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molten_dragon
2013-11-19, 05:24 PM
I've been playing around with some ideas for games I might want to run in the future, and I had an interesting idea today.

I think a modern take on the classical elementals would be interesting. Rather than being manifestations of the 4 classical elements though, they would be manifestations of the 4 fundamental forces (Electromagnetism, Gravity, Strong Nuclear Force, and Weak Nuclear force). Like the elementals, they would be composed of, and could control that force.

I'm kind of having trouble conceiving of what they'd be like and what they'd do though. Electromagnetism and gravity are easier, since I'm more familiar with them, but even those are giving me some problems.

So I decided to ask the playground for help. What abilities do you see these fundamental force beings having, and what do you think they would 'look' like (for lack of a better term).

I'm more concerned with generalities than fitting them into a specific game system.

No brains
2013-11-19, 07:52 PM
That is an interesting thought there. Let me think...

Electromagnetism is real easy. Just have it look like a lightning dude.

Gravity is harder, because it's hard to illustrate gravity without the mass that causes it. It could look like a shapeless prism, as its gravity bends light into a multicolored blob.

Where this gets harder is that electromagnetism is governed by photons(If I didn't have a horrible teacher). So technically, the electric elemental has the monopoly on being visible. Worse, electromagnetism is a process that specifically overrides the weak force in all cases. It will take a lot of imagination to makes these forces interact like classical elements.

One source of inspiration is to ask: what do these forces do for us every day? The strong force is responsible for nuclear energy(again, IIRC), so it would have to have some kind of energetic look to it. The weak force usually comes into play in chemistry, so maybe a weak elemental could look like a fizzing blob of acid, continually exchanging electrons among many elements.

Grinner
2013-11-19, 07:54 PM
Gravity could be a miniature black hole.
Electromagnetism...a living aurora borealis, maybe? Or perhaps a mobile electromagnetic disturbance? (Just imagine everything in the house flickering on and your TV suddenly talking to you.)
Weak Force could be described as a "stillness", I guess.
And Strong Force would be like some sort of chaos elemental. (Edit: Or maybe a snake of light?)


I'm not a physicist, mind you, but my understanding of those terms leads me to believe those fit the bill.

Edit2: Ninja'd?

molten_dragon
2013-11-19, 08:22 PM
I should clarify. I don't expect that all of them will be visible to the naked eye. Some of them may not be visible at all, but they should be detectable in some manner.

For example an Electromagnetic elemental might simply be a shining light that varies through the EM spectrum, from radio waves through hard gamma radiation.

A gravity elemental might be a gravitational singularity that can't be seen at all, except through gravitational lensing, or with a gravimeter.

ellindsey
2013-11-19, 08:24 PM
The weak nuclear force is responsible for certain subatomic particle interactions, particularly those which are responsible for one subatomic particle turning into a different type of subatomic particle. This is the cause of certain types of radioactive decay. The strong nuclear force on the other hand is responsible for holding quarks together to make subatomic particles, and holding subatomic particles together to make atomic nuclei. I have no idea how to make an elemental that represents either of these.

Slipperychicken
2013-11-19, 08:27 PM
Weak Nuclear force

If you can sell a layperson on a "Weak Nuclear Force Elemental", then I tip my hat to you, because that sounds incredibly boring to me.

erikun
2013-11-19, 08:36 PM
Electromagnitism is quite obvious. It is electricity and magnetics.

Gravity is also quite obvious, if a bit harder to implement. It is gravity, and how large objects are attracted to each other.

Weak Nuclear Force is apparently also called the weak interaction (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weak_interaction), and it governs radioactive decay. Probably the easiest way to describe this would be "randomness", as the decay of a radioactive material is the only way we know of to produce true randomness. Other than that, I'm not sure how else you would apply it.

Strong Nuclear Force is also known as strong interaction (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_interaction). It is the force holding the inside of an atomic nucleus together, and does nothing else. On the one hand, it would be difficult to apply it in most situations. Even if you hit somebody with a "Strong Nuclear Force attack", the range of such at attack would be measured in femtometers; it would literally not even affect a single atom of their body. On the other hand, disrupting the Strong Nuclear Forces that make up an object would literally cause it to fall apart. Such an effect would be equivalent to Disintegrate or, quite possibly, spontaneous nuclear detonation.

