Human Paragon 1

[Human Paragon 3]

As you can see by my forum name, I am a huge fan of Human Paragon. I am starting a new game soon (as a player) and am thinking of playing a Human Paragon / Spirit Shaman.

We're starting at level 1.

The obvious thing to do is to take the Spirit Shaman level first, but then I won't have my good knowledge skills at level 1.

If I start with human paragon, I won't have any SPELLS at level 1. And a BAB of 0. In fact, the only ability I will have is my skills and feats.

So my question to you, is how can I make an interesting character at level 1 using just 1 level of human paragon and its skills and feats?

[Grod_The_Giant]

No-one is very interesting at first level. Wear light armor, swing a greatsword or something, and let your skills be the things that make you interesting-- they won't be overshadowed by spells yet.

[Human Paragon 3]

I think what I'm really asking for is advice on feat selection. I get two feats that will encompass my entire catalogue of powers (other than skills).

[Grod_The_Giant]

I think what I'm really asking for is advice on feat selection. I get two feats that will encompass my entire catalogue of powers (other than skills).
Ah. In that case, we're going to have to know what kind of character you're going for-- melee? Ranged? How's your casting going to look? What party roles will you need to cover?

[Chronos]

Knowledge Devotion, maybe? Given that you're planning on pumping knowledge skills anyway. Though the usefulness of this later on will depend on what sorts of spells you're planning on picking up from Spirit Shaman.

[Human Paragon 3]

He's going to eschew personal combat and stick to spells... I was thinking Knowledge Devotion, but I'm not sure I really want to play a guy who wallops other guys in the face, even brainily.

Does Knowledge Devotion actually affect spell damage?

Eventually I hope to use him for utility casting, crowd control, support, and knowledge skill monkeying.

[Harrow]

Knowledge Devotion gives a bonus to "damage rolls" not "weapon damage rolls" so it adds to all spells, even ones like fireball. Some DM's are not OK with this and limit it to weapon damage rolls, meaning it only effects weapon-like spells (spells with attack rolls).

Unfortunately, it requires 5 ranks in any knowledge skill and so can only be taken at level one if you can also manage Favored and Primary Contact from Cityscape, which AFAIK requires flaws.

[Fable Wright]

No-one is very interesting at first level. Wear light armor, swing a greatsword or something, and let your skills be the things that make you interesting-- they won't be overshadowed by spells yet.

Not strictly true. There are Elven Domain Generalists throwing around their 9th level spell of choice. On a more balanced note, Duskblades with Deceptive/Fascinating Illumination and spell selection like Color Spray and Blade of Blood can melee, incapacitate people with spells, use minor battlefield control, and have knowledge skills. Factotums have things like Iajutsu Focus, Autohypnosis, social skills, and the cheap stuff from Shax's Indispensable Haversack that they crafted. Swordsages have a lot of variety in their maneuvers and some good skills, enough to make combat and out of combat interesting.

[Telonius]

Able Learner would be a pretty good option. It sounds like you're going to be all about the skills, you're going to be a human, it's a First-Level-Only feat, and most casting classes who names don't start with B have terrible skill lists.

[Caligstro Smith]

I'm a huge fan of using the "only may be taken as a 1st-level character" feats when possible. Some that might be of interest include:

Gift of Tongues (Ghostwalk): Your Int is +4 for determining your starting bonus languages, Speak Language is always in-class for you, and you get a +1 on all Innuendo and Sense Motive checks.

Multilingual (Lost Empires of Faerun): You know 3 more languages than you normally would, which can be selected even from those not on your bonus languages (still not Druidic/secret ones tho). Speak Language is again always in-class for you, but unlike Gift of Tongues you get a +2 on Decipher Script checks instead.

There's the lulzy Spellfire Wielder (Magic of Faerun) that lets you use spellfire, but ofc this requires you get it past your DM w/o suffering book-induced concussion.

Arcane Schooling (Player's Guide to Faerun): Choose 1 Arcane casting class. You may activate spell-trigger items as if you had 1 level in the class. The class is also considered a favored class in addition to your other(s). Useful to avoid needing to invest in UMD, or if you're planning on Theurging later.

Blooded (Player's Guide to Faerun): +2 Initiative, +2 spot checks, and you cannot become shaken AND you ignore the effects of the shaken condition (I guess in case you STILL become shaken somehow? IE: Dread Witch?) (you can still be Frightened or Panicked though)

Bullheaded (Player's Guide to Faerun): +2 Will saves and you cannot become shaken AND ignore the effects of shaken condition. (aka SUPER Iron Will. If you're going to need this for a feat tax anyway, it'd be worth checking if the DM will allow it to substitute in place of Iron Will)

Cosmopolitan (Player's Guide to Faerun): +2 Bluff, Gather Information, and Sense Motive checks. Not the greatest, but if you're going Skill centric, it's better than your average +2 to 2 skills feats if you're going the social route.

Dauntless (Player's Guide to Faerun): +5 hit points. Basically it's SUPER Toughness. Only listed in case you need Toughness as some feat tax for some reason and you can convince your DM to let you sub this but CAN'T convince them to let you sub Improved Toughness instead...

