OOTS #399 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

[Behold_the_Void]

Oooh two pages. I rather like this one.

Edit: Sabine's mouth is still showing on the first and second to the last panel, through the gag. Also, the faces still have distinctly visible lines through the gags.

[Bisquick_Avenger]

Double Sized! And man, is it wierd to have a smart Elan on the team :-P

[Fishybugs]

I actually LOL'd at this one...and now we know what the rest of the Linear Guild is up to.

[skreweded]

Two weeks? Sounds abit more like a few days.
Whatever, nice job.

BUT YOUR LATE!!! BY 22 MINUTES!!

ahhh... Im kiddin'

(But not technically!)

[Evil_Pacifist]

I beleive this deserves a big DUN DUN DUN!

[Amotis]

Awesome. V is becoming my favorite character. He talks like a man/woman large and in charge.

[Lithgon the Crazy]

Love It!
:elan: "Wow...it's weird to have my ideas actually listen to..."
and
"I suppose not warning Nale about his brother's jailbreak will serve as my two-weeks' notice."
Actually got a lol at those two!

[fithi]

*chuckle*

I found this one amusing, especially the thought of a Miko vs. LG fight :smallbiggrin:

Can't wait to see what 400 is going to be like!

[MightyMuenster]

Haha, I like it, I like it. And that answers all those questions about Pompey, eh?

Also... foreshadowing? Have all of their enemies battle one another? Episode 400 is coming out Friday. Something big is going to happen, afterall.

[Djagir]

Hee! I think the best parts were V's "I did SAY that I was representing the halfling's viewpoint in this" and Haley's "I think they keep changing it." :smallsmile: Nice followup!

I wonder what 's in reserve for #400... Maybe it'll be as big as #100. :smallwink:

[Ka Modan]

Looks like the Giant might be saving the Haley-Elan thing for a special pg. 400...

Nice comic, btw, I like Vaarsuvius' explanation of showing Belkar's POV!

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

That was brilliant, kudos to you Mr. Burlew.

[brionl]

well, now we know what happened to Leeky & Pompeii. Nice evil plan there, Nale.
:tongue:

[Destro_Yersul]

Cool. And I agree. This gets a DUN DUN DUN.

[Grim Greyscale]

Good health plan? Heh. Everyone loves the healer and all that, right?

[The Vorpal Tribble]

I would think that Elan would have put his stat boost from the level up into Charisma to help with his swashbuckling... or is he just so dumb that he forgot and put it into intelligence by mistake?

I'm giving myself a headache, excuse me.

*walks off*

[teratorn]

V playing Blekar, priceless! Go go V-man. Our little Elan seems so grown up.

[jmucchiello]

Poor Nale. No one else will say I'm guessing, so...

[Wolfie_1066]

haha yay! return of leeky and whats-his-name! im sorry i cant remember the names of minor/major characters all the time! hehe, i bet that were going to have another fight scene soon

[Lithgon the Crazy]

hehe
I just noticed Belkar still hanging upside down in the first panel. I'm still wondering where Roy is though...

[archon_huskie]

I noticed something. Nale, Durkon, V, Pompii, and the Gnome Druid don't have any shoes on. Are they supposed to be barefoot?

Oh, and he's 38 minutes early in my time zone :-p

[Leo_Forestclaw]

The scary part: I almost had that exact conversation during one of my gaming sessions...

Tips hat to Giant - long may you tell stories that are far too close to actual experiences...

[Haruki-kun]

Ho was asking what happened to Pompey?
HAHAHAHA LMAO
Nale trusts too much in his over-used villain plans.
Really cool strip, lol

[Charles Phipps]

I assume that he put it in Intelligence because he's not a min-maxer.

;-)

[Shadic]

We are so close to 400 now..

[[email protected]]

edit: nevermind...

[Nerd-o-rama]

Leeky and Pompey: Best minions ever.

Yeah, this conversation has happened far, far too many times in my D&D games. Perhaps I should stick to Evil parties. So much cleaner.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Maybe I missed something in one of the earlier comics, but what the hell is that hand that's dragging Belkar off-panel at the beginning?
Err, Bigby's Giant Hand? #397.

[The Giant]

Whoops, missed the transparent blue gags...one of the constant pitfalls is that certain settings lead to transparent objects in the final GIF that look opaque in my Illustrator file. Oh well, fixed now.

[Lithgon the Crazy]

I noticed something. Nale, Durkon, V, Pompii, and the Gnome Druid don't have any shoes on. Are they supposed to be barefoot?

Oh, and he's 38 minutes early in my time zone :-p

Probably goes with the "spell-casters cannot wear armor". :wink:
Shoes = armor
Sandals = well sandals

[BardicLasher]

haha yay! return of leeky and whats-his-name! im sorry i cant remember the names of minor/major characters all the time! hehe, i bet that were going to have another fight scene soon

His name's Pompey.


And yes, I LOVE this. I'm glad we finally got to see what Pompey's been up to. He and our favorite gnome still in Cliffport... But does this mean they'll have to come back to face the heroes? Or are they out of the picture forever now.

The whole strip was great. I thing my favorite part is V's comments on Belkar's behalf, especially as it's not entirely clear that V's not thinking them him/herself! Oh, V, you may become evil yet... Gleee!

[[email protected]]

Err, Bigby's Giant Hand?

Yeah, I realized it roughly four seconds after posting :smallfrown:

[mikeejimbo]

Yay! Elan made a good suggestion!

[wagomorph]

When I heard Nale give his silent monologue, I thought it would be INCONCEIVABLE that the minions would not rescue him. And that you should never get involved in a land war in Asia or match wits with a Sicilian when death is on the line.

Well done, Rich,

[Sky_Schemer]

Ha! With that last line, Pompey now officially rocks. :smallbiggrin:

[Shadic]

Anybody else wonder where Elan got that certificate from? He got knocked out and stripped without expecting it, but he still has it on hand when wearing a different set of clothes?

[SteveMB]

When I heard Nale give his silent monologue, I thought it would be INCONCEIVABLE that the minions would not rescue him.
I suppose we'll never know if he actually intended to spring Thog out of jail. (I'm inclined to assume so, if only because a Cliffport jailbreak is less trouble than finding another equally useful and loyal goon.)

[DarkLightDragon]

Anybody else wonder where Elan got that certificate from? He got knocked out and stripped without expecting it, but he still has it on hand when wearing a different set of clothes? Plot device.

The last panel was awesome!

[Alex Kidd]

I don't see why they were shocked at V's suggestion, he is true neutral. And yeah I think that was all V's own belief, a realistic Belkar view would involve killing Nale and Thog and letting them be resurrected so he can fight them again, and keeping Sabine captive for his err "use".:smalleek:

So next comic, I predict Elan and Haley nearly having a scene then panning to a window view of Miko being killed in front of the gates by Xykon making a sadistic and awesome entrance

:xykon: "Aww so close... what's our runner up prize Redcloak"

:redcloak: "Raise Dead sounds good."

[Mr._Blinky]

Anybody else wonder where Elan got that certificate from? He got knocked out and stripped without expecting it, but he still has it on hand when wearing a different set of clothes?
Simple, he used the bard spell Summon Plot Item.

[SteveMB]

Anybody else wonder where Elan got that certificate from? He got knocked out and stripped without expecting it, but he still has it on hand when wearing a different set of clothes?
Even Belkar's method (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0261.html) of hiding an ace in the hole wouldn't work in this case.... :smallyuk:

[MReav]

I wonder how they're going to keep thog from busting out in purple pants. Unless they have Enfeebling weapons.

[Lithgon the Crazy]

Anybody else wonder where Elan got that certificate from? He got knocked out and stripped without expecting it, but he still has it on hand when wearing a different set of clothes?

When Shojo was granting them all wishes when they agreed to help the Shojo. Haley was granted a medical check-up, Durkon was granted a letter home, and Roy got his grandfather's sword fixed. (Forget what # though)

[fwiffo]

You know, Haley's argument makes no sense. If we kill them, someone will go to a hella lot of trouble and expense to bring them back, so let's just lock them up. How about both? Prison escape is gonna be a lot, a lot harder when you are dead. And Haley of all people should know that Azure's city prisons are not escape-proof. Why didn't V call her on that?

Or is there something about AD&D rules that makes True Resurrection a process that does not need the body, so getting alive person out of prison is harder than a dead person?

[although]

And yes, I LOVE this. I'm glad we finally got to see what Pompey's been up to. He and our favorite gnome still in Cliffport... But does this mean they'll have to come back to face the heroes? Or are they out of the picture forever now.

They've got no reason to track down the OOTS now. But they're both great characters, and I'd bet we haven't seen the last of them. Especially since Pompey and Vaarsuvius still haven't had that direct confrontation foreshadowed by their names...

[Mnemosyne]

I am glad Sabine and Nale are not dead. They are my favorites.

Vaarsuvias displaying his/her neutrality = excellent.

[Bakta]

I didn't know V took levels in halfling logic skillz...

