Morph watches Puella Magi Madoka Magica and has REACTIONS (feat. Eldan) [Archive]

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-28, 02:00 PM

I promise, I'll try and keep the "head" puns to a minimum. :smallwink:

I had no intention of going into that thread, no. I saw it only just before posting this one, and considering Herp was one of the people to suggest doing this, I now understand his motives. :smallamused:
Yeah. We just wanted to give you a heads-up.

My only regret about this might be that I'd want to pace this and keep it at one episode per day. If I watch anime, I want to watch at least three episodes in a row, and I dunno what to watch besides this now. I certainly shouldn't start up three of these threads at the same time...
Hmmmm. I definitely agree that the thread would be more enjoyable with a slower "Let's Watch" pace. (Though, that being said, it does break nicely into three-episode chunks. Or four-episode chunks. Or two-episode chunks. We discussed it pretty thoroughly in the other thread. Basically, the story has some neat patterns to it, and makes use of its short length well.)

With 3-episode chunks: 1-3 are "expectation versus reality of mahou shoujo, 4-6 are "the rise of Sayaka and further forebodings", 7-9 are "the fall of Sayaka", 10-12 are "Madoka triumphant". Interestingly, episodes 3, 6, and 9 all drop pretty big story reveals--in 3, you find out that death is a big thing in Madokaland; in 6, you find out that they're all liches; in 9, you find the Incubators' motives.

With 4-episode chunks: 1-4 are the introduction, where we meet our main characters and see the dark side of mahou shoujo. 5-8 is the "dark point", where the reality descends in a crushing blow, culminating in Sayaka's witch transformation. 9-12 is the climax, where all the stakes are revealed and Madoka emerges triumphant.

With 2-episode chunks:
1 and 2: the "false" introduction, which has a notably different tone from the rest of the series. It even has its own ED that's never repeated again.
3 and 4: the first blow and introduction of trouble--Mami dies, Sayaka makes a contract, and a presumably selfish and vindictive mahou shoujo enters the scene.
5 and 6: the first horrible truth of mahou shoujo existence is revealed.
7 and 8: the second horrible truth of mahou shoujo existence is revealed.
9 and 10: the true motives of the Incubators and of Homura are revealed.
11 and 12: Madoka faces Walpurgisnacht.

(I just marked that spoiler because it's not a reaction to anything, more an analysis of what you already know has some sort of spoilerdom to it. I figure "the plot has a structure" is not a spoiler. :smallwink: )

Attack on Titan would certainly not be bad if you wanted to watch more episodes at a time. (In my mind, one of the plot arcs moves a bit slow, so watching two episodes at a time would let you clear through it pretty fast.) It's a brutal shounen with some great music and gorgeous visuals.

For funsies, you could always embrace the Code Geass madness if you haven't seen that. But that might be my nostalgia talking. It would certainly be an entertaining "Let's Watch" thread. (Some shows are just fun to comment on.)

endoperez

2013-10-28, 02:45 PM

How about you watch some other magical girl show on the side? Some suggestions:

Sailor Moon (it's a classic and has affected many other series even though it hasn't aged that well itself. I really like the the opening song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsmd-CGKvms). )
Card Captor Sakura is another classic.
Kore Wa Zombie Desu Ka (a parody where a high school boy is killed, revived as a zombie and then dressed up as a magical girl...)
Zero no Tsukaima (a fantasyland witch summons a familiar... who is a confused Japanese teenager)
I dunno, Powerpuff Girls? Kim Possible?

Or for a change of pace, maybe Magical Girl Lyrical Anderson (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=y2TbML2pbA8#t=187) Hellsing?
Jump to 3:07 if the link doesn't do that automatically to see that particular crossover mashup.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-28, 02:59 PM

That's a brilliant idea! For a few reasons. Basically, to mull over how PMMM relates to other mahou shoujo shows.

Somewhere

2013-10-28, 03:17 PM

As far as Let's Watch material goes, there's Valvrave S1 (S2 is in progress now) for the 'what twist will they throw in next?' that happens just about every episode.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-28, 03:21 PM

I promise, I'll try and keep the "head" puns to a minimum. :smallwink:

Yeah. We just wanted to give you a heads-up.

What did you just say?

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-28, 03:35 PM

Only one! I promise! (I put the spoiler above my single offense so as not to tip anything off.)

Morph Bark

2013-10-28, 04:13 PM

Gah, I already know one of the most torturous things about this will be the fact that I otherwise am always so KEEN on opening every single spoiler I come across! GNNNHHH!

Attack on Titan. And Free! Iwatobi Swim Club. Both are also on Crunchyroll. Let's Watch thread at your own leisure.

The first seems like a good one, especially with how the opening has been parodied to hell and back. The second I... a... swim club? I mean, sure, I've auditioned for voice acting some secondary characters in a fandub of that, but it sounds like one of 'em slice-of-life anime, and the only one of those I've been able to stand so far has been Ouran High School Host Club.

For funsies, you could always embrace the Code Geass madness if you haven't seen that. But that might be my nostalgia talking. It would certainly be an entertaining "Let's Watch" thread. (Some shows are just fun to comment on.)

While I managed to dodge reading the spoilers while quoting this post, I think after this I better not quote any post at all that contains spoilers in this thread.

Also, I've seen Code Geass. I'm not a fan of mecha anime. Code Geass? In my top three ever, along with Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann. The first because it focuses more on characters and their action scenes and dramatic tension than what most of Gundam does, the second because of how crazy over the top awesome it is. I love shows that make my skin crawl with awesomeness. I get that a lot. I've been known to give inspiring speeches shortly after watching such things, and I'm not even joking when I'm saying that!

How about you watch some other magical girl show on the side? Some suggestions:

Sailor Moon (it's a classic and has affected many other series even though it hasn't aged that well itself. I really like the the opening song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsmd-CGKvms). )
Card Captor Sakura is another classic.
Kore Wa Zombie Desu Ka (a parody where a high school boy is killed, revived as a zombie and then dressed up as a magical girl...)
Zero no Tsukaima (a fantasyland witch summons a familiar... who is a confused Japanese teenager)
I dunno, Powerpuff Girls? Kim Possible?

Or for a change of pace, maybe Magical Girl Lyrical Anderson (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=y2TbML2pbA8#t=187) Hellsing?
Jump to 3:07 if the link doesn't do that automatically to see that particular crossover mashup.

Something on the other side of the spectrum of anime sounds like a good idea, but another magical girl would tire me, likely. I've seen Kore Wa Zombie Desu Ka and liked it, Card Captor Sakura I quit after episode two (but its alternate universe sister I might like), Sailor Moon is probably not my thing, and Zero no Tsukaima... actually, I think that's one I was planning to watch sometime, but isn't it very, very long?

I have a list of anime I've watched/dropped/plan to watch on MyAnimeList (http://myanimelist.net/profile/morpholomew) (links, woo!), if anyone else would like to make suggestions. I figure that would help in knowing what I've seen and what might be up my alley. I like strange things, in a large variety. I watched Death Note at the same time as TTGL, for instance. Drama, comedy, action, horror, as long as it plucks at the emotional chords and has a decent story/makes me laugh/has a lot of wtf/omg moments... lemme just stop there, it already feels like I'm starting to describe 90% of everything. (I'm thinking one of similar length to Madoka would be a best fit though.)

At any rate, I'll now be off and watch the first episode. Enjoy things in the meantime, maybe make a suggestion for another Lets Watch or two.

Terraoblivion

2013-10-28, 04:49 PM

Oooh, more reactions to Madoka to see. This ought to be interesting. It's a show that's always fascinating to see initial reactions to.

Also, Free! is interesting. It's more of a drama with comedy and sports story elements than a slice of life, however, while it stands well on its own as that, the most interesting part is how it treats fanservice and gendered portrayals in anime. Not sure it's the best anime for let's watching or fits well with your interests, but it's definitely an interesting and unusual one.

Morph Bark

2013-10-28, 04:58 PM

Episode One

So I start it up. Yosh, alright.

Before the intro there's a scene, as per usual. Well, this looks rather trippy. It's like black-and-white kaleidoscopic patterns all over the place. That's not how kaleidoscopes work! They're supposed to be all funky-coloured! Ah well, at least the checker-pattern looks nice all over. Very classy.

Wait, did that girl just run out of a giant tree?

Okay, so this is a very trippy scene, and apparently a friend of hers is fighting with some invisible enemy while she talks to her alien bunny-cat that I'm guessing is her familiar, chatting her up about destiny and stuff. I'm a little creeped by the mouth (IT DOES NOT MOOOOVE), even though it's common in anime. At this point I care not at all for any of these characters, though the scene seems to want to be tense. Girl wakes up. Queue intro. Skipping that, thinking there might be slight spoilers in there.

...okay, that little brother is annoying. Her mom looks like she could just as well be her older sister. I guess it's just the art style.

Friends get introduced, casual scenes, typical of slice-of-life anime. New girl comes into class. Huh, okay, so I guess the earlier scene was a dream. I honestly thought it was a scene from further along in the story, since Madoka seemed to know the other characters present. Guess not. Man, this new girl Homura is kinda creepy, and it seems Madoka agrees with me.

"Don't even think about becoming someone you're not," she says, and OMINOUS SOUND EFFECTS PLAY. Okay, that... that sounds prophetic. Considering the rest of the episode wasn't filled with super-genki music and comedy so far, it clearly is meant to be dramatic rather than just switch up between comedy.

...and apparently Madoka's friends study tea. The Japanese are odd, and not just in ways that involve tentacles.

PSYCHIC BLAST BATTLE IN THE DARKNESS

MAGICAL MUSIC HEADPHONE TELEPAT--ohwait no, that's just Madoka herself. Man, she really goes quickly from a well-lit, colourful music store to a dark abandoned parking garage of some sort.

Aaaand Madoka protects the psychic alien bunny-cat from creepy transfer student. I can see this going many ways of bad. Also, ACID TRIIIIIIIPPP. ACID TRIP FOR EVERYOOOOOONE.

The eyeless marshmallow blobs with moustaches sound like they're trying to speak French and German at the same time. That's clearly bad. And right then, the blonde princess show up. You can see she's a princess because she has drill-hair. All princesses have drill-hair. She's clearly experienced with acid trips, and I'm guessing she's not friends with Homura. Here's to hoping she's not a resident Mary Sue and HOLY **** WHERE DID ALL THOSE GUNS COME FROM IS SHE AMERICAN

...well, she is blonde, but princesses don't come from America, y'know. Also, boobs.

Hmm, guess she's not friends with Homura, but not really enemies that bad either. I wonder which of the two is the Dark Magical Girl. Maybe they both are.

"I want you to make contracts with me and become Puella Magica!"

CONTRACTS IT SAYS

CLEARLY IT IS THE DEVIL

...and that's it for today. Hm. Dunno what to really think of it yet. OH WELL, I'LL TUNE BACK IN TOMORROW.

Tiki Snakes

2013-10-28, 05:01 PM

You can watch the intro sequence safely, Morph. :smallsmile:

Terraoblivion

2013-10-28, 05:16 PM

Yeah. Getting meaningful spoilers from the op would be quite a feat. I haven't analyzed it in the amount of detail needed to say if it is technically possible, but it would be really hard with anything other than a lucky guess and a wild imagination.

endoperez

2013-10-28, 05:30 PM

Terraoblivion

2013-10-28, 05:35 PM

The girl with the guns is awesome, yes. Guns. :smallbiggrin: I'm also definitely interested in reading more tomorrow.

That said, I shall proceed to taunt you with spoilers you can't open.

Morph noticed some interesting things there, and got some good guesses on things. Contracts with the spooky animal familiar..... yeah.

That one is pretty easily noticed for people who grew up in a culture where Faust is frequently mentioned or referenced. And where deal with the devil is a completely ordinary phrase.

John Cribati

2013-10-28, 05:39 PM

I never really saw Mami’s hair as drill-shaped, and now I have no idea how I missed that. Considering all of the ways she’s like Kamina.

And yes, in the States, anything that offers some sort of power as part of a contract might as well have EVIL written across its forehead.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-28, 05:41 PM

This Let's Watch...is gonna be amazing. I can tell already.

Terraoblivion

2013-10-28, 05:56 PM

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-28, 06:29 PM

The eyeless marshmallow blobs with moustaches sound like they're trying to speak French and German at the same time. That's clearly bad. And right then, the blonde princess show up. You can see she's a princess because she has drill-hair. All princesses have drill-hair. She's clearly experienced with acid trips, and I'm guessing she's not friends with Homura. Here's to hoping she's not a resident Mary Sue and HOLY **** WHERE DID ALL THOSE GUNS COME FROM IS SHE AMERICAN

...well, she is blonde, but princesses don't come from America, y'know. Also, boobs.

She's Japanese, but I'm like 99% sure she's based on a central European fairy tale, hence the outfit.

"I want you to make contracts with me and become Puella Magica!"

CONTRACTS IT SAYS

CLEARLY IT IS THE DEVIL

Oh come on, it's not like he's a cell phone company.

Anyway, the OP is odd, but I definitely suggest everyone watching the show give it at least one good, solid watch-through. It doesn't really spoil anything, but you'll definitely appreciate it later.

When you realize who is singing it, and why.

Arcane_Snowman

2013-10-28, 06:37 PM

Well, another interesting thread to be lurking around at. First time reactions to PMMM are always quite amusing, am going to look forward to this. On a different note, relating to what to watch: you've got Durarara!! On your watched list with a decent score, but not Baccano! It's superior spiritual predecessor, something to think about.

jseah

2013-10-28, 07:53 PM

Europe as well. It's just a big archetype in European, and by extension American, Australian etc. culture.
we're not so big on that over here in the Asian side. I didn't think he was all that suspicious in my initial impression of the first episode.
Although I couldn't shake the feeling of "this cannot end well".

the_druid_droid

2013-10-28, 08:36 PM

Aaaand Madoka protects the psychic alien bunny-cat from creepy transfer student. I can see this going many ways of bad. Also, ACID TRIIIIIIIPPP. ACID TRIP FOR EVERYOOOOOONE.

Heh, I remember seeing that for the first time and going "Huh, did the acid just kick in?"

And I totally didn't see that place in my nightmares later. Nuh-uh.

Terraoblivion

2013-10-28, 08:50 PM

we're not so big on that over here in the Asian side. I didn't think he was all that suspicious in my initial impression of the first episode.
Although I couldn't shake the feeling of "this cannot end well".

I know. There's a reason why I mentioned Europe and countries culturally descended from Europe. The devil signing contracts is a recurring motif of European culture going back to the renaissance at the latest, with the stories of Magister Faustus appearing in Germany in the 16th century.

Sith_Happens

2013-10-28, 09:56 PM

Only one! I promise! (I put the spoiler above my single offense so as not to tip anything off.)

Come now, no need to cut your sense of humor off at the neck.:smalltongue:

Anyway, the OP is odd, but I definitely suggest everyone watching the show give it at least one good, solid watch-through. It doesn't really spoil anything, but you'll definitely appreciate it later.

When you realize who is singing it, and why.

:eek:

IT'S HOMURA ISN'T IT?

WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!

Terraoblivion

2013-10-28, 10:10 PM

:eek:

IT'S HOMURA ISN'T IT?

WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!

Once you know it's Homura and have read the lyrics, it becomes rather clear. It's about how she's refusing to give up on saving Madoka, no matter what happens. Even after all those horrible timelines.

Werekat

2013-10-28, 11:29 PM

The marshmallow blobs (I think the fan nickname for them was Anthonies, which is somehow hilarious) are actually speaking German, if memory serves. They're talking about snipping roses and gifting them to the queen.

There's a lot of German in this anime. ;-)

Terraoblivion

2013-10-28, 11:31 PM

It's not a fan nickname, it was officially put up on the official Japanese website.

jseah

2013-10-29, 12:49 AM

You might want to lay off on the German translation. Especially of the runes.
Can be quite the spoiler.

Sith_Happens

2013-10-29, 01:12 AM

Once you know it's Homura and have read the lyrics, it becomes rather clear. It's about how she's refusing to give up on saving Madoka, no matter what happens. Even after all those horrible timelines.

Indeed; I meant "WHY!?" in the sense of "THE REALIZATION, IT HURTS."

Arbane

2013-10-29, 01:19 AM

You know, guys, you've got a WHOLE OTHER THREAD you can post spoilers in without annoying anyone. :smallmad:

Just saying.

There aren't many other anime where there's such interest in reading or point posting an unspoilt "let's watch!"

There's a few... Revolutionary Girl Utena, for example. (And for pretty much the same reasons, come to think of it.)

If someone has suggestions for other things to watch alongside it, you could always post about the other things in this same thread though, I guess?

One I've been enjoying too much lately is Love, Chunibyo, and Other Delusions (http://www.theanimenetwork.com/Anime/Love-Chunibyo-Other-Delusions/Info).
Chunibyo's a Japanese thing: Kids acting with the delusion that they have special powers, are fighting a conspiracy, or similar. The male lead had this, and is now really embarrassed by it. The female lead has it, and has it bad. Comedy (and some drama) ensues.

It's also only 12 episodes.

Hazzardevil

2013-10-29, 02:45 AM

I know. There's a reason why I mentioned Europe and countries culturally descended from Europe. The devil signing contracts is a recurring motif of European culture going back to the renaissance at the latest, with the stories of Magister Faustus appearing in Germany in the 16th century.

Where would be a good place to find an adaptation or version of this?

More on topic, I looked into Mami's outfit. It's deliberately based on a Renaissance musketeer, some of them had silly uniforms.
And just had a revelation about Mami and someone.
:smalleek:
Mami uses muskets, an old weapon.
Homura uses handguns, RPGs, assault rifles and machine guns, newish weapons.
Old vs New parallel anyone?

Eldan

2013-10-29, 02:45 AM

The description is a bit disjointed for someone like me who hasn't actually seen the series.

However, the situation seems pretty clear to me. We have some kind of strange nonhuman creature who turning young females in what are, to my understanding, essentially witches. "Devil" is pretty much my main suspect here, even before "contract for power" was mentioned. Places two and three are "Fae" and "Djinn".

A Fae creature would be just as bad as the devil, if for slightly different reasons. Both appear in the shape of animals (Mephisto as a poodle, in Goethe), so that could still fit. Both sign contracts for power. The fae would be doing it for twisted amusement, instead of souls and power, but the end result would be similar and both would be out for corrupting the innocent.

What should be considered is the runes and German speaking monsters: even if the inspiration is only vaguely Germanic, Fae are unlikely, they are more celtic, as are Djinn. Thinking of Germanic mythology, giants, dwarves and elves all don't really have that kind of power. That pretty much leaves some kind of demon.

I haven't opened any kind of spoilers, but even just from the description of general trippiness and the devil association, I see two outcomes. First, the slow creep. Powers seem nice at first, but then the price for them is slowly ramped up and the true horror is revealed at the end. The second is the sudden break. Just as much true horror, but it comes in suddenly and without warning, for shock value. Around the midway point of the series, maybe, since it's pretty short? I'm tending to the second, it seems to fit the pacing of most darker anime I've seen.

Edit: I'm overanalyzing, aren't I. Sorry, I'll stop.

endoperez

2013-10-29, 03:40 AM

Edit: I'm overanalyzing, aren't I. Sorry, I'll stop.

A bit, yeah. But since you're interested, maybe you should start watching the series with Morph Bark? It'd be awesome having you two discuss the series and how your opinions on the episodes differ from each other.

Would anyone else love to see that? TWO trope-toting people watching Madoka and trying to do better than the other in the "what's going to happen next" prediction game? It seems awesome to me.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 03:56 AM

I actually have the time, so why not. I'm not that good a writer, though. What was the name of that site that had it, again?

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 04:09 AM

It's morning here now. I'm starting to consider just watching episode two.

Maybe I should just watch two per day and do one in the morning and one in the evening, or with an 11 hour cooldown between episodes at least...

You might want to lay off on the German translation. Especially of the runes.
Can be quite the spoiler.

Actually, what you said might be worse now. I can actually read German. Now I'm tempted to pause every so often when they show up and read the runes. D:

You know, guys, you've got a WHOLE OTHER THREAD you can post spoilers in without annoying anyone. :smallmad:

Personally, I'm not anno--okay, I am a little BECAUSE I CAN'T READ THEM YET DANG WHIPPERSNAPPERS *shakes fist*

Otherwise, not really.

There's a few... Revolutionary Girl Utena, for example. (And for pretty much the same reasons, come to think of it.)

One I've been enjoying too much lately is Love, Chunibyo, and Other Delusions (http://www.theanimenetwork.com/Anime/Love-Chunibyo-Other-Delusions/Info).
Chunibyo's a Japanese thing: Kids acting with the delusion that they have special powers, are fighting a conspiracy, or similar. The male lead had this, and is now really embarrassed by it. The female lead has it, and has it bad. Comedy (and some drama) ensues.

It's also only 12 episodes.

Hmmm, maybe I'll consider Utena then. I've seen Chuunibyo (took me a bit to realize you were talking about it, as I've only known its Japanese name so far), and liked it, though I quit for a bit halfway through because of its awkward-feelingness.

*snip*

Wasn't Mephisto a devil/demon as well? And djinn are Arabic in origin, not Celtic.

I actually have the time, so why not. I'm not that good a writer, though. What was the name of that site that had it, again?

Crunchyroll, but it might not have Madoka in Switzerland. Some anime are blocked for me in the Netherlands, but... well, piracy isn't against the law here. (Well, spreading files is, taking them isn't. Sometimes the law is a strange and wonderful thing.)

