Wizard Spell Packs

[Uby1234]

This post contains a "spell pack" so you don't have to choose your wizards or sorcerers spells. Feel free to post your own spell packs here as well. If you like, you can post your spellcaster's spell setup. I'd like to see something other than "The Tank".

For the Scholar:

1st: Identify, Shocking Grasp, Floating Disk, plus the following if you have an Intelligence modifier: Reduce Person, Sleep.
2nd: Blur, Shatter.
3rd: Shrink Item, Arcane Sight.
4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter.
5th: Major Creation, Cone of Cold.
6th: Analyze Dweomer, Mislead.
7th: Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image.
8th: Polar Ray, Prismatic Wall.
9th: Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.

You'll notice that this pack contains very few evocations, and focuses on divinations and transmutations, hence the "scholar" name. Also, almost all of these evocations deal cold damage. That is an advantage over fire damage in some ways, because DMs like to make you fight fire creatures, which are vulnerable to cold and water.

[Story]

What are the purpose of these spell packs? What are the restrictions?

Several of those are pretty bad spells, even if you don't consider the opportunity cost.

[Brookshw]

What are the purpose of these spell packs? What are the restrictions?

Several of those are pretty bad spells, even if you don't consider the opportunity cost.

Don't know what the op's purpose is but I appreciate these as it cuts down on prep time for npc casters.:smallbiggrin:

[nedz]

Presumably so you can run your magic mart like this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0049.html) ?

Actually this was a thing in 1E, albeit for starting spells. A 1st level Wizard started with 1 offensive, 1 defensive and 1 utility spell — determined randomly from a list. I do remember one Wizard whose starting offensive spell was something called Friends. He went on to great things, but that had nothing to do with this spell.

[Slide]

Don't know what the op's purpose is but I appreciate these as it cuts down on prep time for npc casters.:smallbiggrin:

I plan on stealing them for just that purpose if he continues.

[Uby1234]

What are the purpose of these spell packs? What are the restrictions?

Several of those are pretty bad spells, even if you don't consider the opportunity cost.
Excuse me, but I have had massive success with this pack. Post saying what you'd like to see, or just make your own packs and post them, rather than criticize me.

[Uby1234]

Here's a "tank" pack:

1st: True Strike, Burning Hands, Summon Monster I.
2nd: Bull's Strength, Scorching Ray.
3rd: Explosive Runes, Rage.
4th: Wall of Fire, Polymorph.
5th: Teleport, Symbol of Pain.
6th: Circle of Death, Bigby's Forceful Hand.
7th: Limited Wish, Mordenkainen's Sword.
8th: Sunburst, Polar Ray.
9th: Wish, Power Word Kill.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

There's a 5th, 10th, and 15th level spell and item list for a focused specialist Conjurer in the God Wizard handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=k4h3c9rt3mpbassorfpoh7jmp1&topic=394.msg8048#msg8048). Note the build those lists are designed for is a few posts up, it uses versatility tricks like Mage of the Arcane Order and the Domain Power ACF for the Magic domain to still use spell trigger items from prohibited schools.

I recently made a 10th level Sorcerer for someone to use in Tomb of Horrors, feats include Storm Bolt, Split Ray, Practical Metamagic, and Arcane Thesis: Enervation.
He has a custom Runestaff with Endure Elements 1/day, Mage Armor 2/day, Benign Transposition 3/day, Identify 3/day, Rope Trick 1/day, and Greater Resistance 1/day. He has a Healing Belt, Anklet of Translocation, Magic Bedroll, and a Shadowy Diadem with +4 Cha added per MIC p234.
0- Detect Magic, Read Magic, Ghost Sound, Mage Hand, Mending, Message, Stick, Prestidigitation, Arcane Mark
1- Wall of Smoke, Grease, Charm Person, Power Word: Pain, Shield
2- Wings of Cover, Web, Glitterdust, Ray of Stupidity
3- Heart of Water, Stinking Cloud, Ray of Dizziness
4- Enervation, Heart of Earth
5- Arc of Lightning

[Juntao112]

Excuse me, but I have had massive success with this pack. Post saying what you'd like to see, or just make your own packs and post them, rather than criticize me.

Why does a scholar needs blasting spells?

[eggynack]

Excuse me, but I have had massive success with this pack. Post saying what you'd like to see, or just make your own packs and post them, rather than criticize me.
I don't think it's criticism, so much as actually just asking what a spell pack is. Some of the spells on that list are actually quite suboptimal, particularly because you have more blasting than I'd like, particularly on a blasting light guy. However, that could be irrelevant depending on the purpose of these things. Are these just random NPC loadouts, or quickly accessible lists for PC's, or different types of spell booster packs or what? It seems like it's the second one, in which case optimizing might actually be important.

[Uby1234]

Here's another one. More for a gnome than anyone else.

1st: Color Spray, Obscuring Mist, Silent Image.
2nd: Summon Swarm, Mirror Image.
3rd: Protection from Energy, Major Image.
4th: Hallucinatory Terrain, Stone Shape.
5th: Break Enchantment, Seeming.
6th: Programmed Image, Mislead.
7th: Mass Invisibility, Greater Shadow Conjuration.
8th: Power Word Stun, Scintillating Pattern.
9th: Prismatic Sphere, Time Stop.

[Uby1234]

Why does a scholar needs blasting spells?
So he can be at least somewhat capable in combat.

[Uby1234]

I don't think it's criticism, so much as actually just asking what a spell pack is. Some of the spells on that list are actually quite suboptimal, particularly because you have more blasting than I'd like, particularly on a blasting light guy. However, that could be irrelevant depending on the purpose of these things. Are these just random NPC loadouts, or quickly accessible lists for PC's, or different types of spell booster packs or what? It seems like it's the second one, in which case optimizing might actually be important.
This is a scholar pack. I chose the ones that were appropriate. A spell pack is to help DMs with NPC spellcasters, and to provide quick-play options for players with characters of various archetypes. I plan to post one or two of these per day, but don't go ballistic if I don't post one on a given day.

[eggynack]

This is a scholar pack. I chose the ones that were appropriate. A spell pack is to help DMs with NPC spellcasters, and to provide quick-play options for players with characters of various archetypes. I plan to post one or two of these per day, but don't go ballistic if I don't post one on a given day.
That way probably needs less optimization then, yeah. Juntao is correct though, that you don't really need any blasting spells on such a build. You could even replace all of the blasting with teleport, so that your scholar guy doesn't have to fight at all. Also, you're missing non-core and zeroth level options, which means that your scholar doesn't have amanuensis (SpC, 9), which is a bit on the thematically perfect side for a scholar.

[Uby1234]

I don't think it's criticism, so much as actually just asking what a spell pack is. Some of the spells on that list are actually quite suboptimal, particularly because you have more blasting than I'd like, particularly on a blasting light guy. However, that could be irrelevant depending on the purpose of these things. Are these just random NPC loadouts, or quickly accessible lists for PC's, or different types of spell booster packs or what? It seems like it's the second one, in which case optimizing might actually be important.
Which ones do you think are suboptimal?
Polar Ray, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Cone of Cold, and a fair few others are quite powerful.

[Uby1234]

That way probably needs less optimization then, yeah. Juntao is correct though, that you don't really need any blasting spells on such a build. You could even replace all of the blasting with teleport, so that your scholar guy doesn't have to fight at all. Also, you're missing non-core and zeroth level options, which means that your scholar doesn't have amanuensis (SpC, 9), which is a bit on the thematically perfect side for a scholar.
The reason I didn't include cantrips is because wizards start with all of them. As for the non-core, I specifically made these packs core-only, mainly because I only have the DMG, Stronghold Builder's Guidebook, and PHB., so I have no access to non-core spells. And what is amanuensis?

[eggynack]

Which ones do you think are suboptimal?
Polar Ray, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Cone of Cold, and a fair few others are quite powerful.
Magnificent mansion is alright, if quite high level for what it does (rope trick and tiny hut are things), but polar ray and cone of cold are rather poor options. Blasting spells tend towards being intrinsically suboptimal, and polar ray and cone of cold aren't exactly the best blasting spells. Freezing sphere suffers similarly, as does polar ray, and shocking grasp. As for non-blasting spells, etherealness exists where it could be one of the crazy 9th's, which is a high opportunity cost. If you really want a blasting spell, I'd pick up something like disintegrate, to add to the transmutation shtick, and maybe get an orb on there, cause orbs are awesome. You also might want to add contact other plane, because that's a classic of the divination school, and maybe toss an alarm on the list of firsts, so that you know about intruders.