One does learn a new thing every day

[GoldenKitsune]

Oh, evil Vaarsuvius, why must you be as loveable and entertaining as regular Vaarsuvius?:smallbiggrin:

And, on a side note, I would also pay a handsome sum to see Miko fight the LG.

[MReav]

When Shojo was granting them all wishes when they agreed to help the Shojo. Haley was granted a medical check-up, Durkon was granted a letter home, and Roy got his grandfather's sword fixed. (Forget what # though)

He's arguing the logic of him having it while having been in prison.

However, it's irrelevant, since Nale would have his clothes and therefore his ticket, on Elan's clothes, in Elan's room.

[Shadic]

When Shojo was granting them all wishes when they agreed to help the Shojo. Haley was granted a medical check-up, Durkon was granted a letter home, and Roy got his grandfather's sword fixed. (Forget what # though)

You're missing my point. He couldn't have had it in his pockets, Nale took his clothes, and he left them in a completely different room.

[MReav]

Summon Plot Device?

[although]

Or is there something about AD&D rules that makes True Resurrection a process that does not need the body, so getting alive person out of prison is harder than a dead person?
Exactly (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/trueResurrection.htm). That's the crux of Haley's argument; as you say, her point wouldn't make much sense if they could prevent Nale's resurrection by hiding or destroying his body.

[Lithgon the Crazy]

You're missing my point. He couldn't have had it in his pockets, Nale took his clothes, and he left them in a completely different room.


Summon Plot Device?

Second.

Blar Blar Blar :smallwink:

[fwiffo]

You're missing my point. He couldn't have had it in his pockets, Nale took his clothes, and he left them in a completely different room.

Having your loot with you at all times is a common trait of AD&D campaigns, isn't it? You might as well be asking where Bugs Bunny gets that bra and a skirt out of nowhere.

[Dabble]

Very Nice comic.

Elan becomes a useful part of the party, can't wait to see Roy's reaction to that one.

V's idea of the arena was cool. I could see Miko Vs the Linear Guild. but knowing Nale, it will be Miko joining the Linear Guild.

And of course we now know what happened to Leeky and Pompeii (He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Potty-Trained?)


Can't wait to see what happens in #400

[Yzorth]

Wow! Great comic! :smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbi ggrin:

I love it. Elan comes up with a cool idea, and the rest of the linear guild is taken care of with a cool plot twist. I love it. Definitely better than average. Good job Giant! Koo-doos, koo-doos my man.

[Alysar]

I am glad Sabine and Nale are not dead. They are my favorites.

Vaarsuvias displaying his/her neutrality = excellent.

Like Julia, V goes both ways :amused:

[PaladinFreak]

Utterly sweet!

If Nale knew what was going on, I would looove to see his face!

SIMU-STAB!!!!

[Yzorth]

One question though.....

ELAN AND HALEY??????????

Elan just found out that Haley loves him... do NOT tell me that Elan is just going to "forget" about it. (although I could see him doing that)

PLEASE Giant, I want to see more progress there! :smallfrown:

[Dawnstrider_Moogle]

This strip was ominous in its uneventfulness, considering that 400 is right around the corner.

Not to say that the uneventfulness is a bad thing, though. Taking a time-out to plan is one of the main components of any campaign.

[Skippy]

Like Julia, V goes both ways :amused:

In every possible way, apparently...

[Felinoid]

Still loving V, came up with a reasonable explanation for the certificate appearance (Elan unconscious = Nale takes ... Nale unconscious = Elan takes back), and a good chuckle at Nale's thoughts before I'd even seen the last row with a satisfying confirmation. Who else is up for #400?

[Wallyz]

One question though.....

ELAN AND HALEY??????????

Elan just found out that Haley loves him... do NOT tell me that Elan is just going to "forget" about it. (although I could see him doing that)

PLEASE Giant, I want to see more progress there! :smallfrown:

Suck it up Cream Puff. Some of us don't want Bruce Willis and Sybil Shepard to hook up. we like the tension.

[Alysar]

Suck it up Cream Puff. Some of us don't want Bruce Willis and Sybil Shepard to hook up. we like the tension.

I dread the upcoming onslaught of young readers who have no idea what you're talking about.

(Doesn't want to feel old :smallfrown:)

[The Extinguisher]

Do I smell another set of reccuring villians?
...no wait, thats just me.

Anyway, good comic.

[Hushdawg]

When I heard Nale give his silent monologue, I thought it would be INCONCEIVABLE that the minions would not rescue him. And that you should never get involved in a land war in Asia or match wits with a Sicilian when death is on the line.

Well done, Rich,

Ah, you're trying to trick Rich into revealing something. Well it won't work.

[Hushdawg]

Having your loot with you at all times is a common trait of AD&D campaigns, isn't it? You might as well be asking where Bugs Bunny gets that bra and a skirt out of nowhere.

Ah; but that my friend is Victoria's secret to tell...

[Winged One]

Am I the only one who saw the Leeky/Pompey panel coming as soon as Nale thought the words "loyal minions?"

[Wallyz]

I dread the upcoming onslaught of young readers who have no idea what you're talking about.

(Doesn't want to feel old :smallfrown:)

Be quiet and hand me my cane.

[Demented]

Saw it coming the moment Haley mentioned Nale's ability to make loyal minions.

Seriously.
Anything that can be seen as reliable about Nale probably won't be.

Also, it's kind of funny knowing that Belkar is still 'hanging around' while Varrsuvius is discussing what his point of view would be. Maybe he fell asleep, otherwise I don't see why he wouldn't still be commenting, despite being charmed.

[Mr_Saturn]

We want miko and the LG to duke it out!

[Tarek]

Those last four panels had me laughing almost hysterically!

The Evil Mastermind plotting away, while his "faithful henchmen" go riding off into the sunset... :biggrin:

[Kjata]

I dread the upcoming onslaught of young readers who have no idea what you're talking about.

(Doesn't want to feel old :smallfrown:)

Dont worry, im 14 and know what you are talking about.

And godamn it, now ihave to wait 2 frikken daysn to know what happens. Damn!

[teratorn]

I don't see why they were shocked at V's suggestion, he is true neutral. And yeah I think that was all V's own belief, a realistic Belkar view would involve killing Nale and Thog and letting them be resurrected so he can fight them again, and keeping Sabine captive for his err "use".:smalleek:
The only thing she really forgot was the part about harvesting their kidneys.


Suck it up Cream Puff. Some of us don't want Bruce Willis and Sybil Shepard to hook up. we like the tension.
Wow, senior reader allert!

[Sengoku]

The Linear guild vs Miko!!

I'd really like to see it :P

[Ampersand]

Yeah, I imagine the Linear Guild in the dungeons of Azure City would be fun.

:belkar: <Speculation on the cost of retaining your mother's services>
:nale: Oh, come on! Can't you idiot guardsmen see that's an illusion? For the love of the gawds, you can see right through him!
:belkar: <Speculation on the cost of retaining your mother's services>
:sabine: Not to mention he's been in a loop for the last 45 minutes.
:thog: yay! nice guardsmen give thog corn for dinner.
:nale: & :sabine: And they call us evil...

[Angela Christine]

Also, it's kind of funny knowing that Belkar is still 'hanging around' while Varrsuvius is discussing what his point of view would be. Maybe he fell asleep, otherwise I don't see why he wouldn't still be commenting, despite being charmed.

It looks like Belkar's mouth and eyes are both open. I don't think he's sleeping, I think that he's still singing.




As for Nale and Thog,
Kill them, cut off their arms and legs, immediately have them raised as zombies, and then have the zombies sealed up in a wall somewhere. Zombies are too stupid to make good escape plans, especially if they don't have arms and legs. That should keep them safely out of the way for the rest of the OotS's lives. If someone discovers the zombies in the distant future, they are likely to destroy them, but by then nobody will be trying to resurrect them anyway.

That might not work for Sabine though, killing her might just send her home. Maybe an imprisonment (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/imprisonment.htm) spell? You could try it on all three of them, but then they could be freed together and continue causing evil in the future.

[The Extinguisher]

nah, it'll be more

:belkar: <comment on ineffectiveness of plans>

[Itdano]

I find myself once again saying that Nale = Owned. And that makes me happy.

[Jewel Thief]

But will that be the last we see of Pompey??? DUN DUN DUNNNN...

[Arunei]

Yay thanks for double comic Giant!

[MReav]

Yeah, I imagine the Linear Guild in the dungeons of Azure City would be fun.

:belkar: <Speculation on the cost of retaining your mother's services>
:nale: Oh, come on! Can't you idiot guardsmen see that's an illusion? For the love of the gawds, you can see right through him!
:belkar: <Speculation on the cost of retaining your mother's services>
:sabine: Not to mention he's been in a loop for the last 45 minutes.
:thog: yay! nice guardsmen give thog corn for dinner.
:nale: & :sabine: And they call us evil...

Wait. how would they be able to have the illusion function inside the AM field?

[Ampersand]

Wait. how would they be able to have the illusion function inside the AM field?

Beats me, but Eugene managed it somehow, and given that the paladins have yet to freak out it appears to be holding.

