Gate

[Melcar]

Hello...

When it comes to the spell Gate, it says that it can be used to call extraplanar creature. So, as a human wizard on the material plane how do know wich creatures fall into this category? Or can I simply call any creature?

Thanks

[SolioFebalas]

Calling Creatures: The second effect of the gate spell is to call an extraplanar creature to your aid (a calling effect). By naming a particular being or kind of being as you cast the spell, you cause the gate to open in the immediate vicinity of the desired creature and pull the subject through, willing or unwilling. Deities and unique beings are under no compulsion to come through the gate, although they may choose to do so of their own accord. This use of the spell creates a gate that remains open just long enough to transport the called creatures. This use of the spell has an XP cost (see below).

If you choose to call a kind of creature instead of a known individual you may call either a single creature (of any HD) or several creatures. You can call and control several creatures as long as their HD total does not exceed your caster level. In the case of a single creature, you can control it if its HD do not exceed twice your caster level. A single creature with more HD than twice your caster level can’t be controlled. Deities and unique beings cannot be controlled in any event. An uncontrolled being acts as it pleases, making the calling of such creatures rather dangerous. An uncontrolled being may return to its home plane at any time.

A controlled creature can be commanded to perform a service for you. Such services fall into two categories: immediate tasks and contractual service. Fighting for you in a single battle or taking any other actions that can be accomplished within 1 round per caster level counts as an immediate task; you need not make any agreement or pay any reward for the creature’s help. The creature departs at the end of the spell.

If you choose to exact a longer or more involved form of service from a called creature, you must offer some fair trade in return for that service. The service exacted must be reasonable with respect to the promised favor or reward; see the lesser planar ally spell for appropriate rewards. (Some creatures may want their payment in “livestock” rather than in coin, which could involve complications.) Immediately upon completion of the service, the being is transported to your vicinity, and you must then and there turn over the promised reward. After this is done, the creature is instantly freed to return to its own plane.

Failure to fulfill the promise to the letter results in your being subjected to service by the creature or by its liege and master, at the very least. At worst, the creature or its kin may attack you.

You can chose any kind of creature to summon through Gate

[Melcar]

You can chose any kind of creature to summon through Gate

Really? So the line:
"Calling Creatures: The second effect of the gate spell is to call an extraplanar creature to your aid (a calling effect)."

Has no bearing? Extraplanar usualy means outsiders, but does this line only refers to special/unique creature?

[TuggyNE]

Really? So the line:

Has no bearing? Extraplanar usualy means outsiders, but does this line only refers to special/unique creature?

Extraplanar doesn't mean Outsiders. It means (formally) creatures with the [extraplanar] subtype, which is automatically applied to creatures (of any type, including Humanoids) when they're off their home plane(s). In colloquial usage, including (sigh) in many important spells' rules text, it also refers to creatures that would have the [extraplanar] subtype were they, in fact, on the (home? current?) plane of the caster; unfortunately, such creatures very seldom actually possess the [extraplanar] subtype when targeted, because they're on their home planes!

TL/DR: It refers to a creature on and from another plane, unique or otherwise.

Whether this allows a Material Plane caster to travel to another plane and then cast gate to no-save pull in another creature from the Material is uncertain. Fortunately, the spell allows another convenient place to disallow most such abuses, as well as some others of similar sort (such as a Devil casting the spell on a human king or something): include any creatures with more than one class level, or a customized statblock, in the definition of "unique creatures", at least insofar as selection (so a Devil attempting to pull in any old random human might get a king by fortuitous accident, but couldn't do so on purpose).

[Crake]

Really? So the line:

Has no bearing? Extraplanar usualy means outsiders, but does this line only refers to special/unique creature?

Extraplanar means creature not native to the plane you're currently on. Don't confuse outsider (which is typically a creature native to the outer planes) with extraplanar.

If you wanted to gate in another wizard for example, simply go to your personal demiplane and gate them, since on that demiplane they'd be considered extraplanar.

[Melcar]

I'm still confused...

Can I, on the material plane, summon any creature? How do I know whether or not they are native to the material plane or another plane?

