Need some help with my Copper Dragon

[Haxis]

Hey Everyone,

So I have a copper dragon that I play as a PC in a campaign that all the PC's are dragons. There is a gold and a red in the campaign but I liked the trickster, taunting aspects of the Copper.
Right now we're young adults, with 2 extra PC levels. I chose Sorc to stack spells, but right now I don't feel as strong as I want to be.
STR : 25(+7) DEX:12(+1) CON: 25(+7) INT 21(+5) WIS 16(+3) CHA 23(+6)

Feats weren't chosen by me, this DM is very particular in the way he does things. I have Fly By Attack, Hover, Multiattack, Awesome blow ( have never used and can swap ) Power Attack, Combat Casting.

What would you do with this guy? What prestige should I look to? I have one level comming pretty soon.

Any advice is would be awesome, I like Elemental Master however don't like the lone druid aspect of it.

[HalfQuart]

Here's a helpful thread about PrCs for Sorcerers, The Improved Sorcerer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=294500), which you might want to peruse.

Combat Casting is probably suboptimal for you, unless you're using it as a prerequisite for something (like Abjurant Champion, which might work out well for you), since the concentration checks for casting defensively should be pretty easy with a +7 Con modifier. I'd buy a Tunic of Steady Spellcasting from MIC before taking that feat.

[Urpriest]

Luckily on the feat angle, you guys should have enough money at this level to pay a Psion to use Psychic Reformation on you so you can re-choose your feats. That will allow you to pick feats that help with the Trickster angle and let you feel different from your fellow dragons. I'd recommend Knowledge Devotion as one of them, fits the "wanderer" theme that Coppers seem to have. And I'll reinforce the suggestion of Abjurant Champion, it should fit your setup well. Maybe consider Unseen Seer instead if you really want to focus on sneakiness, you may want a Rogue or Spellthief dip first.

[John Longarrow]

See if you can get two ranks in Tumble and the feats Dodge and Iron Will. That would let you dip into Dragon Slayer (Full BAB, Casting at first, D10 HP and immunity to fear) before going into something more fun.

Hey, never hurts to be good at killing evil dragons... :smallcool:

[Haxis]

John > so as a copper, you'd take a rank in dragonslayer? How would that work?

Urpriest > Sorry, he doesn't believe in running his campaign with Psionics, so this isn't an option to me :(

Thanks HalfQuart> but I'm still a dragon. not prof with armor or weapons, so I'm not sure if the tunic thing would work.I do agree with taking out combat casting, but we'll see how it turns out. Can a dragon really stealth?


I'm thinking about dipping into Incanatrix right now, I like all the meta magic powers in conjunction with some of the dragon spells. But I'm thinking a dip into rogue would be fun for sneak attack etc.

Anyone else with any other ideas?

[John Longarrow]

Haxis,
Reason for Dragonslayer is to prevent you from being affected by Fear PLUS it boost your innate casting (if you have any).

Urpriest is from complete divine. It lets you cast cleric spells that you steal from the gods. Requires you to be non-good though.

[Urpriest]

Thanks HalfQuart> but I'm still a dragon. not prof with armor or weapons, so I'm not sure if the tunic thing would work.I do agree with taking out combat casting, but we'll see how it turns out. Can a dragon really stealth?

The tunic is fine. Draconomicon has a list of which items Dragons can use, pretty sure vest slot is on there.

Stealthwise...you won't be great at it out of the box, given your size and low Dex. But with enough resources it might be viable.

[Haxis]

Urpriest > I'll have to look over that again, thanks!

I would like to know if Abjurant Champion will go well with Incanatrix? or would that weaken the over all character?

So as a lvl 2 sorcerer + young adult dragon I cast as a 7th level sorcerer atm. with my next level coming into Incanatrix, ( he's also going to age us once ) that puts me casting at 10th level.

Is there anything in this level range that I can use / do that is considered game breaking? ( so I can avoid it, seriously )

[Urpriest]

Urpriest > I'll have to look over that again, thanks!

I would like to know if Abjurant Champion will go well with Incanatrix? or would that weaken the over all character?

So as a lvl 2 sorcerer + young adult dragon I cast as a 7th level sorcerer atm. with my next level coming into Incanatrix, ( he's also going to age us once ) that puts me casting at 10th level.

Is there anything in this level range that I can use / do that is considered game breaking? ( so I can avoid it, seriously )

With that much casting, Incantatrix has a lot of game-breaking potential, but if you avoid using it that way you should be able to get some good mileage out of it.

Broadly speaking, you're a gish character, with lots of melee-focused feats but still solid spellcasting. As such, Incantatrix would let you Persist various spells (though since your feats are fixed, it might be a bit till you can get in), while Abjurant Champion would give you lots of nice Gish-tricks. I think they would go together well.

[Haxis]

Hey Everyone!

So after much begging I got to redesign my dragon to something that I'd like to do however there are a few catches : No Psionics, No ebberon, Limited Cheese, no dragon druids / dragon monks.

