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bryn0528
2013-11-14, 07:01 PM
Hero

Adventures: Heroes are those that arise to action when their need is called upon. A Hero may be reluctant at first, but to vanquish the forces of evil is his destiny. Sometimes Heroes adventure to gain fame and fortune.

Characteristics: Heroes are champions of powerful sword techniques that they use to accomplish acts of legend. Heroes find themselves at home in melee combat, especially against monsters that are much larger than they are.

Alignment: A Hero is always just and true. Sometimes a Hero may be naive, but he seeks to bring peace and good to the world. A Hero is too concerned with the well-being of all to be evil. Heroes vary on the scale of law and chaos, soom choosing an arms of chivalry while others are more free-spirited.

Religion: Most Heroes are fairly typical in their race's deities, if those deities are good or unaligned. Otherwise, a Hero can vary wildly in his worship. Some Heroes do not worship any god, and some choose to venerate their patron gods or edified ideals. Heroes never choose to worship evil deities, as those gods directly violate a Hero's will for goodness in the world.

Background: A Hero is typically chosen by destiny and circumstance. He is full of innate talent which awakens within him as he trains and defeats more powerful monsters. The source of this power varies; sometimes it is a gift from the smiling gods and other times it is a latent bloodline trait. Most Heroes do not even know of their power until the need is called upon, at which he arises to meet his fate and is rewarded with strength.

Races: The Hero is a mythic figure ubiquitous in nearly every culture. As such, most good races are capable of producing a Hero in times of need. Heroes are most common among Humans, and perhaps least among Elves, in terms of the common races.

Other Classes: Heroes typically get along with most other classes, but can also tend to be solo-adventurers. A Hero who tries to make a name for himself finds great use in the Bard, or similar roles. Other melee fighters, like the Barbarian and Paladin, find a mutual appreciation with a Hero. Clerics and Rangers admire the cause a Hero undertakes, and suffer good relations as such. A Hero is typically less fond of Rogues, Monks, and Druids, because of their philosophies, but usually remain on good terms with these groups.

GAME RULE INFORMATION
Abilities: A Hero relies a great deal upon his weapon and his Strength to take out enemies. A high Dexterity is good for Heroes as most do not wear armor. A Hero makes many use of his Class Skills, and thus a high Intelligence may also be useful.
Alignment: Any good.
Hit Die: d12.
Starting Age: As barbarian.
Starting Gold: As barbarian.

Level | BAB | Fort | Ref | Will | Special
1st | +1 | +2 | +2 | +0 | Skill Style, Flourish +1d6, Stale Moves
2nd | +2 | +3 | +3 | +0 | Turn the Tide (Medium)
3rd | +3 | +3 | +3 | +1 | Flourish +2d6
4th | +4 | +4 | +4 | +1 | Skill Style
5th | +5 | +4 | +4 | +1 | Flourish +3d6
6th | +6/+1 | +5 | +5 | +2 | Turn the Tide (Large)
7th | +7/+2 | +5 | +5 | +2 | Flourish +4d6
8th | +8/+3 | +6 | +6 | +2 | Skill Style
9th | +9/+4 | +6 | +6 | +3 | Flourish +5d6
10th | +10/+5 | +7 | +7 | +3 | Turn the Tide (Huge)
11th | +11/+6/+1 | +7 | +7 | +3 | Flourish +6d6
12th | +12/+7/+2 | +8 | +8 | +4 | Skill Style
13th | +13/+8/+3 | +8 | +8 | +4 | Flourish +7d6
14th | +14/+9/+4 | +9 | +9 | +4 | Turn the Tide (Gargantuan)
15th | +15/+10/+5 | +9 | +9 | +5 | Flourish +8d6
16th | +16/+11/+6/+1 | +10 | +10 | +5 | Skill Style
17th | +17/+12/+7/+2 | +10 | +10 | +5 | Flourish +9d6
18th | +18/+13/+8/+3 | +11 | +11 | +6 | Turn the Tide (Colossal)
19th | +19/+14/+9/+4 | +11 | +11 | +6 | Flourish +10d6
20th | +20/+15/+10/+5 | +12 | +12 | +6 | Skill Style

Class Skills: Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Gather Information (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (Dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (Geography (Int)), Knowledge (History) (Int), Knowledge (Local) (Int), Knowledge (Nature) (Int), Listen (Wis), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Swim (Str), Tumble (Dex), Use Rope (Dex).
Skill Points at 1st Level: (6 + Int modifier) x 4.
Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 6 + Int modifier.