Needless to say, SNF would be the most powerful weapon to use. It would also be the most dangerous, and probably the most difficult to attempt.


[EDIT]

Where this gets harder is that electromagnetism is governed by photons(If I didn't have a horrible teacher). So technically, the electric elemental has the monopoly on being visible. Worse, electromagnetism is a process that specifically overrides the weak force in all cases. It will take a lot of imagination to makes these forces interact like classical elements.
As an aside, light/photons are not a force and so would only relate to forces incidentally. Electromagnetic forces are governed by the movement of electrons, not photons. (Hence, electro-. Also why "electricity" is named what it is.)

molten_dragon
2013-11-19, 09:01 PM
If you can sell a layperson on a "Weak Nuclear Force Elemental", then I tip my hat to you, because that sounds incredibly boring to me.

The group I play with is mostly science nerds. They'll love it.

Beleriphon
2013-11-19, 09:42 PM
Strong Nuclear Force is also known as strong interaction (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_interaction). It is the force holding the inside of an atomic nucleus together, and does nothing else. On the one hand, it would be difficult to apply it in most situations. Even if you hit somebody with a "Strong Nuclear Force attack", the range of such at attack would be measured in femtometers; it would literally not even affect a single atom of their body. On the other hand, disrupting the Strong Nuclear Forces that make up an object would literally cause it to fall apart. Such an effect would be equivalent to Disintegrate or, quite possibly, spontaneous nuclear detonation.

Needless to say, SNF would be the most powerful weapon to use. It would also be the most dangerous, and probably the most difficult to attempt.

I was going to mention that. The SNF is what basically holds atoms together, so if you can control that you can stop it from working functionally making something collapse into its base subatomic particles. On a large enough scale you'd be looking at the ability to make anything cease to be. By the same token with enough control you could turn anything you want into something else.

Slipperychicken
2013-11-19, 09:46 PM
The group I play with is mostly science nerds. They'll love it.

Nice. I figured this kind of thing would make science/physics people happy.

[Note to Self: Cram in some physics classes before graduation]

erikun
2013-11-19, 10:11 PM
I was going to mention that. The SNF is what basically holds atoms together, so if you can control that you can stop it from working functionally making something collapse into its base subatomic particles. On a large enough scale you'd be looking at the ability to make anything cease to be. By the same token with enough control you could turn anything you want into something else.
Not... really, no.

I mean, mucking around with SNF could transmute an element, in a way. Weakening it just enough to let a few protons and neutrons release from each atom would give you a lighter element (along with producing alpha particles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_particle)). Trying to create a heavier element would be far more difficult, and would require extending the SNF to cover at least two atoms to combine them together. This could work... in theory... but it would much be like using gravity to create a black hole as a method to transmute carbon into lead, or something similar.

While I can see the idea behind it, it's kind of hard to say how well it would work - and probably far, far more likely that squashing all the electrons from both atoms into that same nucleus will have some rather... unintended consequences. :smallbiggrin:

Lord Raziere
2013-11-19, 10:24 PM
The group I play with is mostly science nerds. They'll love it.

In my opinion... try solids, liquids, gasses and plasma instead. they're better analogues to the classical elements and they're broad enough for a lot of creativity. plus you don't have to strain yourself trying to think how the strong and weak nuclear forces work as elementals.

but...if you insist on the current formation, then unfortunately I have nothing to add.

Wharrrrrrgarbl
2013-11-19, 10:54 PM
If you can sell a layperson on a "Weak Nuclear Force Elemental", then I tip my hat to you, because that sounds incredibly boring to me.
It's more exciting if you describe them as (gauge) boson elementals.

So, Photon Elemental: pretty self-explanatory. Radiation! Fireballs! Lightning bolts! Ads for personal injury lawyers!

Graviton Elemental: Also, as people have noted, pretty easy. Squish.

Gluon Elemental: I'm thinking a sort of stable Glueball (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glueball), so you have dozens of different interpretations available. If you're fighting it, it has some seriously bad news disintegrating touch/slam attacks, as well as stomping around in a deadly miasma of radioactive and antimatter particles.