[eggynack]

The reason I didn't include cantrips is because wizards start with all of them. As for the non-core, I specifically made these packs core-only, mainly because I only have the DMG, Stronghold Builder's Guidebook, and PHB., so I have no access to non-core spells. And what is amanuensis?
It lets you duplicate non-magical text. As for cantrips, it seems like the dividing line is preparation, rather than learning, so it could prove useful to add them. I've always been a fan of well planned zeroth's, though the list might universally end up looking like some combination of prestidigitation and detect magic, with maybe one spell that isn't one of those two.

[Juntao112]

So he can be at least somewhat capable in combat.

What kind of archaeologist carries a weapon?

[Uby1234]

What kind of archaeologist carries a weapon?
This is not an archaeologist.

[Juntao112]

I think you missed the point of that reference.

Why is a scholar packing heat?

[Uby1234]

I think you missed the point of that reference.

Why is a scholar packing heat?
Er- Indiana Jones? (I'm not much on pop culture, by the way.)

[Juntao112]

Er- Indiana Jones? (I'm not much on pop culture, by the way.)

Terrible archaeologist. (http://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/back-from-yet-another-globetrotting-adventure-indiana-jones-checks-his-mail-and-discovers-that-his-bid-for-tenure-has-been-denied)

[bekeleven]

I assume this provides 2 spells per spell level so that the player/GM can add the other half, but that seems to invalidate its purpose as being a quick preparation tool.

Here's a good spell supplement to take on the even levels, for combat effectiveness:

1 - Grease, Sleep
2 - Glitterdust, Web
3 - Dispel Magic, GMW (gotta fit in non-SoL somewhere)
4 - Black Tentacles, Shadow Conjuration
5 - Dominate Person, Shadow Evocation
6 - Disintegrate, Greater Dispel Magic
7 - Forcecage, Greater Shadow Conjuration
8 - Greater Shadow Evocation, Irresistible Dance (best spell evar)
9 - Shapechange, Shades

Left off some obvious good spells, but it's fairly adaptable with the shadow spells in there.

[Uby1234]

I assume this provides 2 spells per spell level so that the player/GM can add the other half, but that seems to invalidate its purpose as being a quick preparation tool.

Here's a good spell supplement to take on the even levels, for combat effectiveness:

1 - Grease, Sleep
2 - Glitterdust, Web
3 - Dispel Magic, GMW (gotta fit in non-SoL somewhere)
4 - Black Tentacles, Shadow Conjuration
5 - Dominate Person, Shadow Evocation
6 - Disintegrate, Greater Dispel Magic
7 - Forcecage, Greater Shadow Conjuration
8 - Greater Shadow Evocation, Irresistible Dance (best spell evar)
9 - Shapechange, Shades

Left off some obvious good spells, but it's fairly adaptable with the shadow spells in there.
Finally, one of my threads stays on-topic.

[TaiLiu]

YOU OFF YET? IF YOU NEED A METHOD OF SUICIDE, JUST GET DRAWMIJ'S INSTANT SUMMONS ON A GREATAXE, AND SWALLOW THE SAPPHIRE! OR WALK INTO A ROOM WITH 30 TARRASQUES AND A GREAT WYRM-WITH NO EQUIPMENT! OR WALK UNDER A CONVOY OF HEROES WHILE CARRYING BARRELS OF EXPLOSIVE OIL! OR MAYBE TRY AND NOT BE AN IDIOT! YOU'D PROBABLY DIE FROM TRYING THAT!
:smallfurious::smallfurious::smallfurious:
:smallfrown: Comrade Uby1234, are you all right?

[eggynack]

:smallfrown: Comrade Uby1234, are you all right?
Yeah, I gotta wonder. It seems a bit on the excessive side, and the self-quoting seems vaguely crazy, though possibly intentionally so. I thought my post was rather on point, too.

[TaiLiu]

Yeah, I gotta wonder. It seems a bit on the excessive side, and the self-quoting seems vaguely crazy, though possibly intentionally so. I thought my post was rather on point, too.
Indeed. Perhaps it is sarcasm, or some sort of satire, though it is excessively strong.

Comrade Uby1234, if you are ill or something, feel better soon.

[Story]

Excuse me, but I have had massive success with this pack. Post saying what you'd like to see, or just make your own packs and post them, rather than criticize me.

Well if it's Core Only and intended only for NPCs, then it's not so bad. Though I'm surprised by the missing Analyze Dweomer.

If noncore is allowed, then I'd drop Identify and add in Scholar's Touch. The blasting spells are also not so great, so I'd probably just stick Orb of Cold in there instead.

If it's for a PC, I'd drop almost the entire thing and pick more useful spells.

[Uby1234]

Yeah, I gotta wonder. It seems a bit on the excessive side, and the self-quoting seems vaguely crazy, though possibly intentionally so. I thought my post was rather on point, too.
Sorry. You just got a bit - er - really frustrating with your posts about how my scholar spell pack wasn't powerful enough. I have some problems with this sort of thing.

[Uby1234]

[QUOTE=Story;16206227]Well if it's Core Only and intended only for NPCs, then it's not so bad. Though I'm surprised by the missing Analyze Dweomer.QUOTE]
This spell list was intended to have you add some levels of loremaster, so analyze dweomer was unnecessary, because loremasters gain the ability to use it 1/day later on.

[Uby1234]

Indeed. Perhaps it is sarcasm, or some sort of satire, though it is excessively strong.

Comrade Uby1234, if you are ill or something, feel better soon.
I am not ill, but I do have high-functioning autism. And no, it wasn't satire in any way, shape or form.

[Uby1234]

:smallfrown: Comrade Uby1234, are you all right?
I'm fine now, thanks.

[Uby1234]

Yeah, I gotta wonder. It seems a bit on the excessive side, and the self-quoting seems vaguely crazy, though possibly intentionally so. I thought my post was rather on point, too.
Yeah. I guess there was an allip under my bed. :smallwink:

[Uby1234]

Well if it's Core Only and intended only for NPCs, then it's not so bad. Though I'm surprised by the missing Analyze Dweomer.

If noncore is allowed, then I'd drop Identify and add in Scholar's Touch. The blasting spells are also not so great, so I'd probably just stick Orb of Cold in there instead.

If it's for a PC, I'd drop almost the entire thing and pick more useful spells.
It was actually originally made for my character, and I've found these spells surprisingly useful.

[Maginomicon]

Sorry. You just got a bit - er - really frustrating with your posts about how my scholar spell pack wasn't powerful enough. I have some problems with this sort of thing.
Yet another example of why the last line of my sig is so poignant. :smallfrown:

Seriously guys, can we please stop complaining about the OP's premise and answer the actual question?

As for answering the OP's actual question: The Domain Wizard variant (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizardVariantDomainWiz ard) ends up functioning very similarly to what you're looking for. All you have to do is pull the spell choices out and boom you've got a Wizard Spell Pack.

[Uby1234]

Sorry everyone. (Particularly Eggynack.)
Best wishes,
Uby1234
:smallbiggrin:

[TaiLiu]

Sorry everyone. (Particularly Eggynack.)
Best wishes,
Uby1234
:smallbiggrin:
Ah, I love a happy ending. :smallsmile:

[Uby1234]

Hello World. Ah, it's nice to be back in my right mind.

[eggynack]

Yet another example of why the last line of my sig is so poignant. :smallfrown:

Seriously guys, can we please stop complaining about the OP's premise and answer the actual question?
Not really complaining about the premise. Just figuring out how to get existing stuff to match the given premise as well as possible. I've gotta figure that a scholar list would have just about no blast spells. Like, if optimization demanded blasting, then it'd still be outside the flavor of a scholar to want to blast, but it'd be more understandable. As is, there are plenty of more scholarly ways to deal with intruders than shooting ice at their face. I'd figure that you'd want a standard set of battlefield control spells, because those likely fit the premise better.


Sorry everyone. (Particularly Eggynack.)
Best wishes,
Uby1234
:smallbiggrin:
Is good. Hugs for all.

