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View Full Version : Are there any games/geners you don't allow in your house?



Mr. Moon
2006-12-31, 05:11 PM
As a major pacifist, I have always refused to let my brother buy any games that focus on war-time killing, especialy those based on real wars, such as Meadle(sp?) of Honour, or Halo. I also don't let anything rated anything above T into my house.

I was thinking about this last night, and the thought struck me: "Maybe there are those who are strongly against other types of games who want their message to be heard." Or maybe you just don't like them. Either way.

Feel free to vote for whatever you feel - It's multichoice for a reson!

The Orange Zergling
2006-12-31, 05:58 PM
Well, generally I'm not aloud to play anything 'M' or higher, due to my age, but my parents have made a few exceptions... *coughDawnofWarcoughLegacyofKain*

...as long as its just for blood/gore, and its not based on real killing (like Grand Theft Auto, that one Columnbine Shooting game, etc...), I think 'M' games are generally playable for me... I still need to ask my parents to look into games that are above 'T', and if they decide that I can handle it, and wont turn into a Khorne worshipping psychopathic serial killer because of it, I'll be able to play it.

My two long-winded cents.

Crazy Owl
2006-12-31, 07:43 PM
The only rule I have is no games that are based on a film. Those things are too evil to be allowed to touch my 360.

McDeath
2006-12-31, 08:07 PM
My parents know that I am mature enough to pick my own games, and so I do. I choose for quality, and I never pick horror (because I don't enjoy being scared).

Shadow of the Sun
2006-12-31, 08:12 PM
Halo is based on a real war?

I will generally play whatever doesn't bore me. I vowed to never play a MMORPG again- after getting WoW I didn't sleep for three days, so I stopped playing them.

Om
2006-12-31, 09:51 PM
My house is a strictly PC zone. Which limits all allowed games to the good ones.


Halo is based on a real war?
Don't you know that every game ever made is based on WWII? :smallwink:

chrek
2007-01-01, 01:42 AM
...as long as its just for blood/gore, and its not based on real killing (like Grand Theft Auto, that one Columnbine Shooting game, etc...)


I would like to state something real quick for the record "That one Columbine shooting game" was Doom. That was the game the Columbine murders used to "Train" and ANYONE that thinks that playing Doom is anything like actually shooting should re-assert themselves with a little thing I like to call the "real world".

Sorry, that was a tangent, at the time of the shooting, my friends and I were exactly that group in our high school (we all wore black leather coats, played video games all day in our computer classes, and we picked on quite a bit). The number of side ways glances I received after Columbine makes me always want to shake people that think that Video games had ANYTHING AT ALL do with that tragedy.

As far as games that aren't allowed in my house: The sims games, any version. This is mostly because I'm so annoyed that it was the top selling game for like 6 years, and isn't even what I consider to be a "real video game"

Grim Greyscale
2007-01-01, 01:47 AM
The only rule I have is no games that are based on a film. Those things are too evil to be allowed to touch my 360.

Seconded. Except I don't have a 360, but licensed movie titles for ANY console should be shot. And then set on fire. And lots more horrible, horrible things.

The Orange Zergling
2007-01-01, 01:49 AM
*snip*

I was actually talking about modern day violence with aquire-able weapons that do exist. Knives in a non-modern setting don't count.

I wasnt blaming the shooting on video games, just listing a game based on a real school-shooting (I personally think the very idea is just sickening...) as being prohibitted. I was not talking about Doom.

Artanis
2007-01-01, 02:09 AM
I don't allow games that use graphics to make up for being an otherwise bad game. Don't get me wrong, good graphics are nice...but a steaming pile of s*** is a steaming pile of s***, regardless of how many polygons are onscreen. Giving a single cent to anybody who puts graphics before gameplay is, to my mind, totally unacceptable.

Logic
2007-01-01, 02:31 AM
...as long as its just for blood/gore, and its not based on real killing (like Grand Theft Auto, that one Columnbine Shooting game, etc...)
You are probably thinking of "Bully" which is simply set in a school where some bad things happen. As far as I know, there are no guns, and you don't go on a rampage killing classmates with improvised weapons either. The game has gotton a bad rap simply because it was made by the same people that make games that push the limit. Jack Thompson needs to get a real job, and stop blaming the problems of society's youth on video games. Video games are the new DnD. Or Death Metal. Or Rap Music. Or Rock n' Roll. All of the above have been blamed for the "downfall" of society, since parents don't want to own up and take the blame for not raising their children to be decent human beings.

Back to your comment:
You could actually mean the game "Columbine", which was a freeware that someone with a sick sense of humor made shortly after the shootings, that had you as one of the mentally disturbed individuals shooting his classmates.

The Orange Zergling
2007-01-01, 02:33 AM
You could actually mean the game "Columbine", which was a freeware that someone with a sick sense of humor made shortly after the shootings, that had you as one of the mentally disturbed individuals shooting his classmates.

That is indeed the game I am referring to.

Logic
2007-01-01, 02:39 AM
I allow any game into my home, however, if I don't like it, it will not be allowed to play on any of my gaming machines ever again.

I do not play my more mature games around children, with few exceptions. I do not let anyone that I do not consider a competent adult play my games with mature content. Alot of my games fall into this area, so even my 15 year old sister is not permitted to play most of what I own.

Holy_Knight
2007-01-01, 03:10 AM
My house is a strictly PC zone. Which limits all allowed games to the good ones.
Any list of "all the good games" which doesn't include Chrono Trigger is laughable. (There's other examples too, but that one is by far the most egregious.)

Kjata
2007-01-01, 03:59 AM
3 things.

1. If a game is fun, i will buy and play said game.
2. This is the most moral forum ive ever been on. You dont let your 15 yo sister play your mature games? Im 14 and Im only typing this out now cause my friends are passed out drunk. Seriously, ****ing 15?!
3. The whole blaming d&d thing is utterly gay, i wont lie. That is the reason i dont play(my mom didnt allow it, and now i am only a geek with my absolute best friend, and you need more than 2 people to play d&d.

Thexare Blademoon
2007-01-01, 05:33 AM
Well, since I'm not on my own yet (still living with parents), I can't really answer this one as it is now.

I would not ban games from my home, but if I had kids, I'd have some restrictions on what they could play/watch. I'm not gonna punish myself though; I'll play Halo or Doom if I want when they're not around. :smalltongue: However, I can't be more specific than "some reasonable restrictions", since it varies by the person in question. I, for example, was playing Doom when I was 11, because I was mature enough to know that a game is not the same as real life. Some (probably most) kids would need a few more years, though.

Seriously, though, some parents are just getting retardedly paranoid about games. Give your kids a little credit, they're not as easy to turn into psychopaths as politicians and the media would have you believe. I'll fully admit that some of them aren't mature enough for more violent games, but part of the blame for that, IMO, lies with the parents for constantly trying to "protect" their kids from- oh, crap, getting off topic, sorry, I'll stop.

Closet_Skeleton
2007-01-01, 06:14 AM
I don't even WANT to think how young I was when I was playing Doom...

Anything seems to be allowed in my house since there's no one younger than me.

I don't even have that much against games that aren't any good.

Nevrmore
2007-01-01, 06:30 AM
Your list is pretty biased. For instance, that poll makes it seem like you automatically assume that everyone here has absolutely no problem playing games that are rated E or lower. Maybe people don't like those games because they are too kiddy.

The Evil Thing
2007-01-01, 06:59 AM
My house is a strictly PC zone. Which limits all allowed games to the good ones.
Quoted for truth. (Except for crappy console ports that should never have seen the light of day).


You could actually mean the game "Columbine", which was a freeware that someone with a sick sense of humor made shortly after the shootings, that had you as one of the mentally disturbed individuals shooting his classmates.It wasn't intended to poke fun at the incident but at the rampant blaming competition that seemed to take place among all those hysterical right-wing hacks and Christo-fascist nutcases. (EDIT: Or am I thinking of the other freeware game?)


Some (probably most) kids would need a few more years, though.Come on, what's the latest age you ever heard a kid ask if an animated TV show (like say, Tom and Jerry) was 'real'? They can tell it's not real because it doesn't look like the real world. I played Elite when I was about six. I didn't think for a moment that it was real (and not because the physics were all wrong). Give children some credit; they may be dumb but they're not stupid.


Your list is pretty biased. For instance, that poll makes it seem like you automatically assume that everyone here has absolutely no problem playing games that are rated E or lower. Maybe people don't like those games because they are too kiddy.Most management sims are E. They're a far cry from kiddy, they just don't have any violence etc.

Shadow of the Sun
2007-01-01, 07:12 AM
I do not play many games, but my folks do not really mind what I play if I do. Video games are not going to turn me into a psychopath- I do not even like hurting ants, for crying out loud. O'course, when I am angry it is a whole different story (I have trouble remembering, but I am fairly sure that last time someone tackled me to the ground I got so angry I nearly beat him with a sock full of rocks. I cooled down before I did, luckily).

Tengu
2007-01-01, 09:54 AM
There is a category missing - sports games. I just do not like them, they bore me more than brainless first person shooters (though there are some good FPS... if only I could remember one).


Any list of "all the good games" which doesn't include Chrono Trigger is laughable. (There's other examples too, but that one is by far the most egregious.)

Seconded. You do not know what a good RPG is if you haven't played this game (same for FF6&7, Planescape Torment and Fallout 2).

