets of gamers interested in other stuff, and arrange something.



Good luck. I may look up your store sometime if you share its name with us (I live in Northern VA).

Would be nifty, for sure, name's CardBoard Gaming(should be easy enough to find on facebook).

Internets: I've got facebook/G+/twitter down(or rather, I got a friend who loves social media to nail those down and keep them updated), the website is still in progress. Got a blog-like news feed running, but we need to do the rest of the work to build a proper site. Stuff like forums are not hard technically, but they don't do much until you have enough traffic for them to be active. As for internet in store, I originally thought I could get by without it. Based on suggestions, I gave Verizon a call, should have wi-fi set up tomorrow. Everyone I've mentioned this too thought it was a great idea, so cheers!

Staff/Uniforms: Right now, staff is mostly me, my fiance, and a couple other fellow geeks that invested money in the venture. No real uniform yet, other than "neat and clean if you're running the register", but I would love to order logo'd polos. I liked the old yellow and black style of games workshop, but I think they've switched styles since then, and I can't seem to find a similar pattern. They're good peoples, though. We all have regular, professional jobs when we're not working at the shop. It's fortunate that the local class of geek includes many who are not the messy, scary kind of geek.

We do have an automated HVAC system, but it hasn't yet been stress tested with a full shop of gamers, so if that turns out to be a problem, I might have to add a window unit.


If I might suggest: something that's hard to setup in homes, like a few large (and correctly-textured) tables with ceiling-mounted projectors aimed at the table--if you can get the lighting to work right for it. They don't need to be amazing quality for map projection, and not that hard to setup on drop ceilings.

The local FLGS has such a setup, and it seems to get a fair amount of use.

I believe the current DM from the friday group actually has been experimenting with a projector. I need to find the details of that, but I *think* right now it's used to project plot details(images mainly) on the wall, along with a custom init app.



Perhaps some sort of arrangement for renting a high quality photo-lithographic 3d printer, if enough of your customers had an interest in printing their own minis or game pieces. If you have a significant homebrew gaming community there might well be a lot of interest for that. Or maybe none at all, it would kind of depend. It would have to be one of the ones that can do good detail on the 30mm scale though--a significant investment. OTOH, it might be another source of income anyway, since there's interest beyond gamers for them.

Oddly enough, I own multiple 3d printers. I haven't combined the two interests yet, but I suppose having a printer in shop cranking out minis could at least be a curiosity.


Security and friendliness issue: Try to make sure that everyone who comes through the door gets a "hello". Most consider it friendly, but it also keeps staff on top of who is coming and going to reduce shrinkage. Thieves hate to interact with staff as a rule.

Be conscientious about your bookkeeping. I'm a fan of having the numbers transparent to staff as well, because extra eyes and it gets them more involved. But keeping on top of your inventory and figures is very important.

We're fortunate to have a police station across the road...now, that doesn't prevent shrinkage, but I figure it can't hurt security wise. Plus, video and security systems, and the whole retail space is visible from the counter in addition to the usual friendliness.

Bookkeeping is something of a bear. I've been trying to keep it all on google docs so everyone involved can see it, and there's some transparency with our orders and what not, but I fear that there's just a giant pile of it, and some people don't even care to look at it, so I don't know how much it's helping me in the end.

Phew, that got long, but I definitely appreciate all the ideas!

valadil
2013-09-16, 08:15 PM
Oh, you should also post your store's name/location here. No idea if I'll ever be in Maryland but I'm sure I'm not the only one who would pop in and say hello given the opportunity.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-16, 08:53 PM
Oh, you should also post your store's name/location here. No idea if I'll ever be in Maryland but I'm sure I'm not the only one who would pop in and say hello given the opportunity.

Sure,
CardBoard Gaming
8274 Telegraph Rd, Hanover MD.

My rl name's Travis, so if you pop by, ask if I'm in. :smallsmile:

Felhammer
2013-09-16, 11:16 PM
You have to think about the kind of games you want to sell and make space for. Appealing to 40k gamers is very different than appealing to card gamers. The former needs larger (6x4) tables raised up to above waist height. Card gamers need much less space per game but more tables since there tends to be more of them. Roleplayers and Card Gamers like chairs with backs, Wargamers tend to favor tall chairs or stools. Board gamers can easily prefer either, depending on what they are playing.

One of my biggest pet peeves is table space. I generally want to be able to walk in and find a table for a game I want to play right away. I don't want to have to wait for a free table. Tables should be free to use unless you plan on playing a marathon game of D&D or Risk (anything past 4 hours of play time is a bit excessive).

Another pet peeve is bag space. There needs to be a good system for where people put there bags, especially when you start getting into the 100 point Warmachine and Apocalypse-sized 40k games. Many of the best tables I've seen have a shelving unit under the table to store bags, an under slung shelf to store dice/miniatures and an extra foot on each game table that can be used for set up.

For RPGs, I generally prefer to be segregated away from the store, be it behind curtains or walls. I simply loathe onlookers (unless we are playing a D&D Encounters game (which is all about advertising)).

I prefer the store and the play area to be separated as best as one can manage. There should be at least enough space between tables and products on the shelves to comfortably allow a person to sit facing away from the wall and another person to browse, without either feeling squished.

A lot of people are going to push to be the "nerd mecca" but, to be honest, that isn't incredibly successful outside of really big cities. Why would a comic lover buy comics from a game shop, which will never rival the diversity of a true comic shop? There are just too many comics out there now-a-days to maintain a reasonable stock that will consistently sell (print comics are slowly dieing). Now where there is a good chance to make solid sales is TPBs. Those cost a bit more, give people a real taste of a story line and take up much less space than an ever growing plethora of floppies. Of course if you are from an area that does not have a local comic shop, then definitely tap that market. Selling a few novels associated with your other games (D&D, Pathfinder, Warhammer, 40k, Magic, etc.) can net you a consistent, though small, profit.

Lighting is key. Don't make a dungeon. Air on the side of too bright than not bright enough. Try to use natural light as much as possible.

Keep the place heated and air conditioned.

Keep lots of air fresheners handy, especially during tournies and clean your bathroom once a week (at least).

Staff should be nice and knowledgeable.

Host regular events. In the beginning, make them "big events" by offering big prizes for first place, as well as smaller stuff for raffles. You will generate a lot of buzz and good will. When you do run tournaments, don't skim too much of the proceedings. The most successful stores I have been to take nothing and pile it all into prizes. Those stores have the most consistent and largest player bases whom all pile more and more money into product to prep for those tournies.

Diversity of offerings is great and try to develop communities to support each game. If a game weakens in terms of people playing, talk to the players and find out why. 9 times out of 10 it is a single person ruining everyone else's fun.

Clearly state the code of conduct for the store and post it. Do not tolerate sexism, even if the target seems to be enjoying it. Turning a blind eye to bad behavior only makes that behavior grow.

The walls should be tastefully littered with paraphernalia that represents the products you sell. The classier, the better.

Get facebook and twitter and foster a community. Do not make forums. Eliminate any and all Drama. Post lots and lots of pictures of people having fun playing the games you sell. Make sure to post your weekly schedule and keep it updated.

Digitize your inventory and use scanners. It'll really help you keep tabs on what is hot, what isn't and when things are selling best.

jedipotter
2013-09-16, 11:44 PM
Security and friendliness issue: Try to make sure that everyone who comes through the door gets a "hello". Most consider it friendly, but it also keeps staff on top of who is coming and going to reduce shrinkage. Thieves hate to interact with staff as a rule.

Oh do I hate this. The people that run Best Buy and Radio Shack must have read that ''Asomeo Ways to Stop Thieves'' book too.... I hate that friendly hello, and worse the friendly I will stay within one foot of you to make sure you don't steal criminal. I only go to this type of store once, unless the place is ''friendly'' enough to never ever speak to me again.

Though I do think a enforcer to escort the minors is a good idea. Them poor, innocent kids might get hurt by a falling book or a mini with a sharp point. So an enforcer escort that will physically keep one hand on the minor's shoulder at all times is a good idea. But you need to limit their browsing time to like five minutes, with something like a giant hour glass. After that time they must make a purchase or be escorted to the isolated, sound proofed and locked minor area.

Felhammer
2013-09-16, 11:54 PM
Oh do I hate this. The people that run Best Buy and Radio Shack must have read that ''Asomeo Ways to Stop Thieves'' book too.... I hate that friendly hello, and worse the friendly I will stay within one foot of you to make sure you don't steal criminal. I only go to this type of store once, unless the place is ''friendly'' enough to never ever speak to me again.

Though I do think a enforcer to escort the minors is a good idea. Them poor, innocent kids might get hurt by a falling book or a mini with a sharp point. So an enforcer escort that will physically keep one hand on the minor's shoulder at all times is a good idea. But you need to limit their browsing time to like five minutes, with something like a giant hour glass. After that time they must make a purchase or be escorted to the isolated, sound proofed and locked minor area.

I know a few people who work at Best Buy. They actually stay right on top of you because it statistically generates far more sales.

erikun
2013-09-17, 12:31 AM
Please note: I don't go to gaming stores that often. I haven't participated in any in-store RPG events, and just go their to look at titles and make purchases. As such, my shopping preferences may be odd compared to others. However, what I'd expect to see is:

Website. I expect the website to give me a good idea of what the store is about by just glancing at the front page. In addition, I want to be able to find a "Contact Us" or similar link off the front page, along with some information about how to find the store. All the information should be correct, and the phone number should have someone answering it who can give me some information.

If I can't find the store, I'm not going. If I can't find when it's open, I'm likely not to make the trip. If I can't get ahold of anyone in the store by phone, I'll assume that the store isn't open and won't go.

Business cards. When I'm leaving a new store, I'd like a little something to remind me of the place. It doesn't have to be important, it doesn't have to be fancy, but just a stack of business cards by the register is nice.

Clean. I can't really stress this enough, but keeping the place clean and avoiding the funk is pretty critical. Nobody really wants to go someplace that smells bad, and if there are other stores that they could visit, they'll probably go there.

Variety. I do not play D&D all that much anymore. I hardly ever buy D&D books, so if the store only has D&D3e, D&D4e, and Pathfinder, I won't even bother coming back to browse. On the other hand, if it has a lot of different systems, then I'm more likely to show back up to see what's new.

Speaking of which, reading/previewing (within reason) is something I very much prefer. RPG books these days cost $50 or more for the core book, and so being able to leaf through it to see if it's the kind of system you're interested in is important. It's one of the reasons I shop at Barnes & Noble, and it's one of the reasons I visit the two local game stores I do.


About the only other thing that I'll note is that, at the one game shop, they had a free play game day of sorts, where people could sit down and play some of the games in the store. I played Settlers of Catan, at least enough to know I didn't like the game and wasn't interested in buying it. :smalltongue: But it did give me a favorable view of the store, and I did eventually buy a Pathfinder adventure line from the store because of it.

Forrestfire
2013-09-17, 01:52 AM
Firstly, I'd like to wish you the best of luck! There have been a lot of really great ideas in this thread, so my advice on the matter mostly boils down to echoing the things said about friendly staff (especially family friendly. It may annoy some people to not have gratuitous cursing allowed in the store, but in the end it's the moms with kids who are probably doing a good amount of the purchases).


