Floating City

[Milo v3]

In a setting I'm making, one civilisation has it's major cities as huge floating platforms in the sky connected by bridges. Is their any way to do this with the rules as they are or am I going to reverse engineer an Immovable Platform from the Immovable Rod item?

[Brookshw]

Yes, play eberron.

[Milo v3]

Yes, play eberron.

No. :smallsigh:

[lunar2]

an immovable rod can hold up to 4 tons for 5,000 gp. if you have enough of them, you can hold up just about anything. it is entirely possible for your floating cities to be sitting on top of thousands of immovable rods.

[Brookshw]

Well, that's Sharn you just described so jack the rules and cosmology that makes it possible and your good :smalltongue:

[Karnith]

It takes Epic Spellcasting, but Player's Guide to Faerun has the epic spell Proctiv's Move Mountain, which slices off the top of a mountain, flips it upside down, and makes it float in mid-air, creating a surface fit for construction. It's what the Netherese wizards used to create their floating cities.

[Milo v3]

an immovable rod can hold up to 4 tons for 5,000 gp. if you have enough of them, you can hold up just about anything. it is entirely possible for your floating cities to be sitting on top of thousands of immovable rods.
That sounds pretty expensive so I was hesitant to do so.


Well, that's Sharn you just described so jack the rules and cosmology that makes it possible and your good :smalltongue:
Did they ever even give the rules on how that city worked other than "Magik"?


It takes Epic Spellcasting, but Player's Guide to Faerun has the epic spell Proctiv's Move Mountain, which slices off the top of a mountain, flips it upside down, and makes it float in mid-air, creating a surface fit for construction.
Hm... I'm weary about having Epic Spellcasters in the setting, but it is an option.

[Brookshw]

Yes, permanent emanation of the plane of air traits.

Edit: for your purposes numerous bound air elementals with permanent widen planar bubble maybe?

[Karnith]

An alternative that could work would be to have a bunch of custom magic items of continuous Suspension (from Shining South; spell traps or spell clocks of Suspension could also work). Suspension functions as Levitate, but with a duration of 1d4 + 1 days/level, and it works on objects weighing up to 1,000 pounds per caster level.

You could also have people routinely casting/renewing the spell, I guess. Either way seems kind of risky, given the possibilities of dispelling, durations elapsing, and so on.

[Callos_DeTerran]

In Pathfinder there's rules for a mythic version of Levitate that allows you to permanently levitate a certain weight limit of earth/stone that can be added to with each casting. Check those out?

[Kelb_Panthera]

I remember seeing a magic item in one of my FR books that was a metal plate that could hold aloft quite a bit of weight. I wanna say it was Magic of Faerun. In any case the item is used in-setting as the basis of flying ships. Does anyone else remember these? I'm AFB at the moment.

[angry_bear]

That sounds pretty expensive so I was hesitant to do so.


Did they ever even give the rules on how that city worked other than "Magik"?


Hm... I'm weary about having Epic Spellcasters in the setting, but it is an option.

If it's permanent, it shouldn't be an issue... Have the cities be ancient, or in the very least, old enough that whoever made them is long dead.

Although to be honest, under these circumstances I usually just say screw the rules I have fiat. lol

[lunar2]

reverse gravity has no weight limit. a single reverse gravity trap can hold up the entire city, regardless of weight.

have a single small pillar floating inside a hollow chamber. reverse gravity on the inside of the chamber lifts the pillar to the top of the affected area. the pillar will then hang at the top, supporting the weight of the entire city, until the duration of the spell ends, triggering the trap again. as long as the pillar falls less than 10 feet, neither it nor the city takes damage from it slamming into the ends of the chamber every couple of minutes. the worst case scenario is the inhabitants of the city feel a slight jerk every time the trap resets. it would be minor enough that you would stop noticing it within a few hours of being in the city.

this is all completely RAW, btw, since nothing states that the area of the spell moves when the trap moves, or that any amount of weight can force the pillar back down. there are also no rules on structural integrity or anything like that, so your wooden or stone pillar can support the weight of the entire city without damage.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Gravity.... Doesn't work that way.

The weight of a slightly larger pillar sitting atop it would push it down until enough of its own weight was in the AoE to reach equilibrium or until more than half of the first pillar was pushed out, at which point its own weight would pull the remainder out of the AoE.

[Tvtyrant]

I believe the best answer outside of raw was the ghost tower, where the whole thing simply rested on the ethereal plane.

