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Kaemon
2013-09-29, 04:26 AM
Hello there everyone, and thanks in advance for your help.
So, long story short, I'm having some problems upon deciding what system to use for playing a RPG with my friends. Should I play D&D? Should I try to improve and use my custom system again? Do you have a better idea/solution for me?

A "Little" Backstory:

I have always loved RPG since the first time I tried one (the famous Zanzer's Dungeon). I remember being a kid and not understanding many of the rules I was reading on the book included in the "board game", and also not having any clue at all how spells worked (back in that day it made no sense to me that the mage could only cast like 1 spell a day, and it made even less sense being able to cast his memorized spells nonstop).
Afterwards everytime I played was mostly using my own systems, rules, characters and sheets, but always loved D&D nonetheless.

My own games contained mostly a mixture between D&D and Blizzard's Diablo, so classes/races would have different stats on STR/DEX/INT, they would be able to increase those by freely allocating points when leveling (those granting increased Damage/Evasion/etc) and most of the weapons and equipment would have requisites, like a Long Sword would require 10 STR and 10 DEX, and a Two Handed Axe 20 STR (just as an example).
I had lots of fun with those systems (every time we started a campaign it would be a new, edited or polished version); but being honest, they were never really very good (and a couple that were played longer than average showed huge balance issues that required buffing or nerfing; but I'm not completely against that when necessary). However, I liked them and I'm still thinking about using my "own" system once again.

Then, I didn't play any RPG for the longest time, until recently (around 1 year ago) a friend decided to buy on Ebay the board game Hero Quest along all the official campaigns; so we started gathering and playing that (as always I was the GM, is what I do).
But, being honest here, and hopefully not hurning any Hero Quest fan, biut the game is "meh" and "too basic" at best. When playing it (if you follow all or most of the book rules) it feels more like playing chess or checkers than a real RPG game... And even if some of the rules can be blended and use some imagination to allow special things to happen, the game itself is very limited and almost impossible to expand upon because of the dice system it uses (and changing that can be considered as not playing Hero Quest anymore).

Anyway, we were pretty much done with the campaigns and because of studies and work and whatnot we kinda stopped playing. And a couple of days ago I was checking (not for the first time, but apparently for the first in a long time) for options to play online. That is when I discovered both MapTool and Roll20.

Both those tools (for those that don't know them) allow and help you creating maps, scenarios and characters to play good old RPGs online with your friends (or strangers!) and we are going to give it a try (probably later today).
MapTool felt like it could be the better option, but we couldn't manage to connect each other because of some problems and when googling for the solution too many possible causes showed (including the possibility of having to install an older version of Java) so we settled for Roll20. Not only we were already "playing" only 20 seconds after starting to create our accounts, but after using/learning it for less that a day I already feel very comfortable with it.
The only "problems" I encountered is that all players must be in the same "map" at the same time, sharing vision (unless you donate for dynamic lightning) and that unlike MapTool, there doesn't seem to exist any kind of "Path Tracker" for walking.
(If you know solutions to those, or you really think you know how to help me getting MapTool to work (allow to connect players) and really think is superior, directions for that would also be appreciated).

I have already made a test map using Zanzer's Dungeon board as the layout as a wink to nostalgia; and I believe the only player that ever played it will take a long time to recognize it because of the fog of war and the many things I changed.
So far I haven't decided on a system yet, but I'm ready to use something very simple for this first test run and add the "real rules" later.
So far what I have ready includes basic things on the lines of you have X HP, X Armor, 1d20 for Armor/Hit, +0 to all kind of hit, damage, evasion or whatever rolls; and the equipment I included (they start with none, in a cell) is very straight forward (+1 Armor, 1d6 damage, +3 armor -1 movement, etc...) and that is more than enough for this test run; but I really need to get something more serious ready for future sessions...


The Real Question:

Right now I don't have access to any D&D book nor a way of getting one in the near future, neither for GM nor Player; and even if I remember the very basics, is not enough for playing "seriously" or "properly". Also, I was never a big fan of the more overcomplicated part of some D&D rules; and I'm certainly not up for adding hundreds of sub-classes, advanced-classed and other weird stuff that I never read about but mentioned on forums.

Is there such thing as a "basic but efficient D&D rule-set" that is enough for playing a good and balanced campaign for years to come? Can I get a link or some directions for that?