Tom_Violence
2007-01-01, 10:54 AM
I'm not a racist! All geners are allowed in my house! :tongue:

All games are as well, because I disagree with any limiting of access to adults on such things. People are allowed to make their own decisions, and I'll be damned if I'm gonna stop them.

Beleriphon
2007-01-01, 11:04 AM
Given my age, and that I live alone (cast do not count) I play everything. My favourites for consoles are shooters and action games, although anything generally goes. Computers are all about the RTS and RPG games.

Nevrmore
2007-01-01, 11:36 AM
It wasn't intended to poke fun at the incident but at the rampant blaming competition that seemed to take place among all those hysterical right-wing hacks and Christo-fascist nutcases. (EDIT: Or am I thinking of the other freeware game?)
There's only one Columbine game I can think of, and it was a freeware game that was made I think sometime last year, which is probably the one you're talking about. 2005 doesn't really ring "shortly after the attacks" to me...

Jarl
2007-01-01, 12:24 PM
Seconded. Except I don't have a 360, but licensed movie titles for ANY console should be shot. And then set on fire. And lots more horrible, horrible things.

o rly? (http://www.gamespot.com/n64/action/goldeneye007/index.html)

I don't play many RTSes (I'm bad at them) and horror games scare me a bit, but I really don't disallow games at all.

-And, for the record, GTA:SA is one of the best games I've played in recent memory.

Jibar
2007-01-01, 12:40 PM
War Games I hate with a fiery fiery passion.
There screw with so many details, they make it all so unrealistic.
Yes, quit telling me about how you'v gone back and rifled through history, one man would not have killed so many enemy soldiers without being killed himself!

Ms_Elaneous
2007-01-01, 12:57 PM
I just don't like war games. I don't find the idea fun at all. I do a little bit of shooter games, like "Dirge of Cerberus," but generally I'm an RPGer through and through. I do not play games with a whole bunch of bouncing girls that frankly creep me out, like that volleyball game they came out with. I also might dabble with M rated games, content pending, but not anything higher than that because I find it immoral (no offense, just for me) for myself to play games with loads of explicit sex and/or torture and/or hurting little kids and/or things like that. Also, in my opinion, games without a decent storyline should be shot and buried in a hole in the backyard and never spoken of again. There we go! Giant paragraph, away!

Logic
2007-01-01, 01:50 PM
2. This is the most moral forum ive ever been on. You dont let your 15 yo sister play your mature games? Im 14 and Im only typing this out now cause my friends are passed out drunk. Seriously, ****ing 15?!
3. The whole blaming d&d thing is utterly gay, i wont lie. That is the reason i dont play(my mom didnt allow it, and now i am only a geek with my absolute best friend, and you need more than 2 people to play d&d.
There are a few exceptions to my rule.
I would allow my sister to play Halo, but she doesn't like shooters.
She tried to play my Grand Theft Auto Games, and I would not allow it, since she does tend to repeat stuff she really shouldn't.

I said my piece about blaming D&D.

The Evil Thing
2007-01-01, 01:52 PM
There's only one Columbine game I can think of, and it was a freeware game that was made I think sometime last year, which is probably the one you're talking about. 2005 doesn't really ring "shortly after the attacks" to me...
2005? I have a feeling that's the one.


War Games I hate with a fiery fiery passion.
There screw with so many details, they make it all so unrealistic.
Yes, quit telling me about how you'v gone back and rifled through history, one man would not have killed so many enemy soldiers without being killed himself!
Where there's a war game, there's a realism mod. Or two. Or more.

Tom_Violence
2007-01-01, 02:03 PM
The only games that I don't even bother looking at anymore are WW2 games. No matter the genre, they just bore me. The subject matter has been done to death, so if I see a WW2 shooter, for example, all I see is 'Random Generic First Person Game With Guns'. Use your imaginations people! Give me something with a bit of life to it, for heaven's sake!

Edit: Also, this poll doesn't have a 'I allow all games/genres' option.

Logic
2007-01-01, 02:08 PM
Also, this poll doesn't have a 'I allow all games/genres' option.
The "not voting" part is almost the same.

Roderick_BR
2007-01-01, 02:11 PM
I mostly don't play horror/terror histories simply because I don't like them. Dunno, that's not the kind of emotion I enjoy playing. I like to cause terror to my enemies XD

Saithis Bladewing
2007-01-01, 02:13 PM
Any list of "all the good games" which doesn't include Chrono Trigger is laughable.

QFT.


As for me, I don't allow any games in which the characters have individual breasts larger than their brains unless said character is very, very overweight (as it then looks somewhat natural and is mostly just stylisation, but that's very rare).

The reasons are more or less the same as not letting a real person with said qualifications into my house.

They scare me. :smallconfused:

The Evil Thing
2007-01-01, 02:14 PM
As for me, I don't allow any games in which the characters have individual breasts larger than their brains
Could they exist? The brain is pretty darn big.


Also, I'd be a little worried if someone voted RPG

Tom_Violence
2007-01-01, 02:40 PM
The "not voting" part is almost the same.

Hmm, not really. The poll makes it look like everyone excludes some type of game or another, as anyone else who might have a very valid opinion on the matter is excluded from it.

Saithis Bladewing
2007-01-01, 03:05 PM
Could they exist? The brain is pretty darn big.


Also, I'd be a little worried if someone voted RPG

Have you seen Dead or Alive Extreme Volleyball lately? It's not healthy.

Thexare Blademoon
2007-01-01, 03:15 PM
Come on, what's the latest age you ever heard a kid ask if an animated TV show (like say, Tom and Jerry) was 'real'? They can tell it's not real because it doesn't look like the real world. I played Elite when I was about six. I didn't think for a moment that it was real (and not because the physics were all wrong). Give children some credit; they may be dumb but they're not stupid.

Good job, you knew the difference between a Commodore 64 (or whichever other system/computer you played it on, point is it's an old game) game and real life. Just like anyone else with at least one functioning eye.

Now compare something a bit more recent with TV shows. Suddenly it's not so simple. I'll agree that past about 13 or 14, a normal kid should be mostly fine, and for some they'll be alright sooner, but up to that point it's not quite so easy to be sure. Some kids are, to put it kindly, slow to catch on, and as much as I'd love to blame the parents, it's not always their fault.

Shadow of the Sun
2007-01-01, 04:33 PM
Yeah, DOA: Extreme Volleyball is very, very frightening. It is as if the boobs in that game are forging their own laws of physics so as not to A) Make the women fall over and B) Be ripped off due to gravity.

Dragor
2007-01-01, 04:56 PM
I generally don't play games that are trying so hard to be adult, it's scary, as if to say "Hey, Kids, I'm Adult, I must be good!".

The first game I played on was Sid Meirs' Alpha Centauri. I didn't start to become obcessed with Planet Buster Nukes and snide, evil backstabbings.

I say: let your kids play any game they like, as long as it doesn't involve mindless massacre. There has to be a point (generally a good point) to killing those people. Like, "Why am I killing these people." Answer: "To save the human race from tearing itself apart/Save the princess" etc etc etc.

Man, I sounded like HK27 from KOTOR.

Meatbag.

Cybren
2007-01-01, 04:56 PM
I don't allow adventure games in my house. Kings Quest? Monkey Island? Leisure Suit Larry? these lewd, morally depraved games are ruining our children.

Archonic Energy
2007-01-01, 05:57 PM
i'm not alowed to play bad games.

otherwise i'm up for anything.

being 26 you get to pick your own games!

yay for "old" gamers

Mr. Moon
2007-01-01, 07:59 PM
Seconded. Except I don't have a 360, but licensed movie titles for ANY console should be shot. And then set on fire. And lots more horrible, horrible things.

I dunno. I kinda wanna play that Eragon game. My brother would probably kill me, though...


Also, in my opinion, games without a decent storyline should be shot and buried in a hole in the backyard and never spoken of again.

Quoted for truth.


Good job, you knew the difference between a Commodore 64 (or whichever other system/computer you played it on, point is it's an old game) game and real life. Just like anyone else with at least one functioning eye.

Now compare something a bit more recent with TV shows. Suddenly it's not so simple. I'll agree that past about 13 or 14, a normal kid should be mostly fine, and for some they'll be alright sooner, but up to that point it's not quite so easy to be sure. Some kids are, to put it kindly, slow to catch on, and as much as I'd love to blame the parents, it's not always their fault.

Very true. Because of a lot of the newer movies (Matrix, among others), I've heard of kids who think it is actualy possible to shot a car and make it explode, all the while fighting off a swarm of enemies with a katana.

Personaly, I don't care what kind of game I play, as long as it has a plot, and is orriganal. For example, my current favourite games are the "Champions" serries. (Champions of Norath: Realms of Everquest, and Champions: Return to Arms) may have slightly oversized, over bouncy chest area, but I find that with the right armor, even the most... female character has decency. And besides, I love the plot line. It has twists, turns, and characters that are beleivable. Well, sort of. If you ignore the jiggiling flesh on her chest. (Although it's rather annoying that my brother can't stop staring at my Eurodite Wizard... :smalleek:)

I do not allow any games based on wars, especialy if it has very real graphics. I don't know why they make them: All those high-detail masacars give me is nightmares. I also do not play anygames rated higher then "T". I'm not 17, so I can't, and won't, play games rated "M". Besides, my catchphrase is: "They rate the games for a reson, you know." My ten-year-old cousin won't play anything without guns because he's already been brainwashed by games like Meadle of Honor.

Now don't get me wrong. I'm not a gun-game hater. I'm fine with most third-person games. It's not uncommen to see me playing games like Ratchet: Deadlocked, which I like mostly because it's so funny.