Eldan

2013-10-29, 04:16 AM

We have the same law about piracy ,yeah. It's quite nice, sometimes. Our courts also declared it legal to work around DRM and copy protection on media you own.

So, if I were to post my own ideas about the show in here, would you feel as if I was edging in on your territory? Should I get my own thread?

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 04:20 AM

So, if I were to post my own ideas about the show in here, would you feel as if I was edging in on your territory? Should I get my own thread?

I don't mind if you don't. Gives me someone to talk about the show with! At least, depends on how fast you plan on going through the episodes. We'd have to clearly mark our posts with our initial reactions to each episode, as I did with a big bold EPISODE ONE, so that we don't accidentally spoil one another. And go at the same pace. What do you say, one episode a day good enough, or two?

Between your over-analyzing and my over-reacting, there should be at least some good in there.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 04:25 AM

I have a few hours, so I can do episode 1 right now. Then, I should have time most evenings, one episode should be fine.

I'm thinking of doing a bit of a running commentary, stopping after every scene and writing down a few points, since my memory's horrible sometimes. Then a few general thoughts.

Also, I'm a German speaker. And I can read some Futhark. This will be hard.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 04:27 AM

I will delay watching/posting episode two until you've had episode one then. :smallsmile:

A running commentary is a good idea for a first run, IMO. It's what I'm doing. I can remember things well, but I often get the order of events wrong.

endoperez

2013-10-29, 05:31 AM

Wheeee! You are both awesome! :smallbiggrin:

Oh man, one of those comments was so spot on! :smallbiggrin:

"So, they are hunting witches. Strange, I thought they were witches."

Eldan

2013-10-29, 05:31 AM

Eldan watches Madoka, Episode 1

Cold open. Curtain rises, we get grainy film effect. Cute. Seems we'll be getting a flashback later to explain how we got here.

The art style is... weird. Very nicely designed, black and white, slightly trippy backgrounds drawn in a clear style, hard edges.
A character that seems drawn entirely differently. Pink haired girl looks about... six years old? Given that this is Japan, I'm guessing she's high school age. Strange how she's drawn almost a bit washed out, with unclear lines. Makes her stand out a lot, but not necessarily in a good way.
Trees, cogs, crumbling buildins? Is this symoblic? Might be, I'm not in a mood to go into it.
If that flying thing is the enemy, we can barely see what it looks like. That's probably intentional. For some reason ,her only weapon seems to be a buckler. I only realized that I was watching two different girls when the camera started cutting between them.
Magic light effect start flying, which work very well on the stark backgrounds. I assume this is meant to be dramatic, but as I don't know the characters, I don't care.
White mammal creature says mysterious things that would probably make sense in context if there was any. I'm suspecting end of the world. Pinky girl does not think she's important. Mammalthing is tempting her to use her powers.

I'm probably writing too much about this first scene, not all of which is very interesting in retrospect. I'll try to keep this short, but there's not much to say about the characters yet.

Wake up, all a dream (as if).

A wild WORLD'S MOST GENERIC JPOP OPENING attacks! It uses TERRBLE SLIDESHOW ART! It's not very effective...

Pretending to be slice of life, ey? I'm not buying it. Weird thought of the day: Is hugging a naked energy clone of yourself evidence of homosexuality?

Scene two. Suddenly, we have colours. Family scene. Everyone is overacting to annoying degrees. One minute in and I'm both annoyed and bored. I'm already overanalyzing details:
This family must be loaded. That bathroom is about the size of my flat and it seems to have screens in the walls. What kind of weird control freak numbers their cosmetics with little signs? Someone has terrible taste in interior decoration and no colour sense. I'm blaming the father.

More banter that feels like filler. I'm tempted to hit fast forward and watch at double speed. Everyone's a stereotype so far: shy girl, loud girl, quiet proper girl.

Why did someone replace the class rooms with gilded cages? I'm wondering why that teacher wasn't fired, whatever she's talking about is clearly pointless.

Apparently, the transfer student is pretty and/or cool. I'm not seeing it, all the faces look the same to me. She's either evil or a clone, robot or alien. And the secret to being mysterious is looking half-asleep and not saying much.

More touch screens. Are we in the future?

The music is trying way too hard to be mysterious when nothing is happening.

We interrupt this corridor walking scene for a philosophical question. We get the obvious answer. More mysterious talking. Don't make contracts with the devil, gotcha. So, she's the protector, then.

Also, at least slightly sue-ish. If White Mammal thing is the devil, she might be some kind of angel, but I doubt it.

Madoka is seriously getting on my nerves now. So damn whiny.

We're back to magic shoot-out. Mammal thing is grinning while being shot, so I guess that's okay. T

Madoka is a telepath now. Why not. Conveniently, the giant glass-and-white-metal mall has a dark semi-classicist mansion hidden backstage for scariness purposes. The music actually does "scary" pretty well now.

Mammal thing uses cuteness for defensive purposes. Homura is trying to be quietly intimidating. Using a fire-extinguisher was a fun idea, that made me smile.

And magic LSD-trip as mentioned by Morph. Butterflies, red trees, pipes, thorns, Gothic catherdal, the moon, rubies, German inscription "The first buds shall be harvested", playing cards, razorwire. This moves really, really quickly.

Teleport by tearing the background into shreds. Nice. "The **** branches impede **** ventilation". Okay. Either this symbolism is way too deep for me right now, or someone just copied some ominous sounding phrases from a German gardening manual and hoped no one would notice.

The monsters are cotton wool with dapper mustaches. I dig it. Since I know it is German, I can sort of hear it, but I can't understand a single word.

I don't trust this girl. No one with that hair can possibly be sane. She also seems to be chained to a magic circle made up of more chains.

Where have I heard the name Kyuby before? (Edit: Naruto, right. Spelt differently, though, so maybe there's no connection. That thing is no fox spirit.)

Don't juggle the Fabergé egg! Those things are fragile! Gunstorm is nice, though. Normality is restored by killing things.

So, they are hunting witches. Strange, I thought they were witches.

Ooh, look how threatening I can be while talking reasonably. I dislike that character more and more.

Contract time. Cliffhanger ending.

The ending song is pure torture.

Preview: wish granting. Did that ever go well in any medium?

Pacing
The pacing is off. The first half could have stood to tighten a few scenes until things actually started happening. When the mood got first scary, then trippy in the end, those scenes could have used a minute or two more buildup to build tension.

Art
I dig the visuals. There seem to be three categories here: black and white dreamworld looks really impressive. The real world is competently done but not really outstanding. Still, nice enough to look at while nothing is happening. I absolutely love the magical scenes, I've never seen a show do their visuals like that and it's gorgeous and lovely.
There's one exception: the characters. They stand out and in a bad way. Madoka, especially, looks like a half-finished sketch that someone shoved into the beautiful backgrounds. If I want to look at the backgrounds more than the people who are talking, something went wrong.

Characterization
The characters are all flat, so far. There are scenes what feel like they are meant to establish character, but so far, I'm not seeing it. I haven't seen anyone who would need more than one character to describe.

Story:
The story... there's not much here, yet, really. Some foreshadowing and half of that only because people are going THERE WILL BE A TWIST! Not that that took much guessing.

Opinion:
Better than I thought, really. From the few spoilers I indirectly absorbed, I expected one or two terrible first episodes until THE TWIST finally came and things got good, but there was just enough foreshadowing to get over the boring parts and the visuals were fantastic enough that I'd probably watch this just for the magic scenes.

Future prediction:
Kyubey is evil. Dark haired girl who's name I forgot is a sort-of-good guy, but in a stoic, honourable and probably brutal way. Everyone else is terribly naive and will be given magical powers and wishes that will backfire in the most horrible way possible. There's not enough story yet to say anything more precise.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 05:40 AM

I forgot one more piece of speculation. THis may go a bit too far, so I'll spoiler it for Morph. Don't tell me if I'm right or wrong.

Magicians are split into two sects, which for weird reasons are called Magical Girls and Witches. The first have better PR and sparky dresses, but the difference is probably purely ideological. About halfway into the series, the main characters will find out that they aren't actually on the side of good, at which point it will be terribly hard to get out of the contract without horrible consequences. One or more characters will die, go to hell or turn into soulless monsters. Madoka survives, but is mentally broken by the loss of her friends and the terrible things she witnessed or probably did herself.

More details once we actually have some exposition.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 05:45 AM

Nicely done, Eldan. I enjoy reading your writing style and see how it contrasts with mine. You're quite deadpan, but not unhumorously so.

I'll probably watch episode two in the evening, but before I'm off to MMA practice.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 05:47 AM

Fine with me. I can do another one, I'm on semi-holiday.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 06:10 AM

Semi-holiday, eh? Do you have more time in the mornings or in the evenings? I figure the best way to go about this is alternating, like you post one, I post one, which would mean I'm just a tiny bit ahead, but not rushing way ahead. You could then do the second episode this evening or tomorrow morning. Sound good?

Eldan

2013-10-29, 06:24 AM

Semi-holiday means I'm sitting at home and making my own timetables. I have a lot of writing and proof-reading to do and some very little grading, which gets quite dull after a while. But generally, I'm more an evening person.

But, eh, this took me an hour to write including downloading the entire series. I can fit that amount of time in pretty much whenever.

endoperez

2013-10-29, 06:36 AM

This is more than twice the fun, now.

"One or more characters will die, go to hell or turn into soulless monsters. "

Can't wait, can't wait! :smallbiggrin:

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 08:16 AM

And the secret to being mysterious is looking half-asleep and not saying much.

Holy crap, you just figured out Anime.

Madoka is seriously getting on my nerves now. So damn whiny.

Something tells me you're one of those "get in the ****ing robot, Shinji" viewers, aren't you?

Teleport by tearing the background into shreds. Nice. "The **** branches impede **** ventilation". Okay. Either this symbolism is way too deep for me right now, or someone just copied some ominous sounding phrases from a German gardening manual and hoped no one would notice.

Would you believe me if I told you it was both?

She also seems to be chained to a magic circle made up of more chains.

Wow, I never noticed that.

The ending song is pure torture.

It gets better.

Preview: wish granting. Did that ever go well in any medium?

EDIT: Actually, wait. In both Disney's and original Aladdin, it's not so much that the wishes backfire as that the bad guy gets to make his own wishes. Although the "make me a Prince" one in the movie was poorly thought-out and acted-upon.

Art
I dig the visuals. There seem to be three categories here: black and white dreamworld looks really impressive. The real world is competently done but not really outstanding. Still, nice enough to look at while nothing is happening. I absolutely love the magical scenes, I've never seen a show do their visuals like that and it's gorgeous and lovely.
There's one exception: the characters. They stand out and in a bad way. Madoka, especially, looks like a half-finished sketch that someone shoved into the beautiful backgrounds. If I want to look at the backgrounds more than the people who are talking, something went wrong.

I don't know, that conclusion is rather common in anime, at least for me. Possibly because a well-drawn static background is a lot cheaper than a well-drawn animated character. The "real world" visuals grew on me as the series went on, personally, because of all the background details and random but appropriate symbolism in the cinematography.

Opinion:
Better than I thought, really. From the few spoilers I indirectly absorbed, I expected one or two terrible first episodes until THE TWIST finally came and things got good, but there was just enough foreshadowing to get over the boring parts and the visuals were fantastic enough that I'd probably watch this just for the magic scenes.

Future prediction:
Kyubey is evil. Dark haired girl who's name I forgot is a sort-of-good guy, but in a stoic, honourable and probably brutal way. Everyone else is terribly naive and will be given magical powers and wishes that will backfire in the most horrible way possible. There's not enough story yet to say anything more precise.

It's amazing the conclusions people will jump to based on prolific out of context spoilers.

AttilaTheGeek

2013-10-29, 08:18 AM

Oh, man, I'm excited.

Yesssss, weaboo tears! I like Eldan's writing style, but I can't wait for both of them to get to episode three. Eldan called the TWIST, but not the TWIST on the TWIST on the TWIST. :smallbiggrin:

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 08:55 AM

This is BEST DAY EVER. Two contracts for the price of one! ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

Eldan

2013-10-29, 09:01 AM

Something tells me you're one of those "get in the ****ing robot, Shinji" viewers, aren't you?

How did you ever guess. Though I also just dislike high-pitched voices in general.

And I happen to like Evangelion. I just pretend the last two episodes never happened and End of Evangelion was always the ending.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 09:06 AM

Well, at least you'll really like Sayaka.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 09:08 AM

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 09:17 AM

To give a bit of context to this thread, I'll put in a few sentences on my viewing experience in Anime.

My first animes were Heidi (I'm Swiss. Heidi was on air non-stop for years) and several animated German and Scandinavian fairy tales, but I dind't know them as Anime.

Quite a few years after that came Pokémon, my first experience with "OMG, it's so cool and Japanese and therefore even cooler!" Though I was a bit too old for the Anime, mainly liking the games.

The first thing I watched in Japanese was Naruto. I was, oh, 17 at the time and thought I had just found the holy grail.

Then a bit of a gap again, until I came into anime fully by watching my way across pretty much anything Seinen mentioned positively on the internet.

So, I actually haven't seen most of the more cliché animes. My experience with magical girls consists of switching the channel when the German dub of Sailor Moon came on. The only Shonen I watched was pre-filler Naruto and about five episodes of Bleach. Oh, and TTGL and Eva, if those count. The only sort-of Slice of Life thing I've seen was Haruhi Suzumiya, which I thoroughly despite.

In America, at least, Madoka seems to be the go-to magical girl show for people who don't like magical girl shows. It's kind of a counter to the intended experience - like watching Evangelion without watching any of the half-dozen super robot shows it was homaging - but everyone still seems to enjoy it.

They just don't automatically trust the small fuzzy smiling magical creature, because that trope isn't strong in their minds like it would be for someone who grew up watching Pretty Cure or Sailor Moon.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 09:25 AM

John Cribati

2013-10-29, 09:28 AM

Come on. That thing is obviously evil. It takes without moving its mouth, it smiles while getting shot at, it makes contracts for power and it has a girl servant chained to a magical circle.

Why would anyone think that thing wasn't evil?

Cute things are to Japan as a pretty blond girl surrounded by squirrels, birds, butterflies, and baby deer is to America.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 09:31 AM

Cute things are to Japan as a pretty blond girl surrounded by squirrels, birds, butterflies, and baby deer is to America.

Did I come up with that comparison in your thread or am I imagining things?

Eldan

2013-10-29, 09:32 AM

See, I live in Europe. A pretty blonde girl in the forest, talking to animals, is a fairy trying to eat you.

John Cribati

2013-10-29, 09:41 AM

Did I come up with that comparison in your thread or am I imagining things?

Pretty much. I just expanded on it a tad.

See, I live in Europe. A pretty blonde girl in the forest, talking to animals, is a fairy trying to eat you.

Well, just imagine Kyubey as whatever the Europe has that says "this entity is innately trustworthy and cannot be evil, no siree."

Then again, the evilness of "let me make a contract with you" would still sort of overrule that if Kyubey was a Disney Princess. Japan just apparently hasn't seen enough Faustian imagery for it to settle in.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 09:43 AM

See, I live in Europe. A pretty blonde girl in the forest, talking to animals, is a fairy trying to eat you.
I love everything about this post. If I didn't already have a great sig quote...

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 09:46 AM

See, I live in Europe. A pretty blonde girl in the forest, talking to animals, is a fairy trying to eat you.

Stealing this for my next Hunter and/or Changeling game.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 10:03 AM

See, I live in Europe. A pretty blonde girl in the forest, talking to animals, is a fairy trying to eat you.

Slightly different from the Netherlands, where the setting in fairy tales is usually swamp or heathland (the latter often involves giants, the former ghosts). Though there's also tons that involve the rivers or the sea. Then again, we've legitimately lost some towns to the sea several times in Roman and Medieval times.

The best/worst part? The giants eat people, but the people are even worse.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 10:22 AM

Mhm. I don't actually know a lot of genuinely Swiss folk tales, but all most all I do feature dwarves. Not Tolkien dwarves, very small, stealthy, trickster dwarves.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 10:28 AM

I have a book here with some, but they might be from a different province. They vary a lot between them. In the west it's a lot of tales of the sea, south-west it's of sunken towns, giants appear everywhere but mostly in the north-east. I believe there was one story about a girl who got sold by her father to some giants to pay off a debt and while the giants slept the girl sewed their bodies together and fled. They're implied to have died of starvation because they couldn't get out of the house anymore.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 10:29 AM

Also, I don't think the German is that spoilery? Isn't it just passages from Faust and whatnot? Which both Morph and Eldan have already keyed onto with aplomb.

Aren't the witch names in some totally other script?

Terraoblivion

2013-10-29, 10:45 AM

Where would be a good place to find an adaptation or version of this?

Depends on how old school you want to go. Marlowe's Faust and Goethe's Faust are the two obvious, really famous examples.

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 11:00 AM

It gets better.

And everything matters :smallbiggrin:

In America, at least, Madoka seems to be the go-to magical girl show for people who don't like magical girl shows. It's kind of a counter to the intended experience - like watching Evangelion without watching any of the half-dozen super robot shows it was homaging - but everyone still seems to enjoy it.

I actually managed to do this with both Madoka and NGE. Unless you count half-remembered snatches of Sailor Moon episodes and Power Rangers >.>

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 11:10 AM

I think Madoka's a good standalone, though. The argument about what the show is has already been hashed out in other threads, so I don't really want to retread it. But it's my sole exposure to the genre, and I suspect that I only really missed some of the subtler nods. (And I can always pick up on those during a rewatch.)

Really, though--consider the fact that the entire resolution of Madoka literally is "friendship is magic, and the power of hope will save the entire universe!" plus sparkles. I mean, cmon. Deconstruction? :smalltongue: All of the mahou shoujo are literally powered by the Power of Heart, after all.

endoperez

2013-10-29, 11:31 AM

What's up with nudity in the magical girl shows, btw? It usually appears in a transformation sequences, opening and/or ending. I think it happens in some Gundam series too.

Does it have some specific symbolism in the Japanese culture, like naivety or youth or vulnerability? Or one's mind, as opposed to the physical body?

John Cribati

2013-10-29, 11:41 AM

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 11:46 AM

Actually, I'm also pretty sure that it encompasses mind vs. body. Used for out-of-body experiences.

Arbane

2013-10-29, 11:49 AM

What's up with nudity in the magical girl shows, btw? It usually appears in a transformation sequences, opening and/or ending.

"They're not naked, they're magical." - T-shirt I saw at a convention a few years back.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 11:58 AM

Also, they're invisible. :elan:

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 12:08 PM

Actually, I'm also pretty sure that it encompasses mind vs. body. Used for out-of-body experiences.

That would be the random nakedness in recent Gundam more than in magical girl shows, I would think. Although since it mostly pops up in transformation sequences I guess it could be both.

Also, they're invisible. :elan:

Considering transformation sequences, at least in recent shows, have been implied to be artistic license and not "really" happening as far as outside observers can tell, you're actually completely correct.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 12:14 PM

Accidental brilliance!

Fjolnir

2013-10-29, 02:31 PM

I will say that this thread has actually gotten me to start watching the series, I also recently finished episode 1 and am actually impressed, since I have opened every spoiler and such and this has still managed to hold my interest, my wife watching part of it over my shoulder said "oh dear, they're going to try to solve problems using magic aren't they?" at one point. I will not pretend to say I know much German so the weird cotton ball things are not exactly going to spoil much for me. I am an american, my family is from Ireland and I grew up on my grandfather's knee with tales of fairy folk and the like so I was kind of looking at this through the "this is a thing of capricious nature and alien morality, it should not be trusted" spectrum rather than "inherently evil"...

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 02:46 PM

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 02:49 PM

Excellent! Though...we haven't really spoiled all that much in the spoilers.

...well.

Okay, except for the part where I outlined the entire plot in vague details. Still, I certainly agree with the assessment that the enjoyment of the show does not solely consist in spoilers.

Fjolnir

2013-10-29, 02:51 PM

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 02:53 PM

Well, the faster you watch, the sooner you'll be able to discuss with the Choir Spoilered. :smalltongue:

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 02:54 PM

I was going to try to plow through the series yesterday but the good people on the official parahumans IRC told me that it would probably be a good idea to wait a little while before continuing because the series is that charming...

Decompression time is good, in part just because there's so much to turn over after each episode. The writing is very tight and it pays to not just gulp down the series.

Arbane

2013-10-29, 02:56 PM

Hmmm, maybe I'll consider Utena then.

I think it does to shoujo 'genre' what Evangelion did to giant robots, but I seem to be in a minority on that view.

I've seen Chuunibyo (took me a bit to realize you were talking about it, as I've only known its Japanese name so far), and liked it, though I quit for a bit halfway through because of its awkward-feelingness.

it IS rather heavy on the cringe comedy. I liked it better once Dekomori showed up, as she seems to be having a BLAST running around in a 24/7 LARP.

my wife watching part of it over my shoulder said "oh dear, they're going to try to solve problems using magic aren't they?" at one point.

Heh. One of the lessons I've seen in 'classic' (non-fighting) Magical Girl shows is that trying to solve problems with magic usually replaces them with bigger problems.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 03:04 PM

Heh. One of the lessons I've seen in 'classic' (non-fighting) Magical Girl shows is that trying to solve problems with magic usually replaces them with bigger problems.

