PDA

View Full Version : Fantasy counterpart New World



killerjag
2013-11-11, 09:11 AM
So, me and my friends were discussing how northern european culture and eastern asian culture are disproportionaly more common in fantasy than other cultures, and how this affects even worlds created to be un-european.
So we tried, as an exercise, to make a fantasy version of our country(Brazil), but in the end we were doing it for every new world country(the entire american continent and australia).

Now, our brainstorm was mostly fruitless, we were basicaly duplicating either the colonizer culture, or the colonized, being unable to translate a modern new world countrie into a fantasy counterpart.

So now I'm bringing this discussion here to know if you guys have ever used a fantasy version of the new world and how you did it, or how to handle colonization in fantasy. thanks.

TheCountAlucard
2013-11-11, 09:46 AM
You may find this relevant to your interests. (http://nobilis.me/quotes:designing-cultures-the-shomshak-way)

Jay R
2013-11-11, 11:08 AM
For an original D&D universe, I once posited that magic first came to our world in 1066, with the light from the super-nova in the Crab Nebula.

At first it had little effect, except on children. They actually began seeing bogey-men, exactly as described to them in stories. Therefore all fictional beasts in European legend started existing.

Europe quickly went to ruin and civilization collapsed. A few Europeans successfully sailed across to the New World, and stared a new civilzation there.

In cultures that lived within nature, like Orientals and Amerinds, there were fewer changes and less chaos. So the Europeans settled in a somewhat saner world -

- but they brought their legends with them.

Rhynn
2013-11-11, 11:27 AM
Tékumel, the Empire of the Petal Throne, is mostly reminiscent of Ancient South America/Mesoamerica (but not by a lot; it's a very alien and original setting, despite having humans as the primary race), and is thoroughly awesome.

EccentricCircle
2013-11-11, 02:58 PM
I once created a setting where a few ships of Conquistadors had arrived in the new world to find that rather than being the americas it was a jungle shrouded fantasy world complete with magic and monsters. They were the only "Humans" while the world they arrived in was populated by Elves, Dwarves, halflings etc. The newcomers had golden-age-of-piracy type ships, canons and guns, while the natives had magical powers. The New World had been ruled by the Yuan Ti, who had a vaguely Mayincatec style empire, however their civilisation had falled, leaving vast ruined cities and temples to their serpent gods. Their lizardmen slaves were now one of the most populous groups, at war with the elvish tribes, who had a kind of austrailian aboriginal culture, and the halflings who were styled on pacific islanders. I never quite figured out how to fit the dwarves into the new world. I considered making them sort of native american, but didn't know enough about that culture to do it properly.

I ran two campaigns, on set one hundred years after the conquistadors were stranded there, about a war between the struggling human cities and the lizardmen, and another about a ship from 17th century earth ending up there via the same portal.


There is a D&D setting called Maztica, which is basically the americas of the forgotten realms. It's alright as far as it goes, but large amounts of it are very direct counterparts of aztec culture and histor, to the point where you can figure out which characters are expys of which historical figures and mentally change the names as you read it to turn it into a brief summery of the fall of tenoctitlan (kind of)

killerjag
2013-11-11, 03:28 PM
thank you for the answers, but you are all falling in the same trap I did: focusing on pre-colonia culture instead of a fantasy version of the modern country. Its a real challenge to convert the current american cultures into a fantasy world, and I was trying to do something like breland, which is the closest thing from fantasy eagleland.

EccentricCircle
2013-11-11, 03:44 PM
Ah Interesting. Thats a very different approach all together.
I like the way Eberron creates a "technologically advanced" world with magic replacing the technology. It gives the setting a very different feel which is a nice change from more typical D&D stuff. I've always thought that most of the five nations have an early C20 european feel to them, Karrnath as Germany, Breland as Britain, Aundair as france, Cyre and belgium, Zillargo as the Netherlands, Moror holds as Switzerland and so on, with Xen'dric being similar to a fantasy Africa. Of course exactly how they are protrayed with vary a lot from one game to another based on the ideas of the DM. No where in Eberron with an american feel to it jumps out, with the exception of the Lhazaar region which is kind of caribbean pirate themed. Although I may just be forgetting, as its a while since i've read the books.

killerjag
2013-11-11, 04:21 PM
Ah Interesting. Thats a very different approach all together.
I like the way Eberron creates a "technologically advanced" world with magic replacing the technology. It gives the setting a very different feel which is a nice change from more typical D&D stuff. I've always thought that most of the five nations have an early C20 european feel to them, Karrnath as Germany, Breland as Britain, Aundair as france, Cyre and belgium, Zillargo as the Netherlands, Moror holds as Switzerland and so on, with Xen'dric being similar to a fantasy Africa. Of course exactly how they are protrayed with vary a lot from one game to another based on the ideas of the DM. No where in Eberron with an american feel to it jumps out, with the exception of the Lhazaar region which is kind of caribbean pirate themed. Although I may just be forgetting, as its a while since i've read the books.


You should read the breland chapter in five nations, that book makes breland look like a parlamentary USA.