I'd like to do something like this :
While I am Still a Dragon: Wyrm of War Ancient Copper Dragon

Size/Type: Huge Dragon (Earth)
Hit Dice: 32d12+192 (400 HP)
Initiative: +24
Speed: 40 ft., fly 150 ft. (poor)
Armor Class: 36 (-2 size,+28 natural), touch 8, flat-footed 36
Base Attack/Grapple: +32/+51
Attack: Bite +41 melee (2d8+10 damage)
Full Attack: Bite +41 melee (2d8+10 damage), 2 Claws +30 melee (1d8+5), 2 Wings +30 melee (1d6+5), Tail Slap +30 melee (1d6+5)
Special Attacks: Breath Weapon (Line of Acid 20d4/Cone of Slow 1d6+9 rounds save DC 32), Spider Climb, Stone Shape 2/day, Transmute Rock to Mud or Mud to Rock 1/day, Wall of Stone 1/day, Casts as a 15th level Sorcerer, Crush 2d8.
Special Qualities: Immunity to Acid, DR15/magic, SR 28, Frightful Presence DC 31
Saves: +24 Fort, +18 Ref, +23 Will
Abilities:33 Str, 10 Dex, 23 Con, 20 Int, 21 Wis, 20 Cha
Skills: All important Knowledges are sitting at +35 mods so that Knowledge Devotion always works to full effect, then maybe toss Spot, Listen, or what have you on top of that. Max UMD because duh.
Feats:Knowledge Devotion, Hover, Power Attack, Entangling Exhalation, Quicken Breath, Empower Spell, Maximize Spell, Metamagic School Focus (Abjuration), Arcane Thesis (Explosive Runes), Practiced Spellcaster, Large and In Charge, Quicken Spell-Like Ability (Wall of Stone), Improved Initiative x6
Challenge Rating: 22
Treasure: Triple Standard
Alignment: Chaotic Good
Spells Known: 1st Level: Comprehend Languages, Swift Expedious Retreat, Hoard Gullet, True Strike, Magic Missile. 2nd Level: Greater Alarm, Detect Thoughts, Dissonant Chant, Wraithstrike, Magic Mouth. 3rd Level: Explosive Runes, Dispel Magic, Nondetection, Arcane Sight 4th Level: Aerial Alacrity, Scrying, Celerity, Summon Monster IV. 5th Level: Wall of Dispel Magic, Teleport, Mana Flux, Refusal. 6th Level: Antimagic Field, Greater Anticipate Teleport, Analyze Dwoemer. 7th Level: Kiss of Draconic Defiance, Antimagic Ray.


But I cannot get Wyrm of War. How do I get around this limitation? Also, I've got 6 Player class levels that I can play with and am an Adult Copper dragon.
10 Feats, almost all the classes from 3.5 and 3.5 supps. Limited cheese. I want to be a gish, cause I believe thats what dragons are good at. Mostly Solo Play, but our "enemies" are evil dragons, and armys of monsters.

Let me know what you guys come up with :) I'm intersted in your ideas~!

[Xervous]

Arcane thesis is not a good choice for you, you hardly have enough metamagic to abuse it. Ideally you want at least 4+ metamagic feats to stack onto one amazing spell to produce something relatively absurd for such a low level slot that it takes up. This of course is accomplished by tacking on lots of +0 metamagic feats which trigger arcane thesis making them -1 (DM may ban).

This eats feats, and is best pursued by a straight wizard or sorcerer.

To clean house, toss out empower, maximize, and metamagic school focus. If you want to make uber metamagic, simply ask.


Large and in charge is a pitiful feat. You only get one attack of opportunity per round and making an enemy stand still is iffy. At your level, if they want to move away, odds are they can simply teleport. Throw this out.

Throw out Quicken spell like ability (wall of stone). You can use WoS once a day and frankly when you have 32 HD it won't be stopping much.

Assuming that your DM is letting you stack improved initiative, I'd advise against it unless you really can't think of many feats.

Take extraordinary spell aim, use it with an AMF and laugh while you keep your buffs and magic items while everyone around you doesn't. On top of that, you aren't affected by any magic that can't go through the AMF.


Spells...

1st. drop comprehend languages, if you really want it get a wand of it.
I suggest you fit grease and silent image in here. Maybe drop true strike as it's bad for your action economy most of the time.


2nd. Greater alarm should be used out of a wand, detect thoughts may run into many roadblocks since it's [mind affecting], dissonant chant may very well interfere with your party more than it can help, and magic mouth is better off in a wand. Get wings of cover, it will save your sexy scaly behind from more things than you can count on all your claws. Also, glitterdust, because it's amazing too.


3rd. all decent choices. If you plan on creating explosive runes bombs, there is little need for damage boosting because you can fit a considerable quantity of them in a small space and they will all trigger each other.


4th. Aerial alacrity can be replaced with a pectoral of maneuverability, the more expensive one will bring you up to Good maneuverability allowing you to hover (and save a feat!). You'll be better off pumping summoned monsters out of wands.
Perhaps pick up wings of flurry. It's AoE force damage with a daze tacked on, perfect for softening up mobs of enemies (though if you anticipate lots of SR, then don't get this).
Also, Polymorph, because you might want to not be a dragon sometimes.
And dimensional anchor, because you might want to stop people from running away sometimes.


5th. Mana flux is only a 20% failure rate, you can certainly do more terrible things to them than that with a 5th level spell. Refusal may be hit or miss depending on the terrain. Wall of dispel magic caps at +10 like dispel magic, so you won't be dispelling many things at higher levels.
Get wall of force, it has got great utility.
Telekinesis isn't a bad choice either.


6th. All great solo play choices here. Persistent extraordinary spell aimed AMFs can be quite cheesy though. :smallwink:
Get contingency, seriously. It's another thing that will save your hide. On that note, if you are getting contingency, also get feather fall so you can set the contingency to activate when you cast feather fall, allowing you to trigger the contingency whenever you damn well please.
Greater dispel magic is also nice, considering it will at least have a chance of affecting things around your level.


7th. Kiss of draconic defiance requires concentration... so bad. antimagic ray just prevents the target from casting, they still get all their magical goodies and baubles that float about... why not just throw a save or die against a single target?
Projected image is simply an amazing spell, and it's also amazingly flavorful for trickster characters.