Desidus
2007-01-01, 09:36 PM
War Games I hate with a fiery fiery passion.
There screw with so many details, they make it all so unrealistic.
Yes, quit telling me about how you'v gone back and rifled through history, one man would not have killed so many enemy soldiers without being killed himself!


Hate to go tangent but...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Daly
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitchell_Paige

I could give more, but you get the point.


That being said, I don't allow any games in my home which offend me. That is, crap games. Should one somehow make it into my world, I instantly box it. The box of shame, sadly, has become larger :(. Otherwise, the more the merrier.

Saithis Bladewing
2007-01-02, 12:24 AM
Hate to go tangent but...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Daly
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitchell_Paige

I could give more, but you get the point.

I really prefer Simo Häyhä (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4).

Caewil
2007-01-02, 06:00 AM
Horror/Thriller. They seriously creep me out.

Soniku
2007-01-02, 10:48 AM
I let any games into my house, and will play most of them. Sure, I may hate raceing games with a passion, but if I didn't keep my open gameing mind I would never have played F-zero.

Of course, this doesn't mean I'm going to play barbies magical pony or whatever... my little cousan scares me :smalleek:

Jack Squat
2007-01-02, 11:44 AM
My parents don't really care what I play, they trust me enough to let me pick my own games.

The only games I will end up banning are those "educational" games they're making now. Sure, I used to play the Jump Start series when I was younger, but I honestly don't know if it helped or not. Even if it did, the mechanics of the games they're selling now are different, they're not fun unless you don't know any other games; at least with Jump Start I still enjoyed it even with me having a Super Nintendo.

Nevrmore
2007-01-02, 11:47 AM
I really prefer Simo Häyhä (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4).
Also, Carlos Hathcock. He only has 93 confirmed kills but he really killed hundreds and hundreds of people. I think the bounty on his head was 50,000 when most every other sniper's bounty was only 100 or so.

Desidus
2007-01-02, 05:01 PM
I really prefer Simo Häyhä (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4).

I <3 Finland and Simo Häyhä. The fact I didn't list him is only more testimony to my needing to train less and enjoy life more.

That reminds me. There need to be more games (well, a game) based on the Soviet-Finnish wars (including the continuance war... aka WWII). There was a BF1942 mod, but that was just Finnish Defense Force, not an earlier era mod...

And I'm rambling now. G'day.

Lord Magtok
2007-01-02, 05:51 PM
The one game that I will never ever allow in my home is Mafia.

Not The Godfather (Great game by the way), the game called Mafia.

I have never encountered a game with a longer load time, worse car controls, or a worse story. I rented it once, and swear I will never touch it again.

Dr._Weird
2007-01-03, 02:19 AM
War Games I hate with a fiery fiery passion.
There screw with so many details, they make it all so unrealistic.
Yes, quit telling me about how you'v gone back and rifled through history, one man would not have killed so many enemy soldiers without being killed himself!


WWII games are meant to be games. As in, meant to be fun. They are based on WWII, not a simulation of it. Because, you know, that wouldn't be any fun.


That said, I have yet to experience this repitition in WWII shooters, having only one. (Call of Duty 2)

Timberwolf
2007-01-03, 08:54 AM
I'm pretty easy about games but I've felt really uneasy about playing a few of them. Syndicate a few years ago (I think I was 12 at the time) I got rid of it because of that. Generally, unless it's content I think is offensive (and I can't think of much that I find offensive that's been made into a game) I'll probably allow it. Stuff like the Punisher, that I believe has a torture simulation aspect (although that could just be the press banging the anti video game drum again, I've not actually played it) is one example.

The only other games that I'd ban are ones that are rubbish. As has been mentioned before, any game based on a film. Also, GTA, because after your 5th rampage, it's not much fun.

The Evil Thing
2007-01-03, 10:45 AM
Very true. Because of a lot of the newer movies (Matrix, among others), I've heard of kids who think it is actualy possible to shot a car and make it explode, all the while fighting off a swarm of enemies with a katana.Do you have a source for that? Regardless, I'm not talking about movies which depict actions as if they could have happened in real life. The Matrix wasn't rendered (well, ok, it was but not in real time so it looked very, very 'real') whereas games are. You can tell games are games just by looking at them. I have yet to see anything that can generate photorealistic graphics in real time. It's just not possible with the current technology.

Do you know any children who believed it was possible to build a spaceship with an open top, fly around space at faster-than-light speeds and skim the surface of a sun after watching Jimmy Neutron? (I think that was his name).

Marius
2007-01-03, 01:51 PM
I allow any kind of games as long as they are good enough for my, very high, standards.
And in fact I like them to be as real as possible when they should be. For example I hate that Battlefield 2 didn't have any blood, I mean you can shoot a little soldier with a tank and he just flies away. It made me remember the Carmaggeddon version that had green blood... At least they could put some kind of option with a password to choose the violence level.
Of course I'm not a kid (and when I was games weren't very real :p ) but I would allow a kid to play many games not rates for their age as long as I have the time to sit by his side and explain everything to him.
Kids are exposed to violence every day and worse violence than anything they could see on a videogame. I don't think that banning stuff will help them in any way.

By the way, I don't think that being pacifist has anything to do with liking war games or not. I hate war and any kind of REAL violence but I don't mind playing war games or watching movies about war or reading books about war. It's just fiction, not reality.

Duraska
2007-01-03, 04:10 PM
I don't allow games that use graphics to make up for being an otherwise bad game. Don't get me wrong, good graphics are nice...but a steaming pile of s*** is a steaming pile of s***, regardless of how many polygons are onscreen. Giving a single cent to anybody who puts graphics before gameplay is, to my mind, totally unacceptable.

Ah, I bet you love Oblivion then. :)

Dragor
2007-01-03, 04:16 PM
I let any games into my house, and will play most of them. Sure, I may hate raceing games with a passion, but if I didn't keep my open gameing mind I would never have played F-zero.

Of course, this doesn't mean I'm going to play barbies magical pony or whatever... my little cousan scares me :smalleek:

Ah, F-Zero. I wasted hours of my early childhood playing on the SNES. Well, I say wasted, but it was a lot of fun.

Dr._Weird
2007-01-03, 05:09 PM
Ah, I bet you love Oblivion then. :)

:smallconfused:? That game has tons of content and good gameplay to go along with the good graphics! Unless you were serious, that is.

Crazy Owl
2007-01-03, 06:07 PM
:smallconfused:? That game has tons of content and good gameplay to go along with the good graphics! Unless you were serious, that is.

Well they did put more effort into make it look nice than improving gameplay. I would still play Morrowind over Oblivion anytime.

Tom_Violence
2007-01-03, 07:29 PM
Do you have a source for that? Regardless, I'm not talking about movies which depict actions as if they could have happened in real life. The Matrix wasn't rendered (well, ok, it was but not in real time so it looked very, very 'real') whereas games are. You can tell games are games just by looking at them. I have yet to see anything that can generate photorealistic graphics in real time. It's just not possible with the current technology.

Do you know any children who believed it was possible to build a spaceship with an open top, fly around space at faster-than-light speeds and skim the surface of a sun after watching Jimmy Neutron? (I think that was his name).

Its not exactly applicable but this might tickle you some :biggrin: :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/beds/bucks/herts/4575291.stm

Sailacela
2007-01-03, 08:10 PM
The only games I don't allow in my home are those rated "A" for the simple fact that they aren't games as I define the term. That sort of garbage is simply another venue for pornography (and I don't mean a stray boob, I mean the hard core stuff). Not for me.

Artanis
2007-01-04, 01:19 PM
Ah, I bet you love Oblivion then. :)
I've actually never played it, believe it or not :smallfrown:

pestilenceawaits
2007-01-04, 01:39 PM
I figure as an adult that any game I wouldn't want to explain to my 2 year old or I wouldn't want him to play I probably shouldn't play myself. no adult games and mature games only if they are not overly violent/ sexual etc.

Duraska
2007-01-04, 02:28 PM
:smallconfused:? That game has tons of content and good gameplay to go along with the good graphics! Unless you were serious, that is.

I was being completely sarcastic. Oblivion was the final step in changing a once-great RPG series into a low-grade, overly-hyped, visualgasm, single-player version of a MMORPG.

They stripped out almost all of the skills (axe is now considered "blunt"??).

Removed all the unique characteristics of the different races.

Made Cyrodil a province that can be completely crossed from one side to another on foot in 2 in-game hours (less than 10 mins real-time), which completely messes up the scale of the Empire.

They removed or ignored most of the backstory and lore that made the series great, ending up with a lame mish-mash of Elder Scrolls meets Peter Jackson's LOTR.

Spent so much money getting Patrick Stewart to say 10 lines of dialogue that they had to have 4 other voice actors do the voices for every other person in the world.

And they had the audacity to sell additional "plug-ins" featuring stuff that was stripped out of the game just before release, so that they could sell it.


I can't even believe it's a sequel to Daggerfall, but it sold well thanks to the Xbox 360 version, so I'm sure there will be an even more dumbed-down (yet visually stunning) Elder Scrolls game in the future...

Cybren
2007-01-04, 03:11 PM
I was being completely sarcastic. Oblivion was the final step in changing a once-great RPG series into a low-grade, overly-hyped, visualgasm, single-player version of a MMORPG.

They stripped out almost all of the skills (axe is now considered "blunt"??).

Removed all the unique characteristics of the different races.

