Wizards and Versatile Spellcasting

[IAmTehDave]

From a discussion 2 weeks ago in the "Dysfunctional Rules (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304817&page=6)" thread:

Re: Versatile Spellcasting, and whether a wizard that can somehow cast spells spontaneously can use the feat:

Aren't Wizards limited to casting spells that they've prepared, unless specifically otherwise stated? If they have a "spell slot", they can take the time to prepare a spell in said slot, but they can't just cast a spell using it the way spontaneous casters can.

Therefore: A Wizard can use Versatile Spellcaster, only on spells they can specifically cast spontaneously.

Alternatively: Can a cleric or Druid use Versatile Spellcaster to cast Cure or SNA spells, respectively? Or can a Cleric with Domain Spontaneity use Versatile Spellcasting for domain spells?

What defines "Knowing" a spell for this purpose? If a wizard has a bunch of spells in his spellbook, can he be considered to "know" the spells for rules purposes? If a wizard loses his spellbook, he can only prepare Read Magic (unless given ACFs) so does a Wizard actually know any spells? Do Druids/Clerics?

[Radar]

What defines "Knowing" a spell for this purpose? If a wizard has a bunch of spells in his spellbook, can he be considered to "know" the spells for rules purposes? If a wizard loses his spellbook, he can only prepare Read Magic (unless given ACFs) so does a Wizard actually know any spells? Do Druids/Clerics?
I can't say much about the other questions, but the wizard considers all spells in his spellbook as known. That is fairly clear from the description of the class as well as from the way certain feats like Uncanny Forethought work.

Druids and Clerics explicitly know every spell on their respective spell lists.

[Captnq]

I don't have the time to look it up and don't have it memorized so I'm going to just say "No". Because as a DM, if a player is trying something I don't understand, he's just trying to break the game.

[Chambers]

I don't have the time to look it up and don't have it memorized so I'm going to just say "No". Because as a DM, if a player is trying something I don't understand, he's just trying to break the game.

I feel like that's a bad attitude to have and fairly egotistical. Just because you as the DM don't understand a tactic or ability doesn't automatically make it game breaking.

Re: OP

I don't see anything in the Benefit part of the feat that specifically restricts the feat to spontaneously cast spells. Wizards have spell slots just like Sorcerers do.


Spell Selection and Preparation
Until she prepares spells from her spellbook, the only spells a wizard has available to cast are the ones that she already had prepared from the previous day and has not yet used. During the study period, she chooses which spells to prepare. If a wizard already has spells prepared (from the previous day) that she has not cast, she can abandon some or all of them to make room for new spells.

When preparing spells for the day, a wizard can leave some of these spell slots open. Later during that day, she can repeat the preparation process as often as she likes, time and circumstances permitting. During these extra sessions of preparation, the wizard can fill these unused spell slots. She cannot, however, abandon a previously prepared spell to replace it with another one or fill a slot that is empty because she has cast a spell in the meantime. That sort of preparation requires a mind fresh from rest. Like the first session of the day, this preparation takes at least 15 minutes, and it takes longer if the wizard prepares more than one-quarter of her spells.

Spell Slots
The various character class tables show how many spells of each level a character can cast per day. These openings for daily spells are called spell slots. A spellcaster always has the option to fill a higher-level spell slot with a lower-level spell. A spellcaster who lacks a high enough ability score to cast spells that would otherwise be his or her due still gets the slots but must fill them with spells of lower level.

So as long as a Wizard qualifies for the feat with some ability to spontaneously cast spells it appears they can use the benefit of the feat on any type of spell slots, spontaneous or prepared.

[Crake]

Druids and Clerics explicitly know every spell on their respective spell lists.

I think it's worth noting that the mechanical term "known spell" only applies to the following casters:


A spell that an arcane spellcaster has learned and can prepare. For wizards, knowing a spell means having it in their spellbooks. For sorcerers and bards, knowing a spell means having selected it when acquiring new spells as a benefit of level advancement.

So unless a divine class is called out to work like wizard, sorcerer or bard (like archivist and favored soul), they do not actually have "known spells"

[IAmTehDave]

I think it's worth noting that the mechanical term "known spell" only applies to the following casters:

So unless a divine class is called out to work like wizard, sorcerer or bard (like archivist and favored soul), they do not actually have "known spells"

Thank you. Not sure where to go for the D&D glossary, but this is what I was looking for.

So by RAW, Versatile Spellcaster lets you, as a Wizard, spontaneously cast spells from your spellbook by using lower level spell slots.

[Crake]

Thank you. Not sure where to go for the D&D glossary, but this is what I was looking for.

So by RAW, Versatile Spellcaster lets you, as a Wizard, spontaneously cast spells from your spellbook by using lower level spell slots.

It can be found in the back of the player's handbook and here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/glossary) as well.