[PF] Using multiple hand crossbows with QuickDraw

[jhardin87]

I've been playing a lot of assassins creed 4 lately and it's given me an interesting idea, could you make a character that uses multiple hand crossbows in the same way the pirates use their flintlock pistols in ac4. I was considering maybe a two weapon fighter that starts out by drawing a hand crossbow in each hand, fires, moves to the next set, and so on softening up his targets until he runs out of crossbows and then draws his weapons to finish off the rest. The only way I can see this viable is if he were using poisoned bolts, and yes I realize the wonderful coincidence of using assassin class features to mimic an assassin:smallamused:
My only concern is I can't find in the rules if you can use a single attack with two weapons to target two different enemies or not. I mean if you can't that's fine, I was just thinking of using a con damage poison on the main hand softening up their saves for a bigger poison on the offhand but it would be nice to be able to spread the love around. I know you could probably do this easier with the gunslinger but my DM doesn't allow that class. Is there a better way to do this that I'm not seeing?

[Spore]

A TWF fighter can spread his melee attacks onto two targets in his reach, why shouldn't a hand crossbow user target two targets?

Vivisectonist alchemist 6 gives you swift poisoning, use poison, the ability to create your own poisons, extracts for utility (e.g. True Strike extract to not miss that expensive poisoned dart), discoveries for concentrating poison to up the save DCs. Refluff your mutagen to a enhancing drug.

Enjoy an okayish spell list.

[Psyren]

To answer your question, you can target each attack in your full-attack routine at a different target - so TWFing hand crossbows or pistols or throwing knives or any other 1-hand ranged weapon can allow you to aim each attack at someone different.

The problem will come (with the former two) from reloading them for reuse - extra appendages like a Tiefling's tail or an Alchemist's tentacle will help with this. (Alchemist also has sneak attack, poison use, and the other advantages Spore mentioned.)

Your own idea seems to be keeping multiple loaded firearms or crossbows ready to draw. This is certainly doable at low levels but as you climb it will get very expensive unless you want to keep these weapons nonmagical and thus less useful.

[jhardin87]

As for the multiple targets idea I'm talking aiming your main hand attack at one target and your off hand attack at a completely different target, and yes I am talking about using multiple loaded weapons but I'm not wanting to build the entire class around this. This is more the opening gambit so to speak. Like a ninja unloading his opening sneak attacks, with poison, softening up his enemies before whipping out his melee weapons and going to town. Or even using this for a two weapon fighter or ranger with a dip in ninja for poison use.

[Ninjaxenomorph]

As of Ultimate Equipment, there is a repeating hand crossbow.

[jhardin87]

@ninjaxenmorph: yes but it still requires two hands to pull the reloading lever

[Psyren]

As for the multiple targets idea I'm talking aiming your main hand attack at one target and your off hand attack at a completely different target,

I know - as I said, that is indeed possible. Remember, you only get to attack with each of them when you full-attack anyway.


@ninjaxenmorph: yes but it still requires two hands to pull the reloading lever

Well, if you kill the enemy with your opening salvo you can reload at your leisure.

[Zubrowka74]

A TWF fighter can spread his melee attacks onto two targets in his reach, why shouldn't a hand crossbow user target two targets?

Vivisectonist alchemist 6 gives you swift poisoning, use poison, the ability to create your own poisons, extracts for utility (e.g. True Strike extract to not miss that expensive poisoned dart), discoveries for concentrating poison to up the save DCs. Refluff your mutagen to a enhancing drug.

Enjoy an okayish spell list.

Plus you get SA progression.

[Ninjaxenomorph]

Mutagen pretty much IS an enhancing drug.

[Spore]

Mutagen pretty much IS an enhancing drug.

Yeah, but you can bet your arse on to someone mentioning Hulk at the table when you describe how mutagens work.

[jhardin87]

@psyren: can you tell me where in the rules it says that? My DM is convinced that you are only able to split targets once you get multiple attacks. She's convinced that the main and off hand have to target the same enemy.

[Psyren]

@psyren: can you tell me where in the rules it says that? My DM is convinced that you are only able to split targets once you get multiple attacks. She's convinced that the main and off hand have to target the same enemy.

Two weapon fighting IS multiple attacks. I think your DM not knowing this is where some of your problems are coming from.

But okay, sure. CRB/PRD: (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html)


Full Attack

If you get more than one attack per round because your base attack bonus is high enough (see Base Attack Bonus in Classes), because you fight with two weapons or a double weapon, or for some special reason, you must use a full-round action to get your additional attacks. You do not need to specify the targets of your attacks ahead of time. You can see how the earlier attacks turn out before assigning the later ones.

As you can see from the quote above:
1) Extra attacks from two weapons are treated just like extra attacks from iteratives. In either case, you full attack to get them all.
2) You don't have to assign an attack - i.e. choose a target - until it is time for that particular attack in the sequence. So if you kill an enemy with your first crossbow shot, you can change the second one to be aimed at someone else.

If you want a page reference, this line is on CRB 187.