[Green Bean]

:elan: Hooray! XP for everyone!

I laughed like crazy at this part

[MReav]

I'm also curious about Hilgya and Zz'drti. Can we get a comic on their current activities?

[Bisquick_Avenger]

Y'know I just noticed that the LG are laying in glass shards.

That's just... ow.

[SquirrelKing]

Yep, I'm among the curious masses as to what #400 will bring as well. Curious enough to remove my status as a lurker, apparently! For shame, Giant, for shame!!

Incidentally, the comic rocked. As always. But you don't need me to tell you that.

[Holy_Knight]

I noticed the problem with Elan's gift certificate too, and it wouldn't have made much sense for Nale to have it with him at this point. So... um... a cantrip to pull it from Elan's room?

And it looks like we're set up for #400 to finally feature what many of us have suspected it would... looking forward to Friday!

[Arancaytar]

:elan:: It's so weird to have my ideas listened to.

:haley:: Tell me about it.

I cannot help but notice that, coincidentally, Roy is not around.
Not that that would have anything to do with it, of course.

[warmachine]

As Ampersand hinted, Nale knows Belkar is not in prison. There is a danger Miko and the prison guards will hear about this and investigate what happened. If Miko learns the truth, she won't like it one bit.

[denelian]

Suck it up Cream Puff. Some of us don't want Bruce Willis and Sybil Shepard to hook up. we like the tension.


MOONLIGHTING!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?


eep!

[Zeb The Troll]

Suck it up Cream Puff. Some of us don't want Bruce Willis and Sybil Shepard to hook up. we like the tension.
My mind is now reeling from the sudden jerk backwards in time.

Speaking of the Way-back machine, Mr. Peabody, is that a Heavy Metal (the movie, not the mag) reference in the title? :smallcool:

[teratorn]

But will that be the last we see of Pompey??? DUN DUN DUNNNN...

I think so, he was good for a few gags but doesn't amount to much as a villain.

By the way, happy birthday.

[Yorkiebar]

A bit of a slow plod to fill in the storyline. but I liked the last panel.

Take your time with the next one, Mr Burlew, I expect to be blinded with amazement at the spectacular-ness of #400. :smallbiggrin:

[Faramir]

So much to like.

We got to hear V's "And what, exactly, would the problem with that be?" line again. A nice rules joke from Haley. And Elan typically comes up with what sounds like an intelligent plan but which, of course, will result in the LG going free in a very few strips once Xykon arrives. Why he's nearly as incompetent a good guy as Nale is an evil mastermind :).

[Ronald_saveloy]

Giant, I love your way to introduce and use Items when nobody expects it. First the girdle of feminity/masculinity, than the gift certificate for Elan. I though first, that would have exchanged it for the Lollypop in Strip #298. http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0298.html (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/../comics/oots0298.html)

[Alfryd]

V is becoming my favorite character. He talks like a man/woman large and in charge.Int 18 has it's uses.

Looks like the Giant might be saving the Haley-Elan thing for a special pg. 400...Could happen, but I suspect being TP'd away seconds before the invasion is more probable.

Oh, V, you may become evil yet... Gleee!Casting a soul-binding spell on people who have repeatedly tried to kill you for no good reason seems perfectly consistent with CG to me.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/soulBind.htm
It's not even described as an evil-aligned spell, just necromantic.
It is 9th level with a very costly material component, though, (1K gp/target level,) so they may have to wait a while. Also, if the gem involved is destroyed or hit a successful dispel, the soul is freed.
Perhaps some permanent feeblemind-spell upon Nale until he dies of old age in the dungeons, and killing sabine on her home plane, would do the trick.

Or is there something about AD&D rules that makes True Resurrection a process that does not need the body, so getting alive person out of prison is harder than a dead person?That is correct. True Resurrection requires only the name of the target or other means of identification, no physical remnant is required.
What I find less convincing is how, exactly, Nale will convince people to resurrect him once he's DEAD.

And, on a side note, I would also pay a handsome sum to see Miko fight the LG.Could happen yet. We'll see if Xykon drops by the cells en route to the Gate.

And Elan typically comes up with what sounds like an intelligent plan but which, of course, will result in the LG going free in a very few strips once Xykon arrives.Ah, well there you are then.

...but knowing Nale, it will be Miko joining the Linear Guild.Been there, done that, Xykon has more cha.

Fear my Disatar, and my Bazooka of Smite Evil!!!Everyone knows the RPG is a far superior anti-impiety small arm.

Yeah, I imagine the Linear Guild in the dungeons of Azure City would be fun.Most amusing. Yes... fun(tm).

[Eldhrin]

Another double-length comic! This really has been a treat lately. Does it feel to anybody else like the Giant has been making sure that some big event happens right on time in #400?

Not that the events of these past few strips were anything less than momentous.

[TheAnimal]

Okay, V is now officially my favorite OotS character.
That :eek: look on Haley and Durkon's faces when (s)he fired off that "And what, exactly, would the problem with that be?" line... hilarious!

You know, some days you just can't get rid of a bomb recurring villain. Damn True Resurrection... without that, it would just have taken a few Disintegrate spells and BAM!, perma-death for the Linear Guild. Although if Sabine is a succubus, that would make her a tanar'ri, and those have a nasty habit to keep coming back...

So now the LGers go to jail for a strip or two only to be promptly released when Xykon invades Azure City. :annoyed:

Yes, Hilgya is still a bit of a loose end... Wonder where she went after Durkon rejected her?
As for Zz'Drti, I don't think we'll see any more of him. You know, once the lawyers get you, there's no going back...

...Hmm, I wonder if the OotSers could get a cease and desist against the rest of the Linear Guild. :confused:

Looks like Leeky and Pompey will not be teaming up with Nale again... They might clash with OotS, though. Leeky definitely has a bone to pick with Durkon.

[Eldan]

But... If Sabine was killed, wouldn't she be demoted to a lesser form of devil/demon? It wouldn't be so dangerous then.
Also some other thought: Imagine what Nale could have done with the gift certificate if he had found it in Elans pockets!

[Delgarde]

Wait. how would they be able to have the illusion function inside the AM field?


He's a non-spellcaster, which is why he wasn't in the AM field the first time they locked him up. Assuming a proper search was done, there's no particular reason not to put him in an ordinary cell.

[Delgarde]

Heh... it's so hard to find reliable minions these days. :)

Love V's behaviour in this one, standing in for Belkar as the voice for evil.

[The Dirge]

Great comic, V acting as Belkar was priceless

[Chadhulhu]

Yay., another great double comic.. ooo can not wait for #400!

[Em]

I <3 V!
Why do I need more characters? Brevity is the soul of wit... er...

[WarriorTribble]

It's odd how Elan looks confused when V states he's representing Belkars POV. Almost like he's thinking "Belkar? Evil? I though he was chaotic neutral" or something.

I note that I already know, and think Belkar is Chaotic Evil.

[Duke of URL]

His name's Pompey.


And yes, I LOVE this. I'm glad we finally got to see what Pompey's been up to. He and our favorite gnome still in Cliffport... But does this mean they'll have to come back to face the heroes? Or are they out of the picture forever now.

The whole strip was great. I thing my favorite part is V's comments on Belkar's behalf, especially as it's not entirely clear that V's not thinking them him/herself! Oh, V, you may become evil yet... Gleee!

Another reason to believe V is "true neutral" (especially with V's ambiguous gender and Julia's earlier comment that TN "goes both ways").

[Blaznak]

AAAGH! My head hurts! Elan just isn't cool, he's thinking clearly!!! The madness.... the madness.... Still, nice to see Belkar's thought process has as least some merit!

[Duke of URL]

:elan: Hooray! XP for everyone!


Except Roy... and probably Belkar, too.

[blackout]

Simply put, this is awesome, but it could use more Kobolds. >:)

[Vyperhand]

Panel 5, Vaarsuvius - "relevent" should be "relevant"
Otherwise, a very amusing comic.

Oh, and hi everybody.

Cheers,
-V

[TroyXavier]

Yeah, definitely an amusing comic. A lot of fun aroudn and I was glad to see Leeky return. Nale just can't win and that's a good thing.

[Keleko]

Except Roy... and probably Belkar, too.

Where is Roy, anyway? He's been missing since #379 (unless I missed seeing him). Did he sleep through the whole plot conclusion?

[GKBeetle]

I'm pretty sure that the Giant is just planning on never writing about Roy again and hoping that we forget about him.

[Kaerou]

hehehe, this was an awesome strip! I really loved Haleys Panel with the 'i think they keep changing it..' I giggled :D

As for the lack of Roy, i'm glad. He's had a lot of solo panels and strips devoted to him so far, its really nice to see the rest of the cast being given their own time to shine.

[Cleverdan22]

Nice comic. I loved V's lines, as well as the sight of Belkar still hypnotized.

[Kilbia]

I'm with whoever said Roy's player missed the last gaming session (or two) and has thus been written out for a while. I certainly prefer that approach over running somebody as an NPC.

[NullAshton]

I'm thinking that based on what they know about the new Linear Guild members, they should execute them. Why?

