Tactics Ogre

[Tylorious]

I have been looking for Ogre Battle 64 and any way that I could play it, and in my search I discovered Tactics Ogre. I started to play and am really enjoying myself. Its class system is by far one of my favorites from any tactics game, and the combat is pretty much identical to other tactics games. Any one share my opinion on Tactics Ogre?


Also, found OB64 as a rom (forgot those existed for the longest time) and have been playing that pretty much nonstop as well. :smalltongue:

[Ulm11]

Just started to play the psp remake of Let US Cling Together and so far I am a big fan of the game and it's mechanics.

[erikun]

I am a big fan of just about everything in Ogre Battle and Tactics Ogre. :smallsmile:

Just remember that there are two Tactics Ogre games: Let Us Cling Together on the SNES/PS1/PSP, and The Knight of Lodis on GBA. It'll help prevent confusion between the two when the differences show up.

[Lighturtle]

Bloody hated the stupid class system.

"Want something new? Enjoy your level 1, ****er! Bahahahaha!"

Also bloody hate how overpowered octopi were. If the AI was remotely decent with the water bubble buff and throwing rocks, it would steamroll you.

[Tylorious]

Bloody hated the stupid class system.

"Want something new? Enjoy your level 1, ****er! Bahahahaha!"

Also bloody hate how overpowered octopi were. If the AI was remotely decent with the water bubble buff and throwing rocks, it would steamroll you.

It's better than FFT class system in my opinion. Whereas in this game you start at level 1 with a new class, in FFT you start at level 1 in all classes with a new character. The grinding in FFT was absolutely daunting. And by the time you are getting new classes, you will have equipment to help you with leveling them, and they don't even have to fight to get experience...come on man.

[TaRix]

While Enix of that day was notorious for small release volume, I'm pretty sure Tactics Ogre was never on the SNES. The SNES Ogre Battle plays like OB64, subtitled "March of the Black Queen" or somesuch. There is a Tactics Ogre for the Game Boy Advance, but I forget its subtitle.

[Tylorious]

Bloody hated the stupid class system.

"Want something new? Enjoy your level 1, ****er! Bahahahaha!"

Also bloody hate how overpowered octopi were. If the AI was remotely decent with the water bubble buff and throwing rocks, it would steamroll you.

Also, Beast Tamer and Dragoon absolutely demolish the Octopi. They don't even stand a chance when you focus fire on them with a dragoon.

[T.G. Oskar]

While Enix of that day was notorious for small release volume, I'm pretty sure Tactics Ogre was never on the SNES. The SNES Ogre Battle plays like OB64, subtitled "March of the Black Queen" or somesuch. There is a Tactics Ogre for the Game Boy Advance, but I forget its subtitle.

Actually, there WAS one such version of Tactics Ogre, but to be precise, it was for the Super Famicom. The PSX version was a re-release of that game, in contrast with the PSP remake with all changes made.

The GBA version's subtitle is "the Knight of Lodis". Saying anything else would be a big, BIG spoiler.


Also, Beast Tamer and Dragoon absolutely demolish the Octopi. They don't even stand a chance when you focus fire on them with a dragoon.

Dragoons in the SNES/PSX version were pretty powerful on their own. It was fun that they had some spellcasting ability (1 spell slot), but they were the best against dragons (which were, and still are on the PSP version, notoriously hard) and great against anything else. If speaking of the PSP version, after a certain point Octopi aren't so hot, considering that you get more powerful weapons and better spellcasting ability (well, as much as what you get by leveling up the Element ability).

It's one of the things I miss from the original; all characters had their own Elemental affinity, which allowed you to have more than one spellcaster that could then specialize in one type of school. The PSP version forces you to advance an element as an ability, which is hard to do because they level up real slow (on the other hand, the Elemental boost abilities let you deal more damage from elemental-affinity weapons, so...)

[Tylorious]

Dragoons in the SNES/PSX version were pretty powerful on their own. It was fun that they had some spellcasting ability (1 spell slot), but they were the best against dragons (which were, and still are on the PSP version, notoriously hard) and great against anything else. If speaking of the PSP version, after a certain point Octopi aren't so hot, considering that you get more powerful weapons and better spellcasting ability (well, as much as what you get by leveling up the Element ability).

It's one of the things I miss from the original; all characters had their own Elemental affinity, which allowed you to have more than one spellcaster that could then specialize in one type of school. The PSP version forces you to advance an element as an ability, which is hard to do because they level up real slow (on the other hand, the Elemental boost abilities let you deal more damage from elemental-affinity weapons, so...)

From what I heard, in the psp version the dragoons got a little squishy against non dragon or beast enemies. I am still pretty new to the game so I didn't even know that you could level up the elements! I know you can level up weapons and such but elements I had no idea about. Thanks for letting me know :)

[LansXero]

I dont really remember having to re-level classes in Tactics Ogre. You just switched around and back and forth :s

[Tylorious]

I dont really remember having to re-level classes in Tactics Ogre. You just switched around and back and forth :s

Oh you definitely don't have to relevel classes, and skills you learn from one class can carry over to another if it is eligible. Such an amazing system. That's why i like it so much more than FFT

[Infernally Clay]

If I recall, each job itself has a level and switching characters to that job gives them the same job level. At least, I think that's how it worked...

