Undead Dragonborn?

[CyberThread]

If a DB gets killed, and instead of resurrected, but raised as some sort of vampire or weird thing like that, could it still use its breath weapon ?

[Fouredged Sword]

I would think it could only happen in a niche case. Becoming undead almost always turns you evil.

Once you become evil, you would loose the template entirely. Bahamut would withdraw his blessing and they would revert to their natural form.

That said, isn't the save con based? If so you lose it with most templates, as you loose your con score.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

No, because undead creatures have no Constitution score and a breath weapon is a Con-based ability.

[Gemini476]

I would think it could only happen in a niche case. Becoming undead almost always turns you evil.

Once you become evil, you would loose the template entirely. Bahamut would withdraw his blessing and they would revert to their natural form.

That said, isn't the save con based? If so you lose it with most templates, as you loose your con score.

Well, Dracolich would change it to Cha-based. Also Con - is basically Con 10 with immunities.

Although Dracolich requires you to be evil, so that doesn't work. Hmm.

Necropolitan at level 3, turn Good, Rite of Rebirth later? The save for your breath would suck, though.

Vampire Dragon could be added to a Dragonwrought Dragonborn... But then they become Chaotic Evil and get stripped of their Dragonborn-hood.

I don't know if there are any ways to change your breath weapon's save beyond the dragon-focused templates, sorry.

[Slipperychicken]

I would think it could only happen in a niche case. Becoming undead almost always turns you evil.


Not necessarily; undeath doesn't force people into a given alignment, which is one of the reasons Wee Jass can be a neutral goddess of undeath. If you become a Necropolitan (Libris Mortis), for example, you could be whatever alignment you want.

[Gemini476]

Not necessarily; undeath doesn't force people into a given alignment, which is one of the reasons Wee Jass can be a neutral goddess of undeath. If you become a Necropolitan (Libris Mortis), for example, you could be whatever alignment you want.

You could also become a Sacred Watcher and be forced into the Good alignments. If you can stomach being a Deathless Ghost with +5 LA, that is.

[Red Fel]

I think it's possible, but given the fluff, unlikely. Although undead aren't all inherently evil, they are inherently not-natural, which may be enough for a Lawful Good deity to withdraw his Blessing of Awesome.

[CyberThread]

Lawful Good does not mean anti unnatural , otherwise dragonborn could not happen, because it was unnatural when it first started.

Bahamut is not a nature god, so should be less concerned about if someone is undead or not, and more concerned what being undead is doing to the state of things , and if the undead thing is doing bad.

Forgotten realms has a full host of good aligned undead, as does eberron.


An Bahamut is more a forgotten realms god then core.

[Red Fel]

Lawful Good does not mean anti unnatural , otherwise dragonborn could not happen, because it was unnatural when it first started.

I was with you until that last part. Dragonborn are about Bahamut interceding in the prime. There's natural, and unnatural, and then there's divine intervention. Different category altogether.


Bahamut is not a nature god, so should be less concerned about if someone is undead or not, and more concerned what being undead is doing to the state of things , and if the undead thing is doing bad.

Valid. Note that I said it "may" be enough to tick him off. Bahamut considers Rebirth to be a blessing. Voluntarily saying "Yes, that's nice, but I also want to be a walking corpse" doesn't necessarily smack of gratitude. Reading the fluff (and admittedly, it is fluff, so it's subject to interpretation) the Dragonborn see their physical bodies as a mark of something divine. The whole "my body is a temple" thing. It seems that voluntarily becoming undead could be seen (again, could, not must) as desecrating that temple.


Forgotten realms has a full host of good aligned undead, as does eberron.

While true, that doesn't guarantee how Bahamut will feel.


An Bahamut is more a forgotten realms god then core.

What is this, I don't even.

[CyberThread]

Argument One:Forgotten Realms allows good undead


Argument Two: Bahamut has more interaction among the Forgotten Realms Cannon then most of Core

Argument Three: BAhamut is not a nature god, so would view the undead based on the deeds it does or affects of things around it does.

Results of Arguments: IF you view Bahamut more at home for a forgotten realms interaction , then what you see in core, the divine morality of something being undead needs to be the core of that gods standard of beliefs, which bahamut does not have.

The setting allows undead to function beyond the core assumption of "EVERYTHING IS EVIL IF IT HAS WEEVILS! "(worms in a corpse)

You can Link the two through that effort of thought, making bahamut not automatically hateful of something being undead, if it is the RIGHT type of undead.

Core does not have as much flexibility with moral views.

[hamishspence]

Argument One:Forgotten Realms allows good undead


Argument Two: Bahamut has more interaction among the Forgotten Realms Cannon then most of Core

He only really gets mentioned in Dragons of Faerun- none of the previous 3rd ed books with deity listings, had him.

Compared to most of the racial deities (Lolth, Tiamat, Kurtulmak, Moradin, Grummsh, etc) that appear in both "core" and Forgotten Realms, he is extremely low profile.

[Gemini476]

Not to mention that he's kind of from Greyhawk, so yeah. Was with in the first supplement back in 1975, apparently.

He didn't become part of the Forgotten Realms cosmology until Draconomicon (the original) came out in 1990.

So yeah, he's very much Greyhawk first, Faerun second. On a note more related to the topic, a Dragonborn of Bahamut could become an undead without getting stripped of its powers if it is still Good and has not broken the Dragonborn Code of Conduct (TM).

[Kuulvheysoon]

Necropolitan at level 3, turn Good, Rite of Rebirth later? The save for your breath would suck, though.

Nope - dragonborn is a template that can only be applied to a living creature.

[CyberThread]

HAve to be the other way around, you die while being dragonborn

[Kuulvheysoon]

HAve to be the other way around, you die while being dragonborn

I was responding to that single option - hence why I snipped the rest of the post.

[Lord Vukodlak]

No, because undead creatures have no Constitution score and a breath weapon is a Con-based ability.

So is concentration but undead still manage it, having a con score isn't required for a breath weapon, example Iron Golem.