Heck, just watch American kids' cartoons. Or Sabrina.

More people? It really is Christmas in October, isn't it?

Halloween is a kind of appropriate holiday for this show...although six months later would be better.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 03:09 PM

Considering transformation sequences, at least in recent shows, have been implied to be artistic license and not "really" happening as far as outside observers can tell, you're actually completely correct.

Now I'm thinking about Magical Girls wearing clothes that are invisible and make whatever they cover invisible too.

...they'd basically be floating heads, thighs and handless arms wielding magical rods!

Decompression time is good,

You can't tell me what to do! *binges on some other anime*

I think it does to shoujo 'genre' what Evangelion did to giant robots, but I seem to be in a minority on that view.

Oh dear. I don't suppose that means Utena is very depressing and its ending makes no sense, right?

it IS rather heavy on the cringe comedy. I liked it better once Dekomori showed up, as she seems to be having a BLAST running around in a 24/7 LARP.

Oh god, I never thought of it that way. XD I occasionally LARP myself, complete with make-up and fancy robes and a big sword that looks-wise TOTALLY doesn't fit me, but I always have a blast. Last time I even organized in-character gladiatorial fights and made a small fortune on bets people placed, which I then spent on magical stones that instantly turned me into the greatest asset of the mage guild and possibly their most powerful member.

I got such nasty looks from people who weren't as lucky. Teehee~

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 03:14 PM

...they'd basically be floating heads, thighs and handless arms wielding magical rods!
Aha, haha...

T_T

John Cribati

2013-10-29, 03:18 PM

Aha, haha...

T_T

I should not have laughed at that.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 03:23 PM

I should not have laughed at that.
It's a coping mechanism.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 04:00 PM

EPISODE ZWEI (2)

Opening scene contains blonde gun enthusiast chatting us up. Apparently she goes to the same school as Madoka? Not sure, I didn't really pay attention to the name of the school, which is what you get with long, foreign names that likely have no impact on the plot anyway. A witch contracted with Kyubey, whose name's spelling makes me angrey.

Considering Kyubey makes contracts with witches, but was also hunted by one, I'm guessing Homura either made a contract with it and got scorned, or she's contracted with some other, similar creature that is enemies with Kyubey, which would mean this anime is really about animals looking like plush toys and using little girls as their fighting tools. It almost sounds wrong. Then again, the first episode did have a few scenes with disturbing atmosphere, the last of which was oblitorated by tons of gunfire. (I wonder if Mami plays Warhammer 40k...)

Oh, right, watching, gotta get on that! Onwards to the intro, now that I know it's not spoileriffic as some series' tend to be.

Hmmm, pretty standard fare, both in the visuals and music. It's... filled with odd bits though, like Madoka hugging someone looking like an older version of her in the nude (and man does that other Madoka have a huge rack), sleeping with a giant banana and having trouble with her

GIANT

PINK

AFRO

I'm hoping that'll show up and that she'll turn out to hide weaponry or a huge plot device in there.

It does make me realize that the one thing I hate about the animation is probably that Madoka looks too soft-lined, big-eyed and small. Isn't she supposed to be a high schooler?

So apparently Kyubey is invisible to other people, and I only just noticed that it has TWO PAIRS OF EARS. That's unusual, but also makes my ears feel weird. I wouldn't like giant floppy bunny ears to come out of my regular ears, even if I had cat ears.

Madoka's mother's kinda scary, but she's likely the least of trouble here.

Kyubey's explanation of magical girls and witches makes me think of Jedi and Sith (not in the least due thanks to the Star Wars marathon last weekend, no doubt). Hmm... I wonder what that'd make Kyubey then. It claims that magical girls are born from wishes and witches from curses, but clearly you need a contract to become a magical girl, so it's a granted wish. I figure the curse is then also imposed and the witches aren't willingly witches, or maybe there's no difference at all and this is just propaganda, kinda like how the Jedi weren't allow to feel a lot of feelings because they'd supposedly lead to the Dark Side, and then Luke turned that all upside down.

Oh, so that dark place in the last episode they suddenly ended up in was a magic maze. That makes more sense than randomly getting in there.

Mami decides to take the other two along on a witch hunt, which she explains about and the contract and right now it all is looking like it's mainly downsides. I wonder how Madoka will get tricked into accepting the contract.

Madoka's quiet friend completely misunderstanding her and Blue Hair hanging out together late into the evening is, while typical, at least a little funny. Still typical, though.

Apparently Homura IS a magical girl like Mami, and according to Mami and Kyubey neither are witches. Homura doesn't seem to want to hurt Madoka or the others directly, just Kyubey, but I wonder how far she'll go after Madoka accepts the contract (because that she does is prettymuch guaranteed, considering the anime title -- aaand now I'm seeing her doodling in her notebook how her magical girl outfit would look like, so yeah, guaranteed). I really wonder what benefits there are to defeating a witch. Probably that's what pushes them eventually to accept. I'm guessing the wish thing features heavily into that.

Homura apparently wanted to finish Kyubey off before it met with Madoka, so they were right in their assumption about her motives. Her wish is clearly very personal, else she would've said what it was. One and one makes two and I'm thinking Homura will be Madoka's ally and friend within one episode of her becoming a magical girl. Two if it happens at the end of an episode.

Blue Hair has taken along a baseballbat?! Dang, wouldn't such a big thing have been clear in her bag from the start? Prolly won't be much use against witches either, unless they're weak. Madoka shows her doodles and is laughed at. Now now, that isn't very nice! Still though, she clearly doesn't understand the seriousness of the situation, unlike her friend.

And the hunt is on. I already was kind of apprehensive once they said witches cause people to commit suicide, so the dark things have started to come in. The witch's kiss thing is rather odd, but sure. Mami transforms Blue-Hair's bat into a giant fabergé egg-stick and they go through the portal.

Mami, why do you throw away your guns after a single shot each time? I'd think a magical girl could somehow reload single-shot rifles with ease. You disappoint me!

Acid trip is again in full force, complete with music. Very creepy music, which is then replaced with generic J-Pop that sounds kinda like the intro, but with a more metal background that I completely dig. The witch looks absolutely weird. Like really, what the freak. I guess witches then aren't people turned into them through curses, but Cthulhoid monsters of sorts? Well, minus the existential dread and insanity.

So defeating witches turns them into eggs that recharge a magical girl's magic, or maybe makes them stronger. Weird. Mami tries to share it with Homura, but I guess Homura is the very competitive type, the way she declines.

Madoka seems really inspired by all this and all happy happy joy joy and doodles further on her designs and I can't help but think she should at least think a bit more about the whole HEY YOUR LIFE WILL BE IN DANGER A LOT DOING THIS AND YOU CAN'T OPT OUT BECAUSE YOU GOT A DUTY TO FULFILL AND A CONTRACT THAT BINDS YOU TO IT. I guess that's why Kyubey picks young girls though, easier to make someone naive accept the contract. Besides, so far there is nothing to indicate the wishes will come true by defeating witches, just that doing that recharges a magical girl's magic, which she only really uses to defeat witches in the first place! A VICIOUS CYCLE, THIS IS.

It finishes to some ominous words from Madoka, "Or so I thought." WHELP, THAT LAST BIT MADE ME WANT TO GO STRAIGHT TO EPISODE 3, BUT THEM'S THE RULES.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 04:07 PM

'm guessing Homura either made a contract with it and got scorned, or she's contracted with some other, similar creature that is enemies with Kyubey, which would mean this anime is really about animals looking like plush toys and using little girls as their fighting tools. It almost sounds wrong.

I'm not going to tell you if you're right or wrong, I'll just point out that you guessed that this show is Reverse Pokémon.

Also I like this thread. It's full of wonderful guesswork.

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 04:07 PM

Very interesting running commentary there, and sadly so little I can respond to without spoilers... Oh well.

Oh dear. I don't suppose that means Utena is very depressing and its ending makes no sense, right?

It might be my Mage bias showing, but I've always read the ending to NGE as a giant Ascension gambit by Gendo.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 04:10 PM

It might be my Mage bias showing, but I've always read the ending to NGE as a giant Ascension gambit by Gendo.

SEELE, actually. Gendo was trying to hijack their ritual for his own personal use.

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 04:12 PM

SEELE, actually. Gendo was trying to hijack their ritual for his own personal use.

The way I always interpreted it though was that Gendo succeeded and was mostly playing SEELE all along. So I guess that's why I tend to think of it as 'his'.

Tiki Snakes

2013-10-29, 04:15 PM

Gendo would make a believable Scelesti, I think.
And I don't really buy him as being successful.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 04:50 PM

Homura apparently wanted to finish Kyubey off before it met with Madoka, so they were right in their assumption about her motives. Her wish is clearly very personal, else she would've said what it was. One and one makes two and I'm thinking Homura will be Madoka's ally and friend within one episode of her becoming a magical girl. Two if it happens at the end of an episode.
I...

I...

I...

YOU'RE SO INNOCENT. *sniffle*

Mami, why do you throw away your guns after a single shot each time? I'd think a magical girl could somehow reload single-shot rifles with ease. You disappoint me!
Come, come. If you can just pull out more guns, why would you bother reloading? "I don't need to reload; I HAVE MORE GUNS!"

Madoka seems really inspired by all this and all happy happy joy joy and doodles further on her designs and I can't help but think she should at least think a bit more about the whole HEY YOUR LIFE WILL BE IN DANGER A LOT DOING THIS AND YOU CAN'T OPT OUT BECAUSE YOU GOT A DUTY TO FULFILL AND A CONTRACT THAT BINDS YOU TO IT. I guess that's why Kyubey picks young girls though, easier to make someone naive accept the contract. Besides, so far there is nothing to indicate the wishes will come true by defeating witches, just that doing that recharges a magical girl's magic, which she only really uses to defeat witches in the first place! A VICIOUS CYCLE, THIS IS.
Oh, if only you knew how close to the mark (and yet so far) you were coming...

Sorry for the scant and spoiler-laden response. It's great to see your reactions so far to the series. (Also, I dig Mami's dance-music-meets-Latin theme song.)

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 04:53 PM

Gendo would make a believable Scelesti, I think.
And I don't really buy him as being successful.

Gonna switch to spoilers because this is getting off-topic.
I don't know, with Archmage stuff, the goal isn't always coherent so much as "conduct a magical ritual at least yea big" to get points toward godhood. Smashing everyone's psyche into one big super-consciousness definitely dings on the scale and is actually pretty orthodox Mastigos stuff (Remember, not being able to read everyone's mind is part of the Lie, at least by Pentacle canon). I wouldn't really be surprised if he got magi-cred out of it, or even an Ascension. Whether or not that's what he wanted, I couldn't say. I also take comfort in the fact that things were presumably retconned by all the other Archmasters afterward...

EDIT: And actually, I don't know if I'd call him a Scelestus so much as a really hubristic Mage. He doesn't seem like he wants to eat the world so much as change it in a really dramatic way, without everyone else's consent.

Tiki Snakes

2013-10-29, 05:06 PM

Arbane

2013-10-29, 05:07 PM

Oh dear. I don't suppose that means Utena is very depressing and its ending makes no sense, right?

Well... I thought it made MORE sense than the end of Eva. And I wouldn't say it was depressing.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 05:39 PM

@CarpeGuitarrem: Is that what that music is? If so, it's rather weird. I'd have to re-listen to it, as it didn't sound like Latin the first time around. It's a weird mash-up though, interesting in its own way, though I'd keep the background of it and change up the foreground to something less poppy.

Also, reloading is FASTER! She could just save up the other guns for when she needs to go full-salvo! Or is that too logical for magical girls? Or is it just my history with shooting bows speaking, where it would be all the FAR more less logical to throw it away instead of reloading?

Hmmm... ballista barrage... *has visions*

Well... I thought it made MORE sense than the end of Eva. And I wouldn't say it was depressing.

It's not hard to make more sense than Eva's end. :smalltongue: But it sounds alright. Perhaps I'll do another of this thread's kind after this with one of the suggestions posted in it. Though I'd likely do two episodes per day then, or do two anime at once.

Sith_Happens

2013-10-29, 05:42 PM

So about half of that pile of speculation is 180 degrees off the mark, the other half is completely-right-but-totally-not-in-the-way-Morph-thinks, and I think this grin is threatening to tear my face in half.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 05:45 PM

So, I just so Morph posted this, but I didn't read anything other than Pink Afro. Colour me intrigued. (Ba-dum tish.)

Episode Two

We open with a transformation sequence. I notice that she seems to be growing hair on top of her hair. Apparently, everyone goes to the same school. I didn't really notice that part last episode, but then, it's obvious. Threatening chord and...
All a dream! Or not, since Kyubey likes to watch little girls sleep.
Paying a little more atention to the opening sequence, a few random observations: There seems to be the Afro morph mentioned. Also, a rather awesome looking giant leech monster. Something I assume are breasts about the size of small cars. Is she trying costumes and transformatin sequences? Random bits of lyrics: "Darkness", "Fear", "You promised", "Time has run out". Overall, though, they seem somewhere between vaguely optimistic and meaningless.
Kyubey is invisible to parents. Interesting. And Madoka has random flashes to people's feet while brushing her teeth. This seems to be a flashback about the last night, when she was invited back to Mami's house. Who has no parents, but a large house. Exposition time.
Magical power comes from small jewelry. Wishes come up again. Gold! Silver! Immortality! FOOD! Your mission is to fight witches. There's that distinction again. I'm guessing the translation is missing some subtlety of the Japanese language again.
Those make-up things are arranged weirdly, the numbers are all out of sequence. Her mother is also thinking way too small, as far as wishes are concerned. But then, I think pretty much everyone is. No one ever asks for proper world-shattering powers, or for science to be advanced by 10'000 years overnight by your own theories.
Anyway, more exposition. Girls good, witches evil. Witches are also invisible. I'm sure this will in no way be important and potentially embarassing later. They really sound more like evil spirits than witches.
"Why don't you come along while I fight some witches?" THIS WILL IN NO WAY BACKFIRE. I'm now wondering if they will even be able to see anything. But then, they can see Kyubey, so I guess they already have that part of the power. They should totally go and have that studied scientifically. Get an MRI or something, it would be interesting anyway. And telepathy.
Third girl immediately jumps to the conclusion that lesbianism is the only possible explanation.
That school still looks like a laboratory animal farm. Walls exist for a reason. Mami's in on the group mind too, and nothing bad ever happens in school.
"I'm watching over all of you." Calling this now, Mami is so dead. Probably this episode or next.
Hm. So killing witches gives you points and high scores. I didn't think of that, that might change a few things.
Angry green haired girl is asleep in school while Madoka is drawing frilly costumes.
Kyubey can eat food. I wonder if other people just see it vanish in thin air or if it has a Somebody Else's Problem field.
You know, if you have two wishes, it's rather logical what you should wish for. Person one wishes that witches never had existed and will never exist again. Person two wishes that both One and Two were omnipotent. Problem solved, series over. Kyubey mentions that he normally only preys on stupid people who don't think things over.
Green girl is being depressed and introspective. Tragic backstory alert.
And we get a stand-off. This is actually quite short.
I wonder why she just can't say "Don't make this deal or Kyubey will eat your family" or something, instead of being annoyingly vague. Remember kids: bad communication may lead to demon possession, ritual magic, soullessness and the apocalypse.
More exposition dump. Green girl is the only one thinking even a bit ahead, but I don't think a baseball bat will affect a soul-sucking spirit of evil. She should call the Ghost busters. Madoka is being silly.
They are flashing to that exit sign a lot. Is that symbolic? Will the sign be damaged as soon as they sign the contract and can't get out?
Soul gems are witch detectors too. And the real world is being all black and red.

Random German graffiti time:
"She falls,
She decays,
A demigod has shattered her.

We carry
The debris out into the void.
And lament lost beauty"

The grammar is surprisingly good for a Japanese show, there's only one minor error.
"Magic eats your soul, Kyubey is evil and in the end you get annihilated in some way." Though this really conveys more a general mood than any actual spoilers, I think. It is a quote from Goethe, though.

Seems to be a crime scene or an accident. High heels and tight skirts are appropriate attire for that.
Witches seem to be more like vampires in this show, really. Incorporeal vampires aren't exactly rare in fiction. Or succubi.

Remember kids: magic prevents suicide. If your friends are suicidal, contact your nearest good witch today!

Witches leave tasteless tattoos on people. That explains so much.

"Powerful one
Of Earth's Sons
Splendid One
Rebuild her
In your embrace rebuild her

New course of life, begin!
With bright meaning
And new songs
Sound from it."

Apparently, someone can grant resurrection? This sounds very like it could be a quote, maybe Goethe, but I don't recognize it. To google! Huh. It is Faust. I thought I knew that reasonably well. And looking it up, it's just after the last bit.
To set the scene: Faust has just made his contract, but is unsure what to do and pacing around, complaining about the world. Not that that's rare with Faust. He curses all the virtues and a choir of minor spirits show up, saying those lines above.
Anyway, into the spirit world.
Sir Reginald Cotton and the Mustache Men are training as background dancers for a musical. I'm actually reminded of ants, passing food along.
Oh my god! Those are the cutest fairy winged, mustachioed shoggoths ever! Squeee!
Aw, she just shoots them. They just wanted to say hello, you moinster.
Everything here has those mustaches. I want to live in that world, screw reality.
The witch, I'm guess that's her, is a formless blow of slime with wings and roses for eyes. The design is really not that impressive, after some of the other stuff we've seen here.
Drop sofa attack!
I guess those rifles are single shot now.
The witch fights with the power of picture collages, while Mami employs rhythmic gymnastics to create the world's biggest phallic symbol. This show has calling your attacks.

The witch drops something which looks like a small black soul gem. Are witches corrupted magical girls?
They call it a witch's egg. You can eat it to refill your mana points.
Actually, the visuals look more like she's transferring negative energy from her soul gem to the witch's.

Homura refuses to take charity, but otherwise refuses to comment, other than look threatening. This is getting stupid. You have this thing called a mouth, girl. It's for talking, which is a form of communication.

SO skipping the ending this time.

How was it?

Better this time. Less boring stuff in the beginning, more beautiful visuals. Surprisingly good fight scene, even if it was short.
I'm really beginning to dislike the Houmura (am I spelling this differently every time? Yes, I am). She seems to know what the problems are with magical girl contracts, but refuses to actually tell Madoka. Despite saying that she wants to save her. Unless she's under some geas or similar, she's an idiot.
I'm surprised how quick and clean the fight was. Mami never really seemed to be in danger. I'm thinking, however, that cannibalizing that witch egg to get rid of your own black energy motes, whatever those were (negative emotions) will be important later.
If magical girls are powered by happiness and witches by bad emotions, are magical girls forbidden to ever feel bad about anything? Is that what she's unloading on the dead witch? Because she seems suspiciously happy and mellow all the time.

Going over the characters:
Madoka: Seems absent minded to an annoying degree. She just sort of seems to float along without much thought of her own, like she's not quite there.
Green hair girl, who I'm sure has a name: The only character I like so far. She's serious, she's prepared, and she's actually considering whether the wish is worth it and what it should be.
Homoura: look at me, being mysterious and angry. I can't tell you why, that would spoil my coolness.
Mami: doomed to die. Also, she's too happy. It seemed almost a bit strained to me, by the end. See thoughts on magic girls and happiness, above.

Faust excerpt of the day, Eldan's impromptu translation:
When from terrible Pandemonium
A sweet sound pulled me
And childlike feelings
Betrayed with airs of merry times,
So I curse all,
That tempts and lures the soul
And banishs it into this cave of troubles
With powers of flattery and glamours.
Cursed be the high opinions
That minds have of themselves!
Cursed that treachery of those apparitions
Which push themselves on our senses!
Cursed that which lies in our dreams
Of Honour and the persistance of names.
Cursed that which we seem to possess,
wives and children, plows and servants!
Cursed be mammon, if he calls us
to brave deeds with his treasures!
Or when he readies the pillows
For our leisure time.
Cursed be the sweet balm of grapes!
Cursed be that highest of all love!
Hope be cursed! Faith be cursed!
And cursed be, above all, Patience!

Sorry, got carried away for a bit, there.

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 06:18 PM

Ooh, someone who likes Sayaka off the bat. That seems unfortunately rare in these LWs.

Tiki Snakes

2013-10-29, 06:20 PM

Since when did Sayaka have green hair?

Eldan

2013-10-29, 06:24 PM

Greenish-blue sort of colour?

Anyway, added bit of speculation.

Wishes make magical girls, curses make witches. But a witch can easily be a curse. So, if someone wished that, say, their archrival would die, does Kyubey go "YOU HAVE MADE AN EVIL WISH, PUNY MORTAL" and turn you into a witch, to be hunted down by the little girl happiness police?

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 06:30 PM

Also, reloading is FASTER! She could just save up the other guns for when she needs to go full-salvo! Or is that too logical for magical girls? Or is it just my history with shooting bows speaking, where it would be all the FAR more less logical to throw it away instead of reloading?

They're muskets, man, not bolt-action repeaters. A soldier was considered ludicrously skilled if he could reload, prime, and fire one musket every ten seconds or so. That's why everyone lined up and fired in a barrage when they were the primary weapon of war, and why Mami just fires and forgets.

Also it's *~symbolic~*

I'm guessing the translation is missing some subtlety of the Japanese language again.

"Magical Girl" and "witch" are etymologically-related but distinct words in Japanese.

