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View Full Version : [PF] The man with much rope: the Hog Tie fighter



Teh_das
2013-10-12, 12:29 AM
I've always been a fan of the idea of the pugilist, the wrestler who brawls when others take to weapons. I never liked the grapple rules in 3.5, but with archetypes and new grapple rules in Pathfinder, I think I can finally build a successful hog tying grappler.

My build is Half-Orc Cavalier (Order of the Penitent) 2/Monk (Tetori) X. A lot of feat and trait pressure will be towards CMB, but I plan to take the Snapping Turtle Style feat chain, all the grappling feats I can get my hands on, and taking Power Attack and Improved Sunder for extra options.

Does the playground have any build advice?

TroubleBrewing
2013-10-12, 12:33 AM
If you're able to use 3.5 material, I think the Bloodhound class out of Complete Adventurer could hog tie as a move action or something similar...

Teh_das
2013-10-12, 12:49 AM
The cavalier levels let me do that, I'm pretty sure. At least when I get Greater Grapple (around lvl 8).

StreamOfTheSky
2013-10-12, 09:43 AM
The Tetori's main benefit is stopping magical effects that allow grapple escape, but not till 9th level and at tremendous cost in ki to maintain for any length of time.
But few enemies will even have Freedom of Movement or Dim Door (and you can make Dim Door impossible to use just by jacking up your CMB), so I'd suggest going Lore Warden Fighter instead. They just plain get big bonuses to CMB and CMD (CMD is very important to a grappler, since the whole point is to keep someone grappled, and *that* is the thing that will determine if they can escape or not). Know Thy Enemy is another way to boost CMB higher (attack bonuses apply to CMB). Having actual, genuine full BAB means you won't be delayed in taking Rapid Grappler, a feat almost as build critical as Greater Grapple.

For traits, definitely take Bred for War (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/race-traits/bred-for-war) or Serpentine Squeeze (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/religion-traits/serpentine-squeeze-ydersius). Since a foe trying to escape a grapple w/ a grapple check should count as "grappling you" (I think...), the serpent one is probably more useful, unless you plan to do other maneuvers, too.

If you have a high point buy / rolls and can afford good wisdom, you may well want to dip monk for the Wis to AC (to boost CMD), but in that case, I would dip Maneuver Master, not Tetori. MM will let you take a -2 on all maneuver rolls to make an extra maneuver attempt per turn when you can take a full round action attacking/grappling.

If you are not dipping for Wis to AC, then by all means get the Brawling property (+1 market price) on your armor ASAP, for a nice untyped +2 on grapple checks and on unarmed attack/damage.

If you do stick with your current plan, be sure to grab Advanced Defensive Combat Training (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/advanced-defensive-combat-training-combat-faction) for a massive +4 to CMD. The Fighter build can do it, too. But since the pre-req feat (Defensive Combat Training; your HD counts as your BAB for the purpose of determining CMD) is completely worthless to him, it's less appealing.