I'll give more personal thoughts later on but I just wanted to quickly say that in a local game shop here they sometimes have Magic the Gathering drafts using this formula:

Everybody buys 3 boosters each, then gets divided into tables set up as evenly as possible (I guess about 8-10 people each?). There are usually 3 rounds which will determine the ranking per table. At the end, everybody throws in all the rares drafted and then they get chosen in ranking order but the first one gets to take her/his second pick after the 3rd placer. So the order will be: 1,2,3,1,4,5,etc,2,3,4,5,etc,1,2,3,etc until all the rares are chosen. All other cards (common and uncommon) are kept by the person who drafted them. So you get to keep all your drafted cards minus the rares but instead get to choose rares according to your position.

So in the end you get to go home with cards equal to 3 boosters (just not random) which was what you paid for! It is very popular usually, when I've beeen there it's been some 20-30 people there, which I think is a lot considering the tiny town I live in.

And please, for the love of god, don't do this. Rare redrafts are toxic to the hobby, and carry a good chance of causing new players to not draft again. The scenario favors the people who are already good at drafting, allowing them to essentially open a box and take the money cards for the price of 3 packs each. I've seen too many "little timmies" decide to draft, pull an awesome card, and then leave disheartened and not return because their titan/planeswalker/whatever mythic they pulled was taken by the people who went to the draft to win.

If you draft magic (and if you sell magic, you should, because it's a great way to get people into the game and to sell packs), just charges a little extra and have that cover prize support.

Lorsa
2013-09-17, 02:48 AM
Rare redraft. :smallyuk:

I can tell you don't like it. But for a more casual/crappy gamer it is very preferable as you get to go home with something. Yes it's true that the only benefit to winning is that you get to choose that foiled rare-something you wanted but on the other hand you might attract more people that wouldn't come to something where they know they'll just pay for cards for this dude that always wins. I suppose variation is good.


And please, for the love of god, don't do this. Rare redrafts are toxic to the hobby, and carry a good chance of causing new players to not draft again. The scenario favors the people who are already good at drafting, allowing them to essentially open a box and take the money cards for the price of 3 packs each. I've seen too many "little timmies" decide to draft, pull an awesome card, and then leave disheartened and not return because their titan/planeswalker/whatever mythic they pulled was taken by the people who went to the draft to win.

I suppose there are advantages to everything. I never won and still thought it was worthwhile to go since if I'm not the best player I probably don't really care that much about that specific card. People are different I guess.

valadil
2013-09-17, 08:26 AM
I would like employees to be knowledgable without trying to sell me anything. If I tell them I need a break from D&D and ask for rules light systems, I'd want to hear about a few different options. I don't expect the person to have played all those options, but they should have some conversational knowledge or can point me towards someone who has run some of those games.

And I'd want them to not guilt me if I don't take them up on any of those options.


Oh do I hate this. The people that run Best Buy and Radio Shack must have read that ''Asomeo Ways to Stop Thieves'' book too.... I hate that friendly hello, and worse the friendly I will stay within one foot of you to make sure you don't steal criminal. I only go to this type of store once, unless the place is ''friendly'' enough to never ever speak to me again.


I'm with you on the employees that hover. They need to back off when you show disinterest. But what's wrong with saying hello? I feel like I end up being a regular at the stores that acknowledge me.

JusticeZero
2013-09-17, 10:16 AM
Right, hovering can get annoying, but just saying hello (and acknowledging that you are in the building) from across the room isn't particularly bothersome to any but the most hardcore introvert or thief. And some people actually do want to ask questions of the first employee who notices them.

Dusk Eclipse
2013-09-17, 11:08 AM
Get to know your regulars, even if only their name. I am on a first name basis with the owner of the gaming shop I frequent and even if he isn't normally there he takes time to say hello to each of the regulars when he is in.

If you have the space, put as separated VIP area if you will ,people can book it and have something extra (like say a can of soda or something) since it is seclude people will have a better gaming experience (TCG player's get pretty loud IME and it distracts a lot when you are trying to play).

If you sanction tournaments, try to put on a gimmick, for example for the final tournament of the No man's land Heroclix event the gaming shop asked participants to dress up like their team, my personal friends dressed up as the Gotham Police dep.

I second (or whatever) being in contact with food shops or the like, specially on huge traffic days such as tournaments or events.

Fable Wright
2013-09-17, 11:11 AM
I can tell you don't like it. But for a more casual/crappy gamer it is very preferable as you get to go home with something. Yes it's true that the only benefit to winning is that you get to choose that foiled rare-something you wanted but on the other hand you might attract more people that wouldn't come to something where they know they'll just pay for cards for this dude that always wins. I suppose variation is good.

:smallconfused: In a regular draft, you go home with something: The cards you get in a draft. If you know you're not going to do well, you can easily take the fun card in a pack (e.g. Xathrid Necromancer) that you could use in another deck but not in the draft, and not have to worry about another player taking that card from you if you fail to do well, as opposed to being tossed your pick of the scraps. Also, there are issues with rare redraft, such as when someone wants to drop and keep their money rares. Either you take their rares with no compensation if they have to be pulled out for an entirely valid and unforseen reason, or you just have people doing poorly that have the best cards just dropping and walking away with the money cards they're going to have to forfeit. It's a bad system, to the point where when my friends and I did Modern Masters drafts (which have no prize packs and enough fun and money cards to make rare redraft have excellent payouts) we unanimously agreed to do uncommon redrafts, and only then after being able to keep one of the money uncommons you pick up. Most people I know would rather split the cost of a booster box with their friends when they want to draft over participating in a rare redraft.

Serpentine
2013-09-17, 11:17 AM
A hello, a smile, and body language that makes it clear that you're approachable is good, as is asking if you can help someone if it looks like they're confused or looking for something in particular.

Some general stuff:
- With events, it's great that you don't want to half-arse it! I agree, no event can be better than a crappy one. Consider cherry-picking the events you want to run yourselves, and do them properly, and fill in the gaps by making your facilities available to other people's events. A particular gaming club, for example, might want to do a Q&A/member drive. Or a local LARP might find your rooms a good place for a general meeting. Or... pfft, I dunno. Point is, you can let other people organise events too.
- Make sure everyone is welcome. Looks like you already have at least one woman on staff, and that will help a lot right off the bat. Don't let any of your staff treat female customers any different to male ones, try to keep a control on misogynistic, homophobic and similar talk by customers, if you must have cheesecake on the walls have some beefcake as well, etc.
- Personally, I like variety. I'm interested in D&D books, board games, and the occasional comic. I know other people who are more into LARP books and manga. There's gonna be limits to that, though, obviously.
- Try to engage with your customers. Have information on other gaming groups - LARPs, for example. Offer business cards from relevant individuals or businesses on your desk - not desk, the other thing, what the check out's on. My old gaming shop kindly tried selling some of my dice jewellery for me (with a cut, obviously) - I don't think they ended up selling a single thing, and I also don't think they tried particularly hard, but that sort of thing is nice and I think helps turn it more into a "community hub" than just a business.
- Make sure people know where it is. Both looking online, and standing out the front.

The Oni
2013-09-17, 01:29 PM
I go (or rather have gone) to three game shops, some of which are better than others. We're gonna call 'em M, L and E.

M is the best. Runs PFS and only PFS every Wednesday. Near a university, so full of college students. It's a converted apartment, so there's four rooms, two of which have closeable doors. Makes for the best games. Snack selection is limited but not terrible. Their game selection has their best stuff presented right when you walk in, and everything else is in the stockroom; they'll also order just about anything you want.

E is OK. It's noisy and has a lot more merchandise. The rooms are stuck in a back corner, but there are a lot of tables. No closeable doors to speak of. I only still go there b/c one of my friends who plays Pathfinder can't ever make it to PFS on Wednesday.

L is really bad. The manager's a jerk and requires a three-dollar minimum for snacks. The facilities are pretty lousy and it looks more like a warehouse than a business. When a friend left their M:TG cards there, he sold them.

Honest Tiefling
2013-09-17, 01:36 PM
...if you must have cheesecake on the walls have some beefcake as well, etc.

I've never run this sort of business, but you might be better off foregoing both. There's a lot more people who would find such questionable or off-putting then vital. Also, use that valuable wall space for actually interesting things: A gaming bulletin board, projectors, calenders, adverts, etc. PARTICULARLY if you have younger folks stepping in, family friendly events, or casual items such as board games that appeal to a broad audience.

Felhammer
2013-09-17, 02:03 PM
When you do Draft, don't do Rare Reddraft. It will lead to hurt feelings, which isn't good for a business. By all means allow people to set up their own Drafting events but the official ones that are posted on your calendar should be normal.

Speaking of Magic, try to have a diversity of formats available and don't stick to just one format too religiously.

YuGiOh, from what I understand, is having stocking issues at many non-big box stores, so finding an acceptable alternatives for tourney prizes should be a top priority. Most stores seem to shoot for store credit or money but some of the cooler tournies I have seen have used custom game-mats as prizes.

Speaking of peripherals, after you get established, don't hesitate to start making card game mats, dice, dice bags and T-Shirts with your store's logo. it's great advertising and makes your store appear quite successful.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-17, 06:07 PM
You have to think about the kind of games you want to sell and make space for. Appealing to 40k gamers is very different than appealing to card gamers. The former needs larger (6x4) tables raised up to above waist height. Card gamers need much less space per game but more tables since there tends to be more of them. Roleplayers and Card Gamers like chairs with backs, Wargamers tend to favor tall chairs or stools. Board gamers can easily prefer either, depending on what they are playing.

We're primarily CCGs, board(and non collectable card) games, and RPGers.

I like warhammer, and we have a smattering of it, but it's expensive as hell to do well. The starter rack costs around $2300, and the paint rack about that much more...and that's hardly the full line. You can drop $10k supporting 40k alone, and GW tends to give retailers lesser margins than other vendors do(In fairness, they are equally hard on consumers price-wise). The game is solid and the minis are quality, but doing this well is sufficiently costly that it'd mess up other departments, so I'm prioritizing it below other stuff. There's also an excellent tabletop gaming place(that only does that) about 30 minutes away, so I don't feel as if I'm leaving those gamers entirely without options.

Would be nice to get a larger range at some point, though.


One of my biggest pet peeves is table space. I generally want to be able to walk in and find a table for a game I want to play right away. I don't want to have to wait for a free table. Tables should be free to use unless you plan on playing a marathon game of D&D or Risk (anything past 4 hours of play time is a bit excessive).

Just doing free table space at the moment. Scheduled events have priority, of course, but otherwise, they are all free to use, and we have enough tables that it hasn't been a problem.


Another pet peeve is bag space. There needs to be a good system for where people put there bags, especially when you start getting into the 100 point Warmachine and Apocalypse-sized 40k games. Many of the best tables I've seen have a shelving unit under the table to store bags, an under slung shelf to store dice/miniatures and an extra foot on each game table that can be used for set up.

There's some extra space along one wall of the game room that seems to naturally attract bags, perhaps a bench or something there to make the height more comfortable would be logical...hmmm.


For RPGs, I generally prefer to be segregated away from the store, be it behind curtains or walls. I simply loathe onlookers (unless we are playing a D&D Encounters game (which is all about advertising)).

The game room's about two big tables, so big roleplaying games generally just get the room, and other gamers play in the tables in the main room. Seems to work well, and minimize noise pollution.


A lot of people are going to push to be the "nerd mecca" but, to be honest, that isn't incredibly successful outside of really big cities. Why would a comic lover buy comics from a game shop, which will never rival the diversity of a true comic shop? There are just too many comics out there now-a-days to maintain a reasonable stock that will consistently sell (print comics are slowly dieing). Now where there is a good chance to make solid sales is TPBs. Those cost a bit more, give people a real taste of a story line and take up much less space than an ever growing plethora of floppies. Of course if you are from an area that does not have a local comic shop, then definitely tap that market. Selling a few novels associated with your other games (D&D, Pathfinder, Warhammer, 40k, Magic, etc.) can net you a consistent, though small, profit.

