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Pagz
2007-01-09, 07:46 AM
I had a crayzeh idea, If you get a suit of armor thats made of mithril and masterwork quality, does that mean the armor check penalty is -4?

Also does the amount of enchants a suit of armor has reduce its armor check penalty that much as well? (eg. does a +3 enchantment reduce its armor check penalty by -3, or is the maximum reduction any armor can get -1?)

Dark Knight Renee
2007-01-09, 07:52 AM
No, ALL mithral armor is masterwork, and has -3, as the text specifically states. +1 etcc armor enhancements do not reduce the check penalty at all.

Pagz
2007-01-09, 07:56 AM
...aww

I missed that part about the mithril armor, well I feel silly

Thomas
2007-01-09, 11:18 AM
Get a suit of mithral full plate of nimbleness, though. I think that special armor quality is in Magic of Faerūn. Decreased ACP, increased Max Dex Mod.

Fax Celestis
2007-01-09, 11:55 AM
And for maximum twinkage, try twilight mithral breastplate of nimbleness. For all your gishly needs!

Matthew
2007-01-09, 04:49 PM
Damn Mithral Full Plate Armour.

Leon
2007-01-10, 08:32 AM
Mithral Mountain Plate - All the bells and Whistles of Mithral Armour but you still move at a Snails pace

Toliudar
2007-01-10, 10:25 AM
I've seen the "Twilight" enhancement mentioned a couple times on the forums. Where's it found, and can someone provide a rough sense of what it does?

Thomas
2007-01-10, 10:30 AM
PHB2 (on the pages with the Duskblade) and somewhere else. I forget.

ExHunterEmerald
2007-01-10, 10:34 AM
I'm pretty sure it's on the SRD, but I'm not sure where originally. I want to say Unearthed Arcana. If I recall, it lessens the arcane spell failure percentage on your armor.

Toliudar
2007-01-10, 10:49 AM
Thanks to both. Mostly, I just wanted to understand the context in which it was being used. I'm pretty sure it's not SRD.

Thomas
2007-01-10, 11:00 AM
Twilight armor isn't in the SRD, no.

AtomicKitKat
2007-01-10, 11:19 AM
As I recall, the PHB2 mentions it as being first mentioned in BoED.

Ikkitosen
2007-01-10, 12:09 PM
Yeah, gives 9-11% reduction in ASF for a little under a +2 enhancement :wink:

Person_Man
2007-01-10, 12:33 PM
You can always take levels in Dread Commando (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20050407b&page=6). Reduces your Armor Check penalty by 4. Great for Marshal builds.

Having said that, I find that Armor Check penalties rarely come into play. Evasion requires light armor, so most Skill Monkeys rarely wear anything heavier than a Mithril Breastplate. And any Skill Monkey worth their masterwork thieve's tools has enough ranks that a -1 penalty has little impact.

Thomas
2007-01-10, 01:32 PM
As I recall, the PHB2 mentions it as being first mentioned in BoED.

Right you are. BoED it is.

ShneekeyTheLost
2007-01-10, 01:55 PM
Twilight:

+1 equivelant, reduces ASF by 10%

This is why you see a lot of Sorcerers running around in +1 Mithril Twilight Chain Shirt. Mithril reduces ASF by 10%, so does Twilight. No check penalty to screw over use without proficency, no ASF, and better armor bonus to AC than Mage Armor, so that's one less spell he has to keep in memory.

And all this for only around 5k total!

Ikkitosen
2007-01-10, 06:30 PM
And at high levels add Heavy Fortification or similar.

cupkeyk
2007-01-10, 06:48 PM
i have a question about mithral:


Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations.Does this mean that a breast plate's speed for a creature with thirty speed is thirty?

Fax Celestis
2007-01-10, 06:49 PM
No. It is 30'.

Ikkitosen
2007-01-10, 06:51 PM
Does this mean that a breast plate's speed for a creature with thirty speed is twenty?

A standars breastplate: yes. 20'.