The only resurrection magic they have is the druid, and Druids have Reincarnation. *evil grin*

[Duke of URL]

The only resurrection magic they have is the druid, and Druids have Reincarnation. *evil grin*

Okay... so Nale returns as a bitter weasel... what do the others come back as?

[WarriorTribble]

Okay... so Nale returns as a bitter weasel... what do the others come back as?Thog come back as puppy. Thog not love himself...

[Pantler]

Aww, man. I was hoping they would try the arena :smallsmile:

Belkar's head should be almost ready to explode by now, he has been hanging upside down for quite a few rounds now... As in #165 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0165.html)

[Varian7]

I agree, Thog would come back as a puppy, but I think Nale would come back as a skunk!

[Palanthos]

Do you know what would be absolutely hilarious?

If they actually do get the Linear Guild into the Sapphire Guard's prison,The Giant could actually make it so that the OoTS needs Nale's help in understanding the criminal mind to stop Xykon. A 'Silence of the Lambs' parody with Nale as Hannibal Lecter would be amusing to no end.

Haley = Clarice? :smalltongue:

[wagomorph]

Kobolds....Is that a D&D equivalent of needing more cowbells??

[Sky_Schemer]

Take your time with the next one, Mr Burlew, I expect to be blinded with amazement at the spectacular-ness of #400. :smallbiggrin:

No pressure, right? :smallconfused:

[GKBeetle]

Kobolds....Is that a D&D equivalent of needing more cowbells??

I've got a fever, and the only prescription is More Kobold!

[Lisp]

Just wanted to say Thank you Giant, I have really enjoyed the OOtS so far, appreciate the effort ( even when Real Life
interferes) its somehting I look forward to.

I don't know about anyone else, but I keep expecting Elan's
Ideas to be over the top or involve a LLama :)

The More I hear the more I am impressed by his Dashing Swordsman Prestige Class and his new outlook. Way to go.

Elan means Spirit/Zeal and to me thats the Soul of OOtS.

[Doug Lampert]

True Resurrection requires only the name of the target or other means of identification, no physical remnant is required.
Strict reading of the rules as writen gives an interesting result here.

"True Resurrection
Conjuration (Healing)
Level: Clr 9
Casting Time: 10 minutes
This spell functions like raise dead, except that you can resurrect a creature that has been dead for as long as 10 years per caster level. This spell can even bring back creatures whose bodies have been destroyed, provided that you unambiguously identify the deceased in some fashion (reciting the deceased’s time and place of birth or death is the most common method).
Upon completion of the spell, the creature is immediately restored to full hit points, vigor, and health, with no loss of level (or Constitution points) or prepared spells.
You can revive someone killed by a death effect or someone who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed. This spell can also resurrect elementals or outsiders, but it can’t resurrect constructs or undead creatures.
Even true resurrection can’t restore to life a creature who has died of old age.
Material Component: A sprinkle of holy water and diamonds worth a total of at least 25,000 gp."

Note: It DOES'T say you don't need the body if one exists! It functions as Raise Dead exept where specified otherwise, and Raise Dead targets body touched. The only exception provided for True Res is that IF the body is destroyed you can still bring somebody back, thus it follows that if the body isn't destroyed you need access to the body to cast this spell. (Worse, if the body exists but has been badly damaged you presumably can't use True Resurect at all without first destroying the body since Raise Dead works only on more or less intact bodies and you need Resurect for badly damaged bodies. So you presumably need to finish off the body first.

Mind, I suspect that any DM who used this interpretation would find himself short on players, but the written rules are clear, you need the body if it exists and it needs to be in good enough shape for a Raise Dead.

[CGM3]

It's entirely possible that Elan didn't have Lord Shojo's "gift certificate" on him when the OotS went to Cliffport -- that was supposed to be a quick "in and out" to rescue Julia, no need to pack any luggage -- so he left it in his room at the inn. Then, when he needed it, he used a bard spell to 'port it into his hand (there's a bard spell that does that with weapons, so a variant for other items is possible).

Or do you think we're all overly obsessing on a minor story point? :smallsigh:

[Erloas]

Strict reading of the rules as writen gives an interesting result here.

"True Resurrection
Conjuration (Healing)
Level: Clr 9
Casting Time: 10 minutes
This spell functions like raise dead, except that you can resurrect a creature that has been dead for as long as 10 years per caster level. This spell can even bring back creatures whose bodies have been destroyed, provided that you unambiguously identify the deceased in some fashion (reciting the deceased’s time and place of birth or death is the most common method).
Upon completion of the spell, the creature is immediately restored to full hit points, vigor, and health, with no loss of level (or Constitution points) or prepared spells.
You can revive someone killed by a death effect or someone who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed. This spell can also resurrect elementals or outsiders, but it can’t resurrect constructs or undead creatures.
Even true resurrection can’t restore to life a creature who has died of old age.
Material Component: A sprinkle of holy water and diamonds worth a total of at least 25,000 gp."

Note: It DOES'T say you don't need the body if one exists! It functions as Raise Dead exept where specified otherwise, and Raise Dead targets body touched. The only exception provided for True Res is that IF the body is destroyed you can still bring somebody back, thus it follows that if the body isn't destroyed you need access to the body to cast this spell. (Worse, if the body exists but has been badly damaged you presumably can't use True Resurect at all without first destroying the body since Raise Dead works only on more or less intact bodies and you need Resurect for badly damaged bodies. So you presumably need to finish off the body first.

You are reading into the description words that are not there. It does not anywhere say that you can ONLY use true ressurection if the body is present OR (mutually exclusively) destroyed. It says "can even" bring back destroyed bodies, the stipulation is that you have to be able to identify the person you are trying to ressurect, not that the body is destroyed. The "can even" says if they body is destroyed or not, you can still bring them back so long as you can identify them.



I'm eagerly awaiting 400. I wish it was friday more for the comic then because I'm done with a week of work.
I'm expecting a couple pages again, first getting Roy, curing Belkar then heading to see Shojo leading to a pan shot of azure city and the massive army of Xykon


The other possibility with the Shojo ticket is that it is magically bound to Elan, one of those things that will magically appear and disappear at will. Shojo had the wizards available to do that sort of thing and its not like he is going to want to take the chance of a "free gift of almost anything" card out in the world that can be lost (it is being given to Elan), stollen, sold or traded to just about anyone.

[xyzchyx]

Just thinking out loud here, but wouldn't putting them in an antimagic cell block still be problematic?

Thog is, apparently, strong enough to rip prison bars apart when sufficiently motivated. And barbarian rage isn't magical in nature so it couldn't be supressed with an antimagic field.

[Mawhrin Skel]

Belkar was thrown into a pit, from which he escaped using his ring of jumping. How well can Thog jump?

[MaxKaladin]

Originally Posted by h_v http://www.giantitp.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1812381#post1812381)
:elan: Hooray! XP for everyone!
Except Roy... and probably Belkar, too.I am amused to note that one of the opponents that was defeated was :belkar:. :vaarsuvius: and :durkon: should be getting extra XP for stopping him. :smallbiggrin:

[pendell]

Awesome, as always! A strip that had to be, and done well.

And I note that Elan and Haley are conveniently left alone by themselves, except for the (apparently comatose) LG. Setting up 400 rather neatly.

Notes:


Elan and Haley both balk at using an Evil spell, even to eliminate a clear and present threat to the party.

Conclusion :Elan and Haley are chaotic good.



Note: V doesn't care, or at least doesn't care "for the sake of argument".

Conclusion: V is either lawful or true neutral. For some reason I can't imagine him as chaotic -- too stuffy, maybe?



'Nother question: Nale is *lawful evil*, right?


So how would that impact him being put into prison? IF he's lawful, that means he respects due process, right? Shouldn't he try to play the law, rather than simply bust out of jail leaving a trail of corpses behind him?




Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Cifer]

Good health plan? Heh. Everyone loves the healer and all that, right?
I guess the health plan would be "I'll toss a reincarnation your way in case you kick the bucket and be interested what you come back as..."


I noticed something. Nale, Durkon, V, Pompii, and the Gnome Druid don't have any shoes on. Are they supposed to be barefoot?

Nope. Shoes are not drawn by the giant. Boots (see Roy) and barefooted (see Belkar) are.


And Haley of all people should know that Azure's city prisons are not escape-proof. Why didn't V call her on that?

Because Haley is a single-class rogue, and even she managed it only with a fishy competence bonus and taking 20. Nale, on the other hand side, is horribly multiclassed, has extreme MAD (multi-ability-dependance: He needs CHA for his sorcerer aspect, STR and CON for his fighter since he's using a non-finessable longsword and INT and DEX for his roguing) and two of his classes give him a whopping 2+Int skill points per level - wanna bet he is not quite as good as Haley?


Wait. how would they be able to have the illusion function inside the AM field?
As others said: Belkar is not magical. Without the ring of Jumping (which only one guard knows about - and this guard is probably still not in the state for telling anyone), there is no reason for him to be locked up in the AM-cell.