Weapons and Armor Proficiencies: A Hero is proficient with all simple and martial weapons and light armor but not with any shields (including tower shields).

Skill Style (Ex): A Hero may call upon his own inner strength in order to perform legendary acts. At first level, the Hero selects one Skill Style. He may use, at will, any Technique he qualifies for and can currently perform. A Hero selects an additional Skill Style at fourth level and then every four levels afterward.

Ankleslicer
Key Skill: Balance
"Even the greatest hero, a godling among man, had a terrible weakness, and for it he fell like a god from the mountains." --Saga of Heroes

Achilles Strike, (Standard Action)
Your weapon finds leverage in the weak joints of your enemies, causing them great pain and knocking them down.
Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus against a target in range. If successful, deal Flourish damage and make a Balance check. The target must make a Fortitude check (DC equal to your check result minus 10) or it falls prone and takes falling damage equal to its height... (Look up average height for size categories).

Caltrop Spike, (Standard Action)
Sink your weapon into the toes of your enemies, hindering their ability to move effeciently.
Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus against a target in range. If successful, deal Flourish damage and make a Balance check. The target must make a Fortitude check (DC equal to your check result minus 10) or it may only move at half speed and may not take the Run action. This effect lasts for 24 hours, until the damage is healed, or until it is treated with a Heal check (DC 15 + Hero Level).

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Anklebite, (Swift Action)
Send your weapon into a fleeing foe to stop them dead in their tracks.
Whenever a creature moves into or out of your threatened range with a melee weapon, you may activate this Technique as your attack of opportunity. If its movement would not normally allow this, you may make a Balance check against its Tumble check, or against a DC equal to (10 + its HD) if it is not using the Tumble skill to avoid attacks of opportunity. Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus. The target is considered flat-footed against this attack. If successful, it must end all movement for the round immediately.

Backbiter
Key Skill: Climb
"?" --Saga of Heroes

Waylay, (Standard Action)
You find purchase onto your enemy.
Make a Climb check against a target that is at least two size categories larger than you (based on your actual size and not your adjusted size though the Turn the Tide class ability) and is within melee range (DC equal to target touch AC). If successful, you climb onto the target. As long as your remain on the target, you occupy one of its squares (your choice), and the target is considered flat-footed against your attacks. Each round the creature may attempt to shake you off by making a Strength check contested against your Climb check. While on a target you are considered flat-footed against any attacks that may reach you. If you take damage from an attack, you must make a Climb check (DC 10 + damage taken) or fall off the target. If you fall from the target, you take falling damage based on its height.... look up size category's average heights.

Sink the Mark, (Standard Action)
You plunge your weapon into a beast's exposed weak spots.
You may activate this Technique only while successfully on a target via Waylay. Make a Climb check (DC 10 + target HD) to move into place. If successful, make a single melee attack at your highest bonus, against the target's Touch AC. A hit ignores any DR the target has and deals Flourish damage. In addition, the regular damage of the attack is treated as having scored a critical. If you score an actual critical during the attack, multiply the regular damage twice.

Climbing Expertise, (Standard Action)
You use your climbing skills in order to stay alert and nimble.
You may activate this Technique only while successfully on a target via Waylay. Make a Climb check and use the result as your AC for the remainder of the round. If any attack aimed at you fails this AC, but still meets the AC of the target you are on, the attack is automatically redirected to that target.

