Is primitive caster abuse able?

[CyberThread]

are their many spells that can be abused by primitive caster? I know some spells that don't have things, or only one bit, add in a metamagic, and elimited a factor, and you can raise the DC by +3.

[Grod_The_Giant]

The only "abuse" I can think of is getting +2 CL for holy word and related spells.

[Chronos]

Where is this from?

[Karnith]

Where is this from?
Primitive Caster is a feat in Frostburn. It lets you add certain components (specifically verbal, somatic, or material components) to spells that don't already have them in order to increase your caster level.

[erikun]

Right off hand, I think that a lot of Bard spells tend lack components, and so can benefit from Primitive Caster. Also, foci are not material components, so spells with (F) or (DF) can add a material component for the +1 CL. It's very nice for divine casters, who almost always use a divine focus and only occasionally a material component.

[nedz]

So Holy Song, Dance and Symbol = Holy Word +2

[Flickerdart]

Right off hand, I think that a lot of Bard spells tend lack components, and so can benefit from Primitive Caster. Also, foci are not material components, so spells with (F) or (DF) can add a material component for the +1 CL. It's very nice for divine casters, who almost always use a divine focus and only occasionally a material component.
All Bard spells have Vocal components, so they can't benefit as much as characters who have access to non-Vocal spells they can enhance.

[Spuddles]

Could this and eschew material componennts be used togethe

[CyberThread]

Yes but you will need the rare plant still

[lunar2]

All Bard spells have Vocal components, so they can't benefit as much as characters who have access to non-Vocal spells they can enhance.

glibness is one of the few core spells without a verbal component. and many bard spells have only verbal components.

[Sith_Happens]

All Bard spells have Vocal components, so they can't benefit as much as characters who have access to non-Vocal spells they can enhance.

How many spells without verbal components are there really? I remember looking for them once and only finding a handful totally and maybe one or two that I'd ever actually want to cast. Mind you this was just on the arcane side, divine spells might be different.

[CyberThread]

According to a website I use 682 spells do not have a Verbal component

[Chronos]

Almost all spells, period, have verbal components. And by the time that you're stacking this with metamagic, you're basically increasing the spell slot to increase the CL. Isn't there already a metamagic feat that does that directly?

[nedz]

According to a website I use 682 spells do not have a Verbal component

I get 692 as an upper bound from what must be a different website :smallwink:

But that does include many duplicates and also things like IHS which it includes as spells for some reason.

Many of the swift spells have no components.

[Pathagaron]

How about a StP erudite?

[Piggy Knowles]

I've only ever used it on Blasphemy builds, such as Adishesha Deep-Diver (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=14561258&postcount=161), but it's quite handy there.

[Flickerdart]

How about a StP erudite?
They do not cast spells, and gain no benefit. Feats are not subject to Transparency.

[Pluto!]

I remember it coming up in one build to add material components to spells that lack them, but I can't for the life of me remember why that was desirable. :smallconfused:

[Rubik]

They do not cast spells, and gain no benefit. Feats are not subject to Transparency.See: Magic Mantle.

Also, binding a metamagic rod to your hands slot increases the CL of spells cast using that rod. A bound metamagic rod of Still Spell and Silent Spell, combined with Eschew Materials, means +6 CL if you use both feats on the metamagic rod along with Primitive Caster to give it V/S/M/F/DF.