SWSE Ewok Force User (New Player, needing assitance)

[Blind_Prophet]

So uh yeah first time playing SWSE or any star wars PnP for that matter and I love me some Ewoks and I love me some force lightning...so I'm wanting to make a Neutral Force User (former Ewok Shaman) that's primarily uses a single lightsaber and Force Powers

The backstory is pretty in depth but long story short is...Was Ewok Shaman/Leader, Imperials attacked village, Imperial Officer stole Ewok Daughter (weird tastes I guess), Ewok Angry searches for daughter, Meets Jedi tuned Neutral Force User, Ex-Jedi hones Ewok Natural ability with the force, Ewok resumes hunt for daughter utilizing both sides of the force to do so.

Now I'm sure I got a few things wrong like for exampole it seems that Jedi dont just automatically get force powers they have to take force training to gain 1+Wis Mood force powers...is this right?

Anyways that said this is what I have so far (this is for a 1-20 campaign so is currently only level one but the plan is Force User 7 -> Force Adept -> Force Disciple but I'm open to pretty much any force based classes)

Note: The DM has limited us to the core book for now since well that's the only book we have and since she's new.


Ewok Force User1

Str 9 (-1)
Dex 17 (+3)
Con 12 (+1)
Int 14 (+2)
Wis 17 (+3)
Cha 14 (+2)

Skills: UTF (7), Perception (8), Survival (13), Inititative (8)

HP: 31

Ref: 16
Fort: 13
Will: 15

Melee: 4 (2d8+7)
Speed: 4 Sqs.


Feats
1. Weapon Finesse, SF: Survival, Force Sensitivity

Talents
1. Deflect: May negate a ranged attack by making a UTF check, DC = Attack Roll, must be wielding a lightsaber

Force Powers (Usable once an encounter, Nat 20 recharges all powers)

Force Lightning: Range - 6 UTF vs. Reflex 8d6 damage -1 C-Track (save for half)

Move Object: Makes a UTF check..result determines size of object you can move...if target unwilling is Will Save vs. UTF check
Lifted object(s) can be thrown as an attack in the same standard action
DC 15: Medium - Deals 2d6 Damage vs. Target
DC 20: Large - 4d6
DC 25: Huge - 6D6
DC 30: Gargantuan - 8D6
DC 35: Colossal - 10D6

Note: Can continue to hold an object every round with a new UTF check and standard action

Battle Strike - Makes UTF to add extra damage to an attack
DC 15: +1 to attack, +1d6 damage
DC 20: +1 to attack, +2d6 damage
DC 25: +1 to attack, +3d6 damage

Throw Lightsaber - Make a melee lightsaber attack up to 6 squares away, lightsaber returns to you hand afterwards with successful UTF check


Credits: 125

Equipment: Black Lightsaber (2-handed for Ewok, Single Blade 2d8), Short-Range Com, Field Kit, Concealed Wrist Holster (Lightsaber), Heavy Cloak (just clothes).




Oh and I'm not sure if it changes anything but the rest of the party is currently looking this:

A Droid Scoundrel w/ plans to go gunslinger

Scout or Soldier that will be a Bounty Hunter

A Sith focused on being a front line fighter

A force power focused Sith that was kicked out of the academy for insisting the sith were misinterpreting the Sith Mantra and continues as such.

A Sentient Droid Ship/Pilot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=16086279#post16086279) (think EDI from Mass Effect or Max from Flight of the Navigator)

The last one is unsure...wants to be a jedi but would have the same issue a Paladin would with the rest of the party its full of Siths (Blackguards) and Neutral characters.

[Waar]

it seems that Jedi dont just automatically get force powers they have to take force training to gain 1+Wis Mood force powers...is this right?

yes it it



A few house rules that are relevant

- Despite Ewoks getting no proficiencies the DM allowed me to keep lightsaber proficiency due to being trained by an Ex-Jedi

not a house rule, this applies to all level 1 jedi ewoks



- The DM Granted me a free "Force Training" feat at lvl 1 to reflect my training with the Ex-Jedi and my Shaman background

- The DM has decided Weapon Finesse grants attack and damage

Anyways that said this is what I have so far (this is for a 1-20 campaign so is currently only level one but the plan is Force User 7 -> Force Adept -> Force Disciple but I'm open to pretty much any force based classes)

Note: The DM has limited us to the core book for now since well that's the only book we have and since she's new.