Made Cyrodil a province that can be completely crossed from one side to another on foot in 2 in-game hours (less than 10 mins real-time), which completely messes up the scale of the Empire.

They removed or ignored most of the backstory and lore that made the series great, ending up with a lame mish-mash of Elder Scrolls meets Peter Jackson's LOTR.

Spent so much money getting Patrick Stewart to say 10 lines of dialogue that they had to have 4 other voice actors do the voices for every other person in the world.

And they had the audacity to sell additional "plug-ins" featuring stuff that was stripped out of the game just before release, so that they could sell it.


I can't even believe it's a sequel to Daggerfall, but it sold well thanks to the Xbox 360 version, so I'm sure there will be an even more dumbed-down (yet visually stunning) Elder Scrolls game in the future...
It's a sequel to Morrowind, which is a sequel to daggerfall. While i regret the decrease in scale of size I like it better than its predecessors for being a more engaging game. IF only if had more than four guilds.

And not all axes are blunt. Some are blade!

The Evil Thing
2007-01-04, 03:54 PM
Its not exactly applicable but this might tickle you some :biggrin: :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/beds/bucks/herts/4575291.stm
That, ladies and gentlemen, is why we use rotoscoping. :smalltongue:

Alchemistmerlin
2007-01-04, 05:17 PM
The idea that kids become violent because of violent games is so far beyond stupid it's borderline on a mental handicap. If the kids can't tell the difference between fantasy and reality, it's the fault of the parents and the children should be taken away from them.

Duraska
2007-01-04, 07:59 PM
It's a sequel to Morrowind, which is a sequel to daggerfall. While i regret the decrease in scale of size I like it better than its predecessors for being a more engaging game. IF only if had more than four guilds.

And not all axes are blunt. Some are blade!

True enough.

Which axes were considered blades? I finished the mainquest and the fighter, mages, theives and arena quests and never found a non-"blunt" axe. Would have added some more pizzaz to my guy to have an axe-shaped sword. Oh well...

The Evil Thing
2007-01-05, 06:29 AM
Axes are considered blunt for the purpose of distinguishing them from blades. You can't fight with an axe in the same way you'd fight with a sword but the techniques for fighting with an axe are roughly similar to those fighting with a true blunt instrument like mace or morning star.

In terms of how Oblivion interprets this, the hitting animations for blade and blunt are a little different.

zeratul
2007-01-07, 03:27 PM
I don't allow adventure games in my house. Kings Quest? Monkey Island? Leisure Suit Larry? these lewd, morally depraved games are ruining our children.

I do not mean to offend you but this is idiotic. I can understand thinking leisure suit larry is imorale or lude but saying monkey island or kings quest is of that variety of andventure game is wrong. Monkey island and king quest are both OK for children, and very funny, and your ignorance frightens me.

zeratul
2007-01-07, 03:31 PM
The idea that kids become violent because of violent games is so far beyond stupid it's borderline on a mental handicap. If the kids can't tell the difference between fantasy and reality, it's the fault of the parents and the children should be taken away from them.

I'm inclined to agree with you but it's not that simple. Some children arent exposed to mutch and therefor cant tell weather the things happening are true. This can convince them that it's ok to imitate this stuff (Final fantasy and jack and daxter rock

Ego Slayer
2007-01-07, 10:56 PM
The only ones I don't like are like Call of Duty, or anything that even remotely resembles real world military or war.

Other FPS are fine though. Halo is great.

@Mood Called - What have you got against Halo? Just simply that you're holding a semiautomatic?

Mr. Moon
2007-01-08, 02:44 PM
Do you have a source for that? Regardless, I'm not talking about movies which depict actions as if they could have happened in real life. The Matrix wasn't rendered (well, ok, it was but not in real time so it looked very, very 'real') whereas games are. You can tell games are games just by looking at them. I have yet to see anything that can generate photorealistic graphics in real time. It's just not possible with the current technology.

Well, from what my brother tells me, it is, actualy. It's now possible to have animation so life-like you can't tell it's fake. The only reson they don't is that it would freak out the custamors.


The only ones I don't like are like Call of Duty, or anything that even remotely resembles real world military or war.

Other FPS are fine though. Halo is great.

@Mood Called - What have you got against Halo? Just simply that you're holding a semiautomatic?

Did I say that? I don't recall saying that. I have nothing against Halo. I've even played it. Once. Long ago. When I was six. At my babysitter's boyfreind's house.

Ego Slayer
2007-01-08, 02:53 PM
As a major pacifist, I have always refused to let my brother buy any games that focus on war-time killing, especialy those based on real wars, such as Meadle(sp?) of Honour, or Halo.

You said it in the OP...:smallconfused:

The Evil Thing
2007-01-08, 04:01 PM
I do not mean to offend you but this is idiotic. I can understand thinking leisure suit larry is imorale or lude but saying monkey island or kings quest is of that variety of andventure game is wrong. Monkey island and king quest are both OK for children, and very funny, and your ignorance frightens me.Ease up there, old chap. I get the impression he was being ironic. :smalltongue:


The only ones I don't like are like Call of Duty, or anything that even remotely resembles real world military or war.

Other FPS are fine though. Halo is great.Do you include RTS in that? Anyway, is there any particular reason for your dislike of real-war games as opposed to fake-war games?


Well, from what my brother tells me, it is, actualy. It's now possible to have animation so life-like you can't tell it's fake. I said that. That's not the point. You can't render photo-realistically in real time. That's why Pixar can generate their films (at admittedly high resolutions) only at 40 frames per day. Games need to render at 60-100 frames per second and it is unrealistic to expect a computer to solve this
http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/7/9/a/79afc7016dee9593d7adf88915acce97.png
60-100 times in a second.

In order to circumvent this, graphical designers have to 'cheat'. Why do you think game design companies pour millions and millions into engine design if not to facilitate better and shinier graphics ahead of technology?

Try telling me that a game that was able to generate perfect photo-realism on a 3 Ghz chip wouldn't fly off the shelves.

zeratul
2007-01-08, 04:05 PM
[QUOTE=The Evil Thing;1799551]Ease up there, old chap. I get the impression he was being ironic. :smalltongue:

yeah sry bout that i came on a bit strong

Truwar
2007-01-08, 05:31 PM
Now compare something a bit more recent with TV shows. Suddenly it's not so simple. I'll agree that past about 13 or 14, a normal kid should be mostly fine, and for some they'll be alright sooner, but up to that point it's not quite so easy to be sure. Some kids are, to put it kindly, slow to catch on, and as much as I'd love to blame the parents, it's not always their fault.

Actually it IS the parents fault. It is the duty of the parent to control what their children view. Although the most in depth studies show that children are able to quite easily distinguish “cartoon violence” from “real violence” it is still up to the parent to shield young children from adult content.

As far as pacifism goes, it is a WONDERFUL ideology… as long as you have someone that is NOT a pacifist ready to kill to protect you.

Thexare Blademoon
2007-01-08, 08:19 PM
Actually it IS the parents fault. It is the duty of the parent to control what their children view. Although the most in depth studies show that children are able to quite easily distinguish “cartoon violence” from “real violence” it is still up to the parent to shield young children from adult content.
Uh...

Hold a sec.

Did you read my post? I don't think so, becuase if you did, you'd know that the "it's not always their fault" part was referring to some kids not fully understanding that what's seen on TV isn't always allowed in real life, simply due to being naturally 'slow'.

zeratul
2007-01-08, 08:23 PM
I agree alot of the time its the parrents fault but not always, there are special circumstances.

Ego Slayer
2007-01-08, 09:32 PM
Anyway, is there any particular reason for your dislike of real-war games as opposed to fake-war games?
I don't recall the name of the game which my brother has been playing a demo for but... You're dressed in what looks like equipment from WW2, and you are somewhere in the Middle East. There is a real Middle Eastern country's flag on a poll, along with a few American flags. To me that is wrong. The whole Halo storyline and setting just isn't the same. Halo capture the flag feels more like paintball ctf.

Tussy the Druid
2007-01-08, 09:44 PM
Well, games that insult the intelligence of people that are young insult me. That's generalization, something that really bugs me. Being 13, nearly 14, I can play every game but games like Saints Row or GTA.

And the media is retarded. They think that video games turn people into psychopaths. War games have taught me how brutal war is, and how war should only be used as a last resort. ONLY.

Ego Slayer
2007-01-08, 09:51 PM
I tried to get my brother to read All Quiet on the Western Front... o.O

GTA is bad too. If anything I'd expect that sort of game to influence someone in a bad way.

Charity
2007-01-09, 06:07 AM
Meh Tom and Jerry cartoons have graphic scenes of violence.
It is daft,Over the last few years there has been an astronomical rise in gamers. 6 million people play WOW for pities sake, which involves violence and the like, has there been a marked increase in violence from those that play? er nope.

The old argument goes-
Some people are violent.
Some of these people play videogames/watch movies/use pornography/do something I as a member of the moral minority object to
Some of these people play violent videogames/watch violent movies/use violent pornography/do something violent I as a member of the moral minority object to.
therefore violent videogames/ violent movies/ violent pornography/doing something violent I as a member of the moral minority object to breeds violent behaviour.
therefore playing videogames/watching movies/useing pornography/doing something I as a member of the moral minority object to breeds violence.

It is wrong.

Censorship for adults is bad, it boils down to you can't do that because I don't like it.