"I'm watching over all of you." Calling this now, Mami is so dead. Probably this episode or next.

Either you cheated or you're a lot better at death flags than most people.

Kyubey can eat food. I wonder if other people just see it vanish in thin air or if it has a Somebody Else's Problem field.

Further evidence later in the series suggests that it's the latter.

*Faust*

Okay, maybe you just naturally cheat at this anime by speaking German.

Since when did Sayaka have green hair?

Blue and green are considered two shades of the same color in many cultures.

Anyway, added bit of speculation.

Wishes make magical girls, curses make witches. But a witch can easily be a curse. So, if someone wished that, say, their archrival would die, does Kyubey go "YOU HAVE MADE AN EVIL WISH, PUNY MORTAL" and turn you into a witch, to be hunted down by the little girl happiness police?

What an intriguing question.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 06:41 PM

If I was being granted a wish that I'd have to risk my life for, I'd make darn sure it'd be one truly worth it! Eldan's suggestion of 10000 years advancement of science in a day starting off with my ideas would be a good start.

I admit I originally thought witches and magical girls to be the same thing during my watching of episode one, but considering how a small change in wording can mean a big change in meaning ("Masou Shoujo" being one example), they're clearly not, especially after that Cthulhoid monster's appearance and being declared a witch. Eldan compares their suicide-compelling and kisses to vampires and succubi. I guess that's a good comparison. So witches are non-human-looking-but-possibly-once-human vampiric non-Euclidian succubi that fights by wiggling its big blobs of magic fat or something.

@Nerd-o-rama: I'd think that a magical girl could at least reload her guns with magic. Manifesting a new bullet prolly takes less than an entire gun and bullet, and with her barrage in episode one Mami's shown she can clearly do that.

I wonder when we'll get to see that again, and whether it's the most she can do. Where do you go from there? She seems much like a need-more-dakka type, so I'd half-suspect her to summon cannons at some point, but because this is not Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann, I guess it wouldn't go beyond that.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 06:44 PM

What an intriguing question.

You tease :smalltongue:

Fjolnir

2013-10-29, 06:47 PM

Finishing ep 2 myself, thoughts: 1 Trippy nightmare world is less nightmarish this time around. 2 the school resembles a panopticon prison in some respects. 3 hadoka should probably have used the seed. 4 kubey is really soft selling this. 5 I laughed at the bat and am happy someone at least thought to bring a knife to the gunfight. 5 omg magic pretty princess bat! 6 so the grief seed absorbs magic damage and is an ether? 7 evil magic=bad tattoo or a handlebar moustache apparently 8 those rifles look like she should be swinging them from the barrel end more often than she does.

Madoka is going to wish for something that can be fulfilled by becoming a magical girl with no actual reward given. Malicious wishes make witches, or if there is no difference, make witches faster

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 06:51 PM

@Nerd-o-rama: I'd think that a magical girl could at least reload her guns with magic. Manifesting a new bullet prolly takes less than an entire gun and bullet, and with her barrage in episode one Mami's shown she can clearly do that.

I wonder when we'll get to see that again, and whether it's the most she can do. Where do you go from there? She seems much like a need-more-dakka type, so I'd half-suspect her to summon cannons at some point, but because this is not Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann, I guess it wouldn't go beyond that.

All I can say is that everyone's magic works in pretty highly specific ways, which you'll see more of as more characters are introduced. Well, okay, their attack magic. Mami seems to be able to do whatever she wants with those ribbons, really.

And what's Tiro Finale but a cannon, after all?

Oh, and as an aside on the music, I don't think Mami's theme song is real Latin, I think it's just supposed to sound like it. The more dramatic vocal song used during some battle scenes I think is legit Latin. I think.

Morph Bark

2013-10-29, 06:53 PM

"Little girl happiness police". That phrase makes me suddenly think of this setting as being that latest My Little Pony show, but with human characters and while not necessarily pretending everything is super-okay ever.

I'm sad that mustaches are affiliated with evil though. WHYYYY

Nameless Ghost

2013-10-29, 06:58 PM

It's pretty amazing how much of the speculation is so along the right lines and how much is so far off the mark all at once. Not that I'm going to say how of course.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 07:02 PM

Pokonic

2013-10-29, 07:09 PM

AttilaTheGeek

2013-10-29, 07:37 PM

By the way, I'm now moderately invested in this show too... want to ramp this up to two episodes a day?

If I don't go off on a one hour Faust reading spree again next time in the middle of writing, it will be a lot quicker, too.

do it do it do it yes yes yesssss

At that rate, they'll get to episode eight by friday and finish the series by the end of the week. Either way, I expect them to have very different reactions to Mami's death in episode three.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 07:38 PM

Oh, and as an aside on the music, I don't think Mami's theme song is real Latin, I think it's just supposed to sound like it. The more dramatic vocal song used during some battle scenes I think is legit Latin. I think.
I didn't stop to check--I just know that the title is Credens Justitiam or something like that.

At the same time, it could certainly be Kajiura-ese. Though she also uses Latin ("Salva Nos" in Noir). So I'm not sure.

Also, seeing as we have a Triple Threat watchthrough of PMMM on this thread sorta makes me want to go back in time or something (maybe just a mind-wipe) so that I can watch it all over again, unspoiled. Just to be amongst the company of those who are speculating over what's going on and what's going to happen.

Eldan

2013-10-29, 07:58 PM

"Believing in Justice"?

Man. This show is pretty damn subtle, isn't it :smalltongue:

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 08:34 PM

It's Gen Urobuchi. He's about as subtle as his protagonists.

http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/8726/kaynethtrolled.jpg

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 08:39 PM

It's Gen Urobuchi. He's about as subtle as his protagonists.

http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/8726/kaynethtrolled.jpg
He may be amoral as all get-out, but blast it all if Kiritsugu doesn't have his own flavor of style.

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 08:51 PM

His goal seemed to be pretty much to kill himself and everyone else, to end the world in a vast gloopy mess as the very rules of the world are broken apart into meaninglessness.

All in some vague hope that he would get to see his dead wife along the way. For bonus points, he did a lot of pretty terrible, creepy stuff even by mage standards.

And then he isn't even the one who apparently ascends, his worthless pawn of a son somehow gets put in the position of the decider.

Not that I can really adequately put the idea into words, but I'm sure you get the gist. Something about how he had no interest in anything greater, beyond or to come, just in destroying and revisiting and making terrible deals with unearthly things to get it, all whole basically destroying his own son's ability to essentially be human?

I suppose it depends on what part of it you put most emphasis on. I sort of took the combination of human consciousness to be a key component, but maybe that was just Shinji's own issues projected onto things. At any rate, destroying the world isn't necessarily a Scelesti-only thing, especially for Archmasters.

Since when did Sayaka have green hair?

Dunno, I'd call it blue, but I was going by the description of her actions. I would argue Hitomi has green-er hair, although I think it's intended to be a sort of dirty blonde-ish?

He may be amoral as all get-out, but blast it all if Kiritsugu doesn't have his own flavor of style.

He's an ur-Guardian, that's for sure.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-29, 09:00 PM

He's an ur-Guardian, that's for sure.
Did somebody say...."Ur"?
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-G5g4QndpJJ0/TvLJ5_thZhI/AAAAAAAANQ8/LjPgZuKzgqM/s1600/gilgamesh%2Barcher.JPG

the_druid_droid

2013-10-29, 09:03 PM

Did somebody say...."Ur"?
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-G5g4QndpJJ0/TvLJ5_thZhI/AAAAAAAANQ8/LjPgZuKzgqM/s1600/gilgamesh%2Barcher.JPG

*ba dum tish*

Cikomyr

2013-10-29, 09:06 PM

2 a day would require too much coordination between the two LW writers. Except for Da Finale (which ends te series anyway and is meant to be watched as a double feature), I'd rather you keep it at 1 a day, and just reflect on what you've seen :smallbiggrin:

Terraoblivion

2013-10-29, 09:28 PM

I think it does to shoujo 'genre' what Evangelion did to giant robots, but I seem to be in a minority on that view.

There is no such thing as a shoujo genre. Nor can an anime be shoujo. Shoujo is one of the main demographics that manga is published in and holds stories of pretty much any genre you can imagine. Not just that, the manga demographics don't exist in any medium other than manga as they're publishing constructs in that specific industry.

That said, Utena borrows a whole lot of aesthetics and motifs from shoujo manga, most notably Rose of Versailles and Sailor Moon, but it also borrows a lot from Takarazuka Review, fairy tales, children's song and absurdism. It is also one of the most unique, visually interesting shows I've ever seen.

Blue and green are considered two shades of the same color in many cultures.

Yes, but I'm pretty sure that no part of the greater German cultural area is among those. Germany certainly isn't, nor is Scandinavia.

And, Eldan, 10,000 years of scientific advancement would be a terrible wish as it is pretty much entirely meaningless. Not only does it presume that there is a single line of advancement of science and a clear sense of progress, it also ignores all the political, ecological or cultural variables that can influence how research develops. It also doesn't really say anything about which 10,000 years to use it as a yardstick so if it was, say, 190,000 BC to 180,000 BC results might be underwhelming. And, of course, we don't actually know what will be discovered in the future making it quite a gamble.

Also, about Madoka looking younger than a high school student. That's probably because she's a middle school student. At least insofar as anime cares about the actual age of characters when drawing them, the ones in Utena look freakishly old for middle schoolers instead, for example.

He may be amoral as all get-out, but blast it all if Kiritsugu doesn't have his own flavor of style.

I dunno, I honestly find him a void of interest making everything around him less interesting by sheer proximity to his black hole of predictable boredom.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-29, 09:31 PM

I dunno, I honestly find him a void of interest making everything around him less interesting by sheer proximity to his black hole of predictable boredom.

My problem with him was he was completely uninteresting as a character. As a means of effectively and hilariously dispatching other characters I didn't like, on the other hand, my only complaint is he wasn't faster about it. He gets talked up as this hardass no-nonsense assassin, but frankly other than the exaggeration of rumors I don't even know how he got that reputation when he takes like fifteen minutes to coup-de-gras a dude he has beaten.

Fjolnir

2013-10-29, 10:19 PM

I am just cruising through the series posting small stream of consciousness reactions to each episode so I am going to keep cruising and move to spoilers...

first thoughts: the end of the episode bookends the start interestingly.(what was your wish? mami's death) 2: finally competent magic girl #2 says "field trips into the acid zone are probably bad ideas" and threatens to make her stop. 3: Didn't they say that witches spawning at hospitals were VERY bad news? Like Highly above average bad news? Why not leave the telepathic capricious fey there and BOTH attempt to find Mami? 4: The nature of wishes is becoming more clear, and mami's reluctance to let them capriciously spend their wish actually has a well thought out reason. 5: what is mom's job at mystericorp? it seemed in the previous episode she had some heavyweight pull, but in this one she seems more like a girl friday. 6: a warning against wishes that seem altruistic but really are about gaining an advantage over someone. 7: when the other magic girl shows up, let her help, especially since she obviously knows something you don't about the situation. 8: Kubey claims that madoka will have supar magic or sommat. 9: AAAnd madoka puts mami straight off her game heading into the boss battle... 10: speaking of capricious wishes... 11: Honaka seems highly competent, and this seems to be a much stronger witch than before. 12:more warnings against becoming a magic girl, besides the death of their mentor, but they won't stick. 13: new depressing end theme that seems to be about wishes, magic, and time...

first of all, love that the characters have serious second thoughts about the idea of a contract, neither of them seem to really relish the magical girls idea. 2: Honaka reinforces this by pointing out that every magical girl dies in a way that leaves them missing from the real world, good for her. 3: good for Madoka, offering to keep their memories alive. 4. Honaka warns that her niceness could be a weakness. 5. Poor, poor prodigy, it's too bad you can't learn an instrument where you only use one hand to play it or something. 6. Sayaka rightly realizes that this is probably a wish that would be construed as a "bad wish" 7. but it appears that her friend (brother?) wallowing in self pity may move her to a poor decision anyhow. 8. Madoka sees a friend with a witches kiss, and decides to follow. 9. I am assuming that the chemicals that are being mixed are some sort of ammonia compound and bleach, that is pretty much the simplest compound poison that will gas the lot of them. 10: way to save lives madoka, now if you only threw the bucket through the lower window rather than the upper one, you would be in good shape. 11: bet you wish you had your pet wishing cabbit now hrm? 12: nm, looks like kubey wasn't done with your friend after all. 13: never mind that honaka is in town, couldn't even wait for the corpse to become good and disappeared before calling in the nasty magic girl, then to further make it a problem by then immediately telling her that the territory has been claimed by the newbie, rather than the highly experienced magic girl who was also at the scene of the last witch attack. 14: still a capricious fey, but definitely one that thrives on some form of strife to supplement its diet of stolen souls.

Sith_Happens

2013-10-29, 11:24 PM

EDIT: Just to clarify that presumably we're still using Morph and Eldan to mark the spoiler line. So Fjolnir, assume that all spoiler tags are still dangerous.

Wow. Eldan totally just correctly predicted the entire series.

...Except Homura.:smallamused:

Fjolnir

2013-10-29, 11:47 PM

I know, that is why I went into spoilers after I passed them, I am watching ep 5. currently and then probably to bed.

for starters, just from trope knowledge I know there is nothing good going to come of the way Sayaka is talking. 2: Homura pretty much confirms this, and also points out what we know from red haired girl and Mami's own lessons, most magical girls are in it for themselves. 3: Madoka wants to patrol with the highly inexperienced witchhunter, no way this can go wrong. 4: wishing cabbit pretty much wants madoka's soul so bad it can already taste it. 5: Red haired magic girl wants the territory, NOW kubey mentions Homura, and that she is somehow anomalous to the standard magical girl scene. 6: Rooftop concert is kinda interesting, still dunno if boy is friend or family. 7: redhair and sayaka meet and immediately clash over "champion of the people" and "Moar Powah!" viewpoints. 8: see point 4, though to be fair this is a fairly serious situation for her friend, also we get confirmation that different wishes confer different subpowers, such as enhanced healing. 9: Homura shows up, ladies to neutral corners now. 10: I didn't notice it last episode but the swords look to be stylized to look somewhat like a violin bow haven't they? 11: at least the red haired girl didn't try to spin it for the greater good or something.

jseah

2013-10-30, 12:18 AM

Actually, what you said might be worse now. I can actually read German. Now I'm tempted to pause every so often when they show up and read the runes. D:

No worries, the runes are a substitution font similar to wingdings.

So apparently Kyubey is invisible to other people, and I only just noticed that it has TWO PAIRS OF EARS. That's unusual, but also makes my ears feel weird. I wouldn't like giant floppy bunny ears to come out of my regular ears, even if I had cat ears.
I think of it as giant earhair. =D

Wishes make magical girls, curses make witches. But a witch can easily be a curse. So, if someone wished that, say, their archrival would die, does Kyubey go "YOU HAVE MADE AN EVIL WISH, PUNY MORTAL" and turn you into a witch, to be hunted down by the little girl happiness police?
I am totally stealing this.

That sounds like a perfect plot for a magical girl story.

endoperez

2013-10-30, 12:53 AM

Hehe.

No one ever asks for proper world-shattering powers, or for science to be advanced by 10'000 years overnight by your own theories.
Person one wishes that witches never had existed and will never exist again. Person two wishes that both One and Two were omnipotent. Problem solved, series over.

:smalleek: Hahahahaha. Haha. *Sniff*

Werekat

2013-10-30, 01:02 AM

First, let me just say I love the people with the MtA Gendo discussion. :P And Utena's certainly worth a "Let's watch": another amazingly well-structured series.

@CarpeGuitarrem: Is that what that music is? If so, it's rather weird. I'd have to re-listen to it, as it didn't sound like Latin the first time around. It's a weird mash-up though, interesting in its own way, though I'd keep the background of it and change up the foreground to something less poppy.

The Latin OST names are also proper Latin, yes. I'm not so sure about the singing, though; can't make out the words well enough.

Also, reloading is FASTER! She could just save up the other guns for when she needs to go full-salvo! Or is that too logical for magical girls? Or is it just my history with shooting bows speaking, where it would be all the FAR more less logical to throw it away instead of reloading?

AFAIR, creating something with magic in that world requires understanding it and has some other laws that are found by trial and error. Mami originally wanted regular guns, but was only able to make single-charge muskets. So she compensates.
Additionally, anyone remember the myth of der Freischutz? ;-)

Arbane

2013-10-30, 02:21 AM

Did somebody say...."Ur"?
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-G5g4QndpJJ0/TvLJ5_thZhI/AAAAAAAANQ8/LjPgZuKzgqM/s1600/gilgamesh%2Barcher.JPG

Oh, please.

That guys is OBVIOUSLY a First Age Solar Exalted. Nobody else manages to be THAT arrogant. He even dresses the part, golden armor and everything!

At least insofar as anime cares about the actual age of characters when drawing them, the ones in Utena look freakishly old for middle schoolers instead, for example.

Yeah, I find myself reflexively adding 4 years to the declared age of all the Utena characters.
Which lowers the show's Squick Value.... which is obviously not what the writers had in mind. :smalleek:

Morph Bark

2013-10-30, 04:28 AM

Did somebody say...."Ur"?
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-G5g4QndpJJ0/TvLJ5_thZhI/AAAAAAAANQ8/LjPgZuKzgqM/s1600/gilgamesh%2Barcher.JPG

You are now one of my favourite people in this thread.

Not so much because I love that character (I'm extremely partial to Zero Rider :smallbiggrin:), but that series is easily in my top 5. Plus, y'know, that someone saying one of the makers of Fate/Zero was one of the creators of Madoka as well kickstarted this thing.

2 a day would require too much coordination between the two LW writers. Except for Da Finale (which ends te series anyway and is meant to be watched as a double feature), I'd rather you keep it at 1 a day, and just reflect on what you've seen :smallbiggrin:

While I'd love to pick up the pace together with Eldan, I agree. Plus I'm starting my new job in a few days, so the only way I could do two episodes would be right after one another, and that takes away from the fun of speculating what will happen in the next one! Let's do the final two episodes together though, just like it's meant, similar to with a lot of other series.

John Cribati

2013-10-30, 07:16 AM

Well, Eldan can just start putting his reviews in a spoiler if he's going to be watching ahead of you. It would just be up to the rest of us to not spoil you just because Eldan is ahead.

Eldan

2013-10-30, 07:35 AM

Nah, I'm not doing that. Half the fun is reading Morph's review right after I did mine.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 08:20 AM

I can't wait to see the synchronized reaction from Episode 3.

Morph Bark

2013-10-30, 08:40 AM

Nah, I'm not doing that. Half the fun is reading Morph's review right after I did mine.

This is the moment where we brofist, except with a tentacle and a magical-girl-gloved hand.

I likewise enjoy yours, gives me extra things to think about I may have missed before going into the next episode. Kind of like watching a series as its coming out and discussing it, except while being watched by people from the future who already know how it ends. Or maybe the creators of the show.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 09:03 AM

I likewise enjoy yours, gives me extra things to think about I may have missed before going into the next episode. Kind of like watching a series as its coming out and discussing it, except while being watched by people from the future who already know how it ends. Or maybe the creators of the show.
Oh my gosh.

WE ARE ALL HOMURA.

Cikomyr

2013-10-30, 09:30 AM

Oh my gosh.

WE ARE ALL HOMURA.

And we are doomed to watch peoples do the very same mistakes. Time after time. :smalleek:

Time after time (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9lFT8n1dxs). :smallfrown:

Suddenly, I find these Let's Watch depressing

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 09:37 AM

And we are doomed to watch peoples do the very same mistakes. Time after time. :smalleek:

Time after time (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9lFT8n1dxs). :smallfrown:

Suddenly, I find these Let's Watch depressing
Eeeeeeeyup.

And yet we keep going back to them, again and again and again...

AttilaTheGeek

2013-10-30, 09:40 AM

I can't wait to see the synchronized reaction from Episode 3.

Oh man. But didn't Eldan call it already?

Cikomyr

2013-10-30, 09:40 AM

Eeeeeeeyup.

And yet we keep going back to them, again and again and again...

Yet they never listen. Why do they never believe us?

Edit: actually, you may want to spoiler your post, please, CarpeGuitarrem

Morph Bark

2013-10-30, 09:40 AM

Watching episode three now, as I'll have little time for it in the evening.

EPISODE DREI (3)

Blue-Hair/Sayaka visits a boy at the hospital. First guess was brother, but the way she reacts to him she's clearly interested in him romantically (she's at the age you get HORMONAL SURGE after all). Flashback cues, so she's seen him before, playing the violin. Kid's broken his arm, it seems, sucks to be him. I'm guessing he might figure into Sayaka's wish later on somehow.

After the opening, Mami is seen again fighting witches, this time with a single-shot pistol of size that would make it fit easily into a 17th century-themed mecha anime. Madoka and Sayaka are along for the ride again, but they don't seem to be magical girls yet. I'd wonder why they haven't taken the contract yet after seeing the first witch hunt already, but I'm guessing they either don't have the wish thing down yet, or it's simply better for narrative flow and they wanted to show some action first.

Oh, wait, it was a familiar? M'kay? Familiars can apparently turn into their former witchmistresses now. Seems to me like there might be some age-old uber-witch then that constantly takes familiars, lets them go and thus breeds more witches that are copies of herself (itself?). Are these witches [i]that different from normal witches? I mean, normal witches allegedly are total sex nuts and hang around with the devil all the time, but I guess they don't in this anime, probably because the devil is one foot tall, fuzzy and appears to have no orifices when it's not eating.

