Question about #172

[Adrius]

Ran a search, came up with nothing..

Lazy Link: #172 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0172.html)

Question is.. What's V's deal down in the bottom frames? I don't get it.

[TinSoldier]

Ran a search, came up with nothing..

Lazy Link: #172 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0172.html)

Question is.. What's V's deal down in the bottom frames? I don't get it.V knows that Haley likes Elan. Hence the knowing smile. Wink wink, nudge nudge, say no more.

[Adrius]

Thanks :)

I figured it was that but it just seemed to be hinting at more.

[Adrius]

Ok, new question. Last panel of #242?

Lazy Link: #242 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0242.html)

Don't have any clue about that one. Someone understand?

[phobiandarkmoon]

I assume you mean the reference to 'Cerebus'.

I too have no idea, but a quick google search pulls up a comic that it seems Rich was likely to have read by that name, and it sounds like the character was fairly easy to blame for a lot of bad stuff. So, that's my guess at any rate.

It certainly has no long-term bearing on the strip

[fangthane]

Having done a similar search myself (I'd ignored the reference thus far) there's a fairly obvious reference to the notion of a comic having a real, internally-consistent story line wherein characters bear the consequences of their past and their actions, in addition to which the concept behind Cerebus was apparently to have the title character die in the final episode. Seems to me there may be an additional joke on that level, anyhow.

[Fenix]

Ran a search, came up with nothing..

Lazy Link: #172 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0172.html)

Question is.. What's V's deal down in the bottom frames? I don't get it.

I think it means " You saved him from one problem only to push him into another one, but i concur because it was his fault anyway AND Elan wont get traumatised" :smallwink:

[TigerHunter]

I think it means " You saved him from one problem only to push him into another one, but i concur because it was his fault anyway AND Elan wont get traumatised" :smallwink:
That's a good one too, didn't even think of that.

[Brickwall]

May have to do with the Cerebus Syndrome, listed here (http://www.websnark.com/archives/2004/09/faq_lexicon.html). Or it may be that webcomic. Iono.

[Terraxos]

Having done a similar search myself (I'd ignored the reference thus far) there's a fairly obvious reference to the notion of a comic having a real, internally-consistent story line wherein characters bear the consequences of their past and their actions, in addition to which the concept behind Cerebus was apparently to have the title character die in the final episode. Seems to me there may be an additional joke on that level, anyhow.
It goes slightly further than that... 'Cerebus the Aardvark' is not just a serious, character-driven comic, but is a famous example of a comic that started off just making jokes without any ongoing plot, and by the end was entirely engrossed in telling the story with the humour forgotten.
According to Wikipedia:

The comics review site Websnark (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Websnark) uses the term "Cerebus syndrome" to describe the situation when a light, gag-a-day comic adds layer after layer of sophistication to its characters and set-up. Eventually, the strip comes to the point where the strip bears little resemblance to its roots; whether the transformation is successful is another matter entirely.This is, to a certain extent, what has happened to OOTS: compare the early (simple, one-off, joke-driven) strips to the recent (more complex, connected, plot-driven) ones. This is exactly what V's line is referring to, after Haley says "We were a lot safer when we just made fairly obvious jokes about the rules!" If OOTS had remained a gag-a-day, humour-driven comic (as it used to be) rather than becoming a more plot-driven one, they would never have got into that dramatic situation in the first place.

Personally, I don't 'blame Cerebus' for anything. I think OOTS is all the better for its ongoing storylines; long may they continue!

[Spiky]

On #172, I must respectfully disagree with everything said in this thread.

Haley is a Rogue, a thief and a liar by definition. She is not a leader type, and she is not willing to put her neck out for others unless some coin will come her way. At least, that's what she trys to get people to think. But here, she saved Roy all sorts of headaches, a basically selfless act. This basically cements her place as second-in-command, too. Her love for Elan has little to do with this as it was Roy she was helping.

V is smiling about Haley "growing up", not being selfish, and behaving like a leader.

I might add....this is exactly the look every parent gives their adult child when they become a parent themselves and do a good job with their kids. Stupid obnoxious know-it-all grandparents!

[PaladinFreak]

I Disagree with your assesment of rougue. Rougues can be of any alignment, anywhere from LG to CE. I don't necessarily disagree with your conclusion, however. In fact, I think that it is quite insightfull.

[Blood]

Rogues can be of any alignment, anywhere from LG to CE.
Actually, I'm fairly sure that rogues can't be Lawful.

[Kish]

You're both wrong. Rogues can be of any alignment, anywhere from Chaotic Good to Lawful Evil. Rouges, on the other hand, are always neutral evil.

(And, yeah, if you think a rogue is "a thief and a liar by definition" I can only suggest you need to read any or all of the rogue or thief class descriptions from any Edition. Even way back in original D&D-no-A, the tutorial made a big point about the class "thief" not meaning "someone who steals.")

[Spiky]

I was talking about Haley, not rogues in general. Sorry if you didn't get my commas. Rogue, thief, liar....all adjectives for Haley.

[Amon Star]

Actually, I'm fairly sure that rogues can't be Lawful.

Not anymore. These days there are no Alignment restictions for that class.

[Jefepato]

Not anymore. These days there are no Alignment restictions for that class.

Were there ever? I could have sworn I saw someone playing an LN thief in 2e.

[Amon Star]

Were there ever? I could have sworn I saw someone playing an LN thief in 2e.

In 2nd ed Thieves couldn't be LG. Any other combination, but not LG.

[Ampersand]

V is smiling about Haley "growing up", not being selfish, and behaving like a leader.

I think it has more to do with the fact that, earlier on (125-128) Haley forces V to apologize to Elan without using magic after hurting his feelings. In 172, Haley takes the exact opposite tactic, lying to Elan to cover up the fact that Roy had abandoned him. V just appreciates the hypocrisy of the situation.