If not, and/or if I still decide to use my own D&D/Diablo mixture set of rules, should I post my ideas/rules on the Homebrew subforum? Would I get some attention/help in there? You think I should do it anyway, even if I end up playing D&D?

Also another main problem I encountered is that I never had any kind of "advanced rules" (like a real spell progression). Just stats increasing your Damage/Hit/Evasion/Similar and some homemade feats.
Most of the time when doing a Saving Throw (like trying to jump over a big hole), I wouldn't even know what kind of result the players needed: I would just take into account what race/class/stats they had, what they were wearing/carrying and then tell them to roll 1d100. On 1-10 it was pretty obvious that they felt, on 90-100 it was pretty obvious that they jumped it with no problems, but... Where to draw the line? How? Is it usually a good idea to let players know the exact result they need to jump the hole successfully? Should they know how much damage they can receive upon falling into the hole (granted they can see the bottom)? What about saving to not get paralyzed by the touch of a silly lich, should they know what result they need as well before rolling the dice?

Oh, and an extra mini-question: What rolls do you think I should make (as a GM) and what rolls should the players make?
This chest has 2d6x100 coins, should be a Player-Who-Opens roll? A GM-Roll? A GM-Secret-Roll?
What about that room with 1d4 Gnolls? Or with the spell that enemy casted that has a 25% chance of summoning a demon?


Anyway, any kind of help will be appreciated, even if its not directly related to my main issues.

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EDIT 1, 10 Oct 2013, Post #14:

Thanks all for your help. If you are curious we finally settled for Pathfinder. I found a great site in Spanish (so all my players can read it) and I also found lots of things for myself (like a huge creature listing) in english.
Sounds about right to me, "Classic" D&D 3.5 that has been further refined, balanced and tweaked. It simplifies some things (like having Perception instead of Listen/Spot/etc) and spices things up for some classes and some levels and what not.

However, I'm not so sure about this Barbarian one of my players made...
Right now they are Lv1 and fighting against some small groups of goblins. Those have +1/3 BAB (Melee/Ranged), 16 AC (15-14 if no shield/armor) and deal around 1d4 damage.
The Barbarian in the group has 19 STR at L1 wich gives him +4 on Attack and Damage with melee weapons (there seem to be no limits on stats, so I guess at Lv4 he can get 20 STR for +5). As one of his two starting feats (he is human) he choose Power Attack (a classic)... He is using a 1d12 2H Axe I gave him (before knowing what rule set we were going to use) but seems to be an average 2H weapon for the game.

So he has: +1 (BAB) + 4 (STR) + (-1) (Power Attack) to hit.
And for damage: 1d12 (Weapon) +6 (150% STR for using 2H) + (+3 Power Attack).
So, at Lv1, when using Power Attack, he has +4 To Hit and 1d12+9 Damage.
Is that correct? Is that normal? Seems a little out of the chart to me.
Not to mention that he is a Barbarian, and when he rages he gets futher +4 STR that gives him +2 Hit and +3 Damage with his 2Hander Melee Weapon, and when he does so his damage goes up to 13 to 24 on a confirmed hit (non crit); he can pretty much, if the dice helps hitting (and the +7(-1) to Hit with Power Attack while in Rage helps a lot), one-hit any CR1 I can throw at him. Opinions/Suggestions?
Also, is a Crit (after confirmed with a 2nd roll) just double the damage on a normal weapon? Would he crit for 48 freaking damage if he did rolled 12 (+12) on the damage roll while he is using Rage? Or do some of the stats/damages don't get doubled on crits?

If I understood correctly Pathfinder allows you (as a human) to put 2 points on a stat (he changed his 17 STR to 19), and PowerAttack does -1 Hit for +2 Damage (+3 if 2 Hander), and STR is calculated 150% for 2HandWeapons damage.

BTW, his HP also seems a little out of the chart, tell me if I did everything okay:
12 (1d12 Hit Dice) + 2 (15 CON) + 1 (Barbarian Favored Class) + 3 (Toughness Feat, gives 1 Extra HP per level, but +3 minimum) for a total of 18 HP at Level 1. Still, I'm more worried about his 13-24 base damage on any confirmed hit.

BTW, how do you deal with players that keep throwing torches in the middle of the room to have both hands available for battle? You make them cause only "shadowy light", reduce by half the illumination, just allow normally, or what?