[Milo v3]

Yes, permanent emanation of the plane of air traits.

Edit: for your purposes numerous bound air elementals with permanent widen planar bubble maybe?
Plane of Air traits just make air spells more powerful, they never actually state the spell that is being enhanced to allow for Sharn. Unless it was in some book I don't possess.


An alternative that could work would be to have a bunch of custom magic items of continuous Suspension (from Shining South; spell traps or spell clocks of Suspension could also work). Suspension functions as Levitate, but with a duration of 1d4 + 1 days/level, and it works on objects weighing up to 1,000 pounds per caster level.

You could also have people routinely casting/renewing the spell, I guess. Either way seems kind of risky, given the possibilities of dispelling, durations elapsing, and so on.
Risky, but looks like a better option than standard Immovable Rods.


In Pathfinder there's rules for a mythic version of Levitate that allows you to permanently levitate a certain weight limit of earth/stone that can be added to with each casting. Check those out?
I keep seeing stuff about Mythic stuff about PF, but I have no idea what it is.


I remember seeing a magic item in one of my FR books that was a metal plate that could hold aloft quite a bit of weight. I wanna say it was Magic of Faerun. In any case the item is used in-setting as the basis of flying ships. Does anyone else remember these? I'm AFB at the moment.
I'll give it a look, though I don't recall flying ships being that common in Faerun.


If it's permanent, it shouldn't be an issue... Have the cities be ancient, or in the very least, old enough that whoever made them is long dead.
Wait Epic Spellcasters can die? :smalltongue:


Although to be honest, under these circumstances I usually just say screw the rules I have fiat. lol
Can't do that, fiat isn't allowed by the rules of me making the setting. Meant to be sorta like a trippyverse sorta deal... Sorta.


reverse gravity has no weight limit. a single reverse gravity trap can hold up the entire city, regardless of weight.

have a single small pillar floating inside a hollow chamber. reverse gravity on the inside of the chamber lifts the pillar to the top of the affected area. the pillar will then hang at the top, supporting the weight of the entire city, until the duration of the spell ends, triggering the trap again. as long as the pillar falls less than 10 feet, neither it nor the city takes damage from it slamming into the ends of the chamber every couple of minutes. the worst case scenario is the inhabitants of the city feel a slight jerk every time the trap resets. it would be minor enough that you would stop noticing it within a few hours of being in the city.

this is all completely RAW, btw, since nothing states that the area of the spell moves when the trap moves, or that any amount of weight can force the pillar back down. there are also no rules on structural integrity or anything like that, so your wooden or stone pillar can support the weight of the entire city without damage.
Thats... Actually pretty cool... And means I can have skyquakes :smalltongue:


Gravity.... Doesn't work that way.

The weight of a slightly larger pillar sitting atop it would push it down until enough of its own weight was in the AoE to reach equilibrium or until more than half of the first pillar was pushed out, at which point its own weight would pull the remainder out of the AoE.
And that's disappointing...


I believe the best answer outside of raw was the ghost tower, where the whole thing simply rested on the ethereal plane.
That sounds very hard to do with an entire city, and RAW is what I'm going for.

[Tvtyrant]

You cast wall of stone a few dozen times to make a foundation. Now have a ghost with the ability to cast wall of stone cast it while manifesting on the prime. This makes a floor that exists on both the PRIme and the ethereal planes. Now have it de-manifest and cast it on only the ethereal until you reach the right height. Now cast it on both again and put the city on it. Another possibility is just casting permanent walls of force, wrap them in lead and put a city over it.

[Kelb_Panthera]

You cast wall of stone a few dozen times to make a foundation. Now have a ghost with the ability to cast wall of stone cast it while manifesting on the prime. This makes a floor that exists on both the PRIme and the ethereal planes. Now have it de-manifest and cast it on only the ethereal until you reach the right height. Now cast it on both again and put the city on it. Another possibility is just casting permanent walls of force, wrap them in lead and put a city over it.

Wouldn't the gravity on the material plane pull the wall down in spite of its dual planar existence?

[Ninjaxenomorph]

This is where you as a DM can cheat. Make up a spell or set of artifacts that allow for floating cities. In Golarion, the Shory empire had Aeromancy that allowed for flying cities, but the art was lost with them. all we know is that it made enough sense for Numerian tech to try to jump-start it. You can say nobody knows, that the secrets are closely guarded. If it really becomes important, you can make up magical engines.

