How long will Belkar stay a good teammate?

[Fishnet]

When Belkar was all "It's Working Suckers!" and basking in the (directed) murder his membership in the OotS had allowed him to do, it seemed like he'd settled into a twisted sort of harmony with the rest of the party.

Durkon's vampirism changes all that. The obvious first reason is that he tried to eat Belkar, but I'm thinking Durkula sets off all sorts of ripples that could ruin Belkar's relationship with the party.

Let's step in the little sicko's mind and consider:
A) That bearded vampire tried to eat me (already said, but it's a big deal!)
B) Durkon smalled like a beer-soaked gym sock, true, but the new vampire thingy smells like a beer-soaked gym sock covered in dwarf corpse.
C) Thanks to the vampire treating me like a drinking fountain, I can't even kill any of these mooks!!! I have to hide like a bard!

Almost losing his own life? Terrible smells? A roadblock to the good life of unfettered killing? There's no way Belkar can tolerate Durkula's company. I think he's going to come unhinged from the rest of the party as a result (after he gets the Restoration, of course). They may not be the best vessel for serving the greater him any longer.

Thoughts?

[Roland Itiative]

Less than an in-comic year, that's for sure :smallamused:

[Porthos]

Even if I bought the central premise that Belkar hasn't changed a whit since the Arena arc, I will point out that once he gets a Restoration he would be able to get back to 'unfettered killing' as you put it.

[Krim]

IMHO, to death. Which may not be all that long.

[strijder20]

Belkar is Evil. It doesn't mean he will automatically like other Evil people, but LE is at least a lot better than his direct opposite LG.

Vampires don't rot.

I think he's actually happy with Durkon's change. At least now there's someone to support his unneeded murderous rampage (I suppose Durkon doesn't care about the innocent dying anymore).

[Lino]

Belkar loves his cat and won't do anything to endanger the cat. He needs the order for the cat's safety. He's not able to take care of the cat all by himself and he knows it - hell, that kobold already almost killed it in Belkar's absence, if it hadn't been for the others.

[allenw]

Until his last breath. Ever.

[Mike Havran]

Until he finally bites the dust.

[Gift Jeraff]

You seem to be missing the biggest thing about Belkar's feelings on undead Durkon: He's a mockery to living Durkon's beliefs that dishonours Durkon's sacrifice to save Belkar, which was obviously a life-changing experience for the halfling. Plus, he's a walking reminder of Belkar's failure to be of any help in the fight against Malack.

I doubt funny smells will be the cause of any serious conflict between the halfling and the vampire.

[Mike Havran]

You seem to be missing the biggest thing about Belkar's feelings on undead Durkon: He's a mockery to living Durkon's beliefs that dishonours Durkon's sacrifice to save Belkar, which was obviously a life-changing experience for the halfling. Plus, he's a walking reminder of Belkar's failure to be of any help in the fight against Malack.I doubt Belkar ever cared about Durkon's beliefs. We only know he hated them undead so much because he told it like, 900 strips ago.

[Ermete]

For how fool Belkar can be, He might have very well understood that, when Durkon was feeding on him, it was because he was controlled by Malack and not in control of himself.
Thus, I'm not so sure that the presence of Undead Durkon will cause trouble with Belkar per se. I definitely agree, however, that this cannot be ruled out with the few information we have about the matter at this point.

:smallsmile:

[martianmister]

How long will Belkar stay a living being? That's the answer.

[Harbinger]

While I do think there will be a conflict between Belkar and Durkula, I think it will be over something a mite more serious than "he smells funny".

:belkar: "That isn't Durkon!"

[Lord Vukodlak]

Until his death, I suspect that Belkar is going to wear this mask of being a half way decent Halfling being until he becomes it.

[SlashDash]

I think you're also missing the bigger point, so he doesn't like him - so what?
What could he possibly do about it?
We already established that Belkar is helpless against vampires.

He has failed every single will save he had to make, from the illusion runes to Malack's gaze (which Durkon has) to Durkon's hold person (which he still has) to Nale's charm person and whatever.

If he fights Durkon head on? He'll lose in the first round.

[Forikroder]

When Belkar was all "It's Working Suckers!" and basking in the (directed) murder his membership in the OotS had allowed him to do, it seemed like he'd settled into a twisted sort of harmony with the rest of the party.

Durkon's vampirism changes all that. The obvious first reason is that he tried to eat Belkar, but I'm thinking Durkula sets off all sorts of ripples that could ruin Belkar's relationship with the party.

Let's step in the little sicko's mind and consider:
A) That bearded vampire tried to eat me (already said, but it's a big deal!)
B) Durkon smalled like a beer-soaked gym sock, true, but the new vampire thingy smells like a beer-soaked gym sock covered in dwarf corpse.
C) Thanks to the vampire treating me like a drinking fountain, I can't even kill any of these mooks!!! I have to hide like a bard!

