Market price and Cost to Create list

[unseenmage]

What would the Market Price and Cost to Create be for each of the Animated Objects (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/animatedObject.htm) with Permanency (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/permanency.htm) applied?

I'm pretty sure the Colossal one is epic CL (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/animateObjects.htm) but is it epic price as well?

Edit: It's been pointed out that using the Goods and ervices listing for spellcasting is cheapest but then only the spellcaster can command the Construct. These would work only for the Cost to Create entry.

Prices for Scrolls could be more in line with the idea of a Market Price.

[Flickerdart]

Animate Objects is a 6th level spell, and must be cast by a CL14 caster for Permanency. Permanency itself is a 5th level spell that needs to be cast by the same caster. According to Goods and Services, that's 700gp+840gp. An additional cost of 15,000gp is levied because of the XP cost.

Thus, the minimum price of an animated object is 16,540gp. This covers anything up to Huge. For a CL32 casting, it would cost 18,520gp.

Note that only the animator can command an animated object, so buying one isn't terribly useful.

[unseenmage]

Animate Objects is a 6th level spell, and must be cast by a CL14 caster for Permanency. Permanency itself is a 5th level spell that needs to be cast by the same caster. According to Goods and Services, that's 700gp+840gp. An additional cost of 15,000gp is levied because of the XP cost.

Thus, the minimum price of an animated object is 16,540gp. This covers anything up to Huge. For a CL32 casting, it would cost 18,520gp.

Note that only the animator can command an animated object, so buying one isn't terribly useful.

In which case the prices you've provided cannot by definition be used as Market Prices and the associated Costs to Create.
Perhaps using the costs for Scrolls would be more appropriate to the task?

(Reread what I'd typed and I just want to say I'm not being ungrateful, my first thought was to use the Goods and Services info too until you broke it down for me. Thanks Flickerdart! :smallsmile:)

[Flickerdart]

Scroll costs would be meaningless for "cost to create" because not everybody has the same costs associated with scrolls. A cleric would have no problem using one, a rogue might need some UMD boosters to have a chance, and a fighter sits in a corner and cries.

Ultimately, the idea of pricing animated objects as magic items does not compute, because they aren't magic items. It would be like using the cost of a Greater Magic Weapon casting to calculate the price of a magic sword.

[unseenmage]

Scroll costs would be meaningless for "cost to create" because not everybody has the same costs associated with scrolls. A cleric would have no problem using one, a rogue might need some UMD boosters to have a chance, and a fighter sits in a corner and cries.

Ultimately, the idea of pricing animated objects as magic items does not compute, because they aren't magic items. It would be like using the cost of a Greater Magic Weapon casting to calculate the price of a magic sword.

But can't the same be said of any Construct only replacing "scroll" with "item creation feat" and "UMD" with ""a ridiculous number of craft skills"?

[Flickerdart]

But can't the same be said of any Construct only replacing "scroll" with "item creation feat" and "UMD" with ""a ridiculous number of craft skills"?
No, because they are actual full-fledged magic items that are made with the crafting system, have listed costs to create, can be bought and sold for a set price, and aren't brought low by an errant dispel. In addition, everything involved is a set cost - Craft Construct doesn't have a different cost to use depending on who's got the feat.

[unseenmage]

Craft Construct doesn't have a different cost to use depending on who's got the feat.

The Cost Reduction Handbook (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=1000.0) and Artificers especially would disagree.

Might I ask what your purpose is in arguing the premise of the thread?

[Flickerdart]

Might I ask what your purpose is in arguing the premise of the thread?
I already gave you an answer for how much it would cost to go and buy one at a store. Beyond that, the answer is "it depends" and after that there's not much else to talk about.

Artificer cost-reduction tricks are not relevant to the subject because they have no impact on the market price, whereas any cost cutting measures you can come up with when hiring guys to make you a permanent animated object pass the savings onto you.

[unseenmage]

I already gave you an answer for how much it would cost to go and buy one at a store. Beyond that, the answer is "it depends" and after that there's not much else to talk about.

No, you gave me the answer that supported your assertion that the idea does not work, by your own admission even.
And I asked your purpose because I am trying not to assume that you simply stopped by to deride my request.

You postulate that Animated Objects cannot have a simple Market Price and Cost to Create, I disagree.
They have costs that a given character could pay to acquire them. And they have a different cost if they're being created as opposed to purchased outright. Just like any Construct and just like any Magic Item.

I'm just uncertain what those costs are.
I'm sorry if my mild acalculia has offended you somehow or if you think this thread wasn't worth posting.

[Telonius]

I think there are two things being confused here - Animate Objects (the spell) and Animated Object (the creature). Objects that have been animated through the spell Animate Objects, even if they're made permanent through the Permanency spell, can be Dispelled. The duration of the spell is set to Permanent, not Instantaneous, meaning it's vulnerable.

A regular Construct (created with the Craft Construct feat) can't be rendered inanimate through Dispelling. Most Constructs have the creation price listed right there, but Animated Objects don't. So if you're looking to create one using Craft Construct, it's up to the DM's houserule.

If you're looking to price the creation using spells, I'd use the standard cost (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/goodsAndServices.htm#spellcastingAndServices) of spellcasting for a Permanency and an Animate Objects. Per the spell description, you'd need an effective caster level of 32 to animate a Colossal object, so bear that in mind.

[Flickerdart]

A regular Construct (created with the Craft Construct feat) can't be rendered inanimate through Dispelling.
The creature description of animated objects states unambiguously that "They owe their existence as creatures to spells such as animate objects or similar supernatural abilities." Craft Construct has nothing to do with them.

[Fax Celestis]

Note that only the animator can command an animated object, so buying one isn't terribly useful.

Couldn't you use a rod of construct control (A&EG, 68800 gp) to do so?

[Flickerdart]

Couldn't you use a rod of construct control (A&EG, 68800 gp) to do so?
You could indeed do such a thing, but the prohibitive cost (even the best animated object is CR10, while the rod is only purchasable at level 12 and only represents less than a third of your wealth at 15) means that by the time you can get it, the AOs are useless to you.