...I'm reading into this way too deeply and disturbingly. Moving on!

So Mami's wish was basically to live. Nice to see that Kyubey isn't above exploiting the troubling situations of others! Just kidding. Aaaand yep, Sayaka seems to want to make a wish for violin-boy, but is basically told that if she does that for selfish reasons (so that he'll thank her, go out with her, have pretty babies with her IMEANWUT), it'll likely go wrong. We're spared the cautionary tale of what exactly happened with the previous instance of that (though I AM curious now), but it seems like most magical girls wish for selfish things for themselves then. Whelp, putting wishing power in the hands of little girls and telling them if they don't wish for something for themselves bad things will happen sounds like something that could never go wrong!

Kyubey does tell them to hurry up, and from what Mami says in reply I guess Kyubey is male then. As he talks with Madoka in bed, we zoom in on his face when he says Madoka is the most talented girl he's met and will produce a big magical egg. OH YEAH, LIKE THAT ISN'T CREEPY AT ALL. (It's also totally not creepy that it makes me imagine laying eggs. N-not at all.)

After Madoka's mom gets home, she has a chat with her dad and it seems it clears things up for her as to what she might wish for. In the meantime Mami and Homura meet and talk about Madoka, in which it becomes clear Mami is just a servant to Kyubey and Homura probably has prophetic powers of some sort that makes her want to prevent Madoka from becoming a magical girl and cause Ragnarok or something.

SURPRISE, WITCH EGG! Madoka, Sayaka and Kyubey stand around for wayyy too long talking about it, but at least Madoka dumps her bag when she goes to search for Mami, and Kyubey stays behind with Sayaka (probably to protect his assets). Soon, the witch breaks free and the two are absorbed into the maze. All of a sudden I'm saddened that I haven't played more Persona, I probably could draw a lot of comparisons between the maze and things like the TV world in Persona 4. And of course, Kyubey instantly tries to get Sayaka to make the contract.

Once Mami and Madoka arrive and enter, they run into Homura, who is then bound by Mami and tries to convince her to let her go, because this witch is different from the others. I have a feeling this will come back to bite Mami and the others in the ass SEVERELY, even though this maze looks like a warped candyland inhabited by giant cyclops-mice. Madoka talks to Mami about her wish, and Mami seems to be a bit annoyed by how Madoka doesn't get to the point right away as she keeps going on about how she doesn't have any talents (similar to a lot of magical girl protagonists, the other ones usually being insanely talented from what I've heard).

We see even more of Madoka being really naive about being a magical girl, as her wish is basically only just that (but I figure that might be the thing that saves her in the end after things go wrong). Mami seems to hate that, but has an emo lesbian moment with Madoka as Madoka tells her she'll fight by her side and be her friend and the usual magical girl things that remind me of Nanoha and Fate. (Except Mami has guns instead of a laserscythe.)

Mami tries to talk some sense into Madoka about her wish after wiping away her tears, and Madoka visibly gets uncomfortable at the mention of billionaire boyfriends (Madoka x Bruce Wayne's heir), and upset at the thought of becoming a magical girl just for cake. (I dunno, seems like a good deal to me.)

Mami gives us a good gunshow as she magicks up some guns from every bodypart. I can't really believe that that little thing is a witch aaaaand it's not really, some giant thing just came out of its head and--

--it completely murders Mami?

Really.

That's what happens. A character that shows up on all the posters and seems like a main character (though she's clearly shown to be just a servant to Kyubey in this episode) is killed. Huh. I honestly had given her at least one more episode before that would happened. I guess I lost my bets now.

I'm... I'm guessing that's the twist? I mean... after that Homura straight up owns the thing with lots of explosions that would make the MythBusters and Michael Bay proud of her, and then she acts all cold and takes the egg. Is... is this it? I mean yeah, I was just starting to like Mami, but... yeah. It's just some shock, but not the emotional loss I felt over Kamina, Shirley or even L.

I guess the twist is to never trust twists?

Cikomyr

2013-10-30, 09:45 AM

John Cribati

2013-10-30, 09:52 AM

This was basically what happened when I got to that episode (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7l-cX5AoSbU)

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 10:03 AM

I think it depends on how attached you were to her, and how much of an impression she made on you. For me, it was also definitely a "...oh. That happened. Wow." moment. Notably, the "things get real" moment. Not that you couldn't see the tone coming.

Then there's moments when viewers do get attached to Mami...

For reference, here's the appropriate quote from episode 1 of Herp's "Let's Watch Madoka!" thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16171628&postcount=5)...

And then, in the most metal thing I have ever seen in a Magical Girl Anime, she summons a million guns and shoots the mindf**k until it goes away.

This makes me very happy, because whenever there's a series that involves magic in combat, someone eventually brings up guns would work just as well. Well now the guns are magic. WHERE IS YOUR GOD NOW?

I'm sure you can see how what happened next was soul-crushing devastation. (Heh, side note: you have three massive death spoilers in your post up there. Most people have seen the shows referenced, but...)

I suppose what I said in the earlier post was vague enough to be spoilerish, so I can cryptically spoiler it.

Also, given Morph's character interests, I'm interested to see if maybe there comes a moment of anguish five episodes down the line or so...

Morph Bark

2013-10-30, 10:31 AM

@Morph: just give yourself some time.

But yes, many people didn't see the events of this episode coming, and were particularily upset at the final event. Hell, we laughed our asses off when Herpestidae told us candidly "Mami Tomoe is my favourite character!!!" in episode 2. :smallbiggrin:

Dawww, Herpy...

This was basically what happened when I got to that episode (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7l-cX5AoSbU)

Followed by this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKc7f0k_g9w)?

Arbane

2013-10-30, 11:22 AM

And THAT is why everyone says "just watch the first three episodes".

Terraoblivion

2013-10-30, 11:43 AM

You're right that ordinary witches are total sex nuts (http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Marisa#Fandom).

Eldan

2013-10-30, 12:02 PM

That was early. Well, then.

Episode 3:

The opening is being romantic. In a sort of obnoxious way. Sayaka has a love interest. Also, I can actually remember her name now, since I googled pictures of her to check if her hair was actually green or if I'm just colour blind. I am colour blind and it's blue.

That guy has a nice collection. I can't tell if that's paperbacks or DVDs, but it's nicely sorted anyway. Meanwhile, things happen in the foreground. Guess it's DVDs. Oh, no. Classic CDs. Meh. I thought this was the future. If you have touch screens everywhere, surely you have iTunes. Isn't that player far too small to fit a CD into it?

That's one very expensive hospital. Violinist broke his arm. Bad luck, I guess. Is that her wish, then?

Skipping the opening this time.

This witch likes soap bubbles. Or Yog-Sothoth. Liked, rather.

Madora and Sayaka play audience. Not a witch, a familiar. Interesting. They are baby witches, then. Hm. That opens some speculation I'll get into later.

Mami's wis. Let's see. Car accident. Not a well-thought out wish, but then, she even mentions she couldn't think. Kyubey really likes going for the weak ones, it seems. I agree that living as a magical girl seems better than dying, at least. But then, I'm a transhumanist and consider death the worst possible fate. I digress.

And Sayaka loses a few points in my book. Come on, don't make such small wishes as "I wish that guy was healed". At least wish "I wish Doctors suddenly found an easy way to heal all broken bones and restore manual dexterity and nerve and muscle damage instantly in all cases."

Ah. So there are evil wishes. Seems I was right on that one. But if "I wish I was the one who saved him" is bad, surely "I wish I survived" is worse.

Kyubey hurries them along. Well, well. "I'm not pushing you" indeed.

If Madoka's wish is to be just a magical girl, I'll slap her. So hard. Metaphorically.

"I'm slow and there's nothing good about me". From what we've seen of her, I'm sort of agreeing with that assessment. Even if that sounds meaner than intended.

Ah. Your wish defines your magical power. Some people have larger soul gems than others. Larger souls, too? And killing witches is the only known way to refill your soul gem. If you run out, that might mean you lose your soul?

Madoka is the chosen one with super potential. Or Kyubey is lying to sucker her in.

Drunk mother passed out on the floor. Wonderful. And she's an aggressive drunk. Hm. Potential wish number two, as mentioned last episode.

Father bonding moment. "Your mother is happy doing the hard work yourself, don't waste your wish on her." Well, that one's averted then, hopefully. Or we get a tragic wish that ends badly when mom hates being instantly promoted for no reason.

Homura again. She finds it annoying that Kyubey could make more girls. I can't figure her out yet, there's too many ways she could go. Is there a limited amount of magical power to go around and she wants it all for herself? Does she want to save Madoka specifically? Is she just a bitch? Who knows.

More "Madoka is so great" chatter. And more evidence for "I have to be the strongest there is."

Grief seed in a wall. Ominous.

Also, my pie just finished baking. Om nom nom dinner. Needs to cool first, though back to the episode.

Witch eggs can hatch. Was that mentioned before? I seem to have forgotten.

Sayaka stays behind to guard the seed. I sort of hope she isn't the one dying, she's the only really interesting characterso far. But she has to protect her boyfriend.

Madoka doesn't steal one of the bikes. After they show them so prominently. I'm disappointed.

And the egg hatches five seconds later.

Nice. The witch is a nurse. And her servants are... ladybirds with spirals for heads and nurse outfits? Lots of syringes and needles. Hm. Rat tails on the servants.

Yes, walk deeper into the labyrinth. I thought Sayaka was smarter than that. Kyubey is pressuring her again, the little con... creature. Sayaka is not having it. Good. And she found the egg, in surgery.

This dreamscape has chocolate and strawberries. I'm not seeing the downside, even if I'm missing Sir Reginald Cotton and the Moustache Men. The servants are racing hospital beds. Looks like they're having fun.

Oh, the witch hasn't hatched yet. The labyrinth goes up first. Magic wakes her up, though.

Cookie infusions. And scalpels. And more deserts. I wish I had baked a sweet pie instead of a meat pie. Makes me hungry.

Donuts. Maybe fried apples. Jelly. Cookies.

Little Miss DarkFace is here too. Delightful. Yes, waste time arguing, there's no pressure at all. Betting one of them uses too much magic while arguing and wakes up the witch.

Seems it's Mami. And it's a super witch.

Pie. And sugar canes. Kiwis.

Caramels. Bretzels. Those servants are cute.

Cherries. I just realized that this witch is hiding in a gingerbread house.

Oh, good, finished with the food. My stomach is rumbling. Except the medicine is labelled strawberry. Mm. Strawberry pie. Are those preserved organs in the bottles?

Madoka has self-worth issues. Kyubey really knows how to pick them.

Gah more food. Stop it, show. And cheese too. That's below the belt line, man. Are those vermicelles? Kream is not spelt with a K.

Madoka is really that stupid with her wish, isn't she?

"Don't be like me". My "Dying soon meter" goes up another notch. Good, that means it won't be Sayaka's turn yet. Her life is horrible, apparently.

Madoka doesn't get it.

"I'm your mentor". The Dying meter! It's exploding!

Dinner and a cake. DINNER AND A CAKE?! ****.

Okay. If Kyubey didn't tell her to say that, she's spectacularly dense. Madoka certainly is.

Transformation sequence. And all the servants see it. Zerg rush time?

Yup. Countered by Gun-Kata.

"First time I'm happy." "I'm not scared anymore". Poor, poor Death Meter. He wasn't made for this. Rest in peace.

Cupcakes. With strawberries. And... lego bricks?

The witch is hiding in a cereal box. Called "Montpellier Jazz Berries?" Huh.

It's a little girl with a rune name. Good at dodging, too.

Nope, too easy. That's not the witch, is it.

Ah, that's the witch. And it's the scariest thing I've seen yet in this show.

Waffles.

Mami's just standing there.

Is that all? I was expecting a bloodier death. Something gory, after everyone told me this would be so extremely shocking. At least an impalement. This is pretty damn clean.

Kyubey is using it for pressure.

Homoura interrupts. Fighting in high heels is very sensible, apparently. But then, she can teleport.

Roulade. Choclate waffles. I hope this is over soon, or I'll lose my diet.

Yes, it is. With explosions.

There doesn't even seem to be a corpse from Mami. I wonder if Madoka can wish her back alive.

New ending. A bit bland, really. The singing is quite monotone. Ah, gets better.

So, reaction. About what I expected, really, with one exception. I thought one of them, probably Sayaka, would sign a contract right then and there, to save Mami. Then fail at it anyway. Guess we're saving that for later, though I wonder how Kyubey intends to increase the pressure after that.

Homoura is the new puzzle to solve now. From the connection between souls, witches and her "I want to be the only one/the best" statement, I'm guessing this, spoilered for Morph:

The wish and the size of a person's soul, for a lack of a better term, determine how much power your soul gem starts out with. It probably has something to do with how many positive and how many negative emotions you have.

Fighting witches drains that power. You probably lose some for just living, or for having negative emotions too.

When you reach 0, you probably don't die, but lose your soul. Whatever that means in the show.

Killing witches is how you refill your soul, so you keep pushing the inevitable back. Homoura wants to be the only girl, so she can keep all the soul power for herself and continue living.
Hm. Since they are magical girls, do they stop aging? All the girls we've seen so far are the same age. Perhaps they just don't live long. Could mean Homoura is quite old, if immortality is part of the deal.

So, how are witches made? That's an interesting part. Possibilities I see are:

-Making a selfish or destructive wish.
-Deal with another, non-Kyubey entity.
-Witches running out of soul power.

The Characters:

Sayaka loses a few points in my estimate, her wish doesn't seem to bright, but at least she didn't hastily sign.
Madoka is dense as a brick wall. At least she knows it.
Homoura is... dark and mysterious in a really obnoxious way. I'm feeling as if the show is trying to manipulate me into finding her interesting. Whether I want to or not.

No Goethe this time. I'm hungry.

Edit: and a random observation while I'm eating: the terms witch and magical girl seem misapplied to me. In my mythological experience, witches are either withered magical crones or young beautiful girls who make a deal with the devil for power. Seem familiar? The part I can't see in this show is kissing the devil's backside to make the deal.
Meanwhile, the actual witches seem more along the line of spirits, vampires or succubi. The closest I can think is the witches or nightmares who sit on sleeping men's chest and ride them, an explanation for sleep paralysis and bad dreams.

Terraoblivion

2013-10-30, 12:13 PM

I thought this was the future. If you have touch screens everywhere, surely you have iTunes.

The Japanese still rely on physical media for their music as just one of many expressions of their weird relationship with technology. Government bureaucrats dealing with people in the airport also rely on pens, papers and stamps rather than computers. And heating entire rooms is considered literally impossible if you ask most Japanese people. So for all we hear about futuristic technology in Japan, they're weirdly low tech in a whole lot of ways, including music storage.

Homura again. She finds it annoying that Kyubey could make more girls. I can't figure her out yet, there's too many ways she could go. Is there a limited amount of magical power to go around and she wants it all for herself? Does she want to save Madoka specifically? Is she just a bitch? Who knows.

People who have watched the entire show?

Madoka doesn't steal one of the bikes. After they show them so prominently. I'm disappointed.

That's just Shinbo being Shinbo. He loves bikes and chairs for some reason.

And I love how someone who is so cynical and obsessed with figuring it all out is so completely and utterly wrong on what might well be the most important aspect of the show, just what Homura's deal is. :smallbiggrin:

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 12:17 PM

Edit: and a random observation while I'm eating: the terms witch and magical girl seem misapplied to me. In my mythological experience, witches are either withered magical crones or young beautiful girls who make a deal with the devil for power. Seem familiar? The part I can't see in this show is kissing the devil's backside to make the deal.
Meanwhile, the actual witches seem more along the line of spirits, vampires or succubi. The closest I can think is the witches or nightmares who sit on sleeping men's chest and ride them, an explanation for sleep paralysis and bad dreams.
...okay, now I want to see when Eldan figures it out. Episode 6? Seems to have already copped to the fact that a soulgem holds your soul, or close enough.

endoperez

2013-10-30, 12:18 PM

I have a feeling this will come back to bite Mami and the others in the ass SEVERELY

Morph, you have the BEST accidental predictions.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 12:20 PM

Morph, you have the BEST accidental predictions.
Technical note: she got bit in the head.

Sith_Happens

2013-10-30, 12:36 PM

Homura probably has prophetic powers of some sort that makes her want to prevent Madoka from becoming a magical girl and cause Ragnarok or something.

So close, yet so far.

Anyways, minor nitpick, this is obviously the fault of whoever did the translations you're both watching, but the "witch eggs" are called Grief Seeds.

Eldan

2013-10-30, 12:39 PM

The translation I've seen calls them both, actually. The term used seems to change randomly. It also calles the labyrinths "barriers", which made no sense at all to me. Labyrinth is better.

the_druid_droid

2013-10-30, 01:55 PM

The translation I've seen calls them both, actually. The term used seems to change randomly. It also calles the labyrinths "barriers", which made no sense at all to me. Labyrinth is better.

I think they use the term "barrier" in English too, but that seems to refer to the magic field or whatever it is that keeps the labyrinths contained in Dali space.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 02:09 PM

"Dali space" is the best description of labyrinths that I've ever heard.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-30, 03:16 PM

I think they use the term "barrier" in English too, but that seems to refer to the magic field or whatever it is that keeps the labyrinths contained in Dali space.

"Barrier" is a literal translation of the Japanese term typically used for pocket dimensions like the things in this show. "Maze" or "Labyrinth" is a more figurative and descriptive translation.

Yet they never listen. Why do they never believe us?

I won't rely on anyone anymore.

Morph Bark

2013-10-30, 03:42 PM

Man, two and a half hours of exercising is tiring. Probably because you do it for two and a half hours.

Hm, maybe I should do the episodes earlier from now on. Half the fun in reading Eldan's view on the episode was his hunger. :smalltongue:

(I don't suppose there are more witches that have such mazes, eh? Or would that be a spoiler?)

Eldan, your thinking of that magical power = soul makes me something tick. Using up all magical powers means you lose your soul to the one you got the contract with then, but it would be in the contractor's interest to keep you going for longer and harvest a better soul, more matured through battle and honed through magical experiences and power. Alternatively, I wonder where the souls go if the magical girls are killed. It actually makes me wonder if later down the line we'll see a shade of Mami under Kyubey's control when he shows his true form, whatever that may be.

Morph, you have the BEST accidental predictions.

I do, sometimes, don't I?

Technical note: she got bit in the head.

Ahh, but where do you think the witch bit afterwards? :smallwink:

The translation I've seen calls them both, actually. The term used seems to change randomly. It also calles the labyrinths "barriers", which made no sense at all to me. Labyrinth is better.

Grief seeds and witch eggs are also both used in the one I'm watching. I have no idea why they call the mazes sometimes mazes and sometimes barriers. Perhaps it's like the barrier they're encased by is essentially covering a pocket dimension?

"Dali space" is the best description of labyrinths that I've ever heard.

I'm hoping they throw some Escher in there. Dali and Escher combined would be all kinds of fun wuzzafuggalup.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-30, 03:54 PM

There's some right sharp deductions there...even pegged the "Incubator" aspect.

Sith_Happens

2013-10-30, 04:33 PM

I won't rely on anyone anymore.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA-- kill me.

Eldan

2013-10-30, 04:45 PM

I like the name Dali space. Also, you may laugh at my hunger, but I just ate half a delicious meat pie and then had some tea in a hot bath. I call that a win for my side.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-10-30, 04:47 PM

I'm hoping they throw some Escher in there. Dali and Escher combined would be all kinds of fun wuzzafuggalup.

I definitely recall some Picasso later on...

Arbane

2013-10-30, 05:22 PM

I like the name Dali space. Also, you may laugh at my hunger, but I just ate half a delicious meat pie and then had some tea in a hot bath. I call that a win for my side.

Why would you want to take a bath in tea? That can't be good for your skin.

Morph Bark

2013-10-30, 05:24 PM

Why would you want to take a bath in tea? That can't be good for your skin.

It's better for gaining some colour than to fry yourself in UV rays. Instead of cancer, you get buttburns!

Eldan

2013-10-30, 05:46 PM

Look at my Avatar. I'm an Octopus, I can breathe tea. I can tell you, it beats drinking it by far.

Fjolnir

2013-10-30, 07:07 PM

first off, the episode here actually shows more crappy drawbacks of the magical girl life. 2: Homaru wants to attempt peaceful resolution and give the city to Red haired girl, whose name is apparently Kyoko and tells her about walpurgisnacht coming in 2 weeks. 3: Kubey apparently devours witch eggs that are about to be revivified by using them to clean your soul. 4: though apparently if you use it to clean your soul too many times, the egg becomes a witch again so why aren't magic girls just suiting up, overwashing their gem and going after the new clean grief seed? there must be some downside we aren't told about. 5: Apparently the prodigy is not her brother, and is out of the hospital, as a person who had to rehab after a car accident myself I say hooray! 6: Kyoko is at the home of the RICH violin prodigy, admonishing Sayaka for not making a selfish wish and offering to permanently cripple the kid so he will be forever dependent upon you; so many things wrong with this statement, that morph or eldan will delve into more deeply. 7: That is some grade A bad advice mom, but I guess it is caused by the fact that if madoka told the truth you would probably put her in the rubber room. 8: Kubey just wants your soul madoka, why aren't you trading it for ultimate powah!?! 9: And mom's bad advice leads to puppet strings getting cut and actual exposition while Homaru goes after the lost soul. 10: soul returned, how many more episodes will sayaka get before she finds out that her body is a shell and her soul is in a cheap perfume bottle? 11: Also, does sayaka have a smaller soul gem than the ones we have seen so far, it looks to be a little smaller at least. 12: Kyoko is powerful because she loads up on soul cleaners and knows she can go all out all the time because unless she dies she can wash her gem out. 13: I did like that everyone was appropriately horrified that Kubey rips out your soul and leaves you with essentially an immortal body. 14: Why are there no magic girls that just are filthy rich shutins since you can only go about a football field's distance from your soul while your body is immortal?