Maybe one day we can cover everything, but we've only got about 1,500 feet of usable space. Gotta have a big, handicapped accessible bathroom, gotta have a register area, need a fridge to store sodas, because warm drinks are terrible. Gotta have play space. If it takes off, though, after this lease expires, I might be able to move up into a larger space and appeal to more folks. LARP folks, like some suggested, are good people(I'm in a largish larp, and have contacts with others), but they tend to need a fair bit of space for events.


Keep lots of air fresheners handy, especially during tournies and clean your bathroom once a week (at least).

The fiance insists that they shall be cleaned daily. That seems possibly excessive at this stage, but they are remarkably sparkly, so I suppose it works.


Staff should be nice and knowledgeable.

We're very knowledgeable...but not all of us are knowledgeable in everything. There's one guy who will crush my knowledge in RPGs(and I've been hanging around these forums for years, so I'm not entirely clueless), another fellow who knows pokemon, etc(which I *am* clueless about), and so on. We probably need to do more cross training, but there's at least one genuine expert on any given topic.


Host regular events. In the beginning, make them "big events" by offering big prizes for first place, as well as smaller stuff for raffles. You will generate a lot of buzz and good will.

I've been trying to generate promo stuff and freebies from manufacturers, with limited success. Signed cards, that kind of thing. I suppose it wouldn't be a real problem to finance some solid prizes myself for areas with weak prize support.


Digitize your inventory and use scanners. It'll really help you keep tabs on what is hot, what isn't and when things are selling best.

Yeah, no POS machine yet. One of the few areas we went budget on...it does mean a higher workload for me in inventory management, but for me, that's a fun minigame. Right now? Cards Against Humanity and the Game of Thrones card sleeves are apparently the most popular things ever. Both are selling roughly as fast as new shipments arrive.


Oh do I hate this. The people that run Best Buy and Radio Shack must have read that ''Asomeo Ways to Stop Thieves'' book too.... I hate that friendly hello, and worse the friendly I will stay within one foot of you to make sure you don't steal criminal. I only go to this type of store once, unless the place is ''friendly'' enough to never ever speak to me again.

I tend to go with the "greet them when they come in, but don't follow them" method. If they look confused or lost, I'll pop by, of course, but lots of geeks know *exactly* what they want, so no point getting in their way. It's a balance, I suppose.



Business cards. When I'm leaving a new store, I'd like a little something to remind me of the place. It doesn't have to be important, it doesn't have to be fancy, but just a stack of business cards by the register is nice.

Good call...business cards are remarkably inexpensive. Now that I've got a business line, I'm gonna get a pile of these printed up.

Rare Redrafts: I'm not familiar with the practice, but something so controversial could be problematic, yeah. If players wish to do it, they can go nuts, but I definitely see the concern in the experienced players essentially grabbing all the money cards. I picked Swiss draft because it's new player friendly. Nobody gets eliminated early, and the prize distribution is fairly broad. I'm not overly fond of how some local stores essentially dump all the prizes on the #1 player.



- Make sure everyone is welcome. Looks like you already have at least one woman on staff, and that will help a lot right off the bat. Don't let any of your staff treat female customers any different to male ones, try to keep a control on misogynistic, homophobic and similar talk by customers, if you must have cheesecake on the walls have some beefcake as well, etc.

Right now, our decorations consist of some pathfinder society banners(dragons and such), a Hobbit poster, and a star wars ensemble poster. We'll probably keep decorating something in that venue, with various geeky things, but without a ton of skin. We do need a few more things on the wall, some are a bit bare, but I think this'll be an easily avoided issue.



- Try to engage with your customers. Have information on other gaming groups - LARPs, for example. Offer business cards from relevant individuals or businesses on your desk - not desk, the other thing, what the check out's on. My old gaming shop kindly tried selling some of my dice jewellery for me (with a cut, obviously) - I don't think they ended up selling a single thing, and I also don't think they tried particularly hard, but that sort of thing is nice and I think helps turn it more into a "community hub" than just a business.

Oh, I totally want to do that. I've got one friend of a friend interested in making novelty D-whatever shaped soaps(she sells soap as a small business), and I'd happily sell that with her. 'nother friend trying to get a D&D module published, and if that happens, hell yeah I'd love to have that stocked. Maybe do an author signing day or something. I agree, it definitely helps make you feel different, the key is finding those nifty things in the area. If there's any specific things you think are underappreciated by game shops, would definitely appreciate a point-out. How'd the jewelry go overall, btw?



L is really bad. The manager's a jerk and requires a three-dollar minimum for snacks. The facilities are pretty lousy and it looks more like a warehouse than a business. When a friend left their M:TG cards there, he sold them.

Holy god, dude. That's crazy. I see some of the stores like this, and it confuses me how they're still in business. Low rent, maybe? I dunno. There's at least one store near me that I wonder how on earth they pay the bills, for sure.

Zahhak
2013-09-17, 06:13 PM
But seriously dude, people that run bad websites go to hell.

Do not get sent to hell.

Alejandro
2013-09-17, 06:49 PM
Here's a business card brainstorm: On your business cards, maybe on the back, have a little offer: If the person receiving the business card returns to the store at a later date and brings a friend with them, that friend can trade the business card back to you for a 5% discount (or whatever) on their purchase.

Gets people to show the card to their friends, and maybe bring them to the store.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-17, 07:15 PM
But seriously dude, people that run bad websites go to hell.

Do not get sent to hell.

Well, as long as it's not special hell.

It's got the framework up with filler text, today was a busy day of getting internet, shipments, etc. Tomorrows signage, I think. And running a PF event. Might get to the website on thursday.

Toofey
2013-09-17, 11:05 PM
It wasn't that it was MSRP, its that they kicked the price up substantially to match items next to it that WERE at MSRP.
Is there anywhere that people at events can get food or similar?

that still perfectly legal, you can sell something you own for any price you can get for it. Not that I recommend it, it would cut your sales and piss off your customers.

Anyway... I'm trying to think of some meaningful advice, but then I realized that my favorite 2 RPG stores both ended up closing, and the one I go to now is not at all my taste but is open.

The one thing i do say is that you have to get these little cubes they sell that are like d6 but don't have the dots, they're great markers and soooo useful in play.

Felhammer
2013-09-18, 12:29 AM
We're primarily CCGs, board(and non collectable card) games, and RPGers.

I like warhammer, and we have a smattering of it, but it's expensive as hell to do well. The starter rack costs around $2300, and the paint rack about that much more...and that's hardly the full line. You can drop $10k supporting 40k alone, and GW tends to give retailers lesser margins than other vendors do(In fairness, they are equally hard on consumers price-wise). The game is solid and the minis are quality, but doing this well is sufficiently costly that it'd mess up other departments, so I'm prioritizing it below other stuff. There's also an excellent tabletop gaming place(that only does that) about 30 minutes away, so I don't feel as if I'm leaving those gamers entirely without options.

Would be nice to get a larger range at some point, though.

GW is eeeeevil. You can't just buy into 40k, they force you to support all of their games to get the best prices/benefits. I feel really bad for my local comic shop, the guy is a die hard fan, bought everything (full 40k range, full fantasy range, smattering of other GW games and all the paints) and has sold virtually none of it. He should have just stuck to Card Games and comics.

Having said that, if you want to attract a crowd, look into Heroclix. The game is much easier to support and has decent prize support for the big 4-6 month long tourny seasons. The space required for the game is virtually the same as card games, so you can easily slot it into your play area and the stock can amount to as little as a case of boosters (which are about the same size as the old D&D minis boosters). The game is fast, fun and draws in people who may not otherwise be interested in so-called nerd hobbies. WizKids is releasing a YuGiOh set some time in the near future, so it could be a great opportunity to cross pollinate.



Just doing free table space at the moment. Scheduled events have priority, of course, but otherwise, they are all free to use, and we have enough tables that it hasn't been a problem.

Awesome to hear! You'll garner a ton of good will for that policy! :smallbiggrin:


There's some extra space along one wall of the game room that seems to naturally attract bags, perhaps a bench or something there to make the height more comfortable would be logical...hmmm.

Cubbies might also be a good alternative as well. Or even just a few hooks, so people can hang their backpacks (so not all of them are on the floor in a pile).


The game room's about two big tables, so big roleplaying games generally just get the room, and other gamers play in the tables in the main room. Seems to work well, and minimize noise pollution.

That sounds pretty sweet! Wish my FLGS's had a set up like that! :smallsmile:




The fiance insists that they shall be cleaned daily. That seems possibly excessive at this stage, but they are remarkably sparkly, so I suppose it works.

Having seen how disgusting some nerds can be, I don't blame her. Nothing turns off women (and men that have to go #2) more than a horrifying restroom. I've been in one bath room that - even though I was wearing long pants and shoes - I felt as if I had to go home and take a shower afterwards. SO gross! Cleanliness is a good policy!



We're very knowledgeable...but not all of us are knowledgeable in everything. There's one guy who will crush my knowledge in RPGs(and I've been hanging around these forums for years, so I'm not entirely clueless), another fellow who knows pokemon, etc(which I *am* clueless about), and so on. We probably need to do more cross training, but there's at least one genuine expert on any given topic.

Getting some cross-class skills is definitely a good idea, especially for when neophytes come in with a pile of cash and desire knowledge of what best to spend their wad on.


I've been trying to generate promo stuff and freebies from manufacturers, with limited success. Signed cards, that kind of thing. I suppose it wouldn't be a real problem to finance some solid prizes myself for areas with weak prize support.

Like I mentioned WizKids has good support for their tourney seasons (and regular tournies as well). Magic does a great job, especially once you start doing pre-releases, releases and Friday Night Magic. YuGiOh has little support. WoW TCG tries but isn't super supportive.

You don't need to go super big for added prizes, just enough to draw a crowd and generate buzz about your store. A few hundred bucks spread over a few different events could easily see your store become quite popular.

Scope out what your competition is doing, that will definitely indicate what is doing well, what isn't and give you ideas for how to drum up more support.


Yeah, no POS machine yet. One of the few areas we went budget on...it does mean a higher workload for me in inventory management, but for me, that's a fun minigame. Right now? Cards Against Humanity and the Game of Thrones card sleeves are apparently the most popular things ever. Both are selling roughly as fast as new shipments arrive.

It's a costly investment but one that would be good for your store in the long run. Go cheaper now but don't hesitate to buy one once you start to get into the black. :smallsmile:

In the interrum, google docs is a solid method of keeping track.

Serpentine
2013-09-18, 07:07 AM
Right now, our decorations consist of some pathfinder society banners(dragons and such), a Hobbit poster, and a star wars ensemble poster. We'll probably keep decorating something in that venue, with various geeky things, but without a ton of skin. We do need a few more things on the wall, some are a bit bare, but I think this'll be an easily avoided issue.Yeah, those are fine. I was just thinking more general fantasy art. There's some beautiful stuff out there, but a lot of it's just dumb.