There must be some way of discerning this in the write-up of creatures... yes?

[Yora]

When you are on the material plane, you can summon any creature that is not currently on the material plane. I think.

[SolioFebalas]

In other words, when you cast Gate, you have some creature in your mind (as player, not character), just open monster manual and look extraplanar it or not. In game your character knows it by using different knowledge skills.

[Melcar]

Can I assume to be able to call any creature from MM1 - MM5, Monsters of Faerun and Epic Level Handbook if the have the outsider or/and extraplanar subrace?

Specifically these two lists:

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Extraplanar_Subtype

and

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Outsider_Type

Right???

[Psyren]

Everything is Extraplanar if you pull it from somewhere else. For example, you can gate in chromatic dragons if you open your portal in Avernus, the first layer of the Nine Hells where Tiamat resides.

[Vaz]

A Creature that is Extraplanar has the [Extraplanar] tag. If it's not native to your plane, it has the [Extraplanar] tag when it's on your plane.

If you have a look at the Planar Handbook and/or Manual of the Planes, it will show common inhabitants. In game, Knowledge [Planes] is usually the best way to identify extraplanar creatures for this purposes (and I know that as a DM, I'd enforce a Knowledge check to Gate in such a creature).

[Feytalist]

Perhaps to explain it another way: no creature has the "extraplanar" trait inherently. The trait simply gets added when they move (or gets forcibly moved) from their home plane.

So, the gate spell will pull any creature you want from another plane, regardless of type or subtype, and give them the extraplanar tag while they're on your current plane.


So; that extraplanar list you linked to only applies on the Material Plane (this gets called out in the introduction to that list). If you encounter (for instance) an arrowhawk on the Elemental Plane of Air, it will not have the extraplanar tag.

[Melcar]

Perhaps to explain it another way: no creature has the "extraplanar" trait inherently. The trait simply gets added when they move (or gets forcibly moved) from their home plane.

So, the gate spell will pull any creature you want from another plane, regardless of type or subtype, and give them the extraplanar tag while they're on your current plane.

Ok... But how then do I (player) know whether or not they come from another plane? Do they have to have the outsider sub-type or is there some other way of knowing?

[Psyren]

Just the way I described - find a plane where those things would live, and when you cast the spell, open your gate there.

Want a chromatic dragon? Open your Gate in Hell.
Want a metallic dragon? Open your Gate in Celestia.
Want a Kraken or Aboleth? Open your Gate in the Plane of Water.

Note that none of these creatures are [extraplanar] in their stat blocks, but various books (BoED, FC2, MotP) tell you where they can be found aside from the Material.

[Feytalist]

Ok... But how then do I (player) know whether or not they come from another plane? Do they have to have the outsider sub-type or is there some other way of knowing?

The spell finds the creature you want for you on another plane, and pulls it in. It is assumed that there are instances of any and every creature scattered throughout the planes.

So in effect, you as the player don't have to worry about that. Just specify the creature you want, and boom, there it is, freshly pulled in from a romp through the forests of Arborea or whatever. Complete with shiny new extraplanar tag.

[Yora]

To learn the home plane of a creature, you'd probably have to make a Knowledge check as described in the Knowledge skill description. Simply being able to identify the creatures race should be enough to provide that knowledge.

However, I don't think you could call a creature native to the abyss that is currently on the material plane, while you are casting the spell on the material plane.
But you should be able to summon a creature native to the abyss that is currently on the material plane, when you cast that spell in the abyss.

I think it really comes down to "is the creature currently on the same plane as you"?

[Feytalist]

From the spell description:


By naming a particular being or kind of being as you cast the spell, you cause the gate to open in the immediate vicinity of the desired creature and pull the subject through, willing or unwilling.

So you don't even need to know the home plane of the creature you want. Presumably, in the case of the arrowhawk I mentioned earlier, the spell could even find one that somehow wandered into Pandemonium and pull that one through.


Although, in the case of a unique creature, you probably would need to know on what plane it is at that moment. But that actually doesn't get called out in the spell description at all.