Ewok Force User1

Str 9 (-1)
Dex 17 (+3)
Con 12 (+1)
Int 14 (+2)
Wis 17 (+3)
Cha 14 (+2)

those stats are quite strong (as in pb40 strong) combined with the free feats you have a powerfull character (do the others gain simmilar free bonuses?)



Skills: UTF (7), Perception (8), Survival (13), Inititative (8)

HP: 31

Ref: 16
Fort: 13
Will: 15

Melee: 4 (2d8+7)

weapon finesse with a two handed weapon, is not normally allowed... (make sure this is intended on part of the gm)


Speed: 4 Sqs.


Feats
1. Weapon Finesse, SF: Survival, Force Sensitivity

how do you get both weapon finesse and sf: survival? you only get one bonus feat at level 1


Talents
1. Deflect: May negate a ranged attack by making a UTF check, DC = Attack Roll, must be wielding a lightsaber

Force Powers (Usable once an encounter, Nat 20 recharges all powers)

Force Lightning: Range - 6 UTF vs. Reflex 8d6 damage -1 C-Track (save for half)

Move Object:

range 12 (errata)

Makes a UTF check..result determines size of object you can move...if target unwilling is Will Save vs. UTF check
Lifted object(s) can be thrown as an attack in the same standard action
DC 15: Medium - Deals 2d6 Damage vs. Target
DC 20: Large - 4d6
DC 25: Huge - 6D6
DC 30: Gargantuan - 8D6
DC 35: Colossal - 10D6

Note: Can continue to hold an object every round with a new UTF check and standard action

Battle Strike - Makes UTF to add extra damage to an attack
DC 15: +1 to attack, +1d6 damage
DC 20: +1 to attack, +2d6 damage
DC 25: +1 to attack, +3d6 damage

Throw Lightsaber - Make a melee lightsaber attack up to 6 squares away, lightsaber returns to you hand afterwards with successful UTF check

??? this is a talent not a force power



Credits: 125

Equipment: Black Lightsaber (2-handed for Ewok, Single Blade 2d8), Short-Range Com, Field Kit, Concealed Wrist Holster (Lightsaber), Heavy Cloak (just clothes).




Oh and I'm not sure if it changes anything but the rest of the party is currently looking this:

A Droid Scoundrel w/ plans to go gunslinger

Scout or Soldier that will be a Bounty Hunter

A Sith focused on being a front line fighter

A force power focused Sith that was kicked out of the academy for insisting the sith were misinterpreting the Sith Mantra and continues as such.

A Sentient Droid Ship/Pilot (think EDI from Mass Effect or Max from Flight of the Navigator)

Is this a PC or a NPC


The last one is unsure...wants to be a jedi but would have the same issue a Paladin would with the rest of the party its full of Siths (Blackguards) and Neutral characters. that could be tricky, yes

[Blind_Prophet]

yes it it

Kinda strikes me as wrong that you can have a force user with no force powers



not a house rule, this applies to all level 1 jedi ewoks

Oh the way we read it Ewoks get nothing but simple weapons regardless of class...thx for the clarification



those stats are quite strong (as in pb40 strong) combined with the free feats you have a powerfull character (do the others gain simmilar free bonuses?)

Their rolled stats 4D6 drop the lowest...we do it regardless of system



weapon finesse with a two handed weapon, is not normally allowed... (make sure this is intended on part of the gm)

Hmmm...It didn't dawn on me until I chose equipment that a lightsaber would be 2-handed for a Ewok...maybe I'll just use a Small one...either way I'll see what she says



how do you get both weapon finesse and sf: survival? you only get one bonus feat at level 1

Ewoks get SF: Survival for free if trained in that skill



range 12 (errata)

Thanks :D



??? this is a talent not a force power

Oh so it is...guess I'll just choose a second Move object or something



Is this a PC or a NPC

The Sentient Ship is intended to be an NPC as such will likely be played by the DM most of the time but I will take over if it overwhelms her. It obviously can never leave the ship.



that could be tricky, yes

Yeah he's like our resident Paladin...he really plays with the wrong group :P

[Blind_Prophet]

Anyone else?