Oh, I totally want to do that. I've got one friend of a friend interested in making novelty D-whatever shaped soaps(she sells soap as a small business), and I'd happily sell that with her. 'nother friend trying to get a D&D module published, and if that happens, hell yeah I'd love to have that stocked. Maybe do an author signing day or something. I agree, it definitely helps make you feel different, the key is finding those nifty things in the area. If there's any specific things you think are underappreciated by game shops, would definitely appreciate a point-out. How'd the jewelry go overall, btw?Good to hear :) I think having some sort of notice that you're open to working with people on that sort of thing would be good - I'd like to ask my local shop if they'd be willing to sell my stuff, but even though one of my friends works there I feel weird asking. I never felt weird asking the old one, though, for some reason. Guess I just knew him better.
Meh. I definitely still haven't broken even yet. I sell the very rare bit, but mostly I've just been giving them as gifts. Still got my Etsy, and doing t-shirts on Redbubble too. Aside from the Facebook page (Purple Dragon Crafts, if anyone's interested <.<) and my sigbanner I haven't really been doing much marketing, though. Thinking of doing a forum ad again sometime.
Why, you wanna sell some stuff for me? I have business cards you can give out! :tongue:

Tyndmyr
2013-09-18, 08:49 AM
Sure, dunno if it's cost effective for you to ship to the east coast, but I'd be willing to give out business cards or carry jewelry in the store or both.

I definitely feel you on breaking even, though. I'm estimating at *least* six months until the store is in the black, and it'll be quite some time after that until it's made back the initial investment, I'm sure.

Serpentine
2013-09-18, 08:52 AM
Wait, really? Hmmm... I could possibly look at sending over some of the bracelets (they're really the "best seller" sorta thing)... I should do up new business cards, though. The ones I have aren't completely accurate any more.

You should keep us updated. I'd be really interested to hear how you go, and you never know, we might be able to help with your marketing :smallsmile:

JusticeZero
2013-09-18, 10:57 AM
Oh, don't leave air freshener everywhere. Some people have sensitivities to scents.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-18, 11:27 AM
Wait, really? Hmmm... I could possibly look at sending over some of the bracelets (they're really the "best seller" sorta thing)... I should do up new business cards, though. The ones I have aren't completely accurate any more.

You should keep us updated. I'd be really interested to hear how you go, and you never know, we might be able to help with your marketing :smallsmile:

My email's [email protected], so's we can chat offline from here, but that'd be cool.

It's actually been humming better than I thought it would for the first coupla weeks. I assumed it'd be practically dead until everyone found out about the place(and I was sick with mono, taking me out of commission for the store launch), but my friends were amazing at telling their friends to come check it out and running the shop while I was sick and what not. Def owe them something nice. I'll certainly pop by updates now and again.

Justice, good call, hadn't thought of that. We have plug-in glade air fresheners, but don't use the spray cans, is that better or worse?

Yora
2013-09-18, 11:51 AM
When I think about the gaming shops I've been too, the following things come to mind that should be avoided:

The main reason to buy RPG books in a store and not order them on amazon is the ability to flip through the pages before you buy it. There's nothing more annoying that trying to read an A4 hardback book while standing, especially when you're not sure if it annoys the owner if you read his books and possibly not buying one.
So what I say is to create a corner near the RPG books with two or three chairs, where customers feel invited to sit down and flip through the pages of books for 15 minutes or so.

Since fall has arrived and it has been raining for a week here, another thing came to mind. When you're shopping in fall and winter, you often will be wearing a coat that frequently will be wet as well.
Set the heating or air conditioning in the shop to a temperature where customers don't feel like boiling to death in their wet coats after 5 minutes. All your customers will be dressed for the weather outside. Better have the cashier wear a thick sweater and maybe a second pair of socks than to keep it at a cozy 20 degrees. If it is pysically uncomfortable to stay iside the store for more than a few minutes, people won't flip through the books and browse the merchendise, but just take a quick check if you have exactly that one product on the shelf they already decited to buy.
Not sure what can be done about humidity in winter, but do whatever you can to make the people in the wet coats feel less uncomfortable.

Thinker
2013-09-18, 12:14 PM
Since fall has arrived and it has been raining for a week here, another thing came to mind. When you're shopping in fall and winter, you often will be wearing a coat that frequently will be wet as well.
Set the heating or air conditioning in the shop to a temperature where customers don't feel like boiling to death in their wet coats after 5 minutes. All your customers will be dressed for the weather outside. Better have the cashier wear a thick sweater and maybe a second pair of socks than to keep it at a cozy 20 degrees. If it is pysically uncomfortable to stay iside the store for more than a few minutes, people won't flip through the books and browse the merchendise, but just take a quick check if you have exactly that one product on the shelf they already decited to buy.
Not sure what can be done about humidity in winter, but do whatever you can to make the people in the wet coats feel less uncomfortable.

Why not keep the temperature comfortable and have a coat rack?

Yora
2013-09-18, 12:24 PM
That might depend a lot on the local store-culture of the region.

Might work in america, but I don't think people would get that comfortable in Germany when they essentially just came it for "just looking".

Taet
2013-09-18, 12:53 PM
One of the local gaming shops has a lot of table space. On a slow day of the week they let the Amtgard group come in and use that table space for crafting. It keeps the store from looking empty. The Amtgard people get a big table space for cutting out costumes and they know how to vacuum after they pack up. And these people are not quite the same people who come to a gaming store so it's a new group of possible customers. It's a good idea for filler for a slow day of the week if you have big tables.

Another local gaming shop is letting a good customer teach beginner minis painting. The cost is very small and it paid for two blank minis. Space Marines. The customer teacher is bringing some of his own brushes and primer and each person has a basic list of things he will need to have. This was run at a loss but it made future customers of minis and paints.

Felhammer
2013-09-18, 12:59 PM
keeping it frigid inside during winter is not a good idea. Just like it isn't a good idea to keep it hot in the summer.

We live in the modern world, we have air conditionings and heaters for a reason.

BlckDv
2013-09-18, 01:27 PM
Would you mind sharing a bit more about your store with us? I've been a gamer now for nearly 30 years, and have frequented game stores in many cities of different sizes, and I have also worked for two game stores, one in shop, one as web support. I could give you some clearer advice if I had a clearer picture of your shop.

1. I've generally seen a few types of shop: The Table Top Shop with a focus on rules books and a nice selection of gaming tools like dice, minis, templates, etc. The Hobby/Wargamer shop with a dedicated focus on Miniatures, often including a wide array of products that may not technically be for gamers (like model Railroad stuff, etc.), these shops usually also carry a good line of rules books for table top games. The Comics and Card shop, a major focus on comic books and CCGs, with gaming supplies also sold. Different things will be desirable for success depending on what you are going for.

2. Location Cost and it's reality. Depending on where you are, the rent to Sq. Ft. ratio will have a serious impact on what you can offer. If rent allows it, some very successful shops I've seen use the two adjoining units setup with one unit dedicated to game space (snacks, tables with either grids and erasable surfaces or a selection of foam terrains (for Tabletop or Wargamers), or tables pre-setup to allow for easy movement of players for round robin or elimination play for CCGs, etc... but that costs money, and is not always sustainable with game shop margins. You may have to settle for some tables in your stock area.

3. Who are your customers? Some folks may come into your shop five times a week and buy $20 worth of snacks a month, others may come once every three months and buy $200 worth of books each time. If soda guy is bringing in paying friends, great.. if not, don't mistake him for the more valuable customer. Likewise, if your shop does online sales as well, keep that in mind and don't neglect the online order guy just because he is not in sight.

Like I said, if you can share more, I'd be happy to be more specific.

valadil
2013-09-18, 02:57 PM
So I don't think this would be feasible, but I'd love to go to 21+ night at a game shop and play my games with booze. Something tells me it's not worth getting a liquor license for this one fantasy though.

Not going to reread everything, but just to make sure you've hit the basics, having common RPG materials around is great. Tables should have their own battle maps, dice, pencils, and maybe even (cheap plastic) minis. You're going to end up collecting lost dice anyway, so why not leave them where players can benefit?

TheThan
2013-09-18, 04:34 PM
Be very knowleable about the games you sell. Even if you don’t actually play the games, simply knowing them is a huge boon.

My local hobby store has a store dice policy. For every 10 bucks you spend there, you get a free dice with the store’s logo for a 6 (d6s here). You can spend the dice to buy gaming time in the game room (1 die=1 day) or save them and trade them in for a discount on products. I don’t recall much each dice is worth in that regards. A lot of times people will just collect them (I’ve got a lot of them myself).

As others said, an official webpage and social media sites are a huge benefit.

Also set up a gaming schedule. Nothing is worse than getting your friends together to play war machine and heading over to the game shop, only to find it’s packed full of magic players. So set up a weekly schedule, something like this: Magic (Friday night magic for instance) one night, miniatures another night, board games another night, and RPG night another night. If you do this weekly, then 4 of the 5-6 days your open (my store is open every day so 7 for them) something is going down.

Mordar
2013-09-18, 07:59 PM
The fiance insists that they shall be cleaned daily. That seems possibly excessive at this stage, but they are remarkably sparkly, so I suppose it works.

Under no circumstance deviate from The Fiance's wisdom in this matter. The few minutes it takes are really worth it.


Justice, good call, hadn't thought of that. We have plug-in glade air fresheners, but don't use the spray cans, is that better or worse?

I recommend the automated dispensers that are meant for public areas - they use very subtle "freshener" so you don't have to worry about people that are allergic or just dislike really strong fake-floral-fruit smells. If you have a commercial cleaning products outlet nearby, have a look - they are fairly inexpensive and have an array of settings (timed, motion, etc) on some of the units. If nothing else, internets! :)

Again, best of luck - your picture looked like it is a nice spot. Get what signage you can (professionally designed and printed if at all possible) and keep the dream alive :smallsmile:

- M

Waxillium Lande
2013-09-18, 08:29 PM
I have to say, the first thing I thought when I looked at the pictures you gave was 'snacks by the counter, great!'. On a different note, ambient music can be good, but keep it quiet and atmospheric- This Music (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSfkU29hXwM) is good, pop songs will make me want to rip my ears off of my head, tear out my left arm, and smash your speakers with it.

JusticeZero
2013-09-18, 11:09 PM
Justice, good call, hadn't thought of that. We have plug-in glade air fresheners, but don't use the spray cans, is that better or worse?
If you spray when the place is closed or maybe after a particularly freak disaster, then most of the time the room will be clear and fine. I once foolishly managed to run myself out of my own apartment with an air freshener and had to ask a neighbor to go in and fetch it, though, and that one wasn't even plug in. Those leave the room slightly problematic 24/7.

TheThan
2013-09-19, 12:50 AM
I have to say, the first thing I thought when I looked at the pictures you gave was 'snacks by the counter, great!'. On a different note, ambient music can be good, but keep it quiet and atmospheric- This Music (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSfkU29hXwM) is good, pop songs will make me want to rip my ears off of my head, tear out my left arm, and smash your speakers with it.

I used to hang out at a hobby shop that played Iron Maiden...

Honest Tiefling
2013-09-19, 01:18 AM
I've heard Tainted Love twice in grocery stores. Either I have a poor idea of appropriate music, or they do.

But remember to keep the music low, and to crank it down during touraments and when several games are in session. Do you really need music, even?

Serpentine
2013-09-19, 08:33 AM
I kind of like it when employees have their own playlists they can bring in... You could even make it a thing, have people say which staff member has the best taste in music :smalltongue: (just, for the sake of your own sanity, make sure you have as much variety and as few repeats as possible - I almost wanted to hurl my computer out the window the 4th time in one day that "whips and chains" song came on).

Re air fresheners: I'm not allergic but I can't stand the stuff, makes me feel sick. If you must use it, make it as subtle as possible. I think good ventilation is more important, and if you really need it maybe an unscented deodorizer would be better.