Also no more PMMM tonight as it is game 6 of the world series and my red sox have an opportunity to win the whole thing tonight and I am going to be watching that instead.

D_Lord

2013-10-31, 12:27 AM

Not really spoilers. Do not watch the movies, the last one most of all. Author has issues and trolls audience. I hate it when authors get tried of life, or happiness and take it out in their works. Like the book Princess bride. Author got depressed at the end and wrote a tone turn around and invalidated the message of the rest of the book.

Eldan

2013-10-31, 07:51 AM

I know this is far too early, but I'll have to go in about two hours and I have no intention of doing this after midnight when I should be asleep. 'pologies, Morph.

Episode 4

Running. I think that's Violin Boy's bed. He's gone. What a weird carpet, I don't think I could sleep with that in my room.

The nurses explain he's in rehab. Somehow, that's a bad thing.

Seems he hasn't just broken his arm, then. He can barely walk.

Sayaka considers whether her wish is selfish or not. Strange consideration. Of course it is. Everything people do is, in some way. And she has a very obvious crush. Too many negative emotions. You'll damage your mana points.

Apparently, we didn't get a new opening along with the new ending. Even happy Mami is still in it.

I think Madoka is meant to be sad, but she just looks sleepy. But then, I'm really bad at reading anything out of the faces in this show. Why are their heads wider than tall? It just looks weird.

Obviously, the girl crying at the table doesn't like her food. Yes, that's the obvoius conclusion. Now hurry her to school.

And third girl doesn't get it either. I think I have a product idea for this world. Giant signs people can carry around to write their emotions on and how they would like other people to react. I'd make a fortune. Or maybe just signs with smilies, if words are too hard.

Sayaka seems to be playing over it. Or just not to care that much.

That school is still weird. If that's not a secret government psychology experiment to see how quickly they can drive their students insane, the architect should get fired. From a cannon.

Teacher talks about her relationship. Again. I'm still wondering why no one has fired her.

More moping. No one understands them. No one knows. Have you considered telling people? Moving on.

The rooftop scene looks as if someone's preparing a crossover with Mirror's Edge.

Madoka doesn't want to take the contract anymore. I'm wondering what new pressure tactic Kyubey will find. Family member attacked by witch? Bring Mami back from the dead?

Sayaka is inspired by the sacrifice. And asks what will happen to the city without girls. Apparently, there's enough girls to just move in and cover the territory. I now wonder if that's a worldwide phenomenon. Is Kyubey one of many, or is he present in several places?

Ooh, that's a new one. "You can't criticize them if you aren't one of them." Niiice. I admire the little creep. "I can't pressure you into it indeed". Keep saying that. "Well, you cleeeeaaaarly aren't interested so I will just sloooowly walk away from you. Feel free not to stop me at aaaaaall."

Madoka drops her notebook off at Mami's place. The music actually gets the emotion right this time, without being over the top.

And Homura is here to drop the cryptic advice for the week. I assume. Don't blame yourself. "You listened to my warning." No, she didn't. Not really.

What the heck is up with that skyline. Why does this city consist entirely of factories, skyscrapers with street lights on top of them and dead trees the size of the eifel tower? In a different anime, I'd start assuming that the entire city is in fact a witch's labyrinth and we haven't noticed yet (i.e. the "Everyone is in purgatory" trope), but I've been told the maker of this series just has weird taste.

Wait, are they actually talking? I don't believe it. We're over a quarter through this series. You can't start being sensible now. Homura is happy she saved someone. Or says she is. I sitll can't figure her out.

They are walking past silos and tower-sized pressure tanks.

She's evading questions again. "Have you seen a lot of people die?" That's a very deadpan "I have." I'm considering the immortality idea again. Because if she's a teenager of the same age as Madoka, she can't have seen that many fights. Unless Kyubey also takes little kids, which I doubt. THe symbolism would be off.

Was that a Smart? I think it was.

Mami only has distant relatives. That doesn't concern anyone, because as Anime has told me, anyone older than about ten can live on their own in a huge flat with no problem. It's part of the government's Mysterious Orphan program they started after the second world war to create enough mecha pilots, psychics and ghost fighters.

"That's the contract we made." Does Kyubey kill your family?

Actually, now I wonder what would happen if you just didn't fight. Your soul power probably just runs out on its own.

"I won't forget you." Gloomy McDepressionface doesn't buy it. Well, isn't that foreboding. She descends the staircase into the lower industrial hive.

Sayaka talks too much. Violin boy moved on to the anger stage of denial.

That CD player seems like a horrible idea in general, leaving the CD just open and spinning like that. It seems like it would at least scratch it badly.

That's not just a broken arm, then. That's massive nerve damage. Also, "Magic is the only thing that could help me! If only someone near me could sell their soul for a wish!"

And Kyubey is waiting. Of course he is. I think it's my favourite character, the bastard.

And Hitomi got herself a cheap tattoo. And some bad drugs. "I'm going somewhere better than here and you should come with me."

Hey, it's the zombie apocalypse. Maybe we'll finally see some trippy visuals again. She still doesn't have a way to call Homura.

Oooh. Acid and bleach. Chlorine gas is not a pretty way to go.

And they all joined a suicide UFO cult.

The mythbusters showed that zombies can easily knock down doors. That won't stop them for long. It's the TV storage cupboard.

This witch is a blue slime shouting gibberish. I think it's gibberish. I hope the fun part finally starts, the episode is almost over and we had no labyrinth yet.

Angel puppets. Eh. Ooh. Okay, that looked fun. It's the cell shade world. The witch shows her flashbacks on TV. Guess she's getting her mark now.

Is that Sayaka? I think it is. She went for the badass cloak instead of the princess outfit. I approve.

She commissioned a genuine katana in the spirit world for her soul and has been practicing with it for almost 2 minute snow. She can even cut slabs of solid tv screens with her katana.

Oh, look, it's Queen Frownyface. Cut to violin boy. And a power line.

And a new character is introduced. She looks like Madoka's evil twin. Her personality is angry. Magical girls can kill each other. Why didn't I think of that.

Why is the ending talking of shattering hte world and empty futures? Maybe Morph is right with Ragnarök, but I'm not quite seeing it yet. The mood isn't quite right for that, this show seems more about personal ruin instead of global devastation.

Morph Bark

2013-10-31, 08:09 AM

I'm doing it early again today, as my afternoon and evening are completely filled up. Friday evening as well, so tomorrow will be earlier as well. Saturday I dunno, as I'll be gone nearly all day for my first day of work.

EPISODE VIER (4)

The opening scene features Sayaka going to visit Violin Boy Kyosuke, and she reflects on her idea of wishing him to be healthy again. SAYAKA, DARNIT, KEEP IN MIND THAT YOU SHOULDN'T WISH HIM TO BE HEALTHY JUST SO HE'LL MAKE KISSES WITH YOU. BAD STUFF WILL HAPPEN.

Madoka cries over breakfast and makes her family confused. Darnit Madoka, you could at least tell them what's up. You don't even have to tell the details of it, you could've just told them a friend of yours died. Sayaka seems to take it a lot better, but she also hung out with Mami less than Madoka. Madoka stays down the rest of the school day while their teacher still rambles on about why she is entitled to a boyfriend/husband. Someone get that woman a vibrator.

Madoka seems to no longer want to be a magical girl after witnessing Mami's death. Logical result of that, yeah, and smart decision in the first place with all of that bad stuff going on. Sayaka asks Kyubey who will protect them from witches now, which is a good first point, but isn't Homura there, too? Sayaka seems to think Homura isn't cut out for that, and Kyubey neither, who appears to claim most magical girls are only after the Grief Seeds and Mami wasn't. Who says Mami wasn't? She might as well have been, it was either that or death after all, and in the end she got death anyway.

"But I suppose only Puella Magi should have the right to criticize each other." OH YEAH, KYUBEY, REAL NICE, MORE PRESSURE ON THE EMOTIONALLY UNSTABLE LITTLE GIRLS. Right after, he leaves, accepting his losses and going to find other targets. Madoka visits Mami's empty apartment and cries. Y'know, I never got why people in series and movies always cover their mouth. I have the instinct to cover my eyes when I cry, not my mouth. Is that weird?

Madoka runs into Homura and talks with her about the fate of magical girls. Apparently Homura has seen deaths "too many to count" and corpses don't show up if you die in a witch's maze. Dang, so their sacrifices never get known to anyone who wasn't there at the time. That's rather sad. I'd already wondered what happened to Mami's body, since that wasn't shown, but I guess I know now...

Homura tells Madoka that that's just the way it is and they fight only for themselves and their wishes, they've signed a contract for it after all. "It's normal not to get noticed or remembered." That sounds like a very Japanese thing to say. We get to see the clear contrast between Homura the Cynic and Madoka the Idealist.

Meanwhile, Sayaka is at the hospital again and Kyosuke gets angry at her because loss leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and--whoops, wrong series! Sayaka tries to convince him not to give up hope by telling him that magic exists and can save him and riiiiight on cue there's Kyubey! Who woulda known?

Madoka is wandering homewards (presumably) when she spots her other friend Hitomi, who's been bitten by a vampire. I mean taken by a succubus. I mean kissed by a witch. She seems much more formal with Madoka than usual and acts like she's got her head in the clouds as if suicide is the new cocaine. Clearly Hitomi will soon be saved by one of her friends newly turned into a magical girl. I wonder which one will be first.

A lot of other people are going to the same place, so this must be a powerful witch at work. Hmmm, might require more than one magical girl for sure then. TEAMWORK POWERS ACTIVATE?! Madoka recalls a chemistry lesson by her mom, and I forgot what liquids create deadly fumes in contact with water, or maybe it's just Potassium or Sodium (K or Na, dunno if Sodium's the right English name) and things will go boom. Madoka manages to get the bucket and throw it out the window and save everyone, but must then run away from the horde of apathetically rape-faced, suicide-hungry zombies and runs straight into a room where the witch appears. She's then assaulted by little creepy puppet-angels that rip her to shreds.

...she's not dead, is she? I mean, she's the title character and all, but... oh wait, no, there she is, just drawn differently in a pretty interesting style, while she laments about everything. She is then saved from the malicious tv by Sayaka the MAGICAL SWORDSGIRL WEEEE~

Seriously though, I think Sayaka may legitimately be my favourite character here. She scolds Homura for being late and apologizes to Madoka for accepting the contract. We get a shot of Kyosuke with his hand healed in a way that almost makes me think he'll turn evil or something, if he becomes a major character anyway. Then we see Kyubey telling another magical girl the area has been claimed, but she doesn't seem willing to back down. WHELP, GUESS WE GOT A RIVAL, PEOPLE. She looks pretty angry, reminding me kind of Asuka Langley Shoryu from NGE. Considering this show's tone, I have half a feeling she might be willing to straight up maim a bitch. Sayaka, you got your work cut out for you! This "Kyoko's" words make it sound even more ominous. Whelp, Sayaka, your days might well be numbered. Then again, they probably were the moment you accepted the contract, especially with the nature of your wish.

EDIT: OHLOL, HI ELDAN, GUESS WE WERE DOING IT SIMULTANEOUSLY, WHAT COINCEDENCE.

Eldan

2013-10-31, 08:23 AM

Ah, hello Morph. Great minds think alike. So do Anime reviewers.

John Cribati

2013-10-31, 08:25 AM

I ship it.

Eldan

2013-10-31, 08:33 AM

I'm now imagining our avatars skipping through a field together and it's hilarious.

John Cribati

2013-10-31, 08:34 AM

I'm now imagining our avatars skipping through a field together and it's hilarious.

All I can think of is the implications of one half of a ship having tentacles.

Eldan

2013-10-31, 08:50 AM

Eh, my avatar is a transformed human. I just somehow lost my normal avatar.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-10-31, 09:01 AM

*steeples fingers*

Just as planned.

Cikomyr

2013-10-31, 09:03 AM

For all the crap Kyubey seems to get over his remark that "only magical girls can judge others", in a certain point of view; he's right.

These girls are the ones fighting the fights. They are the ones putting their lives in jeopardy to fight witches. Who are these people telling them they should "work in team" and "get along with each others"? Who are they to judge them?

Eldan

2013-10-31, 09:06 AM

Oh, sure. He's absolutely right. He's a totally manipulative bastard, but I don't think he ever outright lied. He's quickly pushing sayaka off the favourite character pedestal.

Cikomyr

2013-10-31, 09:12 AM

Yhea... you should watch SFDebris's review of the show once you will be over. I think you may enjoy it. :smallamused:

Morph Bark

2013-10-31, 01:53 PM

I-it's not like I l-like Eldan or anything!

I do agree that Kyubey might very well not have lied, even if he let loose a lot of manipulation on the girls. Personally though, I am of the opinion that teamwork fetches better results, especially in lethal situations, provided the team works well together. That last part is incredibly important, and for highly emotional pubescent teenage girls working with one another without barely knowing one another, it would be a pretty bad idea. Sayaka and Madoka (and Hitomi?) might well do alright, though. They've known each other for a long time and trust each other a lot.

Eldan

2013-10-31, 04:25 PM

Fine! Dislike me then! It's not as if I have to do these reviews with you! I'll do my own review thread! With Blackjack and Hookers. And pie.

*sob*

Arbane

2013-10-31, 05:42 PM

Fine! Dislike me then! It's not as if I have to do these reviews with you! I'll do my own review thread! With Blackjack and Hookers. And pie.

*sob*

You might as well start your own thread. That way, neither of you needs to worry about getting too far ahead of the other.

Mewtarthio

2013-10-31, 07:40 PM

I think three Madoka threads is a bit on the excessive side. I mean, it's a good show and all, but still...

Also, yay for more Sayaka fans!

Fjolnir

2013-10-31, 09:27 PM

1:So apparently between the last episode and this one they inform her she is a meat puppet. 2: Kubey is pretty much playing any bad wishmaker now, claiming that she really should have looked at the fine print before signing the deal. 3: Kubey demonstrates why the meat puppeting happens by causing TRUE PAIN, good job, you are now sliding towards evil. 4: "You wanted a wish, this is the cost" at least you are still kinda pragmatic about it you vile cabbit. 5: Homura has tried to tell others about this and none of the magic girls believed her, tells madoka that her friend is gone, nothing can be done, that is the price you pay for magic. 6.When Kyoko echoes this and reveals that she created a magic cult for her ex-preacher father with her wish, and now lives a life of "do what I want because I can" and pushes Sayaka to do the same. 8: the other friend likes the boy sayaka spent her miracle on, not good for her. 9: She has a good cry and confronts a witch in a vulnerable emotional state and proceeds to have a rage dump on it while madoka and kyoko watch.

None of this spells anything good for Sayaka, Madoka is trying to be the muggle morale support despite everyone else who peirces the masquerade telling her to get out of the get out of the way. Losing her miracle boy to one of her best friends has to hurt, though I don't think we're about to immediately see a Mami situation develop.

Wow. first thoughts: Kubey is evil, he definitely slid over the event horizon here. 2: do magical girls become more nihilistic as taint increases or is sayaka just this depressed? 3: statistics for a thing that has never shown up before hmm? 4: KUBEY WANTS MADOKAS TASTY SOUL. 5: Blam! 6: ahhh "statistics", time travel statistics 7: Sayaka on a train, a discussion about how to treat women badly, she chews them out with a slightly more mature viewpoint than we thought. 8: Kubey is an incubator hmm? 9: ok, kubey needs witches for some reason... 10: apparently magical girl puberty involves a lot less hair in odd places and a lot more hallucinogens and explosions...

Sith_Happens

2013-10-31, 11:22 PM

Mami only has distant relatives. That doesn't concern anyone, because as Anime has told me, anyone older than about ten can live on their own in a huge flat with no problem. It's part of the government's Mysterious Orphan program they started after the second world war to create enough mecha pilots, psychics and ghost fighters.

This is by far the funniest thing to come out either LW thread so far, and not even in an "I'm laughing to hide the pain" way.

Of course, if you think Mami's apartment is bad you should watch Nanoha. One of the major characters in season two is 9-10 years old, in a wheelchair, and has a HOUSE to herself. It's a two-story, too.

Seriously though, I think Sayaka may legitimately be my favourite character here.

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view/1036966/kira-s-laugh-o.gif

I'm now imagining our avatars skipping through a field together and it's hilarious.

All I can think of is the implications of one half of a ship having tentacles.

Especially when I just realized that Morph's avatar is Yachiru Kusajishi.:smalleek:

John Cribati

2013-10-31, 11:44 PM

This show hates your favorite character. No matter who she is.

Cikomyr

2013-10-31, 11:52 PM

This show hates your favorite character. No matter who she is.

This is why you should root for the guys. Like Dadoka or Edward Brokenhand.

I guess you could root for Kyubey..

I just had a terrible tought. In the Madokaverse, Spectres are the things collecting humanity's despair, and Magical Girls hunt them down. It is said Kyubey's relationship with the Magical Girls is much more honest, since he no longer has an agenda to manipulate them into despair.

I was wondering.. maybe Kyubey's specie are still the ones who created the Spectres in the first place? They still gotta exploit the energy, after all.

the_druid_droid

2013-11-01, 12:04 AM

Of course, if you think Mami's apartment is bad you should watch Nanoha. One of the major characters in season two is 9-10 years old, in a wheelchair, and has a HOUSE to herself. It's a two-story, too.

Well, she did have magical butlers/knights errant >.>

I have to admit, I really like their homeroom teacher although none of the LWers seem to, but I have a soft spot for Anime Homeroom Teacher Syndrome, and just sort of want to hug them and tell them it'll all be ok.

Although I am loving all the Sayaka love up in here. Good stuff!

Mewtarthio

2013-11-01, 12:43 AM

Well, she did have magical butlers/knights errant >.>

She was already living there when they showed up. Heck, I'm pretty sure she has no family at all, seeing as nobody shows up to protest when she starts claiming a bunch of total strangers as distant relatives. I think there might be a handwave about a rich uncle paying for the house or something.

Of course, if you really want to talk crazy living quarters, what's up with Homura's place? I don't think they ever really explain why she lives in what appears to be an Earthbound battle screen, or how she got there.

Arbane

2013-11-01, 01:08 AM

She was already living there when they showed up. Heck, I'm pretty sure she has no family at all, seeing as nobody shows up to protest when she starts claiming a bunch of total strangers as distant relatives. I think there might be a handwave about a rich uncle paying for the house or something.

Her 'rich uncle' is the Space-Time Administration Bureau admiral who was planning to destroy the Book of Darkness, even if it killed Hayate (the guy with the two catgirl familiars). He's the one who made sure if was in her possession in the first place, which is WHY she was in the wheelchair.

the_druid_droid

2013-11-01, 01:52 AM

She was already living there when they showed up. Heck, I'm pretty sure she has no family at all, seeing as nobody shows up to protest when she starts claiming a bunch of total strangers as distant relatives. I think there might be a handwave about a rich uncle paying for the house or something.

I think Arbane has a good point on that one. Wheels within wheels there.

Of course, if you really want to talk crazy living quarters, what's up with Homura's place? I don't think they ever really explain why she lives in what appears to be an Earthbound battle screen, or how she got there.

I always assumed it was a pocket dimension, where she could strategize in peace away from noisy neighbors. It does beg the question of what she tells her family though... Maybe it's boarding-school like since she's a transfer? Iunno.

Morph Bark

2013-11-01, 04:31 AM

I can also recommend Nanoha, or at least the second season. The first is too generic magical girl for me, and I've heard the third one is bad, but perhaps the third one just feels bad because the main characters of the first two seasons are so different in their role.

Especially when I just realized that Morph's avatar is Yachiru Kusajishi.:smalleek:

Kamina shades. The perfect way to hide the fact that you're a little girl. :smallcool:

Anyway, whichever Eldan decides on, I'll support his decision. I'll even bake cookies shaped in such odd ways that it'll be like "did Morph try to make little hearts or--?"

I'll be doing two today, because we did it so early yesterday, and because on Saturday I'll likely have no time at all for this. Doing it this way, Eldan can do sein Ding early today if he wishes, then me again in the early evening, and then Eldan can decide whether he wants to do a second one in the evening or save it for Saturday. Lucky thing we're in the same timezone. I may be getting a bit ahead of myself, but it'd be a shame to let a busy Saturday throw a hole in the pacing, so quickening it up for just once seems like a good idea, and better to have it beforehand than afterwards!

EPISODE FÜNF (5)
in which i'm starting to feel like i'm teaching people counting in german

We see a scene of Sayaka making her contract with Kyubey, but we don't hear what her wish exactly is. Hm. Well, we've already seen Kyosuke's hand all healed and fine, so it clearly was that, right? I kinda hope she wished for it in such a way more like "I wish people dear to me won't suffer physical trauma" or something, in such a way that it counts retroactively. (Of course, dead people wouldn't figure into that, because I presume wishes can't bring back the dead. Though I really think Madoka should ask Kyubey about the possibility.)

