How much would it cost to build, open and maintain the following?

[Kafana]

I'd like to get your assessment on the following table. Could you give it your best shot and discuss the prices for the following things:

School
Hadozee House
Chapel


Now, I need the prices for these three, divided into three parts - price to build from nothing, price to open in an already built building, price to maintain (per year). I also need two or three variants (e.g. Small, Medium, Large establishment).

[ArcturusV]

Hmm. I COULD look at the Stronghold Builder's Guide, but I don't think that's necessarily reasonable for things like that.

I'm going to presume that somehow you got a deal worked out to stake out a claim on the land. Because that's more or less setting dependent, and in a lot of settings amounts to "The local lordling likes me and agreed to give me this" or "I killed the local scourge and took over the ruins of their town" more or less. Least in my experience.

I'll go over a rough estimate of the chapel, as that's probably the easiest one. Lets say you want a small chapel from scratch.

Realistically this means what you're talking about is walls and a roof over... 1200 square feet or so (The size of what we consider a small house in modern times, would be more than enough to be a small chapel for the needs of a neighborhood or village).

Biggest expenditures would be: Materials and craftsmen to build it. Honestly building a building like that would take about 600 man hours of labor, maybe up to 800. It doesn't take a rocket surgeon to build a building (While there is some art to it, you can use almost entirely untrained labor as long as someone knows what they're doing). So mark it as one boss/foreman at 3 sp/day, and laborers at 1 sp/day. Get a crew of 10 of them (Again, a reasonable number for a small project in a small village) and you take 80 days. In labor that means 1040 sp. Or 104 gp if you rather keep costs measured in that. Materials for it are more open ended as things like masonry stones or lumber don't really have a price. A fair estimate would probably end up about doubling the cost, so call it 200 gp after materials. This is just to build the "Shell" you're using. After that you'd need a few Holy Symbols, candles, furniture, altar, knicknacks of the faith. Can probably round that out to about a good 600 GP more if you want something "Lavish", fully decked out marble altars, golden icons, etc, if you're talking about a chapel in a major city (Where they expect more), in a dirt farmer village probably closer to 50 gp (Simple wooden table as an altar, few wooden holy symbols, simple benches and candles, etc).

Which gives us a baseline (A reasonable one I feel), of about 250 gp to build a small dirt farmer village chapel from the ground up, and 800 gp for something like a neighborhood chapel in a city.

[bekeleven]

Maintaining a chapel for a full year - and I'm not thinking Sistine Chapel scale, but something closer to the church in the backwater gospel (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVkDrIacHJM) - would probably run something like 3-10 GP per year in raw materials with an additional cost of roughly 25-50 GP for a full-time maintenance man.

[Kafana]

Would it be reasonable to pay a teacher 3 silver per day of lectures, which means he'd get a gold and a half per week of work?

I suppose having someone run the hadozee house (clean it, keep it maintained and open, etc.) would cost no more than a silver per day of work.

[ArcturusV]

Eh... for education I'd probably be going for the Profession Rules (Or using Knowledge (____) checks and Craft (____) checks in place of a profession skill as appropriate). Presume they take 10 on it. So your school teacher is going to have 10 + Int Mod + Ranks. For a dirt farm village, that might be a simple Int Check, maybe someone who has 12 int (Smart enough to teach, not so smart that they have more important things to do with their time) for about 3 gp/week. Which is just barely higher than the 3 sp/day Trained labor mark.

But if your "School" was something like the Masonry Academy of Central City, your "teacher" probably would be someone who is effectively "retired" (Too old to be doing the job all that well, still knows stuff), provides a good education to would Stonemasons, gets the effect of their Craft(Stonemason) skill check of 10 + 3 Int Mod (Those age bonuses add up) + 5 ranks + 3 Skill focus for a 21 check, weekly wage of 10.5 gp.

Which sounds about right to me.

Granted for something like a Chapel your local priest probably works for cost. it's a calling, not a profession after all. So simple cost of Room and Board.

[Kafana]

Any more suggestions?

[ArcturusV]

Keep in mind in operating costs how your school does teach, and what impact that might have. In a more archaic sort of model that might fit your campaign setting you learn by doing. Rather than reading books, taking notes, and listening to lectures about a subject, they do projects and work in that subject, under instruction and guidance, in order to learn.

This means on top of tuition (Which you may or may not be charging) that your school might also be turning a slight profit as the projects that students work on is pawned off to help run the place. Also means you'll have to have a rough idea of the materials you buy and stock the place with if you do something like that.