Gravitron5000
2013-09-19, 08:44 AM
So I don't think this would be feasible, but I'd love to go to 21+ night at a game shop and play my games with booze. Something tells me it's not worth getting a liquor license for this one fantasy though.


It might be possible to get an event licence that would allow you to serve alcohol for this sort of thing, so I would look up the regulations in your area to see if it's feasible. I have a friend that organizes board game events that take advantage of this (I am not however in MD).

Melayl
2013-09-19, 09:36 AM
I don't really have anything to add that hasn't already been said, other than congratulations and good luck!

Honest Tiefling
2013-09-19, 10:49 AM
As for booze, depending on your region I think you might be able to get away with it if its is included in the price for a private party (That happens to be gaming themed). That's what the FLGS does in my area, through there can be odd quirks if you use that loophole.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-19, 06:23 PM
Booze is sadly a no-go here. Tight community regulations and a lack of alcohol permits. It's technically possible, but it's the sort of possible that requires a half million dollars on hand. If I win the lottery, making a geek mega-center of awesome will definitely be on my to-do list, though.

We don't really have any particular policy on music, other than that it be kept reasonably low. Background noise level. Some people like the radio, some GMs like thematic music for their games, it's all fine by me, really. I just dislike places where the music makes talking difficult.

Also, the die policy and the random encounter idea both sound fun. I know a store in dover, DE that does the random encounter stuff, and it could be a blast for events and things.

One of the cool things about being a store owner is that suddenly the entire world wants to tell you about upcoming games. I just discovered(and got a copy of) the Uncharted board game. Didn't realize that was a thing, even...and now there's a bioshock infinite boardgame. Rather expensive, but it has some cool elements, like the fact that the char you play in the video game is an unstoppable juggernaut of death that all the board game players(representing factions) try to avoid. Kind of brilliant.

Realized today when a customer asked that I didn't have any painting kit in yet. Any suggestions for best brand? I'm not excessively worried over price(they're all expensive), but I'd like to have stuff that players are fond of.

TheThan
2013-09-20, 12:55 AM
I really only know of five paints to try out:
Citadel (but its a GW product)
P3 (put out by Privateer Press)
Army Painter
Vallejo
model masters

What I would do and go over to the other hobby stores and make a note of what paints they sell to find the one that none of them sell and market that.

I know sometimes I want a specific paint from one company, only one store doesn't sell it, so i have to go to another store to find it.

Felhammer
2013-09-20, 02:24 AM
Army Painter is good if you sell a lot of Wargames (which you don't). Citadel paints are the standard by which all other paints are judged (but it's GW, so... EVIL!). Privateer Press' brand is nice but would seem out of place if you did not sell Warmachine/Hordes. That leaves you with Valejo, which is very popular, and Testors. Both have quality ranges. Valejo is more popular in the Wargaming crowd, while Testors is more popular in the model crowd.

Totally Guy
2013-09-20, 04:59 AM
I had an idea recently for what I would do if I ran a game shop.

I'd run an appeal for GMs to say what games they like to run and ask if they would run them in convention style games for a new player who has just bought the book. You may have people tell you about their favourites that they own but you don't stock.

Then when a new player buys a book that corresponds to a game a GM has recently expressed interest in running you can put those people in touch and use your gaming space.

The GM benefits by getting to know a new person and teaching the rules to one of their favourite games.

The customer benefits by being taught the game in play and possibly is introduced to the community.

You benefit by offering something the online retailers can't. If you tag the books with a "Local Active Gamers" tag the product may sell faster.

The risk is that you'd end up managing the people. They may be unreliable or or have unreasonable expectations for the arrangement. You also have to explain the informal nature of the agreement so as to not have people request a refund if they have a bad experience.

Good luck.

Alejandro
2013-09-20, 09:54 AM
Booze is sadly a no-go here. Tight community regulations and a lack of alcohol permits. It's technically possible, but it's the sort of possible that requires a half million dollars on hand.

Don't worry about it. You're asking for trouble if you sell booze (please note, I enjoy drinking alcoholic beverages) due to all the ramifications that fall down from it:

- The mentioned costs and licenses you need; you're not a bar, not worth the investments
- Various angry fundamentalist Bible brigades who will immediately shout that not only are you selling Satan's gaming books, but you are selling the evil alcohol as well, probably as part of a plot to turn kids into goat sacrificing cultists.
- Minors who want to buy your card games will try at some point to buy said booze, and as soon as you or a staff member messes up once, you're screwed
- A Cheetos-scarfing neckbeard with BO is bad enough; a drunk one is 10x worse. Trust me, I had one at the gaming table once.

Draz74
2013-09-20, 06:41 PM
Sadly, I'm very allergic to cats. I like 'em, but I like breathing more,
That seems reasonable enough.


Oddly enough, I own multiple 3d printers. I haven't combined the two interests yet, but I suppose having a printer in shop cranking out minis could at least be a curiosity.

WIN.

Seriously, if you can get this working, it will be an amazing gimmick. If it were me, I'd even just charge at-cost for people's homemade miniatures, because that would bring them into the store so they can buy other stuff.

Of course, whether that's a good idea is highly dependent on how much it eats into your other miniatures revenue. I'm a little biased because I've always been too much of a cheapskate to buy commercial minis, especially in the numbers needed for e.g. Warhammer ... but for all I know, my FLGS makes 60% of its revenue selling Warhammer minis. But I'd certainly be impressed if they had a cheap DIY mini option.

Arutema
2013-09-20, 08:43 PM
I really only know of five paints to try out:
Citadel (but its a GW product)
P3 (put out by Privateer Press)
Army Painter
Vallejo
model masters


There are also Master Series Paints put out by Reaper minis.

As for getting people in the store, if you haven't already, contact your local Pathfinder Venture Captain (http://paizo.com/pathfinderSociety/about/regionalCoordinators) and talk about getting Pathfinder Society events setup in your store. Be sure to keep Pathfinder splatbooks and Pathfinder Battles minis in stock to satisfy the players as well.

molten_dragon
2013-09-22, 06:49 AM
Some things that are important for me when I go to a gaming store.

1. Have the products that I want to buy at a reasonable price. I don't expect a LGS to compete price-wise with Amazon, but if you're selling everything at MSRP all the time, I probably won't buy much there.

2. Have a nice place for people to sit down and play games. Make sure there's plenty of space, and chairs that are comfortable enough to sit on for a few hours.

3. Try to keep a pleasant temperature, for some reason a lot of the gaming stores I've been to in this area don't like to pay for heat/AC for some reason.

4. Don't let customers scare off other customers. This mainly applies to people with poor hygiene, but can involve other things too.

Serpentine
2013-09-22, 10:29 AM
Dunno if it's really that sort of store... But something I used to like at an old board games/puzzle/mind-benders/random entertainmenty things store was that they had tables with a bunch of their games and things out for people to play with. I guess this is the same as the "have games people can play with" suggestion, but little things are good too (depending on what sort of things you sell there).

Dusk Eclipse
2013-09-22, 11:27 AM
Game showcases also work really well to attract interest and/or potential customers, you could invite people to try a new boardgame every other week or so, that way the customers can try many different games. I know I am much likelier to buy a game I know how to play and that I've enjoyed than something completely new.

On that vein you should probably have a boardgame day or something, I have tons of games I like that I haven't bought because I simply can't find anyone to play with.

mathemagician
2013-09-22, 07:21 PM
I'm sure you're acutely aware that you have to provide some way of competing with online retailers. You're going to have a hard time beating them in price, of course, so you need to win in service. A lot of posters have indicated already that knowledgable and friendly staff are very important to them, and I definitely agree.

One of my favorite shops had a whiteboard. There was a list for each employee, listing their favorite games at the moment. This was useful, because I could see if any employees had games I liked on the list (or I was interested in), and I could get their opinion on it. It was also a good way to get me back into the shop, because if that employee wasn't around, I could ask when they'd be in so that I could stop back. Then there was also a list with some "looking for this type of game? Ask us about x!". "E.g. looking for a cooperative game? ask us about Lord of the Rings, or Battlestar Galactica! " , or, "Looking for a game for two players? Have you tried Morels?" "Need a party game? Have you tried Telestrations or Gift Trap?" and so on.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-24, 04:35 AM
I'm sure you're acutely aware that you have to provide some way of competing with online retailers. You're going to have a hard time beating them in price, of course, so you need to win in service. A lot of posters have indicated already that knowledgable and friendly staff are very important to them, and I definitely agree.

Oh, for sure. Service, experience, events...nobody talks about how much fun they had at Amazon. People don't buy a game to have bits of cardboard in a box, they buy it to have fun. The environment has to be enjoyable, and that's a lot of why I'm here hitting people up for advice. Getting that right feel is everything.

We've picked up a LOT of roleplaying folks so far. Got one PF group going on weds, one on friday, a 3.5 group on friday, a DCC game looking at thursdays, a pf society game looking at mondays, and various other one off events and such. I theorize that the local game shops haven't really been supporting RPGs much...magic is the biggest chunk of money, so everyone's off chasing that.

Stocked the game closet yesterday...mostly games I know and love, but a few of 'em were games entirely new to me. I'll have to give those a try. Don't really have any of the little puzzles or the like, but I do try to have a decent range of games down to the fairly small ones. A *lot* of games seem to aim for the expensive, large epic game, but I kind of like the Zombie Dice level stuff a fair bit too.

Waxillium Lande
2013-09-24, 09:54 PM
That reminds me- one of my favorite gaming shops has not only the usual assortment of RPGs and big games (ticket to ride, etc.), but also a display of Cheapass games which sell for about twelve dollars (the ones that used to be shipped in paper bags to cut down on cost). A lot of the time, especially if I want to buy a quick gift, I don't want to have to drop 50+ dollars on a game in a box the size of a small child.
Those I keep for myself, of course :smalltongue:

3WhiteFox3
2013-09-24, 11:46 PM
My advice comes from something my local comic shop's owner has said. (Not word for word, but basic idea)

You need to realize that while you love games and geeky stuff, you need to understand that the first priority is to be a good business. This sometimes means thinking like a business man, but it also means that you have to give the customers the idea that your store is professional and that you take what you're doing seriously. Obviously, you can have fun, but any thriving business is going to come from a serious effort to keep it running.

Besides that, most of the things I can think of other posters have already stated. I would definitely recommend making sure that your store is as accessible to anyone, kids, families, the masses, etc... My shop has a no cursing before 9:00 PM policy to help give the store a respectability. You don't have to be draconic about it, but you want to make sure that people want to come back. And things like poor hygiene, loud cursing and disruptive behavior can all hurt a store's image.

Knaight
2013-09-24, 11:49 PM
On resources: Fear the Boot had a 2 episode interview with a game shop owner local to them. It might be worth listening to - plus, the guy has made himself available for questions.

Serpentine
2013-09-25, 01:54 AM
You know what you should do? You should get a copy of the Starcraft game, and give a prize to anyone who can work out how the rules work, AND complete a full game of it :smalltongue:

(For those who don't know: Well, KuReshtin or Archonic_Energy could tell the story better, but one of them bought a copy of it and brought it to a meet-up. They spent several hours pawing through it, and still had no idea how it worked. Ku ended up taking it home with him to show his gaming store, and eventually they figured out that some of the rules just weren't in the book. They found the missing rules online, and then they were able to play it properly!
After another several hours of actually playing it, they completed one round.
I don't know whether they ever finished a game...)