Reactive Grasp, (Swift Action)
You reflexively grab a hold of your enemy when you begin falling.
You may activate this Technique after being knocked off from a target you were successfully on via Waylay. Make a Climb check (DC 10 + target touch AC). If successful, you avoid taking falling damage, although you are no longer considered on the target and must use your Waylay technique again. If you scored a natural 20 on your Climb check, you get an immediate free action in order to activate your Waylay technique again as normal.

Stormscreamer
Key Skill: Intimidate
"Unleash your fury through the power of your voice." --Saga of Heroes

Thunderous Shout, (Standard Action)
[I]Your voice crackles like the storm and destroys your enemies.
Make an Intimidate check. All targets in a 30ft. burst/cone must make a Fortitude save (DC equal to your check result minus 10), or be dazed for one round. If a target fails this save by more than 5, it is ??? for one round, then dazed. If a target fails this save by more than 10, it is Panicked for one round, then dazed for an additional round. If a target fails this save by more than 20, it is Stunned for one round, then Panicked for an additional round, and then dazed for one more round. If a target fails this save by more than 40, it is instantly slain. This is a sonic effect.

Howling Voice
Your shout blows like the winds of a powerful hurricane.
Make an Intimidate check. Targets directly in front of you must make a Fortitude check (DC equal to your check result minus 10) or be blown back a number of feet equal to your Intimidate check. Targets take ?? bludgeoning damage for every ?? feet they travel in this manner.

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Iron Scream, (Swift Action)
Your furious shout stops enemies in their tracks.
You may activate this Technique anytime during your movement when an enemy makes an attack of opportunity against you. Make an Intimidate check and use the result as your AC against the target.

Skybringer
Key Skill: Jump
"Reach toward the heavens and cleave those before you. There is not safety in the sky." --Saga of Heroes

Aerial Ace, (Standard Action)
You jump into the air to strike at a flying foe.
Make a Jump check against a single target that is above you, but out of melee range (DC equal to 1 per foot away the target is). If successful, make a single melee attack at your highest bonus. On a hit, deal Flourish damage. You move to strike the target, and fall back safely to the ground afterward.

Skyward Swing, (Standard Action)
You launch your enemy high into the air with a powerful swing.
Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus against a target in range. If successful, deal Flourish damage and make a Jump check. The target must make a Reflex save (DC equal to your check result minus 10) or be launched a number of feet into the air equal to your Jump check. If it cannot remain airborne, then it begins to fall. You may either choose to stay on the ground or follow the target into the air. If you choose to move, then you fall back safely to the ground afterward.

Heavy Blow, (Standard Action)
You swing down with immense strength, knocking foes to the ground.
Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus against a target in range. if successful, deal Flourish damage and make a Jump check. The target must make a Reflex save (DC equal to your check result minus 10) or be knocked down a number of feet equal to your Jump check. If at any time this would cause the target to hit the ground, it takes falling damage equal to the distance it has fallen or would have fallen, whichever is greater. You may use this Technique against targets that are already on the ground, though they only take half of this falling damage.

Clipping, (Swift Action)
You strike out against an enemy about to fly, stopping them in their tracks.
Wehenever a target in your threatened range with a melee weapon attempts to fly or otherwise move upwards, you may activate this Technique as your attack of opportunity. If its movement would not normally allow this, you may make a Jump check against its Tumble check, or against a DC equal to (10 + its HD) if it is not using the Tumble skill to avoid attacks of opportunity. Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus. The target is considered flat-footed against this attack. If successful, it may not begin its flight this round.

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Key Skill: Ride
"?" --Saga of Heroes

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Pinpricker
Key Skill: Spot
"Though the blade may be considered the staple weapon of any Hero, he should also consider training with the bow to supplement his abilities." --Saga of Heroes

Pierce the Hide, (Standard Action)
You attack between the plates of armor or scales of your enemies.
Make a Spot check against a single target within range (DC equal to AC). If successful, you may make a single attack at your highest bonus, ignoring any Natural Armor bonus to AC the target may have. On a hit, deal Flourish damage and ignore any DR the target has.

