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mregecko
2013-10-08, 01:28 PM
So, some friends and have had life happen and are separated by many timezones (and continents). We miss gaming, so we decided to come up with a challenge in the system we mostly use: Pathfinder.

The challenge was, using only the PRD and no campaign-specific books (like Inner Sea World Guide), make a 12th level character to fight in an arena match using only 1-level dips in whatever classes/PrC's you like and can qualify for.

I thought I'd share my crazy build, a Fetchling that focuses on stealth and whose kill condition is either unwillingly Shadow Walking opponents to the Plane of Shadow (hoping they have no way back), stealing their equipment (via Pilfering Hand), or pinging them to death from Stealth wands of magic missile.

I won't include ALL of the special abilities (there are a ton), but just the ones that are pertinent to my goals:

Here is Forsythe:

Forsythe
Female Fetchling Barbarian (Urban Barbarian) 1/Bard (Archaeologist) 1/Cleric 1/Eldritch Knight 1/Fighter 1/Monk (Martial Artist) 1/Ranger (Guide) 1/Rogue (Cutpurse) 1/Wizard 1/Oracle (Dual-Cursed) 1/Shadowdancer 1/Summoner (Synthesist) 1
N Medium Outsider (native)
Init +13; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision; Perception +26
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Defense
--------------------
AC 24, touch 22, flat-footed 14 (+9 Dex, +2 natural, +1 dodge)
hp 103 (1d12+3d10+7d8+1d6+36)
Fort +17, Ref +14, Will +17
Defensive Abilities shadow blending; Immune fatigue; Resist cold 5, electricity 5
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 50 ft.
Melee Bite (Bite) +7 (1d6+3/x2) and
Unarmed strike +7 (1d6+2/x2)
Special Attacks agile feet (5/day), cleric channel positive energy 1d6 (12/day) (dc 19, flurry of blows -1/-1, rage (7 rounds/day), ranger's focus +2 (1/day), sneak attack +1d6
Spell-Like Abilities
12/day—Summon Monster I (12/day)
2/day—shadow walk (DC 28)
1/day—disguise self
Bard (Archaeologist) Spells Known (CL 1):
1 (4/day) Vanish, Animate Rope
0 (at will) Haunted Fey Aspect, Know Direction, Daze (DC 19), Summon Instrument
Oracle (Dual-Cursed Oracle) Spells Known (CL 1):
1 (6/day) Obscuring Mist, Cure Light Wounds, Burning Disarm (DC 20)
0 (at will) Create Water, Bleed (DC 19), Read Magic, Detect Poison
Summoner (Synthesist) Spells Known (CL 1):
1 (4/day) Grease (DC 20), Rejuvenate Eidolon, Lesser
0 (at will) Acid Splash, Open/Close (DC 19), Detect Magic, Mage Hand
Cleric Spells Prepared (CL 1):
1 (2/day) Shield of Faith, Bane (DC 13), Protection from Evil
0 (at will) Create Water, Purify Food and Drink (DC 12), Scrivener's Chant
Ranger (Guide) Spells Prepared (CL 0):
Wizard Spells Prepared (CL 1):
1 (2/day) Silent Image (DC 16), Silent Image (DC 16), True Strike
0 (at will) Ray of Frost, Mage Hand, Prestidigitation (DC 13)
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 14, Dex 14, Con 17, Int 16, Wis 14, Cha 29
Base Atk +5; CMB +7; CMD 29 (can't be Tripped)
Feats Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Extra Evolution, Greater Spell Focus (Illusion), Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Mobility, Scribe Scroll, Shadow Ghost, Skill Focus (Stealth), Spell Focus (Illusion), Stunning Fist (3/day) (DC 18)
Traits Desperate Focus, Reactionary
Skills Acrobatics +12 (+20 jump), Bluff +15, Escape Artist +10, Intimidate +24, Perception +26, Perform (dance) +14, Sense Motive +4, Sleight of Hand +17, Spellcraft +14, Stealth +33, Survival +2 (+3 to track), Use Magic Device +24
Languages Abyssal, Aquan, Celestial, Common, Draconic