The Dirge
2007-01-09, 07:54 AM
*Takes a deep breath*

I would never even think about banning a game. Anything in even the most explicit game can be seen by watching 10 minutes of TV. Big jiggling girls (music videos, most shows), violence, torture (news, movies) all of these things are reported on the 5 o'clock news or on 9:00 saturday morning (video hits, in Australia). People you are trying to protect from 'Adult themes' probably already know more about them than you. Just from being in the real world, you will see and hear things far more horrifying than in the most graphic game. I know someone who will not let her son play war medal of honour, but who sat down with him and watched TV as it showed tanks exploding and bodies on the streets in Iraq. Get of your high horse, take a look around the world, and stop trying to 'protect' people.

*Exhales*

The Prince of Cats
2007-01-09, 10:15 AM
In my whole life, there has only ever been one game I have been offended by. Mostly, I can roll my eyes and just accept that my tastes are not the tastes of other people.

The one game I would never be able to accept is Left Behind: Eternal Forces (http://www.eternalforces.com/). At the risk of bringing real-world religion in against the rules, that game makes me feel a little sick.

Setra
2007-01-09, 10:38 AM
Anything devoid of a plot, and anything rated lower than E.

Also, in regards to Kings Quest, I vaguely remember seeing the name, I loved that game when I was younger, however I sucked royally at it.

Closet_Skeleton
2007-01-09, 11:22 AM
Violent games certainly didn't make me violent but I could see how violent people might model their violence on violence in games. The idea of banning games for violence is ignoring the real causes and actually quite dangerous. Maybe it's part of consumerism that if something's wrong people'll look at what you buy rather then take resposibility, I don't know.

Jibar
2007-01-09, 12:52 PM
Halo capture the flag feels more like paintball ctf.

They should totally make a paintball game. That would be awesome.

On the subject of violence...there isn't much I can say. I have such a hatred for the subject that I'll not say a thing.
However, on a humorous note, look at Mars Attacks. Playing video games might just help you save the President.

Truwar
2007-01-09, 02:07 PM
Did you read my post? I don't think so, because if you did, you'd know that the "it's not always their fault" part was referring to some kids not fully understanding that what's seen on TV isn't always allowed in real life, simply due to being naturally 'slow'.

Yes I did read your post and the way you phrased your comment made it seem as if a fair amount of the time, parents were not at fault if their child was simply unable to distinguish real world from fictional violence. This should not be the case. If the parent has actually been INVOLVED in the life of the 13 or 14 year old, they should know them VERY well and be aware of exactly how well their child can distinguish between make-believe and reality. Very rarely a perfectly adjusted child from a great family goes off the deep-end due to a sudden chemical imbalance in their brain, but this is exceedingly rare.

As far as opposition to real-world frame works for war games (i.e. WWII games), I personally believe this is a mistake. Many of the people that are in to this genre of game are also quite interested in history. I am often shocked about how little people truly know about the causes behind many of the wars that have been fought in recent history (or even ancient history for that matter) and what actually occurred during these wars. I think that you will find that some of the biggest fans of these games understand how horrible war can be much better than many of the people that are deadest against them.

Mr. Moon
2007-01-09, 04:43 PM
You said it in the OP...:smallconfused:

Oh yeah... Excuse my goldfish-size memory. :redface:

Well, I'm basicly opposed to all first-person games. Halo would be one of them.


Also, in regards to Kings Quest, I vaguely remember seeing the name, I loved that game when I was younger, however I sucked royally at it.

Now I remember! Yeah, I used to play it as a kid too. I couldn't get very far without Mom's help, and kept getting terrified whenever the Boogyman came up on the screan. Eventualy mom told me that I couldn't play the level. :tongue:


As far as opposition to real-world frame works for war games (i.e. WWII games), I personally believe this is a mistake. Many of the people that are in to this genre of game are also quite interested in history. I am often shocked about how little people truly know about the causes behind many of the wars that have been fought in recent history (or even ancient history for that matter) and what actually occurred during these wars. I think that you will find that some of the biggest fans of these games understand how horrible war can be much better than many of the people that are deadest against them.

I can see where you're coming. Now, in not only my defence, but for many others I have yet to meet but am slightly sure exist, FPS games like that are to well done. The commercials for the newer Dawn of War makes my skin crawl. I hate things like that. I hate war. I hate for people to suffer, even if they aren't real. And while this may seem a little immature, I can't help but feel utter shock and horrer as I watch those comercials, and then have to listen to my brother say things like "Look at those graphics" "Wow, that game looks awesome" when I can't stand them. No war games will be allowed to touch my PS2. End of story.

zeratul
2007-01-09, 04:47 PM
Oh yeah... Excuse my goldfish-size memory. :redface:

Well, I'm basicly opposed to all first-person games. Halo would be one of them.



Now I remember! Yeah, I used to play it as a kid too. I couldn't get very far without Mom's help, and kept getting terrified whenever the Boogyman came up on the screan. Eventualy mom told me that I couldn't play the level. :tongue:

lol the boogyman used to scare me and my sister too but that level was so well made. i liked the thing where you had to get that guy his spine back. anyone know where you can buy it now?

Tharj TreeSmiter
2007-01-09, 04:51 PM
Balance as always is my motto, war games aren't necessarily bad. Personally I'm not a big fan of first person shooters or RTS' because they don't take much thinking. But there are some very good strategy games that help develope planning and long term thought, strategy that are also war-type games. But I agree that violent games like grand theft auto and such should not be played by kids, but ultimately I think it comes down to how you raise your kids regardless of what games they do or don't play.

Moon_Called what about board games? Would you allow war-boardgames? Like Axis&Allies (a kids war game) or Advanced squad leader (an adult one)?

The Evil Thing
2007-01-09, 05:27 PM
I don't recall the name of the game which my brother has been playing a demo for but... You're dressed in what looks like equipment from WW2, and you are somewhere in the Middle East. There is a real Middle Eastern country's flag on a poll, along with a few American flags. To me that is wrong.
So your issue is more political than moral? (so to speak) You prefer games to be apolitical and/or abstract such as sci-fi scenarios like Halo? Some games are set in the future, exploring potential wars (like Battlefield 2). Would you draw the line on those as well?


The old argument goes-
Some people are violent.
Some of these people play videogames/watch movies/use pornography/do something I as a member of the moral minority object to
Some of these people play violent videogames/watch violent movies/use violent pornography/do something violent I as a member of the moral minority object to.
therefore violent videogames/ violent movies/ violent pornography/doing something violent I as a member of the moral minority object to breeds violent behaviour.
therefore playing videogames/watching movies/useing pornography/doing something I as a member of the moral minority object to breeds violence.
I suppose arguably one could argue that the fact that crime rates have not increased dramatically compared to a dramatic increase in the number of people playing games suggests that there is no causal link.

Jack Squat
2007-01-09, 05:31 PM
It could also be argued that the people who commit violent acts are attracted to these violent games, not that those who play violent games are attracted to committing violence

The Dirge
2007-01-09, 08:25 PM
I am less likely to commit a violent act if i vent some anger in a game in which i shoot people

zeratul
2007-01-09, 08:27 PM
I am less likely to commit a violent act if i vent some anger in a game in which i shoot people

I completely agree playin some time splitters is a good way to vent some anger

Thexare Blademoon
2007-01-09, 08:42 PM
Yes I did read your post and the way you phrased your comment made it seem as if a fair amount of the time, parents were not at fault if their child was simply unable to distinguish real world from fictional violence. This should not be the case. If the parent has actually been INVOLVED in the life of the 13 or 14 year old, they should know them VERY well and be aware of exactly how well their child can distinguish between make-believe and reality. Very rarely a perfectly adjusted child from a great family goes off the deep-end due to a sudden chemical imbalance in their brain, but this is exceedingly rare.
Yeah, I was pretty much only referring to the kids with actual mental problems. I'm not arguing about the parents' responsibility to monitor what they play, I'm just saying that in the event of an actual mental disorder , the parents aren't to blame for the child's lack of knowledge. Which, when I put it this way, sounds to me like it doesn't even have to be said and I wonder why I wasted my time saying it in the initial post that started this argument... ah well.

purple gelatinous cube o' Doom
2007-01-09, 08:47 PM
My house is a strictly PC zone. Which limits all allowed games to the good ones.


Don't you know that every game ever made is based on WWII? :smallwink:


I've played some pretty bad PC games before. And are you actually saying that games like Zelda, Halo, FF and RE are bad games? It sure sounds like it to me.

Falkus
2007-01-09, 09:11 PM
I don't recall the name of the game which my brother has been playing a demo for but... You're dressed in what looks like equipment from WW2, and you are somewhere in the Middle East. There is a real Middle Eastern country's flag on a poll, along with a few American flags. To me that is wrong.

Why do say that?

Ego Slayer
2007-01-09, 09:52 PM
Falkus, I can't answer that due to forum rules.


They should totally make a paintball game. That would be awesome.

On the subject of violence...there isn't much I can say. I have such a hatred for the subject that I'll not say a thing.
I'm actually surprised Custom Edition on PC doesn't already have it.

I share your hatred of violence but it's just worth it so much to be a girl and own every player on the other team. They usually don't believe I'm actually a girl, but it's still worth it.:smalltongue:

The Dirge
2007-01-10, 07:03 AM
.