A mithral breastplate: no. 30'.

the_tick_rules
2007-01-10, 07:15 PM
yes remember mithril does all of the following. halve the wight, reduce ACP by 3, and lighten it by a class so a mithril breastplate is light armor for purposes of speed restriction and certain feats require you wear light armor. though like a mithril chain shirt is still in the light category, it doesn't become being considered unarmored. oh and it is automatically masterwork and the benefits thereof are already factored in.

Matthew
2007-01-11, 07:20 AM
Indeed, and its general availability and relative cheapness makes it very annoying...

Jack_of_Spades
2007-01-11, 02:09 PM
I double the cost of armor from mithril. Or, they have to find the mithril themselves. Usually a dragon has some ancient mithril shirts or a shield. I have the PCs get a few pieces and then have them melted down and remade into thier armor. As a reward, in addition to the armor, they get a +1 bonus and a +1 ability for thier new item.

It's so strong! I really think it should cost more than it does.

Lothorus
2007-01-11, 06:31 PM
I agree with Mr. Jack. Special materials shouldn't grow on tress, so you can't just "buy" them at any old place. It must be a very rare material for being so special.

TheOOB
2007-01-11, 09:40 PM
I agree with Mr. Jack. Special materials shouldn't grow on tress, so you can't just "buy" them at any old place. It must be a very rare material for being so special.

Darkwood grows on trees.

Fax Celestis
2007-01-11, 09:48 PM
Darkwood is made out of trees? Darkwood is made out of TREES! TREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES! {/soylentgreen}

MrNexx
2007-01-11, 09:51 PM
I agree with Mr. Jack. Special materials shouldn't grow on tress, so you can't just "buy" them at any old place. It must be a very rare material for being so special.

Remember the 3.x paradigm, though: If you have the cash, and a population center of sufficient size, EVERYTHING is for sale.

RAW, pretty much every city of 5000 or more should be able to provide you with Mithril Full Plate, or any non-Heavy Armor item of Adamantine. If there are more than 12,000 people there, then you can get Heavy Adamantine armor, as well.

Jack_of_Spades
2007-01-12, 09:59 AM
Yes, but I make it cost more if htey buy it; and it doesn't come with free enchantments.
8000 GP to ignore hardness is ridiculus.
PC: Oh look a stone door! I'll cut it down!
Another PC: You talking to me? Are you, Bub?

And Mitril is just too good for the cost.

So, in large towns Mithril armor costs double. I fit's being bought with starting gold it's 2.5x as expensive. I try to keep special materials just that. Special.

Kantolin
2007-01-12, 02:37 PM
The trouble is, then nobody has any, while simultaneously people who don't care are, um, even more awesome than they were a second ago (Druid, Cleric, Wizard?)

8K GP could also go towards making that nonmagical weapon a +2. Or a +1 Flaming or sommat. Or almost a +3 for your armour.

Edit: Actually, I suppose the cleric might care. Maybe.

Matthew
2007-01-12, 04:31 PM
I don't think that is the trouble, I think that is the point. :smallsmile:

I know what you are saying, though. Player Characters ar expected to have access to Mithral by Level X to meet Challenge Y. Dungeon Masters are well advised to take note of that.

AmoDman
2007-01-12, 04:54 PM
If you mess with the prices on basic enchantment stuff you can skew the estimated wealth per level...just fyi, d&d is expected to have a fairly high level of magic.

MrNexx
2007-01-12, 05:07 PM
That's like saying the US is running at a slight deficit, amodman.

Matthew
2007-01-12, 08:11 PM
If you mess with the prices on basic enchantment stuff you can skew the estimated wealth per level...just fyi, d&d is expected to have a fairly high level of magic.

No, default D&D is expected to have a fairly high level of magic. Variants are mentioned in the 3.0 DMG (no idea if they made it into the 3.5 DMG). Magic, Wealth, Experience, Levels and Encounter Levels are all relatively well balanced against one another, but they are not unchangable and the game does not fall apart when changes are made.
D&D is a very flexible game capable of supporting a great diversity of play styles. There is no 'one true way.'