[Lord Vukodlak]

This is where you as a DM can cheat.

Exactly you don't have to use the rules to explain why the cities fly, but if you must, the flying mountains are a "natural" magical phenomenon. People just decided to build cities up there.

[Kane0]

I'm surprised Tippy hasn't weighed in on this yet.

I can't think of anything barring shenanigans and/or epic magic. Maybe take a cue from the Netherese and cook something up with a mcguffin to power it?

Alternatively just do a minecraft. Physics, you have no power here!

Edit: Empowered-maximized-widened-heightened-overkilled Tensers Floating Disk.

[lunar2]

Gravity.... Doesn't work that way.

The weight of a slightly larger pillar sitting atop it would push it down until enough of its own weight was in the AoE to reach equilibrium or until more than half of the first pillar was pushed out, at which point its own weight would pull the remainder out of the AoE.

physics get turned off when the rules disagree.

by RAW, the pillar floats at the top of the reverse gravity area. nothing in the rules say that more weight will push it back down. so by raw, you can float an entire city by hanging it from that one pillar.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Reread it. It says -if- the affected object/creature doesn't hit anything it occilates at the top of AoE. It says this in a passage detailing the effect of gravity's reversal, as opposed to the effect of the magic itself: a simple change of gravity's direction.

[Agent 451]

It's third party, but you might be able to use the level 8 true ritual "Raise the Keep" from Relics and Rituals (http://www.amazon.com/Rituals-Dungeons-Dragons-Fantasy-Roleplaying/dp/1588461599).

It allows a castle of any size to be raised floating into the air. So throw some outer defensive walls around your cities, plop in a central keep, and you should be good to go.

[Tvtyrant]

Wouldn't the gravity on the material plane pull the wall down in spite of its dual planar existence?

No, because it is literally standing on the platform on the bottom. It just happens to be structured side-ways.

Besides, what is this "gravity" you speak of? Is it some sort of fall damage?

[Kelb_Panthera]

No, because it is literally standing on the platform on the bottom. It just happens to be structured side-ways.

Besides, what is this "gravity" you speak of? Is it some sort of fall damage?

So if I understand correctly, it's floating in open air on the material, but on the ethereal it's standing on a stone pillar?

[Tvtyrant]

So if I understand correctly, it's floating in open air on the material, but on the ethereal it's standing on a stone pillar?

Yeah, and then the pillar in the ethereal is sitting on the ground in the material. Think of it as a pillar that has large section in the middle that is incorporeal and invisible to the world around it.

[Angelalex242]

Just call it 'The Kingdom of Zeal' and call it good.

CR 30 Hedgehogs of doom not included. ;)

[Milo v3]

You cast wall of stone a few dozen times to make a foundation. Now have a ghost with the ability to cast wall of stone cast it while manifesting on the prime. This makes a floor that exists on both the PRIme and the ethereal planes. Now have it de-manifest and cast it on only the ethereal until you reach the right height. Now cast it on both again and put the city on it. Another possibility is just casting permanent walls of force, wrap them in lead and put a city over it.
Hmm... That'll take a while to get it to the right height but it could work.


This is where you as a DM can cheat. Make up a spell or set of artifacts that allow for floating cities. In Golarion, the Shory empire had Aeromancy that allowed for flying cities, but the art was lost with them. all we know is that it made enough sense for Numerian tech to try to jump-start it. You can say nobody knows, that the secrets are closely guarded. If it really becomes important, you can make up magical engines.
No it can't. Already said that.


Exactly you don't have to use the rules to explain why the cities fly, but if you must, the flying mountains are a "natural" magical phenomenon. People just decided to build cities up there.
Nope.


I'm surprised Tippy hasn't weighed in on this yet.

I can't think of anything barring shenanigans and/or epic magic. Maybe take a cue from the Netherese and cook something up with a mcguffin to power it?

Alternatively just do a minecraft. Physics, you have no power here!

Edit: Empowered-maximized-widened-heightened-overkilled Tensers Floating Disk.
No macguffins, though the idea of a city on a giant pink disk is abit funny.


It's third party, but you might be able to use the level 8 true ritual "Raise the Keep" from Relics and Rituals (http://www.amazon.com/Rituals-Dungeons-Dragons-Fantasy-Roleplaying/dp/1588461599).