[IdleMuse]

Anyone else?

Well, frankly I think your GM is making a mistake giving you a bunch of free buffs (free Force Training!) on top of a ludicrous statline, in a party with TWO Sith... This sounds like a recipe for problems, but hey, if it works for your group, it works.

Mechanics-wise, there's not much you can do wrong with a setup like that, just makie sure you take SF:UtF at the next possible opportunity, and make sure you get those three force talents to qualify on time for Force Adept; if you take Deflect at 1st level, you need to take the next three talents you get as Force talents; in the core book, I suggest Damage Reduction 10, Equilibrium, and Adept Spellcaster (from the Dathomir tree - If your GM is fine with that background, I can't see any reason why they'd disallow this) which sets you up to take Flight later.

Once you're in Force Adept, make sure to take Force Point Recovery as your first Force Technique (errata prevents you from taking it multiple times). Empower Weapon is probably the best Force Adept talent in core.. but you really want to get to Disciple ASAP so make sure you take two Adept talents rather than Force talents before lvl 12.

[Alejandro]

I agree with IdleMuse, unless the GM really knows what they are doing, there is trouble ahead.

That said, all Jedi have Force powers; you need to read all the things you can do with a Use the Force check in the Skills section of the main book, as well as in the Jedi Academy book. You can move small objects, use telepathy, put yourself or others into Force trances (which heal very fast) and many other tricks. Actual, feat-taken Force Powers are just the strong stuff.

[Blind_Prophet]

I agree with IdleMuse, unless the GM really knows what they are doing, there is trouble ahead.

That said, all Jedi have Force powers; you need to read all the things you can do with a Use the Force check in the Skills section of the main book, as well as in the Jedi Academy book. You can move small objects, use telepathy, put yourself or others into Force trances (which heal very fast) and many other tricks. Actual, feat-taken Force Powers are just the strong stuff.

Oh I didn't know that I'll look into the skill more than bring it to my DMs attention if it really is that OP and we might drop the free force training

[Blind_Prophet]

So far it seems like a Republic Cruiser C70 Refit or Thalassian Slave Transport (removing all the slave cages) are the best options crammed with Imperial TIE Defenders or CEC S-100 Stingers...not sure how likely it is we'll get our hands on those.

[Mando Knight]

are the best options crammed with Imperial TIE Defenders or CEC S-100 Stingers...not sure how likely it is we'll get our hands on those.
Getting even one TIE Defender should be out of your reach for a long time... but if your GM doesn't know how to say no... :smallsigh:

[Blind_Prophet]

Getting even one TIE Defender should be out of your reach for a long time... but if your GM doesn't know how to say no... :smallsigh:

Lol I doubt she'd let me work that in we'll likely end up with a hunk of junk that can barely fly and a world war 2 plane for a fighter :P

Thats said I posted that in the wrong thread lol

[The Glyphstone]

Wait. An expelled student at the Sith Academy is still around when TIE Defenders (or, for that matter, the Galactic Empire) exists? Methinks your GM is getting his eras (and his Republics/Empires) mixed up a bit.

[Blind_Prophet]

Wait. An expelled student at the Sith Academy is still around when TIE Defenders (or, for that matter, the Galactic Empire) exists? Methinks your GM is getting his eras (and his Republics/Empires) mixed up a bit.

To clarify I was trying to make a joke (a republic ship loaded with imperial fighters or a former slave ship now used by the "heroes" loaded with weaponry instead of slaves) I haven't even brought this to my DM...I also posted this is the wrong thread.

I did just ask what Era though...she says just after Revenge of the Sith...so Rebel vs. Empire...long after the fall of the republic.

[The Glyphstone]

How does that reconcile with your two low-level Sith party members, at a point well past the institution of the Rule of Two? Or are you playing fast-and-loose with SW canon (entirely sensible if you are) to enable people to play Evil Force Users if they want?

[Blind_Prophet]

Well, frankly I think your GM is making a mistake giving you a bunch of free buffs (free Force Training!) on top of a ludicrous statline, in a party with TWO Sith... This sounds like a recipe for problems, but hey, if it works for your group, it works.

Mechanics-wise, there's not much you can do wrong with a setup like that, just makie sure you take SF:UtF at the next possible opportunity, and make sure you get those three force talents to qualify on time for Force Adept; if you take Deflect at 1st level, you need to take the next three talents you get as Force talents; in the core book, I suggest Damage Reduction 10, Equilibrium, and Adept Spellcaster (from the Dathomir tree - If your GM is fine with that background, I can't see any reason why they'd disallow this) which sets you up to take Flight later.

Once you're in Force Adept, make sure to take Force Point Recovery as your first Force Technique (errata prevents you from taking it multiple times). Empower Weapon is probably the best Force Adept talent in core.. but you really want to get to Disciple ASAP so make sure you take two Adept talents rather than Force talents before lvl 12.

So Force User 1-7, Force Adept 8-11, Force Disciple 12-20?


How does that reconcile with your two low-level Sith party members, at a point well past the institution of the Rule of Two? Or are you playing fast-and-loose with SW canon (entirely sensible if you are) to enable people to play Evil Force Users if they want?

A) Were playing a little fast and loose with the Canon...namely cause none of us are super familiar with anything beyond the movies so we have no one to regulate it

B) The campaign module says the only pre-req to be in this campaign is a hate for the empire.

Also to be fair alot of sith seem to break the rule of two and one of those sith was rejected he's just practicing on his own...also he might be switching to a Noble/Crimelord

[Mando Knight]

So Force User 1-7, Force Adept 8-11, Force Disciple 12-20?
There are only 5 levels of Force Disciple.

B) The campaign module says the only pre-req to be in this campaign is a hate for the empire.
Is it Dawn of Defiance? Then there isn't an Academy. Also there shouldn't be any Ewoks roaming the Galaxy at that point, but that's another matter.

Also to be fair alot of sith seem to break the rule of two and one of those sith was rejected he's just practicing on his own...also he might be switching to a Noble/Crimelord
Anyone who qualifies as anything close to "Sith" during the Galactic Empire is loyal to the Emperor and/or Vader (who, by the way, "get around" the Rule of Two by not training Sith, but Dark Jedi and Force Adepts).

[Blind_Prophet]

There are only 5 levels of Force Disciple.

So there is...So Force User 1-7, Force Adept 8-11, Force Disciple 12-16, ??? 17-20. More force adept...maybe Jedi Master and call it Force Master?



Is it Dawn of Defiance? Then there isn't an Academy.

I think thats the one (please don't spoil anything)



Also there shouldn't be any Ewoks roaming the Galaxy at that point, but that's another matter.

Wait why not...they show up throughout the original star wars series and this is supposed to be set just after Revenge of the Sith...well at least that's what the DM said.



Anyone who qualifies as anything close to "Sith" during the Galactic Empire is loyal to the Emperor and/or Vader (who, by the way, "get around" the Rule of Two by not training Sith, but Dark Jedi and Force Adepts).

I guess he's a Dark Jedi than...besides he might go Noble -> Crime Lord it suits what he wants to do better and we want a variety of classes in the group.

[Mando Knight]

Wait why not...they show up throughout the original star wars series and this is supposed to be set just after Revenge of the Sith...well at least that's what the DM said.
Ewoks appear in one film, Return of the Jedi (chronologically the last of them), and have little to no connections with the rest of the Galaxy before then (see the Era Notes: Species sidebar in the core book, page 23). Also note that the Wookieepedia article on them was recently vandalized, and shouldn't be used as a reference for anything until it's cleaned up. (Edit: should be clear now, I fixed it.)

TIE Defenders also do not exist (at all) at this point (~19 BBY (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Galactic_Standard_Calendar), or 16 GrS (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Great_ReSynchronization)), being produced in 3 ABY (~35 GrS).

[Alejandro]

Mando is right. There is basically no feasible reason for an Ewok to be off Endor until well after the Battle of Endor. They do not show up throughout the series, they appear at the end of one film, and in two straight to TV films (which also do not involve any Ewoks leaving Endor.)

TIE Defenders don't exist yet, as also already said.

Incidentally, if each PC is supposed to have a hate for the Empire, why would a Dark Jedi hate it? The Empire actively destroys Jedi and recruits Dark Jedi (or, in some cases, crushes them if they are foolish ones.)

[Blind_Prophet]

Mando is right. There is basically no feasible reason for an Ewok to be off Endor until well after the Battle of Endor. They do not show up throughout the series, they appear at the end of one film, and in two straight to TV films (which also do not involve any Ewoks leaving Endor.)

My Ewok finds your lack of faith....disturbing

http://images.wikia.com/uncyclopedia/images/5/55/Squirrel_Force_Lightning.jpg


Sorry couldn't help it :P

[Friv]

Mando is right. There is basically no feasible reason for an Ewok to be off Endor until well after the Battle of Endor. They do not show up throughout the series, they appear at the end of one film, and in two straight to TV films (which also do not involve any Ewoks leaving Endor.)

Ehn, some trader stopped on Endor, thought a family of Ewoks was cute, and stole them to sell at a massive profit. Ewok child learns Basic, uses Force abilities to escape from slavery. Bam. Ewoks.


Incidentally, if each PC is supposed to have a hate for the Empire, why would a Dark Jedi hate it? The Empire actively destroys Jedi and recruits Dark Jedi (or, in some cases, crushes them if they are foolish ones.)

I assume it would be because they don't want to be recruited by the Emperor and then slain out of hand. ;) Maybe they learned their Sith-ness somewhere else, and intend to be the 'two' in the Rule of Two.

I sort of assume that happens a lot. It happened at least once, canonically, during the Clone Wars.

[Blind_Prophet]

Ehn, some trader stopped on Endor, thought a family of Ewoks was cute, and stole them to sell at a massive profit. Ewok child learns Basic, uses Force abilities to escape from slavery. Bam. Ewoks.


To be specific they took my daughter (among others) and killed the rest, I was injured but was able to sneak onto one of the ships that landed on Endor I was already an Ewok Shaman and having met an Ex-Jedi who believed there is no "Sides" to the force just "The Force" he taught me to hone my natural abilities now I'm continuing to look for my daughter.

Oh and speaking of my Ewok I talked to the DM, showed her how the UTF skill works and we agreed that we dont need the free force training anymore.

[Hawk7915]

Ehn, some trader stopped on Endor, thought a family of Ewoks was cute, and stole them to sell at a massive profit. Ewok child learns Basic, uses Force abilities to escape from slavery. Bam. Ewoks.



I assume it would be because they don't want to be recruited by the Emperor and then slain out of hand. ;) Maybe they learned their Sith-ness somewhere else, and intend to be the 'two' in the Rule of Two.

I sort of assume that happens a lot. It happened at least once, canonically, during the Clone Wars.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Treek

Star Wars: The Old Republic has an Ewok player companion. Ewoks are extremely low-tech and rarely leave Endor, but they existed as a species and at least one left Endor of their own free will as early as 3,641 BBY. While it's a bit of a stretch to see an Ewok force-user in the "Dark Times" (15-3 BBY), it's far from impossible, especially if players are open to some canon-breaking shenanigans.

[Alejandro]

I suppose it could be worse, it could be a Gungan.

[Echobeats]

My Ewok finds your lack of faith....disturbing

http://images.wikia.com/uncyclopedia/images/5/55/Squirrel_Force_Lightning.jpg


Sorry couldn't help it :P

Awesome.

I'm a little surprised that no-one's yet pointed out that there's no such class as "Force User". Arguably "Jedi" should be called that though, because having levels in Jedi doesn't mean you are a member of the Jedi order. The Sith all have levels in Jedi too. So if you are already aware of this, and your group has just decided to rename the Jedi class, good for you.

Saga is very multiclassing friendly. Take a level or three of some other Core classes and you'll get some useful feats/talents (Evasion springs to mind). And then your problem of there not being enough levels in your prestige classes goes away.

I am all for messing around with the canon as long as you know you're doing it, rather than simply letting anachronisms slip in through ignorance. The number one rule of roleplaying is fun.

[hamishspence]

Arguably "Jedi" should be called that though, because having levels in Jedi doesn't mean you are a member of the Jedi order. The Sith all have levels in Jedi too.

Not all, but certainly many do.

However:

In the Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide:
High Lady Brezwalt of the Mecrosa Order is a Noble 7/Force adept 5/Sith Lord 4.
Darth Sion is a Soldier 7/Sith apprentice 7/Sith Lord 5.
Darth Nihilus is a Soldier 7/Sith apprentice 7/Sith Lord 5.