[Captnq]

Recommended Changes:

Scholar Pack:

0: Detect Magic, Amanuensis
1st: Scholar’s Touch, Ancient Knowledge
2nd: Insight of Good Fortune, Detect Thoughts
3rd: Tongues, Arcane Sight.
4th: Scrying, Detect Scrying.
5th: Contact Other Plane, Shadow Evocation.
6th: Legend Lore, True Seeing.
7th: Arcane Sight, Greater, Scrying, Greater.
8th: Discern Location, Bestow Curse, Greater
9th: Hindsight, Astral Projection


Tank Pack:

0: Sonic Snap, Launch Bolt
1st: Mage Armor, Orb Of Acid, Lesser
2nd: Blur, False Life
3rd: Reverse Arrows, Warcry
4th: Celerity, Polymorph
5th: Indomitability, Transmute rock to mud
6th: Starmantle, Stone Body
7th: Energy Immunity, Body of War
8th: Mysterious Redirection, Dreaded form of the eye tyrant
9th: Time Stop, Wish.

EDITOR: Transmute Rock to Mud fully heals you if you are using stone body. I know it doesn't seem to fit, but it gives you a work around to fully heal yourself after Indomitability leaves you at only 1 hit point.

Generic Adventurer:

0: Detect Magic, Caltrops
1st: Grease, Sleep
2nd: Glitterdust, Web
3rd: Dispel Magic, Greater Mage Armor
4th: Black Tentacles, Shadow Conjuration
5th: Hold Monster, Shadow Evocation
6th: Disintegrate, Greater Dispel Magic
7th: Forcecage, Greater Shadow Conjuration
8th: Greater Shadow Evocation, Irresistible Dance
9th: Shapechange, Shades

[Story]

Ancient Knowledge

Where's that from, Dragon Magazine? I haven't heard of it before.

[Captnq]

Where's that from, Dragon Magazine? I haven't heard of it before.

Irony: Check out my sig file if you have questions about spells.

ANCIENT KNOWLEDGE
- MAGIC OF EBERRON (3.5)
Divination
Level: Bard 1, Sorcerer/Wizard 1
Before making a Knowledge check, you can decide to discharge this spell as an immediate action to give yourself a +5 insight bonus on the check.

[Captnq]

Suggested Spell Packs:

Specialty Wizards (Have 3 spells instead of 2 for each level. All three spells are from the specialty school):
Abjuration
Conjuration
Divination
Enchantment
Evocation
Illusion
Necromancy
Transmutation


Domain Wizards
Add two more spells to each of these lists.

ABJURATION DOMAIN
0—resistance; 1st—shield; 2nd—resist energy; 3rd—dispel
magic; 4th—remove curse; 5th—Mordenkainen’s private
sanctum; 6th—greater dispel magic; 7th—banishment; 8th—
mind blank; 9th—prismatic sphere.
ANTIMAGIC DOMAIN
0—detect magic; 1st—protection from chaos/evil/good/law;
2nd—obscure object; 3rd—dispel magic; 4th—minor globe of
invulnerability; 5th—break enchantment; 6th—antimagic field;
7th—spell turning; 8th—protection from spells; 9th—
Mordenkainen’s disjunction.
BATTLE DOMAIN
0—daze; 1st—true strike; 2nd—protection from arrows; 3rd—
greater magic weapon; 4th—fire shield; 5th—Bigby’s interposing
hand; 6th—Tenser’s transformation; 7th—power word blind;
8th—moment of prescience; 9th—time stop.
COLD DOMAIN
0—ray of frost; 1st—chill touch; 2nd—chill metal (as 2nd-level
druid spell); 3rd—sleet storm; 4th—wall of ice; 5th—cone of
cold; 6th—Otiluke’s freezing sphere; 7th—delayed blast frostball
(as delayed blast fireball, but deals cold damage instead of fire
damage); 8th—polar ray; 9th—comet swarm (as meteor swarm,
but deals cold damage instead of fire damage).
CONJURATION DOMAIN
0—acid splash; 1st—mage armor; 2nd—web; 3rd—stinking
cloud; 4th—summon monster IV; 5th—wall of stone; 6th—acid
fog; 7th—summon monster VII; 8th—maze; 9th—gate.
DIVINATION DOMAIN
0—detect magic; 1st—detect secret doors; 2nd—see invisibility;
3rd—arcane sight; 4th—arcane eye; 5th—prying eyes; 6th—
true seeing; 7th—greater arcane sight; 8th—discern location;
9th—foresight.
ENCHANTMENT DOMAIN
0—daze; 1st—charm person; 2nd—Tasha’s hideous laughter;
3rd—suggestion; 4th—confusion; 5th—hold monster; 6th—
greater heroism; 7th—insanity; 8th—mass charm monster;
9th—dominate monster.
EVOCATION DOMAIN
0—light; 1st—magic missile; 2nd—flaming sphere; 3rd—
lightning bolt; 4th—shout; 5th—wall of force; 6th—Bigby’s
forceful hand; 7th—Mordenkainen’s sword; 8th—Otiluke’s
telekinetic sphere; 9th—Bigby’s crushing hand.
FIRE DOMAIN
0—flare; 1st—burning hands; 2nd—scorching ray; 3rd—
fireball; 4th—wall of fire; 5th—cone of fire (as cone of cold, but
deals fire damage instead of cold damage); 6th—summon
monster VI (fire creatures only); 7th—delayed blast fireball;
8th—incendiary cloud; 9th—meteor swarm.
ILLUSION DOMAIN
0—ghost sound; 1st—disguise self; 2nd—invisibility; 3rd—
major image; 4th—phantasmal killer; 5th—shadow evocation;
6th—mislead; 7th—mass invisibility; 8th—scintillating
pattern; 9th—shades.
NECROMANCY DOMAIN
0—disrupt undead; 1st—ray of enfeeblement; 2nd—false life;
3rd—vampiric touch; 4th—fear; 5th—waves of fatigue; 6th—
circle of death; 7th—control undead; 8th—horrid wilting; 9th—
energy drain.
STORM DOMAIN
0—ray of frost; 1st—obscuring mist (as 1st-level cleric spell);
2nd—gust of wind; 3rd—lightning bolt; 4th—ice storm; 5th—
control winds (as 5th-level druid spell); 6th—chain lightning;
7th—control weather; 8th—whirlwind (as 8th-level druid
spell); 9th—storm of vengeance (as 9th-level cleric spell).
TRANSMUTATION DOMAIN
0—mage hand; 1st—expeditious retreat; 2nd—levitate; 3rd—
haste; 4th—polymorph; 5th—baleful polymorph; 6th—
disintegrate; 7th—reverse gravity; 8th—iron body; 9th—
shapechange.


Yes, they might seem the same in some cases, but the domain wizard should be more flexible and think outside the domain for spells, whereas a specialist should have at least half his spells in his specialty school, hense 3 spells in one school.


Spell Lists on the following spell descriptors:

Acid
Air
Chaotic
Cold
Darkness
Death
Earth
Electricity
Evil
Fear
Fire
Force
Good
Incarnum
Language-Dependent
Lawful
Light
Mind-Affecting
Mindset
Sonic
Water


Wizard General Types:

Blaster
Controller (Enchanter)
Controller (Summoner)
Defensive Buff
Offensive Buff
Mobility Buff
De-Buffer
Battlefield Control
Saboture


Some suggested lists


Blaster Spells by Level
0 level - acid splash (c), ray of frost (ev), disrupt
undead (n)
1st level - burning hands (ev), chill touch (n), magic
missile (ev), shocking grasp (ev)
2nd level - acid arrow (c), flaming sphere (ev), scorching
ray (ev)
3rd level - fireball (ev), lightning bolt (ev), vampiric
touch (n), flame arrow (t)
4th level - ice storm (ev), phantasmal killer (i), shout
(ev)
5th level - cone of cold (ev), blight (n)
6th level - chain lightning (ev), circle of death (n),
disintegrate (t), freezing sphere (ev), undeath to
death (n)
7th level - delayed blast fireball (ev), finger of death
(n), mage’s sword (ev), prismatic spray (ev)
8th level - clenched fist (ev), horrid wilting (n), polar
ray (ev), shout, greater (ev), sunburst (ev), symbol
of death (n)
9th level - meteor swarm (ev), power word kill (en),
wail of the banshee (n), weird (i)