It allows a castle of any size to be raised floating into the air. So throw some outer defensive walls around your cities, plop in a central keep, and you should be good to go.
I'm now trying to decided how much of a strech it would be to allow sorcerers to use wizard true rituals....


Just call it 'The Kingdom of Zeal' and call it good.

CR 30 Hedgehogs of doom not included. ;)

Considering I've never played Chronotrigger I don't think it be appropriate. :smalltongue:

[Lord Vukodlak]

Alright here's my suggestion don't do it. Your trying to do something "beyond the scope" of the rules "within the rules." So your options are don't do it, or go beyond the scope of the rules.

[BWR]

Look up the Alphatian kingdom of Floating Ar from Mystara. Originally from "Dawn of the Empires" boxed set, Bruce Heard expanded greatly on the kingdom in his blog, first article here (http://bruce-heard.blogspot.no/2013/01/Ar01.html).

[Der_DWSage]

I'm afraid I don't have the book myself, but this sounds like the sort of thing the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook could answer. I could swear there were rules for that sort of thing in there.

Though alternatively, if a ton of Immovable Rods are too much for you, there's the potential of expanding the Permanency list to include Fly on objects? It's a much more minor cheat than 'Majick.'

[Demonic_Spoon]

Plane of Air traits just make air spells more powerful, they never actually state the spell that is being enhanced to allow for Sharn. Unless it was in some book I don't possess.


The Elemental Plane of Air has the following traits.

Subjective directional gravity. Inhabitants of the plane determine their own “down” direction. Objects not under the motive force of others do not move.

Manifest Zone(Plane of Air)(In one of the eberron books), is superior, permanent, effective and lower level way of getting this than various other methods.


I remember seeing a magic item in one of my FR books that was a metal plate that could hold aloft quite a bit of weight. I wanna say it was Magic of Faerun. In any case the item is used in-setting as the basis of flying ships. Does anyone else remember these? I'm AFB at the moment.
Halruaan Skyship, Shining South


I'm afraid I don't have the book myself, but this sounds like the sort of thing the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook could answer. I could swear there were rules for that sort of thing in there.
It does indeed, page 48, flying mobility with 0 speed. However it's probably cheaper to just use immovable rods if you use weightless or near-weightless construction materials, of which there are several.

Joke Answer: Build the city high enough that it's actually in orbit.

[Milo v3]

Alright here's my suggestion don't do it. Your trying to do something "beyond the scope" of the rules "within the rules." So your options are don't do it, or go beyond the scope of the rules.
"Trying to do something beyond the scope of the rules within the rules" is effectively the motto of the setting.


Look up the Alphatian kingdom of Floating Ar from Mystara. Originally from "Dawn of the Empires" boxed set, Bruce Heard expanded greatly on the kingdom in his blog, first article here.
Can't go to that site because of blocks on my computer.


Manifest Zone(Plane of Air)(In one of the eberron books), is superior, permanent, effective and lower level way of getting this than various other methods.

That interestingly sorta contradicts the Eberron Campaign Setting book thingy, but is very very useful none the less.


I'm afraid I don't have the book myself, but this sounds like the sort of thing the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook could answer. I could swear there were rules for that sort of thing in there.

Though alternatively, if a ton of Immovable Rods are too much for you, there's the potential of expanding the Permanency list to include Fly on objects? It's a much more minor cheat than 'Majick.'


It does indeed, page 48, flying mobility with 0 speed. However it's probably cheaper to just use immovable rods if you use weightless or near-weightless construction materials, of which there are several.
I'll check to see if I have that book.


Joke Answer: Build the city high enough that it's actually in orbit.
Sadly the inhabitants require oxygen. :smalltongue:

[Demonic_Spoon]

Sadly the inhabitants require oxygen. :smalltongue:

That's easily solved.

Also, to build on(heh, pun) the "near weightless city on an Immovable Rod" idea.

Craft a Colossal+++(however many +s you need) wooden shield, made out of soarwood(-75% weight), with Lightweight Construction(-20% weight) and with the Halfweight enchantment(-50%), then support it with however many Immoveable rods are needed. Buildings are either inside portable holes/enveloping pits(weightless), formed directly from the shield via woodshape or the like, or supported slightly above it by their personal immovable rods, flying mobility wondrous architecture or similar.

Also, I've discovered the penultimate flying city method probably:

Create a city-"ship", of any desired size, let's say couple miles long. Give it the Cloud Keel augmentation(A&EG), it can now "soar" into the air at a speed of 40 feet. There's your floating city.