SQ +4 bonus on initiative checks, ac bonus +2, arcane bonds (arcane familiar, scorpion, greensting), archaeologist's luck +1 (13 rounds/day), aura, bardic knowledge, controlled rage, crowd control, domains (curse, travel), eidolon link, forewarned +1, fused eidolon, fused link, hide in plain sight, malign eye (5/day), mysteries (nature), opposition schools (enchantment, necromancy), oracle's curses (lame, tongues [abyssal]), prescience (6/day), revelations (nature's whispers), shadow blend, shadow form, share spells with eidolon, share spells with familiar, specialized schools (foresight), spontaneous casting, stunning fist (stun), track, unarmed strike (1d6), variant channeling (trickery variant channeling [±1 sacred]), wild empathy
Combat Gear Scroll of Deeper Darkness x2, Scroll of Faerie Fire x4, Scroll of Fly x2, Scroll of Forcecage, Scroll of Heal, Scroll of See Invisibility x2, Wand of Cure Light Wounds, Wand of darkness, Wand of magic missile (x2), Wand of Pilfering Hand;
Other Gear Belt of mighty constitution +4, Boots of speed (10 rounds/day), Candle of invocation (lawful good), Cloak of resistance +3, Elixir of darksight, Eyes of the Eagle, Handy haversack (empty), Headband of alluring charisma +6, Ring of chameleon power, 695 GP
--------------------
Special Abilities
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+4 bonus on initiative checks & you gain the Alertness feat while your familiar is within arm's reach.
AC Bonus +2 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
**Archaeologist's Luck +1 (13 rounds/day) (Ex) Gain Luck bonus to attack, damage, saves, and all skills.
Cleric Domain (Curse) Associated Domain: Luck
**Cleric Domain (Travel) Granted Powers: You are an explorer and find enlightenment in the simple joy of travel, be it by foot or conveyance or magic. Increase your base speed by 10 feet.
**Controlled Rage (Ex) May gain lesser bonus split as desired, but without normal drawbacks.
**Forewarned +1 (Su) Always act in surprise round. Initiative bonus. Init = 20 at level 20.
Fused Eidolon A synthesist summons the essence of a powerful outsider to meld with his own being. The synthesist wears the eidolon like translucent, living armor.
Greater Spell Focus (Illusion) +1 to the Save DC of spells from one school.
**Hide in Plain Sight (Su) You can use Stealth even while observed, as long as there is a shadow within 10'
**Immunity to Fatigue You are immune to the fatigued condition.
Lame One of your legs is permanently wounded, reducing your base land speed by 10 feet if your base speed is 30 feet or more. If your base speed is less than 30 feet, your speed is reduced by 5 feet. Your speed is never reduced due to encumbrance. At 5th level you are immune to fatigue
**Malign Eye (5/day) (Su) Target suffers -2 to saves vs. your spells until they hit you with an attack. Standard action.
**Measure the Mark (Ex) Learn target's Perception result before pick pocket. Bluff check to go undetected if back out.
**Prescience (6/day) (Su) Roll a d20 at the beginning of the round, and use that result as the result of any other d20 roll before the next turn.
**Rage (7 rounds/day) (Ex) +4 Str, +4 Con, +2 to Will saves, -2 to AC when enraged.
**Ranger's Focus +2 (1/day) (Ex) +2 to hit and damage focused target.
**Shadow Blend (Su) Outside of bright light, gain 20% concealment. With Shadow Form increase to 50%.
**Shadow Blending (Su) Miss chance in dim light increases to 50%. This does not grant total concealment.
**Shadow Form (Su) Constant 20% concealment, melee atks have ghost touch, half dam vs. corp foes.
**Trickery Variant Channeling (±1 Sacred) Bluff, Disguise, Sleight of Hand,Stealth bonus/Perception penalty

Items
Scroll of Deeper Darkness x2
Scroll of Faerie Fire x4
Scroll of Fly x2
Scroll of Forcecage x1
Scroll of Heal
Scroll of See Invisibility x2
Wand of Cure Light Wounds
Wand of Pilfering Hand
Wand of Magic Missile x2
Wand of Darkness

In combat, I have a +34 to stealth (including bard buff) along with HiPS. Shadow Form & Shadow Blend from my fused Eidolon give me permanent Total Concealment outside of bright light. If encountered with bright light, I have many means of creating darkness & deeper darkness.