Controller Spells by Level
0 level - daze (en), flare (ev), touch of fatigue (n)
1st level - cause fear (n), charm person (en), color
spray (i), hypnotism (en), ray of enfeeblement (n),
reduce person (t), sleep (en)
2nd level - blindness/deafness (n), daze monster (en),
ghoul touch (n), hideous laughter (en), scare (n),
touch of idiocy (en)
3rd level - deep slumber (en), hold person (en), slow
(t), suggestion (en)
4th level - bestow curse (n), charm monster (en), confusion
(en), contagion (n), crushing despair (en),
enervation (n), fear (n), geas, lesser (en), rainbow
pattern (i), resilient sphere (ev)
5th level - baleful polymorph (t), dominate person
(en), feeblemind (en), hold monster (en), mind fog
(en), waves of fatigue (n)
6th level - eyebite (n), flesh to stone (t), suggestion,
mass (en)
7th level - grasping hand (ev), hold person, mass (en),
insanity (en), power word blind (en), prismatic
spray (ev), waves of exhaustion (n)
8th level - binding (en), charm monster, mass (en),
demand (en), maze (c), power word stun (en)
9th level - crushing hand (ev), dominate monster (en),
energy drain (n), hold monster, mass (en)

Saboteur Spells by Level
0 level - ghost sound (i), dancing lights (ev)
1st level - alarm (a), animate rope (t), grease (c), hold
portal (a), obscuring mist (c), summon swarm (c)
2nd level - arcane lock (a), darkness (ev), fog cloud (c),
glitterdust (c), hypnotic pattern (i), magic mouth
(i), minor image (i), obscure object (a), web (c)
3rd level - arcane sight (d), magic circle vs. chaos/
law/good/evil (a), major image (i), sleet storm (c),
stinking cloud (c), wind wall (ev)
4th level - arcane eye (d), black tentacles (c), hallucinatory
terrain (i), resilient sphere (ev), solid fog (c),
wall of fire (e), wall of ice (e)
5th level - cloudkill (c), mage’s faithful hound (c),
mind fog (e), mirage arcana (i), persistent image
(i), symbol of sleep (en), transmute rock to mud (t),
wall of force (ev), wall of stone (c)
6th level - acid fog (c), antimagic field (a), globe of
invulnerability (a), permanent image (i)), repulsion
(a), symbol of fear (n), symbol of persuasion (en),
wall of iron (c)
7th level - project image (i), reverse gravity (t), symbol
of stunning (en), symbol of weakness (n)
8th level - antipathy (en), incendiary cloud (c), prismatic
wall (a), prying eyes, greater (d), scintillating
pattern (i), symbol of death (n), symbol of insanity
(en)
9th level - prismatic sphere (a), refuge (c)

Support Specialist
Spells by Level
0 level - resistance (a)
1st level - endure elements (a), enlarge person (t),
expeditious retreat (t), jump (t), levitate (t), mage
armor (c), magic weapon (t), protection from
chaos/law/good/evil (a), shield (a), summon monster
I (c), truestrike (d)
2nd level - bear’s endurance (t), blur (i), bull’s strength
(t), cat’s grace (t), eagle’s splendor (t), fox’s cunning
(t), invisibility (i), mirror image (i), owl’s wisdom
(t), protection from arrows (a), resist energy (a),
spider climb (t), summon monster II (c)
3rd level - displacement (i), fly (t), gaseous form (t),
haste (t), heroism (en), invisibility sphere (i), keen
edge (t), magic circle vs. chaos/law/good/evil (a),
magic weapon, greater (t), protection from energy
(a), summon monster III (c)
4th level - enlarge person, mass (t), fire shield (ev),
globe of invulnerability, lesser (a), polymorph (t),
stoneskin (a), summon monster IV (c)
5th level - mage’s faithful hound (c), summon monster
V (c), teleport (c)
6th level - antimagic field (a), bear’s endurance, mass
(t), bull’s strength, mass (t), cat’s grace, mass (t),
eagle’s splendor, mass (t), fox’s cunning, mass (t),
globe of invulnerability (a), heroism, greater (en),
owl’s wisdom, mass (t), summon monster VI (c),
true seeing (d)
7th level - invisibility, mass (i), spell turning (a), statue
(t), summon monster VII (c), teleport, greater (c)
8th level - iron body (t), moment of prescience (d), protection
from spells (a), summon monster VIII (c)
9th level - foresight (d), freedom (a), shapechange (t),
summon monster IX (c), time stop (t)


Have fun!

[Captnq]

Oh, if you ever do finish it, I just might make a new appendix to The Spellbook.

[bekeleven]

Focus Specialist (Diviner) Shopkeeper Wizard pack. Assumes access to PHB and Spell Compendium. Bans Enchantment and Necromancy. Could be adapted to an Abjurer fairly easily.

1 - Identify, Comprehend Languages, Unseen Servant, Appraising Touch, Floating Disk
2 - Detect Thoughts, Locate Object, Arcane Lock, Misdirection
3 - Arcane Sight, Nondetection, Shrink Item, Tongues
4 - Detect Scrying, Fire Trap, Illusory Wall, Treasure Scent
5 - Mage's Private Sanctum, Permanency, Telepathic Bond, Zone of Respite
6 - Contingency, Analyze Dweomer, True Seeing, Guards and Wards
7 - Greater Teleport, Greater Arcane Sight, Phase Door, Greater Dispelling Screen
8 - Discern Location, Moment of Prescience, Mind Blank, Dimensional Lock
9 - Foresight, Hindsight, Refuge, Shades, Time Stop, Gate, Wish, Greater Spell Matrix

[Captnq]

I've been thinking about this, and I think for it to be useful there needs to be some general guidelines.

I don't think this is the "ultimate" spell list. Frankly, you can't be sure how many spells any given NPC/PC might have. So I would suggest that you limit the lists to the following:

A Normal Arcane Spell Pack is only two spells a level. This is because wizards max out at 4. Yes, they get many other spells from Int bonuses and other crap, but the goal is to distill it down to the BEST that this set of spells might be. What are the BEST tank spells? What are the BEST conjuration spells? Then the other spell slots can be filled based on the situation.

Or, if you are in a hurry, you can just grab another Arcane spell pack and stick them together. Fire Spell Pack and Tank Spell Pack. Transmuation and Necromancy. That sort of thing.

Domain Wizards get a "free" spell that is preset. You should pick the next two most obvious spells. Those two spells should stick with the "theme" of the domain.

Specialty wizards get an extra spell from the school they specialized in. So those lists should be three spells all from the chosen school.

By focusing on lists in such a fashion with the "best" that you can come up with, then it should be simple to just grab two or three lists based on what the encounter is. Select the best off your chosen lists based on what level your spellcaster is and how many bonus spells he has coming. Boom. Chances are you have a good spell selection with little work.


For example:

You have a 8th level necromancer. He's enacting his final evil plan and expects trouble. He picks Necromancy, Abjuration, and Movement spell packs. Mixing and matching, he's got some necromancy, good defenses, and the ability to run away if things go south.

You have a 6th level royal wizard who spends a great deal of time making invisibility potions. He has the Scholar and Illusionist Spell Pack. Since he isn't expecting combat, there's little need for anything else.

[johnbragg]

Excuse me, but I have had massive success with this pack. Post saying what you'd like to see, or just make your own packs and post them, rather than criticize me.

It's not that we want to criticize you, it's that we're not sure exactly what you're asking for in the thread. I have a campaign idea where spellbooks were actual books of 8-20 spells, organized thematically. So this could be a great thread for me. These spellpacks could be actual spellbooks, with flavorific names.

But we'd still need an answer why the Tome of Scholarly Spells has Shocking Grasp and I forget what else.

[Uby1234]

Updated Scholar Pack:

1st: Shocking Grasp, Identify, Tenser's Floating Disk, plus one of the following per point of Int modifier: Shield, Sleep, Detect Secret Doors, Color Spray, Ancient Knowledge, Nystul's Magic Aura.
2nd: Blur, Shatter, Arcane Lock, Levitate, Spectral Hand.
3rd: Dispel Magic, Arcane Sight, Major Image, Shrink Item, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Lightning Bolt, Amanuensis.
4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter, Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer.
5th: Rary's Telepathic Bond, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Teleport.
6th: Greater Dispel Magic, Analyze Dweomer, Programmed Image, Disintegrate.
7th: Teleport Object, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image, Spell Turning, Greater Arcane Sight.
8th: Polar Ray, Scintillating Pattern, Prismatic Wall, Power Word Stun.
9th: Astral Projection, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.

