Questions for a Homebrew: Spellbane Class

[UmpteenthDoctor]

I am working on a class called Spellbane, its basically an imporved version of the Spellthief but not a FIX of said class.

I was thinking of giving it some of the following abilities.

0-6 Spell Progression
Custom Spell List (Need help with that. It would be a mic of Arcane and Divine spells. Buffs, Debuffs, Save or Dies are his style of casting intermixed with a few vague utility stuff.)

Spell Resistance = Level + Charisma
Due to their design in fighting spell casters.

Spellburn = Basically the same as the Warlock's Eldritch Blast in that it gains up to 10d6 (10d8 for PF) over twenty levels via a every even level progression. This is a ranged Touch Attack 30+10 per level.

The Spellburn is also how the class effects spell casters. By dropping d6s (or d8s) they can pick that many spells from the caster's spell slots or spells prepared that day to effect. Meaning the limit at level 20 is 10 spells (Which is a lot, perhaps a better solution is needed? Advice?)

The Spellbane can not only burn a spell slot, rendering it unusable for that day.

But also they do not just burn a spell they absorb the essence of the spell when they do that (Imagine it like them burning the spell and absorbing the smoke). They add the spells to their spell known list in the proper place even if that spell is in excess of 6th level.

They cannot cast these spells, instead they can use them for a difference purpose.

The Spellbane can use stored spells that they have stolen and use them to counter spells of their enemies.

Say my Spellbane steals the spell fireball off a Wizard. Now this spell is not a level higher then 6th but it is a spell that is not on their spell list. If a wizard attempts to use a fireball on my Spellbane he can use that spell he stole to counter that using the ability Counterspell.
Using the Counterspell the Spellbane can gain an opposition roll. The Wizard casting the fireball suddenly has to make a Fort Save as the Spellbane does the same. This is due thematically to the fact that the Spellbane is sending the send magical essence of the Fireball back at the Wizard to cancel it out.

If the Spellbane makes the higher save then the Fireball is negated midflight and does no damage but still uses up the spell slot it occupied. If he fails the Wizard's attack lands as normal.

At level three and every three levels thereafter the Spellbane gains a specialty Touch of ability
Touch of Will Blank for Arcane
Touch of Divine Disruption for Divine
Touch of Decaying Nature for Druid's Divine
Touch of Mind Blank for Psionics
At each of these levels the Spellburn chooses one of these, which grants him his Charisma modifier to his Saves to resist spells from that type of magic, as well as to his opposition checks against spells from that type as well as stacks with Touch of Disruption.

The Spellburn's Spell of Disruption is a touch attack (Not Range) spell like ability. When the Spellburn makes a successful Touch Attack against a magic user he makes an opposing Fortitude Save. If the opponent fails their save, the caster loses access to their current high spell level known (Temporarily) to the effect of the Spells Caster Level -1.

I am thinking of possibility giving him the Warlock/Artificer's magic device creation at level 4.

Any advice, suggestions, comments?

[Glimbur]

SR equal to level + Cha mod is not very good. The typical formula is 10+level, so an even-level full caster has a 55% chance of affecting you. As you have it written, though, it's level + cha score, which is ~16 at level 1 and should grow a little faster than 10+level. Stick with that and make it clearer that it's not a typo.

6 levels of buffs, debuffs, and SoD's feels like it lacks focus. I'm far too lazy to suggest spells for the list, sorry.

Spellburn: what is the 30 + 10 per level at the end for?

The counter-spell mechanic is interesting, but kind of limited. What kind of action is the counter? Standard action would mean you have to ready it and be rather weak; immediate action is probably better. Dueling Fort saves is an interesting way to do the dispel.

A Spellbane will have all four touches at 12th level. It's an interesting idea to let them focus on particular kinds of magic; you might want to broaden that so that a Spellbane that focuses on wizards ends up different than one that focuses on clerics. Maybe anti-wizard includes more flying disrupting abilities, contingency by-passing, and bonuses v illusions while anti-cleric is better at stripping off +hit buffs and maybe banishing/turning called outsiders.

A touch that reduces caster level could be useful. You'll need to define a duration, if it stacks, if it can be used for iterative attacks (multiple touches in one round)... but it is interesting.

Magic device creation is powerful.

There are some interesting ideas here, I'd be curious to see it turn into a class. Spellthief is a fun idea but ends up being a little limited in scope. This class sounds like it might have more to do when not fighting casters while still having unusual and useful powers there.

[UmpteenthDoctor]

Ah ok I was not sure of the SR rules and norms.

So Spell Resistance would then be 10+Class Level+Charisma [Average should be at level twenty 34 if your Charisma is an 18) But stacks with any racial spell resistance or spell resistance from other classes or methods.

The spell list is my biggest current problem.
I was just being general if anyone has any ideas or suggestions feel free, I might use the Spellthief as a base though and add in from other 6th level progressions to make a adhawk list.