Wand of Pilfering Hand is to sleight of hand steal my opponent's gear.

And I have a DC28 Will save vs my Shadow Walk racial SLA (which I have 2/day).

Very random character, but I had a lot of fun with it. What would you guys and gals make?

Daftendirekt
2013-10-08, 02:51 PM
Erm, how exactly are you taking Eldritch Knight at 4th level? You need 3rd level arcane casting. Your one level of bard gives you cantrips. Not even 1st level spells.

mregecko
2013-10-08, 02:54 PM
Erm, how exactly are you taking Eldritch Knight at 4th level? You need 3rd level arcane casting. Your one level of bard gives you cantrips. Not even 1st level spells.

Ahh, that is a little confusing, you're right. Hero Lab's statblock output doesn't put the levels in the order you take them.

I took Eldritch Knight at 10th level.

Pathfinder FAQ has ruled that SLAs can qualify you for feats and PrCs that require casting of a specific level. Since I have the Shadow Walk SLA (6th level), we ruled that qualified me for Eldritch Knight.

stack
2013-10-08, 02:55 PM
PF bards get 1st level spells at 1st level. No comment on the rest.

Daftendirekt
2013-10-08, 03:16 PM
PF bards get 1st level spells at 1st level. No comment on the rest.

Ah yes, they do, derp.


Ahh, that is a little confusing, you're right. Hero Lab's statblock output doesn't put the levels in the order you take them.

I took Eldritch Knight at 10th level.

Pathfinder FAQ has ruled that SLAs can qualify you for feats and PrCs that require casting of a specific level. Since I have the Shadow Walk SLA (6th level), we ruled that qualified me for Eldritch Knight.

Did not know that. Carry on.

Psyren
2013-10-08, 04:06 PM
Did not know that. Carry on.

Specifically the ruling (including rationale) is here. (http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9qow)

Kristinn
2013-10-08, 06:33 PM
Pathfinder FAQ has ruled that SLAs can qualify you for feats and PrCs that require casting of a specific level. Since I have the Shadow Walk SLA (6th level), we ruled that qualified me for Eldritch Knight.

By RAW you must be able to cast "3rd-level Arcane Spells", in plural. Even if being able to cast Shadow Walk as a Spell Like Ability counts as casting a spell, you can only cast one spell. (Although at lvl 13 you get another SLA that would qualify you both according to RAW and FAQ.)

The comment by the Piazo design team on the FAQ answer is rather funny though. "Given that prestige classes are usually a sub-optimal character choice (especially for spellcasters) [...]" Even though Wizards and Sorcerer actually get something on level-up in Pathfinder, if Prestige Classes are anyway near as powerful as in 3.5 that sentence is definitely not universal. Then again, Piazo thought Tripping was overpowered, while the poor Sorcerer only got spells on level-up, and we all know spells in general are underwhelming

mregecko
2013-10-08, 06:41 PM
By RAW you must be able to cast "3rd-level Arcane Spells", in plural. Even if being able to cast Shadow Walk as a Spell Like Ability counts as casting a spell, you can only cast one spell. (Although at lvl 13 you get another SLA that would qualify you both according to RAW and FAQ.)

The comment by the Piazo design team on the FAQ answer is rather funny though. "Given that prestige classes are usually a sub-optimal character choice (especially for spellcasters) [...]" Even though Wizards and Sorcerer actually get something on level-up in Pathfinder, if Prestige Classes are anyway near as powerful as in 3.5 that sentence is definitely not universal. Then again, Piazo thought Tripping was overpowered, while the poor Sorcerer only got spells on level-up, and we all know spells in general are underwhelming

Yeah, PrC's are honestly usually pretty underpowered in Pathfinder. Base classes have compounding "class level" dependent abilities in addition to capstones, such that the PrC's don't usually come out on top.

This can change for certain PrCs and certain builds.