[lunar2]

Reread it. It says -if- the affected object/creature doesn't hit anything it occilates at the top of AoE. It says this in a passage detailing the effect of gravity's reversal, as opposed to the effect of the magic itself: a simple change of gravity's direction.

fine. reverse gravity the city itself. you'd need to do it in at least 4 different spots for balance reasons, making it more expensive, but it would work.

[Angelalex242]

Okay, okay, call it the Magic City of Vane, and put a bunch of snobby wizards on it.

(More relevant, since the magic city of Vane is held up by divine power, mostly, you could have it set up such that the gods keep it afloat...)

[Legendxp]

Lovin' this thread so far, I'm trying to think up a way to use sovereign glue somewhere. The best idea I've seen so far is multiple permanencied Wall of Force spells.

[Cruiser1]

The best idea I've seen so far is multiple permanencied Wall of Force spells.
Indeed, Wall of Force (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/wallOfForce.htm) and Permanency (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/permanency.htm) are both level 5 Wizard spells, so a floating city can be created by a simple core only 9th level Wizard. Once your force wall(s) is in place, it can hold up any amount of weight. After you've piled a bunch of rock on the force wall, cast Sor/Wiz 4 Stone Shape (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/stoneShape.htm) to flow stone around the force wall like wrapping paper, so there's no direct line of effect to it and it's much harder to dispel.

One issue with Wall of Force is it has to be a "flat, vertical plane". We'd prefer a level horizontal plane to better hold up things on top of it, instead of an upright knife edge that may slice into things. To get a horizontal Wall of Force, first cast Sor/Wiz 3 False Gravity (SPC), which allows you to temporarily redefine "down" for yourself. Make "down" be off to one side, and then when cast a "flat, vertical plane" to you will be horizontal in the real world. :smallbiggrin:

[unseenmage]

Flying Buttress for 48,000gp from Sharn: City of Towers page 170.

Enjoy.

[ellindsey]

I'm using the permanent Wall of Force method for the flying cities in my campaign. I also houseruled that the Wall of Force can be horizontal if the caster desires. Each city is held aloft by many such walls, which are buried in the city foundations, but are still accessible by service tunnels so they can be inspected periodically and replaced if required.

[mregecko]

Second the Stronghold Builder's Guide. It has all of the rules for this. It's not even all that expensive, all things considered.

[TuggyNE]

Indeed, Wall of Force (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/wallOfForce.htm) and Permanency (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/permanency.htm) are both level 5 Wizard spells, so a floating city can be created by a simple core only 9th level Wizard.

Technically, such a Wizard would need UMD for Beads of Karma to get their CL high enough; permanency requires a CL of 13 for wall of force.

Wiz 13 in Core works just dandy though.

[Demonic_Spoon]

Dominate some Rimefire Eidolons. By RAW nothing prevents them from moving their icebergs upwards so you can settle on your Eidolon slave's iceberg than have him sent it into the sky. Viola floating chunks of ice.

[Brookshw]

Take a base creature whatever that giant turtle was in 2e that was confused with islands when it surfaced. Apply template with fly (afb atm, half air elemental?). Advance it as high as necessary. Put 4 advanced mastadons on its back. Lay some form of circular flat plane on their backs. Cover with dirt, mountains etc. Plant large variety of seeds and get some druids to get the flora growing. Populate with critters. Build cities and inhabit. I think you get where this is going :smallbiggrin:

[Kane0]

Take a base creature whatever that giant turtle was in 2e that was confused with islands when it surfaced.

Zaratan.
10char

[Captnq]

Stronghold builders:

Immovable Rod (7,500 gp)
For an interesting foundation, you can place your
(small) stronghold upon a series of immovable rods
placed at whatever height in the air you can reach.
Each rod can support 8,000 pounds, so putting one at
each corner of a stronghold space is enough to hold a
space built of wood and most furnishings. Using heavier
materials requires more immovable rods, which
could prove financially untenable. Don’t overburden
the rods, unless you want to risk a disastrous collapse.
Smart builders encase the rods in something substantial
before the project gets too far along. After all, if
anyone can come along and push the button to allow
the rod to be moved again, the entire place it supports
is in constant danger.
Unlike other floating strongholds, one based on a
foundation of immovable rods cannot be moved about.
Once a rod has been made part of a foundation, causing
the rod to move in any way destabilizes the whole
building. How drastically this would happen depends
in part upon what rests upon the immovable rods and
how many rods are in use.