[TuggyNE]

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Outsider_Type

Outsider type is irrelevant; there are Outsiders that would not be extraplanar (mostly Native Outsiders), and there are lots of extraplanar creatures that are not Outsiders and are valid targets just the same.

Besides that, well, my TL/DR earlier was pretty simple, or so I thought. :smallconfused:

[Melcar]

I think it really comes down to "is the creature currently on the same plane as you"?

True... but that is the problem, how do I know whether or not its here or there?

But what I gather from this is, that I can summon any creature, because the spell, if a wanted a human, while on the material plane, would search the planes for a human on another plane and call that, instead of picking one on the material plane. So its simple because the spell is SO powerful that is does the whole location thing for me.

But sticking to RAW how then do I say to my DM: "This Gloom is summonable? Or I gate in this Prismatic dragon. It might not have the outsider or extraplanar sub-tybe but it not on the material plane right now so...." Without him pointing to the writeup and saying NO!?

[Yuki Akuma]

You can use Gate to call anything.

Seriously. Anything. Go nuts.

You are thinking too hard about this. You can call anything.

[Psyren]

You can use Gate to call anything.

Seriously. Anything. Go nuts.

You are thinking too hard about this. You can call anything.

This. Just state what you want, the spell will find it for you.

[Feytalist]

You can use Gate to call anything.

Seriously. Anything. Go nuts.

You are thinking too hard about this. You can call anything.

What he said.


Really, though, there's nothing to point to. Nothing in the spell description has any restrictions on what type of creature you may or may not call (also, by the way, not once in the entire description is the word "outsider" mentioned. I'm not sure where you got that from).

[Melcar]

What he said.


Really, though, there's nothing to point to. Nothing in the spell description has any restrictions on what type of creature you may or may not call (also, by the way, not once in the entire description is the word "outsider" mentioned. I'm not sure where you got that from).

I deducted myself that outsider ment "not native to the material plane", but besides that nothing.

[Yuki Akuma]

I deducted myself that outsider ment "not native to the material plane", but besides that nothing.

Aasimar says hi. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/planetouched.htm)

Outsider is a creature type, nothing more.

Edit: It's important to note that summoning and calling are different things. Gate calls creatures, rather than summoning them.

A called creature is really there and will die if it's killed. A summoned creature is only inhabiting a magically-constructed shell and will reform on their home plane if killed.

[Segev]

Really, all the line about calling "extraplanar" creatures does is say, "You can't use this to call a creature who is on the same plane you are." Or, rather, it limits you to calling creatures that are not, currently, on the same plane as you. You are calling them from another plane.

Thus, while you could call for "a human" while on the Prime, you would get a human from another plane. You could not call for "Axebeard Beardaxe, the party Cleric," if he was imprisoned on the other side of the continent in the evil king of evil's evil castle, because that's on the same plane as you. On the other hand, you could call for "AymnatBil Beaux, the party rogue," who jumped into a bag of holding and then ruptured it from the inside. He's scattered to a far off region of the Ethereal or Astral (I forget which), and is thus not on the Prime with you, so you can Gate him in.

You could use Gate, as well, to get to, say, the Elemental Plane of Earth (usually a safe one to hop to for short periods, at least), and then use Gate to call forth your friend Axebeard Beardaxe, as he's now no longer on the plane you're on.

Gate's limitation is that it cannot open up between two points on the same plane. That's really about it.

[Psyren]

If your DM insists on pointing to something, you can show him books that discuss the typical inhabitants of other planes - e.g. MotP, PH, BoED, BoVD, FC1, FC2. But none of these are actually necessary. It's enough for you, and him, to know that just about every printed creature can be found somewhere else.

[Melcar]

Thanks everyone for clearing that up for me!!! :smallbiggrin:

[Urpriest]

True... but that is the problem, how do I know whether or not its here or there?


This is something your DM is supposed to handle for you. As part of creating the setting, the DM made a list of planes, and for each plane, a list of typical inhabitants. If you're using a published setting, there will generally be an equivalent list in the campaign setting or later sourcebooks.

Basically, you should know what you can find on any given plane because you know what the planes in your DM's setting are like.