And yes, we realized there was a syntactic ambiguity there. If it helps your conscience at all, I took a feat that gave me the SLA 2/day, so technically that is "spells" instead of a "a spell". But we basically all agreed it's OK. I honestly just took it for the BAB and high HD. It could just as easily been a variant Paladin, Crusader, etc.

Psyren
2013-10-08, 07:50 PM
By RAW you must be able to cast "3rd-level Arcane Spells", in plural. Even if being able to cast Shadow Walk as a Spell Like Ability counts as casting a spell, you can only cast one spell. (Although at lvl 13 you get another SLA that would qualify you both according to RAW and FAQ.)

You can cast "spells." Just cast the same one twice. And if it's 1/day, cast it once today and once tomorrow. There, you've cast two spells. It doesn't say anything about having to cast them all in one day.

grarrrg
2013-10-08, 09:23 PM
You may find this useful:
TA-DA! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=230500)

Moving right along...

1 level of any given class huh?
Excluding the "spell-like ability" tricks, that would make a caster (of any kind) fairly difficult...

Let's see what we can shove together!

The alignment, as you'll find out, must be Neutral Evil
Classes:
1) Wizard 1, INT based caster, gets Scribe Scroll as a bonus feat.
*1st level spells
2) Rogue OR Vivisectionist Alchemist, for 1d6 Sneak Attack
3) ?
4) ?
5) ?
6) Cyphermage (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/c-d/cyphermage), +1 Caster
7) Diabolist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/c-d/diabolist), +1 Caster, 'early' entry through use of UMDing the required spell (must be Lawful Evil, or within 1-step of)
*2nd level spells
8) Sleepless Detective (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/s-z/sleepless-detective), fairly easy reqs, nets another 1d6 Sneak Attack
9) Arcane Trickster (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/arcane-trickster) +1 Caster, required 2d6 Sneak to enter (Trickster cannot be Lawful, combined with Diabolist, this leaves Neutral Evil,)
10) Veiled Illusionist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/s-z/veiled-illusionist), +1 Caster, requires Spell Focus (Illusion)
*3rd level spells
11 & 12) at this point we can easily qualify for any of the following: Bloatmage (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/a-b/bloatmage), Genie Binder (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/e-h/genie-binder) (12th level only) Harrower (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/e-h/harrower), and/or Loremaster (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/loremaster)
* Caster level 7, with 4th level spells

Required Feats:
Scribe Scroll, freebie from Wizard
Cypher Magic, anytime before level 6
Spell Focus (Illusion), anytime before level 10
[various], whatever is required by your last 2 classes.

Depending on what our 3 'mystery' classes are, our Bab could be as high as 3!
If using Fractional Bab, anywhere between 5 and 8 Bab. We have at least 2 classes with 3/4, and 7 with 1/2, so the final Bab would be 5+[3 mystery classes).
Will Save should be quite nice though. Can't say the same for the others.

Wizard was chosen for being INT based (easier skill pre-reqs), and for having Scribe Scroll as a bonus feat. Witch would work perfectly fine as well. Sorcerers need not apply, as they wouldn't be able to reach 2nd level spells in time.

In place of Sleepless Detective we could have used Master Spy, or Inner Sea Pirate.
Master Spy has steeper Skill/Feat requirements, and less INT synergy.
Inner Sea Pirate has easier reqs, but no really synergy.

I'm sure it's possible to do something similar with Divine spells, but I'll leave that for someone else.

StreamOfTheSky
2013-10-08, 09:28 PM
I don't feel like making my own build, so I'll just give advice on yours, OP.

Archaeologist: Takes Fate's Favored trait. Just do it.

Monk: Unless it's for alignment reasons (you know you can become an ex-monk and keep all class features, right?), I'd dip Master of Many Styles for a nice 2nd or 3rd in the chain style feat, rather than Martial Artist.

Rogue: I'd go with Thug or Rake.

Wizard 1: Cha is your best stat... Drop it for Crossblooded Sorcerer.

Oracle: I don't see Misfortune revelation. That is the only reason to even BE dual-cursed.

Saidoro
2013-10-08, 10:39 PM
Fetchling shadow walk is self-only, you can't use it as a win condition.