And if I understood correctly, Pathfinder doesn't has any XP Reduction/Penalty for Class, Race or Multiclassing? Is there a Class-Limit when multiclassing? It sounds like I could be a Lv10 with 1 Lv on 10 classes. Not that it seems to be the best idea, but seems too easy to Multiclass to me.
Also, if I'm a Multiclass Lv2 Barbarian/Ranger, I get +1 BAB +1 BAB for +2 BAB; right? They just add up, don't they?

And a last question. I'm not sure about the treasures/gold/XP I should give the players, as I haven't studied the CR/XP charts yet (they seem a little complicated). What do you think it should be the average XP/Gold/MagicItems (if any) for 3-4 Lv1 chars killing small groups of 6-12 Goblins?

Oh, and also: for asking further questions about Pathfinder, should I use the D&D3/3.5/d20 Forum, or the "Others" forum (here)?

Arcane_Snowman
2013-09-29, 04:37 AM
http://www.d20srd.org/ and http://d20pfsrd.com/ are both excellent gateways into D&D or Patherfinder respectively. They've got most of the rules needed to play either game. With the exception of Wealth by Level and Experience needed to level up, but ultimately that's something you can make up, the former doesn't always get followed 100%, but as long as you're evenly distributing it, it shouldn't be a problem. The latter for Pathfinder can almost as easily be made into a ding button "I say ding when you level up".

Edit: with that kind of rolling it's entirely up to you IMO. You could give it to players if you wanted to, or you could roll it secretly. Depends entirely upon the feel you want.

Kaemon
2013-09-29, 04:53 AM
Thanks for the links Arcane Snowman. Gonna take a look at the D&D one right now.
Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "Wealth by Level", but I believe the experience to level up should be no problem. Also, I like leveling my players when they rest or finish the dungeon/whatever.

BTW, I have read Pathfinder being mentioned multiple times and the Roll20 tool even has a move-option that adapts to it, but I have no clue what is about... I mean, in what ways its different to D&D? Care to explain even if very briefly?

Arcane_Snowman
2013-09-29, 05:21 AM
Wealth by level is a rough guideline by which the DM is supposed to hand out equipment to the players.

Pathfinder is a revision of D&D, after Wizards of the Coast went on to 4th Edition, a different Company called Paizo continued with the style of 3.5, making a few alterations to the base classes and rules. Some people prefer one or the other, but Pathfinder definitely has good support in terms of free featured material.

Black Jester
2013-09-29, 05:30 AM
When it doubt, roll openly and tell your players what it means beforehand, so that they know what you are doing and what is the importance of that role. Transparency can create trust and trust is essential for a functional player-GM relation.

Pathfinder is a sidestep evolution of the third edition of D&D for those who didn't like the somewhat more radical changes of the new edition. Depending on whom you ask, it is a great improvement of 3rd edition which compensated most of that one's minor mistake, or it is a compiled and published list of houserules. But for all purposes, it is basically the same system as D&D (3.5) with a few changes.

When it comes to new players, the newer D&D editions (including Pathfinder) seem to bit on the complex and convoluted side. That is not bad per se, but it is not exactly a light weight system. If your primary interest is a game where players face the dangers and denizens of a dungeon and have to overcome them through cleverness, tactical plans and resourcefulness, the older D&D versions or the many modernized versions of those might be a lot more streamlined and accessible for you. Take a look at Labyrinth Lord (http://www.goblinoidgames.com/labyrinthlord.html)(for instance; there is a dozen or so freely available 'retro clones' games out there, but as far as I am aware, Labyrinth Lord seems to be the biggest one).

Generally speaking, there are many, many good games available for free out there. I know that D&D is often used synonymously with RPG but there are alternatives, pretty much for all tastes. If you, for instance, would prefer a more streamlined, 'realistic' game with a gradual and less drastic character improvement scheme, you could go for Runequest (http://basicroleplaying.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=6) instead.

Knaight
2013-09-30, 06:52 PM
It sounds like you've seen a handful of very similar games, and are considering making your own because none of those work, but without much grounding in the hobby. I'd recommend against this, and would suggest looking into some genuinely different games. Assuming you want to stick to fantasy:

Chronica Feudalis: It's much more medieval than D&D, specifically focusing on the 1100's, without much in the way of fantasy elements. It also focuses on four different conflict systems (combat, chases, parleys, and subterfuge) which are all equally developed, with mechanics to tie the character's personalities to the mechanics to some extent.