For Counterspell its an immediate action, and its meant to be slightly limited. Think of it this way though, the more spells that are stolen and copied the more powerful this becomes as if you are diligent and copy maybe from magical items such as scrolls, wands, and staves as well as breaking down magical items by absorbing the magic out of them he could then use the added spells to always counter it.

Take my fireball example. The Wizard loses that spell slot and his fireball fizzled out. But his Sorcerer buddy tries to use Fireball as well. It falls into the problem of needing to make that same Fort Save.

But these can be used on more then just offensive powers, just used that as a best example. Imagine casting Wish, well if my Spellbane has stolen the magical essence of the Wish spell you still need to make the fort save if you are within range of my Spellburn ability.

For Spellburn the 30+10 per level is its range. So at level 1 it can be cast to a distance of 40 feet, unless you think that is to short? Maybe 60+10 feet per level.

As far as the touches I intended to make it that if you take the Wizard or Arcane focus touch twice it gives you something like an AoO with spellburn, or maybe allows a greater bonus with it such as adding Wis to the saves and opposition rolls.

The Spell of Disruption does indeed stack with itself so every use drops it down from the current max (Its why it doesn't say highest level but current highest) and can be used for iterative attacks.

I know its powerful and maybe dd item creation feats for free along it or at least a handful of them, maybe just bonus feats overall for them. But I think it would allow the Spellbane to really fit an idea of fight fire with fire idea even if his spell list is restricted the UMD could he very useful.

Anyone else?

[TuggyNE]

Ah ok I was not sure of the SR rules and norms.

So Spell Resistance would then be 10+Class Level+Charisma [Average should be at level twenty 34 if your Charisma is an 18) But stacks with any racial spell resistance or spell resistance from other classes or methods.

Just a quick note: do not stack whole SRs like this, because it's essentially the same as saying "if you have armor you can stack total AC with the total AC calculated with natural armor" — the numbers grow way too high and are based on the wrong things. A pixie here would have SR of 61 at ECL 20 with no buyoff, which is utterly absurd (being higher than any Core monsters except the CR 57 hecatoncheires). Instead, try something like this: "If your Cha modifier + any other racial or inherent spell resistance is higher, use this instead." That way the bonus from the class means something, but you don't completely throw off the math. (A pixie with the suggested change would have SR 35 with no buyoff, instead of the usual 31.)

[UmpteenthDoctor]

Thank you, that is very informative. I am gonna post up a rough draft to give people a better chance to help me PEACH this.

[UmpteenthDoctor]

These are a rough draft of some of my ideas. Please recall that when you examine the list below. These are not final versions.

If you have constructive advice please share it, but please do not give replies about how this doesn't need to exist or something similar.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency:
Spellbanes are proficient with all Simple Weapons, all Martial Weapons. Spellbanes are also proficient with Light and Medium armor as well as shields (Except Tower Shields).

Spells:
All Spellsbanes draw their spells from the Spellbane spell list. Like divine casters the Spellbanes know all spells of the levels that they can currently cast. Like many spellcasters Spellbanes have a limited amount of spells they can cast per day.

Spellbanes spells per day may increase if they have a high Charisma score as with other classes.
Spellbanes cast all spells as if they are a divine spell thus a Spellbane does not suffer from Arcane Spell Failure.

Spell Resistance (Su)
Spellbanes have a innate resistance to the magical arts, some say this is a blessing by the gods of magic but others believe it is due to their training and knack of absorbing magical essences. The Spell Resistance is equal to 10+Class Level+Charisma Modifier. If your Cha modifier + any other racial or inherent spell resistance is higher, use this instead.

Force of Personality (Ex)
The Spellbane's personality and sense of self is so strong it strengthens all aspects of himself. This allows the Spellbane to add his Charisma Modifier bonus to his Saves.

Spellburn (Su)
The Spellbane possesses the ability to manipulate their own magical essence and launch it as a ranged touch attack. The attack itself deals 1d6 points of damage at every odd level the number of d6s increases by one to a maximum of 10d6 at level 19. To use this ability is a Standard Action.

The Spellburn can also be used to effectively rob a foe caster of their spells. By reducing the number of d6s down by 1 the Spellbane can make an opposing spellcraft check the Spellbane can effect one spell slot per d6 reduced to a maximum of 10 spell slots at level 19.

When a spell slot is burnt it is effectively treated as if the caster has already used that spell slot, and thus is unavailable till the following day. At level 8 the Spellbane can force an adaptive save on the opposing caster for every burnt spell slot that the Spellburn inflicts the save is selected at the beginning of the day and is the same save type as Counter Spell. Upon a success the spell slot is rendered unusable for the current day, upon a failed save the spell slot has a 50% chance of being rendered unusable the following day.

When a spell slot is effectively 'burnt' the spell prepared there or if used on a spontaneous caster the random spells taken from their spell known list are treated as having been prepared there. The prepared spells are added to the Spellbane's spell essence known list.