The Fury
2013-09-25, 10:45 AM
Maybe keep a binder of blank character sheets for commonly played games on hand?
Other than that, I'm not sure if you're willing to paint the walls but some color might liven the place up a bit. If not that maybe some decorations here and there. Keep it tasteful though, not that I need to say that because we're all nice people, right?

Alejandro
2013-09-25, 12:19 PM
Every once in a while, have someone run in, throw a sword across the room, and shout "Are you not entertained!?"

kidnicky
2013-09-25, 05:05 PM
Oh, for sure. Service, experience, events...nobody talks about how much fun they had at Amazon. People don't buy a game to have bits of cardboard in a box, they buy it to have fun. The environment has to be enjoyable, and that's a lot of why I'm here hitting people up for advice. Getting that right feel is everything.

We've picked up a LOT of roleplaying folks so far. Got one PF group going on weds, one on friday, a 3.5 group on friday, a DCC game looking at thursdays, a pf society game looking at mondays, and various other one off events and such. I theorize that the local game shops haven't really been supporting RPGs much...magic is the biggest chunk of money, so everyone's off chasing that.

Stocked the game closet yesterday...mostly games I know and love, but a few of 'em were games entirely new to me. I'll have to give those a try. Don't really have any of the little puzzles or the like, but I do try to have a decent range of games down to the fairly small ones. A *lot* of games seem to aim for the expensive, large epic game, but I kind of like the Zombie Dice level stuff a fair bit too.

Within driving distance of me,there's -1-"gaming store" ....and it's all magic. The thing is,a RPG player in theory needs to buy one to three books and one set of dice and he can play forever,MTG players spend thousands.

Mr Beer
2013-09-25, 06:21 PM
Every once in a while, have someone run in, throw a sword across the room, and shout "Are you not entertained!?"

This, also sometimes stand across the door and prevent people from leaving while brandishing a staff and shouting "You shall not pass!"

valadil
2013-09-25, 08:32 PM
Had another thought. What about preowned books and board games? I'd be way more likely to buy a board game on a whim if I thought I could cash out if I didn't like it. Instead they just take up space, which keeps me from buying more. I'd gladly trade in many of them for some store credit.

As a counterpoint to my own suggestion, you'd need to verify that board games you bought back were complete. I *think* most games include a card/pieces count in the manual, but handling that seems tedious and might not be the best use of employee time.

That counterpoint only applies to board games, btw. I still think used RPG books would be great.

tasw
2013-09-25, 09:17 PM
rather then selling soda's invest in a fountain machine. I ran a convenience store for 2 years and trust me, the profit margin is much, much higher on fountain drinks. If you wind up doing lots of events it even lets you sell things like signature cups with half price refills. You will still make a profit and your sending out marketing materials.

Mr Beer
2013-09-25, 10:37 PM
rather then selling soda's invest in a fountain machine. I ran a convenience store for 2 years and trust me, the profit margin is much, much higher on fountain drinks. If you wind up doing lots of events it even lets you sell things like signature cups with half price refills. You will still make a profit and your sending out marketing materials.

What's the margin like on vending machines? Or is that like, the owners pay you a set rental fee to put one in the store and they collect the coins?

Ivellius
2013-09-25, 10:41 PM
You know what you should do? You should get a copy of the Starcraft game, and give a prize to anyone who can work out how the rules work, AND complete a full game of it :smalltongue:

I want a copy of that game. It's my type of thing.

Best wishes to you, Tyndmyr. It sounds like you're on the right track. Having a specific night or two dedicated to board games sounds like a good plan.

jedipotter
2013-09-25, 10:58 PM
That counterpoint only applies to board games, btw. I still think used RPG books would be great.

I'd guess you live in a part of the country that does not have Half Price Books?

tasw
2013-09-25, 11:32 PM
What's the margin like on vending machines? Or is that like, the owners pay you a set rental fee to put one in the store and they collect the coins?

To buy your looking at a grand or so.

But after that you buy these mixes that you put together with water in the line to the machine where a 10$ mix gets you about 40 gallons of drink. So its a big profit margin item and a 1k investment isnt really all that high when it comes to any sort of food or beverage equipment

valadil
2013-09-26, 08:11 AM
I'd guess you live in a part of the country that does not have Half Price Books?

Never heard of it, so I guess you're right. I'd still rather support FLGS than a book store though.

mathemagician
2013-09-26, 08:39 AM
I like the suggestion of used RPG books, but you will likely need a lot of storage for it. I swapped out all of my 3e stuff when 4e came out, and almost all of my 4e stuff when my group retired from it recently. My FLGS gave me a reasonable price on both, and I hope they can turn a profit on it. Of course the problem is that the stuff can sit in storage forever (though you can also probably run an online store through amazon or something similar). When Darksun 4e came out, I asked the staff if they had any of the old AD&D Darksun adventures sitting in storage, and was thrilled when the next week they had brought out some for me to peruse. Cost me a bit to buy one, but it was a great purchase :) They've been doing the used book thing forever it seems, so it must be working for them. It also adds a certain charm to the store, I always paw through the used books just for the memories :)

GrayGriffin
2013-09-26, 01:08 PM
3. Who are your customers? Some folks may come into your shop five times a week and buy $20 worth of snacks a month, others may come once every three months and buy $200 worth of books each time. If soda guy is bringing in paying friends, great.. if not, don't mistake him for the more valuable customer. Likewise, if your shop does online sales as well, keep that in mind and don't neglect the online order guy just because he is not in sight.

This is a horrible thing to say. I don't want to be treated as "less valuable" just because I can't afford to drop hundreds of dollars on a gaming book. Maybe I just want to have fun there. If you take the attitude that some customers are more valuable than others, you are creating a toxic environment and driving people away.

Logic
2013-09-26, 01:24 PM
This is a horrible thing to say. I don't want to be treated as "less valuable" just because I can't afford to drop hundreds of dollars on a gaming book. Maybe I just want to have fun there. If you take the attitude that some customers are more valuable than others, you are creating a toxic environment and driving people away.

Unfortunately, this is true (at least, partially.)

Dollars are dollars, and a shopkeeper is more likely to pay more attention to the customer that they know spend money there.

However, just because you may not be spending as much, and may not be as "valuable" a customer as the guy dropping $100 a week, word of mouth is the fastest way a business can succeed or fail. If you have a bad time, and tell people that "this shop caters to the rich jerkwads," then chances are that place of business will probably dry up as the meat and potatoes guys leave to find other, more accepting shops.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-26, 03:36 PM
rather then selling soda's invest in a fountain machine. I ran a convenience store for 2 years and trust me, the profit margin is much, much higher on fountain drinks. If you wind up doing lots of events it even lets you sell things like signature cups with half price refills. You will still make a profit and your sending out marketing materials.

We actually focus heavily on specialty sodas...sure, we've got the regular cans of mountain dew, but for instance, we got a bottled Butterbeer soda in yesterday, and immediately sold half a case of it to various Potter fans or people who wanted to try a butterscotch soda.

Not sure if that translates well to fountain machines or not...I'm just not familiar with them. Ditto for local vending machines. Right now, it's not really any trouble to ring people up for the occasional chips and drink, so I'm not worried about it, but maybe later, once there's more traffic, it'll be a good bet. Someone did suggest a retro video game machine or pinball machine, but noise might be an issue there.


Had another thought. What about preowned books and board games? I'd be way more likely to buy a board game on a whim if I thought I could cash out if I didn't like it. Instead they just take up space, which keeps me from buying more. I'd gladly trade in many of them for some store credit.

As a counterpoint to my own suggestion, you'd need to verify that board games you bought back were complete. I *think* most games include a card/pieces count in the manual, but handling that seems tedious and might not be the best use of employee time.

That counterpoint only applies to board games, btw. I still think used RPG books would be great.

We have sold a few preowned books(for cheaper, naturally), and those have been reasonably popular. Well, specifically, used pathfinder books sell like crack, while the 4e books have been roundly ignored. So, we'll have to be careful about which books we offer to buy, I suppose, but at least in principle, there's a market there.

The missing pieces for board games does worry me a bit. It happens in new games, even(not often, but it does happen). I cracked open a copy of Tahiti for the store demo copy, and it was missing one of the player tokens. Glad I hit that one, it'd definitely be a downer for a customer.

I've also considered having a swap day for customers to come in, trade games they're tired of and the like. Probably not a big money idea, but might be popular.


Within driving distance of me,there's -1-"gaming store" ....and it's all magic. The thing is,a RPG player in theory needs to buy one to three books and one set of dice and he can play forever,MTG players spend thousands.

Oh sure. Even less, maybe. You can use an online dice roller and use SRDs and have a functional game. RPGing isn't going to be the same money treadmill as CCGs is, but there's still value there. Gamers often enjoy multiple types of gaming, so you can appeal to them with other aspects they like. And hey, even if I only *need* one set of dice, I still own rather a lot more than that. I don't think I'm alone in having the dice bin, the shelf of geek games, etc, so I think maybe the RPG players aren't adequately appreciated by stores. Sure, they won't have the big splashy sales of Theros this weekend, but the snacks and minis purchased during a game help too. It all counts.

Also, this starcraft game sounds worrying. I till have copies of Tannhauser and Dust that I've never finished a game of because the rulebooks are sufficiently lengthy and unwieldy. They look like great games, but reading through a textbook of rules before gaming is rough.


Unfortunately, this is true (at least, partially.)

Dollars are dollars, and a shopkeeper is more likely to pay more attention to the customer that they know spend money there.

However, just because you may not be spending as much, and may not be as "valuable" a customer as the guy dropping $100 a week, word of mouth is the fastest way a business can succeed or fail. If you have a bad time, and tell people that "this shop caters to the rich jerkwads," then chances are that place of business will probably dry up as the meat and potatoes guys leave to find other, more accepting shops.

There's a fine balance, for sure. You need money to keep the lights on, but if the shop isn't actually a fun place to hang out, that's going to kill you in the long term.

I've had other business people freak out when I tell them that people can play in the store for free...but honestly, having people playing in here and having a great time has lots of value to me. Not only will they be more likely to buy here, they'll tell their friends and family, and it'll improve the atmosphere. So, I value both the guy that drops hundreds on each new magic set AND the guy that likes to hang around the shop playing RPGs...just for different reasons.

Edit: Also, fantastic idea on keeping around spare char sheets. We started keeping a stack of pathfinder sheets around, and it's been quite handy for a couple forgetful players already!

JusticeZero
2013-09-26, 08:32 PM
rather then selling soda's invest in a fountain machine.
Yeah, there's a reason that fast food places and the like can be so blase about offering free refills. Just charge for access/a cup, and they physically cannot drink enough to eat up the profit margin. That said, it'd be nice if more places offered fountain offerings that were both non/low-sugar and caffiene free, even if it's just soda water or something.

huttj509
2013-09-27, 04:47 AM
There's a fine balance, for sure. You need money to keep the lights on, but if the shop isn't actually a fun place to hang out, that's going to kill you in the long term.

I've had other business people freak out when I tell them that people can play in the store for free...but honestly, having people playing in here and having a great time has lots of value to me. Not only will they be more likely to buy here, they'll tell their friends and family, and it'll improve the atmosphere. So, I value both the guy that drops hundreds on each new magic set AND the guy that likes to hang around the shop playing RPGs...just for different reasons.


My view is, unless I'm missing a hidden cost, having someone hanging around not buying anything costs you nothing, as you'd be open anyway, and the impact of one person on the heating/cooling system is negligible.

This is unless he starts being an impediment to customers or prospective customers (either from crowding the store, being obnoxious/loud, etc.).