But... If Sabine was killed, wouldn't she be demoted to a lesser form of devil/demon? It wouldn't be so dangerous then.
Well... maybe. It could be she becomes a lesser fiend... or reforms as strong as ever... or completely merges with her home plane... or whatever it is fiends do in this edition, as Haley said.

[Duke of URL]

I am amused to note that one of the opponents that was defeated was :belkar:. :vaarsuvius: and :durkon: should be getting extra XP for stopping him. :smallbiggrin:

Maybe I'm an evil DM, but I wouldn't award XP for stopping a party member who is operating under an enemy enchantment.

On the other hand... if Belkar's player did actually know all the words to "Meet Me In St. Louis" and was continuing to sing them for the entire part of the session devoted to this sequence, then I'd award him/her a full XP share just as a roleplaying bonus.

[AngryGreek]

Belkar was thrown into a pit, from which he escaped using his ring of jumping. How well can Thog jump?

Elan seems smart enough now to tell them to shackle his feet. I don't imagine Thog will be bending any bars or lifting any gates (ahhh, good old AD&D) if he was shackled with appropriately strong manacles etc., nor would he be making any of those min / maxed leaps from the pit either.

*edit* Woohoo, I'm finally a halfling in the playground!!*

[Draz74]

Hmmmm ...

I can't decide if I love this episode, or if I'm disappointed by it.

Very plot-heavy rather than mainly being a joke. Usually I like that, but this time I was disappointed with the lack of major punch lines, even though a number of jokes (including the last panel) did make me at least grin a bit.

Several minor plot holes is disappointing. Besides the mysterious appearance of Elan's ticket in his hand (though I guess that really could just be like V's familiar), we have:
- How DOES Belkar's illusion survive in the antimagic dungeon? This question should have been asked ages ago, but this strip made people notice it. I guess it's pretty easy to say, "This is a different section of the jail, without the AMF," but after Belkar escaped the first time, wouldn't they have learned to always put him in an AMF, just in case?
- Why don't they think the LG could escape the Dungeon even without magic? Between Nale's Bluff skill, Sabine's seduction abilities, and Thog's bar-tearing rage ... I know the Azure City jail is probably more secure than the Cliffport one, but still ... can they really afford adamantine bars on Thog's cell?
- Why is Belkar not participating in the discussion? Charm Person isn't supposed to be that strong. The idea to sing the entire score of "Meet Me in St. Louis" wasn't a Suggestion, it was just a suggestion made by a good friend (since Charm makes Belkar consider Nale a good friend). And it was only supposed to apply while Belkar fought his allies; now that he seems to understand he's out of the fight, shouldn't he give up singing? I understand this could be ignored for humor's sake, but without Belkar actually singing words, I fail to see the humor in the continued singing. (I actually really hope he gets to sing "Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas." Actually, I really wanted a one-panel bonus strip on Christmas with Belkar singing that.)
- Wasn't the whole reason V and Durkon got in the fight because they wanted Haley's help gagging Belkar? Why haven't they done so???

But enough of plot holes. Other observations/praise:

Nice touch that the gags are blue. What other color of spare cloth rags would they have been able to find in Azure City?

Shame that the Chief won't actually be avenged by any sort of legal retribution in Cliffport. :smallfrown:

I like how in-character all of V's comments seem. "Proverbial two copper pieces," ... "I did SAY that I was representing the halfling's viewpoint," ...

I note that, in sharp contrast to strip #72, Elan doesn't immediately say, "No! We will NOT kill my brother!" He is actually considering it, after the later things Nale has done to earn his wrath. Guess Elan is becoming less innocent ... :smallsigh:

:vaarsuvius: Maybe we could get a few of our recurring villains to fight one another ... I would pay a handsome sum to see the Linear Guild and that paladin battle for our amusement ...
YES! V is a genius! I really, really hope this comment was foreshadowing! Oh, I don't think it will be soon, but I hope, someday, the Guild gets what it deserves at last from Miko for their crimes that she was so upset about long ago, like tying up the dwarf blacksmith in the small town. :smallsmile:

I like how Elan is listened to when Roy's not around. Funny, because when Roy is around, most of Elans ideas really are horrible.

I saw the last panel coming. It's good, though, that some of the disadvantages of evil minions are shown here. But while I liked seeing Leeky again, and having that loose end of the plot tied up, and liked these two's snarkiness, my main reaction was:
Leeky and Pompey will be back someday, right? RIGHT??
Just because they've split with Nale doesn't mean we won't see them, does it? Because they're way too good villains to just drop, Rich! And too much could still be done with them.

Even without these two, though, Nale does have several options of outside aid. I think Zz'dtri is gone for good, and Hilgya likes Nale even less than Leeky and Pompey. But as others have pointed out, when Xykon arrives, he may decide Nale can still be useful to him. Or, Sabine's archfiend bosses might get curious what has happened to their informant about the whole Snarl situation.

[Duke of URL]

'Nother question: Nale is *lawful evil*, right?


So how would that impact him being put into prison? IF he's lawful, that means he respects due process, right? Shouldn't he try to play the law, rather than simply bust out of jail leaving a trail of corpses behind him?



Not necessarily. "Lawful" means following a specific code of conduct... it does not automatically mean that he acknowledges the authority or laws of any particular society, though as a rule, Lawful characters will at least show some deference to a legitimate authority.

[MaxKaladin]

Maybe I'm an evil DM, but I wouldn't award XP for stopping a party member who is operating under an enemy enchantment.That viewpoint did occur to me after I posted. It's legitimate to say defeating :belkar: counted as part of defeating :nale: and not give extra XP for him. That said, I love the humor potential in :belkar: knowing that :vaarsuvius: and :durkon: got XP for defeating him...


On the other hand... if Belkar's player did actually know all the words to "Meet Me In St. Louis" and was continuing to sing them for the entire part of the session devoted to this sequence, then I'd award him/her a full XP share just as a roleplaying bonus.If he survived the other players, that is.

[baerdith]

Gold. Absolute Gold, top to bottom.

Now we get to see Roy's stunned face when the rest turn up at the meeting with the LG in tow, and ELAN has the bright idea to let the SG guard them in the antimagic cells.





Anybody else wonder where Elan got that certificate from? He got knocked out and stripped without expecting it, but he still has it on hand when wearing a different set of clothes?

That's where he was last comic, going through his brother's (his) things to get the certificate. Shows planning and forethought.

So yes Class/level geeks, Elan put a point in INT.

[Solara]

Great comic, and even double sized! Had to tie up all the loose ends before whatever big thing happens in the next one, I guess. :biggrin: And as much as I liked this one, #400 is all I can think about right now.

I keep remembering how awesome it was when Miko busted into the last meeting with Shojo, and how this time she's going to have an army of the undead right behind her. And then there's the likelihood of the LG being in the room at the same time, and the problem of curing Belkar, and the question of what Roy's been up to all this time, and how the Elan/Haley situation is going to be resolved, and, and... well, you get the idea. :smallbiggrin:

[Iball]

- How DOES Belkar's illusion survive in the antimagic dungeon? This question should have been asked ages ago, but this strip made people notice it. I guess it's pretty easy to say, "This is a different section of the jail, without the AMF," but after Belkar escaped the first time, wouldn't they have learned to always put him in an AMF, just in case?

I think we should consider that if the Lord of the Saphire Guard (or whatever the exact name was) decided to set up an illusion of Belkar in the prison to appease Roy, then he would do in a cell without an AMF...regardless of what he had to tell the guards to explain this. But then, considering they're fooled by the illusion anyway, how hard could that be?


Why is Belkar not participating in the discussion?

For the same reason that thor's lightning can create sonic damage targeted at a specific person? I think it's artistic license - I don't play AD&D, but even if I did I wouldn't mind bending the rules for what I consider is a good joke.


Wasn't the whole reason V and Durkon got in the fight because they wanted Haley's help gagging Belkar? Why haven't they done so???

I wouldn't call that a major plothole - I mean, the reason they entered Haley's room was for a gag, but of course this original reason can quickly be forgotten in a fight.

I thought the comic was extremely good, as always - although like others I guess some resolution of Haley & Elan, and maybe more jokes would have made it even better, without putting too much presssure on the Giant, I'm sure #400 will more than make up for these small nitpicks. :)

[Nekkira]

Yeah gotta hate it when you don't kill the baddies outright and have to figure out what to do with them. Grrr.

[Duke of URL]

If he survived the other players, that is.
There is that complication, yes. :smallbiggrin:

[Kilbia]

Y'know I just noticed that the LG are laying in glass shards.

That's just... ow.

That's just... the OotS had better friggin' move them quick before one of them wakes up enough to try and use a glass shard to cut his/her ropes!

("What is this 'Sin City' you speak of?")

[Doug Lampert]

You are reading into the description words that are not there. It does not anywhere say that you can ONLY use true ressurection if the body is present OR (mutually exclusively) destroyed. It says "can even" bring back destroyed bodies, the stipulation is that you have to be able to identify the person you are trying to ressurect, not that the body is destroyed. The "can even" says if they body is destroyed or not, you can still bring them back so long as you can identify them.