Concussive Shot, (Standard Action)
You launch a well placed arrow to stun your enemy.
Make a ranged attack at your highest bonus to a target within range. If successful, deal Flourish damage and make a Spot check. The target must make a Reflex save (DC equal to your check result minus 10) or be stunned for one round and dazed for 1d4 additional rounds.

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Waverider
Key Skill: Swim
"Great beasts lurk within the depths. Do not allow them power over you." --Saga of Heroes

Deadly Current, (Standard Action)
You rush past in the water, leaving those in your wake swept away to the water's mercy.
You may only activate this Technique while swimming. You may move forward in a straight line up to your base land speed (or, if you have a swim speed, four times that). You may pass through occupied squares during this movement, but doing so counts as moving two squares instead of just one. You overrun any targets you pass in this manner and make an opposed Swim check. If successful, the target begins to drown if it is able to. If not, the target is instead dazed for one round. If you fail the Swim check, you do not pass their occupied square and this Technique ends.

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Trickcrafter
Key Skill: Tumble
"" --Saga of Heroes

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ADVANCED SKILL SCHOOLS? available starting lvl 12.
When you take an advanced skill school, add its Key Skill to your list of Class Skills.

Gearbreaker
Key Skill: Disable Device
"Even machines have their weaknesses. Instead of joints, they have cogs and gears. Instead of muscles, they have pistons and springs." --Manual of the Automaton

Wrench in the Works, (Standard Action)
Your attack causes great distress to the inner workings of constructed beings.
Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus against a target in range with the Construct subtype. If successful, deal Flourish damage and make a Disable Device check. The target must make a Fortitude? save (DC equal to your check result minus 10) or be stunned for one round.

Between the Iron, (Standard Action)
You strike a construct in its vulernable areas, dealing massive damage.
Make a Disable Device check against at single target in melee range that has the Construct subtype (DC equal to its AC). If successful, make a single melee attack at your highest bonus. On a hit, deal Flourish damage and bypass any DR that the target has.

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Mageslayer
Key Skill: Spellcraft
"Among the deadliest enemies in the world are those that practice magical talents. If you learn their art, then you may learn to defeat them with ease and grace." --Codex of the Asp Clan

Ague, (Standard Action)
You attack at your enemy's very soul, fracturing its ability for magic.
Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus to a target within range. On a hit, deal Flourish damage and make a contested Spellcraft check. If successful, lower the target's Caster Level by 1 for every 4 you rolled higher on your Spellcraft check. This effect lasts until the end of the encounter. Multiple uses of this Technique do not stack, though the highest roll will take effect over a lower one. If the target succeeds on the check, then it is immune to this Technique for 24 hours.

Moon Cleave, (Standard Action)
You attack at the threads which bind a spell, severing its connection with our world.
Make a single melee attack at your highest bonus against a target currently under the effects of an enchantment. On a hit, deal Flourish damage and select one enchantment the target has. Make a Spellcraft check (DC equal to caster level of targeted enchantment). If successful, end that enchantment.

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Spellstitch, (Swift Action)
You rework the fabric of a spell, redirecting its course.
You may activate this Technique anytime you are the target of a spell or spell-like ability. Make an opposed Spellcraft check against the caster. If successful, you may select a new target for the spell that is in within range of the original spell. You may also not choose another target in which case the spell is diffused harmlessly.


Flourish: A Hero receives a number of Flourish Dice used to power his Techniques. As he increases in levels, he gains more Flourish Dice to use. At first level a Hero receives one Flourish die. He receives an additional die every other level afterward (on every odd level).

Whenever a Hero uses a Technique against a creature in a larger size category than he is, he must sacrifice two Flourish dice per size category the target is larger than he. If he cannot make the cost, then he cannot use the Technique against that enemy.