I share your hatred of violence but it's just worth it so much to be a girl and own every player on the other team. They usually don't believe I'm actually a girl, but it's still worth it.:smalltongue:


Who doesnt hate violence? That comment is like saying 'I enjoy having fun' SO DOES EVERYONE ELSE

pestilenceawaits
2007-01-10, 11:12 AM
Who doesnt hate violence? That comment is like saying 'I enjoy having fun' SO DOES EVERYONE ELSE

Unfortunately there are plenty of people in the world who don't hate violence and in fact relish it, so attacking someone for stating that they do hate it seems to me like you have an ax to grind. As for the topic at hand violence, murder, war, corruption, greed, and just about every other vice you can think of existed since the dawn of man. The problem with mature video games and media and the reason that they shouldn't be played by children (and some adults) is because they give people ideas they may not have had otherwise if someone is an alcoholic but never takes a drink then they will never have to suffer through the problems that come with alcohol abuse. The same can be said of violent video games if a person has a propensity for violence but is raised to be non-violent and doesn't experience the "thrill" of the kill so to speak in a video game chances are they will be less likely to try to recreate that experience in real life. That being said, I think the real problem with these games and media in general that has been touched on by several people here is that parents are not involved in their children's lives anymore they let TV raise their kids and then wonder why they don't know their kids when they get older. if you sit down and explain to your child what is right and wrong and then live your own life so the child sees and example of what you are talking about you will have a better chance they will come out well adjusted and not some chainsaw wielding psycho.:smallsmile:

Ego Slayer
2007-01-10, 11:14 AM
If you hated violence enough there would be limits to the games you play. I can compare Halo to paintball, and I can compare Battlefield of whatever that game my brother was playing to wrong. GTA is also wrong, obviously.

Yes, and there are obviouly people who don't hate violence.

Mr. Moon
2007-01-10, 11:40 AM
Moon_Called what about board games? Would you allow war-boardgames? Like Axis&Allies (a kids war game) or Advanced squad leader (an adult one)?

You mean like 40k? Yeah, I play those. I have an LOTR army (my orcs rarely wins against my brother's Fellowship-based army), and I'm just starting off in 40k. Yay Games Workshop!

Now, what I just realized is that this may sound a little hypocritical of me. But here's how I justify it: I will only play fantasy based War games, like the ones Games Workshop does. I will not play anything based on any real war. Dispite my brothers nagging, I don't ever join him in playing his WWII games.

Charity
2007-01-10, 12:03 PM
Unfortunately there are plenty of people in the world who don't hate violence and in fact relish it, so attacking someone for stating that they do hate it seems to me like you have an ax to grind. As for the topic at hand violence, murder, war, corruption, greed, and just about every other vice you can think of existed since the dawn of man.. True that, and the swine who went back in time and showed violent trailers to proto-humanis is clearly to blame for our torrid history.



The problem with mature video games and media and the reason that they shouldn't be played by children (and some adults) is because they give people ideas they may not have had otherwise if someone is an alcoholic but never takes a drink then they will never have to suffer through the problems that come with alcohol abuse. The same can be said of violent video games if a person has a propensity for violence but is raised to be non-violent and doesn't experience the "thrill" of the kill so to speak in a video game chances are they will be less likely to try to recreate that experience in real life.
Comparitively alcohol is easy to avoid. If you lock someone up in a white box during their entire formative years then, maybe, you might, be able to prevent them from witnessing violent acts.
How then would they cope when they inevitably encounter it when they are released? In truth life is pretty brutal, we like to think it's all sunshine and roses, but that is not the case. We need to be inurred to the violence fairly early on, to learn how to protect our sanity. No I'm not saying let kids play violent games, but once you are an adult if you are going to go on a killing spree because you saw a bit of pixelated gore I fear it was likely on the cards in any case.




That being said, I think the real problem with these games and media in general that has been touched on by several people here is that parents are not involved in their children's lives anymore they let TV raise their kids and then wonder why they don't know their kids when they get older. if you sit down and explain to your child what is right and wrong and then live your own life so the child sees and example of what you are talking about you will have a better chance they will come out well adjusted and not some chainsaw wielding psycho.:smallsmile:

If you don't raise your kids how you want them to behave, someone else will. Kids do not always find destuctive role models when left to their own devices, would you be willing to risk it though? Seriously if you don't care for your kids why have them?
I'm a father of two, my eldest is autistic, I allow them both to play games all of which I personally vet before letting them play.

As an adult with the ability to discriminate between fantasy and reality, I play what I want, I watch what I want, I bow to no man.

pestilenceawaits
2007-01-10, 12:33 PM
"Snip"
It sounds like we pretty much agree but to further expound on the topic.

It is true that alcohol is easy compared to violence to avoid but my intent was to point out that there is no reason to purposefully expose children to explicit violence. You want your children to be able to cope with what life throws at them and to be emotionally strong but that doesn't mean you should sacrifice the family dog they love in front of them and bath in its blood just to "toughen" them up. (or its video game equivalent) :smallsmile:
I know that is a bit extreme but people use the excuse all the time that they are going to see it on the news so they might as well play the game. To me seems like sloppy parenting it excuses bad behavior and has lead to our current state of the world where everyone is a victim. The mass murderer played video games that made him do it. By limiting what children see and play you take away the lame excuses so for those people who have mass murder in their cards they have no one to blame but themselves and their own poor choices.I don

I am a parent as well and I stated in a previous post I don't allow games that I wouldn't want my son to play. Some of the games I play have some violence in them and the themes are over his head but I am not afraid he will see those things and act them out. Watching dad kill orcs and goblins isn't a problem and my son playing with his plastic sword and fighting imaginary bad guys isn't a problem but if I was playing grand theft auto and then telling him to watch his language and respect police officers and such it would be giving him a mixed message and kids need consistency. I am also a very involved parent I know exactly what he is seeing and I make sure to spend time talking to him about what is appropriate behavior in real life and in make believe. but unfortunately many parent treat their kids as mini adults not realizing they don't always differentiate the real from the imaginary. I think adults should be able to do play what they want and I don't think people should lose the ability to choose what they want to play but they have to remember small eyes watch everything they do and kids pick up on stuff they would never expect.

The Dirge
2007-01-11, 12:11 AM
[QUOTE=pestilenceawaits;1808218]Unfortunately there are plenty of people in the world who don't hate violence and in fact relish it, so attacking someone for stating that they do hate it seems to me like you have an ax to grind. QUOTE]

What i meant was nobody goes aroung saying 'I love violence'. Saying 'I hate violence' is one of those comments that most people feel but the people who say them think they are better than everyone else.

Setra
2007-01-11, 05:39 AM
They should totally make a paintball game. That would be awesome.

They did, however it sucked, big time, in my opinion.

The Dirge
2007-01-11, 05:42 AM
Originally Posted by Jibar
They should totally make a paintball game. That would be awesome.


They did, however it sucked, big time, in my opinion.

Are you talking about the game where you get a gun and shoot your TV to hit enemy paintballers?

Edit: not a real gun

Ambrogino
2007-01-11, 07:23 AM
I have nothing against Halo. I've even played it. Once. Long ago. When I was six. At my babysitter's boyfreind's house.

Halo came out in 2001. Are you twelve, or thinking about a different game?

Ego Slayer
2007-01-11, 12:50 PM
^: Yeah, I was going to say that.:smalltongue:


Saying 'I hate violence' is one of those comments that most people feel but the people who say them think they are better than everyone else.
Er, wtf? That's not true.

Marius
2007-01-11, 02:20 PM
Sadly this actually happens
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2002/10/14

Om
2007-01-11, 06:30 PM
Halo came out in 2001. Are you twelve, or thinking about a different game?
The scary thing is that that is a long time ago in gaming terms. How can it have been six years already? :smalleek:

ChubsMcGee
2007-01-12, 02:40 AM
Er, wtf? That's not true.

Actually, I am going to have to side with Dirge. Most people DO dislike violence. They don't want to see people be hurt or killed and such. But there are people who say that they hate violence like it makes them different. In reality, it doesn't. Though don't take it as an insult, I don't know you. So I don't know if that applies to you. It's just the kind of thing those 'enlightened teenage philosophers' like to include in there babblings. The whole, "I understand life so clearly, but no one understands me." "I am just to philosophical, why don't my parents understand that and let me lead my own life." And then they find out that a million people have 'figured it out' before them, and moved on from that phase.

As for video games, most games I have no problem with. Though most Adults Only games are really just lame, with no content. And for the violence bit, there are games I wouldn't let my little sister play until she has grown up a bit. Kids do pick things up from everywhere, tv, movies, and video games. And there is no set age when the kid understands what is okay to do in a video game and what is okay in real life. And about GTA, I don't think it is a terrible game, it is fun here and there. The not right driving physics can make it fun for a while. But I don't find it bad morally or anything. Any that has played an evil character in a D&D game I would call a hypocrite if they say that shooting regular people and cops in a video game is wrong. Playing an evil character in D&D requires much more exploring of the motivations and such behind the actions. Which I would argue would have to be considered more damaging than just performing the actions. And for the paintball game, I see no difference between playing paintball and playing a violent FPS. Heck, in paintball you are actually HURTING people, not polygons.

And finally, for the 14 year olds getting drunk, and this forum being moral. I don't think it has to do with morals. I am sure a number of people on this forum drink, and get drunk. But with time and wisdom you will come to realize that it isn't going to make you an adult. Those that I respect who get drunk are the ones that don't feel the need to make sure everyone knows they got drunk last night.