It's AS RAISE DEAD. That specifies body touched. The sentance you refer to is "This spell can even bring back creatures whose bodies have been destroyed, provided that you unambiguously identify the deceased in some fashion (reciting the deceased’s time and place of birth or death is the most common method)."

That second clause is a dependent clause (no ifs ands or buts, it's dependant). By standard English grammer it applies ONLY when the condition provided in the first (independent) clause is met.

[Amon Star]

A good plot comic, with alot of loose ends tied up. A didn't LOL, but I did giggle, mainly at the $th wall humour and the final panel.

Also, as no else has said it yet. I love the fact that :nale: didn't go down from :vaarsuvius:, but was faking it. THAT is the sign of a Evil Genius, knowing when to play possum.


Where is Roy, anyway? He's been missing since #379 (unless I missed seeing him). Did he sleep through the whole plot conclusion?

He was in #380 as well. As for what he's been doing since then, well there's been a lot of speculation in the forums on that. Personally, I think he's either asleep or polishing his sword.


How DOES Belkar's illusion survive in the antimagic dungeon? This question should have been asked ages ago, but this strip made people notice it. I guess it's pretty easy to say, "This is a different section of the jail, without the AMF," but after Belkar escaped the first time, wouldn't they have learned to always put him in an AMF, just in case?

Shojo could have arranged for the AM properties to be turn of in that cell. His chief wizard was in on it anyway.


Why don't they think the LG could escape the Dungeon even without magic? Between Nale's Bluff skill, Sabine's seduction abilities, and Thog's bar-tearing rage ... I know the Azure City jail is probably more secure than the Cliffport one, but still ... can they really afford adamantine bars on Thog's cell?

Azure City should easily be able to afford at least one cell with adamantine bars. Also, this place has catered for fiends before, which we know from #365, and if :roy: can resist :sabine:, then so can the guards. As for :nale:'s Bluff skill. he will need to roll rediculously high to get out of that one.


Wasn't the whole reason V and Durkon got in the fight because they wanted Haley's help gagging Belkar? Why haven't they done so???

They probably consider deciding what to do with the LG more important.

Edit: Ninja'd by Iball!

[Duke of URL]

So yes Class/level geeks, Elan put a point in INT.
Not necessarily... a Dashing Swordsman may be able to substitute CHA for INT in a "save the damsel" situation... the effect just might not have wound down yet.

Not to mention, even a broken (analog) clock is right twice a day.

[mhoram]

I'm a little disappointed that noone commented on what I thought was the funniest line of the comic:

"Oh? Then I shall book the area..."

Varsuvius defers judgement to others, but with the slightest bit of encouragement, he's prepared to spend a small fortune to create an
elaborate piece of theater for the group's amusement.

Also noteworthy is that he's defering to ELAN's judgement. Not waiting for
feedback from Haley OR Durkon before he does so. That's a major step for
Elan.

Also, I find the idea of RENTING OUT AN ARENA and INVITING YOUR ENEMIES TO FIGHT IN IT hilarious. It's just over the top self-indulgent. Like impersonating a king while staying at an inn.

[fehler]

:roy:: I'm guessing he lost the game of Parcheesi back in 380, and had to run "invisible" through the streets of Azure City (tis be Thor's will...). Ergo Belkar went to find Elan ("Roy has boobies!"), setting up his meeting w/ Nale.

[Mawhrin Skel]

"Oh? Then I shall book the area..."
Sarcasm, surely? Look at V's expression...

[Tach13]

Another great comic strip, I have no idea how this gets done so often and with such regularity. great job again.
Spoiler:

whatever Roy is doing, I see him bursting in saying "you guys won't believe... What happened here?"

[Movoza]

heh, liked this one

and once must be the first time, an irritating comment.
what about the mark of justice on the linear guild?
ok never mind i said. they die when they do that... completing the circle

[Guildorn Tanaleth]

I, too, would pay to see Miko battle the Linear Guild. Is there some place we could send our checks?

[Tharj TreeSmiter]

I, too, would pay to see Miko battle the Linear Guild. Is there some place we could send our checks?

Can I get the extended DVD of that? :)

[lord_khaine]

ill just point out that OTS runs on 3.5 rules now, and unlike AD&D you cant get reincarnated as a small animal, it has to be some sort of humanoid.

[Daedrous Avari]

Another great comic.

[krossbow]

It looks like Belkar's mouth and eyes are both open. I don't think he's sleeping, I think that he's still singing.




As for Nale and Thog,
Kill them, cut off their arms and legs, immediately have them raised as zombies, and then have the zombies sealed up in a wall somewhere. Zombies are too stupid to make good escape plans, especially if they don't have arms and legs. That should keep them safely out of the way for the rest of the OotS's lives. If someone discovers the zombies in the distant future, they are likely to destroy them, but by then nobody will be trying to resurrect them anyway.

That might not work for Sabine though, killing her might just send her home. Maybe an imprisonment (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/imprisonment.htm) spell? You could try it on all three of them, but then they could be freed together and continue causing evil in the future.

ummm.... notice the whole thing about Not being evil. That's evi

[the_tick_rules]

Boy the giant shot down my execution theory quite thoroughly, i wonder if he's spying on me.:smalleek: I loved V in this thread, a battle royale sounds like a superb idea. So now we know where pompey and leaky were, they decided to quit and form their own evil organization. But i forget, where actually is roy at the moment, he's been MIA for a while.

[Manga Shoggoth]

Am I the only one who saw the Leeky/Pompey panel coming as soon as Nale thought the words "loyal minions?"

I am reading this on a 56k modem, so the page appears a bit at a time. I couldn't wait to see exactly why Nale's minions were not going to be around...

Mind you, that wasn't nearly as funny as :vaarsuvius: playing the part of :belkar:.

[vbushido]

Doncha just love a good comic :)... <----drool

True Res does not require a body. If the WoTC/RPGA rules lawyers say it doesn't, I don't think the rest of us have to worry about a stricter interpretation. Note the intermediate Resurrection: "So long as some small portion of the creature's body still exists, it can be resurrected."

Removing all the hit points from an outsider will kill them unless they are summoned, in which case they pop back, hale and hearty, to their home plane.

------
Cat: furry keyboard cover and alarm clock

[Angela Christine]

I'm not missing Roy yet.

The last time we saw him was the beginning of the Parcheesi game, but that was just a few hours ago. Belkar and Durkon were with him until the end of the game, which could easily have been less than an hour ago. Right after the game Belkar goes looking for Elan, gets charmed, starts chasing Durkon and then gets caught by V. How long does Grasping Hand last, one round per level? So all the stuff that has happened in the last couple pages would have to have taken no more than a minute and a half or so.

We last saw Roy in #380, at almost the same time as Sabine left. According to #394 she was gone for 3 hours (that would include the time she spent drinking at the bar). That means that Roy was playing parcheesi with Durkon and Belkar until less than three hours ago. It has probably only been about 2 hours since he last saw Belkar, and even less since he last saw Durkon.

He could have gone out for a snack. Or gone to talk to his Dad. Or he might have taken advantage of the fact that they were in a "safe" place and gone to bed early, according to #14 he doesn't sleep well when they are on the road. Poor Roy.




ummm.... notice the whole thing about Not being evil. That's evi


Yes, but effective! I'm not sure you can even make zombies without being evil, much less zombies with no arms or legs.


You are reading into the description words that are not there. It does not anywhere say that you can ONLY use true ressurection if the body is present OR (mutually exclusively) destroyed. It says "can even" bring back destroyed bodies, the stipulation is that you have to be able to identify the person you are trying to ressurect, not that the body is destroyed. The "can even" says if they body is destroyed or not, you can still bring them back so long as you can identify them.


I don't know. I can see the merit in needing the body if a body exists. Otherwise what happens if the body is perfectly intact, and someone does a True Resurrection somewhere else, does the soul go back into the intact body in the unknown location, or form a new body at the location of the Priest? If it forms a new body, what happens if the people in possession of the old body try to resurrect it or raise it as a zombie after the person has been True Resurrected without it?

[Solmage]

Nice, but does Elan's prestige class allow him to substitute int for cha or something? :)

[Wrecan]

Belkar's been hanging upside down for two strips now. Shouldn't he be getting "kinda woozy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0165.html)" by now?

[Uzraid]

I'm not sure you can even make zombies without being evil, much less zombies with no arms or legs.


I'm sure what you meant to say is "you can't make zombies with no arms or legs without being awesome!" It's a common typo.

[garylian]

Good comic!

And thus, the clock starts ticking. Episode 400 in the lives of our amusing band of adventureres looms. And I for one, can barely wait!

Sound the drums of tension!

Boom BOOM Boom BOOM...

[5tephen]

Oh, very nice.

I sincerely hope though, that Leeky and Pompey aren't gone for good. It'd be nice to have a gently expanding cast of ambiguously focussed antagonists out there, instead of just the usual suspects....

[Bluesilver]

I beleive this deserves a big DUN DUN DUN!
Yeah, and I believe this will put an end to all those " Where are Pompey?" threads

[bengator]

Ok, so I'm an idiot. I don't get the last panel. I get that the evil minions don't really give a crap about the Nale. But why would Pompey have seen Elan break out of prison? What am I forgetting? And did Pompey not tell Nale on purpose b/c he has a thing against Nale b/c Nale mistreated him in the past? Or did he just forget? Or maybe he was hired by someone to backstab the LG? And was the Gnome also in on the "plot", if there even was one? Am I being a bit too analytical about a free webcomic (albeit one I enjoy very much)? Insert confused face icon here.

[Wallyz]

POmpey is a loser, and a crappy henchmen. That panel tied up a thread, and brought the funny in contrast to Nale's delusional faith in his second rate henchmen who have no loyalty to anyone, let alone their loser leader.

To answer your first two quesitons, Pompey had been assigned to watch the jail and warn nale if elan escaped.

[euler]

Be quiet and hand me my cane.

1989 wasn't that long ago... At least it seems that way to me.

[Jewel Thief]

I was really hoping Pompey would fight V, but they never did. I'd love to see V have some fun blasting him!

[Dazdya]

What I find less convincing is how, exactly, Nale will convince people to resurrect him once he's DEAD.


The only dead person in the comic is Roy's dad, and he seems to be pulling plenty of strings.

[LurkerBeneath]

I, too, would pay to see Miko battle the Linear Guild. Is there some place we could send our checks?


If anything, I would see Miko breaking the LG out of prison. After all, Elan's plan seems to call for them to be detained indefinitely without charges being filed against them. She already hates the OotS, especially now that she knows they didn't kill Xykon, so she and the LG have common cause. Granted, Sabine's alignment could be a problem, but she could always claim that she detects as evil because of her lower planes outsider nature and not because of her alignment.


"And what, exactly, would the problem with that be?" - amusing OtOoPCs reference.
-LB

[MReav]

If anything, I would see Miko breaking the LG out of prison. After all, Elan's plan seems to call for them to be detained indefinitely without charges being filed against them. She already hates the OotS, especially now that she knows they didn't kill Xykon, so she and the LG have common cause. Granted, Sabine's alignment could be a problem, but she could always claim that she detects as evil because of her lower planes outsider nature and not because of her alignment.


"And what, exactly, would the problem with that be?" - amusing OtOoPCs reference.
-LB

I seriously doubt that. In addition to vandalism and attempted murder being fully acceptable charges to place against them, I doubt Miko'd ever ally herself with a so called lesser evil. She is an experienced loner and holds very fast to her ideals, so running around with people who actually register as evil without the need for obscure artifacts seems grossly out of character for her. She's said "the lies of the wicked cannot be believed" so I doubt she'd respond to them saying "hey, we can track down the OotS so you can fulfill your revenge fantasies" with anything more than a Smite Evil.

[Solara]

I seriously doubt that. In addition to vandalism and attempted murder being fully acceptable charges to place against them, I doubt Miko'd ever ally herself with a so called lesser evil. She is an experienced loner and holds very fast to her ideals, so running around with people who actually register as evil without the need for obscure artifacts seems grossly out of character for her. She's said "the lies of the wicked cannot be believed" so I doubt she'd respond to them saying "hey, we can track down the OotS so you can fulfill your revenge fantasies" with anything more than a Smite Evil.

I imagine there's going to be plenty of confusion when/if Miko does burst in in the middle of things, what with her newfound hatred of the OotS and Xykon right behind her, so I could easily see at least a temporary alliance forming, as long as Nale does some quick talking (that nasty trick he pulled on Elan and Haley shows that he certainly knows how to improvise and make even the most ridiculous lies sound plausible) and as long as she doesn't see Sabine in her true form, what reason would she have to cast Detect Evil in the first place?

Remember, there's likely to be a lot of fighting and kneejerk reactions going on and little if any time for explanations or clearing up misconceptions.

I can't wait. It will be glorious. :smallsmile:

[The_Old_Fox]

I guess INT is tied to confidence, :elan: showed us that.

However, too bad for :thog: , you beat one red-headed girl with a door and your new friend just lets you get tied up. jeezzzz

[MReav]

I imagine there's going to be plenty of confusion when/if Miko does burst in in the middle of things, what with her newfound hatred of the OotS and Xykon right behind her, so I could easily see at least a temporary alliance forming, as long as Nale does some quick talking (that nasty trick he pulled on Elan and Haley shows that he certainly knows how to improvise and make even the most ridiculous lies sound plausible) and as long as she doesn't see Sabine in her true form, what reason would she have to cast Detect Evil in the first place?

Remember, there's likely to be a lot of fighting and kneejerk reactions going on and little if any time for explanations or clearing up misconceptions.

I can't wait. It will be glorious. :smallsmile:


I don't know. While he's good at improv, much of his stuff relies on people having poor Sense Motive, something that hasn't been established one way or another with her (while Durkon has successfully bluffed her at least once, he was taking advantage of her trust of him ). Also, she has heard about the evil twin from Elan, so she actually does have reason for Detect Evil. Just because she thinks one twin is evil doesn't negate the possibility that the other could also be.

[baerdith]

Not necessarily... a Dashing Swordsman may be able to substitute CHA for INT in a "save the damsel" situation... the effect just might not have wound down yet.

Not to mention, even a broken (analog) clock is right twice a day.


Maybe, but think of the long running gags that could come from "Elan is stupid, don't listen to him" But he is right. "Elan couln't possible be smart enough to know the answer..." "The answer is...."

It promises Gold. GOLD I TELL YOU!!!

[GenLee]

Kudos to the Giant for recapping a discussion from our game group's recent past. In our last session, we were attacked by a trio of bad guys. Two PCs died, but we captured the lot of them. Since we are also suspicious of the town guard, we debated a lot what to do with them. So far, we're planning to interrogate them ("who hired you?") and sneak them out to another town where we do trust the guards. After we sell their magic items to pay for a pair of Raise Dead spells, of course.:smallbiggrin:

[teratorn]

Note how Haley argues against killing them on the grounds of being ineffective and not about being wrong killing tied opponents. Note also that she objects against soul binding because it's evil, implying the former was not. It's quite funny given the endless rantings in this forum about what kind of acts are or aren't evil.

[keri]

i still don't like the new elan. he's boring.

i'm not entirely convinced that soul binding or cutting the limbs off of zombies you've just made should be considered evil when the objects of said spells are themselves evil. :smallamused: do whatever you need to in order to have justice, i say!!

and, although i loved this comic, i was a bit disappointed. #393 was just so freaking great. my expectations are now too high to be reasonable. :smallfrown: i was hoping something HUGE and melodramatic would happen.

and what if 400 is just another comic? nothing (especially) special (not that the every day comics are AWESOME)? how can you find roy/ see miko and xykon's army AND heal belkar in one comic???? not to mention that we'll be hanging in suspense with the elan/haley thing until it's done. i just don't see there being an epic battle against evil for 20 or more strips without there being at least SOME kind of resolution there.

i don't know. i don't think the army is coming yet.

i could be wrong.

[teratorn]

and, although i loved this comic, i was a bit disappointed. #393 was just so freaking great. my expectations are now too high to be reasonable. :smallfrown: i was hoping something HUGE and melodramatic would happen.
Yes,but we know something really really big is coming. So it's time to cool down a little before the heat rises again. The Battle for Azure City is very close.


i don't know. i don't think the army is coming yet.

i could be wrong.
As one famous local soccer player once said in an interview: prognostics only after the game. (No the guy's name wasn't Elan). But I think you are right. There are too many loose ends to tie. I would like something dramatic like the reforging of Roy's sword, but probably that is asking for too much. Oh well, we are only a few hours from it.

[Angela Christine]

i'm not entirely convinced that soul binding or cutting the limbs off of zombies you've just made should be considered evil when the objects of said spells are themselves evil.

No, no, no. You don't raise the zombies and then cut off their limbs. You cut the limbs off the corpse and then raise the remaining limbless bodies as zombies. Doing it the other way around opens the door to having evil zombie hands crawling around, or having the arms and legs somehow get re-attached to the rest of the zombie. Sure, that might not be the way it usually works in D&D, but mobile zombie limbs have plenty of president in fiction, and who wants to take that chance? Ideally you want to destroy the limbs before raising the zombie, if you can do so without delaying the zombiefication too much. Burning them should work, or maybe disintegration.

Removing the teeth from the corpse before zombiefication would be good too, to prevent ankle biting attacks, but pulling teeth sounds a little messy and unpleasant. Cleaving off limbs is par for the course for adventurers, but breaking out the dental pliers is just weird.

[Jewel Thief]

how can you find roy/ see miko and xykon's army AND heal belkar in one comic????

Belkar doesn't need to be healed... Yet. He'd be completely useless if Xykon attacked Azure City because of the Mark of Justice.

[Angela Christine]

They don't need to heal Belkar at all, because the charm should wear off in a few hours regardless. They don't have any big plans before morning, so leaving him charmed for a while isn't a huge problem. They DO need to restrain him, because the Grasping hand should wear off in a few seconds.