Flying stronghold:
maintains stable airy position 15,000 gp/space

How many spaces is a city? well, a large castle is 80. You figure out how many castles could fit in your city.


Flying: This function allows the stronghold to float
adrift in the air, immune to the call of gravity. Without
locomotion (see Table 2–12: Stronghold Locomotion),
the stronghold floats and does not truly fly—in this
case, the designer must, during construction, choose a
fixed height from 10 feet to ten miles in altitude. If this
mobility function is dispelled or destroyed somehow,
the fortress slowly drops down to whatever surface lies
below (as if under the effect of feather fall).
Caster Level: 17th; Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item,
reverse gravity; Market Price: 15,000 gp


I have a more elegant solution.

STONE TRAP
- SHINING SOUTH (3.5)


Transmutation
Level: Cleric 7, Sorcerer/Wizard 7
Target: Stone object up to 200 lb./level
You cause a block of stone to turn invisible and hover at a designated point in the air. The stone remains there until triggered, either by special conditions set by you or by a command word you choose. Once triggered, the stone trap turns visible and falls naturally. The stone of the stone trap can be positioned so that it holds up additional material within the weight limit of the spell. For example, a 2,200-pound stone with stone trap cast on it by a 13th-level Cleric could support an additional 400 pounds. This additional weight could be placed on top of the stone in midair, the stone could function as a plug in a hole in a ceiling, and so on.


Triggering Conditions: When 1 Billion Years Passes.

Now, 1 cubic foot of rock is aprox 165 pounds. Lets go with 200, to be safe.

So a 2'x2'x1' rock would weigh 800 pounds. Cast by minimum caster level, you would have 1800 pounds to spare. It would have quite a but of sructural integrity, being a foot thick piece of granite.

You get some guy to cast this, over and over, day after day, week after week, month after month.

Now, if you built the structures out of wood, that would cut down on weight.

So, I would take 4 immovable rods as my "corner stones" and then have a "line" of stone traps between them. Actually, I'd cut down on space and make it a 5'x1'x1' rock. That would be aprox 1000 pounds, allow me to make a continious strip of 1'x1' thick rock between immovable rods, and each rock, if cast at 15th level, would hold up 2000 lbs each..

So Lets make our building... 100'x100' base.

The rods provide 8000 lbs x 4 = 32,000 lbs
The rocks would provide 2000 lbs x 80 = 160,000 lbs

Maybe I don't have any support beams that can run 100' accross. So I'll drop a stone trap in the middle of each "floor" make it 9 traps to be on the safe side.

Those traps we will ignore, because they just really handle sheer force.

Now, I had to spend 30,000 gp for the rods (I'm assuming construction grade rods are more expensive) but nothing for the spells, except for time (which in this cast is 89 castings of the same spell.

I could ignore the rods, except that the way the spell reads, I don't think I can put the rocks under each other to support one another. I think once one goes, it goes. The one below it would then have to hold whatever it was holding, PLUS the 1000 lbs rock above it.

The rods, however, I think I can wedge those in the corners to give extra support, just in case, you know? But if I wanted to do things on the cheap, I could skip them.

You would TOTALLY want to make this out of wood. And you would repeat the spells for every level of the building. But, in theory, there would be no limit to how high you could build this.


Of course, there is an issue. Anti-magic.

So, you would want some redundant backup. Specifically, wall of force.

Now, wall of force has no weight limit. You could build whatever you want on a permanent wall of force. It's a Lower level then stone trap. It is immune to AMF which would destroy the Stone traps.

It has a few drawbacks:
1. Disintegrate pops it like a zit. THE WHOLE WALL. So entire buildings will colapse if you lose one spell.
2. Permanency costs xp. 2,500, to be exact.

So, I would require each building to be made from:
Stone traps every 5 feet on the outside for every floor.
4 redundant immovable rods as cornerstones, every 5 stories (Keeps wind sheer under control)
A Permanent wall of force Every 10 stories to keep colapses compartmentalized.

Expensive? Sure, but not insanely expensive. Given time, say, a 100 years, one building a year, yeah, you could have your floating city, easy.

And parts of the city oculd be made "not up to code" so they got thrown up faster and cheaper. So you got parts of the city that are new, sparkling and shiney, and then the bad part of town that is literally crumbling away.