W Boson Elemental: Difficult to detect; you have to track it by the trail of neutrinos and charged particles it spews out. Also has a tendency to start nuclear reactions (of whatever size the DM pleases :smallwink:). Always accompanied by a Higgs Elemental, or some other strong fluctuation in the Higgs field.

Z Boson Elemental: Even harder to detect; is most easily spotted (if you could possibly call it easy) by its shadow in streams of neutrinos. Also accompanied by a Higgs Elemental.

Higgs Elemental: Very mysterious, but has no associated directionality. Accompanied by an area of increased vacuum energy, where (in the absence of sufficient gravity) space begins to expand and tear itself apart.

Kane0
2013-11-19, 11:07 PM
Can we compromise and have a Nuclear elemental?

Cause you know, the Tarrasque and Astral Dreadnaught need an elemental counterpart...

Slipperychicken
2013-11-19, 11:13 PM
Can we compromise and have a Nuclear elemental?

If we have nuclear elementals, I vote that the Elder version should have Death Throes (Ex) with a radius listed in miles, with smaller elementals having (relatively) smaller death-explosions.

Wharrrrrrgarbl
2013-11-19, 11:14 PM
You may be interested in the Nuclear Toxyderm (http://www.d20resources.com/arcana.d20.srd/creatures/toxyderm.php).

Kane0
2013-11-19, 11:15 PM
If we have nuclear elementals, I vote that the Elder version should have Death Throes (Ex) with a radius listed in miles, with smaller elementals having (relatively) smaller death-explosions.

... I am ok with this.

Edit: Now I will forever see a small nuclear elemental bouncing around inside each Battlemech engine. Way to cross game systems.

The Glyphstone
2013-11-19, 11:18 PM
I dunno, an Elder Strong Nuclear Force Elemental having an attack line of 'Slam +26 melee: 2d8+6 plus spontaneous nuclear detonation' would be pretty cool to see in a MM.

Slipperychicken
2013-11-19, 11:25 PM
I dunno, an Elder Strong Nuclear Force Elemental having an attack line of 'Slam +26 melee: 2d8+6 plus spontaneous nuclear detonation' would be pretty cool to see in a MM.

If those words appear in a dnd game, one knows that something has just gone horribly wrong gloriously right.

Wharrrrrrgarbl
2013-11-19, 11:30 PM
If those words appear in a dnd game, one knows that something has just gone horribly wrong gloriously right.
Ahem. From the d20 Modern SRD:


Chain Reaction (Su): If the nuclear toxyderm is reduced to 0 or fewer hit points, it explodes in a blinding flash of light that deals 400 points of damage to everything (creatures and objects alike) within 400 feet and 100 points of damage to everything within a mile; a successful Reflex save halves the damage (DC 10 + 1/2 toxyderm’s Hit Dice + toxyderm’s Dexterity modifier). This explosion generally results in a milehigh mushroom cloud and a highly radioactive crater a quarter-mile across.

Mastikator
2013-11-19, 11:32 PM
Can we compromise and have a Nuclear elemental?

Cause you know, the Tarrasque and Astral Dreadnaught need an elemental counterpart...

A miniature neutron star?

Slipperychicken
2013-11-19, 11:34 PM
Ahem. From the d20 Modern SRD:

I already read that. I just thought it was homebrew because of the site's layout.


A miniature neutron star?

There was a homebrew Neutronium Golem a while back. It might as well have been a Big Numbers Elemental, since that's more or less what it boiled down to.

Wharrrrrrgarbl
2013-11-19, 11:35 PM
A miniature neutron star?

But that would be a Hadron Elemental! :miko:

Re: Toxyderms, if you prefer a less... Geocities source, check http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd under Arcana Creatures, or if you can find a print copy of Urban Arcana.

nedz
2013-11-20, 04:07 PM
I dunno, an Elder Strong Nuclear Force Elemental having an attack line of 'Slam +26 melee: 2d8+6 plus spontaneous nuclear detonation' would be pretty cool to see in a MM.