Happy?

[Story]

Polar Ray is still a bad spell, and it's not clear why the "Scholar" pack includes so many combat spells anyway.

Also, if you've got Amanuensis, then it's not Core only, so the continued omission of Scholar's Touch is pretty glaring. Plus Amanuensis is now a cantrip anyway (it got reprinted in SpC).

[eggynack]

Polar Ray is still a bad spell, and it's not clear why the "Scholar" pack includes so many combat spells anyway.

Indeed so. Even if these blasting spells were good, and they're not, it would still be illogical for them to be on a scholar's spell list. For example, what scholar would have something like shocking grasp over unseen servant, or comprehend languages, or even erase? Also, if you want blasting, explosive runes is sitting right there as a super thematically coherent defensive blasting spell.

[Uby1234]

Indeed so. Even if these blasting spells were good, and they're not, it would still be illogical for them to be on a scholar's spell list. For example, what scholar would have something like shocking grasp over unseen servant, or comprehend languages, or even erase? Also, if you want blasting, explosive runes is sitting right there as a super thematically coherent defensive blasting spell.

Now you're just trying to find ways to criticize me. I know that most blasting spells are pretty bad, and that they don't fit with a scholar pack, but combat is utterly unavoidable, no matter how many teleportation and fly spells you cast, so I was forced to put a few combat spells on the list.

[eggynack]

Now you're just trying to find ways to criticize me. I know that most blasting spells are pretty bad, and that they don't fit with a scholar pack, but combat is utterly unavoidable, no matter how many teleportation and fly spells you cast, so I was forced to put a few combat spells on the list.
Look, I don't know what you want here. Folks say things, and then I make fair and logical critiques of those things. You really don't have to take these things personally. It's basically the whole point, and it's how you end up with actually cool stuff. None of us are perfect, except maybe Urpriest. If you like, you can just keep all of these ideas in your head, safe from criticism. If you put yourself out there, you have to expect that not everyone's going to agree with the decisions you make.

As for your counterargument, a scholar is going to spend a lot of time in a scholarly place, completely uninvolved in combat. That's how they roll, and it's why they're scholars, instead of not-scholars. I'm not exactly sure how combat is utterly unavoidable if you just teleport away from it, and maybe have some defensive countermeasures against things stopping you from doing that. Even if you do want to be able to engage with enemies a bit, I can't see why you'd do it with big blasty spells. Scholars are passive and defensive, even in combat. At their most aggressive, they should be summoning something to do the fighting for them, so that they can get back to reading. More reasonably, they should be tossing up walls and other BFC's. Maybe a solid fog. Anything to keep folks away. Besides all of that, there are plenty of wizard builds that never ever touch blasting, primarily because they are suboptimal. If a wizard can exist who doesn't touch blasting, then a scholar would be one of them.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Mostly fixed:

1st: Shocking Grasp Magic Missile, Identify, Tenser's Floating Disk, plus one of the following per point of Int modifier: Shield, Sleep Comprehend Languages, Detect Secret Doors, Color Spray, Ancient Knowledge, Nystul's Magic Aura.
2nd: Blur, Shatter, Arcane Lock, Levitate Alter Self, Spectral Hand Rope Trick.
3rd: Dispel Magic, Arcane Sight, Major Image, Shrink Item, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Lightning Bolt, Amanuensis.
4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter, Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer.
5th: Rary's Telepathic Bond, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Teleport.
6th: Greater Dispel Magic, Analyze Dweomer, Programmed Image, Disintegrate.
7th: Teleport Object, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image, Spell Turning, Greater Arcane Sight.
8th: Polar Ray Horrid Wilting, Scintillating Pattern, Prismatic Wall, Power Word Stun.
9th: Astral Projection, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.

[eggynack]

Mostly fixed:

1st: Shocking Grasp Magic Missile, Identify, Tenser's Floating Disk, plus one of the following per point of Int modifier: Shield, Sleep Comprehend Languages, Detect Secret Doors, Color Spray, Ancient Knowledge, Nystul's Magic Aura.
2nd: Blur, Shatter, Arcane Lock, Levitate Alter Self, Spectral Hand Rope Trick.
3rd: Dispel Magic, Arcane Sight, Major Image, Shrink Item, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Lightning Bolt, Amanuensis.
4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter, Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer.
5th: Rary's Telepathic Bond, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Teleport.
6th: Greater Dispel Magic, Analyze Dweomer, Programmed Image, Disintegrate.
7th: Teleport Object, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image, Spell Turning, Greater Arcane Sight.
8th: Polar Ray Horrid Wilting, Scintillating Pattern, Prismatic Wall, Power Word Stun.
9th: Astral Projection, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.
I dunno if you even need the blasting spells you left there. There're tons of great first level spells that I'd take over magic missile, and that are thematically appropriate. In addition to what I've mentioned, there's also silent image, alarm, disguise self, and maybe obscuring mist. At third level, neither lightning bolt nor amanuensis belongs (the latter for spell level reasons). Some replacements could be nondetection, tongues, secret page, illusory script, and as I've mentioned, explosive runes.

Fourth level definitely needs a copy of resilient sphere, and maybe stuff like dimension door, and polymorph (just cause it's good). I don't really like horrid wilting all that much, so that level could use stuff like mind blank, dimensional lock, and maze. Maze actually seems really appropriate, because it's offensive, yet in a defensive way, and it relies on the target's intelligence. Very stylish. For other stuff, I'd probably replace blur and shatter. I like invisibility and mirror image for blur, and maybe a detect thoughts or web for shatter. That seems like a good start on how I'd configure a scholar list off of only core sources.

[Uby1234]

Polar Ray is still a bad spell, and it's not clear why the "Scholar" pack includes so many combat spells anyway.

Also, if you've got Amanuensis, then it's not Core only, so the continued omission of Scholar's Touch is pretty glaring. Plus Amanuensis is now a cantrip anyway (it got reprinted in SpC).

What IS Scholar's Touch?

[Uby1234]

There. Fully updated Scholar Pack based on your advice. DO NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT THE EVOCATIONS. THEY ARE ENTIRELY NECESSARY UNLESS YOU WANT TO DIE. :smallannoyed:


1st: Shocking Grasp, Identify, Amanuensis, plus one of the following per point of Int modifier: Shield, Sleep, Detect Secret Doors, Color Spray, Ancient Knowledge, Nystul's Magic Aura.
2nd: Blur, Shatter, Arcane Lock, Levitate, Spectral Hand.
3rd: Dispel Magic, Arcane Sight, Major Image, Shrink Item, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Lightning Bolt, Explosive Runes.
4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter, Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer.
5th: Rary's Telepathic Bond, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Teleport.
6th: Greater Dispel Magic, Analyze Dweomer, Programmed Image, Disintegrate.
7th: Teleport Object, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image, Spell Turning, Greater Arcane Sight.
8th: Polar Ray, Scintillating Pattern, Prismatic Wall, Power Word Stun.
9th: Astral Projection, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.

[Karnith]

What IS Scholar's Touch?
Here you go. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20041210b&page=2)

[Boci]

What IS Scholar's Touch?

Spell from complete adventurer I think. Allow you to read a book by touching it.

Edit: Okay that's the second time this has happened Karnith. My patience is wearing thin. :smallbiggrin:

[Karsoff]

The "Pew Pew" Pack
(And thanks to whoever created "The Spell Book"--I'm downloading it now which will probably let me make better spell packs: I like the application of using these for NPCs on the fly

0th: Acid Splash, Disrupt Undead
1st: Magic Missle, Ray of Enfeeblement
2nd: Ice Knife, Scorching Ray
3rd: Explosive Runes, Shadow Tentacle(Lesser)
4th: Orb of Force, Ice Storm
5th: Vitriolic Sphere, Resounding Thunder
6th: Acid Storm, Contingency
7th: Prismatic Spray, Simulacrum
8th: Shout (Greater), Shadow Evocation (Greater)
9th: Summon Monster IX, Energy Drain


This is supposed to focus on "blasty" spells with some "storm" sub-focus; It's not meant to be really optimized but if there's some more appropriate spells to add (or just some awful spells that shouldn't be) I'd appreciate the advice as I'm not too familiar with some of these spells but went by the descriptions in TSB. :smallsmile:

[Captnq]

Yer welcome.

