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SciChronic
2013-10-22, 02:29 AM
making yet another theoretical build, and was looking for a bit more help filling out the build.

The goal, as the title says is an unarmed Skillmonkey who utilizes SA through unarmed strikes, but i'm having trouble figuring out in what order i should take my dips, and determining what I should take in later levels.

Classes:
Penetrating Strike Rogue: trapfinding and SA progression, great amount of skill points, minimum 3 levels
Invisible Fist Decisive Strike Monk: invisibility every 3 rounds, and double damage as a full round action, decent amount of skill points, minimum 2 levels
Swordsage: Assassin Stance, Island of Blades, maneuvers, good amount of skill points, minimum 0 levels (take martial stance and martial study feats)
Factotum: cunning strike to amplify SA, good amount of skill points, opens all knowledges for Knowledge Devotion.
Swashbuckler: free weapon finesse, +int to damage, decen amount of skill points, minimum 3 levels

i'm trying to avoid spellcasting if i can.

Feats:
Knowledge Devotion, Craven, Shadow Blade, Weapon Finesse, Able Learner, Improved Unarmed Strike.

I want this build to be operating at around well at around level 9-10.

best build i can come up with atm is:
Swordsage 1/Penetrating Strike Rogue 3/ Invisible Fist Decisive Strike Monk 2/ Swashbuckler 3/ Swordsage 1/ Factotum 3/ Rogue 7.

Feats being:
1)Able Learner, Knowledge Devotion, Shadow Blade, Darkstalker, Weapon Focus(Shadow Hand), Improved Unarmed Strike, Shaky(flaw), Poor Reflexes (Flaw)
3)Item Familiar
6)Craven, combat reflexes
9)Lifesight (if i take necropolitan template)
12,15,18) Font of Inspiration

this build was put together in like 15min, so i'm sure i can optimize it better, but i dont have the time atm, as i should be studying for a test, so could the Playground help me out a bit?

A.A.King
2013-10-22, 08:09 AM
You have too many dips, let me show you a simpler way to do this. First of all, too many dips which don't add much to either Sneak Attack or Unarmed Strike. This is more of a Skill Monkey who happens to know about Sneak Attack Damage and Unarmed Combat. Let me show you a build in which I tried to create a melee warrior who focused on hitting "pressure points", hitting just the right spot in the right way to deal maximum damage. (Read: SA and Skirmish)

Build:
Race: Strongheart Halfling
Halfling Monk 2 / Rogue 1 / Halfling Monk +3 / Rogue +2 / Swordsage 2 / Rogue X

Feats:
1. Kung Fu Genius/Carmedine Monk
Ability Focus (Stunning Fist)
Two Weapon Fighting (Requires a Flaw)
Darkstalker (Requires a Flaw)
2. Weapon Finesse
3. Ascetic Rogue
6. Swift Ambusher
9. Shadow Blade
Weapon Focus (Shadow Hand)
12. Staggering Strike
15. Craven
18. Savvy Rogue

Alternative Class Feature:
Halfing Monk:
1. Skirmish instead of Flurry of Blows
2. Weapon Finesse instead of Bonus Feat
2. Invisible Fist instead of Evasion
Rogue:
3. Penetrating Strike instead of Trap Sense
Swordsage:
Unarmed Variant means they count as Monk levels for Unarmed Attacks

Other:
Sparring Dummy of the Master lets you take 10 feet steps instead of 5 feat steps means easy Melee Full Attack + Skirmish


If you can both skirmish and sneak attack then your damage per hit (ignoring stats) are:

2d8 + 13d6 + 20

2d8 from Small Monk's unarmed attack (Ascetic Rogue lets Rogue and Monk stack for effectic monk level of 20 for purpuse of unarmed damage and )
8d6 Sneak Attack damage from Rogue 15
1d6 from Monk's Skirmish
4d6 from Scout's Skirmish (Swift Ambusher let's Rogue 15 also count as Scout 15 for the purpuse of Skirmish which stacks with Monk's Skirmish)
20 from Craven

Plus Monk Rogue and Swordsage have some great skill selections. Plus the Halfling Monk Variant (which you take at Level 1 and 2) gives you 6 Skill Points + Intelligence instead of just 4.

So at levels 1, 2, 9 and 10 you get 6 + Int Skills
At levels 4, 5, 6, you get 4 + Int Skills
and at all the other levels you get the Rogue's 8 + Int Skills. This should make you a very decent skill monkey

Mountain
2013-10-22, 12:12 PM
You'll probably want Carmendine Monk to base monk-ness on INT. (I'm assuming you have a high INT, being a skillmonkey.)

SciChronic
2013-10-22, 08:16 PM
current build:
Penetrating Strike Rogue 3/ Invisible Fist Decisive Strike Martial Monk 2/ Swashbuckler 3/ Swordsage 2/ Rogue +X

Feats:
1) Able Learner, Craven, Kung Fu Genius, Darkstalker, Shaky(flaw), Poor Reflexes(flaw)
3)Item Familiar
4)Improved Unarmed Strike, Martial Study (Distracting Ember)
5)Martial Stance(Island of Blades)
6)Shadow Blade
9)Snap Kick
12)Ascetic Rogue
15)Daring Outlaw
18)Superior Unarmed Strike

By level 9(where i want this build to be coming into its own) the use of a Decisive Strike Sneak Attack followed by a Decisive Strike Snap Kick Sneak Attack leads to massive damage. On a 32 Point-Buy i'll use 10 Str, 16 Dex, 14 Con, 10 Wis, 16 Wis, 10 Cha. Using items and level i'll have something like 10,20,16,10,18,10. Making my attacks deal:
1d8*2(unarmed strike)+10(dex)+8(int)+2(amulet of natural attacks +1)+4d6*2(SA)+18(craven)
for an average of 75 Damage each, making my full attack deal 150 damage

all while still being a skill monkey, making up for the 4+int class levels through Item Familiar and being human.

A.A.King
2013-10-23, 09:56 AM
I'm guessing a good question to ask here is, how theoretical is this build? Is it just a level 20 build trying to get the best Unarmed Attack + Sneak Attack possible not caring about the rest or do you actually want it to be decent from level 1 onwards (even if you don't intend to play it). Because right now there is one obvious problem if it's not just a level 20 build. You get Weapon Finesse way too late.