But it's a concern to think about in the back of your head as you do... whatever. When you come back from killin' stuff and taking their loot, look over the books and see that your "School" has turned a profit or not. Maybe your Weaponsmithy Academy is turning out Arrows for the local guard in the Bowyer/Fletcher class, another working on blades, etc.

[Coidzor]

What exactly do you mean by Hadozee House?

[holywhippet]

You could get around the need for, or supplement the, laborers if you had a lyre of building. Provided you can make the perform check repeatedly you can get a lot of construction done in a short amount of time.

[Benthesquid]

Pathfinder has the Downtime (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/other-rules/downtime) rules for things such as these. Basically, there are four kinds of capital- Labor, Goods, Influence, and Magic. You can get these either by working (an appropriate Profession, Craft, or other check, see your DM for details), outright buying them, or ate Profession, Craft, or other check, see your DM for details), outright buying them, or generating them with a Building or Organization.

Buildings are made up of Rooms, each of which has a cost in one or more of the above kinds of capital, and a build time, or a GP cost to buy an already existing version outright. Many Rooms gives a bonus to the Building's check to generate either one of the kinds of capital or gold. Some have other benefits.

For example, the statistics they give for a School consist of a one Bell Tower, two Classrooms, one Common Room, one Courtyard, one Kitchen, one Lavatory, one Office, two Storages, and one Workstation.

[Emperor Tippy]

What level and what amount of cheese is allowed?

Because you can do Shapechange -> Wish for a scroll of Fabricate a Chapel (CL = total cubic footage of the desired Chapel, might even be able to include the Craft Checks in the scroll) -> Shapechange to Lilitu -> Item Use the scroll.

It takes you 12.5 minutes per five foot square in the chapel.

If you have the raw materials for your chapel on hand then Wish for a Scroll of Wish at the appropriate CL and then use that to duplicate Fabricate and the entire chapel is up in 1 round.

---
But it really does depend on level and available resources.

[Kafana]

What level and what amount of cheese is allowed?

Because you can do Shapechange -> Wish for a scroll of Fabricate a Chapel (CL = total cubic footage of the desired Chapel, might even be able to include the Craft Checks in the scroll) -> Shapechange to Lilitu -> Item Use the scroll.

It takes you 12.5 minutes per five foot square in the chapel.

If you have the raw materials for your chapel on hand then Wish for a Scroll of Wish at the appropriate CL and then use that to duplicate Fabricate and the entire chapel is up in 1 round.

---
But it really does depend on level and available resources.

Nah, we're pretty low level, between 4 and 8, so no higher level spells.

[Keneth]

Pathfinder's downtime rules (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/other-rules/downtime) have some pretty sweet mechanics for both building structures (room by room or all at once), as well as running organizations. I find both superior to whatever rules Wizards managed to give us to date, though not the best I've ever seen, and they're easily adopted in any 3.X game.

[Chronos]

For the chapel, you'll probably also want to cast Hallow (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/hallow.htm) on it. That'll cost at least 1000 GP for the components, plus possibly another 450 if you can't cast it yourself and need to pay an NPC to cast it.

[Zero grim]

Doesn't a scroll of wish cost more then you can wish for, that's basically just asking for a cursed scroll.

Id go for the old make everything out of wood (trees are plentiful and cheap) method for materials, then just get some skeletons to construct it (undead too are plentiful and cheap) so you can build all the structures for probably only a couple hundred gold or if you source the undead yourself (rebuke a nearby tainted graveyard or something) it will be basically free.

Schools need teachers and books, depending on the quality of the school id say about 200g for learning materials per class and 2s a day for a lecturer of basic means, double or triple for better results.

Chapels need some fancy stuff on the walls i am told, id say about 500g would cover a small chapel, then you need to hire some adepts but since its a chapel you may be able to get away with just having everyone who goes there pay a few coppers into the offering box. id price the payment the same as the teacher.

[Chronos]

Doesn't a scroll of wish cost more then you can wish for, that's basically just asking for a cursed scroll.
By the RAW, there's a gold piece limit for nonmagical items, but not for magical items: You can wish for a magical item as expensive as you want, and it just costs you more XP. But if you're getting your Wish via a method that bypasses the XP cost, such as a Zodar's supernatural ability, that doesn't matter. You'll see this trick a lot, in Tippy's posts.