Specifically the ruling (including rationale) is here. (http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9qow)

So by that ruling a dreamspeaker elf with absolute loyalty would qualify as being able to cast 5th level arcane and divine spells at level 1. I feel certain there must be some way to abuse that, I just can't think of what it might be. On the plus side, it would arguably allow anyone with SLAs to take crafting feats. So long, master craftsman, no one loved you.

@Grarrrg
If you use a race with access to divine only SLAs you can throw in a level each of cleric and mystic theurge.

Psyren
2013-10-08, 10:45 PM
So by that ruling a dreamspeaker elf with absolute loyalty would qualify as being able to cast 5th level arcane and divine spells at level 1.

I feel certain there must be some way to abuse that, I just can't think of what it might be.

PrCs still have skill rank requirements, and they are indeed much weaker in PF anyway.



On the plus side, it would arguably allow anyone with SLAs to take crafting feats. So long, master craftsman, no one loved you.

Er, that was the case even in 3.5; having SLAs gave you a caster level.

grarrrg
2013-10-08, 10:47 PM
@Grarrrg
If you use a race with access to divine only SLAs you can throw in a level each of cleric and mystic theurge.

*hem*

Excluding the "spell-like ability" tricks
NOT using one of those races was kind of the point.

Saidoro
2013-10-08, 11:05 PM
PrCs still have skill rank requirements, and they are indeed much weaker in PF anyway.

Start with Level 1 Human Arcane Bloodline Sorcerer.
Add Absolute Loyalty Trait.
Apply human favored Class Bonus. Note that the bonus does not specify that the level is based on the highest sorcerer spell you can cast. Add Summon Accuser (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/summon-accuser) to your spells known.
Select an arcane bond item This allows you to cast one spell you know once per day.
???
Profit.

Psyren
2013-10-08, 11:30 PM
Select an arcane bond item This allows you to cast one spell you know once per day.

One spell you know and are able to cast. You can't cast 4th-level spells at level 1 even if you know them.

Saidoro
2013-10-09, 12:17 AM
One spell you know and are able to cast. You can't cast 4th-level spells at level 1 even if you know them.
Alright, so that step of that specific implementation doesn't work, the other steps still do, and making the human favored class bonuses even better is reason enough to call that a poor ruling. Also, having to reread the wizard class reminded me of something. Specialist wizards gain a bonus spell slot of each level they can cast :smallbiggrin:.

Psyren
2013-10-09, 12:22 AM
Alright, so that step of that specific implementation doesn't work, the other steps still do, and making the human favored class bonuses even better is reason enough to call that a poor ruling.

So you can learn a bunch of extra 4th or lower spells that you can't cast yet, whoopty-do.


Also, having to reread the wizard class reminded me of something. Specialist wizards gain a bonus spell slot of each level they can cast :smallbiggrin:.

What does that have to do with the ruling? They always got that.

Saidoro
2013-10-09, 08:22 AM
So you can learn a bunch of extra 4th or lower spells that you can't cast yet, whoopty-do.
It says up to. So while at 8th level or less the sorcerer has access to 1 additional first level spell and 1-2 additional spells of their highest spell level. At levels above 8 they have 1 additional 1st level spell and 2 additional 4th level spells. this is a noticeable power boost at all levels(though most significantly at low levels).

What does that have to do with the ruling? They always got that.
By treating SLAs as spells you can cast the wizard gains a spell slot at the level of each SLA they can cast if it's higher than their normal max. So now we've got 1st level characters casting 5th level spells which can be changed to any other spell from the same school once per day. Furthermore, since lower level spells can be prepared in higher level slots, they also gain a slot of each intervening level. Clerics can do the same with their domain spells.

Psyren
2013-10-09, 08:35 AM
By treating SLAs as spells you can cast the wizard gains a spell slot at the level of each SLA they can cast if it's higher than their normal max. So now we've got 1st level characters casting 5th level spells which can be changed to any other spell from the same school once per day.

No, a caster still has to be high enough level to cast those higher spells. Merely having the slots isn't enough. PRD:


In addition to having a high ability score, a spellcaster must be of a high enough class level to be able to cast spells of a given spell level.