Spell Essence (Ex)
When a Spellbane using spellburn on a caster and absorbs the essences of prepared spells these spells are now added permanently to this secondary spell known list. These spells are not treated as part of his spells known list for the purposes of spells per day casting. Instead if a Spellbane takes levels in another spellcasting class that can use these spells as part of their spells known list.

Counter Spell (Su)
When a Spellbane is either the target of a spell, in the area of effect of a spell, or is within range of his Spellburn ability the Spellbane can force an opposition roll to be made against the caster casting the spell. This roll is an adaptive save against the Spellbane's own save, the save type is selected at the beginning of the day. The Spellbane uses the Spell Essence of a spell essence known obtained via the spellburn special effects if the Spellbane does not possess said spell essence he cannot force this opposition roll. If the opponent’s roll succeeds the spell is cast to normal effect, though must overcome the Spellbane's spell resistance. If the opponent's roll failed the spell is tried as having failed and fizzled using up the spell slot. At Level 8 the Spellbane can force a second adaptive save, if this succeeds there is no effect. If this save fails the caster loses a second spell slot of that level for that day. If no other spell slot exist for that level for that day, a spell slot of the highest spell level known is used, if none of these exist then the highest spell level -1 is used. (For example a 10th level wizard uses a 3rd level spell and is Counter Spelled, but he fails his second fort save, he then loses a 5th level spell slot. However if he has none remaining it goes to 4th, if none there it goes to 2nd and so forth.)

Spell Target Focus (Su)
At 3rd level and every three levels thereafter the Spellbane can choose one of the following abilities. If the Spellbane so chooses they can choose the same target multiple times to gain better effects.

When the Spellbane reaches 3rd level the Spellbane selects a specific spellcaster class such as Sorcerer, Wizard, Druid, etc. Upon taking this focus the Spellbane gains his Int modifier to his opposition rolls used with the Counter Spell and Spellburn effects on the selected class type.

When the same class is picked a second time the Spellburn gains the effect of an aura like ability. Starting from the Spellbane and spreading out in an area of 20 ft +10 ft per class level the Spellbane forces an adaptive save check of 20+Spellbane's Charisma Modifier+Spell Level for the spellcaster that was selected to cast a spell within the field of effect of this aura. If the save succeeds then the spell is cast normally, if it fails the spell fizzles out and the spell slot is expended.
It is at this level that the Spellbane can use up one of their spell slots for the day to increase DC saves and add a modifier of that spell slot level to any saves put against a foe of that specified class.

When the same class is picked a third time the Spellbane gains the ability to treat up to four of his spell slots as containing counter spell. This ability allows the Spellbane to use Counter Spell even if he does not actually have that spell essence in his spell essence known list.

Touch of Disruption (Sp)
When a Spellbane makes a successful touch attack against a spellcaster they make an adaptive save, the save type is the same for Counter Spell and Spellburn. If the spellcaster fails their save they lose access to their current highest spell level and are treated for all purposes regarding spellcasting, spell trigger, and spell completion items as having CL-1 of their current highest spell level. This touch attack does stack and can be used in iterative attacks. This touch attack can only be used with either unarmed attack or with light masterwork weapons.

Imbue Item (Su)
A Spellbane is filled with magical essence and has learned to use this to imbue magical effects into spell trigger and spell completion items such as Wands, Scrolls, Staves, etc. The Spellbane does not need to know the spell in which he is adding to a wand or scroll, etc. The only requirement is that the Spellbane must known the creation item feat before he can perform this. The DC check is DC 15+Spell Level for Arcane Spells or DC 25+Spell level for Divine. These magical items are not treated as being either Divine or Arcane and so cannot be used for the purpose of scribing into a wizard spell book. The exception to this rule is if the spell exists on the Spellbane's spell list or Spell Essence known list.

Mystical Skill (Ex)
The Spellbane has a natural knack for magical essences especially when manipulating the magic inside magical items. The Spellbane can take 10 on a Use Magic Device check even if distracted of threatened. This ability also allows a Spellbane to use a Spellcraft check of 15+Spell Level for an Arcane Spell or 25+Spell Level for Divine spells to add a spells essence to his Spell Essence known list. This however does reduce the charges of a Wand by 10, a Scroll is used up, and a spell is removed from the stave if this is done to it.

Touch of Draining (Sp)
Making a Successful Touch Attack the Spellbane must make a Willsave of DC 15+SL to absorb the essence of arcane spells. 25+SL for absorbing the essence of divine spells. The Spellbane can absorb the essences of up do a 1d4 each round the touch is maintained. After the initial touch attack the Spellbane must make a successful Grapple Check to maintain his physical contact. The spells absorbed are added to the Spell Essence known list. The spells absorbed are either the prepared spells the Wizard has prepared that day or for spontaneous casters these are randomly drawn spells from their spells known list.