Almost losing his own life? Terrible smells? A roadblock to the good life of unfettered killing? There's no way Belkar can tolerate Durkula's company. I think he's going to come unhinged from the rest of the party as a result (after he gets the Restoration, of course). They may not be the best vessel for serving the greater him any longer.

Thoughts?

well 1) V has tried to kill Belkar yet Belkar is getting along fine with V so i dont think hes that petty

2) hes never complained about Durkons smell only the humans

3) hes not going to go crazy just because hes been forced to sit out one battle

4) he already clearly explained before fighting Malack that hes commited to saving the world now

[Skorj]

Belkar is faking it until he's making it, as the saying goes. He's well on the path to, well, not redemption but genuine change. I firmly believe his death will a noble sacrifice - though really I think he'll jump into the rift, and his fate will either be "happily ever after" or a mystery. But one way or another, the final rift will be the end for him in this world, and it will be knowing self-sacrifice when he goes.

I only hope he gets to save his kitty.

[Fishnet]

Man, is everyone but me convinced that Belkar isn't still a self-interested punk? I always got the sense from the Giant's comments in the books that Belkar isn't supposed to follow the classic "road to redemption", and that even his "character growth" is just a sham. Granted, he has started to show feelings for Mr. Scruffy in the current arc, but I don't think that extends to the rest of the party, or their mission for that matter. Belkar's still an amoral toad - he's just learned to play by the rules a little better.

So, to address the latest post;s counter-arguments


well 1) V has tried to kill Belkar yet Belkar is getting along fine with V so i dont think hes that petty
We haven't really seen a lot of interaction between Belkar and V in this arc. They both watched Mr Scruffy poop in the kobold's mouth, and maybe Belkar still thinks V has turned Evil ("welcome to deep end of the alignment pool") so he could just not care. Also, it's been a while since V pranked him, so he might've also forgotten. Belkar doesn't seem to hold grudges - he either settles them or moves on to a new one.


2) hes never complained about Durkons smell only the humans
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0682.html last panel, and further back I'm sure there are more examples.


3) hes not going to go crazy just because hes been forced to sit out one battle
Belkar gets angry and unhinged pretty easily, and he's sat out a lot of battles before this one. I'm just thinking that, by Belkar logic, this is a problem, especially since he's doing this whole team thing so that he CAN kill more.


4) he already clearly explained before fighting Malack that hes commited to saving the world nowhttp://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0869.html No, he just says he has something worth fighting for: himself. Forget the world.

[Onyavar]

I think he's actually happy with Durkon's change. At least now there's someone to support his unneeded murderous rampage (I suppose Durkon doesn't care about the innocent dying anymore).

Nope. Durkon is Lawful, Belkar is Chaotic. Durkon will never go rampage, much less unneeded so - he will chide Belkar just as the others will, if Belkar rampages again. Durkon already knows how to "play society", Belkar is still clueless about that whole thing.

Durkon will thus be efficient in his evilness, and steal Belkars spotlight in being evil. Belkar will hate it. It sucks to be Belkar now. It sucks even more than when his Mark was activated. Something has to change for Belkar, and soon - death or ... hm. what are the other options?

His only way to get noticed is developing towards NEUTRAL. He will hate it, too. Did I already mention it sucks being him now?

[Bulldog Psion]

How long will Belkar be a good teammate? Until he dies.

[Michaeler]

As long as it works, and it worked very recently.

This is essentially what civilisation is. You don't need to be a good person, but acting like a decent member of society works for you and for those around you.

[Ghost Nappa]

Nope. Durkon is Lawful, Belkar is Chaotic. Durkon will never go rampage, much less unneeded so - he will chide Belkar just as the others will, if Belkar rampages again. Durkon already knows how to "play society", Belkar is still clueless about that whole thing.

Durkon will thus be efficient in his evilness, and steal Belkars spotlight in being evil. Belkar will hate it. It sucks to be Belkar now. It sucks even more than when his Mark was activated. Something has to change for Belkar, and soon - death or ... hm. what are the other options?

His only way to get noticed is developing towards NEUTRAL. He will hate it, too. Did I already mention it sucks being him now?

Belkar Bitterleaf is now playing Grand Theft Allosaurus.
195 People recommend this game. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0922.html)

[Onyavar]

I feel dumb about my previous post today, but I stand to it.

This is just a short boom of awesomeness, there will be a long baisse.

But yeah, in fact, being Belkar mayne doesn't suck, as of right now. :smallbiggrin:

[the_tick_rules]

As long as it's the best option he has, it's what he's done so far, with varying degrees of success.

[DR27]

After this arc on the western continent, Belkar is loyal to the cause. His outlook as changed rapidly - the Order doesn't even need to expend effort pointing him towards the bad guys, he knows who the bad guys are now. "That's not Durkon" is/will be a problem for him, but it doesn't mean that he is ignoring the goals and objectives of the party anymore. I know why people are so quick to assume his dishonesty based on long past actions, but I really see change in how Belkar is acting. I think the Giant is going to keep taking Belkar in this new direction.