When a Technique says it deals Flourish damage, this is in addition to the weapon's full base damage and any remaining Flourish dice left to roll. Creatures that are immune to Sneak Attacks, critical hits, or other precision based damage are likewise immune to Flourish damage, but not immune to Techniques.

Stale Moves: A Hero must not rely on using the same Technique repeatedly. After a Hero uses a Technique, he may not use that Technique again for another 1d4 rounds. If he does, he is fatigued for the remainder of the recharge. If he attempts to use it again or if he was already fatigued, he becomes exhausted until the end of combat, at which point he is then fatigued as normal.

A Hero may only use his Techniques a number of times equal to his level plus his Wisdom modifier per encounter. If he uses his Techniques any more than this, he becomes exhausted until the end of combat, at which point he is only fatigued.

Turn the Tide (Ex): The specialized training of a Hero lets him function in many ways as if he were larger than he actually is. Whenever a Hero is subject to a size modifier for an opposed check (such as during grapple checks, bull rush attempts, and trip attempts) or the use of one of his Techniques, the Hero is treated as a size larger if doing so is advantageous to him. A Hero is also considered to be a size larger when determining whether a creature's special attacks based on size (such as improved grab or swallow whole) can affect him.

At 2nd level, the Hero is considered to be Medium sized if he is not so already. At 6th level, the Hero is considered to be Large sized. Every four levels after (10th, 14th, and 18th) his size category is considered to be an additional size larger, up to the charts listed size. However, the Hero's actual physical shape and size never change, and he never receives the benefits having natural reach or being able to wield weapons larger than he would normally be allowed. The benefits of this ability stack with the effects of powers, abilities, and spells that change the Hero's size.

************************
So, this is my first real homebrew attempt (at least for 3.5). My main inspiration for this includes Shadow of the Colossus and Legend of Zelda. The end product is, hopefully, a warrior who will go toe to toe with the largest of enemies.

I'm basing the class abilities off of varying Homebrew martial disciplines I found, and will work under a similar mechanic. Although, I'm not too fond with how martial disciplines work, so the varying bits that I like are being recombined into something that's hopefully fresh and fun to play.

Dracomortis
2013-11-14, 10:29 PM
Turn the Tide has no description; what does it do?
What are Techniques? Which Techniques can a hero learn?
What does Flourish actually do? Aside from adding some sort of numerical bonus to a Technique we have no idea how it works.

AuraTwilight
2013-11-14, 10:41 PM
Dracomortis, it's a WIP. He's working on it.

Dracomortis
2013-11-14, 10:49 PM
Dracomortis, it's a WIP. He's working on it.

I'm just pointing out the stuff that needs to be filled out before we can really judge or critique the class in any capacity.

bryn0528
2013-11-14, 11:06 PM
Yes, unfortunately I'm not that proficient with 3.5 and there are a lot of nuances that I'm not exactly well versed. So this is a slow process for me. Honestly, this probably won't even be presentable for another few days, I just needed a nice spot to lay it out so that I could work on it.

Dracomortis
2013-11-14, 11:12 PM
Yes, unfortunately I'm not that proficient with 3.5 and there are a lot of nuances that I'm not exactly well versed. So this is a slow process for me. Honestly, this probably won't even be presentable for another few days, I just needed a nice spot to lay it out so that I could work on it.

For what it's worth, even with the limited crunch I was excited about this class the moment I read "Shadow of the Colossus and Legend of Zelda". I'll definitely be keeping an eye on this.

bryn0528
2013-11-14, 11:26 PM
For what it's worth, even with the limited crunch I was excited about this class the moment I read "Shadow of the Colossus and Legend of Zelda". I'll definitely be keeping an eye on this.

MAN, THAT SOUNDTRACK IS STILL GOOD. AND I'VE ALWAYS WANTED TO PLAY A PROPER HERO THAT CLAMBERS OVER GIANT MONSTERS.

I've added Turn the Tides description, but I can't help but think I've worded it poorly. I don't want to have to spell out each step and its effects, but I might have to for clarity purposes.