Hitomi remembers nothing from the day before from the time she was bewitched, but she appears to be completely fine. Sayaka shows Madoka her soul gem, which is blue, so I'm guessing this series makes the soul games the same colour as the magical girl's hair, so Madoka's would be pink. Sayaka's reasoning for her swift contracting seems sound to me. She might even be good at critical thinking, though in this case the decision was clearly emotionally-driven and she had had plenty of time to think about it beforehand anyway.

This is also the moment I notice that Sayaka's voice would've annoyed me in other anime, but I'm perfectly fine with it here. A bit odd. I'm very audio-oriented, so voices are a big thing for me in media (and real life), but Madoka's sounds too soft and timid. It fits her character very well, but it just shouts "I WON'T EVER DO ANYTHING USEFUL" (but, like, it shouts very softly). Like... kind of like Orihime from Bleach, except there was that one time. Madokaaa, please become a magical girl so I can see you be useful and grow strong as a person! I know I shouldn't urge little girls to make contracts with the devil, even imaginary ones, but it's for your own good!

Sayaka then takes off for an appointment or somesuch, and it turns out to be with Kyosuke. Knew he wouldn't be out of the picture now. Hm, his legs still need rehab and they want to do more testing on his hand. Figures, shoulda thought of that, Sayaka! He apologizes for his outburst, which Sayaka brushes off and then takes him to the roof. Oh, like there's no chance of bad things happening up on the roof. Of course not. Only lovebirds go to the roof, after all. And people jumping off them.

Oh, it's just a party to celebrate Kyosuke's hand healing, also starring his violin teacher! Kyosuke gets handed his violin and starts playing a sad song (then again, most violin solos are), with Sayaka momentarily looking sad about it, but then tells us that she has no regrets and it is the happiest moment of her life. RED FLAG. RED FLAG. SAYAKA, PLEASE.

Oh, no immediate witch showings or anything. Hm, maybe later. I'm a little on edge with characters living or dying since two episodes ago. You know the one. We do change scenes to Kyoko and Kyubey talking about Sayaka and another magical girl in town. At first I think of Madoka, then remember Homura still exists. Kyubey says she "maybe, maybe not" accepted a contract with him, that she's an irregular. I figure then that she didn't, and did it with another fluffy creature, or became one in a different way. Considering how Homura has acted so far, especially in reaction to Kyubey, I'm banking on rival fluffy creature. Only time will tell if that's relevant enough for it to show up later in the series, but considering we're nearly halfway already, I doubt it.

Madoka has a conversation with Homura and seems to try to explain Sayaka as if she tries to convince Homura to go easy on her or somesuch, but Homura brushes it off with saying Sayaka is full of fatal flaws, and those are exactly what got Mami killed. Madoka gets upset about that and begs Homura to be a friend to Sayaka, and says it would be safer to hunt witches together. Homura reacts coldly again and tells Madoka to just give up on Sayaka. She says once the contract is made, the magical girls have to give up everything for their wish and nothing can change that, being "as fruitless as trying to raise the dead". I'm guessing that's what her wish had to do with then.

Sayaka does take being a magical girl seriously though, and appears to start training for it and going on witch hunts with Kyubey, taking over Mami's duties. Madoka wants to come along to make sure Sayaka is alright. Sayaka reacts cheerfully, shrugging it off, but it's clear that while she'd love to have Madoka along, she's too worried about her safety to allow her to co--nevermind, she basically just invited her to come along, telling Kyubey she'll act less klutzy with Madoka around. Kyubey talks to Madoka telepathically, telling her she's their ace in the hole, which is basically just saying that if something goes wrong, she can still accept the contract. Of course.

They find a familiar and Sayaka goes for it, handling it very nicely at first, good visuals and movement as with Mami before. She gets stopped by Kyoko, who wants the familiar to kill someone and grow into a witch so she can get a Grief Seed. Sayaka gets really fired up because of that. No wonder, Kyoko is a real bitch. She puts a move on Sayaka that should practically put her into a coma, but because of Sayaka's wish, she's got regenerative powers. Huh, now that's interesting! That would actually mean Madoka might be really powerful as a magical girl, because her wish would be to be a magical girl, and that's it.

Sayaka resumes the fight against Kyoko, and despite clearly being at a disadvantage due to being less experienced, she holds her own well enough. Kyubey says he can't stop it, but Madoka can if she accepts the contract. Pfft, now that's an outright lie, I can smell it! But of course Madoka will acce--or not, hi Homura! How handy of you to drop by at this opportune moment in which you can take out one of your rivals.

Not that I have any illusions about Kyoko being out of the picture so soon, though. I’m betting she’ll be around for a while longer and act as the foil to Madoka and Sayaka. Especially Sayaka at first, then Madoka once she accepts the contract (which I’m starting to think won’t happen until the finale at this rate, though I bet it will be GLORIOUS) and then either get murdered or befriended. Or both. Considering the tone of this series I’ll probably have to bet my money on both.

So yeah. Not much happened here, aside from the clash with Kyoko at the end and probably a few things that are plot-relevant that were said by Homura or Kyubey, but I can't quite put my finger on it. Right now, Sayaka's like the Naruto of the show, except the show is named after Madoka, who is more like Sakura before she became useful in Shippuuden.

...images of an "Inner Madoka" with a highly aggressive personality amuse me greatly.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 08:22 AM

Many apologies. This is absolutely almost entirely spoiler reactions to things that you said.

Madokaaa, please become a magical girl so I can see you be useful and grow strong as a person! I know I shouldn't urge little girls to make contracts with the devil, even imaginary ones, but it's for your own good!
Mwa-ha-ha-haaaaaaaaaa.

Madoka has a conversation with Homura and seems to try to explain Sayaka as if she tries to convince Homura to go easy on her or somesuch, but Homura brushes it off with saying Sayaka is full of fatal flaws, and those are exactly what got Mami killed. Madoka gets upset about that and begs Homura to be a friend to Sayaka, and says it would be safer to hunt witches together. Homura reacts coldly again and tells Madoka to just give up on Sayaka. She says once the contract is made, the magical girls have to give up everything for their wish and nothing can change that, being "as fruitless as trying to raise the dead". I'm guessing that's what her wish had to do with then.
Wow. I never considered that particular line.

Sayaka does take being a magical girl seriously though, and appears to start training for it and going on witch hunts with Kyubey, taking over Mami's duties. Madoka wants to come along to make sure Sayaka is alright. Sayaka reacts cheerfully, shrugging it off, but it's clear that while she'd love to have Madoka along, she's too worried about her safety to allow her to co--nevermind, she basically just invited her to come along, telling Kyubey she'll act less klutzy with Madoka around. Kyubey talks to Madoka telepathically, telling her she's their ace in the hole, which is basically just saying that if something goes wrong, she can still accept the contract. Of course.
Manipulative fuzzball is manipulative.

Not that I have any illusions about Kyoko being out of the picture so soon, though. I’m betting she’ll be around for a while longer and act as the foil to Madoka and Sayaka. Especially Sayaka at first, then Madoka once she accepts the contract (which I’m starting to think won’t happen until the finale at this rate, though I bet it will be GLORIOUS) and then either get murdered or befriended. Or both. Considering the tone of this series I’ll probably have to bet my money on both.
If you only knew.........

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 08:34 AM

Madokaaa, please become a magical girl so I can see you be useful and grow strong as a person! I know I shouldn't urge little girls to make contracts with the devil, even imaginary ones, but it's for your own good!

AAAAAAAAAAAAAhahahahahahahahahaha *sob*

Also yes, Hayate's whole situation was a setup by Admiral Graham, who at least wanted to make the victim of his scheme comfortable while he sacrificed her for the sake of the universe. This goes completely unexplained in the movie version, but they did a good job of handwaving stuff by saying they're in-universe movies.

Morph Bark

2013-11-01, 09:24 AM

Many apologies. This is absolutely almost entirely spoiler reactions to things that you said.

My revenge will be so, so (bitter)sweet.

Eldan

2013-11-01, 09:32 AM

We may be in the same timezone, but I'm nocturnal. Anyway.

Episode Cinq

Because foreign numbers are cool, now.

Standing in a hedge labyrinth. Symboblic.

"You can fulfill any wish, right?" "I can do yours." First, that's not a yes, second, he's spying on her. But then, it seems she never needs to actucally speak her wish.

And he reaches into her chest with his arms. She seems to fall down, but can hover now.

Greeney Girl is is tired. She was sent to the hospital and interrogated by the police. Apparently, authorities do exist in this show. And she can't remember what happened.

Sayaka feels fantastic. That can't possibly be good. Madoka is worried. Sayaka is saving the city and her friends. I'm getting the first death vibes, but they aren't that strong. We're just over a third through, killing a second character already seems a bit premature with such a small cast.

She wishes she did it sooner so she could have saved Mami. Then she keeps going on about destiny and worthwhile lives. Please don't die yet. A cast of just Madoka and Emo von Eyelid sounds horrible.

Violin boy is not getting released. He only had his arm fixed, not his leg. And the doctors want to see his hand. Makes sense.

Is having two of the same chair considered bad luck or did the hospital just dump all their excess furniture in here?

And suddenly, flower petals and sadness. Because he was so mean to her. She takes him to the roof in a wheelchair. Maybe we'll get a witch attack.

Ah, surprise party in the roof garden. He gets his violin back. He doesn't even seem all that happy, just stunned. Luckily, it's one of those new instruments that don't need tuning. Very pretty visuals.

Sayaka is too happy. Won't end well.

Evil Girl has her own magic spyglass. And waffles. I want waffles. She really seems to be wasting her magic on trivial stuff. Killing Sayaka is too easy and not worth the effort. Kyubey disagrees.

Kyubey does not know what Princess Gloomypants is like. So, he didn't make her? He made a contract with her, but also not. Different version of him? Or of her? Not a real contract? Made under duress? Different contract?

And she's "irregular" and Kyubey can't predict her.

Madoka tries to talk to Madame TooCoolforThis again. To convince her that sayaka is really nice and they shouldn't fight.

Lady Emolinda thinks that's bad for a magical girl. Kindness leads to Weakness. Courage leads to Inattentiveness. Dedication is pointless. Also, her ring has witch runes on her. More support for the ex-magic girls are witches theory?

Mami's death is her own fault. Madoka doesn't like that. And she wishes she could help Sayaka. If that's going to be her contract wish... that would be just silly. She wants them to eam up.

Dramatica Boredstare laughs at her idea (well, not laugh, but you know) and says that doesn't work and that Sayaka is pretty much dead anyway.

"It's my fault, I should have watched her." Or, you know, told her the details.

"So, you have given up on everything?" "Sure. I'm too good for everything anyway." Well, she doesn't say that, but she might as well. She has to fight on no matter what. Why, exactly? Oh, no, that would be an explanation, we can't have that.

Sayaka collects mirrors. Madoka intercepts her on patrol and asks if she's alright. Sayaka plays self confident. "Don't worry, I can do this. Mami did the same thing." Remember what else she did? That's right! Die!

Madoka wants to run along. Sayaka takes her along because she's scared on her own. "I'll protect you." She just said it, didn't she. But the mood is still a bit different, not quite getting a death flag yet. Good, they are saving her for later.

Kyubey puts more pressure on Madoka. Below them, a team of stuntmen is practising driving in formation. There's an add for PNNEF, too, my favourite architect.

They found a witch or familiar. This one is crayon themed. Or more little kids' craft in general.

The witch looks weird. A puppet in a toy airplane. Sayaka's transformation is music themed. Either E-flat major or C-minor. I'm guessing the second.

Oh hey. Those aren't katanas. The grips look more like cavalry sabres, but the blades are straight.

Evil girl uses a rope dart spear to defend the witch from thrown swords so she can do it herself.

Or, no. Fighting it is pointless since it's just a familiar and won't drop any phat lootz. Just let it kill a few people first so it can grow. Charming.

It's all about the food chain. Ecology. We eat witches, witches eat humans. And Kyubey is a decomposer?

The stronger you are, the higher up you are. E-, see me after class.

"You didn't just make a contract so you could be a superhero, right?" Hehe.

Oh, so Evillina is a professional and slaps Sayaka around a bit.

sayaka demonstrates the "take the first hit, but don't give up and instead slowly reach for your weapon" trope.

The kind of wish you make determines your superpower. We were right on that. She healed someone, so she's Wolvervine.

Evillina wants to kill her. Sayaka deflects in the weirdest way ever. This fight is way less interesting than a witch fight because of the lack of visuals.

Madoka is sad. Kyubey says he can't do anything, but he sees an opening for more pressure when he sees it. But then, Blackie strikes a pose so ridiculous, everyone forgets to fight and the episode is over.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 09:44 AM

I believe that someone in this thread or another thread pointed out that Sayaka's swords are shaped like violin bows. Then, of course...check out the hair clip.

http://moarpowah.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/new-sayaka-hair-beret-300x200.jpg

Gal's got a bit of a one-track mind, eh?

Morph Bark

2013-11-01, 09:52 AM

Reading Eldan's view on this, I got to thinking... Kyoko's point about only killing witches for their Grief Seeds is made really weak by her actually being there, considering she prevented Sayaka from killing a familiar just so she could do it herself. Sure, she's doing it so she can take out Sayaka and hog all the witches to herself like an old lady hoarding cats, but still.

I believe that someone in this thread or another thread pointed out that Sayaka's swords are shaped like violin bows. Then, of course...check out the hair clip.

http://moarpowah.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/new-sayaka-hair-beret-300x200.jpg

Gal's got a bit of a one-track mind, eh?

Naissss. The devil's in the details. :smallbiggrin:

Eldan

2013-11-01, 09:54 AM

I didn't see that one either.

I like the idea that Homura tried to raise the dead and it backfired spectacularly, because that's the kind of thing that always backfires.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 09:56 AM

Reading Eldan's view on this, I got to thinking... Kyoko's point about only killing witches for their Grief Seeds is made really weak by her actually being there, considering she prevented Sayaka from killing a familiar just so she could do it herself. Sure, she's doing it so she can take out Sayaka and hog all the witches to herself like an old lady hoarding cats, but still.

The point of Kyoko's intervention was that Familiars grow into Witches after killing a few people. Witches drop Grief Seeds but Familiars don't. Kyoko's point is basically "don't just slaughter the calves willy-nilly: let them grow up into cows so we can get a full meal off of them."

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 09:59 AM

I didn't see that one either.
Yeah, I didn't notice it myself, but somebody pointed it out so I went back to check and sure enough! It's one of my favorite bits of detail in the series.

I like the idea that Homura tried to raise the dead and it backfired spectacularly, because that's the kind of thing that always backfires.
I feel like the only proper follow-up is...
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090524023847/fma/images/f/fd/RuneAnime.jpg

Eldan

2013-11-01, 10:00 AM

Quite so, that's what I was thinking of.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 10:02 AM

It's rather interesting how close to the mark it is, on a metaphorical level. Homura really is trying to raise Madoka from the dead by traveling back to save her. And it keeps going wrong every single time.

Morph Bark

2013-11-01, 10:03 AM

I feel like the only proper follow-up is...
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090524023847/fma/images/f/fd/RuneAnime.jpg

Follow-follow-up:
http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Fullmetal_b05e49_183677.jpg

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 10:09 AM

*slow clap*

Sith_Happens

2013-11-01, 11:58 AM

Wow. I never considered that particular line.

Personally I fixated more on the "give up everything for their wish" part. You know, because that's what Homura herself did.

I believe that someone in this thread or another thread pointed out that Sayaka's swords are shaped like violin bows. Then, of course...check out the hair clip.

http://moarpowah.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/new-sayaka-hair-beret-300x200.jpg

Gal's got a bit of a one-track mind, eh?

Well, considering her labyrinth...

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 12:03 PM

Well, considering her labyrinth...
You know what I didn't realize until now? Yes, I noted that the labyrinth is filled with eternally-playing violinists. Which means...

She's only shown to be "into" classical music because of Kyosuke. He's presumably the only violinist she knows.

I don't think it's a leap in logic to conclude that her labyrinth is filled with silhouetted Kyosukes, eternally playing music for her.

That's MESSED UP. That...wow.

And it makes perfect sense that her witch form would do that.

Silverraptor

2013-11-01, 01:53 PM

Oh... This will be GOOD!!!:smallbiggrin: I'm in on reading this thread. I want to see other people's reaction.

When I discovered this series, I watched all 12 episodes in rapid succession, back to back, and then went to sleep. BIG MISTAKE!!!:smalleek:

I can't wait to see the reaction of future episodes from you guys.:smallbiggrin:

the_druid_droid

2013-11-01, 01:58 PM

Yeah, I didn't notice it myself, but somebody pointed it out so I went back to check and sure enough! It's one of my favorite bits of detail in the series.

Agreed. Although I am a huge Sayaka fanboy, so not sure if my vote counts...

You know what I didn't realize until now? Yes, I noted that the labyrinth is filled with eternally-playing violinists. Which means...

She's only shown to be "into" classical music because of Kyosuke. He's presumably the only violinist she knows.

I don't think it's a leap in logic to conclude that her labyrinth is filled with silhouetted Kyosukes, eternally playing music for her.

That's MESSED UP. That...wow.

And it makes perfect sense that her witch form would do that.

Horrifying, isn't it?

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 02:04 PM

Also of note: said hair clip is the fortissimo notation, which is pretty high up on the loudness scale. It's a very forceful motif, indeed.

Morph Bark

2013-11-01, 02:09 PM

Also of note: said hair clip is the fortissimo notation, which is pretty high up on the loudness scale. It's a very forceful motif, indeed.

I believe it also means "stronger" or "strongest" in Italian. I really wonder now whether that meaning will have implications later on...

I'll be doing the next episode in a few hours, if I'm home on time. I plan on going to bed earlier than usual (which is to say... before midnight), so I'll be home earlier than usual too.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 02:13 PM

Not "strongest", just "very strong". There's also "fff", which is "forte fortissimo", which is basically "turn it up to 11".

There are also some pieces with notations such as "ffff" or "ffffff". I'll leave that up to your imagination.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 02:55 PM

I believe it also means "stronger" or "strongest" in Italian. I really wonder now whether that meaning will have implications later on...

It means she's the strongest, she has blue hair, and she's an idiot.

I'll leave the conclusion to you.

Terraoblivion

2013-11-01, 03:12 PM

You know what I didn't realize until now? Yes, I noted that the labyrinth is filled with eternally-playing violinists. Which means...

She's only shown to be "into" classical music because of Kyosuke. He's presumably the only violinist she knows.

I don't think it's a leap in logic to conclude that her labyrinth is filled with silhouetted Kyosukes, eternally playing music for her.

That's MESSED UP. That...wow.

And it makes perfect sense that her witch form would do that.

However, when we see her turn into a witch in episode 10, she has silhouette dancers instead. Also, even going by her own words, she's actually come to like classical music for itself and not just because it's Kyousuke playing it and I don't see any real reason to doubt that. So while those violinists are pretty certainly based on Kyousuke, it's probably going too far to say that her labyrinth is purely about him.

And, of course, Nerdo. I'd comment more, but the comments I could make would be spoilers.

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 03:18 PM

However, when we see her turn into a witch in episode 10, she has silhouette dancers instead. Also, even going by her own words, she's actually come to like classical music for itself and not just because it's Kyousuke playing it and I don't see any real reason to doubt that. So while those violinists are pretty certainly based on Kyousuke, it's probably going too far to say that her labyrinth is purely about him.

I had the gut feeling I was veering into "reading too much into it". And it's not as though the world isn't effed-up enough already. Heh.

Fjolnir

2013-11-01, 04:02 PM

I was the one who pointed out the swords resembled violin bows with basket hilts...

CarpeGuitarrem

2013-11-01, 04:15 PM

I was the one who pointed out the swords resembled violin bows with basket hilts...
A-ha! Cookie for you, then! An excellent observation.

Morph Bark

2013-11-01, 06:44 PM

EPISODE SECHS (6)

We get a bit of last episode's last scene, and I now see Kyoko clearly tried to outright murder Sayaka. Hope she will think about this later and get some sense drilled into her, little blue-haired fool.

Homura unsettles Kyoko, who apparently has Sakura as her first name. That makes my comparison of Madoka to another Sakura earlier all the more amusing, in a way! I like that Kyoko is thrown off-balance by Homura's teleporting and her knowing her name and all, so I guess not just good girls think Homura is creepy. Kyoko leaves and Homura acts cold and threatening towards Madoka. I wonder when she'll snap. It's almost as if Homura is a yandere in disguise and really wants to be all over Madoka. Homura leaves as quickly as she appeared.

Sayaka purifies her Soul Gem with the Grief Seed she got earlier (or is it a different one already?) and it turns out it's Kyubey's duty to eat them afterwards. He says it's to protect Sayaka, but since Grief Seeds take the negative emotions from Soul Gems (I presume, at least, considering witches pump them into others, that this process removes the negativity from a magical girl's Soul Gem), Kyubey must've gotten really filled with a lot of negativity from eating all those Grief Seeds. I have a feeling that will become a major thing later on, especially if Kyubey turns out to be the Final Boss.

Kyubey also basically says that Mami and Kyoko are both more talented than Sayaka, so I'm guessing she's naturally the least talented, even if she might have the most raw power (speculating from the whole "fortissimo" bit). Kind of like how Yami was the strongest Espada in Bleach in terms of raw power, but was still ranked the lowest overall, I guess.