Disintegrate touch attack

A Weak Nuclear Force Elemental would do a random polymorph perhaps ?


In my opinion... try solids, liquids, gasses and plasma instead. they're better analogues to the classical elements and they're broad enough for a lot of creativity. plus you don't have to strain yourself trying to think how the strong and weak nuclear forces work as elementals.

Also Bose-Einstein Condensate Elementals and Supercritical Fluid Elementals.

Anne Calie
2013-11-20, 04:21 PM
Yay! I always thought bringing our science knowledge to RPG makes things more interesting.



In my opinion... try solids, liquids, gasses and plasma instead. they're better analogues to the classical elements and they're broad enough for a lot of creativity. plus you don't have to strain yourself trying to think how the strong and weak nuclear forces work as elementals.



I also like to think the classic elementals are analogies to states of matter.
About the "forces" elementals... really, is hard to think a materialization for them, especially because it will probably tend to atoms and subparticles. Perhaps doing like the Giant, bringing elementals out of the periodic table, is refreshing and more easy.

Fayd
2013-11-20, 05:40 PM
One thing I would point out is that the classical elements aren't TOTALLY unjustifiable by science; each represents a STATE of matter, so you've got Earth (Solid), Water (Liquid), Air (Gas), Fire (Plasma). Each of them is a relatively easily available form of the state of matter. I suppose if you want to get a Bose-Einstein Condensate we're getting into more... interesting... elementals.

Chauncymancer
2013-11-20, 08:38 PM
More conceptually, the weak and strong force elementals could affect the connections between and within things respectively. The weak force could "disconnect" things (denying teamwork/flanking bonuses?) while a strong force golem could "dissolve" things into constituent parts.

Sir_Thaddeus
2013-11-20, 09:39 PM
I think this thread is a wonderful idea, and I fully support the creation of elementals corresponding to the 4 forces.

Except one problem: forces aren't elements, so we can't call them elementals.

Does anyone have a good idea for an alternate name? Forcementals? Forcals?

Necroticplague
2013-11-20, 09:42 PM
Just my 2 cents on two possibilities for gravity elementals:

1:Invisible, mostly. Since the forvr of gravity is only directly visible in the way light bends through it, the elemental would not be visible in a normal way. Light bending through it would mean the most you see is an outline of it at the point where it ceases to be bent.Figuring where it is should be easy, but it would benefit from permanent concealment.

2:Starkly noticeable. The gravity of a gravity elemental is so great, light does not escape at all, instead of merely being bent. It appears as less of a figure and more of a hole in the world.Basically, a vaguely humanoid-shaped black hole. Of course, it's hawking radiation means infrared cameras can see this thing from miles off.

Although, when I saw the thread title, i did expect to be reading about Hydrogen Elementals all the way up to ununoctium elementals.

No brains
2013-11-20, 10:30 PM
...The gravity of a gravity elemental is so great, light does not escape at all, instead of merely being bent...

Oh, what if that light got out when it died? It's not a nuke, but a flash bomb could make an inconvenient low level death throes.

Kane0
2013-11-20, 10:59 PM
If you're doing the Periodic table though, don't forget Mithril and Adamantine Elementals. Then laugh like a lunatic when your players prepare to fight constructs.

Mastikator
2013-11-20, 11:23 PM
... mithril and adamantine are not real elements.

Kane0
2013-11-21, 12:20 AM
And the periodic table doesnt appear in any splatbook i know of. We are already killing catgirls by the dozen with the physics contained in this thread, why not throw in some crossover?

The Glyphstone
2013-11-21, 02:42 AM
I think this thread is a wonderful idea, and I fully support the creation of elementals corresponding to the 4 forces.

Except one problem: forces aren't elements, so we can't call them elementals.

Does anyone have a good idea for an alternate name? Forcementals? Forcals?

Embodiments?



Disintegrate touch attack

A Weak Nuclear Force Elemental would do a random polymorph perhaps ?

Thinking too small...
Spontaneous Nuclear Detonation: Anyone struck by a Strong Nuclear Force elemental's slam attack must succeed on a Fortitude save or undergo total mass-energy conversion. This kills the target and deals 100d6 damage per pound of the target's total mass and the mass of all objects in their possession to all targets within a radius equal to 1 mile per 5 pounds. Half the damage dealt is fire damage and the other half is bludgeoning damage.

nedz
2013-11-21, 06:11 AM
Thinking too small...
Spontaneous Nuclear Detonation: Anyone struck by a Strong Nuclear Force elemental's slam attack must succeed on a Fortitude save or undergo total mass-energy conversion. This kills the target and deals 100d6 damage per pound of the target's total mass and the mass of all objects in their possession to all targets within a radius equal to 1 mile per 5 pounds. Half the damage dealt is fire damage and the other half is bludgeoning damage.
Thinking too small...
Spontaneous Nuclear Chain Reaction: Anyone struck by a Strong Nuclear Force elemental's slam attack must succeed on a Fortitude save or undergo total mass-energy conversion. This kills the target and deals 100d6 damage per pound of the target's total mass and the mass of all objects in their possession to all targets within a radius equal to 1 mile per 5 pounds. Half the damage dealt is fire damage and the other half is bludgeoning damage.
If any of the targets of a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion blast are killed then they undergo a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion too, as described above.

Adoendithas
2013-11-21, 08:29 AM
Thinking too small...
Spontaneous Nuclear Chain Reaction: Anyone struck by a Strong Nuclear Force elemental's slam attack must succeed on a Fortitude save or undergo total mass-energy conversion. This kills the target and deals 100d6 damage per pound of the target's total mass and the mass of all objects in their possession to all targets within a radius equal to 1 mile per 5 pounds. Half the damage dealt is fire damage and the other half is bludgeoning damage.
If any of the targets of a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion blast are killed then they undergo a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion too, as described above.
Thinking too small...
Spontaneous Mass-Energy Conversion: Any person or object struck by a Strong Nuclear Force elemental's slam attack must succeed on a Fortitude save or undergo total mass-energy conversion. This kills/destroys the target and deals 100d6 damage per pound of the target's total mass to all targets within a radius equal to 1 mile per 5 pounds. Half the damage dealt is fire damage and the other half is bludgeoning damage.
If any of the targets of a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion blast are killed/destroyed by it they undergo a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion too, as described above.

EDIT:

One thing I would point out is that the classical elements aren't TOTALLY unjustifiable by science; each represents a STATE of matter, so you've got Earth (Solid), Water (Liquid), Air (Gas), Fire (Plasma). Each of them is a relatively easily available form of the state of matter. I suppose if you want to get a Bose-Einstein Condensate we're getting into more... interesting... elementals.
Fire isn't technically a plasma, as the air isn't necessarily ionized. What I want to see Redcloak use is a superfluid/Helium II elemental. It wouldn't even need to be animated, just magically chilled to a few Kelvins and allowed to flow.

Sith_Happens
2013-11-21, 08:36 AM
I think this thread is a wonderful idea, and I fully support the creation of elementals corresponding to the 4 forces.

Except one problem: forces aren't elements, so we can't call them elementals.

Does anyone have a good idea for an alternate name? Forcementals? Forcals?

Since at least two of them necessarily involve bringing quantum mechanics into this, why not Particals?:smallwink:

The Glyphstone
2013-11-21, 11:05 AM
Thinking too small...
Spontaneous Nuclear Chain Reaction: Anyone struck by a Strong Nuclear Force elemental's slam attack must succeed on a Fortitude save or undergo total mass-energy conversion. This kills the target and deals 100d6 damage per pound of the target's total mass and the mass of all objects in their possession to all targets within a radius equal to 1 mile per 5 pounds. Half the damage dealt is fire damage and the other half is bludgeoning damage.
If any of the targets of a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion blast are killed then they undergo a spontaneous total mass-energy conversion too, as described above.

That sounds more appropriate for an Ice-9 elemental.

nedz
2013-11-21, 11:39 AM
So, what would a Dark Matter, or Dark Energy, Elemental look like ?

The Glyphstone
2013-11-21, 11:42 AM
Incorporeal and immune to all forms of vision, senses, and detection, magical or otherwise. The only way to notice its presence would be by observing the constant Repulsion aura surrounding it.

Fayd
2013-11-21, 02:21 PM
EDIT:

Fire isn't technically a plasma, as the air isn't necessarily ionized. What I want to see Redcloak use is a superfluid/Helium II elemental. It wouldn't even need to be animated, just magically chilled to a few Kelvins and allowed to flow.

True, though it DOES respond to charge, similarly to a plasma. And some physics sources I'm finding seem to imply that they ARE plasmas (not the best or most charged plasmas, certainly, but they do qualify) (see Here (http://www.askamathematician.com/2013/05/q-is-fire-a-plasma-what-is-plasma/), one of the arguments Here (http://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/23469/is-fire-plasma), and this video here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7_8Gc_Llr8)but you are correct in that there is a significant amount of debate on this point.

Adoendithas
2013-11-21, 05:02 PM
I didn't realize that magnets had an affect on fire. With that information I'm willing to accept it as a plasma.

nedz
2013-11-21, 06:43 PM
Fire is a chemical reaction which produces heat.

Plasmas are ionised gases.

They are not the same thing.

Beleriphon
2013-11-21, 09:47 PM
I didn't realize that magnets had an affect on fire. With that information I'm willing to accept it as a plasma.

They don't, although a magnet might have an effect on burning/burnt ash particles that can make it appear as though the fire is affected. Nedz is correct in that a fire is at its base a rapid oxidation of something. That being said the gases produced by a fire can become plasma (or small amounts of plasma may form in low temperature fires) provided the fire is hot enough.

Forrestfire
2013-11-21, 11:39 PM
If you do periodic elementals, you should throw in at least one elemental made of a compound.

Because the look on the players' faces when an enemy wizard throws a FOOF Elemental at them will be priceless. :smallamused:

The Glyphstone
2013-11-21, 11:51 PM
Had to look up what that was. I like the Wikipedia entry line 'it has no practical application but remains of theoretical interest'. Things I Won't Work With's entry on FOOF is fun too. Satan's kimchi, indeed.

No brains
2013-11-22, 12:33 AM
This video does a very good job explaining how the visible effects of fire are made. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFWSlAP2NVk&list=FLWaHYAbgOYxI5W98RPVqm1A&index=1

Rhynn
2013-11-22, 12:55 AM
Had to look up what that was. I like the Wikipedia entry line 'it has no practical application but remains of theoretical interest'. Things I Won't Work With's entry on FOOF is fun too. Satan's kimchi, indeed.

Well, following your footsteps on Google, I have discovered the two awesomest things this week: dioxygen difluoride (http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_wont_work_with_dioxygen_difluoride.php) and chlorine trifluoride (http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2008/02/26/sand_wont_save_you_this_time.php).

On chlorine trifluoride:

There's a report from the early 1950s [...] of a one-ton spill of the stuff. It burned its way through a foot of concrete floor and chewed up another meter of sand and gravel beneath[.]

For reference here, "hypergolic" basically means "self-igniting":

It is, of course, extremely toxic, but that's the least of the problem. It is hypergolic with every known fuel, and so rapidly hypergolic that no ignition delay has ever been measured. It is also hypergolic with such things as cloth, wood, and test engineers, not to mention asbestos, sand, and water-with which it reacts explosively.

TuggyNE
2013-11-22, 03:40 AM
For reference here, "hypergolic" basically means "self-igniting":

I think that last excerpt is just about my favorite of all the hilarious Things I Won't Work With posts.

Which I should reread one of these times.

Edit: Ooh, no, here it is:
Well, it's been a bit too serious around here this week. So I thought today I'd step back to a period when men were men and chlorine azide was a reactive, toxic, and unstable compound that was only good for finding out what sort of explosion it would set off next. What's that? You say that that's still about all it's good for? Staying power, that's what I call it. If you work with the halogen azides, you work with things whose essential character time does not alter.

"Until they blow up", you say. Ah, but that is their essential character. It's the things around them that alter. Make sure you don't put anything next to them that you're not comfortable seeing altered - you know, all sudden-like.

The underlined sentence is like Wodehouse was a chemist.

nedz
2013-11-23, 08:04 PM
If you do periodic elementals, you should throw in at least one elemental made of a compound.

Because the look on the players' faces when an enemy wizard throws a FOOF Elemental at them will be priceless. :smallamused:

If you want some mind blowing Compoundals you could try something like an LSD Compoundal; where a touch attack turns into an interesting RP encounter.

Forrestfire
2013-11-24, 10:08 PM
If you want some mind blowing Compoundals you could try something like an LSD Compoundal; where a touch attack turns into an interesting RP encounter.

Pun intended? :smalltongue:

Sith_Happens
2013-11-25, 06:52 PM
Really, four days with no apparent notice of my awful pun?:smallfrown:

Adoendithas
2013-11-25, 10:23 PM
Really, four days with no apparent notice of my awful pun?:smallfrown:
Wait, I don't see the pun. I observe the word as "waves". :smallconfused:

No brains
2013-11-25, 11:23 PM
Really, four days with no apparent notice of my awful pun?:smallfrown:

Sith Happens.:smalltongue: That my fiend is an awful pun.

I liked it. :smallsmile:

Forrestfire
2013-11-25, 11:44 PM
Since at least two of them necessarily involve bringing quantum mechanics into this, why not Particals?:smallwink:

I totally missed that. :smallamused:

Fortis
2013-11-26, 12:32 AM
What about hypothetical matter or particles? I wonder what a Tachyon elemental would look like.

Adoendithas
2013-11-26, 10:02 AM
I'd love to see its stat block. "Move speed: 1x10^9 squares per round. Note: if the Tachyon Elemental moves less than its speed ay round it ceases to exist."

nedz
2013-11-26, 05:01 PM
What about hypothetical matter or particles? I wonder what a Tachyon elemental would look like.

Having negative energy: it's stat block would be functionally identical to a Nilbog.

The Oni
2013-11-26, 08:29 PM
Tungsten Elemental. Fire damage doesn't hurt it at all, but rather heats it up so things that touch it take tons of damage. If you drop one from space it makes earthquakes that level cities and sets it to Maximum Fire Damage to mop up any survivors.

Noble Elemental. They're big, nearly-indestructible, incorporeal beings that are poisonous to most humanoids, but they're usually not aggressive. They'll sit down in a city and accidentally poison everyone to death.

Mercury Elemental. Amorphic mass, toxic to the touch, morphs its body into weapons to deliver the poison deep into its opponents' hearts.

Calcium Elementals. They eat bones and become huge ungodly horrors. They have a love-hate relationship with necromancers.

Carbon Elemental. They're made of solid diamond. If you think they're dangerous in a small room, fight them in broad daylight and everyone's dazzled with a 30% chance of blindness.

Gold Elemental. Other elementals destroy adventurers, this one destroys economies.

Boron Elemental. It's not very interesting...

Salbazier
2013-11-27, 02:50 AM
I think this thread is a wonderful idea, and I fully support the creation of elementals corresponding to the 4 forces.

Except one problem: forces aren't elements, so we can't call them elementals.

Does anyone have a good idea for an alternate name? Forcementals? Forcals?

Fundamentals

Mastikator
2013-11-27, 06:01 AM
So, what would a Dark Matter, or Dark Energy, Elemental look like ?

Completely invisible and undetectable by all means and we only think they exist because of lack of expected mass & energy according to measured gravity.



Noble Elemental. They're big, nearly-indestructible, incorporeal beings that are poisonous to most humanoids, but they're usually not aggressive. They'll sit down in a city and accidentally poison everyone to death.

Noble gases aren't poisonous (because they aren't reactive), you can breathe helium and argon without any negative consequences (as long as you also get your oxygen).

Noble elements would be gaseous clouds that modify the tone of your voice when you enter it and may asphyxiate you if you don't leave.
They would probably not care about stuff too.

The Oni
2013-11-27, 09:43 AM
@ Mastikator: Ah, this is true, but it's very hard to simulate asphyxiation in a way that makes it a threat in Pathfinder. If the players aren't dumb as rocks or locked in a room with the thing, it'll be utterly harmless ...If that's the case, the scariest Noble Elemental is Radon, which passes through a city and gives everyone cancer five years later.