And should I ever get the time, I plan on making the big list of Spell Packs myself and adding it to The SpellBook. I actually would enjoy non-optimized submissions. I think the spell packs should be more "theme-based" then combat-effective. True, the combat ones should be focused on combat, but on a patricular type of combat.


As a DM, it would be ever so helpful to say, "Hrm. I need a... acid based... schollar type... who is... grafting flesh and metal onto his body.

Well, If there was an Acid, Scholar, Flesh, Metal spellpack, I just narrowed down my likely list of spells he might have currently. I'm not bound by the list. It's just a suggestion, after all. But it's a quick and dirty suggestion that cuts down on my NPC creation time when I need to pull,

Marque de Zarko, Lord of Acid. "All Shall melt and join the Flesh Singularity!"

Out of my ass in 5 minutes.

So, yeah. Still watching. This thread is on my to do list. Armor handbook comes first. Working on the ASAs now.

[Fable Wright]

The Paranoia Pack

1st: Mage Armor, Nerveskitter, Shield
2nd: Invisibility, Rope Trick
3rd: Heart of Water, Greater Mage Armor
4th: Greater Mirror Image, Heart of Stone
5th: Teleport, Overland Flight
6th: Contingency, Greater Anticipate Teleport
7th: Greater Ironguard, Simulacrum
8th: Mindblank, Greater Plane Shift
9th: Astral Projection, Genesis

[Karsoff]

Yer welcome.

And should I ever get the time, I plan on making the big list of Spell Packs myself and adding it to The SpellBook. I actually would enjoy non-optimized submissions. I think the spell packs should be more "theme-based" then combat-effective. True, the combat ones should be focused on combat, but on a patricular type of combat.


As a DM, it would be ever so helpful to say, "Hrm. I need a... acid based... schollar type... who is... grafting flesh and metal onto his body.

Well, If there was an Acid, Scholar, Flesh, Metal spellpack, I just narrowed down my likely list of spells he might have currently. I'm not bound by the list. It's just a suggestion, after all. But it's a quick and dirty suggestion that cuts down on my NPC creation time when I need to pull,

Marque de Zarko, Lord of Acid. "All Shall melt and join the Flesh Singularity!"

Out of my ass in 5 minutes.

So, yeah. Still watching. This thread is on my to do list. Armor handbook comes first. Working on the ASAs now.

Yeah I think we have similar goals; Your method is pretty much what i had in mind for using these packs. If you have theme lists then you can grab and squish the ones you want together into one appropriate character in no time!

[Brookshw]

Yer welcome.

And should I ever get the time, I plan on making the big list of Spell Packs myself and adding it to The SpellBook. I actually would enjoy non-optimized submissions. I think the spell packs should be more "theme-based" then combat-effective. True, the combat ones should be focused on combat, but on a patricular type of combat.


As a DM, it would be ever so helpful to say, "Hrm. I need a... acid based... schollar type... who is... grafting flesh and metal onto his body.

Well, If there was an Acid, Scholar, Flesh, Metal spellpack, I just narrowed down my likely list of spells he might have currently. I'm not bound by the list. It's just a suggestion, after all. But it's a quick and dirty suggestion that cuts down on my NPC creation time when I need to pull,

Marque de Zarko, Lord of Acid. "All Shall melt and join the Flesh Singularity!"

Out of my ass in 5 minutes.

So, yeah. Still watching. This thread is on my to do list. Armor handbook comes first. Working on the ASAs now.

Personally I still think this would be a great resource and would cut down on prep time. For purposes of this thread I was thinking of writing a few up. For your puposes I'm assuming core only is lifted? I wouldn't mind doing a care then spoiling an alternative with non-core.

[Bovine Colonel]

There. Fully updated Scholar Pack based on your advice. DO NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT THE EVOCATIONS. THEY ARE ENTIRELY NECESSARY UNLESS YOU WANT TO DIE. :smallannoyed:


1st: Shocking Grasp, Identify, Amanuensis, plus one of the following per point of Int modifier: Shield, Sleep, Detect Secret Doors, Color Spray, Ancient Knowledge, Nystul's Magic Aura.
2nd: Blur, Shatter, Arcane Lock, Levitate, Spectral Hand.
3rd: Dispel Magic, Arcane Sight, Major Image, Shrink Item, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Lightning Bolt, Explosive Runes.
4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter, Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer.
5th: Rary's Telepathic Bond, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Teleport.
6th: Greater Dispel Magic, Analyze Dweomer, Programmed Image, Disintegrate.
7th: Teleport Object, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image, Spell Turning, Greater Arcane Sight.
8th: Polar Ray, Scintillating Pattern, Prismatic Wall, Power Word Stun.
9th: Astral Projection, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.
If you -really- want 1st, 3rd, and 8th level blasting spells, may I instead recommend Magic Missile (which doesn't require you to be in melee), Fireball (which doesn't require you to be within anywhere remotely near melee), and Twinned Orb of <something> (which does strictly more damage with no downside)?

EDIT: Wait, you have Color Spray on that list. Do you really need another low-level combat spell when you have Color Spray?

[Uby1234]

Here you go. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20041210b&page=2)

Hmmm. Interesting.

[molten_dragon]

YOU OFF YET? IF YOU NEED A METHOD OF SUICIDE, JUST GET DRAWMIJ'S INSTANT SUMMONS ON A GREATAXE, AND SWALLOW THE SAPPHIRE! OR WALK INTO A ROOM WITH 30 TARRASQUES AND A GREAT WYRM-WITH NO EQUIPMENT! OR WALK UNDER A CONVOY OF HEROES WHILE CARRYING BARRELS OF EXPLOSIVE OIL! OR MAYBE TRY AND NOT BE AN IDIOT! YOU'D PROBABLY DIE FROM TRYING THAT!
:smallfurious::smallfurious::smallfurious:

Do you have some odd form of tourette's that manifests itself when you type?

On the topic of the OP, These actually seem like they'd be pretty handy for creating quick NPC casters, but they could be improved upon quite a bit.

1. Include at least 4 spells per level so the DM doesn't have to spend as much time picking spells.
2. Include sources outside of core.
3. Include an intended optimization level with each spell pack. Some DM's may want more heavily optimized casters than others.

[TaiLiu]

There. Fully updated Scholar Pack based on your advice. DO NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT THE EVOCATIONS. THEY ARE ENTIRELY NECESSARY UNLESS YOU WANT TO DIE. :smallannoyed:
The best way to avoid death, especially as a fragile scholar unfamiliar with combat, is to leave the area of potential danger.

[molten_dragon]

Here's a list for a mid-to-high op malconvoker. This is actually taken from an NPC I created, so it's what she had prepared that day rather than what's in her spellbook, and includes an INT of 32, but it's something.

Level 1: Nerveskitter, Summon Monster 1, Silent Image, Grease, Benign transposition, Ray of clumsiness, Shield, Wall of smoke.
Level 2: Summon monster 2, create magic tattoo, web, glitterdust, scintillating scales, invisibility, mirror image
Level 3: Greater mage armor, summon monster 3, dispel magic, alter fortune, battlemagic perception, heart of water, dimension step, stinking cloud, mass resist energy
Level 4: Greater invisibility, summon monster 4, celerity, assay spell resistance, heart of earth, dimension door
Level 5: summon monster 5, teleport, draconic polymorph, dimension shuffle, telekinesis, greater enlarge person, greater blink
Level 6: Summon monster 6, freezing fog, brilliant blade, true seeing, greater dispelling, acid storm
Level 7: Summon monster 7, choking cobwebs, greater teleport, mass invisibility, glass strike, elemental body
Level 8: Summon monster 8: Incendiary cloud, moment of prescience, mind blank, polymorph any object
Level 9: Summon monster 9, sphere of ultimate destruction, time stop.

[Fable Wright]

1. Include at least 4 spells per level so the DM doesn't have to spend as much time picking spells.

I disagree with this one. I like having it at 2 spells per level to make it easy to mix and match the different packs to get a character. So, you make a Scholar's pack with zero offensive capability that you pair with an offensive pack, say, Summoning to get a planar scholar pack. Mix and match stuff.

(This is, Uby1234, why people are complaining about offensive spells added to the Scholar pack. You can get damage and battlefield control spells from packs that aren't supposed to be solely about learning stuff. The packs are not supposed to be a Wizard's entire spell list, only half of it focused on one particular aspect of the Wizard.)

