Making scrolls a different type.

[Xuldarinar]

Simply, my question is as follows: Is there any way to craft a magic item, such as a scroll, to contain a spell or similar effect but of a different source?

For example, a wizard creating a divine scroll of a wizard spell, or a cleric creating an arcane scroll of a cleric spell.

If so, how far does this extend? Could arcane/divine spells be made into mystery scrolls and visa versa? Could powers be imbued into scrolls as arcane/divine, or spells be imbued into power stones as powers?

[Curmudgeon]

Not really. Even with crafting help from a different type of spellcaster (say a Cleric supplying a divine spell for a Wizard), a scroll scriber can only make a scroll of a spell they also know (i.e., it has to be on both arcane and divine spell lists).
Benefit: You can create a scroll of any spell that you know.

[Radar]

I've dug out an Archivist handbook (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=185.msg613#msg613), which contains a variety of ways of obtaining arcane spells as divine. Feats like Alternate Spell Source allow one to do it the other way around as well.

Aside from that, Spell-to-Power Erudite explicitly converts spells to powers (that's right there in the name of the variant), which means, he can create appropriate psionic items.

I don't know of anything else at the moment aside from the fact, that Warlock and Artificer can craft a scroll of any spell that exists without knowing the spell in question, shich might come in handy.

[Xuldarinar]

Not really. Even with crafting help from a different type of spellcaster (say a Cleric supplying a divine spell for a Wizard), a scroll scriber can only make a scroll of a spell they also know (i.e., it has to be on both arcane and divine spell lists).


I've dug out an Archivist handbook (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=185.msg613#msg613), which contains a variety of ways of obtaining arcane spells as divine. Feats like Alternate Spell Source allow one to do it the other way around as well.

Aside from that, Spell-to-Power Erudite explicitly converts spells to powers (that's right there in the name of the variant), which means, he can create appropriate psionic items.

I don't know of anything else at the moment aside from the fact, that Warlock and Artificer can craft a scroll of any spell that exists without knowing the spell in question, shich might come in handy.

Thank you so far.

I'll just assume there is no Power-to-Spell Wizard or anything like that (though, oh how I wish..).

Hmm.. if an Artificer so desired and had the materials, could they create an (Arcane) Miracle scroll or a (Divine) Wish scroll?

[Radar]

Thank you so far.

I'll just assume there is no Power-to-Spell Wizard or anything like that (though, oh how I wish..).

Hmm.. if an Artificer so desired and had the materials, could they create an (Arcane) Miracle scroll or a (Divine) Wish scroll?
1. I don't know of any way to convert powers to spells sadly.
2. Tough question actually. I guess that yes, since such scrolls can be made in other ways. In general Artificers and Warlocks can wave some requirements for item creation away, but those items still have to be possible to make in the first place.

Keep in mind, that this will only help Archivists, because of their unusually worded spell list (they can learn any divine spell). Wizards on the other hand can only learn spells from their own list and can't for example abuse Haste as a 1st level spell.

[johnbragg]

So, when we had the Wizard with Scribe Scroll and the cleric with Cure Light Wounds work together on that scroll of 8 Cure Light Wounds spells, we were houseruling?

[Keneth]

So, when we had the Wizard with Scribe Scroll and the cleric with Cure Light Wounds work together on that scroll of 8 Cure Light Wounds spells, we were houseruling?

That would work in Pathfinder, but 3.5 RAW prohibit it afaik.

[fishyfishyfishy]

So, when we had the Wizard with Scribe Scroll and the cleric with Cure Light Wounds work together on that scroll of 8 Cure Light Wounds spells, we were houseruling?

Short answer: yes.

Slightly longer answer: unless you have a specific class feature that trumps the general rule, you can only scribe a scroll of a spell that appears on your spell list. A wizard cannot scribe a divine scroll. Arcane scrolls of cure wounds come from bards, not wizards working together with clerics.

[Xuldarinar]

1. I don't know of any way to convert powers to spells sadly.
2. Tough question actually. I guess that yes, since such scrolls can be made in other ways. In general Artificers and Warlocks can wave some requirements for item creation away, but those items still have to be possible to make in the first place.

Keep in mind, that this will only help Archivists, because of their unusually worded spell list (they can learn any divine spell). Wizards on the other hand can only learn spells from their own list and can't for example abuse Haste as a 1st level spell.

1. I don't know either.

2. That makes sense. I'd pose the question, a natural follow up, if things alike mysteries could be made into divine/arcane spells by the same function.

I wouldn't say it necessarily would only help archivists, but it would be the greatest help to them. Though, I think erudites also stand to gain.

[Radar]

2. That makes sense. I'd pose the question, a natural follow up, if things alike mysteries could be made into divine/arcane spells by the same function.
I don't know of any way of changing mysteries into anything else - that's the problem with obscure systems. Neither Souther Magician nor Alternative Spell Source feats affect anything else then divine or arcane spells.

I wouldn't say it necessarily would only help archivists, but it would be the greatest help to them. Though, I think erudites also stand to gain.
True, I forgot StP Erudites can learn any arcane spell.

[Harrow]

Artificer scrolls are neither Arcane nor Divine. This was added in errata to prevent an artificer from teaming up with a Wizard to give the Wizard every spell known because Wizards can only add Arcane spells to their spellbook.

[Radar]

Artificer scrolls are neither Arcane nor Divine. This was added in errata to prevent an artificer from teaming up with a Wizard to give the Wizard every spell known because Wizards can only add Arcane spells to their spellbook.
It still works with the Warlock I guess. One correction though: Wizards don't get to learn every arcane spell anyway - they can only learn spells from their specific list, which for example excludes several Sorcerer-only spells as well as Trapsmith, Bard or Suel Arcanamach spells.

There are few classes, which have all arcane or all divine spells available.

[Harrow]

It still works with the Warlock I guess. One correction though: Wizards don't get to learn every arcane spell anyway - they can only learn spells from their specific list, which for example excludes several Sorcerer-only spells as well as Trapsmith, Bard or Suel Arcanamach spells.

There are few classes, which have all arcane or all divine spells available.

This is correct. Wizard's can only learn Arcane spells on the Wizard spell list. Divine Wizard spells or Arcane not-Wizard spells are off the table.

[Clistenes]

I guess that if you take the Alternative Source Spell metamagic feat you could create scrolls that hold divine versions of arcane spell (divine Fireball, divine Teleport...etc.) or arcane versions of divine spells (arcane Heal, arcane Holy Word...etc.).