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Ragnorrok
2013-11-18, 12:42 AM
One of my players is a Tiefling. He is hoping that later he can use a wish to gain the half-fiend template and get all of it's benefits while staying Chaotic Good. We look it up and it says under the template Always Evil(any) and he gets upset and reads into the little detailing paragraph that tells a little story about the template and how it exists in the Monster Manual. In the last sentence at the bottom left of the page it says "some half-fiends look past their evil heritage" saying that completely allowed him to be Chaotic Good. We debated and he thinks that even though the half-fiend templates says Always Evil(any) that the small descriptive text over-writes that. I understand that as DM I can just say yes or no but I've already changed a lot of things and as I see the templates is that they were made for a particular thing in mind, and that changing that defeats the point of the template. Do you guys think that I should allow this or should the half-fiend stay evil?

Flickerdart
2013-11-18, 12:45 AM
If you read what Always X actually means, you'll see that it's poorly named. In actuality, only the vast majority of Always X creatures are X, and there can be exceptions. D&D canon already includes things like Lawful Good Succubus Paladins, so he's not exactly out of his mind here.

aeauseth
2013-11-18, 03:22 PM
One of my players is a Tiefling. He is hoping that later he can use a wish to gain the half-fiend template and get all of it's benefits while staying Chaotic Good.

The Half-Fiend (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfFiend.htm) template clearly states the base creature must be of nongood alignment. Your player is good.

The Always Evil (any) would require an alignment change to Evil after the template is applied.

As a DM you are free to make selective exceptions to the rules. Although, I just can't see him remaining Good, just doesn't fit the template at all.

Role playing wise, a leveled NPC's with Knowledge (planes) would identify your player as a Half-Fiend, and likely assume he was evil.

Red Fel
2013-11-18, 03:55 PM
The Half-Fiend (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfFiend.htm) template clearly states the base creature must be of nongood alignment. Your player is good.

The Always Evil (any) would require an alignment change to Evil after the template is applied.

To be fair, most templates that have prerequisites do not require you to maintain those prerequisites after acquiring the template. That is to say, a template that requires a particular alignment to acquire the template does not require that you maintain that alignment. (Dragonborn being a notable and explicit exception.)

Half-Fiend, as an inherited template, may only be taken (1) at character creation (2) by a non-Good character. This is admittedly a special case, as the template will be taken via Wish. In theory, the Wish would allow the DM to waive the alignment requirement. Even assuming you could not, however, and even assuming that the character had to be non-Good before taking the template, nothing stops the character from becoming Good afterwards. (Except all of the back-and-forth alignment whiplash.)

Of course, a Good half-fiend can expect to come under fire from both good (for being an evil outsider) and evil (for being a Good-aligned evil outsider). But that's a different headache altogether.

Zanfire
2013-11-18, 04:28 PM
I think you're referencing the SS rituals, if so, isn't there also one for changing your alignment as well? (seeing that written out, looks really silly, so I'm prolly mis-remembering something)

Anyway, as you said, its your call in the end, if you're looking for a way to justify it, you could have the ritual forcibly alter his alignment to Evil, and then require him to role play the change back.

ie. He's good at heart, but misguided, and while attempting to acquire the power he needs to do some worth wile good deed he falls down the wrong path and is partially corrupted by a fiend, once he realizes his mistake he must atone to redeem himself

Studoku
2013-11-18, 04:47 PM
On a somewhat related note, if he's a spellcaster has he considered the Fiend-Blooded class from Heroes of Horror?

Karnith
2013-11-18, 04:49 PM
I think you're referencing the SS rituals, if so, isn't there also one for changing your alignment as well?
It actually gives you a particular alignment subtype (or changes it if you already have one), in addition to changing your alignment. Also it can kill you if the subtype and your initial alignment don't match up.

Benthesquid
2013-11-18, 04:53 PM
Well, if it's an inherited template, then that suggests that it's 'taken' at birth (or at conception, or sometime in between, depending on the nature of the inheritance. Within a fantasy setting, not well known for conforming to RL biology, I could go for any of these).

So what was the character's alignment at the time of birth? Probably neutral. So you could have a Good aligned half-fiend humanoid or native outsider, no problem. Just probably not a Half-Fiend Celestial.

Kuulvheysoon
2013-11-18, 04:58 PM
You know, there is a half-fiend progression class (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20031010a) that lacks the Evil requirement, you know.

ShurikVch
2013-11-18, 05:44 PM
From the Savage Species:

Alignment Change
If a character transforms to a kind of monster that always has a particular alignment, and the character did not originally have that alignment, the transforming character makes a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 the goal monster’s Hit Dice + the goal monster’s Wis modifier) to avoid an involuntary alignment change.