Tyndmyr
2013-09-27, 10:41 AM
My view is, unless I'm missing a hidden cost, having someone hanging around not buying anything costs you nothing, as you'd be open anyway, and the impact of one person on the heating/cooling system is negligible.

This is unless he starts being an impediment to customers or prospective customers (either from crowding the store, being obnoxious/loud, etc.).

Nah, that's pretty much it. Sure, there's mild wear and tear on stuff, but that's pretty much life. You gotta expect that.

Sure, I'll kick out someone who's being particularly obnoxious, but it hasn't come up yet, and anyway, it'd have nothing to do with purchasing.

People can't always buy all the time...sometimes they go through periods of not having money or what not, but circumstances can always change, and people are obviously going to remember how you treated them before. Plus, there's always word of mouth. I see no real downside to free play for all, and a lot of upsides. I mean, I'm gonna have play space anyway, may as well have it well used.

valadil
2013-09-27, 10:44 AM
Plus, there's always word of mouth. I see no real downside to free play for all, and a lot of upsides. I mean, I'm gonna have play space anyway, may as well have it well used.

And there's a definite upside. Free advertising. If you have people in the store having fun playing games, that will draw attention and make other people want to try those games.

Mordar
2013-09-27, 07:51 PM
What's the margin like on vending machines? Or is that like, the owners pay you a set rental fee to put one in the store and they collect the coins?

Short answer is "it depends". Bottlers will often place machines (like at apartment complexes) and share the proceeds with the venue, private vendor services will do the same with a lower share for the venue, and venue purchase and stocking of the machine is also a possibility, with 100% of proceeds to the venue, but the added headache of maintenance and stocking.

Re: Fountain

Check with your local health department regarding potential inspection needs for soda fountains. The applicability varies wildly depending on the state/county as to the requirement, so ask.

- M

Mr Beer
2013-09-27, 08:16 PM
Short answer is "it depends". Bottlers will often place machines (like at apartment complexes) and share the proceeds with the venue, private vendor services will do the same with a lower share for the venue, and venue purchase and stocking of the machine is also a possibility, with 100% of proceeds to the venue, but the added headache of maintenance and stocking.

Interesting. It seems like an ideal way to do it, in the sense that you get paid and someone else looks after the machine, but I guess it comes down to how much time other options take and profitability. I imagine the margins are much higher on soda fountains based on tasw's posts.

Serpentine
2013-09-28, 03:09 AM
The missing pieces for board games does worry me a bit. It happens in new games, even(not often, but it does happen). I cracked open a copy of Tahiti for the store demo copy, and it was missing one of the player tokens. Glad I hit that one, it'd definitely be a downer for a customer.It's not such a big deal with new games, though, to get a replacement. I once got a Monopoly set that had all Australian Monopoly cards in it for some reason. It was kind of annoying, but I just had to call the company once and they sent me the right set of cards - no proof or anything required. I'd imagine (hope) most game companies are like that.
I like the idea of second hand board games as well, but yeah, you would want to check it first.

I've also considered having a swap day for customers to come in, trade games they're tired of and the like. Probably not a big money idea, but might be popular.Ooo, I like that idea too,

Also, this starcraft game sounds worrying.
It is worrying, that's why you should have a prize for completing a game of it! :smallbiggrin:

tasw
2013-09-28, 03:43 AM
We actually focus heavily on specialty sodas...sure, we've got the regular cans of mountain dew, but for instance, we got a bottled Butterbeer soda in yesterday, and immediately sold half a case of it to various Potter fans or people who wanted to try a butterscotch soda.

Not sure if that translates well to fountain machines or not...I'm just not familiar with them. Ditto for local vending machines. Right now, it's not really any trouble to ring people up for the occasional chips and drink, so I'm not worried about it, but maybe later, once there's more traffic, it'll be a good bet. Someone did suggest a retro video game machine or pinball machine, but noise might be an issue there.


Well here's my thought, assuming your having lots of events. if not, doesnt matter. But heres the numbers.

10$ worth of fountain drink mix equals 20 gallons when mixed with water or 5120 ounces, in a 16 oz serving gets you 320 servings of soda. The paper cups are about 5 cents each if you have a terrible retailer so your paying 37 cents per serving with a fountain machine. Since people expect a deal when buying a fountain drink you charge 1.19 (and thus sell more) for 16 oz. With a profit margin of 82 cents per drink.

But if you buy the bottles a 16 oz bottle of major brand soda generally sells for about 1.49 (west coast) and if you order enough to have a dedicated pepsi-co route salesmen you can usually get them for around 1.09, meaning you make 40 cents per bottle. This number will fluctuate with sales and such but its a fair measure to make over say 5 years of sales.

so 320 servings with pre-bottled soda's (and specialty drinks probably have lower profit margins, they often do at retail level) get you 128$.

However that same 320 servings with the fountain machine get you 164 $.

Assuming you only sell 200 a week, which is absurdly conservative with events thats a difference of 36$ a week, 144$ a month or 1728$ a year.

Assuming you own this shop for 30 years that one small change is 51,840 in your retirement account when that time comes.

I've been a consultant with GE for a long time focusing on retail and we have a saying "2% sounds small but 2% year over year is what makes millionaires. "

This one small change is much more then 2%.

8 years of small business consulting, heres my best advice on everything.

Find every way to make a 2% difference you can.

paddyfool
2013-09-28, 04:17 AM
This sounds like a far better gaming shop than any in my area already. One tiny suggestion: it would be great for access if there's a point outside for people to lock bicycles to / chain motorbikes. (Of course, I don't know what the local usage statistics of these are, or how bicycle-friendly your local transport infrastructure is, so the amount of customers you'd be catering to in this way could be minimal; so YMMV).

Tyndmyr
2013-09-28, 11:12 AM
This sounds like a far better gaming shop than any in my area already. One tiny suggestion: it would be great for access if there's a point outside for people to lock bicycles to / chain motorbikes. (Of course, I don't know what the local usage statistics of these are, or how bicycle-friendly your local transport infrastructure is, so the amount of customers you'd be catering to in this way could be minimal; so YMMV).

Haven't had any bikers yet, but we do have an iron fence & lampposts that could certainly be used to lock bikes too...hadn't thought of that, but I'll definitely suggest it if anyone wants to lock up a bike.


Well here's my thought, assuming your having lots of events. if not, doesnt matter. But heres the numbers.

Oh, this is good. Yeah, trying to go as event heavy as possible. This week, we only have maybe six events, but eventually, I'd like to see events every day, with multiples on weekends, etc. We can do half a dozen tables inside and a few outside with a great deal of room to spare, so events are great for us...and the incidental snacks and drinks sales are significant.


10$ worth of fountain drink mix equals 20 gallons when mixed with water or 5120 ounces, in a 16 oz serving gets you 320 servings of soda. The paper cups are about 5 cents each if you have a terrible retailer so your paying 37 cents per serving with a fountain machine. Since people expect a deal when buying a fountain drink you charge 1.19 (and thus sell more) for 16 oz. With a profit margin of 82 cents per drink.

But if you buy the bottles a 16 oz bottle of major brand soda generally sells for about 1.49 (west coast) and if you order enough to have a dedicated pepsi-co route salesmen you can usually get them for around 1.09, meaning you make 40 cents per bottle. This number will fluctuate with sales and such but its a fair measure to make over say 5 years of sales.

so 320 servings with pre-bottled soda's (and specialty drinks probably have lower profit margins, they often do at retail level) get you 128$.

Specialty drinks do have lower profit margins, but they have higher profit overall since they're more expensive. They range from $2-$3 a glass bottle, and we try not to have margins lower than 40%(though there is a certain amount of rounding because even prices are easier for all).

For instance, a glass bottle of mexican coke costs us 75 cents(plus a somewhat variable cost for delivery depending on size of order...but usually fairly trivial given the volume we're doing soda orders in). It retails for $2, so margin percentage on it is the highest of the specialty sodas. It still isn't going to touch the percentage margin on a fountain drink, but on a per-sale basis, it does pretty well.

Honestly, the specialty drinks have done far, far better than I thought they would. I figured mostly, it'd be people trying out the occasional oddball energy drink or unusual soda as a treat, but in practice, everyone would mostly drink the much cheaper canned sodas. Over the past month, we've only sold a full box of one canned soda(mountain dew), and less than a box of all other canned sodas combined. For perspective, we've sold a case of specialty sodas in a single day. Apparently, people find an unusual soda that they love, and then they buy the hell out of it.

This is probably specific to this area. It's well above average income, and a lot of my customers don't appear to worry much about price at that level. So, I'm *probably* not going to get a soda fountain until/if this changes, because I really don't know how I'd manage the specialty sodas with that, and the regular sodas don't have much for volume. However, the principle is sound.


I've been a consultant with GE for a long time focusing on retail and we have a saying "2% sounds small but 2% year over year is what makes millionaires. "

This one small change is much more then 2%.

8 years of small business consulting, heres my best advice on everything.

Find every way to make a 2% difference you can.

Absolutely. Right now, this is probably credit card processing. The Square reader worked pretty solidly at lower volumes, but it's about time to move up to something different to save a touch on those fees. I must say, I really hate this particular choice, because roughly a billion different companies call you and try to do the hard sell. Got to be done, though. 2.75% off the top adds up surprisingly fast.

Mando Knight
2013-09-28, 01:38 PM
Honestly, the specialty drinks have done far, far better than I thought they would. I figured mostly, it'd be people trying out the occasional oddball energy drink or unusual soda as a treat, but in practice, everyone would mostly drink the much cheaper canned sodas. Over the past month, we've only sold a full box of one canned soda(mountain dew), and less than a box of all other canned sodas combined. For perspective, we've sold a case of specialty sodas in a single day. Apparently, people find an unusual soda that they love, and then they buy the hell out of it.

This is probably specific to this area. It's well above average income, and a lot of my customers don't appear to worry much about price at that level. So, I'm *probably* not going to get a soda fountain until/if this changes, because I really don't know how I'd manage the specialty sodas with that, and the regular sodas don't have much for volume. However, the principle is sound.
Well, the one thing you have with specialty soda vs "normal" soda is lack of competition. People may buy a normal soda or two if they're in the shop and happen to need a drink. But the specialty sodas? You might be the only shop around with them in stock. If they find a specialty soda that they like, and you're the only place (or the closest place, at least) that sells it, they'll be more likely to drop in and pick one (or more) up.

Fortis
2013-09-28, 05:48 PM
Man, I wish you were opening up where I live. That shop sounds like it'd be a fun place to go. Best of luck with it!

Jyton
2013-09-28, 06:38 PM
Real chairs and real tables to play around, as in solid wood. I cannot emphasize this enough. I don't know how difficult the logistics of getting them would be for you, but that is one of the best ways to make people feel comfortable. I moved cities in my early twenties, and the thing I miss most about my old city was my FLGS. I haven't been able to find a LGS that's comfortable to play at, which is really disappointing. They all use folding medal chairs or stackable plastic chairs and flimsy plastic tables, and that's just not comfortable.

On retail vs online; you can't complete on price, period. What you can, and indeed must do, is sell an experience. Look up "how malls manipulate you" and base your lighting and atmosphere on that. They've already spent literally millions upon millions in market research, use that. Smell is important, it's the sense most closely tied to memory. If your place starts to smell, people may not consciously think "I don't want to go there because the place stinks" but they will know that there was something about the place that was off-putting, and that will nudge them away from returning. Cleaning the bathrooms once a day is the bare minimum. You should also do frequent checks during events. Even if those paper towels were on the floor for less than two hours, say, if 15 or 20 people experienced a dirty bathroom, well then, 15 or 20 people remember "dirty bathroom."