[LansXero]

That sounds more like FFT to be honest.

I really liked TO´s class system, although some classes were kind of redundant due to the variety and how OP story characters tend to be. Valkyries were always my favorite female class, and the terror knight for Demin / males.

[Grinner]

Oh you definitely don't have to relevel classes, and skills you learn from one class can carry over to another if it is eligible. Such an amazing system. That's why i like it so much more than FFT

Really? Tactics Ogre's class system is nice and all, but FFT is so much more flexible. Instead of being limited to one set of abilities, characters can combine skills from different classes, leading to some interesting combinations. That, unfortunately, is the only thing it has over Tactics Ogre, but still...

[Tylorious]

Really? Tactics Ogre's class system is nice and all, but FFT is so much more flexible. Instead of being limited to one set of abilities, characters can combine skills from different classes, leading to some interesting combinations. That, unfortunately, is the only thing it has over Tactics Ogre, but still...

I have to give you that FFT is a very flexible class system, but don't forget that you CAN transfer abilities from one class to another. For example, use the knight to get skill x, switch over to warlock, warlock now can equip skill x. There are certain skill/class combos that don't work but it is by no means limited.

[LansXero]

I have to give you that FFT is a very flexible class system, but don't forget that you CAN transfer abilities from one class to another. For example, use the knight to get skill x, switch over to warlock, warlock now can equip skill x. There are certain skill/class combos that don't work but it is by no means limited.

Is that from the remake? If so, that sounds kinda cool.

The good part about TO's system was that you didnt need to grind another class to get its benefits. The biggest difference (beyond abilities and what spells they could cast) between classes was stat growth, but a competent melee unit would always be a competent melee unit, be it a berserker, dragoon, or knight, as soon as you switched them up. A competent caster would always be a competent caster, regardless of you using it as a cleric, witch or siren.

[Tylorious]

Is that from the remake? If so, that sounds kinda cool.

The good part about TO's system was that you didnt need to grind another class to get its benefits. The biggest difference (beyond abilities and what spells they could cast) between classes was stat growth, but a competent melee unit would always be a competent melee unit, be it a berserker, dragoon, or knight, as soon as you switched them up. A competent caster would always be a competent caster, regardless of you using it as a cleric, witch or siren.

I am playing the PSP version of the game and it is the only version I ever played. If you level up a warrior to level 10, then recruit a new person and make them a warrior, they will be level 10 because your warrior class is level 10. Then each member of a battle gets skill points to spend on skills specific to their class. Once they have skills from their class, they can carry those skills with them to another class. It is very cool :)

[Lighturtle]

A competent caster would always be a competent caster, regardless of you using it as a cleric, witch or siren.


There was kind of a huge difference between a Persuaded level 50 high tier class, and a "natural" high tier class. Sadly, that's bad news for the main character.

[Gnoman]

It's better than FFT class system in my opinion. Whereas in this game you start at level 1 with a new class, in FFT you start at level 1 in all classes with a new character. The grinding in FFT was absolutely daunting. And by the time you are getting new classes, you will have equipment to help you with leveling them, and they don't even have to fight to get experience...come on man.

Huh? The ONLY thing job level in FFT did was affect how much JP you got to learn abilities with. It did not affect your stats at all. Yeah, you had to start with very few abilities (although leaked experience was a big help for that), but you can't expect to change class to Wizard and immediately start busting out Flare spells.

[Jermell]

Ahhhh I love the remake. Of course I have to limit myself to a 1 ninja limit so I don't just steamroll everything. Seriously they're kind of op the moment I use their armor enhancing ability my ninjas are nigh invulnerable. And I can keep getting the points to cast it by double katana'ing everything in my considerable range. Couple that with absurd speed and it makes up for lackluster katana finishing moves (like I would ever use them anyway I've got super armor to use!)


Kinda makes me unhappy that my PSP broke I wanted to do the law route it was the only one I didn't finish.

[T.G. Oskar]

Hmm, forgot about that big change I don't like.

To clear things up: the SFC/PSX version (the original and the re-release, to be exact) had each character level up separately, and classes merely modified the character. Thus, you didn't have a 50th level Ninja; you had a 50th level character that progressed as a Ninja. Higher-tier classes required specific scores, and you couldn't turn into one of these classes unless you met them all. The PSP version has classes level up, so if your level in the Knight class is 50, everyone that turns into a Knight will be a 50th level Knight, even if it's a brand-new character. Those characters who remain in the class get a meager, but noticeable, benefit by actually leveling up in the class, so a character that stays in a class from level 1 to level 50 will be slightly more powerful than a character that shifts to the class after it's reached level 50.