So you do get a bonus 5th-level slot, but because you aren't high enough to cast 5th-level spells, you can't do anything with it until ECL 9.

Saidoro
2013-10-09, 10:16 AM
Huh, took me a while to find the source on that but it was totally worth it (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/basics-ability-scores/ability-scores#TOC-Abilities-and-Spellcasters). Not only is it specific to the bonus spells granted from a high ability score and therefore entirely inapplicable to the bonus spells granted by being a specialist wizard, but since the character in question is already casting 5th level spells with a caster level of 1 clearly a single class level is enough to get those 5th level spell slots from a high ability score. And even if you found a more general prohibition, that wouldn't stop the filling of those slots with metamagiced versions of weaker spells, which are explicitly the same level as the original rather than the slot.

Psyren
2013-10-09, 10:47 AM
Not only is it specific to the bonus spells granted from a high ability score and therefore entirely inapplicable

Wrong, it's a general rule. It says nothing about being limited to bonus spells - "to cast spells of a given spell level," not "to cast bonus spells of a given spell level." It's in the "abilities and spellcasters section" because that contains the other general rule about needing a minimum ability score, which also applies to all spells. Both of those rules apply to all spellcasters, whether they get bonus spells or not.



And even if you found a more general prohibition, that wouldn't stop the filling of those slots with metamagiced versions of weaker spells, which are explicitly the same level as the original rather than the slot.

Now this reading might actually fly, so long as you don't try and Heighten the spell.

Saidoro
2013-10-09, 11:30 AM
Wrong, it's a general rule. It says nothing about being limited to bonus spells - "to cast spells of a given spell level," not "to cast bonus spells of a given spell level." It's in the "abilities and spellcasters section" because that contains the other general rule about needing a minimum ability score, which also applies to all spells. Both of those rules apply to all spellcasters, whether they get bonus spells or not.

There are two possible readings of that sentence that I can see. The first is that it applies to when you get your bonus spells from a high modifier in which case you are free to cast higher level spells, you just don't get the extra slots to do so. This is the interpretation I am assuming and it is further supported by This FAQ (http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9o91). The second is the one you are suggesting where it does not apply to when you get your bonus spells and is instead a limitation on what level of spell you can cast. By that interpretation you get all the bonus slots due to your ability modifier at first level and can immediately fill them with lower level spells with metamagic applied. You will not be able to cast higher level spells with them, though. So feel free to choose your abuse, I can build something broken either way.
And just ignoring the "you can already cast 5ths at 1 so it must be high enough" thing, huh? :smalltongue:

Assuming the first reading is valid, here's a potential caster build for the OP:
Wizard 1/Cleric 1/Fighter 1/Eldritch Knight 1/Mystic Theurge 1/Bloodmage Initiate 1/Harrower 1/Cyphermage 1/Veiled Illusionist 1/Diabolist 1/Hell Knight Enforcer 1/Genie Binder 1
Feats:
1:Bloodmage
Human:Spell Focus(Illusion)
Wizard:Scribe Scroll
Fighter:Arcane Armor Training
3:Harrowed
5:Cypher Magic
7:Craft Wondrous Items
9:Persuasive
11:Spell Focus(Conjuration)
Traits:
Magical Knack(Wizard)
Absolute Loyalty

It casts as a 10th level wizard (with a CL of 12) and a 2nd level cleric, has a BAB of +2, Fort +5, Ref +0, Will +12 and 2d10+2d8+8d6 Hit Dice. It also has a whole mess of special abilities that are largely useless.

Psyren
2013-10-09, 11:37 AM
There are two possible readings of that sentence that I can see. The first is that it applies to when you get your bonus spells from a high modifier in which case you are free to cast higher level spells, you just don't get the extra slots to do so. This is the interpretation I am assuming and it is further supported by This FAQ (http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9o91).

That FAQ directly contradicts what you're trying to do here. It even quoted the same line I did. Did you even read it? :smallconfused:

Saidoro
2013-10-09, 11:44 AM
That FAQ directly contradicts what you're trying to do here. It even quoted the same line I did. Did you even read it? :smallconfused:
What I'm trying to do doesn't require bonus spells from a high ability score. Which is what the FAQ is talking about.