Maximize breath with DFA question

[kpumphre]

Maximize breath
Prerequisite

CON 17, breath weapon,

So as a DFA I can use this.

My questions
1. I have cold breath, and fire currently so If I use this with cold breath then it will need to recharge for 3 rounds, however could I the next round use my normal fire breath?
2. Does the work with Entangling Exhalation,?

For number 2 with Power surge then could I have my time be 6 rounds with every round be doing 6 damage?

[Chronos]

You need to have a breath weapon with a recharge time measured in rounds. By default, a DFA does not qualify for this, since the DFA's breath weapon has no recharge time.

[ShurikVch]

You need to have a breath weapon with a recharge time measured in rounds. By default, a DFA does not qualify for this, since the DFA's breath weapon has no recharge time.

Feat Power Surge from Dragon #313 allow to qualify for it, because affected supernatural attack get recharge time +1 round (minimum 1).

Also add +1 to DC, or +1 damage dice, or +50% duration time.

[ohil]

Can anyone tell me the answer to 1? I'm wondering this to

[Alabenson]

Regarding question 1:
Technically, you only have one breath weapon, which is modified by your breath effects. Therefore, you could not use any DFA breath weapon for three rounds after using one modified by Maximize Breath.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Breath Weapon is a single ability, even if it can be used in different modes. If your entire breath weapon ability is on a wait timer for a metabreath feat, you cannot use your breath weapon in any mode until that time has passed.

[ShurikVch]

Breath Weapon is a single ability, even if it can be used in different modes. If your entire breath weapon ability is on a wait timer for a metabreath feat, you cannot use your breath weapon in any mode until that time has passed.

Technically, you can have arbitrary amount of Breath Weapons from race, template(s), class(es), graft, and spell effect(s), but DFA give you only one Breath Weapon

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Technically, you can have arbitrary amount of Breath Weapons from race, template(s), class(es), graft, and spell effect(s), but DFA give you only one Breath Weapon

Rules Compendium page 22 disagrees:

Even if a creature has more than one type of breath weapon,
the time between uses is a time during which it can’t use any
of its breath weapons.

[ShurikVch]

Rules Compendium page 22 disagrees:

Firstly, Rules Compendium is waste of perfectly good paper

Second, what if you are true dragon with levels in DFA? Your "natural" Breath Weapon can be used once per 1d4 turns, your DFA breath weapon can be used every turn

Also, what if after using BW dragon will cast Dragon Breath? Do you seriously say spell will do nothing for 1d4 turns?

[Deophaun]

Firstly, Rules Compendium is waste of perfectly good paper
Still RAW.

Second, what if you are true dragon with levels in DFA? Your "natural" Breath Weapon can be used once per 1d4 turns, your DFA breath weapon can be used every turn
If you use your natural breath weapon, then you need to wait 1d4 turns until you can use any breath weapon. If you use your DFA breath weapon, then you don't have to wait to use either your DFA or natural.

Also, what if after using BW dragon will cast Dragon Breath? Do you seriously say spell will do nothing for 1d4 turns?
Dragon breath does not give you a breath weapon. It gives you an attack that mimics a breath weapon. So no, it doesn't interfere with your breath weapons. You also cannot apply metabreath feats to it, or apply the bonus from Ability Focus (Breath Weapon) to the DC, because, again, the spell does not say that you gain a breath weapon.

[ShurikVch]

Dragon breath does not give you a breath weapon. It gives you an attack that mimics a breath weapon. So no, it doesn't interfere with your breath weapons. You also cannot apply metabreath feats to it, or apply the bonus from Ability Focus (Breath Weapon) to the DC, because, again, the spell does not say that you gain a breath weapon.
Depend on source.
Variant from Draconomicon says:
You gain a breath weapon resembling that of a dragon.
When you cast this spell, you choose both the shape and energy type of the breath weapon, from the following options: line (acid, electricity, or fire) or cone (acid, cold, or fire).
A line is 5 feet high, 5 feet wide, and 60 feet long, while a cone is 30 feet long, 30 feet high, and 30 feet wide.
Once you make the selection of shape and energy type, it is fixed for the duration of the spell.
Using your breath weapon is a standard action.
The breath weapon deals 3d6 points of damage of the chosen energy type, plus an additional 1d6 points of damage for every two levels above 5th (to a maximum of 10d6 at 19th level).
Targets in the area may attempt a Reflex save for half damage.
You can use this breath weapon up to three times during the spell's duration (plus one additional use per two levels above 5th).
After using this breath weapon, you can't use it again for 1d4+1 rounds.
(Using this breath weapon has no effect on your ability to use other breath weapons you might have, and vice versa).
You can't have more than one dragon breath spell active at the same time.
Even though using your breath weapon poses no danger to you, you don't gain any resistance or immunity to the energy type of the weapon.
Special: Sorcerers cast this spell at +1 caster level.

And Draconomicon is a book which contain nearly all [metabreath] feats

[Yuki Akuma]

Depend on source.
Variant from Draconomicon says:

The Spell Compendium version, being published later, takes precedence.

And it reads "You gain the ability to breathe a gout of energy as a standard action that mimics a dragon's breath. Once you've used the breath attack, you must wait 1d4 rounds before doing so again."

Which does not actually say you gain a breath weapon.

[ShurikVch]

The Spell Compendium version, being published later, takes precedence.

Draconomicon is primary source for dragons.

[Yuki Akuma]

Draconomicon is primary source for dragons.

Dragon Breath isn't a dragon. It's a spell.

[ShurikVch]

Dragon Breath isn't a dragon. It's a spell.

OK

I say, Spell Compendium variant is a different spell with the same name

Variant from Draconomicon is

Transmutation
Level: Sorcerer 3, Wizard 3,
Components: V, S,
Duration: 10 minutes/level (D)


Variant from Spell Compendium is

Evocation [Good or Evil]
Level: Sorcerer 5, Wizard 5,
Components: V, S, M, DF,
Duration: 1 round/level

[Deophaun]

I say, Spell Compendium variant is a different spell with the same name
That would be something, as I am unaware of any spell within the Spell Compendium that did not previously exist elsewhere, or of any rule that would support having two spells of the same name. And it's not like dragon breath got unique treatment, either. Bestow curse, greater had the same changes made (spell list adjustment and school change). And if you really want to look at violence done to a spell, you should look at the changes lion's charge has undergone since it appeared in Savage Species.

[Phelix-Mu]

Actually, an interesting point on spell names and versions. I believe the one I'm thinking of is called burning blood. There is a version in draconomicon which is clearly a totally different spell than the version in Spell Compendium by the same name. The new one in Spell Compendium can't really supersede the old because they don't even do the same thing. Like not even close. One the dragon casts on itself to enchant its blood to deal damage when it's spilled, and the other you cast on the enemy to hurt them.

So, my overall point is they break their own rules for how the version precedence is supposed to work by doing stuff like making two different spells with the same name.