TheStranger
2013-11-11, 05:41 PM
There's a guy over on the worldbuilding forum who's put a lot of work into something like this.

Crossroads: The New World (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=269334)

Jay R
2013-11-11, 09:28 PM
Its a real challenge to convert the current american cultures into a fantasy world, ...

It sure is. It took six years (1965-1971) for Disney to do it in central Florida.

banthesun
2013-11-12, 02:15 AM
I'm a bit confused at what you're asking for here. Are you trying to take technologically and socially advanced societies and regress them back to the middle ages? Create fantasy creatures based on modern myths? Take social issues and apply them to fantasy countries? I'm interested, but I don't really understand what the idea is here.

GungHo
2013-11-12, 10:28 AM
So we tried, as an exercise, to make a fantasy version of our country(Brazil), but in the end we were doing it for every new world country(the entire american continent and australia).

Now, our brainstorm was mostly fruitless, we were basicaly duplicating either the colonizer culture, or the colonized, being unable to translate a modern new world countrie into a fantasy counterpart.
Well, think of what makes Brazil Brazil.


You have a large number of pretty distinct biomes. Two versions of tropical forest in the Amazon and Maza Atlantica. The central savannas. The northeastern scrublands. The southern plains. The earth is red from clay, just like central Africa (go figure).
You have the most diverse flora and fauna of any country on the planet, even considering environmental challenges. Big snakes. Big spiders. Jaguars. Toucans. Macaws. Rheas. Maned Wolves. Monkeys. Offshore and in the rivers you have tons of diverse wildlife, as well.
You also have a very diverse, cosmopolitan population that, while economically stratisfied, is also quite mixed and mostly united by a language that isn't "native" to any of them (thinking not only of the indigenous population, but of the Italians, Germans, Japanese, etc). There are also still-undiscovered indigenous peoples, simply because it's easy to live off the land and because the terrain just simply keeps people from exploring everything.
The culture is strong... celebrations are bombastic and colorful. I'm not going to get deep into the politics because that's verboten here, but environmentalism and self-respect are large issues on the national and international stage.

So, if I were to create a fantasy Brazil without touching too much on the colonial aspects (though it's impossible to ignore completely):


Keep the biomes. Keep the wildlife.
Rather than just jaguars, I'd add in werejaguars who live in the jungle. Their tribes are mostly human, and werejaguars don't always breed true, but they are in the top echelons of each tribe. Instictive casters are prized in the tribes, whether divine or arcane, and if an individual is a werejaguar, their magic is somehow magnified, and they are fully capable of casting while in hybrid form. They all protect the jungle fiercely. The only way to remain in the jungle is to join one the tribes, and a symbolic gesture is not good enough. Each member is tattooed, but the tattoos mark not only the body, but the soul, and while the humans may be fooled by a fake, the werejaguars notice it immediately and the penalty is death.
The werejaguars are in a constant dispute with the aarakocra/kenku-like humanoids with macaw beaks and colorings who live in the savannas and highlands. The aarakocra have a strong alchemical tradition, but the best ingredients are in the jungle, and the werejaguars consider incursions to be a challenge of their honor, and they will emerge from the jungle to raid in punishment. The werejaguars are not able to completely overcome the aarakocra because the bird-men are able to use the third dimension to their advantage and because when a werejaguar leaves the jungle, their magic is diminished. They still have their physical power and they don't lose all magic, but it's simply not as overwhelming for some reason.
The rhea are large enough to use as mounts, and they're preferred over horses because they don't spook as easily when facing the giant snakes and spiders of the land, they breed more quickly, and they have a booming shout that can flatten a squad of men. They are difficult to train, but once they are broken, they are a force to be reckoned with.
The other forest, separated from the jungle by the savannas, are ruled by arboreal, sapient tribes of howler and capuchin monkeys. They stay to the trees, as the forest floor belongs to the formorians.
No sentient life currently lives in the rivers. Ruins have been found of a very large mer-society, but there are no mermen. The river dolphins will not discuss the matter, but it's very clear that the mermen left in a hurry... possibly instantaneously.
The southern plains and savannas are civilized and ruled by a very diverse group of humanoids. When the land was established, it was opened to all. Elves, dwarves, halflings, humans of all ethnicities, and even orcs were welcomed. Originally the mission was to tame the wild land and gain access to the riches of the jungle. While the aarakocra were happy to trade for their alchemical knowledge, and in fact some have moved south to join the new society, the tribes of werejaguars have been as fierce with the foreigners as they were with the aarakocra, and no matter how large the army, the werejaguars have rebuffed the invaders.
Over time the foreign power that sponsored the mission has become distracted with other matters. De facto independence has been established for roughly a generation. The various races have intermixed and half-elves and half-orcs are a common sight. The addition of the aarakocra's own culture has inspired a rennaisance in bardic culture, which has grown from being the profession of scoundrels to being one of the more noble professions in the land, with the most reknowned bards, colored vibrantly in the fashion of the feathers of the aarakocra, even returning to the home continent to amaze and delight.