Wis to armor question

[UmpteenthDoctor]

If you had levels of monk as well as swordsage would ur ac bonus stack? I know SS has it of they are light armored but my dm has always ruled that to include unarmored as well since the unarmed variant does it and seems so decent.

[The Trickster]

Somewhere, there was a FAQ that asked this question, and if I remember correctly, WotC said that they did not stack. My google-fu is failing me though.

[KillianHawkeye]

They don't stack, even if house-ruled to both work while unarmored. It's because they are both essentially the same ability, named AC Bonus, and bonuses from the same source do not stack unless it is specifically indicated that they do. It is akin to taking a feat like Improved Initiative twice, or gaining the Evasion ability from two different classes. You are able to do so, but the effects do not stack.

[Rijan_Sai]

The Tome of Battle Q&A (http://community.wizards.com/forum/previous-editions-general/threads/1125111):


Q: Does the AC bonus of the swordsage (from Tome of Battle) stack with the AC bonus of the monk, even though they are both based on Wisdom modifier?
A: No. The swordsage’s AC bonus, allowing the swordsage to apply her Wisdom bonus to her armor class, mimics the ability of the monk’s AC bonus. Since these abilities share the same name and have the same effect, they will not stack.

[UmpteenthDoctor]

Ok thanks everyone

[Rubik]

If you had levels of monk as well as swordsage would ur ac bonus stack? I know SS has it of they are light armored but my dm has always ruled that to include unarmored as well since the unarmed variant does it and seems so decent.Ur AC? This thread isn't about ur-priests.

[Urpriest]

Ur AC? This thread isn't about ur-priests.

Sure it is. Obv the OP is going for a Sacriligeous Fist build.

Anyway, the thing about this particular situation is that it depends on the stacking rule. Untyped bonuses from the same "source" don't stack. Source here is usually taken such that class features with the same name are the same source, even if they come from different classes. However, this isn't really spelled out anywhere, and the quotes Curmudgeon uses to support this interpretation actually contradict it. So YMMV.

[UmpteenthDoctor]

I can understand it not stacking but agreed if i used the variant unarmed ss i could change the name to anything then its the same effect under new names

[KillianHawkeye]

I can understand it not stacking but agreed if i used the variant unarmed ss i could change the name to anything then its the same effect under new names

How does using a variant allow you to change the name to whatever you want? :smallconfused:

[UmpteenthDoctor]

Because your changing it to a new ability. You have to rewrite the ability. Not by too much but you do. Remove the classes light armor prof. Rewrite the bonus to read that it adds wisdom to ac unarmed when originally it was while wearing light armor.

You do rewrite it

[tyckspoon]

Because your changing it to a new ability. You have to rewrite the ability. Not by too much but you do. Remove the classes light armor prof. Rewrite the bonus to read that it adds wisdom to ac unarmed when originally it was while wearing light armor.

You do rewrite it

Yes, if you homebrew it so it stacks and your DM agrees that you can do that, then it totally stacks. :smallconfused: That doesn't have anything to do with the question you asked to start the thread, tho.

[KillianHawkeye]

Because your changing it to a new ability. You have to rewrite the ability. Not by too much but you do. Remove the classes light armor prof. Rewrite the bonus to read that it adds wisdom to ac unarmed when originally it was while wearing light armor.

You do rewrite it

When using a detailed variant, you only make the changes it tells you to make. You don't add on any other change you want and claim that it's all part of using a variant. :smallannoyed:

[Chronos]

I don't know about 3.5, but 3.0 explicitly had a rule that players could re-name any of their abilities they wanted. The example in the text is that Lidda the rogue might call her Move Silently skill "footpaddin'", but Ember the monk might call it "rice paper walk".

[Vhaidara]

That's just what you call it, not the actual name. Actual name is used for rules related stuffs, what you call it is flavor.

[Jeff the Green]

I don't know about 3.5, but 3.0 explicitly had a rule that players could re-name any of their abilities they wanted. The example in the text is that Lidda the rogue might call her Move Silently skill "footpaddin'", but Ember the monk might call it "rice paper walk".

I've always felt like the example should have been extended to include Mialee calling them both "stupid" for not admitting that it's not a special technique. Sneaking is not esoteric. It would have been a much more reasonable for Jozan to call flame strike "touch of the sun disk" and Vadania to call it "wrath of the scorched earth".

And yes, Kaledrath is right, allowing this refluffing to count for mechanical questions is a bad idea. Otherwise I'm renaming Eldeen Plantgrafter to Graft Flesh to get into Fleshwarper four levels early.

[Zombulian]

Because your changing it to a new ability. You have to rewrite the ability. Not by too much but you do. Remove the classes light armor prof. Rewrite the bonus to read that it adds wisdom to ac unarmed when originally it was while wearing light armor.

You do rewrite it

Yes so you see folks, if you change the rules of the game then this totally works.

Also VoP is good because good dm's give you relics.

[TuggyNE]

Yes so you see folks, if you change the rules of the game then this totally works.

Also VoP is good because good dm's give you relics.

Wut u did thar, I c it.

Seriously, though, this is extended Oberoni Fallacy: If I get the DM to change the rules, I can totally make this work!