REIGN: REIGN is a high fantasy game, every bit as magical as D&D. The system itself is built around a brilliant core mechanic which covers quite a bit, and in addition to the character level it has something called the "Company" level, which covers all organizations from local gangs to empires - where the players probably get to use both layers.

Grod_The_Giant
2013-09-30, 07:06 PM
When it comes to picking a system, you have to ask yourself what you want out of it:

What genre do you want to play?
What power level do you want to play at (Nameless mooks? Competent-but-human? Conan? Spiderman? Superman?)
What style do you want? (Gritty? Pulpy? Over-the-top?)
What level of complexity are you looking for?
How close to what you know (ie, D&D)?
How much are you willing to spend?

and so on.

EDIT: Oh, and the homebrew boards are generally pretty good for getting feedback. Come and say hi, we don't bite.

Kaemon
2013-10-01, 12:20 PM
Sorry for taking a little to long to answer, but I'm very busy this week with a temporal job.
Thanks everyone for the answers.

Arcane Snowman: Thanks for the brief description of Pathfinder, now at least I know what it is about. Any brief mention on the bigger differences or what were the big (radical?) changes to D&D that originated Pathfinder as a different option?

Black Jester: Thats what I usually do, but I wanted to know what was the "official/favored" way of doing that kind of rols (if there was one at all), or what you usually think is better.
I checked Labyrinth Lord, but seems too basic for me; everything that I read in there (about 10 pages worth) was mostly thinks that I already knew (basic D&D and Hero Quest stuff, mostly).
How is Runequest different (if you don't mind explaining) and why do I automatically think that is a WebBrowser RPG?

Knaight: I read you answer now and I didn't have time to check those suggestions yet, will do so later (tonight or this week).
I have seen and played quite some games indeed, in Computer, Console and Boardgames. Of the later, very basic D&D (Zanzer's Dungeon), almost all the official stuff from Hero Quest (even if I'm not a big fan, is what a friend bought, so we played it), Lord of the Rings (the one with a detailed description for each attack roll on 1d100+X) and a couple more not worth mentioning.

The "problem" is that I have never been a non-stop player or actively looking for info/news, and from my group of friends you could consider me the only one doing any research or knowing rules when we start playing (even if they adapt fast enough to what I know/share, that is usually where it ends, so I'm kinda alone for that matter).

Grod The Giant: I'm going to play Medieval Fantasy as is what I like. Warriors, Mages, Elves, Trolls, Healing Potions, Fireballs, Necromancers and the like. Not a big fan of realistic or futuristic settings.
As for the Power Level, I like my players to start kinda as Nameless Mooks and mover towards a Connan like level. I don't like it when everything needs to be a Dragon, Demon or Demi God to be a real threat; and I try to prolong the "going into a dungeon/castle/cave full of kobolds/orcs/trolls" as long as possible (in fact, I don't think I ever used anything bigger/stronger than a ogre; but then again, we never played a really serious and long campaing).

When this week ends and I have more free time again, I will probably post in the Homebrew Boards my ideas and see what kind of feedback I get or if people are able to point flaws on my design.


I always liked creating my own system, and to be honest I think I'm kinda good at it; but I like Skills/Feats/Spells (or whatever you call them) as I "can't" make so many for so many classes (to allow my players some variety of choice); so I started looking those links Arcane Snowman posted to learn more about which ones D&D uses.
I also read many basic rules; was kinda surprised when I realized that I pretty much invented Attack of Opportunity (I didn't know what it was about) when doing my tweaking on Hero Quest (as players kept doing things like "I Attack and Move" and the next one "I Move and I Attack" and felt cheap.
Was also surprised to learn that running on D&D is a x4 (straight line, no heavy armor), seems too much for the boards we usually use; and I really like the "5-feet step" rule and gonna use it for sure.

However, when I start checking Feats and Skills... Basic D&D and Hero Quest seem too simple, but D&D seems too complex, so I'm not sure what I will do there...
BTW; I'm still not sure what kind of HP system I will use (we started playing already just to try out the Roll20 site, using 9+1d6 HP on "blank chars"), but if I end using the D&D Hit Dice system (1d4 for mage, 1d12 for barbarian) I was thinking about giving them Max HP at Lv1 (4 Mage, 12 Barbarian), and then make them roll for each new level, but not allowing repeated results (so the Mage would only allow 1, 2 and 3, and if he gets 2, the next level he will only be able to get 1 o 3), sounds good? Seems like a nice way of balancing the randomized HP, but without taking the random factor fun completely out of it.

