#680: "But it might be worth asking around in this new place that's--"

[Gift Jeraff]

Panel Nine (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0680.html)

What was that all about? Worldbuilding? Foreshadowing the Linear Guild's divination front? Something that's still yet to pay off? A reference that flew over my head?

I must know the truth.

[jidasfire]

Probably a reference to the Empire of Blood, or one of its contemporaries in the Sweat and Tears department.

[DiamondHooHaMan]

fairly sure it's NPC shopkeeper dialog and not much else, although Z was going around pretending to be a psychic so maybe that woman thought it was a place that could help?

might be reading too much into things there.

[ChristianSt]

I think it is only a flavourful reference that there is a new place - since there is often enough a new place with the ongoing wars/shifting borders/new kingdoms.

[Mike Havran]

The shopkeeper probably didn't mean any Empires - they are not very new, at least from her point of view - but she might mean the company she gets the maps from. And I suspect the company being supervised by Kilkil.

[AKA_Bait]

That... is an excellent question. I have no idea. It sounded to me like she was going to suggest that they check another shop. It could be a lead into some bonus material in the next book maybe?

[DaggerPen]

I'd figured she was referring to one of the Empires that's taken over the general region.

[Bulldog Psion]

Immediately before that, she's listing empires and kingdoms. This thought is clearly continuing the previous one -- "a Cruelvania, and two Despotanias, East and West. But it might be worth asking around in this new place that's--"

Seems singularly non-mysterious to me. :smallconfused:

[Purgatorius]

I think she is trying to help Haley in her search, by suggesting another shop she can look into – perhaps one with history books or something.
It is very unlikely that this shop is Zzdtri's and Sabine's fortune teller shop, since they must have had that in Bleedingham, Empire of Blood, and Haley and the cartographer is in Sandsedge, quite far away from that.

I find "NPC shopkeeper dialog and not much else" to be the most plausible theory yet, I'm afraid.

[thereaper]

Remember, Rich is not a huge fan of the Law of Conservation of Detail.

[rs2excelsior]

The shopkeeper had been talking about empires, but with respect to Haley's question about why she can't find the country she's looking for. Something along the lines of "I don't have the map you want (because of [reasons]), but you might try this new store that just opened..." I seriously doubt she's talking about going to a newly formed nation just to find a map. And I doubt a cartography shop, no matter how extensive their archives of maps, is likely to be plot-critical.

Though if anyone could pull it off, it'd be the Giant. :smallwink:

[Fish]

She was about to say "--this new place that just opened up, Starshinia, which was founded by a red-headed aasimar, but was just taken over by an Azurite fallen paladin turned blackguard. Apropos of nothing, I hear they just invented a new spell called Halflings Don't Have To Breathe."

[thatSeniorGuy]

She was about to say "--this new place that just opened up, Starshinia, which was founded by a red-headed aasimar, but was just taken over by an Azurite fallen paladin turned blackguard. Apropos of nothing, I hear they just invented a new spell called Halflings Don't Have To Breathe."

May I sig this Fish? This is just full of awesomeness :smallbiggrin:

[Fish]

Sure! If you can make it fit ... :)

[Benthesquid]

"taken over a bunch of territory, recently. It's called The Empire of Blood."

[Gift Jeraff]

"taken over a bunch of territory, recently. It's called The Empire of Blood."

The Empire of Blood is 2 years old, and the shopkeeper even says "'Two years ago' is ancient history around here," so I don't see how that can be considered a new place.

[davidbofinger]

The Empire of Blood is 2 years old, and the shopkeeper even says "'Two years ago' is ancient history around here," so I don't see how that can be considered a new place.

Could it be, "This new chancellor/warlord/priest/whatever they have in the Empire of Blood"? Or do we know they'd been there at least two years?

[Bedinsis]

"...called People's Democratic Dictatorship. Their capital has a library that is famous for stocking old documents, so they might have a map where Tyrinaria is still present."

Maybe?

[Gift Jeraff]

Could it be, "This new chancellor/warlord/priest/whatever they have in the Empire of Blood"? Or do we know they'd been there at least two years?

Malack and Tarquin both mention being there 2 years ago:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0719.html
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0725.html

Kilkil may be somewhat new (he said Nale "must be an older bounty" because he was unfamiliar with him), but the shopkeeper says new place).

[The Giant]

The best part is that I don't even remember what she was referring to. I think maybe it was supposed to be foreshadowing for the Empires, but the timing is off...but I may just not have had the timeframe locked in yet in my mind. As in, I may have (at the time of that strip) thought that the Empire of Blood was newer and that there was another name between Tyrinaria and Empire of Blood that I subsequently decided against and/or forgot about by the time I got to Tarquin's exposition. Who knows?


She was about to say "--this new place that just opened up, Starshinia, which was founded by a red-headed aasimar, but was just taken over by an Azurite fallen paladin turned blackguard. Apropos of nothing, I hear they just invented a new spell called Halflings Don't Have To Breathe."

You forgot that the half-orc cleric who researched it is Redcloak's niece.

[Doug Lampert]

Remember, Rich is not a huge fan of the Law of Conservation of Detail.

More to the point, the law of Conservation of Detail is most relevant to short works. Checkov's LONG works were three act plays, any ONE of the Order of the Stick books has more text (never mind pictures) than any of them. It makes sense for Checkov to say that if you hang a gun on the wall in act one it needs to be used by act three, because he was telling a story in as little as a few hundred words, you simply can't do that and add lots of extraneous details.

Rich is telling a story in 10 or so BOOKS, he can and should include lots of little indications that the world is bigger than what's shown on panel.



She was about to say "--this new place that just opened up, Starshinia, which was founded by a red-headed aasimar, but was just taken over by an Azurite fallen paladin turned blackguard. Apropos of nothing, I hear they just invented a new spell called Halflings Don't Have To Breathe."

You forgot that the half-orc cleric who researched it is Redcloak's niece.

True. Remembering to include this sort of detail is why Rich is the master and we are but students who sit in awe before his feet.

Now that Rich has CONFIRMED that Redcloak's neice is definitely a half-orc rather than a goblin we can start discussing the VITAL information about the comic's future that this gives us!

[Reddish Mage]

More to the point, the law of Conservation of Detail is most relevant to short works. Checkov's LONG works were three act plays, any ONE of the Order of the Stick books has more text (never mind pictures) than any of them. It makes sense for Checkov to say that if you hang a gun on the wall in act one it needs to be used by act three, because he was telling a story in as little as a few hundred words, you simply can't do that and add lots of extraneous details.

Rich is telling a story in 10 or so BOOKS, he can and should include lots of little indications that the world is bigger than what's shown on panel.



True. Remembering to include this sort of detail is why Rich is the master and we are but students who sit in awe before his feet.

Now that Rich has CONFIRMED that Redcloak's neice is definitely a half-orc rather than a goblin we can start discussing the VITAL information about the comic's future that this gives us!

Lol. She's obviously half-orc, half-goblin. Notice how well white goes together with that blue cursor outline?

[Gift Jeraff]

Well, we have no real timeframe on the Empire of Sweat (it's as old as Roy's map, at least), so we can pretend she was alluding one of the Empires, just not the right one. (It was her first time on-screen, cut her some slack for getting her foreshadowing wrong!)

[Bulldog Psion]

You forgot that the half-orc cleric who researched it is Redcloak's niece.

Half-orc? Man, that's going to start a million rumors if this leaks out to the forum in general. :smallbiggrin:

[NerdyKris]

He's referring to the Therkla threads where people would ask if she could be Red Cloak's niece, forgetting that she was a half orc and not a goblin, isn't he?

[Doug Lampert]

He's referring to the Therkla threads where people would ask if she could be Red Cloak's niece, forgetting that she was a half orc and not a goblin, isn't he?

Nonsense. I'll freely admit that there were a number of people who claimed that Therkla was Red Cloak's niece totally ignoring the complete lack of evidence for that position, and the strong evidence against. These people deserve a certain amount of ridicule.

But the Giant hasn't said that AT ALL, the half-orc he's talking about is TOTALLY different, as she's a wizard and is researching spells and actually is Redcloak's niece.

I don't see how you plan to fit in with forum speculation if given the SOLID evidence of a professional liar author saying something as a joke you're not willing to spin elaborate theories out of almost nothing.

I'm just surprised he didn't find a way to fit in the apparently obvious to many fact that Ian is going to show up again in the comic in the current scene for no apparent reason. (How would he get there? Who knows? Why would he get there? Who knows? How did he even know that there is there? Who knows? None of this is important, Ian will show up soon. The forums have spoken.)

Edited to add: Next thing you know you'll be saying that Belkar will most probably die at the climax at the fifth gate, and that's crazy talk.

[brionl]

He's referring to the Therkla threads where people would ask if she could be Red Cloak's niece, forgetting that she was a half orc and not a goblin, isn't he?

Half-orc/Half-goblin?

[Gift Jeraff]

But the Giant hasn't said that AT ALL, the half-orc he's talking about is TOTALLY different, as she's a wizard and is researching spells and actually is Redcloak's niece.

No, she's a cleric, and probably the same cleric who was a friend of Old Blind Pete, and possibly carrying Durkon's baby.

[malloyd]

Half-orc/Half-goblin?

That's obvious nonsense. She must be half human, since her mother was clearly Girard in disguise.

[Sunken Valley]

You forgot that the half-orc cleric who researched it is Redcloak's niece.

You Lie! Redcloak's Niece is only 15, far too young. The Half-Orc Cleric is clearly Fyron's son, who is also a lich so as to be more like the one who killed him, Xykon.

[DaggerPen]

You forgot that the half-orc cleric who researched it is Redcloak's niece.

Hilgya is a half-orc? I wonder what that makes her and Durkon's baby, then.

:P

[Doug Lampert]

No, she's a cleric, and probably the same cleric who was a friend of Old Blind Pete, and possibly carrying Durkon's baby.

You're right, she is stated to be a cleric. And for forum theory purposes this is compelling evidence that she was also Brainy Pete's friend. And of course all female clerics are Hilya in disquise and carrying Durkon's baby.

It all fits now.