Also, I got excited about this when I found the Martial Discipline Compendium (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=255468) and saw that a school was about climbing all over monsters! I just... didn't like how it turned out, and I'm not the biggest fan of how maneuvers and what not actually function. I like the idea of being skill based, so I'm essentially going to make little "disciplines" based around key class skills (probably Balance, Climb, Intimidate, Jump, Ride, Spot, Swim, and Tumble). I have a lot of the ideas, it's just a matter of how to get them to function in the way that I want and with the overall system. We shall see.

Grod_The_Giant
2013-11-14, 11:40 PM
The wording is a little ambiguous, aye. Try something like the following (taken from my own fighter fix):

The Bigger They Are... (Ex): Bigger isn't always better. Beginning at 5th level, when attempting a combat maneuver against a larger foe, a fighter gains a +4 bonus to opposed Strength checks, grapple checks, and the like, effectively cancelling out one size category's worth of difference.

At 8th level, this bonus improves to +8 against foes who are two size categories or more larger than him, effectively cancelling out two size categories worth of difference. Against foes one size larger than the fighter, this bonus is still only +4. For example, a medium sized fighter would have a +4 bonus to grapple checks against and ogre (large size), but a +8 bonus against a cloud giant (huge size).

EnemyTroper
2013-11-15, 02:40 AM
So for the Turn the Tides ability couldn't you just say that you count as one level higher than you are, and you get the bonuses appropriate vs all other enemy sizes?

So if there was a Tiny "The Hero" they would end up being treated as Gargantuan vs a Colossal creature and the Colossal would only get a +4 bonus to those specific actions. Is that accurate?

The Bigger they Are feature Grod mentioned seems to be specific training that simply counters the bonuses that size categories give.

-----
I like the fact that someone is having making a Hero class. I'm making somewhat of a villain class(though it is mostly alignment open). You have just helped me create some more schemes to defeat your lovely hero.

I will change my mooks and minions to small or smaller sizes and increase their number and have them swarm you. I'll also have to come up with a 'training" scheme that allows feats for specific sized members for my legion.

bryn0528
2013-11-15, 02:53 AM
It says just that, actually? I'm a little confused as to what you're saying and/or trying to ask.


***

Turn the Tide is supposed to work like this:

At second level, a medium sized Hero attempts to grapple a medium sized creature. The Hero for this purpose counts as Large and gets a +4 bonus to his grapple check. If he tried to grapple a large creature, he would not receive any bonus. If he tried to grapple a small creature, he would be treated as Large and would get a +4 bonus to the check (while the Small creature still counts as small and receives a -4 penalty).

At sixth level, a medium sized Hero would get the following bonuses; +8 vs. Small (who still gets a -4), +8 vs. Medium (with not adjustment), and +4 vs. Large (who also gets a +4). If he attempted to grapple a Huge creature, he would receive no bonus.

At tenth level, bonuses are; +12 vs. Small, +12 vs. Medium, +8 vs. Large, and +4 vs. Huge (who gets +8).

So on and so forth.

Dracomortis
2013-11-15, 06:05 AM
Turn the Tide seems overly complicated for what you're trying to accomplish. I don't think it's necessary to restrict the use of this ability based on the opponent's size; just give the Hero the benefits all the time. I would also specify in exactly what ways the Hero gets to act like the next larger size; as currently worded, some pretty silly situations can pop up. For example, if I'm a human hero and I'm fighting an elf, a strict RAW interpretation of Turn the Tide means I can suddenly use Large weapons without penalty (since I'm considered Large if it's beneficial to me, and using Large weapons is mostly definitely beneficial), but then suddenly I lose that ability if a troll shows up or the elf dies.