While this allows for some expediency, it breaks suspension of disbelief and makes careful tinkering with classes a pointless thing. The original required good knowledge of classes (though, to be fair, Archer >>>>> everything, with Ninja being a close second and Swordmasters best used to Charge your casters into reasonable MP), but the reward was building each character correctly; the remake kills that, despite all the improvements.

Regarding skills in the PSP remake: not all classes crossed through. The vast majority are ability boosters (Str +10%, for example), and are limited to certain tiers; some classes might not get them at all. What's worse, some abilities that would make sense in one class are unable to shift into others (so yeah; the Wizard skill that lets you sacrifice your HP for MP can be shifted into a Warlock and, IIRC, a Siren; why I can't, then, get the Mighty Blow skill into a Knight, which would make nice use of it? Or, say, a Berzerker?). The way the system works isn't much like FFT, where once you learned an ability, you could select it no matter which class; thus, you could have a Knight with Absorb MP or Counter or Blade Grasp/Shirahadori, or a Wizard/Black Mage with Damage Split/Soulbind, even if it'd be pointless to do so. Also, some of the choices are pretty weird: the loss of Exorcists is pretty bad, since that leaves you without the ability to cast Divine Magic attack spells if you're a Priest; you need to be a High Priest or a NPC class to pull that off. That's without mentioning some of the big changes (Canopus' Vartan class isn't unique to him, and Vyce's Ranger class can't compare to his former Wanderer class with limited spellcasting and innate Dual-Wield ability) which come so out of the blue that don't feel like balancing the game, but rather change it for change's sake.

[Jermell]

Hmm, forgot about that big change I don't like.

To clear things up: the SFC/PSX version (the original and the re-release, to be exact) had each character level up separately, and classes merely modified the character. Thus, you didn't have a 50th level Ninja; you had a 50th level character that progressed as a Ninja. Higher-tier classes required specific scores, and you couldn't turn into one of these classes unless you met them all. The PSP version has classes level up, so if your level in the Knight class is 50, everyone that turns into a Knight will be a 50th level Knight, even if it's a brand-new character. Those characters who remain in the class get a meager, but noticeable, benefit by actually leveling up in the class, so a character that stays in a class from level 1 to level 50 will be slightly more powerful than a character that shifts to the class after it's reached level 50.

While this allows for some expediency, it breaks suspension of disbelief and makes careful tinkering with classes a pointless thing. The original required good knowledge of classes (though, to be fair, Archer >>>>> everything, with Ninja being a close second and Swordmasters best used to Charge your casters into reasonable MP), but the reward was building each character correctly; the remake kills that, despite all the improvements.

Regarding skills in the PSP remake: not all classes crossed through. The vast majority are ability boosters (Str +10%, for example), and are limited to certain tiers; some classes might not get them at all. What's worse, some abilities that would make sense in one class are unable to shift into others (so yeah; the Wizard skill that lets you sacrifice your HP for MP can be shifted into a Warlock and, IIRC, a Siren; why I can't, then, get the Mighty Blow skill into a Knight, which would make nice use of it? Or, say, a Berzerker?). The way the system works isn't much like FFT, where once you learned an ability, you could select it no matter which class; thus, you could have a Knight with Absorb MP or Counter or Blade Grasp/Shirahadori, or a Wizard/Black Mage with Damage Split/Soulbind, even if it'd be pointless to do so. Also, some of the choices are pretty weird: the loss of Exorcists is pretty bad, since that leaves you without the ability to cast Divine Magic attack spells if you're a Priest; you need to be a High Priest or a NPC class to pull that off. That's without mentioning some of the big changes (Canopus' Vartan class isn't unique to him, and Vyce's Ranger class can't compare to his former Wanderer class with limited spellcasting and innate Dual-Wield ability) which come so out of the blue that don't feel like balancing the game, but rather change it for change's sake.

Hmm...I only played the remake so I can't speak for all that. But more flexibility when crossing abilities (except for Denam his class can do literally everything) would have made things better.

Speaking of Denam how did everyone's main character turn out? Mine ended up dual wielding a 1 handed sword and a katana while using divine magic. All of it. He couldn't hit worth crap with offensive magic though. Those ninja and knight levels don't help with that and I don't wanna waste time trying to make him a caster.

[Tylorious]

Huh? The ONLY thing job level in FFT did was affect how much JP you got to learn abilities with. It did not affect your stats at all. Yeah, you had to start with very few abilities (although leaked experience was a big help for that), but you can't expect to change class to Wizard and immediately start busting out Flare spells.

I honestly don't recall saying anything about stats. And I think a character should be able to switch to wizard and pump out flare spells if other people in his army have that ability because they could teach him. That's how I consider it, since someone on your team learned it already, anyone who switches to that class will take some lessons from him/her and they will know it too.

[Gnoman]

Ok, it seemed like you were conflating character level with class level, because I don't think that "advancement as a party" makes even the tiniest bit of sense.