In Threats of the Galaxy:
Lumiya is a Soldier 5/Scoundrel 3/Ace pilot 3/Force adept 3/Sith apprentice 3/Sith Lord 2.

And in the Legacy Era Campaign Guide:
Darth Nihl is a Soldier 7/Officer 3/Sith apprentice 5/Sith Lord 1.

[Alejandro]

Ham beat me to it. You can actually make powerful light and dark side Force users without ever touching Jedi :)

[hamishspence]

In fact, the unnamed "generic Sith Lord" in Threats of the Galaxy, was an example of this.

[IdleMuse]

So there is...So Force User 1-7, Force Adept 8-11, Force Disciple 12-16, ??? 17-20. More force adept...maybe Jedi Master and call it Force Master?

You ned to be lvl 12 to get into Force Disciple, so you'd be looking at either Jedi 7/Force Adept 5/Force Disciple 5 or Jedi 7/Force Adept 3/Jedi +2/Force Disciple 5. Or, I guess, you could use those hanging two levels to take a different PrC, or some levels in base classes (I quite like taking two levels of soldier).

That gets you up to lvl 17, what you take beyond there is a little irrelevant, and I doubt your campaign will actually make it that far, few do... The game's not particularly balanced after lvl 15 anyway, stuff starts getting silly.

If it wasn't for the fact that Saga edition inherits from the 20-level D&D paradigm, I can't help but feel like it would stop at lvl17 anyway; that's enough to max out every PrC, for example.

[Ravenica]

Building a force user is actually better for the most part not using Jedi levels, soldier levels work best for munchkining in the armor talents. Although a jedi dip can usually pull that "one" talent you want off their trees as well as the free force sensitive if you do it early. There's never any reason to take jedi past 7 (for the lightsaber building)

[Mando Knight]

You don't need any levels of Jedi to build a lightsaber. Just be 7th level in general and both Force Sensitive and proficient in lightsabers.

[Ravenica]

I seem to recall there was some additional shenanigans you could only pull from the academy training manual if you took those levels in jedi. But I havent played SE in ages so I'm perfectly fine with it if I'm misremembering.

[Blind_Prophet]

Hey guys thanks for all the suggestions I've noted many people who are saying going 1 Jedi than multi-classing into another heroic class is usually best. Well I'm trying to make what I've heard called a "Space-Wizard" I am Dex/Wis focused (Cha Tertiary) and obviously want to use a lightsaber (a small one since I'm an Ewok)

So uh that known any suggestions on which I should take if not Jedi (aka Force User)

Also I could use some help on an Older (30-35ish) Ewok Name, A Human Male Force Master Name, A Young (14ish) Female Ewok Name.

Lastly some class changes amongst the party


The "Passion = Love" Sith is now a Noble 1 -> Soldier X and is fairly young...something to do with his father being a particularly cruel Imperial General caused him to runaway but not before stealing a bunch of weapons and credits than he joined a local rebellion. He's also our party Face...is hoping for some sort of demolitions focused prestige class. Dex/Cha Main (Int Tertiary - Bothan)

The guy who wanted to be a Jedi decided to make a Scout Sniper..plans to take the Assassin PrC (Human)

The Sith decided to make a Str/Con Build and is our "Tank" since were primarily low HP ranged combantants (I off-tank if he gets low since as a Jedi my HP is not bad) his character is a Slave who was force-sensitive and was basically copying his Dark Jedi jailors...I doubt this is canon but w/e. Anyways after training himself in secret he busted out basically killing everything in his way slave or slaver alike. His got a little he's got a bit of psycho in him but in general is fairly calm unless he comes across slavers (ie. A Chevon attacked us in an encounter today and the Sniper mentioned that Chevons tend to be slavers and a second later the Sith had eviscerated him)

The Scoundrel remains as a dual pistol wielder whos planning to go gunslinger

The fifth party member was absent due to work so his character is unknown.

We are Lvl 2 now.

So yeah any suggestions welcome :D

[Blind_Prophet]

OK well here's my current plan

Force User6/Scout1/Force Adept5/Force Disciple3/Force Master1/Force Adept4