[3.5] Melee Rogue Gish

[A.A.King]

Okay, I haven't done much research on this. I just know that when I make a Rogue/Spellcaster it pretty much always naturally steers towards ranged combat (usually archery or rays) which is great and all but I want something different.
The image I have in my head, what I think is a true sneaky warrior wizard is that of a guy who pops up behind you, SNEAK ATTACk, and is gone before you know it.

What kind of spells/abilities allow me to teleport like this a regular basis?

[mealin]

I think the "standard Build" for this is rogue/warlock into Telflammar Shadowlord.
Basically teleport and use shadow pounce to attack

[Dusk Eclipse]

That is not really a gish...

The best TWF gish I've seen is a Mystic Sword of the Arcane Ranger 20, full BAB, up to 5th level ranger/wizard spells, incredible skill list (including the sneaky stuff). If you really want to go with Sneak attack, going rogue, assassin, SA classes in general after level 10 would probably be the best.


You can also go Spellthief 1/ Full bab (Duskblade works pretty well here)4/ Chameleon 7/ Unseen Seer (for moar Sneak attack) or Abjurant Champion (for more melee. Take note that you would need to advance Duskblade casting since Chameleon can't be advanced by other classes.

[Taveena]

For melee sneaky gishery, you could always go for Daggerspell Mage.

In more detail you could go Wizard 5/Spellthief 1/Daggerspell Mage 10/Abjurant Champion 4. Take Master Spellthief (may as well.) It's only 4d6 sneak attack but you're also working spells into the routine. (You could blow two feats on grabbing Assassin's Stance to up that to 6d6 if you wanted.) 16 BAB and 18th level Wizard casting.

[Emperor Tippy]

Factotum 8/Assassin 5/ Arcane Trickster 5/ Swordsage 2

Does what you want pretty much perfectly.

It's only an always on +5d6 sneak attack but you have Assassin's Stance and that should be your default stance, so that is +7d6. And then you have Cunning Strike to make up the difference when needed.

Make your race Gray Elf and grab Faerie Mysteries Initiate (Int to HP). The extra 4 feats to Chaos Shuffle are a great boon. You want Darkstalker, Adaptive Style, Shadow Blade, Weapon Finesse (probably, as your strength will be pathetic), Craven, and all of the Font of Inspiration you can stuff in around everything else.

[A.A.King]

I don't know all of the stuff mentioned here.....
How do those combos let me teleport sneak attack effectively?

[Taveena]

Quickened Dimension Door, full attack?

[A.A.King]

But that is only one way. I would like to be the annoying guy who all of a sudden is behind you and stabs you. You then turn around out of pure rage to kill the guy and all your sword strikes is smoke, he teleported away again.

[Emperor Tippy]

I don't know all of the stuff mentioned here.....
How do those combos let me teleport sneak attack effectively?

Factotum (Dungeonscape) has the ability Cunning Surge which lets you spend Inspiration Points to gain an additional Standard Action.

Swordsage (Tome of Battle) with the feat Adaptive Style can regain maneuvers as a full round action. One of the maneuvers it can take is Shadow Jaunt which is a standard action to use and lets you teleport to any place that you have LoS and LoE to within 50 feet. Use Cunning Surge, use Shadow Jaunt to teleport to your target, use Cunning Surge to pick up another standard action to attack (and use a strike maneuver for extra fun), take your full round action to regain your maneuvers, use Cunning Surge to Shadow Jaunt away.

Shadow Stride is a move action and with both that and Shadow Jaunt you don't need to regain maneuvers to port in and out.

Assassin also has Dimension Door as one of its spells known. Cunning Surge is basically free quicken. So attack your enemy and then Cunning Surge + Dimension Door to leave.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

What level range do you expect to play this character the most?

I'd go for Spellthief 1/ Psion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psion.htm) or Ardent 4/ Psychic Assassin (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723d) 6/ Slayer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/prestigeClasses/slayer.htm) 9, and pick Mind Cripple from Psychic Assassin. This allows you to do 2 Int damage per sneak attack, so fighting with two weapons you should be able to outright disable many opponents in a single full attack.