And one last question; if anyone here uses Roll20, can you give some advice to improve our experience? Specially towards Char Sheet and Inventory Management, as those seem too clumsy and slow.
BTW, one of my players (that does like looking for things that make his life easier) found us a macro that will add initiatives automatically and it sure is handy, I only have to select the creatures and press it, and they are in there ultra-fast.

JusticeZero
2013-10-01, 12:56 PM
Arcane Snowman: Thanks for the brief description of Pathfinder, now at least I know what it is about. Any brief mention on the bigger differences or what were the big (radical?) changes to D&D that originated Pathfinder as a different option?
Classes were mildly changed to remove "dead levels" (levels where you don't get any new toys).
Feats were tweaked - PF gives out more feats, but some of them were split across two feats.
Spells were slightly tweaked; some commonly accepted as broken spells were edited to be less broken.
Slight changes to status effects and the like.
Some skills were merged.
Certain bits of content which are D&D-specific IP (mind flayers, for instance) were replaced with new content. A different default setting was created (closed Paizo IP) for default use.

It really is not very different; I have described it as "D&D, with just enough tweaks to be able to claim that they aren't just reprinting the free 3.5 SRD for a profit". There are numerous slight changes all over the place. There are very few of the changes that I have disagreed with, though it has been noted that the second and third order consequences of those changes are sometimes as annoying as the original rules, in different ways. Major problems inherent to D&D since it was created have been once again grandfathered in, but "they didn't fix the problem with the other choice" is hardly a rational reason to make a decision on, since by definition, the problem is in both.

I do Pathfinder because i'm too old and too mobile and not in a point in my life to enjoy the idea of prowling around for rare out of print tomes when all that stuff is offered for free in Pathfinder. Pathfinder pays their bills by selling awesome adventures and content, and requiring registry-checked book ownership for their central events. It's a much friendlier system for the gamer on a budget.

Kadzar
2013-10-01, 02:02 PM
BTW; I'm still not sure what kind of HP system I will use (we started playing already just to try out the Roll20 site, using 9+1d6 HP on "blank chars"), but if I end using the D&D Hit Dice system (1d4 for mage, 1d12 for barbarian) I was thinking about giving them Max HP at Lv1 (4 Mage, 12 Barbarian), and then make them roll for each new level, but not allowing repeated results (so the Mage would only allow 1, 2 and 3, and if he gets 2, the next level he will only be able to get 1 o 3), sounds good? Seems like a nice way of balancing the randomized HP, but without taking the random factor fun completely out of it.


Another way to do this is borrowing from Stars Without Number and having players roll all their accumulated hit dice (plus modifiers) every level-up to determine their HP. If the new HP total comes up greater than before, they keep it, otherwise they just use their old HP.

Grod_The_Giant
2013-10-01, 02:18 PM
D&D e6 (http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?206323-E6-The-Game-Inside-D-amp-D)? You progress up to 6th level normally, and then you switch over to epic-level-style advancement-- you get more feats as you get more experience, but no more class levels. It cuts down on the material you need to know rather considerably. You can trim down feat and skill lists to taste-- it's always easier to modify an existing system than to build a new one.

Knaight
2013-10-01, 02:37 PM
Knaight: I read you answer now and I didn't have time to check those suggestions yet, will do so later (tonight or this week).
I have seen and played quite some games indeed, in Computer, Console and Boardgames. Of the later, very basic D&D (Zanzer's Dungeon), almost all the official stuff from Hero Quest (even if I'm not a big fan, is what a friend bought, so we played it), Lord of the Rings (the one with a detailed description for each attack roll on 1d100+X) and a couple more not worth mentioning.

The "problem" is that I have never been a non-stop player or actively looking for info/news, and from my group of friends you could consider me the only one doing any research or knowing rules when we start playing (even if they adapt fast enough to what I know/share, that is usually where it ends, so I'm kinda alone for that matter).

This still leaves fairly few tabletop RPGs, which are very much a distinct entity. As for being the only one who knows the rules and does research, I feel you there. Even the main game I play (I use Fudge heavily), which I've played for years, remains unread by a decent chunk of the group, everything else is even less known.

erikun
2013-10-01, 06:17 PM
How is Runequest different (if you don't mind explaining) and why do I automatically think that is a WebBrowser RPG?
You're thinking RuneScape (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RuneScape) rather than RuneQuest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RuneQuest).