I would suggest just copying most of the wording from the Powerful Build racial trait (sans the ability to use larger weapons), as follows:


Turn the Tide (Ex): The specialized training of a Hero lets him function in many ways as if he were one size category larger. Whenever a Hero is subject to a size modifier for an opposed check (such as during grapple checks, bull rush attempts, and trip attempts), the Hero is treated as one size larger if doing so is advantageous to him. A Hero is also considered to be one size larger when determining whether a creature's special attacks based on size (such as improved grab or swallow whole) can affect him. However, his space and reach remain those of his actual size. The benefits of this ability stack with the effects of powers, abilities, and spells that change the Hero's size.

You can then have the Hero treated as being even larger at later levels if desired. For example, maybe at level 10 he is treated as two size categories larger instead of one.

bryn0528
2013-11-15, 06:23 AM
Hm, yes.

I knew there were other benefits to being a larger size category that I just seemed to not be able to remember. And yes, I think my method is being too complicated. Thank you!

I've copied what you've mostly presented, with a few changes.

BlackestOfMages
2013-11-16, 11:17 PM
looks interesting so far. keeping my eye on this :smallsmile:

bryn0528
2013-11-17, 07:29 PM
Yikes! :smalleek:

You guys sure are putting a lot of pressure on a noob like me.


In other news, I have started adding in some of the Skill Styles and Techniques, which in all consideration are really going to be the heart of this class. For other class abilities, I'm thinking about adding in ways to combo multiple Techniques that you wouldn't be able to normally do in a round, and that also circumvent the Stale Moves to a degree and lessen Technique usage during an encounter.

BlackestOfMages
2013-11-17, 10:27 PM
Yikes! :smalleek:

You guys sure are putting a lot of pressure on a noob like me.

it takes pressure to turn carbon into a diamond :smallamused:

Achilles slice: hmmmm, Keying it of flat height might be a bit awkward, because most creatures are simply given a size category and a rough size estimate. in addition, well, do you mean damage in height by inches/feet/millimetres? because right now it dosen't state

I'd advise switching this to being damage keyed off their size category, rather than height.

I like caltrop strike, though I'm not sure of the use of it,

and anklebite is good :smallsmile:

Sink the Mark is intresting, but due to full BaB I fear it might end up being useless compared to a simple full attack. maybe make it a full attack, with the first hit benefiting from the crit-effect?

Waylay looks good, but a few questions: can the latched on monster still attack you, and can damage cause you to fall? furthermore, it might be a bit impossible to shake the player off, ever, as even in best circumstances climb increases at twice the rate of reflex.

climbing expertise is hilarious

Aerial Ace - define what you mean by level? I'd recommend just switching to a distance in feet to make things simpler. also, due to momentum, maybe make this count as a charge? furthermore, does the character move when using this?

skyward sword and clipping looks good, but again for skyward I'd recomend using feet in place of levels :smallsmile:

pierce the hide is a bit crap for a full attack action. since this seems to be based on finding weaknesses, maybe make it a flat touch attack or something like ignore DR?

Grod_The_Giant
2013-11-17, 10:40 PM
Just stacking size boosts like that maybe isn't the best idea. You need something if you want combat maneuvers to be viable against late-game melee brutes, but it makes you almost impossible to defend against if you're not fighting giants.

bryn0528
2013-11-17, 11:32 PM
it takes pressure to turn carbon into a diamond :smallamused:

Point taken. Let's see if I can shine~


Achilles slice: hmmmm, Keying it of flat height might be a bit awkward, because most creatures are simply given a size category and a rough size estimate. in addition, well, do you mean damage in height by inches/feet/millimetres? because right now it dosen't state

I'd advise switching this to being damage keyed off their size category, rather than height.

I meant it to mean as in the creature having fallen from a distance equal to its own height, but I guess I never really considered that height isn't a stat. Hrm.


I like caltrop strike, though I'm not sure of the use of it,

and anklebite is good :smallsmile:

It is a very specific use, but so is using regular caltrops (which I really like). Good that one at least one of these so far is good!


Sink the Mark is intresting, but due to full BaB I fear it might end up being useless compared to a simple full attack. maybe make it a full attack, with the first hit benefiting from the crit-effect?