[eggynack]

(This is, Uby1234, why people are complaining about offensive spells added to the Scholar pack. You can get damage and battlefield control spells from packs that aren't supposed to be solely about learning stuff. The packs are not supposed to be a Wizard's entire spell list, only half of it focused on one particular aspect of the Wizard.)
Actually, the reason I'm complaining is that it makes no sense. If you're going to concoct a spell list, then I figure that the spells on that list have to be one of two things. They either have to be thematically appropriate, because that's the whole point of this thing, or they have to be optimal, to keep you alive long enough to cast the thematically appropriate spells. Polar ray, a spell that is neither thematically appropriate nor optimal, has no place on a scholar's list. By contrast, a spell like maze is both thematically appropriate and reasonably optimal, and is thus fitting on such a list.

I should put together some kinda druid thing, by the by. Maybe some kinda urban druid, to fit the whole cityscape thing. You'd obviously get some of the spells from cityscape itself, like impeding stones, but there'd also be some of the more utility and divination stuff, and maybe some stuff like summon swarm. Also, did you guys know that summon swarm can get a murder of crows (ToM, 87)? It's a cool thing.

[Rastapopolos]

Seconding DMofDarkness' point, also I think the objective of this thread needs to be clarified before it gets anymore intense. OP are you intending this list to be; ALL of the spells a wizard has memorised (your first list is very short)? In thier spellbook (ALOT shorter)? A sample of spells that a wizard should consider taking if they want to specialise in a particular area (byfar the most interesting topic for me, however if this is the case then there shouldnt be much "overlap" between packs because im gonna be taking a couple)? Or a sorcerers known spells (in which case your gonna need a much more generalist selection because as you say "THEY ARE ENTIRELY NECESSARY UNLESS YOU WANT TO DIE"). These things make a massive difference when one is trying to put together such a list.

My instinct is that when you posted a "scholar" spell pack that was way under what a wizard could memorize by the time he got to lvl9 spells that people assumed that this was somthing that could be used to supplement thier own research to pick spells, therefore the "blasting" spells you picked could have been replaced with something more relevant to the topic.

[eggynack]

I'ma make a new post for this, cause it'll probably take up some room. There are four spells of each level, and the main motifs are vermin, sickening, stone, and cold, with out of combat utility and SoD's on there as needed. Additionally, this druid is hanging out on the deep end of the alignment pool, and thus touches into some BoVD stuff. He could also technically be neutral, cause corrupt spells are weird like that, but I'm staying away from good stuff as a general rule, even though rain of black tulips would be amazing on there. Note that earthquake would probably fit fine on the list, and it's not like it'd be replacing anything particularly great, but I can't in good conscience put it on there, because oreads are giving you the spell two levels early. Anyways, here's the list.

The Urban Druid Spell Pack:

Orisons: create water, detect magic, mending, detect poison

Level One: impeding stones, spiderhand, wall of smoke, wood wose

Level Two: blinding spittle, bite of the wererat, summon swarm, mass snake's swiftness

Level Three: stoneshape, touch of the juiblex, wall of vermin, whispering sand

Level Four: passage of the shifting sands, poison vines, scrying, wall of salt

Level Five: blackwater tentacle, blizzard, dire hunger, insect plague

Level Six: antilife shell, greater dispel magic, mummify, scalding mud

Level Seven: death by thorns, master earth, pestilence, true seeing

Level Eight: deadfall, fimbulwinter, frostfell, red tide

Level Nine: antipathy, elemental swarm, shambler, shapechange

[Story]

DO NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT THE EVOCATIONS. THEY ARE ENTIRELY NECESSARY UNLESS YOU WANT TO DIE. :smallannoyed:

This simply isn't true. I'm currently playing a Conjurer who banned Evocation and he's never even come close to death despite us playing a module designed for parties three levels higher.

Polymorph is pretty much one of the best combat spells there is, and it's even thematically appropriate for a scholar. Plus it has massive out of combat utility too.

[Karsoff]

Personally I still think this would be a great resource and would cut down on prep time. For purposes of this thread I was thinking of writing a few up. For your puposes I'm assuming core only is lifted? I wouldn't mind doing a care then spoiling an alternative with non-core.

I think having core and non-core versions is a good idea. Although thanks to captnq I don't see why we can't expand outside non-core with all those other spells readily available


EDIT (on account of triple-posting): Oh, captnq, would you be willing to do a similar project for psionics? Or perhaps there already is one? I'll PM you this request also (hope that's okay). :smallbiggrin:

[Karsoff]

Defensive-Escape Spell Pack (aka the "I'm too scared to die!" pack)

0th: Silent Portal, Message
1st: Alarm, Expeditious Retreat
2nd: Dimension Hop, Fog Cloud
3rd: Fly, Invisibility Sphere
4th: Dimension Door, Greater Invisibility
5th: Magic Jar, Teleport
6th: (Stilled) Swift Etherealness, Contingency
7th: Greater Teleport, Plane Shift
8th: Clone, Celerity (Greater)
9th: Gate, Time Stop

Once again I'm open to any suggestions/advice; I was going for a moderately optimal setup of escape spells/escape plans but I may have missed some good choices.

[eggynack]

Well, resilient sphere is a bit of a classic, and astral projection might be one of the best defensive spells in the game. Also, if out of core spells are in the running, I've always been a fan of gemjump. Benign transposition too.

[Karsoff]

What's gemjump do, if you don't mind? And Resilient sphere isn't something I"ve had much personal experience with but I agree it might have a place: although I was thinking of this being a more escape-oriented pack and then doing a "non-escape" oriented defense pack that ran with walls and barriers and the like but maybe merging them would be a more appealing pack altogether (as I know some of my choices got redundant/less optimal)


Also, I found a powers list (not quite as comprehensive as captnq's spell one, I believe, but pretty good at first glance):

http://mnemnosyne.com/D&D%20Stuff/

There's a .csv, excel, and htm version (although the htm version doesn't seem to have abbreviated spell descriptions)

[eggynack]

What's gemjump do, if you don't mind?
It's a 6th level spell that makes a gem which you can teleport to once as a standard action. The whole thing gives off the aura of being a sort of fixed teleport, because you have to plan out destinations in advance.


And Resilient sphere isn't something I"ve had much personal experience with but I agree it might have a place: although I was thinking of this being a more escape-oriented pack and then doing a "non-escape" oriented defense pack that ran with walls and barriers and the like but maybe merging them would be a more appealing pack altogether (as I know some of my choices got redundant/less optimal)
I can feel it, but I figure that resilient sphere has some escape worked in there too. It's incredibly defensively minded, whereas other barrier type spells might have more tactical applications. It's mostly just about giving yourself some room to breathe, and maybe come up with a more long term plan.

[Story]

Heart of Water is a really good escape spell.

[Karsoff]

You've made some good points eggynack (and your's is a good suggestion too, story) so I've made some changes:

Defensive-Escape (2.0) Spell Pack (aka the "I'm too scared to die!" pack)

0th: Silent Portal, Message
1st: Alarm, Expeditious Retreat
2nd: Dimension Hop, Invisibility
3rd: Fly, Heart of Water
4th: Dimension Door, Resilient Sphere
5th: Magic Jar, Teleport
6th: Gemjump, Contingency
7th: Greater Teleport, Plane Shift
8th: Clone, Celerity (Greater)
9th: Gate, Astral Projection

Thanks for the help :smallsmile:

[Sith_Happens]

EDIT: Wait, you have Color Spray on that list. Do you really need another low-level combat spell when you have Color Spray?

From my experience, when you're hitting three enemies with the same Color Spray, one of them is going to save.

[eggynack]

From my experience, when you're hitting three enemies with the same Color Spray, one of them is going to save.
I'm inclined to think that the solution to that problem is a second color spray, or some other thing that doesn't deal damage. It's not like the spell you use in case the first one failed has to be a magic missile or something.

[Sith_Happens]

I'm inclined to think that the solution to that problem is a second color spray,

You know, I had literally just come back here to add that line to my post. Sneaky ninjas.:smalltongue:

[eggynack]

You know, I had literally just come back here to add that line to my post. Sneaky ninjas.:smalltongue:
I am everywhere you want to be, Sith_Happens. You would do well to learn that. :smallbiggrin:

[Uby1234]

HAPPY? :smallannoyed:
I've removed the blasting spells.