I have not played RuneQuest myself and only have the RQ6 book for familiarity, so I'm not sure if Black Jester's link is anything different. I'd probably be best leaving the explanation to someone who knows the system better. However, what I can tell you from RQ6:

Skills range from 1 to 100 (and above) and rolls are made with d%, compared to the skill value. Equal to or less than the skill is a success. Variables can change the target number, from very easy tasks doubling the target number, to Hurclean tasks dividing it by ten. (There is also a variant of just adding and subtracting a value from the target number, rather than multiplying it.) Skills begin as a combination of two stats, so if a 10 in Strength and a 12 in Dexterity, your Athletics base is 22. Skills are then increased at character creation based on the character's career.

Increasing skills is done through spending experience on experience rolls. Roll d% and compare it to the skill. Rolling equal to or above the skill improves it by d4+1, which rolling below improves the skill by 1.

Kaemon
2013-10-10, 07:20 AM
Thanks all for your help. If you are curious we finally settled for Pathfinder. I found a great site in Spanish (so all my players can read it) and I also found lots of things for myself (like a huge creature listing) in english.
Sounds about right to me, "Classic" D&D 3.5 that has been further refined, balanced and tweaked. It simplifies some things (like having Perception instead of Listen/Spot/etc) and spices things up for some classes and some levels and what not.

However, I'm not so sure about this Barbarian one of my players made...
Right now they are Lv1 and fighting against some small groups of goblins. Those have +1/3 BAB (Melee/Ranged), 16 AC (15-14 if no shield/armor) and deal around 1d4 damage.
The Barbarian in the group has 19 STR at L1 wich gives him +4 on Attack and Damage with melee weapons (there seem to be no limits on stats, so I guess at Lv4 he can get 20 STR for +5). As one of his two starting feats (he is human) he choose Power Attack (a classic)... He is using a 1d12 2H Axe I gave him (before knowing what rule set we were going to use) but seems to be an average 2H weapon for the game.

So he has: +1 (BAB) + 4 (STR) + (-1) (Power Attack) to hit.
And for damage: 1d12 (Weapon) +6 (150% STR for using 2H) + (+3 Power Attack).
So, at Lv1, when using Power Attack, he has +4 To Hit and 1d12+9 Damage.
Is that correct? Is that normal? Seems a little out of the chart to me.
Not to mention that he is a Barbarian, and when he rages he gets futher +4 STR that gives him +2 Hit and +3 Damage with his 2Hander Melee Weapon, and when he does so his damage goes up to 13 to 24 on a confirmed hit (non crit); he can pretty much, if the dice helps hitting (and the +7(-1) to Hit with Power Attack while in Rage helps a lot), one-hit any CR1 I can throw at him. Opinions/Suggestions?
Also, is a Crit (after confirmed with a 2nd roll) just double the damage on a normal weapon? Would he crit for 48 freaking damage if he did rolled 12 (+12) on the damage roll while he is using Rage? Or do some of the stats/damages don't get doubled on crits?

If I understood correctly Pathfinder allows you (as a human) to put 2 points on a stat (he changed his 17 STR to 19), and PowerAttack does -1 Hit for +2 Damage (+3 if 2 Hander), and STR is calculated 150% for 2HandWeapons damage.

BTW, his HP also seems a little out of the chart, tell me if I did everything okay:
12 (1d12 Hit Dice) + 2 (15 CON) + 1 (Barbarian Favored Class) + 3 (Toughness Feat, gives 1 Extra HP per level, but +3 minimum) for a total of 18 HP at Level 1. Still, I'm more worried about his 13-24 base damage on any confirmed hit.

BTW, how do you deal with players that keep throwing torches in the middle of the room to have both hands available for battle? You make them cause only "shadowy light", reduce by half the illumination, just allow normally, or what?

And if I understood correctly, Pathfinder doesn't has any XP Reduction/Penalty for Class, Race or Multiclassing? Is there a Class-Limit when multiclassing? It sounds like I could be a Lv10 with 1 Lv on 10 classes. Not that it seems to be the best idea, but seems too easy to Multiclass to me.
Also, if I'm a Multiclass Lv2 Barbarian/Ranger, I get +1 BAB +1 BAB for +2 BAB; right? They just add up, don't they?

And a last question. I'm not sure about the treasures/gold/XP I should give the players, as I haven't studied the CR/XP charts yet (they seem a little complicated). What do you think it should be the average XP/Gold/MagicItems (if any) for 3-4 Lv1 chars killing small groups of 6-12 Goblins?