Side note, anyone else think of any safety features besides these?

[Demonic_Spoon]

Take a base creature whatever that giant turtle was in 2e that was confused with islands when it surfaced. Apply template with fly (afb atm, half air elemental?). Advance it as high as necessary. Put 4 advanced mastadons on its back. Lay some form of circular flat plane on their backs. Cover with dirt, mountains etc. Plant large variety of seeds and get some druids to get the flora growing. Populate with critters. Build cities and inhabit. I think you get where this is going :smallbiggrin:

A Zaratan is merely colassal. May as well use a Cloud Ray or Soarwhale if you're going that way.

[BWR]

The zaratan (http://kayedraper-writeme.blogspot.no/2012/04/z-is-for-zaratan.html), at least in 2e, was well beyond 3.x Colossal.

[Fouredged Sword]

I remember setting up a cat girl killing contraption that used 3 ring gates and some Riverine to make a object that transmits motion only one way.

You get 3 pairs of ring gates. You set them along the three axis of motion (X, Y, and Z. All the gates point inward, and are mounted to a device that holds their orientation.

You then create a jack looking object that sits in the center of the gates and passes through each, connecting back with itself each time.

The fortress is then supported by connecting the center object to the foundation through NI thin chords of Riverine (to save cost).

The ring gates cannot be moved by the center object, because any motion by it is resisted by the force through the opposing gate. The city cannot move in relation to the gates, and cannot exert any kind of force on the gates.

Then gates then act as an fulcrum to move the city around. Rotation would be a problem, but any motion in the X, Y, or Z direction could be performed by a small air elemental holding the gate device, allowing your city to float indefinably.

[Captnq]

Then gates then act as an fulcrum to move the city around. Rotation would be a problem, but any motion in the X, Y, or Z direction could be performed by a small air elemental holding the gate device, allowing your city to float indefinably.

I... am not sure if that would work RAW.

However, I love the way it looks. I'm seeing this metal six pronged thing floating inside six spinning rings. There's a walkway around it and two guys are standing on the walkway, staring at the thing.

"So, that's what holds up the city?"
"Yup."
"So how's it work?"
"Some kids were playing with some ring gates and tossed a jax into it. Poof."
"Poof?"
"Damned if we know. It works. That's all we care about. Summoned a few air elementals to cut down on the wind sheer and we've had smooth sailing ever since."

[Brookshw]

The zaratan (http://kayedraper-writeme.blogspot.no/2012/04/z-is-for-zaratan.html), at least in 2e, was well beyond 3.x Colossal.

There are too many creatures that don't fit into the space parameters of colossal for it to have an upward size cap as far as I'm concerned, call it colossal+ if you like. Otherwise a moon is colossal while a dragon walking on its surface also is. Gets a bit silly.

[Demonic_Spoon]

There are too many creatures that don't fit into the space parameters of colossal for it to have an upward size cap as far as I'm concerned, call it colossal+ if you like. Otherwise a moon is colossal while a dragon walking on its surface also is. Gets a bit silly.

No, the moon would be divided into sections, like any other super large objects.

[Maginomicon]

You can permanency an indeterminate number of Emerald Planes spell effects (1 per 2 CL 5ft-square walls of force; Dragon Magazine #323 page 79) and encase the planes in something that makes them immune to being dispelled or otherwise negated.

Alternatively, you could also have your setting take place on the Plane of Radiance (Dragon Magazine #321 page 68). Floating Islands are the norm there.

[Brookshw]

No, the moon would be divided into sections, like any other super large objects.

Actually I was thinking of the Elder Evil that IS a moon. Also I think there's another similar creature in the epic handbook.

[Demonic_Spoon]

Actually I was thinking of the Elder Evil that IS a moon. Also I think there's another similar creature in the epic handbook.
Atropus(The Moonlet), is not statted out in Elder Evils, only his aspect is. If players wanted to attack the moonlet directly though they'd probably deal damage in sections though. I'm not aware of any such creature in the ELH

[Brookshw]

Atropus(The Moonlet), is not statted out in Elder Evils, only his aspect is. If players wanted to attack the moonlet directly though they'd probably deal damage in sections though. I'm not aware of any such creature in the ELH

/shrug, the point remains that an entity exists that defies standard size categories, statted or not. There are other examples but I chose an extreme one.

But the point here is that cruising around on your own discworld/city would, for me at least, be amusing:smallbiggrin: