[3.5] Search Rolls and Treasure

[20yrslater]

First thing my players do in my games after an encounter is start rolling d20s and spit out "oh! oh! oh!! I got a 23 on Search" blah blah blah.

Me:Where or what did you search?
Them: The entire damn room and more!
Me: Are you serious?
Them: Uh yea, that's how it works!
What I want to say: You find your head up your arse and when you realize what you found, you surprise yourself and your spinkter tightens and squeezes off your own head killing you!!!
What I actually say is: You idiot, I've told you a million times... it doesn't work that way!

Now, with the comedic relief out of the way... lets get serious.

1) How do you handle individual search rolls when a player attempts to search for treasure after an encounter or when entering a new room or area?

2) How often do you give out loot/treasure outside of an encounter?

3) Do I have to include enemy gear as part of the loots total worth and if so, is it wrong from withholding enemy gear from even being found by the party (for example a +1 ring of protection that was used to buff the enemies AC)?

[Qc Storm]

2) How often do you give out loot/treasure outside of an encounter?

I hide things around. They are not included in the expected wealth per level. They are typically things I find kinda cool, but are not worth their price. Sometimes they are art items with possible backstories, depending on if players explore on it.


3) Do I have to include enemy gear as part of the loots total worth and if so, is it wrong from withholding enemy gear from even being found by the party (for example a +1 ring of protection that was used to buff the enemies AC)?

Check out the expected reward value for this encounter. Subtract the value of these items (When I know the players will simply resell specific items, I only take half its value into account). Use the remaining reward value to make the rest of the reward, using gold, art items, or even more equipments.

[Kelb_Panthera]

1) I ask if they want to search any particular squares, the perimeter of the room, or the whole room; assuming they didn't specify. I do a quick calculation for the total time to search the room or its perimeter and inform the player on how long it should take to do the search and confirm if they'd like to take that time and unless they're doing particular squares whether they'd like to take 10 or 20.

2) Not often. Mostly just when someone's off of WBL by a fair margin or when there'd be a logical reason for there to be treasure hidden in the area. In the latter case it's usually a randomly determined art piece or gem or, very rarely, a cache of mixed treasure which may or may not include a magic item if I'm feeling generous or want to include a new homebrew item.

3) You don't have to but if you expect the players to loot everything that's not nailed down it's probably a good idea if you're worried about keeping to WBL.

[jedipotter]

1) How do you handle individual search rolls when a player attempts to search for treasure after an encounter or when entering a new room or area?

At least like 90% of the time there is nothing to search for after an encounter. The loot is often found on the dead bodies, so it is easy to find. For rooms it is often somewhat obvious if a room might have hidden treasure, like if the room is a vault. It is simple enough to just tell the players that while every 5x5 square might have hidden treasure.....they, just, um, don't.

When they do search, they need to be specific. I never let them get away with the the ''I search the room''. They would need to say ''the north wall'', ''the bookcase'' or ''the pile of sticks''. With a group this works out good with team work as each character will take something




2) How often do you give out loot/treasure outside of an encounter?

Often. After all they can find stuff anywhere anytime.




3) Do I have to include enemy gear as part of the loots total worth and if so, is it wrong from withholding enemy gear from even being found by the party (for example a +1 ring of protection that was used to buff the enemies AC)?

No, the gear does not count. There is no reason to withhold items. Giving the same items often works as they can't be used. A character can only wear one item per slot, so it is not like they can use five rings of protection. And the 'cheap' magic items don't really give all that much cash if they sell them.

But the best way to avoid the whole magic item thing: Temporary Items. Potions, for example. So give them potions of mage armor.

[awa]

i only ask where they want to search if it matters for example a time limit. If they want to spend the time searching the room anything else just seems like pointless time wasting.

In my games the players are playing as the character not the guy running him by remote control, so thing like whoops you forgot to say you checked the bottom of the chair feel like unnecessary minutia which will just encourage time wasting as they go now i check the drawers and now i check under the desk and now i check on top of it ect.

search checks are not particularly exciting so i don't drag them out i get them over with so they can get back to the fun stuff, on the rare occasion that a search check is exciting such as searching for a lever to open a door before getting crushed by a slowly lowering ceiling then i might drag it out. but just i want to look for treasure in this room after we kill the bad guys I'm not gonna waste the time making them declare everything.

Although i do allow pcs who say they are looking at a specific thing a bonus on there search check for example when they are pretty sure a secret door is behind a tapestry they get a big bonuses on check.

[rexx1888]

anyone else think WBL is dumb just for the implications on role play alone :\

like, the other day one of my team mates died, and the other guy got perma poly'd into a snake. While the end of this fight was pretty sad for my character, i still had to search the room for loot, which just feels plain wrong :\ wish my dm didnt think he has to play the game "the way its meant to be played", tis painful*.


*disclaimer, he is slowly learning that some stuff is just dumb, but it takes effort :\ an sometimes he tries to go in the other direction an nerf mundanes just because :( lol moving on

[Kelb_Panthera]

WBL can (and in my opinion should) be maintained without forcing the players to loot everything that's not nailed down and carry a crowbar.

This is what I do, feel free to use it if it sounds good.

Since, as DM, I'm solely responsible for handing out the treasure, it's trivial for me to keep track of what everyone has. I also only count permanent and semi-permanent items (wands mostly) against WBL since that's what actually contributes to the PC's power.

I start with normally generated random treasure per the table in the DMG.

If they go too far over because of excessive thrift or just dumb luck on a series of treasure rolls I find a way to work in a few encounters with creatures with lower than normal treasure values.

If they get too low because of encounters gone horribly wrong (rust monster, gray ooze, black pudding, multiple deaths requiring a heap of diamonds for resurrections) or because I'm just feeling sadistic (thieves, powerful creatures using the sunder option, being robbed by overwhelming opposition) which doesn't happen often, mind, then I throw in some random treasure caches and/or creatures with higher than normal treasure values.

If they start bogging down the game by picking up every tin cup from an enemy camp and prying gilded hardware out of walls I flat tell them to cut that crap out, they're already carrying around magic items worth enough to buy whole towns (unless they're like level 3).

[NichG]

I tend to run into players using Search when there's something very specific they want to find or that they think is present (whether or not it actually is). However, in a campaign I was in, the DM had a sort of routine when we entered a place that was laden with interesting things (ancient libraries, treasure vaults, etc):

Each PC rolls Search. Each PC finds something. The quality/importance of what they find is based mostly on the order of the Search results rather than their magnitude, though extreme results can play a role in bumping up the quality of a find.

Note that usually these things were not pre-generated by the DM (or perhaps he had one MacGuffin for each vault that the party was 'destined' to find). So basically, everyone gets a toy, and if you've invested most in Search of the party (modulo some luck), you get the rarest/biggest/etc toy. And PCs being PCs, sometimes these things get handed off to someone more appropriate, so its mostly about first pick.

Also, the results need not actually be treasure. Often, this was used to find who discovers the secret passage/indicator of the horrifying truth/plot clue first (at which point its their option to keep it secret/reveal it/lie about it/etc). Generally of course people would reveal it, but there were times when people decided that its better if the party not get to mess with what they found (e.g. a chained-down book that responds with 'When I am Opened, the World will End' when they Legend Lore/Vision/Bardic Knowledge/etc it).