Okay, I was really unsure about the power balance of this. I was afraid that it would be too powerful, actually! Keeping in mind, of course, that the target would be flat-footed and you're getting your bonus Flourish damage. The way I have it is just for each Technique to only be a single hit... so what if Flourish damage is also multiplied by the crit effect?


Waylay looks good, but a few questions: can the latched on monster still attack you, and can damage cause you to fall? furthermore, it might be a bit impossible to shake the player off, ever, as even in best circumstances climb increases at twice the rate of reflex.

Yes. And it should.

What might you recommend instead? I want the Hero to be able to make a Climb check, to make sure the skill comes into play, but against... what?


climbing expertise is hilarious

Perfect.


Aerial Ace - define what you mean by level? I'd recommend just switching to a distance in feet to make things simpler. also, due to momentum, maybe make this count as a charge? furthermore, does the character move when using this?

skyward sword and clipping looks good, but again for skyward I'd recomend using feet in place of levels :smallsmile:

Okay, at the time when I wrote this, I was offline and unable to look up falling rules. I wasn't sure what would be a good measure of distance, so I defaulted to my Seventh Sea roots. A level should roughly be one die of damage. Or... something similar, I'm not too sure about balance issues.

Also, for Aerial Ace, the Hero should move, but falls back down safely.


pierce the hide is a bit crap for a full attack action. since this seems to be based on finding weaknesses, maybe make it a flat touch attack or something like ignore DR?

Okay, good to know. I... wanted it to be like a touch attack, but I was a little unsure of the wording.


Just stacking size boosts like that maybe isn't the best idea. You need something if you want combat maneuvers to be viable against late-game melee brutes, but it makes you almost impossible to defend against if you're not fighting giants.

But... that's almost the point. Why should I be crappier at fighting, say, a human, when I can wrestle just fine with a red dragon?

BlackestOfMages
2013-11-18, 12:00 AM
Point taken. Let's see if I can shine~



[QUOTE]I meant it to mean as in the creature having fallen from a distance equal to its own height, but I guess I never really considered that height isn't a stat. Hrm.


Okay, I was really unsure about the power balance of this. I was afraid that it would be too powerful, actually! Keeping in mind, of course, that the target would be flat-footed and you're getting your bonus Flourish damage. The way I have it is just for each Technique to only be a single hit... so what if Flourish damage is also multiplied by the crit effect?


yet a rogue/ninja can make several attacks dealing the same amount of additional damage as flourish, which puts them ahead, and theres the fact being flat footed doesn't actually mean that much, especially for most large monsters.


Yes. And it should.

What might you recommend instead? I want the Hero to be able to make a Climb check, to make sure the skill comes into play, but against... what?

hmmmmm, maybe an opposed check - the monsters strength strength modifier? might be a bit closer, and due to not being static gives a fairer chance


Okay, at the time when I wrote this, I was offline and unable to look up falling rules. I wasn't sure what would be a good measure of distance, so I defaulted to my Seventh Sea roots. A level should roughly be one die of damage. Or... something similar, I'm not too sure about balance issues.

Also, for Aerial Ace, the Hero should move, but falls back down safely.


hmmmm, well a basic jump check gives 1ft per 4 on the test result, and average flight speed is about 30ft per round. since this is a special jump, maybe twice the jump result - it lets the character get crazy heights without going to far

also, maybe give any hero that chooses this skill style slow fall all the time, to represent them being good at landing?

bryn0528
2013-11-19, 11:06 PM
Alright, well, I've done a lot of reworking on the Techniques.

I've cut all Full Round actions and bumped them down to Standard actions (much more like Martial Discipline strikes). Also gave all previous Standard actions Flourish damage. Changed the set up of having Full/Standard/Swift actions to having three Standard actions and one Swift action.

There's still a bit of information I have to look up and double check to make sure it's fair and what not... but that's not my top concern right now.