Fearless (Player's Guide to Faerun): You're immune to fear effects. Not bad for a feat.

Mercantile Background (Player's Guide to Faerun): You get +300 gp at character creation, plus you sell items at 75% market instead of 50%, and you can buy 1 item/month at 75% market price. Great for saving money on really expensive stuff and for boosting value of random loot you don't want by 50%.

Silver Palm (Player's Guide to Faerun): Like Cosmopolitan, but for merchants, or maybe social thieves: +2 Appraise, Bluff, and Sense Motive.

Street Tough (Player's Guide to Faerun): JUST LIKE Cosmopolitan, but for mean people. +2 Gather Info, Intimidate, Sense Motive.

Survivor (Player's Guide to Faerun): SUPER Great Fortitude. If you need it for some reason, see if you can get the DM to let you use this instead. Adds +2 to Survival checks, b/c why not? Better than NOT having +2 to survival checks... *shrug*

[Fax Celestis]

I agree with the poster above but I am appalled he omitted Luck of Heroes. +1 luck to ac and all saves, for a feat? It's like better dodge plus half of the save bonus feats, and it stacks with everything.

[Christine Daae]

I find a very useful feat to counteract the loss of spells for one level to be Spellcasting prodigy. For the purpose of bonus spells your primary casting stat is considered 2 higher. While not great that normally nets you at a minimum of +1 spell per day, at best it gives you 2 or 3 extra spells.

If you are working in a frozen tundra combine this with Frostfell Prodigy (I think thats what its called) and gain +8 to your primary casting stat for bonus spells. Now thats a lot of extra bonus spells. I have a friend working off of this concept right now in a game taking place in a frozen wasteland to great effect.

[Story]

I agree with the poster above but I am appalled he omitted Luck of Heroes. +1 luck to ac and all saves, for a feat? It's like better dodge plus half of the save bonus feats, and it stacks with everything.

It's less appealing if you consider it turning your Strongheart Halfling back into a crappy regular Halfling.

Speaking of feats that boost saves, Lifebond is really good if you can become Necropolitan somehow.

[Fax Celestis]

It's less appealing if you consider it turning your Strongheart Halfling back into a crappy regular Halfling.

...except Luck of Heroes'd Strongheart Halflings are better than regular halflings. You essentially trade +1 racial on saves up to +1 luck on saves and AC.

[Story]

But you can often get luck bonuses from other sources. And AC isn't terribly important in comparison to the feat you're giving up.

[Urpriest]

You could just stock up on feats that will be useful once you gain a few levels. Spell Focus + Augment Summoning, for example, is something you want to get off the ground as soon as you start doing summoning seriously. Just spend this level making skill checks and waving a greatsword around.

[Kuulvheysoon]

It's less appealing if you consider it turning your Strongheart Halfling back into a crappy regular Halfling.

Speaking of feats that boost saves, Lifebond is really good if you can become Necropolitan somehow.

Also keep in mind that we're talking about a Human Paragon.

[ahenobarbi]

I agree with the poster above but I am appalled he omitted Luck of Heroes. +1 luck to ac and all saves, for a feat? It's like better dodge plus half of the save bonus feats, and it stacks with everything.

It's pretty meh. Small numerical bonuses are rather boring. Could be ok for level 1 if you can re-train it later.



Speaking of feats that boost saves, Lifebond is really good if you can become Necropolitan somehow.


Also keep in mind that we're talking about a Human Paragon.

You need qualify only when taking first level of the class, right :smallwink:


You could just stock up on feats that will be useful once you gain a few levels. Spell Focus + Augment Summoning, for example, is something you want to get off the ground as soon as you start doing summoning seriously. Just spend this level making skill checks and waving a greatsword around.

Won't make interesting level 1 (though few are interesting at level 1).

I second suggestion of able learner - it won't help you at level one but will be great for your build (probably).

Magical training (Players Guide to Faerun) will give you some cantrips to play with (take it only if you can retrain it later).

Bind Vestige (Tome of Magic) could be nice.

[Kuulvheysoon]

You need qualify only when taking first level of the class, right :smallwink:I was actually referring to the entire Halfling/Strongheart halfling discussion, not the second half of the post.:smallsmile:

[Story]

Also keep in mind that we're talking about a Human Paragon.

I was bringing up Strongheart Halfing to imply that most people don't think Luck of the Heroes is worth it. If it was, Strongheart Halfling wouldn't be in such high demand.



You need qualify only when taking first level of the class, right :smallwink:


I think you can still qualify as a Necropolitan. It doesn't change your race. The bigger problem is that it only becomes available when the party is 3rd level so you can't take it starting out. But if you want to boost your saves via feat for some reason, it's worth consideration later.

[John Longarrow]

I'd suggest not mixing it with Spirit Shaman unless you are going into a campaign that is heavy on "Spirits" as defined by the class. It plays as much weaker than a druid/cleric/favored soul. Druid spell list isn't all that exciting, plus while you can change your spells daily, you are still only using a small number each day. You run into even worse problems than a normal caster regarding "What shall I prepare for today?" without most of the upside other casters get.