The Dirge
2007-01-12, 09:15 AM
Thank you ChubsMcGee, for seeing my point so clearly

Ego Slayer
2007-01-12, 10:51 AM
Actually, I am going to have to side with Dirge. Most people DO dislike violence. They don't want to see people be hurt or killed and such. But there are people who say that they hate violence like it makes them different. In reality, it doesn't. Though don't take it as an insult, I don't know you. So I don't know if that applies to you. It's just the kind of thing those 'enlightened teenage philosophers' like to include in there babblings. The whole, "I understand life so clearly, but no one understands me." "I am just to philosophical, why don't my parents understand that and let me lead my own life." And then they find out that a million people have 'figured it out' before them, and moved on from that phase.
I don't think Jibar thinks he 'different', and I know I'm not 'different'. "Enlightened teenage philosophers" who "understand life, but no one understands me" usually turn out to be annoying emo kids.

There's is a difference between my Lennon-worshipping peace-loving hippie self, and philosophical emos.


And for the paintball game, I see no difference between playing paintball and playing a violent FPS. Heck, in paintball you are actually HURTING people, not polygons.
QTF.

The Dirge
2007-01-13, 08:16 AM
There's is a difference between my Lennon-worshipping peace-loving hippie self, and philosophical emos.


QTF.


Bah the only person worth worshiping is Lenin, our great leader in the fight against capitolism!

The Evil Thing
2007-01-13, 08:23 AM
Bah the only person worth worshiping is Lenin, our great leader in the fight against capitolism!
For someone so opposed to it, he used it an awful lot. :smalltongue:

the RC factor
2007-01-13, 10:14 AM
I (thank all the gods), don’t live in a repressive household, so I can bring any sort of garbage into my life/mind that I want (as long as it’s now really really really explicit. you all know what I mean). And for that I’m happy. Because my parents know the two things that most fail to realize 1) I’m mature enough to make the (mostly) right choices and 2) all that stuff doesn’t affect real action unless its paired with a very powerful CS (conditioned stimulus ) or there are problems with the kid to begin with..

The Dirge
2007-01-13, 08:47 PM
For someone so opposed to it, he used it an awful lot. :smalltongue:

No! Thats not true! *Weeps*

The Evil Thing
2007-01-14, 01:18 PM
*cough*NEP*cough*

Jibar
2007-01-14, 01:25 PM
Now is not the time for Russia's Civil War guys. Save it for History.
(He is right though.)


I don't think Jibar thinks he 'different', and I know I'm not 'different'. "Enlightened teenage philosophers" who "understand life, but no one understands me" usually turn out to be annoying emo kids.

There's is a difference between my Lennon-worshipping peace-loving hippie self, and philosophical emos.


Only think I'm different because people keep telling me I am. Curiously, never for the same reason.
And she is perfectly correct in all other manners.

Vazzaroth
2007-01-18, 11:11 PM
One word. Madden.

Grrrr.... *squints eyes*

Alex Kidd
2007-01-19, 02:26 PM
I was generally allowed to play what I wanted for several reasons

1. I am and always have been an extremely cynical and intellectually curious person. I've known for as long as I can remember where games and TV come from(writers and animators and such). I also seem to have had an innate belief in rational explanations, so no belief in the supernatural(never believed in Santa, the Easter Bunny magic or anything similar for as long as I can remember) as it required complicating the world with invisble undetectable stuff, which I've never been able to accept.
So I know very strongly the difference between fantasy and reality. Strangely I love escapism, maybe I appreciate it more or something.

2. I'm just not violent. I have not fought anyone to inflict pain or damage since the very earliest years of primary school(some kid kicked me in the crotch in preprimary because he'd heard how bad it was, I damn near hospitalised him). When I got into a fight (which was a little too often I've got a big mouth:smalltongue: ) I'd use intimidation or humiliation or if it was risky I'd just bolt. And I've never done anything to animals and have protected them where necessary.

3. My parents paid attention, they knew the above. They probably wouldn't have let me play GTA3(depends on whether they thought it glorified drugs or not, the sexual innuendo would have gone over my head and they were rightly not worried about violence) if it came out when I was a kid, though after I got into High School I would have been allowed(hell I know I was it came out the year I started), but they weren't worried about Doom and they probably would have let me play Dead Rising fairly young.

Essentially the only thing I would have hard and fast not been allowed would have been the porn and hentai games, not so much for the sexual side but for the degradation of women. The same'll go if I want kids, that and no online games until their middle teen years, as much for the other players as for them.

Mr. Moon
2007-01-20, 06:34 PM
Halo came out in 2001. Are you twelve, or thinking about a different game?

Either that or I've forgotten how old I was when I played it.

Arang
2007-01-21, 01:45 PM
Star Wars: The Phantom Menace for the PC. I never want to see that piece of wombat again.

The Dirge
2007-01-21, 04:50 PM
After playing that i cried for hours

Healos
2007-01-27, 11:33 AM
I'm all shooter/Fantasy/medieval warfare and strategy. Shooters Halo(Halo 2 soon) battlefield 2 and 2142, A crapy little game called mount and blade(yay for mods) BFME I and II. as fo the poll i'm a PC person no "A" rated games, my sister (egoslayer) runescape(BLAHH) and Halo sometimes.

Deaddude
2007-01-27, 11:51 AM
My mom won't lent any D&D in the house. But I'm allowed to play every other rpg and mmorpg similar to it. LOL

Penguinizer
2007-01-27, 12:29 PM
I usually choose what I play visely. I avoid overly violent games.

The Dirge
2007-01-27, 07:25 PM
But overly violent games can be the most fun, as long as you dont take extreme gore/unnecesary force to seriously.

RandomNPC
2007-01-27, 07:49 PM
i don't let things like GTA into my house. if you want blatant violence watch the ten o'clock news. Bully is another one, its just gta for kids. also most FPS are the same to me, so i leave them all on the store shelves, and if you want to p[lay them don't bring them to me.

when someone does bring a game over i don't make them leave it outside or anything, by "house" i kinda mean if you put it in my game system you are no longer welcome in my home.

although a long while ago, when RE2 was new, i went and got it. my parents thought i was going to go shoot someone, and i told them "its a game, i know the difference, people die when you shoot them, zombies moan and fall down when i press a button that makes a not real character use a weapon"

Logic
2007-01-28, 04:02 AM
i don't let things like GTA into my house. if you want blatant violence watch the ten o'clock news. Bully is another one, its just gta for kids.
I can tell you have not actually played the game Bully. If you had, you would realize it is not "just GTA for kids"
The game has been called that by far too many people that have not given it a chance, since it is made by the Rockstar company, which does in fact make the GTA franchise.
GTA is known for pushing the envelope, and somehow, Bully has just been thrown in as a deplorable game, and even been called "A Columbine Simulator" by Jack Thompson, the man pushing to censor and ban whatever games he feels are indecent.
Whereas I would never let my 15 year old sister play any of the GTA games I currently own, I would allow her to play Bully. The game, more often than not, has the protagonist defending other cliques within the school, not randomly shooting them.
I do not believe I have any more to add without mentioning the politics of the current situation on violent video games.

The Dirge
2007-01-28, 06:10 AM
Its like the obesity problem. People can't control their kids so they make all kids suffer. Because of parents complaining of obesity, my school canteen has banned junk food.

Edit: Though by buying chocolates in bulk and selling for 50c extra, I am making a tidy profit.

Jibar
2007-01-28, 06:41 AM
While you're completely right Logic, Bully does also feature you attacking other cliques a lot.
Some missions do seem like a watered down GTA (instead of blowing up a house, you egg it), most sandbox, mission driven games these days end up labeled as a GTA clone.
I'm not sure I would like it in my home though. Sure, it's not real life, but when you've been on the other end of the bullying line for most your life, any game that calls itself Bully is gonna put you ill at ease.
Also, that was made by Rockstar? I had no idea...

Penguinizer
2007-01-28, 06:54 AM
But overly violent games can be the most fun, as long as you dont take extreme gore/unnecesary force to seriously.

I mean something along the lines of God of War and GTA.

The Dirge
2007-01-28, 07:07 AM
Jibar, have you ever seen the webcomic shclock mercenary. Later on it gets a Koala that i think you would like.

BTW, how do I do spoilers?

Penguinizer
2007-01-28, 12:15 PM
type (spoiler)text here (/spoiler) but with [ and ] instead of (and )

neriana
2007-01-28, 01:32 PM
I don't allow games that aren't any good in my house. If they're really violent, but also really good, that's fine. I also would never allow misogynistic games like DOA: Extreme Beach Volleyball or The Guy Game. These things have never come up, though.

You can't even have a gun in Bully, iirc. It's rated "T". The humor and such is for older teens and adults, but the whole point of the game is to unite everyone else in the school against the bullies. It's like one of those late 80s teen movies. If Jack Thompson says the sky is blue, you can be 99.9% certain it is not. He claimed The Sims 2 was hardcore porn, for crying out loud.

The Dirge
2007-01-28, 05:34 PM
Thank you Penguinizer

The Evil Thing
2007-01-29, 01:50 AM
He claimed The Sims 2 was hardcore porn
I believe the exact phrase was "paedophile's dream". Managed to embarrass himself quite well. First he claimed (erroneously, of course) that the censor 'blocks' could be very simply removed, allowing the player to see children naked when it was painfully obvious they were featureless mannequins. When this was pointed out that EA knew they were doing something wrong/illegal etc. because the censor blocks were there in the first place.

What a fruitcake. You could almost feel sorry for him. If I were you, I'd keep a closer eye on Wolfgang Schaeuble. This chap wants to ban computer games but crucially, he has actual political power. :smalleek:

Thexare Blademoon
2007-01-29, 02:11 AM
I don't allow games that aren't any good in my house. If they're really violent, but also really good, that's fine. I also would never allow misogynistic games like DOA: Extreme Beach Volleyball or The Guy Game.
Personally, I tend to expect the games you named to already be banned under your first restriction...