On rare redrafts; Don't.

Rare redrafts are, from a costomer retention standpoint, the same as physically walking up to a customer and physically slapping them across the face. Or kicking their puppy. Or calling them fat and ugly and bringing everyone over to mock them with you. Or... well you get the idea. People share (read talk about) good experiences with on average two people, and bad experiences with seven. Don't be in the business of bad experiences, since good experiences will be what bring people in and keeps them coming.

Finally, people like inclusion, and recognition. Visibles memberships, such as badges, let people feel like part of the "in crowd." That's a great thing, because they'll keep coming back for that feeling. Sell a membership with rewards, drink credits, other preferential treatment, humans eat that stuff up. Be careful to keep that as a positive however, it should never be "you can't because you aren't" it should always be "they can because they are."

I know I'm forgetting some points I meant to include, but I've already given you a wall of text to go through, so I figure I'll leave off here for the time being.

Tyndmyr
2013-09-28, 10:24 PM
Well, the one thing you have with specialty soda vs "normal" soda is lack of competition. People may buy a normal soda or two if they're in the shop and happen to need a drink. But the specialty sodas? You might be the only shop around with them in stock. If they find a specialty soda that they like, and you're the only place (or the closest place, at least) that sells it, they'll be more likely to drop in and pick one (or more) up.

Yeah, that does seem likely. I know we're definitely the only place anywhere even vaguely close that carries Bawls, for instance. One of only two places that carry Big Red. Certainly the only place around that carries Butterbeer.

I wonder if there are niche snacks that would fill a similar role in the snack department...hmm. The snack selection is wide, but it's very typical, doesn't have the same exotic appeal. May have to work on that.


Real chairs and real tables to play around, as in solid wood. I cannot emphasize this enough. I don't know how difficult the logistics of getting them would be for you, but that is one of the best ways to make people feel comfortable. I moved cities in my early twenties, and the thing I miss most about my old city was my FLGS. I haven't been able to find a LGS that's comfortable to play at, which is really disappointing. They all use folding medal chairs or stackable plastic chairs and flimsy plastic tables, and that's just not comfortable.

Right now, we've got folding chairs....but at least the not-crappy padded folding chairs. Unfortunately, not a matched set, since it's literally the sets that each of the gamers involved had in their basements. We have a ton of them, and they're all good quality and in perfect condition, but the mismatched bit is a weak point that can certainly be shored up.

Tables are plastic, mostly for easily mobility and cleanliness. The good plastic tables, though. The ones Costco sells for 40-50 bucks each, they're pretty stable, and they line up nicely with each other. Not as good as the custom wooden gaming tables, of course, but they're really practical for magic in terms of dimensions, and they work pretty nicely for roleplaying when you put two side by side(perfect space for map and lots of sheets/books on table). Maybe something to improve upon long term, but it's functional for now. Oh, the outside tables are glass with a metal frame. Very solid, because they've got to stand up to the elements.



On retail vs online; you can't complete on price, period. What you can, and indeed must do, is sell an experience.

Oddly enough, we do in a few sectors. The internet is great at some things, but shipping and handling are obnoxious for small orders, and collectable things sometimes go for inflated amounts on amazon/ebay as people try to manipulate the prices. For instance, in magic singles, we match or beat everyone online that matters. Buying boxes at wholesale or flipping local chase rares that customers swap works well if you know the market extremely well...but any card with a value under a couple of bucks suffers a lot online because of shipping.

That doesn't replace the experience bit, of course, that's still extremely important, but I stay aware of online pricing. We can't beat them on everything, but even where we don't, the gap matters. If someone googles your game and sees it for five bucks more online, well, convenience matters. He'll probably shrug and buy it here. If it's half the price...that's different. I've noticed that some other stores seem to just ignore online pricing altogether, selling stuff for well over MSRP and what not. Seems potentially problematic.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm gonna make sure there's a healthy margin on what I sell...I just rely more heavily on the supply side than the sales side for making sure that exists. I got a great deal on a ton of copies of Tahiti(solid game, deals mean nothing without that), so I can easily run a sale of it next month for $25, even though MSRP is $35.

Serpentine
2013-09-29, 11:10 PM
Re. Snacks: TimTams! Fantales! Minties! :biggrin:
Actually, as cool as that sort of thing would be, they tend to be pretty expensive over there or so I hear.
...
Now I want TimTams :/

Kaun
2013-09-29, 11:30 PM
Re. Snacks: TimTams! Fantales! Minties! :biggrin:
Actually, as cool as that sort of thing would be, they tend to be pretty expensive over there or so I hear.
...
Now I want TimTams :/


I have a feeling these are all local to Aus only Serp. I know TimTams are but i wouldn't be surprised if the other to are as well.

Edit: I re read your post and realized you had mentioned this point. Though in saying that most yanks don't even know what those things are.

Mr Beer
2013-09-30, 12:40 AM
Fantails and Minties are mainly special because childhood nostalgia value. Every civilised country has decent toffee/chocolate and mints. Tim Tams are an objectively superior biscuit though.

paddyfool
2013-09-30, 02:12 AM
Well, if the Butterbeer sold well, one or another of these recipes (http://www.brittablvd.com/wizards/recipes.html)might be an option.

Serpentine
2013-09-30, 09:43 AM
I have a feeling these are all local to Aus only Serp. I know TimTams are but i wouldn't be surprised if the other to are as well.

Edit: I re read your post and realized you had mentioned this point. Though in saying that most yanks don't even know what those things are.Well yeah, that's the point... Tyndmyr was wondering about "niche snacks" with "exotic appeal" that "fill a similar role" to the difficult-to-find drinks.

veti
2013-10-01, 05:38 PM
OK, these may or may not be valuable, but you asked about "the perfect" shop. That's a pretty high bar you're setting. So:

If there are drinks, make sure there's water. I want to be able to get something with no sugar (or other sweetener) in it. I'm perfectly willing to pay (probably less than soda prices, though), but if you meet this requirement with a filtered tap or water cooler, make sure it's kept sparkly clean and the supply of cups is pristine.

One big turn-off for me is to look into a "games" shop, and see that a disproportionate amount of it (vaguely defined as "more than about 25%") is devoted to a single system (e.g. M:tG or D&D). 'Games Workshop' was originally a fine store, but it degenerated when it started selling 'Warhammer', and declined further in my estimation as that product took over more and more of the shop.

"Events" are great and all, but don't neglect the casual visitor. If an event makes the shop an intimidating place for the person who's just looking for a gift for their nephew/sister/whatever, then your customer base will soon be limited to hardcore geeks only. You know better than I do if that's how you want to position your business, but I would think it's limiting.

In the same vein, position your playing tables well away from the product shelves. Not to say in a different room, but people should be able to play, and other people should be able to come in to browse, without either party feeling that the other is looking over their shoulder.

Good luck.

Tyndmyr
2013-10-01, 10:44 PM
Well yeah, that's the point... Tyndmyr was wondering about "niche snacks" with "exotic appeal" that "fill a similar role" to the difficult-to-find drinks.

Sounds good. They probably won't all be hits, but when you're working with niche stuff, there's a certain element of guessing at what the hits are. Still shocked about the butterbeers. We entirely sold out in under a week. Other things, we sold maybe one, and the rest are just sitting. *shrug* Part of the game.

And yeah, nostalgia totally has value. Big Red is a huge southern drink, so we sell a lot of it to people who moved up here from the deep south and haven't seen it in forever. I'm just not terribly creative with my own candy consumption, so it isn't a big deal for me. Hmm, wonder if bubble tape is still around...I remember that from when I was a kid...

Sadly, recipes don't work as well. Making food for sale runs into licensing issues that selling prepackaged snacks don't. It's a shame too...one of the guys involved with the store is an amazing chef. Can't do everything, I suppose.


OK, these may or may not be valuable, but you asked about "the perfect" shop. That's a pretty high bar you're setting. So:

If there are drinks, make sure there's water. I want to be able to get something with no sugar (or other sweetener) in it. I'm perfectly willing to pay (probably less than soda prices, though), but if you meet this requirement with a filtered tap or water cooler, make sure it's kept sparkly clean and the supply of cups is pristine.

There is indeed bottled water...same $1 price, but of course, larger bottle. *shrug* Tap water is available, and it certainly is safe and free, but the iron content is a little high, so it tastes a bit off. There is a sink available(other than the bathroom) though, if people want to use it.


One big turn-off for me is to look into a "games" shop, and see that a disproportionate amount of it (vaguely defined as "more than about 25%") is devoted to a single system (e.g. M:tG or D&D). 'Games Workshop' was originally a fine store, but it degenerated when it started selling 'Warhammer', and declined further in my estimation as that product took over more and more of the shop.

That's an excellent point...we might have the opposite issue. Right now, the wall of board games is maybe a little too big in relation to everything else. Selection in that area is crazy, but it might be overshadowing other stuff. *orders games workshop rack* That should help somewhat...and I'm definitely going to pad out RPGs somewhat. We've literally not sold anything but Pathfinder and Castles and Crusades, though both of those have done well...but people certainly browse through the other stuff. Perhaps there is some value to people in exploring the oddball things, even if they're there for the basics.



"Events" are great and all, but don't neglect the casual visitor. If an event makes the shop an intimidating place for the person who's just looking for a gift for their nephew/sister/whatever, then your customer base will soon be limited to hardcore geeks only. You know better than I do if that's how you want to position your business, but I would think it's limiting.

True, true. Holidays are coming, and I certainly don't want to be exclusionary. I admit, I don't particularly aim at the kids market, so the crowd I get tends to be more 20-35, but the geek level and interests seem to vary significantly. I like events, but they aren't necessarily competitive in nature. Halloween, we're gonna have some kind of thematic(possibly CoC) roleplaying event, likely some costumes, candy, a few decorations, that kind of thing. Maybe a sale or promotion for an appropriately horror-themed game(several excellent ones exist).

And thanks all for the kind wishes. =)

Mando Knight
2013-10-02, 12:05 AM
Can't do everything, I suppose.

Nonsense! It needs to be Cardboard Gaming: Restaurant, Resort, Hotel, and Supermarket! :smalltongue:

GrayGriffin
2013-10-02, 12:52 AM
Is the licensing issue only with selling homemade stuff? Could you, for example, make snacks of some sort and hand them out for free? I'm not sure how that would affect costs, but I think it would be a big draw.

Oh, that made me think of an event idea! A combination game night/potluck! I have no idea if it would work with your scope, but you could also just have everyone bring "snack" type foods instead of "meal" foods?

I dunno, it's late and I'm rambling.

Melayl
2013-10-02, 07:39 AM
Hmm, wonder if bubble tape is still around...I remember that from when I was a kid...

Indeed it is. My kids beg me for it every time we go to the grocery store.

Tyndmyr
2013-10-04, 01:20 AM
Indeed it is. My kids beg me for it every time we go to the grocery store.

I used to eat that stuff all the time. Don't know if it counts as sufficiently rare to be nostalgic. *shrug* Im quite fond of them, but I might be biased here.

Gray, I *think* that giving stuff away is less regulated than selling it, but I'm not really certain of the details. The laws are hella complex in general, and I haven't invested the time to comb through them thoroughly. At a minimum, stuff like giving out commercial candies on halloween is good times.

Ran into one aspiring game designer today...I'm hoping I can find enough of them to put together some type of meetup/playtest group. It'd be seriously awesome to have locally designed games and such.