Oh, and also: for asking further questions about Pathfinder, should I use the D&D3/3.5/d20 Forum, or the "Others" forum (here)?

JusticeZero
2013-10-10, 08:01 AM
So, at Lv1, when using Power Attack, he has +4 To Hit and 1d12+9 Damage.
Is that correct? Is that normal? Seems a little out of the chart to me.That is completely typical and normal for everything 3.0 and onward, and my only concern is why it is that only one character has pinged on your radar for doing things like that. What is the rest of the party?

Also, is a Crit (after confirmed with a 2nd roll) just double the damage on a normal weapon? Would he crit for 48 freaking damage if he did rolled 12 (+12) on the damage roll while he is using Rage? Or do some of the stats/damages don't get doubled on crits?A Greataxe has a crit of 20X3 (it just shows as X3). On a 20, with a confirmed crit, he should roll full damage three times. If it was an 18-20X2, it would be two hits of damage, but a natural 18 would be enough to to confirm a crit.
12 (1d12 Hit Dice) + 2 (15 CON) + 1 (Barbarian Favored Class) + 3 (Toughness Feat, gives 1 Extra HP per level, but +3 minimum) for a total of 18 HP at Level 1. Still, I'm more worried about his 13-24 base damage on any confirmed hit.Yes, that looks right, and again not exceptional.
BTW, how do you deal with players that keep throwing torches in the middle of the room to have both hands available for battle? You make them cause only "shadowy light", reduce by half the illumination, just allow normally, or what?I just allow it. Remember that if they are fighting things with darkvision, the enemy can as an action go to one of the torches they have tossed to them and put it out.
And if I understood correctly, Pathfinder doesn't has any XP Reduction/Penalty for Class, Race or Multiclassing? Is there a Class-Limit when multiclassing? It sounds like I could be a Lv10 with 1 Lv on 10 classes. Not that it seems to be the best idea, but seems too easy to Multiclass to me.
Also, if I'm a Multiclass Lv2 Barbarian/Ranger, I get +1 BAB +1 BAB for +2 BAB; right? They just add up, don't they?Sure, you can do that. You will end up as the puniest character in the party, so there's really no point to adding an extra penalty on top of it. Multiclassing is rarely a power move in PF.
And yes, you have +2 BAB, same as the Barbarian 2 and the Ranger 2.

And a last question. I'm not sure about the treasures/gold/XP I should give the players, as I haven't studied the CR/XP charts yet (they seem a little complicated). What do you think it should be the average XP/Gold/MagicItems (if any) for 3-4 Lv1 chars killing small groups of 6-12 Goblins?http://webpages.charter.net/tedsarah/Pathfinder/utilities/encounterCalculator.htm
I'm sure there's others. That's just automating those charts.
Use the D&D/3.5 forum for PF.

Kaemon
2013-10-10, 08:10 AM
That is completely typical and normal for everything 3.0 and onward, and my only concern is why it is that only one character has pinged on your radar for doing things like that. What is the rest of the party?
A Wizard (that still has +2 from STR/DEX/CON and +4 from INT), a Paladin (+2 CON/CHA +3 STR) but that is using a shield, a "naked" Monk (not sure what equipment, if any, Monks should end using) that has +2 STR/DEX/WIS and +1 CON (not very good rolls) and Ranger that has +2 CON and -2 CHA (really bad rolls, and so far is using the only thing he could find, a Heavy Crossbow, that he has to spend 1 round charing).
BTW, do you allow ranged attacks to me made through a friend? What if he is fighting something smaller than him (like a Goblin)? What if there are like 2-3 friends between the archer and a small/medium enemy? What if the enemy is in line of sight with you (with no one in the middle), but still meleeing a friend, does the "typical -4 Hit" still apply?


A Greataxe has a crit of 20X3 (it just shows as X3). On a 20, with a confirmed crit, he should roll full damage three times. If it was an 18-20X2, it would be two hits of damage, but a natural 18 would be enough to to confirm a crit.
Well, its a 2Handed Axe he found in the pillaging of the Goblins. We have been using it as a Natural 20 to Crit x2; and since he does that much damage already, I will keep it that way until he buys one himself.


Use the D&D/3.5 forum for PF.Will do so.
Thanks for the other answers as well, and for the link, gonna check it now.