Meanwhile, Kyoko is involved in the EPIC DANCE BATTLES OF HISTORYYYY!! I can imagine a good feel for rhythm and good dance moves can be handy as well in a fight. She even gets a perfect score, all the while talking to Homura, who tells her she can have the city as she's better suited than Sayaka, but she wants to settle it with Sayaka peacefully and personally. Apparently something called "Walpurgisnacht" is coming up. Walpurgisnacht is a traditional spring festival on 30 April and 1 May in Central and Northern Europe and is the yearly polar opposite of Halloween. Walpurgisnacht is the German name for it, and in German legend, it is the night during witches celebrate... something. So presumably a lot of Grief Seeds can be harvested then, and Homura and Kyoko both want as little competition as possible. Homura even tells Kyoko she'll bow out if Kyoko wins during Walpurgisnacht, so I presume the condition for winning depends on who gets the most Grief Seeds. I'm also guessing that's when the series finale will take place, and possibly be the night Madoka becomes a magical girl. (Or she'll show that she has some other magical power somehow and never really becomes one, thus the twist of the entire series would be "haha, the series is called Magical Girl Madoka, but Madoka never becomes one!")

Kyoko also offers Homura some "Rocky" candy. I'm guessing that is derived of "Pocky", which is some popular otaku candy, or so I've heard.

Madoka goes after Sayaka, who's hunting for the familiar from before. Huh, guess it's not dead then. She tries to convince her to talk things out with Kyoko, but Sayaka rebuffs her, because they had a real duel to the death. Madoka persists in trying to convince her. She's really, really naive, isn't she? I mean, even other magical girls in other series got serious once people started being in mortal danger. Does she really think that letting her best friend go talk to someone who wants her dead is going to end well? If so, she's dumber than Sayaka.

Sayaka gets angry when Madoka mentions Homura and says Homura waited until Mami was dead before defeating the witch. Wat. WAT. BITCH, REALLY. THAT WAS MAMI BEING STUPID, DIDN'T MADOKA TELL YOU ABOUT WHAT SHE DID TO HOMURA?

COME ON, SISTER. REALLY.

Sayaka says she only wanted her power to protect her loved ones, rather than specifically to fight witches, even if it means fighting magical girls. Good point. She claims Mami was special and all other magical girls are like Kyoko and Homura and let familiars grow into witches and endanger people. Probably just her blindsighting herself, as I don't think Homura's ever done that, even as cold-hearted a bitch she is. Sayaka has clearly become The Determinator (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Determinator), strong in action, but rather extreme in her views.

Kyubey tells Madoka that Sayaka isn't strong enough to take on either of the other magical girls and that her big flaw is being too reckless. Got that right.

Madoka has a midnight chat with her mom about her troubles. Why are the chairs placed at the table like that? That's no logical way to place chairs at a table, they should be placed alongside the long sides of a table! Madoka's mom tells her she should mess up and tell white lies instead of just outright tell people what to do, and that that's how she'll grow up, or something. Madoka tells her mom she wants to be an alcoholic like her.

Sayaka goes in search of Kyosuke, who's just been discharged from the hospital, and runs into Kyoko. Kyoko starts going on a lecture about how wishes are meant to be for just yourself and they shouldn't be wasted on others, plus they never work right anyway. Apparently she heard from Kyubey what Sayaka's wish was. I'm starting to feel like Kyubey wants Kyoko to kill Sayaka and see if that'll get Madoka to accept the contract. Plus, this whole "wishes for others don't work out" thing might well just be propaganda, and an outright lie, so that magical girls only make selfish wishes, so that all magical girls are assured to be selfish girls, which would ensure a strong rivalry, which would cause a "only the strong survive" world between them, which is probably in the best interest of their contractors.

Kyoko suggests using Sayaka's magic to cripple Kyosuke again so he'll be completely hers. YANDERE ALERT! The two settle on going elsewhere to fight. Cut to Madoka typing on a desk with letters that don't even have buttons, so how would you know when you've got your finger on the right letter? Kyubey warns her about the fight and they run towards it, arriving just before Homura, and everyone is together. Madoka grabs Sayaka's Soul Gem and throws it off the bridge, likely hoping it will prevent her from transforming and thus make everything normal again. It backfires when Sayaka's body goes limp and Kyubey tells Madoka "what are you doing, just throwing your friends away like that?"

Homura goes flash-stepping after the truck the Soul Gem fell on. Kyoko checks Sayaka and states that she's dead.

What.

No.

C'mon.

C'mon!

Kyubey explains that when the contract is made, the Soul Gem becomes what the magical girl really is, and the body is just a host, at least as long as the Soul Gem is within 100 meters. So... it'll be alright when it gets back? Kyoko expresses astonishment at this and looks afraid, not having known this before. Clearly Homura did though, else she wouldn't have immediately run off (or maybe she wants to drain the magic out of it?). Truly an irregular, eh? Kyubey says that the body can be repaired with magic as long as the soul is intact. So I'm guessing if Mami's Soul Gem is out there somewhere still, she can be reborn? (Well, remade, or healed back together, essentially.) Doubt it is though, but Kyubey might well store old Soul Gems within himself, just like Grief Seeds. No wonder Homura wanted to prevent them from forming a contract, she really was protecting them. For Mami it wouldn't have made a difference, she was about to die when she made her wish, but Sayaka...

Kyubey shows his Blue-Orange morality. "Why do humans all have such a problem with where their souls end up?"

Homura is back all of a sudden and placed Sayaka's Soul Gem in her hand and Sayaka "wakes up", asking what happened, apparently having no recollection of what took place on the bridge. Phew. Man, they really had me going for a minute there. I'm guessing Sayaka won't be trusting Kyubey from this moment on, and neither will Kyoko. I doubt they'll be very cooperative with one another though... at least for the next episode, maybe two.

Episode 3 had a major death, episode 6 nearly... I kind of went into this one thinking there might be a death, and if there had been, I would have SO expected one to be in episodes 9 and 12, too. I mean, in all, we've now seen 4 magical girls and one wannabe. One dying in 3, 6, 9 and one killed by Madoka in 12 would've been a real linear structure. I really wonder now whether Madoka ever will accept the contract though. I figure from this moment on it will be more dealing with the horror of being a magical girl and finding a way to "fix it", rather than the previous protecting of innocents. And of course, the lead-up to Walpurgisnacht.

Things are getting horrifyingly interesting...

Fjolnir

2013-11-01, 07:41 PM

first thoughts: nice open, a labyrinth and a witch trying to eat sayaka's catatonic body, kyoko fails basic reasoning and homura spells it out with little words and shows off her magical abilities. 2: apparently kubey is some sort of collector of energy for Aliens who require something to turn back entropy on a universal scale, and emotionality is it. 3: Kubey is baffled as to how humans could possibly see a completely frontloaded deal with no personal upside return on investment as a bad deal. 4: Kubey wants you to be a D-cell battery madoka, why are you still entertaining any of his chit chat?5: At least now that it is all spelled out, he just calls a spade a spade, then disappears. 6: how do three middle school aged girls and a corpse wandering around on the train tracks not have security all over them?!

I will say that the episode titles are pretty hilariously ironic so far

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 08:40 PM

Homura unsettles Kyoko, who apparently has Sakura as her first name.

Just to clarify, her family name is Sakura and her given name is Kyoko (coincidentally, she shares a name with two extremely minor Evangelion characters - Asuka's mom and Touji's sister). All the main characters have family names that double as given names: Kaname, Tomoe, Miki, Sakura...Akemi is really uncommon, but so is Homura.

Madoka's mom tells her she should mess up and tell white lies instead of just outright tell people what to do, and that that's how she'll grow up, or something. Madoka tells her mom she wants to be an alcoholic like her.

Anime Mother of the Year, all years. You have to admit it's actually good advice for the real world, though.

So I'm guessing if Mami's Soul Gem is out there somewhere still, she can be reborn? (Well, remade, or healed back together, essentially.) Doubt it is though, but Kyubey might well store old Soul Gems within himself, just like Grief Seeds.

You probably didn't notice, not knowing the significance, but Mami wore her Soul Gem in her hat in magical girl form.

No wonder Homura wanted to prevent them from forming a contract, she really was protecting them. For Mami it wouldn't have made a difference, she was about to die when she made her wish, but Sayaka...

And here you thought she just wanted all the delicious Soul Gems for herself.

Episode 3 had a major death, episode 6 nearly... I kind of went into this one thinking there might be a death, and if there had been, I would have SO expected one to be in episodes 9 and 12, too.

You know, this episode DID technically have a death...

Things are getting horrifyingly interesting...

／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

Eldan

2013-11-01, 09:01 PM

Well, then.

Episode liù

We continue were we left of. Blacky von Frownenstein can either move so quickly she can't be seen or teleport. Sayaka tries to get into the battle and gets buckler-bashed to the neck. That looks like it could lead to some lasting injuries, but she's Wolverine, now.

"I'm on the side of those who maintain composure and an enemy hof those who initiate fights needlessly. I am the terror that flaps in the night. I'm Darkhair Witch."

Death stare meets boredom stare. Oh the tension.

Red girl runs away.

Kyubey doesn't seem to be sure who The Girl with her Eyes on Half-Mast is either. Interesting. Also, I'm really running out of nicknames.

Sayaka got a grief egg somewhere, apparently. I'm wondering where, I didn't see a fight. Apparently, if you put too much negative energy from your own magical girl jewel thingie (forgot the name) into it, it turns into a new witch.

Kyubey eats it with a mouth on his back. So, apparently, he's powered by negative emotions, then? Makes sense, given how much effort he puts into make everyone fight monsters based on them.

Kyubey now calls using mana points "tainting" your soul gem. Seems I got that part right.

Are some girls stronger than others? Kyubey says yes. That's why he's after Madoka, after all. Yup, Kyubey confirms it: Madoka is a super-prodigy who's better right away than any veteran.

And he uses it for another attempt at suckering her in: getting Sayaka to ask her. *slow clap* I admire the bastard, but Sayaka is not taking the bait.

Red girl plays DDR. Boredomia Tireface visits the arcade too, to practise starting at blinking lights without reacting.

She wants to give the city to Red Girl. Because Red Girl is good at this and Sayaka isn't. That's sort of mean. To Red Girl, I mean: the message seems to be that it doesn't matter if Red Girl dies.

Creepy-Eyes wants to solve this peacefully.

Ooh. Two days until Walpurgisnacht! That's exactly what this game needs! Singing, dancing, bonfires, maypole and free drinks!

Oh, wait, they mean the christianized version with the witches. How did I ever get that wrong.

Apparently, the night can be defeated. It's too much to handle for Red Girl, though.

Madoka is worried about Sayaka, because Red Girl might attack her again. Try talking, that clearly helps with people like that.

Sayaka says it was to the death. That was sort of obvious, with all those sharp weapons. At least she gets that talking won't help.

Madoka insists on being annoyingly naive. And her voice just got a few points more on the "painfully high-pitched whine" scale.

Sayaka thinks it's Homura's fault that Mami got killed. That's... sort of stupid. Didn't they see Mami chaining her up? I don't remember. She's now Angry. Which leads to Fear? Or Hate? Or something? I've never watched Star Wars.

She thinks the other girls are worse than witches. So she's fighting everyone. At least someone in the show has some principles.

Manager Mom came home late, I guess. She's talking to her mother about the issue in a really roundabout way. I'm now thinking her mother would be a pretty awesome magical girl.

"You can't get a happy ending just by doing the right thing all the time." She has a strange definition of "right thing", then.

Madoka thinks people who are right should be happy. Dream on girl, it's... sort of cute, in a pitiful way.

"Do you want to solve this?... Then do something wrong." What perfect advice. Actually, the way the show is staged seems to imply this is good advice. IT's not. It's terrible.

Violin boy is gone again. This time, he was released. Red Girl laughs at her for not having the backbone to ring.

"You used your only chance for a miracle on something retarted." Didn't think I'd ever agree with her, but here we are.

Oh, wait. She's just thinking of personal wishes, not smart ones.

"Go in there and break his arms and legs. Then he'll love you". Or call the police and get some other caretaker.

Kyubey calls Madoka because Sayaka is in trouble.

Transformation sequence. Nice effect when the ruby on Red Girl's chest opens like an eye. Madoka interrupts.

"IT's not surprising that the annoying bitch has an annoying friend." *teleport* "And what would that make your friend?" Who would have thought. Gloomy actually gets a good line. She offers to take Sayaka on herself.

Huh. Apparently, you can steal soul gems. Well, I'm sure that will have no bad effects at all. And throwing it off a bridge. Not destroyed, though.

I wonder if you can use another witch's gem to power up yours.

And Sayaka faints. I half expected her to turn into a witch right there, but then, those have their own gems.

She's dead.

Naaah. Not enough drama for that. She'll get her gem back and be fine.

"You can only control your bodies from a distance of 100 meters". So, their minds are in the gems now, actually? Iiiinteresting. Kyubey very freely admits that he removes souls and transmutes them. Anyway, just resleeve her, problem solved.

I'm actually with Kyubey on this, I don't really see the problem. They didn't even notice, until now.

Actually... if only your gem breaking can kill you and it has remote control ability, wouldn't it be safer to armour your gem and hide it somewhere near a battle? It's actually pretty damn useful.

Sayaka didn't even notice.

Closing thought: I really miss the long labyrinth sequences. They were the best thing about the show and we haven't had a proper one in a long while.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 09:08 PM

"You can't get a happy ending just by doing the right thing all the time." She has a strange definition of "right thing", then.

I just want to clarify this one more thing since we have two non-native English speakers here. Junko/the subtitles are referring to "the right thing" as in the morally correct and socially accepted idea: don't lie, don't cheat, don't steal, don't do anything that might get you in trouble or cause you or anyone else harm, not as in simply "the correct course of action".

Basically she's encouraging Madoka to stop being the naive whiner who's annoying you, take risks, and be willing to make mistakes in the process of reaching her goal.

Silverraptor

2013-11-01, 09:10 PM

／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

*Wimper*:smalleek:

Eldan

2013-11-01, 09:11 PM

You probably didn't notice, not knowing the significance, but Mami wore her Soul Gem in her hat in magical girl form.

:smallbiggrin:

Oh god, I feel terrible, but I can't stop laughing at that. It's hilarious.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 09:19 PM

:smallbiggrin:

Oh god, I feel terrible, but I can't stop laughing at that. It's hilarious.

I laugh to hide the pain, personally.

Edited in response to edit:

Closing thought: I really miss the long labyrinth sequences. They were the best thing about the show and we haven't had a proper one in a long while.

Don't worry, there's a good Witch fight next episode.

Eldan

2013-11-01, 09:27 PM

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 09:35 PM

I didn't really have any emotions attached to Mami either way, so losing her didn't hurt. And it was flagged so clearly and early it wasn't shocking either. But I've been reading the other two Let's Watches that were linked in this thread, up to the episode shown, and there was some hilarious decapited Mami fan art in one of them, so I now can't think about that scene without giggling.

The fandom has that effect on people. After you two are done I'll link my favorite summary of the series.

Also, it's really interesting reading this thread after Herpestidae's. He got a lot more emotionally attached in the beginning and the rollercoaster produced much more entertaining results. At least until we got to about this point and he became dead inside. Meanwhile, you guys are both hung up on trying to analyze and figure things out rather than forming emotional connections so most of the entertainment comes from knowing what the answers to your speculation are.

And yes, there are answers in this show. It's not an intentional unsolved puzzle like Evangelion, although you might start to notice more similarities next time when the visual symbolism goes into overdrive.

Eldan

2013-11-01, 09:43 PM

LaZodiac

2013-11-01, 09:48 PM

:smallbiggrin:

Oh god, I feel terrible, but I can't stop laughing at that. It's hilarious.

The worst part about this is that now that we know they're still conscious, and thus alive, when the soul gem is close enough to their body, and that destroying the soul gem destroys the body...and Mimmi's body didn't vanish for a looong time.

Make of that what you will.

Also Magical Girls are Lich's and that's hilarious. They even have phylacteries.

(totally posted just to bring up the Lich thing).

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 09:51 PM

YOu know, I just looked over Herpestidae's thread and the screenshots made me realize something.

I think part of why I have so little emotional attachment to most of the characters is the character artwork. It's too cartoonish for me. The girl's heads look... deformed, really. And very stiff, unable to really show subtle emotion. They are either screaming or crying or completely vacant. Or at least they seem so to me.

That's actually entirely fair. They are kind of uguu. At least the backgrounds make up for it most of the time.

The comment about the ability to show emotion, though...well, get back to me in three episodes.

The worst part about this is that now that we know they're still conscious, and thus alive, when the soul gem is close enough to their body, and that destroying the soul gem destroys the body...and Mimmi's body didn't vanish for a looong time.

Make of that what you will.

I hate to keep making pedantic posts, but this is simply untrue. Destroying a Soul Gem doesn't destroy the body; a body left in a Labyrinth disappears. You can tell when a Magical Girl is full-on Soul Gem Dead when her spells end; in Mami's case, when her ribbons/magical girl outfit disappeared.

Tiki Snakes

2013-11-01, 10:05 PM

I don't know, Eldan. The way I read your posts, I do get a very strong feeling that you're far too busy not being caught out to simply connect with the characters.

That's just the impression I get personally, though. I won't pretend it's authoritative or anything, just how it comes over in the text, to me.

I think that kind of approach, regardless of whether it's actually something you're doing or just me misreading the situation, is very much a risk for "let's watch" style endeavours, especially of infamous shows like Madoka. Even people who are unspoiled go in expecting there to be at least one twist of some kind, purely from the reaction they get when they announce they are going to.

I also wonder if the fact that all three of you apparently are watching subs have anything to do with it? Personally, I watched the Dubs and thought they were really rather good. There is a value in what's happening taking place in your own language, you pick up on nuances that you simply cannot otherwise.

Eldan

2013-11-01, 10:09 PM

I don't know about that. Yes, I'm going at this very analytically. And I've noticed that when I'm writing, I have a tendency to stop every few seconds to write, which, yes, isn't conductive to immersion. But partially, that's just how I am. I've stopped watching shows on TV just because I couldn't freeze frame and missed some onscreen text. I hate missing clues. Or even just background details.
At least for tihs show, I haven't gone for any mid-episode Wiki-Walks yet. I've done that for some. Or started to draw diagrams.

The voice work, however, is very good. They make up for a lot of problems with the animation.

Nerd-o-rama

2013-11-01, 10:14 PM

Eldan

2013-11-01, 10:16 PM

Oh, I am having fun. But, well.

It's strange, but there's two kinds of show I enjoy. Those with complicated stories, unexpected twists and a lot of small clues you could miss. I love analyzing those.

Then there's emotional shows with relatively straightforward stories. I enjoy those too, because I can go along for the ride without analyzing.

But there's a certain intersection between the two types where it gets difficult. This show almost hits it and writing while watching probably makes that worse.

Oh, and I was lying when I said no Wiki Walks for this show. I did go around some history sites to see if there were any surviving copies of the calvinist laws banning Walpurgisnacht.

jseah

2013-11-01, 11:16 PM

Jseah's reaction to other people's reactions:

Unless Kyubey also takes little kids, which I doubt. THe symbolism would be off.
He does. Google for Yuma. After you are done anyway, it's one of Kyoko's backstory manga and obviously full to the brim of spoilers.
EDIT: remembered wrongly. Sorry.

And Kyubey is waiting. Of course he is. I think it's my favourite character, the bastard.
*claps*

She commissioned a genuine katana in the spirit world for her soul.
I don't know, it looked more western than jap. It makes me think cavalry saber.
Also doujins and derivative art tend to draw her holding a straight sword (it's curved!) and Mami holding normal guns (it's a flintlock... rifle?).

Darnit Madoka, you could at least tell them what's up. You don't even have to tell the details of it, you could've just told them a friend of yours died.
I dunno. If even a cousin (much less a daughter) of mine started crying over breakfast and saying "I'm glad to be alive", going "what's wrong" would not be everything.

I mean, hell, she's clearly disturbed about something and warrants more alarm than going "yeah, all right".

And Kyubey is a decomposer?
Lololol. =O

I'm actually with Kyubey on this, I don't really see the problem. They didn't even notice, until now.
I mostly thought this, until forumites brought up the issue of consent.

So sure, if remote control soul gems was the only part of being a magical girl, I might actually take kyubey up on his offer myself. Only if I knew what all the other fine print was of course. =D

I think part of why I have so little emotional attachment to most of the characters is the character artwork. It's too cartoonish for me. The girl's heads look... deformed, really. And very stiff, unable to really show subtle emotion. They are either screaming or crying or completely vacant. Or at least they seem so to me.
Aoki Ume's characteristic wide-face.
Wiiidee faaaceee.

It's just the character designer. She also draws Hidamari Sketch, which I like.

And yes, there is Hidamari Sketch characters in Madoka MG uniform doujin art. They are mostly even colour coded correctly too, except kyouko (no red hair in Sketch)
Yuno -> Madoka as in opening song
Hiro or Miyako -> Mami
Sae -> Sayaka

----------------------------

RE: magical girls letting witches re-hatch from grief seeds to harvest them again for profit!

Dunno, I did think of that but well, given how the series is structured, bad things are probably gonna happen. Evil DMs are evil and don't take too kindly to munchkins.

Being a munchkin-type myself... that's not very nice. T_T