Logic
2007-01-29, 05:14 AM
If I were you, I'd keep a closer eye on Wolfgang Schaeuble. This chap wants to ban computer games but crucially, he has actual political power. :smalleek:

No worries to anyone not in Germany apparently.
Wolfgang Schaeuble (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfgang_Sch%C3%A4uble)

The Dirge
2007-01-29, 06:26 AM
Poor, poor Germans

Artanis
2007-01-29, 09:46 AM
The one good thing about Jack Thompson: as long as he's around, it's a lot harder for the general masses to take the "OMG! VIDEO GAMEZ R TEH EVAHL!!1" crowd seriously. I do NOT look forward to the day when somebody with charisma - or hell, even just the ability to speak coherently - takes up his banner :smalltongue:

Logic
2007-01-29, 09:55 AM
The problem is that video games are the new scapegoat for society being terrible.
The ones I can recall:
Elvis-era Rock Music
Dungeons and Dragons
Metal
Rap Music
Videogames

Feel free to point out the other ones I have missed.

Jack Squat
2007-01-29, 10:16 AM
You forgot hippies.

No list is complete without hippies

Charity
2007-01-29, 11:34 AM
How about bikers, they used to be a popular choice.

The Dirge
2007-01-29, 08:26 PM
Don't forget, they used to blame societys problems on racial groups.

neriana
2007-01-29, 10:46 PM
Personally, I tend to expect the games you named to already be banned under your first restriction...

You're right :smalltongue: .

rabish12
2007-01-29, 11:42 PM
The problem is that video games are the new scapegoat for society being terrible.
The funniest thing is that society doesn't need a scapegoat right now, because it's getting better. Violent crime, the thing video games are blamed for the most, has actually gone down rather steadily over the past several years.


The ones I can recall:
Elvis-era Rock Music
Dungeons and Dragons
Metal
Rap Music
Videogames

Feel free to point out the other ones I have missed.
Comic books are a good one. Really good parallel for video games - politicians acted as though the most violent and excessive ones were representative of all of them, psychologists and others came forward claiming that they did cause moral depravity and violence without any solid basis or proper scientific study, and they were basically blamed for most of society's problems. Only really stops being a good parallel when you get to the creation of the CCA, where an organization was started by the comics industry that basically cut off a massive amount of creative possibilities, but that could still happen.

And on the original topic, I allow and play all sorts of games, up to and including games that I absolutely hate. I even played right through Final Fantasy VII (a game that set me off JRPGs for... well, I still have a hard time playing them) just to finish it because it was recommended to me, for example, and currently have both versions. Only kinds of games I don't have are AO games, but that's less because they're against the rules or because I wouldn't allow them and more because there aren't any worth trying out.

The Dirge
2007-01-30, 04:27 AM
Scapegoating seems like a popular political tool.

neriana
2007-01-30, 07:41 PM
Scapegoating seems like a popular political tool.

Since the beginning of human society. Us vs. them only works if there's a "them" -- and without us vs. them, "us" falls apart rather quickly.

Penguinizer
2007-01-31, 01:15 AM
Therefore they need to create a "them" for the Us vs. Them campaighn idea. am I right.

Thats what scapegoating is for in politics.

The Dirge
2007-01-31, 01:23 AM
Yes, you are right.

Penguinizer
2007-01-31, 11:39 AM
Yay. Im participating :P

Mr. Moon
2007-01-31, 08:56 PM
Carefull, don't want to go to off topic and get this thread closed. Or even worse, get busted for discusing real-life polotics.

The Dirge
2007-02-01, 01:54 AM
Sorry. So.....Violent games are good and are only as bad as the 6 o'clock news.

Penguinizer
2007-02-01, 07:10 AM
we should get back on track.

I dont play overly violent or in-appropriate games.

anarch_nomad
2007-02-02, 12:59 AM
Ya there are just some games out there that go way over the edge on violence. Not saying thats bad but i mean when its just a stupid gore fest *coughs* Bloodrayne *cough*

The Evil Thing
2007-02-02, 01:54 AM
Trouble with the "Stupid Gore Fest" title is that some games which all but advertise themselves as "excessively bloody" (strictly speaking, almost-realistically bloody) can be reasonable games in their own right (I'm looking at Soldier of Fortune I and II). Admittedly, Manhunt was boring, but it struck me more as an experiment so kudos to Rockstar for at least trying to be original.

The Dirge
2007-02-02, 03:48 AM
Is manhunt the snuff film one?

The Evil Thing
2007-02-02, 06:12 AM
Manhunt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhunt_%28video_game%29)

Not terribly clever but a relatively interesting concept.

Dumbledore lives
2007-02-02, 11:10 AM
I don't play wargames. I just don't like them, they make war a fun thing and that's just wrong.

DM Kiirnodel
2007-02-02, 11:36 AM
Speaking of war heroes...

Jack Churchill for the win! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Churchill)

;)

As for talking about Oblivion being a sub-par game?

I like it better than Morrowind, mind you I think Daggerfall was the best, by far. In my list of best games ever created, I place Daggerfall above FF7, FF6 and Chrono Trigger, which I also love. I'm a huge Blizzard/Bethesda/Square fan, especially Bethesda, considering I own the entire Elder Scrolls series. Has anyone actually played Arena?

Daggerfall's plot was much more engaging than Morrowind or Oblivion, it had more court intrigue, much more cities (Supposedly over twice the size of Great Britain was the world map)... it was just a superior game if you looked past the graphics. ... and the sheer amount of bugs it had.

I really really dislike first person shooters. Why? Because I suck at them. I'm pretty good with games where I can fire spells, but if it's got guns... I just suck at the game. So I don't buy any of those games. I prefer strategy games with guns instead of ...soloing with a gun. Starcraft was cooler anyways ;)

The Evil Thing
2007-02-02, 01:50 PM
As for talking about Oblivion being a sub-par game?
There is no discussion of this idea. There is only its statement as fact. Excellent concept and clever idea etc. let down by mindbogglingly stupid AI and clunky, XBoxified controls.

Penguinizer
2007-02-02, 01:58 PM
I prefer Morrowind to Oblivion. Morrowind is a lot more interesting IMO.

Weebl
2007-02-02, 03:59 PM
I play anything, anywhere! Apart from those disney film based ones. They are absolutely rubbish.

rabish12
2007-02-02, 04:26 PM
Has anyone actually played Arena?
I have. It's probably actually my favorite in the series, or at least comes very close behind Daggerfall. It is much simpler, but it's also more stable, feels more "complete", and has a faster pace than any of the other games in the series


Daggerfall's plot was much more engaging than Morrowind or Oblivion, it had more court intrigue, much more cities (Supposedly over twice the size of Great Britain was the world map)... it was just a superior game if you looked past the graphics. ... and the sheer amount of bugs it had.
And the fact that all of the terrain was almost flat and very repetitive, and the fact that most of the dungeons looked alike, and the general lack of variety in the towns, and the incredibly cookie-cutter random quests that you got from guilds and inn-keepers/store-owners/other folk, and the cookie-cutter NPCs, and the parts of the game that weren't fully implemented or implemented at all but left in the game, and the general incompleteness and rushed status of the game.

Still, it's a great game, even despite absolutely all of that.


I really really dislike first person shooters. Why? Because I suck at them. I'm pretty good with games where I can fire spells, but if it's got guns... I just suck at the game. So I don't buy any of those games. I prefer strategy games with guns instead of ...soloing with a gun. Starcraft was cooler anyways ;)
You should probably give Deus Ex a try. It has guns, but you never actually have to use them.

DM Kiirnodel
2007-02-02, 04:40 PM
Yeah, Daggerfall's 'sandbox' factor wasn't good, all the quests were repetitive, BUT the plot is what I liked. I liked Arena a lot too! =D

I might try out Deus Ex sometime, thanks for mentioning it.

Okrainets
2007-02-03, 02:18 PM
I play all types of games if I find them interesting.

It's terribly foolish to discard away games based on wars. So, what, if your son plays a little Medal of Honor, will he go and try to shoot people with an M1 Garand? No. Because violence and murder isn't inspired by video games in any way, and neither do they 'train' you for violence.

Of course, if I have a son, I might limit the games he plays somewhat. Hentai Adventures 4 or Magna *** Laude, for example. But that's all.

Anyway, there are some people writing about how they hate any FPS. They're not all Counter-Strike shooting and running, you know. Like GMod.

Ceska
2007-02-03, 02:22 PM
I am the only one playing in my house, so the answer is I don't allow what I don't play. Simple as that. I have no clue about the ratings but I think most shooters miss their target audience as they're too stupid for adults.

Mr. Moon
2007-02-03, 03:34 PM
You know, a lot of people are only looking at this from the desrepency factor. (IE: I can tell the diffrence between killing someone in a video game from killing someone in real-life) But when it comes to kids, there's also the "coolness" factor. IE: "Whoa, look at that! *insert name of totaly awesome main character* totaly carnaged *insert name of villan/antagonist*! He's so cool! I want to be just like him one day!"

Ceska
2007-02-03, 03:49 PM
Yeah, but without this coolness factor, why play it? It's just boring "let's kill some virtual bots" without any risk. If you die, reload. That's childish and makes death look harmless and glorifies murderers. At least children buy that, those adults I know don't.