Psion would give you a much better selection of powers, especially for a gish archetype, plus Int synergy, but you'll need to use fractional BAB from UA to get a +16 BAB by 20th level. Ardent will get you 9th level powers and a +16 BAB by 20th level, and with Substitute Powers (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a) you should still be able to get many of the needed powers to operate as a gish. That single Spellthief level allows you to use wands of Wizard spells from any of the schools that class gets access to, namely Wraithstrike. Put a Wand Chamber in each of your weapons so you can use that without switching what you're holding.

[A.A.King]

Factotum (Dungeonscape) has the ability Cunning Surge which lets you spend Inspiration Points to gain an additional Standard Action.

Swordsage (Tome of Battle) with the feat Adaptive Style can regain maneuvers as a full round action. One of the maneuvers it can take is Shadow Jaunt which is a standard action to use and lets you teleport to any place that you have LoS and LoE to within 50 feet. Use Cunning Surge, use Shadow Jaunt to teleport to your target, use Cunning Surge to pick up another standard action to attack (and use a strike maneuver for extra fun), take your full round action to regain your maneuvers, use Cunning Surge to Shadow Jaunt away.

Shadow Stride is a move action and with both that and Shadow Jaunt you don't need to regain maneuvers to port in and out.

Assassin also has Dimension Door as one of its spells known. Cunning Surge is basically free quicken. So attack your enemy and then Cunning Surge + Dimension Door to leave.

Damn, that's so much better then my orginal idea (which basically stopped at Rogue X / Conjurer Y (with the immidiate magic variant) / The Right Prestige Classes for the rest). I'll definitely look into it further.

[gorfnab]

Sneak Attacking Spellcasters Handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1240)

Mystic Ranger (Trapfinding, Sword of the Arcane Order) 12/ Swordsage 2/ Telflammar Shadowlord 6

Swordsage 1/ Warlock 6/ Swordsage 1/ Telflammar Shadowlord 6/ Arcane Trickster (advancing Warlock) 6 - needs Whisper Gnome for race or Spell Hand feat, uses feat Eldritch Claws

[A.A.King]

Sneak Attacking Spellcasters Handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1240)

Mystic Ranger (Trapfinding, Sword of the Arcane Order) 12/ Swordsage 2/ Telflammar Shadowlord 6

Swordsage 1/ Warlock 6/ Swordsage 1/ Telflammar Shadowlord 6/ Arcane Trickster (advancing Warlock) 6 - needs Whisper Gnome for race or Spell Hand feat, uses feat Eldritch Claws

I might be wrong but the best trick in either is to use the Shadow Jump gained from Telflammar Shadowlord to teleport. It however seems very restricted in its use because (the way I read it) it's a Standard Action which you can use at most 6 times a day to teleport 10 feet each time. So how exactly are those two helping me create the guy who stabs you in the back but is never close enough for you to attack him?

[Firebug]

As I have noted in several other threads, I am currently a fan ofGray Elf Trickster Spellthief 1/ Elf Generalist Wizard 3/ Wilderness Rogue 1/ Unseen Seer 2/ Dragonslayer 1/ Spellsword 1/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Unseen Seer 6(more) . For a large amount of skill points and list, 16 Base attack (for the 4th iterative attack, assuming Fractional Base Attack), 9th level spells at 24th caster level (28th for arcane divination spells). You can steal up to 9th level spells from another caster, and hold . Proficiency with all Martial Weapons, Shields and Armor ignoring 10% arcane spell failure (+1 Githcraft Mithril Fullplate of Twilight is ~15k gold for 10% arcane spell failure). Shield spell gives an additional +5 AC and is freely quickened and extended (along with all other abjurations 3rd level and lower). Permanent Nondetection (ie, opponents have to beat a caster level check DC 39 to magically tell if you are lying, or scry on you, or detect your alignment, or even if your gear glows magical). 5d6 Sneak Attack (+ another 9d6 from a persisted Hunter's Eye, + another 8d6 melee sneak attack if you wanted to Polymorph any Object yourself into a Kelvezu Demon(plus at-will con poison, 15 natural armor, look human-ish)). Also immune to fear.