[Wiione]

Just one left until 400.

[Jewel Thief]

So... close...

[R blademaster]

hoping it will be spectaculer, or at least answers some questions :smallwink:

[Amon Star]

But i forget, where actually is roy at the moment, he's been MIA for a while.

No body knows, but theories abound. Some say the Illuminati.


Yes, but effective! I'm not sure you can even make zombies without being evil, much less zombies with no arms or legs.

Technically, you can be neutral if you don't do it to often and give to charity afterwards. But Animate Dead is an Evil spell.

[TheAnimal]

No, no, no. You don't raise the zombies and then cut off their limbs. You cut the limbs off the corpse and then raise the remaining limbless bodies as zombies.
Why not just lop off their heads, dispose of the bodies and raise the heads as zombies?
To prevent anyone from killing and True Resurrecting the LG, the OotSers could lug the zombified heads around in a bag. :amused:

But on the second thought, if they'd be willing to go there, why not just Soul Bind the LG and carry the soul-gems with them? :confused:

[Blood]

Awesome! A double-comic! A bit more plot-related than humor-related, but we know you're trying to squeeze in stuff for 400 to be on the mark. :smallsmile:

[GKBeetle]

I know everyone is looking forward to something big in #400, but I'm kind of hoping that it will be something like #100 instead. Maybe something like:

Spoiler:
Maybe it could be a recap of the Parchesi game that Belkar was so excited about in episode # 383. That really the only loose end that I care about.

[Skippy]

I've had a peculiar feeling for the 400th.. what if Xykon attacks the city and everyone is damaged in some way and Shojo has no alternative but to remove the MoJ from the Belkster, thus releasing again his bloodthirst?

[berrew]

I'm not missing Roy yet.

<snip>
I don't know. I can see the merit in needing the body if a body exists. Otherwise what happens if the body is perfectly intact, and someone does a True Resurrection somewhere else, does the soul go back into the intact body in the unknown location, or form a new body at the location of the Priest? If it forms a new body, what happens if the people in possession of the old body try to resurrect it or raise it as a zombie after the person has been True Resurrected without it?The same logic would apply to any rez that doesn't require most of the body to be present.

PCs have only 1 soul, so attempts to rez another finger/leg/spleen would fail, since the soul is already inhabiting a body on the Prime Material Plane.

[krossbow]

I personally could care less where roy is right now; Roy's purpose is to solve the order's problems and keep them from devolving into a horrible mess.

With Elan competent now, the team is suddenly working together just fine and solving their own problems, fighting the villians on their own... sounds like a certain fighter's not needed anymore...:smalltongue:

[Nighthawk4]

One question which I thought - where is :roy: ?


Clearly others have had the same idea already. :smallamused:

[EthanAlshire]

The one quote that has ever made me LOL:

'We'd mess it up sooner or later.'

Hilarious!

[baerdith]

They don't need to heal Belkar at all, because the charm should wear off in a few hours regardless. They don't have any big plans before morning, so leaving him charmed for a while isn't a huge problem. They DO need to restrain him, because the Grasping hand should wear off in a few seconds.

Well, the Charm would last 6 hours, so there is probably about 4-5 hours left on it. The way to break the charm is have elan walk up to him and say, "I'm Nale" and then slap him.


Any act by you or your apparent allies that threatens the charmed person breaks the spell.

[krossbow]

Well, the Charm would last 6 hours, so there is probably about 4-5 hours left on it. The way to break the charm is have elan walk up to him and say, "I'm Nale" and then slap him.


But Belkar can smell the difference; He'd still be seen as elan.

[skyclad]

But Belkar can smell the difference; He'd still be seen as elan.

what if elan charms nale and gets him to slap belkar?

[Jewel Thief]

I find it interesting having Belkar hanging from her magically created hand while he's charmed. Why want it to change?

[Caractacus]

[quote=pendell;1813451]

'Nother question: Nale is *lawful evil*, right?


So how would that impact him being put into prison? IF he's lawful, that means he respects due process, right? Shouldn't he try to play the law, rather than simply bust out of jail leaving a trail of corpses behind him?


I think we are all certain that he is. I have to say though, that Lawful people do NOT obey ALL laws and show deference to ALL authority. I mean, the law says 'Don't kill people' in most towns, but he does just this.

In another thread, I pointed out that a paladin would not be put off by a goblin town council by-law that read 'No paladins allowed within the village limits'.

Basically, Lawful people have a strong tendency to obey rules and defer to established hierarchical rules but NOT if they are from a completely different culture; here, this includes being Evil when the rules are Good, or vice versa.

krossbow: "I personally could care less where roy is right now; Roy's purpose is to solve the order's problems and keep them from devolving into a horrible mess."

I assume you mean you couldn't care less? Otherwise you emphasise that it is easily possible to care less than you in fact do, which makes you care about Roy's location... :smalltongue:

Eagerly awaiting 400. Hope we don't get a 'Oots answers fan-mail' one...:smalleek:

[morbiczer]

I think it tells a lot about the group (and Belkar) that none of them bothers to cast a Dispel Magic on the halfling.

[Mawhrin Skel]

krossbow: "I personally could care less where roy is right now; Roy's purpose is to solve the order's problems and keep them from devolving into a horrible mess."

I assume you mean you couldn't care less? Otherwise you emphasise that it is easily possible to care less than you in fact do, which makes you care about Roy's location... :smalltongue:
krossbow is using the US English form of the idiom "couldn't care less", which is mysteriously missing a required negative. Just another reason why US English is so clearly inferior :smalltongue:

(There are probably oddities with Proper British English too, I'm just not aware of them as I take them for granted.)


I think it tells a lot about the group (and Belkar) that none of them bothers to cast a Dispel Magic on the halfling.
V did so and rolled a natural 2. #397.

[Caractacus]

krossbow is using the US English form of the idiom "couldn't care less", which is mysteriously missing a required negative. Just another reason why US English is so clearly inferior :smalltongue:

(There are probably oddities with Proper British English too, I'm just not aware of them as I take them for granted.)

Thanks, Mawhrin Skel!

Sorry Am.Eng. users, didn't know. Nice to have the information...

Regarding oddities in Br.Eng., I'll just bet that there are plenty!

[eilandesq]

I think it tells a lot about the group (and Belkar) that none of them bothers to cast a Dispel Magic on the halfling.

V. tried and rolled badly on the Dispel Magic check, and had only memorized it once. Durkon didn't get Dispel Magic that day--both according to #397.

[Parasocrates]

krossbow is using the US English form of the idiom "couldn't care less", which is mysteriously missing a required negative. Just another reason why US English is so clearly inferior :smalltongue:

(There are probably oddities with Proper British English too, I'm just not aware of them as I take them for granted.)

Here's one:

"Pull the other one, it has got bells on."

What on earth is that supposed to mean? I know how it's used in conversation, but why is it used that way in conversation?

As for disenchanting Belkar, I say don't do it. I want to hear the end of the musical.

[keri]

sorry about the double post but uh... why did leeky (or however the heck you spell his name) thank pompeii?

*reads previous comics*

[Wrecan]

Because, presumably, Pompey broke Leeky out of jail.

[Mawhrin Skel]

Here's one:

"Pull the other one, it has got bells on."

What on earth is that supposed to mean? I know how it's used in conversation, but why is it used that way in conversation?
The "other one" is the other leg, i.e. it's the same as "you are pulling my leg", which I believe exists in US English too. No, I don't know it's derivation. A quick Google not helpful.

[Goldendice]

You know, the last time we saw Xykon, he was on his way to invade Azure City. The Order is still in Azure City. The jail is in the same builing as the Magic Portal. The next issue is #400. Does anyone else think they know how the Linear Guild escapes from jail?

[Gandal]

:tongue: By walking into the gate and promptly dying?

[elgrabadula]

i like this one it makes me wonder what number 400 is going to be like:smallconfused: and by the way where is roy hasnt he been gone for like 20 strips? also how do you do spoilers? is it spoiler: or :spoiler: or :spoiler or what it is

[pendejochy]

Hey I was wondering...how did Pompey know about Elan escaping? Did they just happen to be near the same cell, watching the whole thing and choosing not to react to Elan and Thog escaping?

[Silverain]

now that's an interesting strip ... yay for the good guys winning!

(Vaarsuvius' vocabulary has gotten ahead of his spelling again. see "relevant.")

[keri]

Because, presumably, Pompey broke Leeky out of jail.

what if they did something to :roy: ?

[Angela Christine]

Hey I was wondering...how did Pompey know about Elan escaping? Did they just happen to be near the same cell, watching the whole thing and choosing not to react to Elan and Thog escaping?

The news was probably all over town. A couple mass murderers escaped from prison, destroying their cells in the process, news like that tends to get around.

[IFCC]

A question: :vaarsuvius:"proverbial two copper pieces"? What is that supposed to mean?

[Morquard]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_two_cents

OotS-verse has no cents, but copper pieces instead.

[mucco]

Also, we're talking Xykon-level thread necromancy here. Sheesh, five years? :smalleek: You still needed an invite to register on facebook!