FINAL Scholar Spell Pack:

1st: Scholar's Touch, Identify, Amanuensis, Shield, Sleep, Detect Secret Doors, Color Spray, Ancient Knowledge, Nystul's Magic Aura.

2nd: Blur, Shatter, Arcane Lock, Levitate, Spectral Hand.

3rd: Dispel Magic, Arcane Sight, Major Image, Shrink Item, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Sepia Snake Sigil, Explosive Runes.

4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter, Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer.

5th: Rary's Telepathic Bond, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Teleport.

6th: Greater Dispel Magic, Analyze Dweomer, Programmed Image, Disintegrate.

7th: Teleport Object, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image, Spell Turning, Greater Arcane Sight.

8th: Discern Location, Scintillating Pattern, Prismatic Wall, Power Word Stun.

9th: Astral Projection, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.

[eggynack]

HAPPY? :smallannoyed:

Marginally. I mean, it's certainly a lot closer to what a scholarly spell pack would entail. Amanuensis is actually a zeroth level spell though. You could always find random flaws in the spell pack I put together, if that would make you happy. You'd probably have to look through a bunch of obscure sources, because my ability to find obscure druid spells is nigh on limitless, but it could be worth it if it would restore your peace of mind.

[Uby1234]

Do you have some odd form of tourette's that manifests itself when you type?

HEY!

(And I thought everyone had stopped fussing about that incident.)

[eggynack]

(And I thought everyone had stopped fussing about that incident.)
But then you did a bunch of other similar things. It's hard to take a, "Let's all move past this, and progress into a brighter future together," seriously when you keep doing the thing in question. Perhaps it's a bit less so now, because that was a pretty crazy thing to live up to in subsequent posts, but it's still an ongoing issue.

[Uby1234]

But then you did a bunch of other similar things. It's hard to take a, "Let's all move past this, and progress into a brighter future together," seriously when you keep doing the thing in question. Perhaps it's a bit less so now, because that was a pretty crazy thing to live up to in subsequent posts, but it's still an ongoing issue.

Sure, there have been a few fairly minor things since the incident, but it has happened with far less frequency. The rude posts have been deleted.

[Uby1234]

FINAL Scholar Spell Pack:

1st: Scholar's Touch, Identify, Comprehend Languages, Shield, Sleep, Detect Secret Doors, Color Spray, Ancient Knowledge, Nystul's Magic Aura.

2nd: Blur, Shatter, Arcane Lock, Levitate, Spectral Hand.

3rd: Dispel Magic, Arcane Sight, Major Image, Shrink Item, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, Sepia Snake Sigil, Explosive Runes.

4th: Scrying, Secure Shelter, Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer.

5th: Rary's Telepathic Bond, Prying Eyes, Secret Chest, Teleport.

6th: Greater Dispel Magic, Analyze Dweomer, Programmed Image, Disintegrate.

7th: Teleport Object, Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, Project Image, Spell Turning, Greater Arcane Sight.

8th: Discern Location, Scintillating Pattern, Prismatic Wall, Power Word Stun.

9th: Astral Projection, Mordenkainen's Disjunction, Wish.

There, I removed amanuensis and replaced it with Comprehend Languages.

[eggynack]

Seems workable. I'd replace something like power word: stun with something like maze, both because it's better, and because it feels more scholarish. How can you beat a spell that basically defeats your opponent by giving them a test? You can't, is the answer. Super classy. I should come up with more druid things, by the by, because druids are cool, and it's nice to make use of my crazy druid knowledge in a visible manner. Maybe some sort of exaltedish druid, or something like that. I'm always open to suggestions.

[Red Rubber Band]

Just dropping in to say this is a really, really good idea. Thanks, Uby!

It makes creating a caster much less intimidating (along with Captq's spell list).

[Uby1234]

Seems workable. I'd replace something like power word: stun with something like maze, both because it's better, and because it feels more scholarish. How can you beat a spell that basically defeats your opponent by giving them a test? You can't, is the answer. Super classy. I should come up with more druid things, by the by, because druids are cool, and it's nice to make use of my crazy druid knowledge in a visible manner. Maybe some sort of exaltedish druid, or something like that. I'm always open to suggestions.

This is completely unrelated, but rangers are WAY better than druids.

[Maginomicon]

This is completely unrelated, but rangers are WAY better than druids.
You mean in terms of "coolness factor"? Because if you're talking about raw power then... there's likely a massive number of people here that would like to have words with you.

[Uby1234]

This simply isn't true. I'm currently playing a Conjurer who banned Evocation and he's never even come close to death despite us playing a module designed for parties three levels higher.

Polymorph is pretty much one of the best combat spells there is, and it's even thematically appropriate for a scholar. Plus it has massive out of combat utility too.

And the reason you haven't died is likely because Lesser Orbs and Orbs are conjurations.

[eggynack]

This is completely unrelated, but rangers are WAY better than druids.
I guess on standards of being far less powerful. Rangers are way better at that. Apart from that, I can't think of much that rangers do better.

Edit:
And the reason you haven't died is likely because Lesser Orbs and Orbs are conjurations.
I think you vastly overestimate how critical blasting is to the functioning of wizards. I'm pretty sure that plenty of wizards get by with just about no blasting at all, orb or otherwise. If you want to claim that you like blasting, then you can do that, but people who aren't you can get by perfectly fine without them.

[Uby1234]

You mean in terms of "coolness factor"? Because if you're talking about raw power then... there's likely a massive number of people here that would like to have words with you.

I mean in terms of flavor and coolness. I mostly like them because of Combat Style and the fact that they can fill the same role as a fighter or paladin without being totally lame.

[Uby1234]

I guess on standards of being far less powerful. Rangers are way better at that. Apart from that, I can't think of much that rangers do better.

Edit:
I think you vastly overestimate how critical blasting is to the functioning of wizards. I'm pretty sure that plenty of wizards get by with just about no blasting at all, orb or otherwise. If you want to claim that you like blasting, then you can do that, but people who aren't you can get by perfectly fine without them.

And all wizards will need some sort of damaging spell if they have the intention of being useful to the party, but I definitely see your point.

[eggynack]

I mean in terms of flavor and coolness. I mostly like them because of Combat Style and the fact that they can fill the same role as a fighter or paladin without being totally lame.
Ah. I guess I can't claim that druids are objectively way cooler than rangers. Except I totally can. Druids are just objectively way cooler than rangers. Straight up objective fact right there. They cast better spells, and they fight better, because druids trivialize the very existence of rangers in every way that matters.

[eggynack]

And all wizards will need some sort of damaging spell if they have the intention of being useful to the party, but I definitely see your point.
You're really stuck on the idea of damage being the only measure of usefulness. It's not true, and you're wrong. Just read a spell like black tentacles, and see how it can just shut down an encounter. Do the same with solid fog, or even silent image. You don't need to do damage to be insanely useful. I get the impression from your posting that you understand little about the balance of this game.

[bekeleven]

And all wizards will need some sort of damaging spell if they have the intention of being useful to the party, but I definitely see your point.

Although damage spells are a lot of run, there are other ways to contribute to a party. One guide explaining this is the batman wizard (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104002).

The short version is that if you damage an opponent with damage lower than his max HP, he's still up and 100% as damaging to you. Therefore the most effective forms of combat are either to deal ludicrous damage in one round (see: uberchargers, often build off of a barbarian or paladin base), or to avoid HP damage entirely. Examples include glitterdust (AoE blind, taking most forms of enemies out of the fight for multiple rounds while you mop up their friends then whack them to death), black tentacles (AoE grapple enemies while... the same things happen), wall of force/forcecage (same deal), etc. etc. etc.

Basically, high-op "rocket tag" gameplay ends up in the paradigm where if you can't deal with an enemy in one round, then they deal with you in one round and you're toast. Wizards are actually one of the worse classes for blasting - not that they're bad, because they're still wizards - but it's not their forte. Generally save-or-suck (finger of death), touch-and-suck (shivering touch), or no-save-just-suck (solid fog, forcecage) are the preferred methods of a wizard contributing to combat, with alternate spells prepared in case of emergencies (spells targeting all three saves, targeting grapple checks with tentacles or summoned beasts, targeting int with Maze, etc.)

Basically, have the arsenal to disable all enemies instantly and the knowledge to always use the right one. As opposed to throwing fireball at level 10 and dealing a whopping 35 damage to some people.